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Christian literature based curriculum?


calihil
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Hey everyone, Im kind of new to the boards. I have a 5.5 yr old starting her K year soon and I had always planned to use Sonlight because I *love* the idea of reading great living books to learn. However, it's been brought to my attention by several Christian friends that it isn't a good options for conservative Christians, which my husband and I are. Is there anything out there similar to Sonlight but more Christian? I know Sonlight says it's Christian, but the more I look into it, I'm not sure I like their approach to things in literature, based on the books they use and experiences of other people I've talked to who have used it.

 

I'm not interested in MFW or HOD, but they aren't like Sonlight anyways. I've heard of Beautiful Feet, but is there an actual curriculum to it? Any experiences with it? Can anyone suggest a Christian literature based (for history, lit, etc) program? I know Veritas Press is more Classical minded, but do they use a lot of "living books"?

 

Ahhh, help! :)

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Just curious...what is it about SL that your friends say isn't a good choice for conservative Christians?

 

Mostly they say it's due to the reading materials. They don't feel they are appropriate. I guess many don't feel they are "Christian" enough? I had been planning to use SL for awhile now but to hear several people I know and trust tell me this, well, it's discouraging.

 

And Rosie, yes I've looked at Ambleside Online. I really like it but need something that's a little more planned out!!! haha (Another reason I liked the idea of SL)

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Maybe you could go with a more workbook type Christian approach and then add in the living books that you think are appropriate from all the other Christian companies listed here - of course it would mean more planning for you but in kindergarten this is easier than trying to do it at an older age.  Or you could use Sonlight and just pick which parts you do want to use and which books are suitable - you don't have to do the full curriculum.

 

Then you could also try Rod and Staff and Abeka.

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For K level and something with Sonlight-ish titles, Five in a Row might be down your alley. (A good number of FIAR titles aren't really *Christian* either.  They are mostly just good children's books.  Some I skip because I never really found them to be that edifying/worth our time.)

 

BF is great (and we have happy memories of using it different times over the years), but be aware it is American history at the very early levels (which SL K is not), so you aren't getting the same thing there.  Great stuff, just not the same stuff.  (Besides, I tend to hold off with BF EA until a bit later than K, but that's me).  I do find it refreshing that BF is *just* history and isn't trying to include all subjects.

 

I have used SL for their booklist for years.  At K level (and, for me, any level) I don't need a schedule to tell me what to read and when.  We just read what interests us, and skip the ones that don't. I am a conservative Christian as well.  :)

 

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I understand what you are saying. I used to be ultraconservative. I can't think of a single curriculum that will fully meet your needs.

 

SOW (Student of the Word) is one option you might want to look at.

http://www.sowcurriculum.com

 

FAR And BITM are too advanced

http://www.lyndacoats.com

 

You can get the Heart of Wisdom Approach book, but the author's full curriculum has remained unfinished for a LONG time.

http://www.heartofwisdom.com/homeschoollinks/heart-of-wisdom-approach-an-overview/

 

Most ultraconservatives use textbooks or write their own plans. There are many versions of conservative and utra-conservative and these groups are often not able to use each others materials. Some ultra-conservative, especially the Amish, use secular materials. Secular is not anti-God. If a book is anti-God it is not secular.

 

I will keep thinking about this, and maybe will remember something I have forgotten.

 

You might want to check out the Principle approach. Most people spend a LOT of money on these resources though and then give up for a variety of reasons.

http://homehearts.com/step-by-step-guide/step-4-develop-your-approach/the-principle-approach/

 

:grouphug: I have the feeling you are going to be spending a lot of time and money over the coming years and doing a lot of this.  :willy_nilly:  and  :banghead:

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I'm a very conservative Christian pastor's wife. If YOU are comfortable using sonlight (and the reading materials), YOU should use it. Please don't ditch a program b/c of others! There are issues with using non-"Christian" books. But I believe there are far greater benefits. I don't have time to elaborate now. I will come back later. Dig around on the sonlight, AO, and tapestry of grace sites. Each of those sites have a FAQ section that deals with this issue. Pray about it and let The Lord lead. It may not be for you but it may.

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Hey everyone, Im kind of new to the boards. I have a 5.5 yr old starting her K year soon and I had always planned to use Sonlight because I *love* the idea of reading great living books to learn. However, it's been brought to my attention by several Christian friends that it isn't a good options for conservative Christians, which my husband and I are. Is there anything out there similar to Sonlight but more Christian? I know Sonlight says it's Christian, but the more I look into it, I'm not sure I like their approach to things in literature, based on the books they use and experiences of other people I've talked to who have used it.

 

I'm not interested in MFW or HOD, but they aren't like Sonlight anyways. I've heard of Beautiful Feet, but is there an actual curriculum to it? Any experiences with it? Can anyone suggest a Christian literature based (for history, lit, etc) program? I know Veritas Press is more Classical minded, but do they use a lot of "living books"?

 

Ahhh, help! :)

 

 

Beautiful Feet Books *is* curriculum, but it is only history (with a stretch, you can also say that it includes copywork, and it uses trade books which the children must read, so to that extent there are some English skills involved, but it is primarily history). And really, children who are not yet able to do the writing involved are not ready for it. :-)

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I'm a very conservative Christian pastor's wife. If YOU are comfortable using sonlight (and the reading materials), YOU should use it. Please don't ditch a program b/c of others! There are issues with using non-"Christian" books. But I believe there are far greater benefits. I don't have time to elaborate now. I will come back later. Dig around on the sonlight, AO, and tapestry of grace sites. Each of those sites have a FAQ section that deals with this issue. Pray about it and let The Lord lead. It may not be for you but it may.

I really agree with this. I've used SL materials for a number of years and I've found that they have aided in the spiritual growth of my children - not hindered it. It was been great for helping them develop a Christian worldview and mission outlook. I know not every book is 'Christian' but often it can be the way a book is applied that makes it valuable, and you can still learn worthy things by reading the accompanying SL book notes and discussing the concepts in the light of the Bible and your own knowledge of God - this is what SL intends that you would do.

 

Of course, the decision needs to be yours, but I'm just saying that it might be a shame to write it off based on someone else's say-so if you really like the looks of the program. Know what I mean?

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We used Sonlight for K, and 1 and then took a really circuitous route back to it for 7th, and now 8th... We'll see in the future.

 

I totally 100% agree with what the PP said about picking your OWN curriculum. Advice is great. Counsel is great. But your family is YOURS. Not anyone elses. Your discussions, discipleship, and teaching are your own.

 

Our pholosophy when the kids were young was to read great books and a lot of them. We kept them clean and God honoring. We skipped 99% of twaddle. We discussed what was and was not in line with scripture - as much as little kids can ("Are these attitudes honoring to God?", "Are these characters being respectful to their parents?"). We wanted them to learn to think biblically and discern in light of what scripture teaches. We did allow junk, or specific bad attitudes, bad words, name calling, etc. but even Edmund has some character issues in Narnia that are well worth discussing!! LOL!! FOr book lists we used the 1000 Great Books list, Honey for a Child's Heart, and Read for the Heart. When the kids read more on their own we'd discuss similarly and the kids always knew to drop a book if there was something really objectionable in it. As they grew and matured, they have been more able to discern, and more able to read something for fun and then let it go if it's not something we would embrace in our home. We've allowed a lot at 12 and 13 that others allowed at 9, but we feel good about the kid's ability to sift now. I try hard not to "ban" anything now, but really, at 11 and 13 they're very self regulating.

 

For curriculum we used SL, MFW, and later some Veritas Press Self paced stuff. Each has strengths and weakness, but like someone else said - nothing will ever be perfect or fit your goals 100%. Pick what you like and make it yours. For SL, I will say that despite their "grade" levels, I found their books to be intense emotionally and were more enjoyed at ages older than SL recommends. We did Core F last year with an 10/11 and a 12 year old and it was wonderful. I think SL fails because the books don't connect well at the ages they say to use them. We love SL and my son has gone back and reread all the Core F books 2 or 3 times this year. That's a win to me!

 

As a reinforcement for "reading" we use CLE. The books are wonderful, and the workbooks are great for test taking type "reading" skills. We did not use them for phonics, and I wouldn't use them before Grade 3. I think there's too much writing and pickiness before then in the workbooks - but I would use the readers as practice and fun readers. My kids loved them. We also loved the R&S bible readers in there "reading" curriculum. Great stuff there. And the Pathway readers. All wonderful, sweet stories for sensistive kids. You can find them used and they're great to keep in the car.

 

Again, pick your own curriculum for YOUR family. Spend time in the Word buidling and disciplining your kids. Memorize scripture. And as I constantly remind myself - curriculum won't save my kids or commit their hearts to The Lord, that's working of the Holy Spirit and God's grace. I feed them, He nourishes them. It's been scary and freeing at the same time. Blessings to you and your family - this is a wonderfully fun journey you're starting on!!

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I have personally not used Sonlight, but I do think you would be doing yourself and your children a disservice if you didn't check it out for yourself. As a Christian parent, you have an obligation to not only raise your children in the faith, but also to give them an excellent education. Just because a book is written by a Christian author or has Christian values does not mean it is excellent literature. My kid picked up some books by Danae Dobson (Dr. James Dobson's daughter) in our church library. Now, from a strictly content stand-point they were good books. Good lessons, etc. But they were the most poorly written books I have ever seen. I couldn't believe they actually got published. But they was Christian. So, there is a balance. We use A Beka's readers in the early grammar years in our house and I don't think anyone would argue that they are a very Conservative Christian publisher. But they don't necessarily us Christian authors. The selections they include are from good children's literature.

 

Besides, what is the definition of Christian literature? A Christian author? A book that mentions God? A good book with no bad language or violence?

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I will completely agree with the others that you need to research, pray and develop your own convictions.  I've seen a number of ladies in church or elsewhere who chose a curriculum based on a friend's recommendation without really thinking through it for themselves -- sometimes just thinking, "Well so-and-so uses xyz, so I guess I will use it too" -- without even thinking about if their situation is the same is their friend's situation.  It doesn't always work out very well.  

 

I attend a church that would be considered conservative by many (though probably considered liberal by others...LOL!). I feel like it is so, so important to see out your own path before the Lord.  Even among conservative Christians there isn't agreement on what is most Biblical.  The things in Sonlight that bother your friend might not bother you when it really comes down to it.   Seek e counsel of other families too, and ask what they think.  Don't reject a curriculum you might like based on one person's advice.  Even if you find a few things objectionable, you might be able to use it with just a few modifications.

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I agree with what the previous posters are saying.  It's important to realize that curriculum is not the teacher.  You are.  Curriculum is a tool, and you can tweak it to meet your needs however you need to.  You can always preview a book and skip it.  My pastor's wife used Sonlight with her ten children, and I would consider her very conservative.  I also understand that they have a great focus on missions.  My suggestions would be BF, Biblioplan, TOG or MFW if you're looking for something else very conservative with living books.  I find living books give a higher quality of education by allowing children to think critically on the original sources instead of textbook answers.  BF takes the tactic of a providential view of history.  Their guides have you go through portions of a book, memorize corresponding principles and poems and highlight discussion questions.  We mostly read the whole book in one or two sittings and just discuss, as I have used their books as supplemental to Story of the World.  MFW is very structured and laid out, which did not ultimately appeal to me, but it works very well for others.  We ultimately decided on Tapestry of Grace when we are finished with SOTW.  While they may include material in their plan that may be questionable for some people (such as pagan gods), they always give a heads up in the guide the week before as to any questionable material and tell you what alternative reading selections you can use and how to alter your planning.  Their discussion questions also guide the reading.  I find their flexibility and freedom refreshing and a great fit for my family as a tool we need to teach our children.  

 

Pray about it, and give it to God.  What looks right for others may not look right to you.  

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I never had a good feeling about SL, just felt I wasn't suppose to use it. What does your heart say though? That is what is important. TOG is literature based and Christian. I am curious why you are opposed to MFW? Faith is interwoven throughout it. They use a lot of literature and have an extensive book basket. If you like unit studies you may want to look at Amanda Bennett Unit Studies. Her curriculum is very Christ based. She includes a huge suggested book list for each study.

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*I* like Sonlight, I always considered myself a conservative Christian. But, I have a lot of friends who say the same thing your friends are saying. All of those friends use MFW (which I do not care for). Have you looked at Tapestry of Grace? You might like that one. I also do not care for Beautiful Feet, but I used and looked at that a long time ago and it was a very old version that I had, as well. Ultimately, YOU are going to need to read some of the books and make a decision for YOUR family. Good luck and welcome to the boards.

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Would it help you to see the lists of the Sonlight books? I know they renamed everything, but I have a google doc I put together of various literature lists. Perhaps, it you scan through it, you might get a sense of whether or not it is a good fit over time for you. You can find it linked on my blog here (scroll to the bottom). The Ambleside is on there as well.

 

http://lifeatwarpspeed.wordpress.com/2014/04/17/good-literature-is-what-everyone-needs-to-feed-their-childs-soul/

 

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Thanks everyone! I really appreciate all the feedback!

 

I have been researching HS curriculum since before my children were ever conceived, lol! And I've been wanting to use SL for years, so I do know their premise (and I've read their, what, "26 reasons not to use SL"?) and I've always agreed with it. I've just heard a lot of naysayers recently and it just has me doubting. But I already have the P4/5 program so we'll do that for K.

 

I dont really have an issue with MFW, and we might check it out as my kids get older, but the K program wouldn't be a good fit for us. My daughter is very close to reading, so I dont like how the whole K program is basically phonics. Their 1st grade program looks good and also their unit studies, so I dunno, maybe we'll check it out in the future. :) I've always felt strongly about a literature based curriculum, though, so I guess we will try SL and I'll just take away and add books as I see appropriate.

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We did SL Core A for my daughter's kindergarten - I found it to be quite "Christian."  I do not think, at the kindergarten level, you are going to get into great in-depth theological discussions with your child.  If you don't want to tell them that the dinosaurs lived 65 million years ago, for instance, just skip over that part on the one tiny mention of it on one page of a kids' science book.  If you look at the Instructors' Guide as you're going along, they always draw the parent's attention to anything "controversial" like that way ahead of time, so you can choose how to approach it with your child, if at all.  They even give options as to how to frame a discussion in Biblical light.  I found the literature choices to be very much in line with our family's conservative values, and if you want something completely, totally planned out for you, you can't do much better than SL.

 

That said, it wasn't the right fit for us, and we opted to switch to VP.  We have recently started our 2nd year in the VP cycle, but we only do history and literature through VP.  It isn't exactly literature-based in the same way that SL is, where you just sit and read all day.  Their history cycle is structured around a set of event flashcards, where you read one card each week and do corresponding reading in "living books" and kids' nonfiction books.

 

Originally I was looking for a history spine that folded in living books that were strictly about or from that time period, like in WTM, and neither SL nor VP stuck strictly to that for the grammar stage years.  VP does include historical fiction from the ancients in their history curriculum, as does ToG.

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I just dusted off my FAR(Far Above Rubies) and BITW(Blessed is the Man) unit studies. I had forgotten how many lower level books are also included in these studies that are aimed at 7-10 college prep and 9-12 general high school. The author informed me that she is writing a supplement for younger students.

 

FAR sample

http://www.homeschoolradioshows.com/FarAboveRubies/FarAboveRubiesSampler1.pdf

 

BITM sample

http://www.homeschoolradioshows.com/BlessedIsTheMan/BlessedIsTheManPreview.pdf

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"I dont really have an issue with MFW, and we might check it out as my kids get older, but the K program wouldn't be a good fit for us. My daughter is very close to reading, so I dont like how the whole K program is basically phonics. Their 1st grade program looks good and also their unit studies, so I dunno, maybe we'll check it out in the future. :) I've always felt strongly about a literature based curriculum, though, so I guess we will try SL and I'll just take away and add books as I see appropriate.

"

 

My dd already knew the phonics covered in MFW K when we began, I just skipped the phonics and focused on the Bible, science, booklists, crafts, handwriting, character themes, and worksheets. I added Progressive Phonics and a I See Sam books in place of MFW phonics. I purchased the package used and sold the manual after completed, so that alone made it worth the price. Otherwise I would have put K together myself in a FIAR type way.

 

Of course, if you already have the Sonlight it makes sense to use that, just decide for yourself if you don't want to do certain books. Any Christian curriculum you use will have critics from a variety of Christians. If you have an excellent booklist chosen by you using things like Sonlight, Beautiful Feet, or Ambleside booklist then you can use something like Rod and Staff, Abeka, or CLE for LA.

 

Also, for after Kindergarten, you might like the Simply Charlotte Mason history/geography/Bible modules. It takes 3 years to go through ancients, but that is because she uses the Old Testament as the bulk of the history content for ancient history, and she does not rush through Bible history. You could start with the US history modules 5 and 6 to begin with, has good living book suggestions, and later decide if you want to do something different for ancients. There are excellent suggestions for what and when to add for all the other subjects.

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You are about to step into a minefield.  Proceed with caution.

 

 

#1 - Research the theological beliefs of the AUTHOR of whatever curric you choose.  Dig deep.  The term *conservative*, when paired with Christian, has a few different definitions in the homeschool world.  Do you believe that America is the New Jerusalem?  In marital hierarchy?  In slavery as a biblical institution?  White supremacy?  Literal 6 day Creation?  Grace-based Parenting?  Spare the Rod parenting?  etc...

 

 

#2 - You are not likely to find an exact match.  Go with a curric that does not contradict on the BIG issues for you.  You cannot look at labels.  You have to look at what is actually taught, especially in the high school levels.

 

#3 - Once you decide, do NOT tell your irl friends who poo-pooed SL.  Avoid discussing.  Do what you do and do it well, make no explanations.  Or...find another group of HS moms b/c it might be very difficult to navigate the waters (as a new HSer!!!) with people who are so openly judgemental.  (I'm afraid you might be shunned for picking the "wrong" book...and who is deciding which books are right/wrong?  You don't need that sort of "support.")

 

 

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You have to make up your mind for yourself & not fuss about what others say. I know a person who speaks ill of SL & has never once looked at a catalog or owned any of the curriculum. She's heard it through the grapevine & so she keeps right on spreading her opinion.

 

As for something else.. Have you peeked at Winter Promise? I wouldn't say that ALL their books are Christian in Nature, but as it's not been mentioned..

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We are pretty conservative, non-Calvinistic Christians who want our kids exposed to a wide variety of belief systems while in our home so they will understand that the world at large is not only - or even mostly- Christian.  We have used SL for six years.  I prefer the older versions, and we do not use the language arts.  Through the years, I have come to believe that SL relies too heavily on historical fiction at the loss of classic literature so I am making a break next year after tweaking for several years.

 

Not all of the materials selected by SL were a great fit for us, for a variety of reasons, but it was good enough.  Our SL years provided the opportunity for many good discussions, and it made history interesting.  My only regret is that I read too much historical fiction and missed some classics because there is only so much time in the day.  :) As the years passed, I tweaked SL more and more, but I still appreciated having a framework and not reinventing the wheel.  That said, there are many other programs which are quality programs, and you can always put together your own program which pulls from all the aspects/materials you like from various other programs. 

 

I have nothing new to add to this convo, obviously.  ;)  All the best to you in your journey.  I loved the early years.  So fun.  :)

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Also, I am with others in this thread that I don't even know what conservative Christian means anymore!  I am too conservative for many and not conservative enough for some.  What the heck?  How can a girl have any idea of her correct label like that?  ;)

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Everyone else gave such excellent curriculum suggestions that I don't have anything to add.  However, if you need to find good Christian literature I have a couple of suggestions.

 

Veritas Press has some good book lists.  Here is a link.  If you click on literature on the left-hand side, you can see the books suggested for each grade.

 

Classical Christian Homeschooling has a 1000 Good Books list.  It is excellent and we haven't had any complaints about the books suggested.

 

I've also just started a children's book blog where I plan to review books and give some extra questions for reading.  On it I have a children's book Master List.  I've tried to include wholesome, Charlotte Mason-type books; there are very few (if any) modern books included.  If you go to Children's Classic Book Carousel, you can see the list there.  I'm also working on a chronological list that I hope will be helpful to homeschoolers.

 

With lists like these, if you come across a book that is objectionable to you, then you will at least have the resources to be able to exchange it for something more to your liking.

 

Best wishes for starting out on your homeschooling journey!  I remember this age and it was so much fun.  I love that you're doing a literature based curriculum.  With hindsight I think it's the best way you can go.  Blessings!

 

Cleo

 

 

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I dont really have an issue with MFW, and we might check it out as my kids get older, but the K program wouldn't be a good fit for us. My daughter is very close to reading, so I dont like how the whole K program is basically phonics. Their 1st grade program looks good and also their unit studies, so I dunno, maybe we'll check it out in the future. :) I've always felt strongly about a literature based curriculum, though, so I guess we will try SL and I'll just take away and add books as I see appropriate.

 

I like the idea that you might try SL and just see if it's the right fit for you.   you never know.   I know with my oldest (who is college age now) I wanted to use SL (when she was starting into 2nd grade), but decided to use it as extra reading list for a short while... then stopped and only used MFW's stuff.    Back in the day, where I lived no one heard of MFW yet (it was only a few years on the market) and SL was the thing.  But I did my own thing and went with MFW, and my friends did what they wanted and all was good.

 

I'm another one who was able to use MFW kindy with  2 children who were already reading short vowel stories when we started our kindy year.  The program is a lot more than phonics.  And we turned those learning to read worksheets into handwriting practice and spelling lessons.   Rest of the program was great.   and the current edition of the teacher's manual has about 400 or so optional literature titles that you can use from your library.  lots to read if you have it and if you don't...  it's ok to use less. :)   I also played around with some of the phonics activities as language games and such.   never felt like we were holding back that way. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I think you should use the Sonlight you have.

 

Personally, I don't care for Sonlight, for many different reasons. I wouldn't say it's because I'm very conservative (though I lean that way). I don't care for some of The Usborne book titles they use. Some of the missionary stories may be heavy topics at a young age. However, similar things have been said about MFW. I do like the looks of MFW, much better than Sonlight, and if I wasn't using HOD, I'd go with MFW. I'm now considering just piecing my own thing together again. Sonlight IMHO comes off as lofty/bold in the way they have written their 26 reasons to/not to use their program. It left me feeling like I should feel bad for not introducing certain topics to my children at an early age. Yet my heart was saying, no. I had searched their website, filled my shopping cart full of curriculum, but The Lord has led me elsewhere. That's not to say many titles aren't good! Many don't use their program, but use their reading list. MFW and HOD use many of the same titles, and I haven't found any of them to be questionable.

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We are very conservative Christians who love Sonlight.   We've used SL Cores P4/5 (beginning before they had the P3/4 Core) all the way through Cores F & G, which we will begin in the fall.   

 

With that said, I do "get" what your friends say about SL not being appropriate for the ages recommended.   I had friends tell me the same thing when I was just starting out.   When I delved a little deeper, however, I discovered that those friends used a SL Core at the very *youngest* recommended age, and with children even younger, and complained that the content was too mature for the intended ages.  

 

Our experience has been very different, but we have used the SL Cores at the very *oldest* recommended age for each Core, and have found 90% of the material is age appropriate at that level.   There have been one or two books in each Core that I've read and decided to skip or to substitute an alternate book.   The key is that I pre-read EVERYTHING that I don't read aloud (and often I pre-read the Read Alouds as well) so my husband and I can direct my children's education the way we see fit.

 

We have also made some modifications - like taking a Sharpie marker to the Usborne Book of World History in Cores B & C and covering up the more graphic nudity.   Some parents wouldn't have had an issue with the nudity, but the Sharpie made the book acceptable for MY family and still allowed us to use the SL program fully. 

 

There is no "perfect" curriculum.   If you feel that SL is a good fit for your family, use what works and skip the rest.   Don't be bound by others' opinions or experiences, because your friends are not raising or teaching YOUR children.   Don't feel the need to justify what you choose to anyone except your husband.   Knowing that the content of some books may be an issue for you, I recommend that you buy books in advance (or borrow them from the library) and pre-read them the year before your kids reach that Core.   If you find that you're skipping more than a few books each year, then start buying books piecemeal and don't buy full Cores.   

 

Also, look not only at the content of the books but how they are scheduled.   I read complaints on the SL forums about evolutionary content in the CHOW book (also used in Cores B & C).   But when you delve deeper, those particular chapters aren't even scheduled in the IG.   Even if they were scheduled, if that was an issue for you, just skip the portion that you don't agree with and use the rest.   Don't be a slave to any curriculum, but rather use it as a tool to work for you.

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I'm not super conservative but I'm pretty conservative and a Christian and I use a mix of Ambleside and Charlotte Mason Help. I know plenty of people more conservative than I am who use and LOVE Sonlight.  I think it can definitely work for you and if you like it, give it a shot!!!

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