Tell me about the living in the Deep South.

[AMDG]

My family is in a frigid climated, northern, liberal state of Minnesota. We've always lived here, and we love our community. I posted a few weeks ago about one of my children who has significant special needs, and while our family leans pretty conservative, it has been nice that in our state that our daughter gets the special services she needs. 

 

I know that the deep south is a totally different world from the one I live in, and we've contemplated a total move south because there are parts that seem better suited for us, but I really want to know about life and community in the south. Is there an objectively better state if we were to consider moving? I've visited Louisiana and loved it, but I wouldn't move there because of the hurricanes. What can any share about life in Tennesse, or Alabama? The good and bad. 

 

Our family is Catholic, too, and I'd want to be in a "pocket" of Catholics, which I know is tricky. There is definitely a Minnesota culture, and I am genuinely wanting to know about the modern southern culture. Thanks!

[SailorMom]

Well - to avoid hurricanes you'd have to stay away from eastern TX, LA, AL, MS, FL, GA, and the Carolinas at least....

As for religion - it is very pervasive and diverse.  Locals don't ask if you go to church, they ask where.  Lots of Catholics, but I never noticed a "pocket" of them.

Cuisine....  well - it's getting better (meaning, more diverse and more choices).  :)  Southern cuisine is so varied - depending on what part of the south you're in - that it is hard to quantify.  Lots of fried food, though :)

Conservative states also have good services ;)  Really, they do.  It is more about the income level of the population than anything else from what I noticed.  More metropolitan areas will have the best choices, as will larger communities along the coastline (but the hurricanes....).  DEEP south - in my experience this usually refers to more rural areas all over the south, but usually in AL, LA, and MS.  You'll find "deep south" right next to New Orleans which is more metropolitan south with a lot of deep south food and music. 

Community... hmmm... well - the 'community' a lot of people think of when they think of the south is the small town version, and it can be hard to "break in" in small towns.  Everyone already knows everyone since before they were born sorta thing...  It can make it hard to feel like you fit in.  Don't get me wrong, most people are very nice and friendly, but it is usually glaringly obvious who wasn't born there, IYKWIM.

They also don't take kindly to 'northerners' views of many aspects of the culture.  They think some of the stereotypes are ridiculous, and some downright insulting.  I found it was always best not to bring any of them up, lol....  They have, of course, assigned northerners a fair share of inaccurate stereotypes as well :)

Of the places I've been in the south that I loved, that seem to be what you're looking for - I'd say the Cumberland Gap area of Tennessee.  Gorgeous, far from hurricanes (they get the end of them sometimes), very southern.  I'm not sure how good services are there.  I've never been to Kentucky, so can't comment on that but I've heard it is also very nice :)

I also want to add that you would have to prepare for true culture shock.  Really.  Things move more slowly, racism (in both directions) can be pretty bad, poverty is pervasive, the educational systems aren't very good....

[AMDG]

.  Really.  Things move more slowly, racism (in both directions) can be pretty bad, poverty is pervasive, the educational systems aren't very good....

So this just isn't a stereotype? I think often of racism, poverty, and poor education when I think of the south. But I also think of kindness, great food, beautiful weather, and a more open mind to certain things that the Northerners need to be defensive about. My most relevant example of this is that I stay home with my kids instead of using my education in the workforce, but it took me several years not to feel like every person around me thought I was a failure. For some reason I have  the impression that the South is more respectful about those decisions. As a female, I also have this impression of a "Southern Belle" or an acceptance of females being female without apology. I will say in MN that being feminine can almost be a sign of weakness. But, perhaps these are just my own stereotypes. 

[shawthorne44]

I know you didn't ask about Texas, but it is to the South. It is a great state, and I have a direct comparison.  

We moved from Mound, Minnesota to the Dallas Fort Worth area when I was 8.  The only thing better about Minnesota is the lakes.  I've said for a long time that moving to Texas was the second best thing that my parents ever did.  My extended family still lives there, so I've been back many times.  One thing that I have noticed is how much more expensive it is to live there.  Not only are the housing prices expensive, you also have state taxes and the weather expenses. People are confused by the idea of a summer and winter wardrobe.  They have one set of tires and none of the windows are removable.  Winter hats, mittens and scarfs are mainly decorative and optional.  Cars don't rust because it rarely snows.  I've lived here a long time and I've never experienced any weather worse than a hail storm or a couple inches of snow.

 

[AMDG]

I know you didn't ask about Texas, but it is to the South. It is a great state, and I have a direct comparison.  

We moved from Mound, Minnesota to the Dallas Fort Worth area when I was 8.  The only thing better about Minnesota is the lakes.  I've said for a long time that moving to Texas was the second best thing that my parents ever did.  My extended family still lives there, so I've been back many times.  One thing that I have noticed is how much more expensive it is to live there.  Not only are the housing prices expensive, you also have state taxes and the weather expenses. People are confused by the idea of a summer and winter wardrobe.  They have one set of tires and none of the windows are removable.  Winter hats, mittens and scarfs are mainly decorative and optional.  Cars don't rust because it rarely snows.  I've lived here a long time and I've never experienced any weather worse than a hail storm or a couple inches of snow.

Yes. I think you really understand what life is like in MN. It *IS* expensive with taxes (income and property). We also have the added crunch of having to have a 4-wheel drive vehicle, and the very real expense of all the different coats and outdoor wear. We live on a lake in MN, and the summers are get humid but very enjoyable when the weather cooperates, but the winter is so long, and I often wonder if our family would be happier if we could be in a warmer climate where we could be outdoors more, and have more money in our pocket. 

[Stellalarella]

Prepare for culture shock.  Our move from rural midwest to urban south was quite challenging.  

 

You just have to enjoy it and take it as you go.  

 

If someone says, "We should have you over for dinner,"  that is a southern expression that means, "Hey, I like you, Ms. New Person.  I think you are nifty.  We had a nice time chatting. :) :) :)  We will certainly chat again the next time we run into each other. And theoretically it would be nice to have you over.  And you sure are nice."  But it doesn't really mean the person is actually going to call you up and have you come over.  

 

Culture wise one of the other little challenges I've had is just being able to figure out the rhythm and timing of conversations.  Somehow or other what I think will be a 2 sentence response ends up being a 6 sentence response and I find myself accidentally interrupting.  I just don't have timing down!  But I am getting better after 11 years.....

 

I have been wrapped up in the love and care of wonderful friends down here in the South.  My life is forever changed for the better because of their tender love.

 

Even so, I feel the difference in culture and I do sometimes long very much for "home."

 

Oh, yes, and whatever you do, do not walk into Drug Emporium and ask for grape pop.  Grape coke is the correct term and the only one that will be understood.....

[shawthorne44]

My Minnesota relatives say, "I could never live in Texas.  It gets too hot".  Then I would say that people in Texas say the same things about Minnesota being too cold.  Then they would respond that the cold doesn't really bother them and when it gets cold, they just stay inside.  But, they don't realize that on days they are staying inside, we are enjoying the outside.  I think what really matters is the ratio "How many days of the year do you not want to go outside" divided by the "Days that you leave the furnace and A/C off and the windows open".  Because, really, in Minnesota the only difference between -5F and 25F would be the fuel bill to heat the house.  I wouldn't be going out in either.  Same for 100F or 115F in Texas.  Not going outside.  But in Texas there are probably 30 days I don't go outside because of the heat.  10 because of the cold, i.e. less than 50F I am a wimp, and at least 90 days that I have the windows open for at least several hours a day.  Although, there was that summer that it never ever went below 100F.  That was brutal.  But, for example, this weekend Saturday will be a low in mid 50's and a high in the mid 70's.  Yesterday I went into the conference room at work and it was a bit cold.  That was because no one had changed the thermostat from A/C to Heat. 

[Klwhelan]

We're in Texas too, in the suburbs north of Dallas. I'm from Buffalo, NY and lived in Boston for years. I would move in a heartbeat. I would happily give up our big house and low cost of living if the opportunity arose. We live in an HOA (everything here is an HOA) with a really nice city park that is always empty. No kids to be found despite the fact that there are tons of kids in the neighborhood. People just don't play outside. If you are not religious or don't attend a specific church you might as well not bother trying to make friends. The heat and humidity is awful in the summer. I know of one Catholic Church in the area, so I wouldn't say you'd find a pocket. Every one that I'm friends with is from somewhere outside of Texas and really dislike living here. Like I said, I'd move back north in a second (and have been pushing my husband to find a job elsewhere). (Edited because I said low standard of living instead of cost! Big difference!)

[Paula in MS]

I always find it interesting when people say that "things move more slowly" in the south. Life seems pretty fast-paced to me, but I have never lived anywhere else and have nothing to compare.

[AMDG]

Super interesting. Thank you, everyone, for your input. 

 

I think the "We'll have you over for dinner," isn't just a southern hospitality thing. There is an expression in MN, too, "Minnesota Nice," and it's basically super demonstrative. While always a liberal state, we're nothing like the east coast with their bluntness, abrasiveness. Minnesotans tend to be super friendly and warm, and I like that aspect of the south. It would be a hard habit to break now to always speak to the cashier at the gas station, or small talk with whoever you run into. I like that a lot. 

 

I'm also very happy to hear that the services are available for children, special needs, etc., if they are needed. We live in a very rural area (most areas outside of the Twin Cities are rural), and while my daughter qualifies for many services, the actual implementation of them is very challenging. We had thought about moving to the Twin Cities, but we really don't want to...which is why we thought if we had to move, we'd at least try to move somewhere we could hand pick. 

 

I totally get the small town thing, too. Been there, doing that now. It's cute, but it gets old for me...I'd like our family to stand on its own without everyone knowing our family of origin. 

 

I enjoy hearing the differing opinions. Thank you!

[Ellie]

Yes, Texas is the South. :-)

 

I live in the Austin area, which is my favorite part of Texas. Besides the fact that culturally it is definitely the South and I love the South, it is also close enough to visit other parts of the state as a day trip...well, maybe an overnight, but still close...without having to deal with hurricanes or snow, or even humidity (San Antonio, Houston, and Corpus Christi have major humidity). Real estate is inexpensive, we have lots of Catholics (the diocese of Austin alone has 127 parishes or so), and the countryside is beautiful (although I do miss azaleas in the spring, and autumn leaves in the fall).

[...................]

Hurricanes are NO BIG DEAL if you are not directly on the coast.  Even just one mile inland is fine.  YOu get at least 3 days notice.  You stock up on water, batteries, food, use up everything in your freezer, and you have plenty of non perishables and a portable radio.  You get gas in a little tank and if you have $$ you even have a generator.  THen you put up your shutters and stay inside.  As long as the house is built to code (after 91), you are fine.  

 

Central Florida is pretty good.  Look into Sebastian.  There are nice Catholic pockets all around So. Florida.  Palm Beach County is overcrowded, as is anything south of there.  But there's no state income tax, the schools are improving and it's mostly fairly conservative.  I have family that live there and I feel they have a great balance of everything they need with that little bit of small town feel, fresh air from the ocean, and they can visit the ocean and inlet any time.

 

It's extremely hot hot hot so you'd have to like the heat to have a good outdoors life...we hated the Florida heat and humidity.

[AMDG]

Hurricanes are NO BIG DEAL if you are not directly on the coast.  Even just one mile inland is fine.  YOu get at least 3 days notice.  You stock up on water, batteries, food, use up everything in your freezer, and you have plenty of non perishables and a portable radio.  You get gas in a little tank and if you have $$ you even have a generator.  THen you put up your shutters and stay inside.  As long as the house is built to code (after 91), you are fine.  

 

Central Florida is pretty good.  Look into Sebastian.  There are nice Catholic pockets all around So. Florida.  Palm Beach County is overcrowded, as is anything south of there.  But there's no state income tax, the schools are improving and it's mostly fairly conservative.  I have family that live there and I feel they have a great balance of everything they need with that little bit of small town feel, fresh air from the ocean, and they can visit the ocean and inlet any time.

 

It's extremely hot hot hot so you'd have to like the heat to have a good outdoors life...we hated the Florida heat and humidity.

I couldn't do the humid parts of Florida. I actually have a handful of friends in TX, and it sounds appealing, but so large and expansive. I like the idea of being able to see and do a lot without needing to drive through Chicago to do it. I like that aspect of the deep south--the east is all right there. 

[SailorMom]

So this just isn't a stereotype? I think often of racism, poverty, and poor education when I think of the south. But I also think of kindness, great food, beautiful weather, and a more open mind to certain things that the Northerners need to be defensive about. My most relevant example of this is that I stay home with my kids instead of using my education in the workforce, but it took me several years not to feel like every person around me thought I was a failure. For some reason I have  the impression that the South is more respectful about those decisions. As a female, I also have this impression of a "Southern Belle" or an acceptance of females being female without apology. I will say in MN that being feminine can almost be a sign of weakness. But, perhaps these are just my own stereotypes. 

 

Sadly, no - not stereotypes.  Coming from the north - I had no idea racism even still existed, lol - but it is still a problem.  Poverty - yup.  MS, AL, and LA have some of the highest poverty rates in the US. 

The weather - well.....  winters are nice - and so is fall.  Early spring is ok, but as soon as mid April hits - the heat and humidity start and don't stop until October.  Big bugs, lots of snakes, mosquitos to drive you mad.

As for the view on women staying home in the workforce - in my experience in the panhandle of Florida - it was the same as everywhere else I lived.  I was seen as "wasting" my chance at a career.  I have a feeling the Southern Belle thing is only in upper-crust/ old money society (which is impossible to break in to as an outsider).  I did not ever experience that in any of our travels.  Perhaps there is more jewelry, bright nail polish and outward femininity - but it seems all superficial to me (as far as - the stay at home moms still get dissed and other people aren't very respectful about the choice to stay home - or homeschool...).

I've lived in six different states - half in the South and half in more Northern/western areas. Here are the only differences I've really noticed in people:

South-

Bible belt - people are truly shocked if you aren't in a church, it just isn't done there, and it's hard to fit in without one.

Slower conversations, fast food is not really fast, I've been told "You just talk so fast, honey, slow down - I can't understand you" (I'm from Northern California).

Drivers.... arg....  just - arg.

Catty women, lots of them (I know not all, I have some wonderful southern friends).  Gossiping seems very prevalent - more so than up north.   

 

That's about it really.....

[FriedClams]

I am a Bostonian transplanted in the Deep South. Deep. I've lived in the south for almost 20 years to include North Florida (yup, a different state than the rest of Florida, LOL), Louisiana, Alabama, and Mississippi. Here are some general observations-

 

1. I wouldn't say Southerners are more "friendly"", I'd say more "polite". There can be some distance and chill in the friendliness, but most everyone will be sweet to your face. I'm not saying anyone is being two-faced, I'm saying people are polite but just like in the north, it can take a while to get to know people. Rude is very rare, and sir/ma'am is expected in most social circles.

 

2. New Orleans and most of LA is very Catholic. New Orleans has a vibrant Catholic community and culture - well beyond that of the whole Mardi Gras scene. Mobile, AL also has, if I remember correctly, a large Catholic community.

 

3. Football = religion. Really. Mostly college.

 

4. State schools are much more prevalent here than in the North. As a kid, everyone up North was focused on small, private schools (Ivy or Sub Ivy), down here the majority of kids go to state schools. The colleges are huge, but I personally like that they are substantially more accepted and light years more affordable. I think there is much less looking down the nose of state school grads here than up North. I really, really Ike that about living here.

 

5. No cannoli here. Pizza stinks. New Orleans itself makes up for all that. BBQ here is insanely good, cheap, and prevalent. There is much more to Southern food than fried. No Dunkin Donuts. I hate that. Krispy Kreme is NASTY.

 

6. Church. Everyone goes (or a lot of people do anyway), but there are tons of "cultural Christians" who go for the friends, etc. that don't take it too seriously. I think that's a problem, you may not.

 

7. It is so, so, so, so, so much cheaper to live down here. Food, gas, property, taxes, etc. Just about everything.

 

8. Just like rural ME is very poor - the rural south is as well.

 

9. Our library stinks. Very, very low property taxes - but a lame library and public schools are (IMHO) unimpressed at best.

 

10. Land, space, room to move. Not expensive - but again - IMHO schools are lacking.

 

11. The beaches in north FL ROCK!!! I'd move to Pensacola in a minute.

 

12. August is really, really, really hot. But - everything has a/c.

 

13. Farmer's markets, CSAs, etc and all those movements are growing in the South.

 

HTH! If you have specific areas you're thinking about z- let us know and maybe we can help.

[Mrs. Lilac]

What Andrea Lowry said is SPOT ON.  Lots of "oh my, we just love you, we MUST get together!" and ZERO follow through.  We moved to the Nashville suburbs from Colorado 6 years ago.  We've had a difficult time fitting in and making GOOD friends.  People are very friendly, but I find it very surface.  And I think there's more racism than you might expect in 2013.  Most people know that racism isn't cool, so it's not an in-your-face thing, but post about Martin Luther King Day on Facebook, and you get crickets.

 

We live about 35 minutes outside of Nashville.  I think the more outlying suburban/rural you get, the more traditionally Southern.  Where we live, everyone went to high school together, the accents are thicker, the thinking a little more country, and people actually use the word Yankee.  A lot.

 

We have been attending a church IN Nashville, and Nashville itself is very diverse, with lots of people from different cities and different countries.  We are pursuing a move out of state, but if that doesn't happen, we will move into Nashville proper.  For me personally, it's the only way I can continue to raise my kids here in good conscience.

[JessReplanted]

Prepare for culture shock. 

 

If someone says, "We should have you over for dinner,"  that is a southern expression that means, "Hey, I like you, Ms. New Person.  I think you are nifty.  We had a nice time chatting. :) :) :)  We will certainly chat again the next time we run into each other. And theoretically it would be nice to have you over.  And you sure are nice."  But it doesn't really mean the person is actually going to call you up and have you come over.  

 

 

:iagree:

 

This specifically has been incredibly frustrating for our family. We moved from PA to TX just over a year ago. (I'm originally from MA.)  Of course, we want to make friends. People will act like they *love* you and are dying to get together with you, and then you literally never see them again. I think part of it has to do with a culture of 'busyness', but it's very frustrating.

 

I have dealt with a lot of culture shock this past year, and I still don't feel settled. Many of the 'Texans' we have met absolutely LOVE Texas (they call it "God's Country"  :huh: ), and they seem to have a difficult time understanding why we're just not overjoyed to be here.

[AMDG]

What Andrea Lowry said is SPOT ON.  Lots of "oh my, we just love you, we MUST get together!" and ZERO follow through.  We moved to the Nashville suburbs from Colorado 6 years ago.  We've had a difficult time fitting in and making GOOD friends.  People are very friendly, but I find it very surface.  And I think there's more racism than you might expect in 2013.  Most people know that racism isn't cool, so it's not an in-your-face thing, but post about Martin Luther King Day on Facebook, and you get crickets.

 

We live about 35 minutes outside of Nashville.  I think the more outlying suburban/rural you get, the more traditionally Southern.  Where we live, everyone went to high school together, the accents are thicker, the thinking a little more country, and people actually use the word Yankee.  A lot.

 

We have been attending a church IN Nashville, and Nashville itself is very diverse, with lots of people from different cities and different countries.  We are pursuing a move out of state, but if that doesn't happen, we will move into Nashville proper.  For me personally, it's the only way I can continue to raise my kids here in good conscience.

I am particularly fascinated by Nashville, or just outside of Nashville.  I have a feeling it's super suburbia, which is so NOT what we are used to living in a small town with acreage, lots of room for my kiddos to play shirtless, where I don't have to worry about what I water the flowers in. 

 

I brought this conversation up with my facebook friends recently, who live all around the US, and several of them are discontent with their location. I sometimes wonder if it is because we are all in a stage with young or school-aged kids, we're probably all too lonely, and feel ever the more isolated for staying at home, or homeschooling--both. Perhaps location is what you make of it. 

 

But, as Fried Clams posted, I love what she wrote about the state school thing in the Northern states. Spot on. There is such a big thing here with private colleges. Yuck. And, to think of the money we'd save in the south is so tempting. We are a pretty middle class family, and we pay A LOT in taxes. If we left for a state without those taxes, we'd easily save over $25,000 within five years. I mean...that's a state college in the south ;-) . 

[Mrs. Lilac]

If I can answer any specific Nashville area questions, I'd be glad to! :)

[Rachel]

I agree with what everyone else has said.  I moved to the south, not deep south 14 years ago from a neighboring state of MN.  I did have culture shock, but nothing that couldn't be overcome quickly.  I think if I had moved to either coast I would have had similar culture shock.  I lived 13 years in a small city and a year ago moved 15 miles away to a small town (8K).  Even though there are a lot of commuters to the city, it has a completely different feel and attitude.  My in laws are more rural and their area has a different feel too, so even in an hour radius things can be very different.

 

I am not sure about Catholic communities, there are private Catholic schools and at least a couple of fairly large parishes that I am aware of.  Homeschooling seems to be accepted.  The library system in both communities has been wonderful.  The public schools are very mixed, there is huge disparity in programs and success depending on where in town the school is located. There are many private schools both religious and secular.  There are many home school groups, religious and secular of varying sizes.  Where I live stay at home moms seem to be accepted, I do feel like I live in an more affluent than average area.  I think it is less common and less accepted in the more rural areas.  Many moms stay home until their youngest are off to school and then rejoin the work force.  I know that there are lots of services for families with special needs but I don't know about the quality of those programs.  Cost of living in my area is average or slightly above average compared to the rest of the nation, it is much lower in more rural areas.  We do have state income tax, along with county and city income taxes. 

 

Although we do get four seasons here, winter is mild.  Spring and fall are gorgeous.  Summer can vary between hot and humid and barely comfortable.  If you are a runner, you can run year round here, you just have to get out in the mornings before it gets too hot.  A lot of people complain about the mosquitoes, but they are nothing like when I go back home.  People don't seem to be outside as much in winter or summer compared to where I grew up. We get a few days a year where the temperatures may be in the single digits or teens, but that is usually a low.  We get snow 2-3 times a year and it usually melts in a couple days.  We are one of the few neighbors that shovel, everyone else just lets it melt.  This can make walking in the neighborhood treacherous in the winter due to the slush refreezing.

 

People are polite but difficult to get to know.  Racism is a lot more prevalent than I ever expected, especially among the older generations.  I do like being a few hours drive from several major cities.

 

We have family in LA & TX and have spent time in various states around the south.  Different states and individual towns within those states have very different feels to them.  If you have an open mind and do your research, I think you could find a place where you could be quite happy.  I really like living here and don't see us moving away unless an amazing opportunity comes about.  If you want more information you can PM me.

[foxbridgeacademy]

So this just isn't a stereotype? I think often of racism, poverty, and poor education when I think of the south. But I also think of kindness, great food, beautiful weather, and a more open mind to certain things that the Northerners need to be defensive about. My most relevant example of this is that I stay home with my kids instead of using my education in the workforce, but it took me several years not to feel like every person around me thought I was a failure. For some reason I have  the impression that the South is more respectful about those decisions. As a female, I also have this impression of a "Southern Belle" or an acceptance of females being female without apology. I will say in MN that being feminine can almost be a sign of weakness. But, perhaps these are just my own stereotypes. 

IME you got it right.  I'm from a very liberal part of Indiana, we moved to the South(Florida, Tennessee, North Carolina, now Kentucky) about 8 years ago.  I would say that generally the level of medical care is good, certain lifestyles are welcome others are.... somewhat tolerated.  Racism is rampant in the local community... this was very hard for me to tolerate, but tolerate you must because you can't fix it.  There are of course groups that are not prejudiced.  Homeschool groups, anything with younger people or as in N.C. groups with transplants. Charlotte is far enough inland to avoid most of the hurricane weather, it's a large enough city to provide culture, good medical care and services.  There are several large homeschool groups from conservative to liberal, christian to secular.  The only reason we moved was to be closer to family.... we'll probably move back after the kids are grown. 

[craftyerin]

I did not read all of the responses, but if you're Catholic and looking for the south, New Orleans is the place for you! This is by far the most fun town I have ever lived in.  We've been here about 2.5 years.  I am not Catholic, but really, it's almost assumed that you are down here!  

[boscopup]

I've lived most of my life in the area of Huntsville, AL. I love it here. Huntsville is a high tech city with low cost of living. There is a good mix of northerners and southerners here. There are areas where you can still get land and be within decent commute to work (we have 10 acres ourselves, and are only about 30 minutes from DH's work). SAHMs are normal. Conservative and liberal are both represented, but definitely leans more conservative in general. Poverty is much worse in southern AL - there are whole areas down there that are very, very poor. The Huntsville area tends to be a bit richer. And Huntsville is a big enough city to be a "city", but not so big that you get lost driving around.

 

There are some good sized Catholic churches in Huntsville and Madison. There are also some private Catholic schools in both of those cities (Madison is just outside of Huntsville, kind of surrounded by Huntsville).

 

The main bad thing about the northern AL is the tornadoes. They are pretty common here. We are Tornado Alley #2. Not quite as bad as out west, but still pretty bad. But since the April 27 tornadoes, many houses have been fit with tornado shelters (basements aren't as common here).

 

Oh, and it's hot in the summer. Winter isn't bad. We occasionally get snow, and everything shuts down because a) there isn't as much equipment to clear snow, b ) it's a wet snow, and c) sometimes the snow melts and then refreezes into ice. But it's pretty rare for snow to stick to the roads, and if it does stick, it usually isn't there more than a day. Once every 10ish years, we get a big foot deep snow that lasts a week, or a good ice storm that lasts a week.

 

A PP was right that football = religion down here. Thankfully, in Huntsville, we have hockey! :D The local university doesn't have a football team, but they have a division 1 hockey team (rebuilding after being canceled and then started up again last year).

 

The Huntsville public library system is very good and is available all over the county - put a book on hold, and they'll bring it from another branch within the county system for free. I'm not in that county, and I pay for the membership because it's very good. I'm not having to buy books for TOG Year 4. That makes me happy. :)

 

There are a lot of homeschoolers here, so being out and about during the day is no big deal.

 

Oh, and if you are in a rural area with old men playing checkers on the porch of the general store, you may not understand what they're saying. Even I can't understand what they're saying, and I've lived in this area since I was 4. :lol: My DH can converse with them in their "tongue", and I can't understand him either. He translates for me. :D

[CAtoVA]

Well we moved from California to the upper south about 15 years ago. There were more differences then there are now. One big difference is people do talk to you more, chatting with store clerks, waiting in line etc. But they also do things I still cannot get used to and think are rude given my western sensibilities: people often drop by without calling or emailing or letting you know they are coming. They also park in your driveway or park behind your car in the driveway rather than parking on the street in front of your house. Where I am from that would be rude. I don't know how many times I have had to ask guests to move their cars (my DH's friends I mean) so I can get out and take my kids somewhere.

 

I think it really depends where you move whether or not you will face some of the liberal ideas and high costs of the north. If you move to a college town, prepare for liberalism as extreme as you may find in Ann Arbor depending on the town and the state. I mean that the city council or county Board of Supervisors may in fact have a high rate of property tax (compared to other localities) and the make up of the political body may be entirely one party (and it might not be your party). I live in a "machine town" and it is impossible for anybody outside of the one ruling party to get elected. They are liberals from up north who moved south who are in control and often it feels like we are in Massachusetts no matter what the rest of the state does.  If I went about 20 miles out I would find more conservatism and lower property taxes.

[Stellalarella]

Kiplinger gave LIttle Rock a #1 ranking.  http://www.kiplinger.com/article/real-estate/T006-C000-S002-10-great-places-to-live.html

 

I think Little Rock is becoming a terrific little city.  Our city has park after park after park.  Parks everywhere!  There has also been a big project to build miles and miles of biking/walking trails around the river front.  We now sport the world's longest foot bridge.  Of course, they called it The Big Dam Bridge since it goes over the bridge.  We have had a major push for downtown revitalization that has been quite successful, beginning with the Clinton library.  Next up is a downtown technology park.  

 

Of course, if you fly in, you can come to our recently renovated and renamed airport-the Bill and Hillary Clinton airport.  It's known to the locals as the HIll-BIlly Airport.  

 

We do have a sizeable catholic community who support several private Catholic schools.  

 

WE HAVE THE BEST LIBRARY SYSTEM YOU CAN POSSIBLY IMAGINE.  I don't usually use all caps, but I feel that strongly about it.  I love, love, love, love, love, love the Central Arkansas Library System.  We have 13 libraries within our city...including 1 brand new library just for children.  Of course it got named for Hillary, but anyway...  Check outs are for long periods, I usually have about a 100 books at a time, and I can get whatever book I need, even to the point of requesting a new purchase.   :)    

 

The state parks in Arkansas are just fabulous.  And beautiful.   Caves, waterfalls, unmatched beauty.  Our state also has free educational nature centers--including one in downtown LR.  

 

LR weathered the Great Recession fairly well.  When other cities were greatly suffering, LR was doing OK.  

 

The governor of our state is a reasonable kinda guy.  He hasn't lied, cheated on his wife, run his mouth off, or generally embarrassed us at a national level.   Does that count as a perk for moving to a state?  

 

LR is big on recycling.  The city just gave us a big wheeled bin for all recyclables--everything gets thrown into one very large cart.  It is sorted out later at the plant.

 

We have trolleys downtown.   :)

 

We have a real mountain at the western edge of town.   :)  Pinnacle Mountain.  It's a 40 minutes climb to the top and offers lovely views of the Arkansas river and downtown.

 

 

[dragonflyer]

I have a friend who puts it this way:

Everyone has two walls in their life.  Past the first wall and you are friendly, get past the second wall and you are close friends forever.  In the north (where my friend is from) she says everyone has a high first wall and a low second wall.  In the south (where I have lived my whole life) the first wall is really low.  This is everyone complaining about people being friendly and welcoming with no follow through.  The second wall is really high because you are often so busy with the people you are related to and already know.

If you want to live in the south, you will have to enjoy people being genuinely happy to see you again, but not ready to make personal time for you.  Although, I do not imply that we should get together if I do not intend to follow through.

It is easier to make friends in some of the more metropolitan or transient areas than in the towns where everyone knew your grandmother and the people who have been around 15 years are the newcomers who live in the old Jones house...

[shinyhappypeople]

I'm from California, but lived in TN for awhile.  I *loved* it there.  I was in Nashville and there were many, many non-southern transplants living there.  I'd move back in a heartbeat if DH could handle the humidity.   I remember Nashville as having very nice people, low cost of living, and beautiful country (just outside of town).   I'd venture a guess that it's more "liberal" than other parts of the south, but not obnoxiously so.  

 

Writing this has made me miss middle TN *so much*.

[Chelli]

Kiplinger gave LIttle Rock a #1 ranking.  http://www.kiplinger.com/article/real-estate/T006-C000-S002-10-great-places-to-live.html

 

I think Little Rock is becoming a terrific little city.  

 

The state parks in Arkansas are just fabulous.  And beautiful.   Caves, waterfalls, unmatched beauty.  Our state also has free educational nature centers--including one in downtown LR.  

 

We have a real mountain at the western edge of town.   :)  Pinnacle Mountain.  It's a 40 minutes climb to the top and offers lovely views of the Arkansas river and downtown.

 

I grew up in Arkansas and while the Ozark Mountain area will always be my favorite, Little Rock really is trying to compete with the Fayetteville-Springdale-Rogers trifecta to attract business and families. I'm glad you enjoy living there. Maybe the next time I go home to visit we'll have to meet up for lunch or something (I promise this is NOT a Southern way of asking!  :tongue_smilie: )

 

As for the South in general, I think you can find whatever you want in the South. Is there still racism and poverty? Yes, but there are also parts of the South that are a true melting pot and VERY wealthy. If you want to avoid most of the Southern stereotypes (except the best ones!), I wouldn't move into too small of a Southern town. It is definitely harder to make friends. Currently I live in Texas in a town of 10,000. I am constantly amazed at how many people graduated from high school, moved away to go to college, and then came BACK here to live. It's almost impossible to break into the social groups because they've all been friends since they were embryos!!! It doesn't bother me too much though because I'm so busy with homeschooling that I don't have much time to hang out with friends, but I do have about three REALLY good friends that I've made since we moved here 7 years ago. I do love the fact that we live within a 30 minute drive of the Houston suburbs, so I would highly recommend at least being relatively close to a biggish city. It's super handy. 

[Stellalarella]

I grew up in Arkansas and while the Ozark Mountain area will always be my favorite, Little Rock really is trying to compete with the Fayetteville-Springdale-Rogers trifecta to attract business and families. I'm glad you enjoy living there. Maybe the next time I go home to visit we'll have to meet up for lunch or something (I promise this is NOT a Southern way of asking!  :tongue_smilie: )

 

As for the South in general, I think you can find whatever you want in the South. Is there still racism and poverty? Yes, but there are also parts of the South that are a true melting pot and VERY wealthy. If you want to avoid most of the Southern stereotypes (except the best ones!), I wouldn't move into too small of a Southern town. It is definitely harder to make friends. Currently I live in Texas in a town of 10,000. I am constantly amazed at how many people graduated from high school, moved away to go to college, and then came BACK here to live. It's almost impossible to break into the social groups because they've all been friends since they were embryos!!! It doesn't bother me too much though because I'm so busy with homeschooling that I don't have much time to hang out with friends, but I do have about three REALLY good friends that I've made since we moved here 7 years ago. I do love the fact that we live within a 30 minute drive of the Houston suburbs, so I would highly recommend at least being relatively close to a biggish city. It's super handy. 

 

I just drove up to Bentonville-Fayetteville-Springdale-Rogers to go the the Crystal Bridges Art Museum.  We hit it on the weekend that the leaves turned.  It was so lovely.

 

The museum is truly world class.  The large grounds and trails surrounding the museum are very beautiful.   

 

Crystal Bridges, the Central Arkansas Library System, and the State Parks of Arkansas make me very proud to have lived in Arkansas.  

 

I can't really call myself an Arkansan, though, because I have never attended a Razorback game.  They did "call the hogs" at church, though....does that count?

 

When people say football is religion here and that you don't plan anything without first checking the Razorback and hunting calendar, they mean it.  

[Paige]

I love the south. It's much cheaper, I prefer warm over cold any day, and it's closer to the beach.

 

Racism- I'm sure it's there, and you probably have a small population that is more vocal than you'd hear in the north, but I really enjoyed being in the south because of the diversity. We lived some places up north, where you'd be hard pressed to see anyone who wasn't white for months. We also had a huge Klan presence in the areas we lived in the northern states. I've never had more friends from different ethnic backgrounds than I did in the south.

 

Services- If you live near a larger city, you should have no problem accessing whatever therapy you need. Small towns anywhere will have more problems.

 

Culture- Manners are much more important. You should say sir and ma'am, write thank you notes, and always offer your guests something to eat.

 

You should also offer them Sweet Tea- don't try to serve any unsweet tea without warning.

 

I don't think you'd have any problem finding a Catholic community in a medium sized city.

 

Public Education- It varies. You can have some really great schools and some really crappy ones. I think most southern states are trying hard to improve education. My kids were too little or not born when we lived in the north so I don't know much about the education except that our school taxes were really expensive.

 

It's hot. I love it, but I live in a border/middle state now and am amazed at how many people complain about the heat. I think it is not hot at all and actually too cold but my friends who are used to cooler climates are miserable when I feel like it's just starting to feel warm.

 

Snow in the south is like an emergency situation. It's a combination of people not knowing how to drive in it, the cities not being prepared to clean it up much before it melts, and some sort of mass hysteria. Our first winter in Augusta we were surprised when we showed up at church and found it closed after what I would call a hard frost. We hadn't even thought of checking for closing because there was NO snow. It works out because it rarely snows which could be good or bad depending on what you like.

 

Bad- there are more bugs and the bugs are bigger. You don't get the early hard frosts to kill them off in Oct and Nov. Fire ants are no joke.

 

KY and TN are not the deep south and people from there may be considered northerners by those from more southern states. KY and TN are very different from GA/AL/MS/SC/LA, etc. I'd recommend living near but not necessarily in the bigger cities- Atlanta, GA; Columbia, SC; Augusta, GA; Birmingham, AL; Charlotte, NC; New Orleans, LA, etc. In the big cities, you'll have access to cool things to do, medical specialists, and homeschool activities or cool charter and magnet schools. If you end up in a small town in the boonies it could be much more of a culture shock.

[Stellalarella]

I have a friend who puts it this way:

Everyone has two walls in their life.  Past the first wall and you are friendly, get past the second wall and you are close friends forever.  In the north (where my friend is from) she says everyone has a high first wall and a low second wall.  In the south (where I have lived my whole life) the first wall is really low.  This is everyone complaining about people being friendly and welcoming with no follow through.  The second wall is really high because you are often so busy with the people you are related to and already know.

If you want to live in the south, you will have to enjoy people being genuinely happy to see you again, but not ready to make personal time for you.  Although, I do not imply that we should get together if I do not intend to follow through.

It is easier to make friends in some of the more metropolitan or transient areas than in the towns where everyone knew your grandmother and the people who have been around 15 years are the newcomers who live in the old Jones house...

 

Astute.  Thanks for the insight.

 

I have had some friends who've taken me in...but I've been here a long while.  :)  I will say that I will often meet someone new and really hit it off--then find out that they, too, are not from here.  

 

When my oldest daughter went to kindergarten she quickly made friends.  The moms of those friends and I met a few months later and discovered that we had all been raised in the midwest and transplanted to LR by a spousal job move.  It was  interesting to me how these girls-raised-by-midwestern-mommas gravitated toward one another.  It's not like the girls were interviewing kids on the playground asking if they head home for Christmas in Nebraska or Kansas.

[Chelli]

I just drove up to Bentonville-Fayetteville-Springdale-Rogers to go the the Crystal Bridges Art Museum.  We hit it on the weekend that the leaves turned.  It was so lovely.

 

The museum is truly world class.  The large grounds and trails surrounding the museum are very beautiful.   

 

Crystal Bridges, the Central Arkansas Library System, and the State Parks of Arkansas make me very proud to have lived in Arkansas.  

 

I can't really call myself an Arkansan, though, because I have never attended a Razorback game.  They did "call the hogs" at church, though....does that count?

 

When people say football is religion here and that you don't plan anything without first checking the Razorback and hunting calendar, they mean it.  

 

Awwww, you're making me miss home.

 

We were at my sister's wedding in Eureka Springs at the end of October and the leaves were spectacular. My dh (who is from Oklahoma) always says that Arkansas is the best kept secret in the U.S. for it's natural beauty.

 

I had to "call the hogs" by myself at a Ladies' Luncheon when my husband was graduating from seminary. One of the couple had been hired at a church in Arkansas and I made the off hand comment that they would need to learn how to "call the hogs". A professor's wife stepped to the mic and asked me to show them how that was done. It was pretty mortifying because "calling the hogs" doesn't sound nearly as awesome when you are doing it by yourself in a room that is dead silent.

 

******Sorry for the hijack, OP*******

[Stellalarella]

I love the south. It's much cheaper, I prefer warm over cold any day, and it's closer to the beach.

 

Racism- I'm sure it's there, and you probably have a small population that is more vocal than you'd hear in the north, but I really enjoyed being in the south because of the diversity. We lived some places up north, where you'd be hard pressed to see anyone who wasn't white for months. We also had a huge Klan presence in the areas we lived in the northern states. I've never had more friends from different ethnic backgrounds than I did in the south.

 

Services- If you live near a larger city, you should have no problem accessing whatever therapy you need. Small towns anywhere will have more problems.

 

Culture- Manners are much more important. You should say sir and ma'am, write thank you notes, and always offer your guests something to eat.

 

You should also offer them Sweet Tea- don't try to serve any unsweet tea without warning.

 

I don't think you'd have any problem finding a Catholic community in a medium sized city.

 

Public Education- It varies. You can have some really great schools and some really crappy ones. I think most southern states are trying hard to improve education. My kids were too little or not born when we lived in the north so I don't know much about the education except that our school taxes were really expensive.

 

It's hot. I love it, but I live in a border/middle state now and am amazed at how many people complain about the heat. I think it is not hot at all and actually too cold but my friends who are used to cooler climates are miserable when I feel like it's just starting to feel warm.

 

Snow in the south is like an emergency situation. It's a combination of people not knowing how to drive in it, the cities not being prepared to clean it up much before it melts, and some sort of mass hysteria. Our first winter in Augusta we were surprised when we showed up at church and found it closed after what I would call a hard frost. We hadn't even thought of checking for closing because there was NO snow. It works out because it rarely snows which could be good or bad depending on what you like.

 

Bad- there are more bugs and the bugs are bigger. You don't get the early hard frosts to kill them off in Oct and Nov. Fire ants are no joke.

 

KY and TN are not the deep south and people from there may be considered northerners by those from more southern states. KY and TN are very different from GA/AL/MS/SC/LA, etc. I'd recommend living near but not necessarily in the bigger cities- Atlanta, GA; Columbia, SC; Augusta, GA; Birmingham, AL; Charlotte, NC; New Orleans, LA, etc. In the big cities, you'll have access to cool things to do, medical specialists, and homeschool activities or cool charter and magnet schools. If you end up in a small town in the boonies it could be much more of a culture shock.

 

 You. Are. Not. Kidding. About. The bugs.  

 

The first time I saw a cockroach that big I yelled.   A native of the city told us those are "palmetto bugs, not cockroaches, honey."  Please note, palmetto bug is a euphemism for really-amazingly-big-and-hairy-cockroach.

 

In my city, school is called off if there is a forecast of snow.  :)  And wisely so.  With these hills, it just isn't a good idea.  Also, the city has only like 3 plows or something.

 

The gift of the south, though, for its mild winters is a little something we call freezing rain.  The freezing rain that started on Christmas Day took out our power.  It hit our region so hard, our street didn't get power back on for four days.  And it also happened the same way about 12 years ago.  No power from Christmas to New Years.  

 

But generally speaking, the winters are nice.  :)

 

[shinyhappypeople]

P.S.  Racism and poverty are not unique to the south.  I live in "too-liberal-for-its-own-good" California and racism absolutely rears its ugly head on a regular basis.  It might be more subtle than some other places (maybe) but it's definitely here.  Same with poverty. So, don't let the racism/poverty stereotypes worry you.   

[shinyhappypeople]

 You. Are. Not. Kidding. About. The bugs.  

 

The first time I saw a cockroach that big I yelled.   A native of the city told us those are "palmetto bugs, not cockroaches, honey."  Please note, palmetto bug is a euphemism for really-amazingly-big-and-hairy-cockroach.

 

Oh my gosh, I forgot about the roach (?)  that FLEW.  It had wings and it friggin FLEW!

 

Oh, and I remember being warned not to walk through the tall grass or I'd get chiggers.

 

I still love (and miss!) the south, though.

[Stellalarella]

Awwww, you're making me miss home.

 

We were at my sister's wedding in Eureka Springs at the end of October and the leaves were spectacular. My dh (who is from Oklahoma) always says that Arkansas is the best kept secret in the U.S. for it's natural beauty.

 

I had to "call the hogs" by myself at a Ladies' Luncheon when my husband was graduating from seminary. One of the couple had been hired at a church in Arkansas and I made the off hand comment that they would need to learn how to "call the hogs". A professor's wife stepped to the mic and asked me to show them how that was done. It was pretty mortifying because "calling the hogs" doesn't sound nearly as awesome when you are doing it by yourself in a room that is dead silent.

 

******Sorry for the hijack, OP*******

 

 

OH, no--the OP needs to know that these things really do happen.  Sooner or later, when you live in Arkansas you will end up "calling the hogs" at a non-football event.  The first time we flew here I remember hearing women hotly discussing football at the terminal.  Huh, I thought.  That's interesting.  

 

And how many ladies at the Ladies' Luncheon reapplied their lipstick following dessert?  That needs to be told, too.  

 

I have absolutely flunked the lipstick and smooth hair requirements.  I am grateful for the kind friends who have decided to love my frizzy headed, non-lipsticked self anyway.  

[boscopup]

The first time I saw a cockroach that big I yelled.   A native of the city told us those are "palmetto bugs, not cockroaches, honey."  Please note, palmetto bug is a euphemism for really-amazingly-big-and-hairy-cockroach.

 

Agreed! Thankfully, we don't have those in north AL. You have to go farther south to get them. When my brother lived in New Orleans, his apartment was literally crawling with those things, and they would dive bomb you. Scary!

 

The fire ants here are bad now. You know there are fire ant problems if you see a lot of dead armadillos on the side of the road (I don't believe armadillos come in live variety... the one we saw digging at Disney World a few feet from us must have been animatronic :lol: ).

 

[Scarlett]

Kiplinger gave LIttle Rock a #1 ranking. http://www.kiplinger.com/article/real-estate/T006-C000-S002-10-great-places-to-live.html

 

I think Little Rock is becoming a terrific little city. Our city has park after park after park. Parks everywhere! There has also been a big project to build miles and miles of biking/walking trails around the river front. We now sport the world's longest foot bridge. Of course, they called it The Big Dam Bridge since it goes over the bridge. We have had a major push for downtown revitalization that has been quite successful, beginning with the Clinton library. Next up is a downtown technology park.

 

Of course, if you fly in, you can come to our recently renovated and renamed airport-the Bill and Hillary Clinton airport. It's known to the locals as the HIll-BIlly Airport.

 

We do have a sizeable catholic community who support several private Catholic schools.

 

WE HAVE THE BEST LIBRARY SYSTEM YOU CAN POSSIBLY IMAGINE. I don't usually use all caps, but I feel that strongly about it. I love, love, love, love, love, love the Central Arkansas Library System. We have 13 libraries within our city...including 1 brand new library just for children. Of course it got named for Hillary, but anyway... Check outs are for long periods, I usually have about a 100 books at a time, and I can get whatever book I need, even to the point of requesting a new purchase. :)

 

The state parks in Arkansas are just fabulous. And beautiful. Caves, waterfalls, unmatched beauty. Our state also has free educational nature centers--including one in downtown LR.

 

LR weathered the Great Recession fairly well. When other cities were greatly suffering, LR was doing OK.

 

The governor of our state is a reasonable kinda guy. He hasn't lied, cheated on his wife, run his mouth off, or generally embarrassed us at a national level. Does that count as a perk for moving to a state?

 

LR is big on recycling. The city just gave us a big wheeled bin for all recyclables--everything gets thrown into one very large cart. It is sorted out later at the plant.

 

We have trolleys downtown. :)

 

We have a real mountain at the western edge of town. :) Pinnacle Mountain. It's a 40 minutes climb to the top and offers lovely views of the Arkansas river and downtown.

I grew up in AR. lived there for most of my life until a year ago. I love AR. Most of it is beautiful....the Delta, southeast, not so much. But Little Rock, Hot Springs, Northwest AR, all very nice areas. You haven't mentioned making a living, but LR would be ok for jobs and services.

 

The state parks are just incredible. We are in OK now.....much flatter and well just so so to me. I would move back to AR in a heartbeat if dh had a job there.

[kiana]

I've just moved to the deep deep/rural south, heh.

 

There is definitely a thriving Catholic church in this small and rural town. I drive past on Sunday and see large groups of people coming out. I don't know anything more about it.

 

The racism is more in-your-face but quite honestly I find that easier to deal with than catty comments about how "those people" are.

 

The COL is definitely cheaper.

 

Summer is going to be horrible. OMG the bugs -- I had never seen a cockroach in my life so the first time I saw a 4-inch one it was a bit of a surprise.

 

The education system is pretty bad. I'm not going to share specifics here.

 

There has been surprisingly little culture shock going from rural midwest to here.

[Ellie]

I love the south. It's much cheaper, I prefer warm over cold any day, and it's closer to the beach.

 

Racism- I'm sure it's there, and you probably have a small population that is more vocal than you'd hear in the north, but I really enjoyed being in the south because of the diversity. We lived some places up north, where you'd be hard pressed to see anyone who wasn't white for months. We also had a huge Klan presence in the areas we lived in the northern states. I've never had more friends from different ethnic backgrounds than I did in the south.

 

Services- If you live near a larger city, you should have no problem accessing whatever therapy you need. Small towns anywhere will have more problems.

 

Culture- Manners are much more important. You should say sir and ma'am, write thank you notes, and always offer your guests something to eat.

 

You should also offer them Sweet Tea- don't try to serve any unsweet tea without warning.

 

I don't think you'd have any problem finding a Catholic community in a medium sized city.

 

Public Education- It varies. You can have some really great schools and some really crappy ones. I think most southern states are trying hard to improve education. My kids were too little or not born when we lived in the north so I don't know much about the education except that our school taxes were really expensive.

 

It's hot. I love it, but I live in a border/middle state now and am amazed at how many people complain about the heat. I think it is not hot at all and actually too cold but my friends who are used to cooler climates are miserable when I feel like it's just starting to feel warm.

 

Snow in the south is like an emergency situation. It's a combination of people not knowing how to drive in it, the cities not being prepared to clean it up much before it melts, and some sort of mass hysteria. Our first winter in Augusta we were surprised when we showed up at church and found it closed after what I would call a hard frost. We hadn't even thought of checking for closing because there was NO snow. It works out because it rarely snows which could be good or bad depending on what you like.

 

Bad- there are more bugs and the bugs are bigger. You don't get the early hard frosts to kill them off in Oct and Nov. Fire ants are no joke.

 

KY and TN are not the deep south and people from there may be considered northerners by those from more southern states. KY and TN are very different from GA/AL/MS/SC/LA, etc. I'd recommend living near but not necessarily in the bigger cities- Atlanta, GA; Columbia, SC; Augusta, GA; Birmingham, AL; Charlotte, NC; New Orleans, LA, etc. In the big cities, you'll have access to cool things to do, medical specialists, and homeschool activities or cool charter and magnet schools. If you end up in a small town in the boonies it could be much more of a culture shock.

 

True. All of it's true.

 

I'd add Norfolk, Virginia, to the list. Beautiful, historic area. And yes, Virginia is most definitely The South. :-)

[SailorMom]

That wall analogy is perfect!!!!  I'm stealing that one :)

As for cost of living - it is cheaper in many places, but where we lived on the coast it was every bit as expensive as places in California (which is ridiculous....).  It is amazing to me how localized the higher prices can be.

[Tess in the Burbs]

It's just different than other areas of the country.  I've lived in a few places in this country that were very different my southern upbringing.  You adapt.  

 

I do remember once telling a good friend from Canada he wouldn't do well in Mississippi.  He often said things that were just wrong in so many ways.  It was who he was.  I told him he'd probably get his butt whooped down south pretty quick over some of his comments.  He couldn't understand that racial issues do exist, that religion is important to large groups of people, and sometimes being different in the south isn't good.  

Personally in the larger cities I think it's fine compared to other places.  It's when you get more rural you feel like an outsider.  And if you have some very liberal views you may not find anywhere that you truly feel welcome.  Change is hard and southerners don't tend to move on from past issues.  

 

I like the south.  I grew up here.  Left here many times.  Always come back.  And I hate the heat/humidity and bugs.  But it's home.  And change is happening.  I remember when people asked what church you attended....not 'if' you attended.  But change is slower here.  

 

Also, what area you go to matters.  Some are used to other people moving in.  Some areas not so much. As for Catholic....seems like you could look at city data for the % religion on the city you are considering.  

 

 

[mytwomonkeys]

I grew up in Atlanta & as an adult, my husband and I, we lived in Charlotte for five years. Both are fabulous places for homeschoolers. A lot of transplants live in cities, so the Deep South thing won't apply as much. Very diverse. Catholic friendly.

 

That's my two cents :)

[AimeeM]

I'm in upstate SC. While in BJU land (BJU is based here), there is a very large Catholic population and it's very homeschool friendly. We have over a half dozen active Catholic parishes, 4 Catholic co-ops that I'm aware of; downtown there are art museums, a children's museum, a zoo, tons of parks all over the upstate.

It's very family friendly AND affordable.

As to education... well, I'll just say that there's a reason most of the private schools are filled to capacity and there's a HUGE homeschool community. There are better schools, but they are often filled to the brim and, frankly, the best school in an all around bad state for education still isn't going to be great.

There are a lot of transplants here - my husband is one and many at his office are from the north (DH is philly born and bred).

Very, very friendly. Picturesque neighborhoods where children still ride their bikes into the late evening, block parties, everybody helps everybody. I thought it was just my subdivision, but I hear similar stories about other neighborhoods around here.

[AimeeM]

NM. Misread.

Well - to avoid hurricanes you'd have to stay away from eastern TX, LA, AL, MS, FL, GA, and the Carolinas at least....

As for religion - it is very pervasive and diverse.  Locals don't ask if you go to church, they ask where.  Lots of Catholics, but I never noticed a "pocket" of them.

Cuisine....  well - it's getting better (meaning, more diverse and more choices).  :)  Southern cuisine is so varied - depending on what part of the south you're in - that it is hard to quantify.  Lots of fried food, though :)

Conservative states also have good services ;)  Really, they do.  It is more about the income level of the population than anything else from what I noticed.  More metropolitan areas will have the best choices, as will larger communities along the coastline (but the hurricanes....).  DEEP south - in my experience this usually refers to more rural areas all over the south, but usually in AL, LA, and MS.  You'll find "deep south" right next to New Orleans which is more metropolitan south with a lot of deep south food and music. 

Community... hmmm... well - the 'community' a lot of people think of when they think of the south is the small town version, and it can be hard to "break in" in small towns.  Everyone already knows everyone since before they were born sorta thing...  It can make it hard to feel like you fit in.  Don't get me wrong, most people are very nice and friendly, but it is usually glaringly obvious who wasn't born there, IYKWIM.

They also don't take kindly to 'northerners' views of many aspects of the culture.  They think some of the stereotypes are ridiculous, and some downright insulting.  I found it was always best not to bring any of them up, lol....  They have, of course, assigned northerners a fair share of inaccurate stereotypes as well :)

Of the places I've been in the south that I loved, that seem to be what you're looking for - I'd say the Cumberland Gap area of Tennessee.  Gorgeous, far from hurricanes (they get the end of them sometimes), very southern.  I'm not sure how good services are there.  I've never been to Kentucky, so can't comment on that but I've heard it is also very nice :)

I also want to add that you would have to prepare for true culture shock.  Really.  Things move more slowly, racism (in both directions) can be pretty bad, poverty is pervasive, the educational systems aren't very good....

 

[AimeeM]

Oh, and the term "bless your heart..." can mean so many different things.  It can mean "well, scr*w you" (please excuse my language), or it can sincerely mean "bless your heart - you poor thing; I'm praying for a speedy recovery/good trip/etc". Context, context, context, lol.

[Lanny]

A late cousin lived in Mississippi. You could look into the possibility of living in Jackson, which is quite a way from the Gulf Coast, with regard to Hurricanes.  

 

I worked on a job assignment in Huntsville, AL; and when I was looking for job assignments, Huntsville was always near the top of the list of places I would like to be, because of the size of the city. Huntsville has the highest per capita population of Engineers in the USA...

 

I lived in Texas for 28 years and do not consider Texas to be in "the Deep South" but you could do far worse. Texas should probably be at or near the top of your list, because of the economy, taxes, cost of living, etc.

 

Parts of Tennessee are really beautiful. I always enjoyed going from TX, via TN, when I was going to the N.E.  I especially remember the area in East Tennesee, Knoxville, etc. and then driving North on I-81 in the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia.  Beautiful scenery...

 

It can be extremely cold in the Deep South,  and in Texas; but that is very rare and if it  happens, in a few days the weather is much warmer. The coldest place I have been was Huntsville, AL, where the real temperature got down to -13  (not wind chill) one December. I was also in Nashville, TN once when it got down to 3 or  4 below zero.

[ScoutTN]

I grew up til middle school in Ohio and also lived in NYC and New England growing up.

On the southern side, I've lived in rural VA, Charlottesvile, VA, Jackson, MS and now Nashville, TN.

 

I think the observations about southern steroetypes being more noticable in rural or small town areas is true. In a place like Nashville, where it seems nobody is actually from here, the southern culture is more mellow and blended with lots of other influences.

 

I love Nashville!

Real city with a symphony, good theater, nice restaurants and shopping etc. And country music and and NFL team. Vanderbilt University and a number of smaller colleges. Good medical including Vandy Children's Hospital. Good economy - on the relative scale for the nationwide situation. No state income tax, but 9.75 sales tax. Property taxes much lower than up north. Reasonable sized airport.

 

Weather is moderate 4 season climate. About 2.5 months of winter - hat and gloves are not just for decoration, but we get lots of 50 degree, sunny days in winter too. Hot in the summer, but not nearly as hot as MS. Very pretty here, rolling hills. We do get some tornadoes.  Lots of farms not far away. Horse farms. Real farms that provide produce, meats and dairy for a strong and growing group of famer's markets. 

 

Fabulous place to homeschool! Zillions of homeschoolers of many varieties, though conservative Protestants are a large group, for sure. Several large Catholic churches in the city, several with schools. And Aquinas college. People ask where you go to church, not if.

 

SAHM is normal here too. More common in more affluent areas, of course. Great library system. Lots of tutorials and other homeschool resources. Zoo, children's science museum, art musuem, kid-friendly botanical garden, excellent parks etc. 

 

We are 3 hours from real mountains and 8 from the beach (Gulf coast or East coast). 

 

I loved Charlottesville when I was there, but don't know if I would now that I'm not a student or right out of school. MS was definitely a different world. Great people, but I would never move back.

 

NYC stresses me out. I am not a city person. Gotta have trees! 

 

Anyway, consider Music City! 

 

Mrs. Lilac, maybe we need a WTM Nashville/middle TN get together? I know there are at least 3 or 4 other boardies in or near Nashville. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mrs. Lilac]

I think Nashville itself is GREAT.  Very diverse, lots to do, lots of homeschoolers.  The further out suburbs is where you get more of the negative elements of the South.

 

And yes, the bugs here are science-fiction worthy.

 

Ooo, a WTM Middle TN get together, sounds promising! :)

[umsami]

I've lived in Jacksonville, Orlando, and Naples, FL... as well as Nashville, TN.  I'm originally from Michigan, but we've also lived in NYC and Albany, NY and Washington, DC.

 

I loved living in Nashville--but this was 15 years ago, so I can't speak for it now.  It was just becoming cool--and was a great place to be.  Not sure I'd want to live there today as a visibly Muslim woman, but back then, it was fine.  (I also wasn't wearing hijab--so not as much of an issue.)   

 

Jacksonville, FL is far more the "South" than the rest of Florida.

 

As for hurricanes, you always have tons of notice.  You can move.  You can join the masses at Publix (super market) and Home Depot...pretending like you never knew one was coming. ;)  Much more worrisome are tornadoes, which have no warning. Get a weather radio.

 

There are no basements in FL...and at least where my Aunt lives in AL.  Lived in an apartment in Nashville, so they might exist up that way. That can be an issue for folks from up North used to that extra space.  

 

Southern states are poor states, and tend to have Republican-led legislatures.  That means often less services for people in need (most States down here were against expanding Medicaid even with the gov't paying for it), etc.  That could be a real concern.  Another issue is the schools.  They are simply not as good.  Sure, there are exceptions--but in general, they offer no where near the quality of the NY schools.  Down here, things like art and music (if offered) are "specials"--which occur every two weeks if you're lucky.  In Jacksonville, every single other Wednesday was an early release day, which could be trouble for those who work.  Although this is a homeschooling board, not everybody has all of their kids in homeschool.   

 

Good thing is that homeschooling laws are usually more relaxed.  You can also do the FL Bright Scholarships for college, take college credits at a community college for free in H.S., etc. as a homeschooler.

 

It can be very lonely being a non-Protestant, non-Conservative.  The Tea Party is very much alive in well in local and state politics down here.   Yet if choose an artsy area, you're more likely to meet kindred spirits.  I've had Catholic friends everywhere I've lived, and I haven't heard of much anti-Catholic stuff going on. 

 

Racism (anti-Latino, anti-Black, anti-anything) is much stronger than I experienced up North.  Not everybody is that way, but it's far more prevalent.  (And far less hidden.  For example, I've heard older Southern White Ladies refer to African-American men as "boy.")

 

One great thing is neither Florida nor TN have state income tax. 

 

I'm not a fan of the snow, but I'd move back up North in a heartbeat if we had a job opportunity.