Can We Talk about the Pearls Here?

[elizam]

I just read this article and was stunned. ALso, many moms posted comments on another message board about it and equated following the Pearls with outright child abuse.

 

I don't follow the Pearls. I don't hate them or think they are evil abuse advocates, either. I think they would be sickened to hear of these abuse cases. I wonder how the slander is going to affect their ministry and their lives.

 

I hope this isn't too big a can of worms???

 

http://www.charlotte.com/breaking_news/story/692245.html

[Sue G in PA]

There was a time when we followed their teachings on discipline. I told myself that it was Biblical to spank your children w/ a "rod". Hands were for loving, not spanking. I even (gulp) carried my "rod" (a wooden spoon) around with me in the van for when we were out. Now before you all go calling CPS on me...this lasted about a week before I realized it was just plain wrong. My children never humbled themselved after a spanking like the book said. Praying w/ them afterward seems like hypocrisy to me. It was so unnatural. AND, it CAN lead to abuse if you aren't careful. Many swear by the Pearl's teachings, but it just didn't work for us. That story is so very tragic. I doubt, however, that the Pearl's way of doing things was the whole story. This woman obviously had issues.

[Ashleen]

My parents believed in spanking with a "rod" and it absolutely led to abuse. The problem is that a parent who is spanking with a stick cannot tell how hard they're hitting the child (if you used the palm of your hand, for example, your hand would sting if you hit hard). My parents sometimes were able to simply spank me with a rod, but often they'd lose control and keep hitting me until I had welts, etc. Once my mom was using a yard stick because it was the only stick she could find; it broke and she just kept hitting me with the broken stick. I would absolutely never listen to parenting advice from anyone who advocates spanking with a piece of plumbing. Oh, and I was never, ever, ever, ever contrite after a spanking. I was always more rebellious afterward. Because in my heart I knew that nothing I had ever done justified the kind of spanking I'd received. So I never regretted my own behavior; in my mind, my parents were the ones who were wrong. If the goal was to spank me until I showed a contrite spirit, they would have killed me first (and a few times I thought they might).

[nmoira]

The mere contemplation of beating toddlers with plumbing supply line or of switching babies makes me see red.

[Ashleen]

The mere contemplation of beating toddlers with plumbing supply line or of switching babies makes me see red.

 

:iagree:

[bkpan]

Blaming the Pearls for what happened to that little boy is really no different than blaming it on the homeschooling. The cause of the child's abuse was an abusive mother, who herself had an abusive childhood. I have read a great deal of the Pearl's books and I find them to be committed to the Lord and to the strengthening of families. It is those that apply their child-training principles with distortions and anger that hurt children.

 

They do not advocate EVER disciplining a child in anger, leaving marks on a child, or assaulting the dignity of a child. They DO emphasize the necessity of joy in a family and in training the children.

 

I think that what so often happens is over-reaction on the part of parents so wanting their dc to not become casualties of this culture. They are zealous, and in reading some of the Pearl's literature, focus mainly on "training children to first-time obedience" and then become frustrated when their dc don't perform properly. They aren't as zeroed in on the Pearls' admonitions to parents. I found that their harshest criticisms were for the parents who weren't willing to give all they have for their dc. To first "clean out their own cup" before they attempt to train their dc.

 

I hope this thread stays civil, though I don't expect it to. I do feel sorry for the Pearls and how often their teaching is misrepresented, taken out of context, or blamed, for the misapplication of discipline by over-zealous parents. Just my opinion, and I don't even really spank anymore. I was one of those over-zealous parents, but I don't blame the Pearls for my misapplication at times of their teaching. I blame myself, and for not trusting my mommy instincts more. Their principles are more a part of their background and the southern culture they were raised in. It is no different than any other child-rearing book. Some may fit your family and some may not. But that doesn't make them villains.

 

Kim

[cin]

beating toddlers with plumbing supply line or of switching babies

 

I have read the Pearls' books on child-rearing and I honestly do not remember them recommending using plumbing line. Regarding the switch....They do recommend switching the kids, but I thought it didn't start til around 12-18 mos old. And that is when the kids are old enough to know what NO means. I call that negative reinforcement.

 

There was a time when it was normal for children to be spanked or switched. My dad use to talk about having to go out to the barn to get his own switch. And you know what. He and his brothers and sisters grew up to be well-adjusted, contributing members of society. And they were NOT abused.

 

In those days children were more obedient & well-behaved. And there were fewer discipline problems, children running wild, teens running the streets, and juvenile hall was MUCH smaller. Schools were more productive too. Johnny didn't have ADD, Johnny knew to keep his trap shut and his butt in his chair. *I* have ADD, without the hyperactivity component, and I made it through school without getting in trouble. *I* would get a whuppin when I got home. (Please don't slam me about ADD. It is real, I know, but it is also WAY overdiagnosed in the public schools).

 

I do beleive in spanking. I have a strong-willed child and spanking is the only thing that has worked for her. Do I beleive in abuse? Nope. Does she get abused? Nope. She gets stinging spanks, usually one, sometimes 2, depending on the offense. And she is no longer a wild, tantruming child. (Her longest tantrum was about 3 1/2 hours). She is a well-mannered little girl who is obedient in public. She does not run from me, back talk or yell at me. Her and her sister do really well together. She still pouts occasionally, but it has been a while since she's had a full-blown tantrum.

 

We also talk alot. We talk about why we should and shouldn't do things. We talk about why we are spanking. We talk about how other people feel. Do other people want to listen to you? Would you like it if someone did that to you? If you run here, could you run into someone? THen what would happen? Would you like that? And so on, and so on.

 

And that's what we do.

[sdWTMer]

:iagree:

[Ellie]

I don't think anyone can comment on the Pearls who has not read their books.

 

I have read their books and receive their newsletter. I wish I had known about them when my dc were little (or that I'd had the sense they did).

 

IMHO the Ezzos' materials are abusive, not the Pearls'.

[nmoira]

I have read the Pearls' books on child-rearing and I honestly do not remember them recommending using plumbing line.

Here's an article by Michael Pearl. Go down to "What Instrument Should I Use?"

 

I'll find a cite for switching babies... and update.

[Jennifer in MI]

What I don't understand about the Pearls (and other books I've read about spanking) is that you only spank after you've calmed down. That just seems so cruel. If you've both calmed down and talked about it and the child seems contrite, why then go ahead with the spanking? Why not let the talk be it?

 

Do the Pearls really advocate spanking (or switching) a child at 12 - 18 months? Wow. At that age children often just don't have the impulse control. It's our job as parents to distract them or take them out of a situation rather than switch them.

 

I get so sad when I read about spanking because I just can't imagine using it as a discipline tool (and, yes, I have an extremely spirited child myself!).

[Spy Car]

Here's an article by Michael Pearl. Go down to "What Instrument Should I Use?"

 

I'll find a cite for switching babies... and update.

 

I'm shocked!!!

 

Bill (who is just unenlightened enough to wonder if these people don't deserve a dose of their own medicine)

[Plucky]

I don't understand the need to wear plumbing line around your neck or have some in each room. I think the Pearl's should relook at some of the discipline advice they give.

[nmoira]

Here's more:

How young is too young?

Apparently its OK if you call it "using a training rod" rather than "corporal punishment."

 

From the same article, regarding a 6 month old baby.

It's also OK if you don't call it "punishment."

[Jennifer in MI]

Here's an article by Michael Pearl. Go down to "What Instrument Should I Use?"

 

I'll find a cite for switching babies... and update.

 

 

OMG. I think I'm going to be sick. I really shouldn't have read that. I'm seriously in tears now thinking that if I'd read this as a new parent I may have actually implemented this. Thank God I didn't. I'm off to hug my children. . .

[nmoira]

Here's an article by Michael Pearl. Go down to "What Instrument Should I Use?"

 

I'll find a cite for switching babies... and update.

One more cite on the supply line that doesn't say "other people use" but rather "the rod we speak of is..."

[Pamela H in Texas]

I've read the entire book (it's available in full online) and the Pearls DO advocate child abuse. Period. It is neither legal nor Biblical. However, just because they advocate a certain amount of child abuse doesn't mean a parent isn't responsible if they take it that far and certainly if they take it further!

[chickenpatty]

Blaming the Pearls for what happened to that little boy is really no different than blaming it on the homeschooling. The cause of the child's abuse was an abusive mother, who herself had an abusive childhood. I have read a great deal of the Pearl's books and I find them to be committed to the Lord and to the strengthening of families. It is those that apply their child-training principles with distortions and anger that hurt children.

 

They do not advocate EVER disciplining a child in anger, leaving marks on a child, or assaulting the dignity of a child. They DO emphasize the necessity of joy in a family and in training the children.

 

I think that what so often happens is over-reaction on the part of parents so wanting their dc to not become casualties of this culture. They are zealous, and in reading some of the Pearl's literature, focus mainly on "training children to first-time obedience" and then become frustrated when their dc don't perform properly. They aren't as zeroed in on the Pearls' admonitions to parents. I found that their harshest criticisms were for the parents who weren't willing to give all they have for their dc. To first "clean out their own cup" before they attempt to train their dc.

 

I hope this thread stays civil, though I don't expect it to. I do feel sorry for the Pearls and how often their teaching is misrepresented, taken out of context, or blamed, for the misapplication of discipline by over-zealous parents. Just my opinion, and I don't even really spank anymore. I was one of those over-zealous parents, but I don't blame the Pearls for my misapplication at times of their teaching. I blame myself, and for not trusting my mommy instincts more. Their principles are more a part of their background and the southern culture they were raised in. It is no different than any other child-rearing book. Some may fit your family and some may not. But that doesn't make them villains.

 

Kim

 

:iagree:

[elegantlion]

"Don’t be so indiscreet as to spank your children in public—including the church restroom. I get letters regularly telling of trouble with in-laws who threaten to report them to the authorities. Parents have called the Gestapo on their married children. Church friends who have noses longer than the pews on which they perch can cause a world of trouble. If you cannot get them trained before going out in public, stay home and read our four books again." Quote from the article

 

This sounds like an incident we discussed here earlier this year. The article is sad, he has such a fear of children in his tone, and this quote makes it sound as if he knows his methods are sure to cause trouble.

[Mrs Mungo]

Personally, I find the Pearls and Ezzos *at least* borderline abusive. I disagree with their world view that all children are automatically mean, sneaky, rebellious, etc and must have their spirits broken so that they can be controlled. Babies do not need to be discipline, they need guidance.

 

I think people who are parented this way are put in danger of further abuse down the road. It's not present in *all* of the materials presented by either group but it is unquestionably there.

[Colleen]

I wonder how the slander is going to affect their ministry and their lives.

 

What struck you as slanderous? I'm not seeing that.

[Quiver0f10]

The mere contemplation of beating toddlers with plumbing supply line or of switching babies makes me see red.

 

This is what made me toss the Pearl's book into the trash, where in my opinion, it belongs.

[Colleen]

I don't think anyone can comment on the Pearls who has not read their books.

 

Why not?

[clarkacademy]

Wow we really can tak about anything on other groups I am on we are not allowed to bring this abortion capital punishment or religion. I have seen it all right here this past week. :glare: oh and what is Ezzos????

[Pensguys]

Wow we really can tak about anything on other groups I am on we are not allowed to bring this abortion capital punishment or religion. I have seen it all right here this past week. :glare: oh and what is Ezzos????

 

I'm just wondering....:confused::confused:Do you not use punctuation? I'm sorry to say this but I have a really hard time reading your posts. (There have been other times where I've just given up....and I'd like to hear what you have to say.)

[Kelli in TN]

I don't think anyone can comment on the Pearls who has not read their books.

 

I have read their books and receive their newsletter. I wish I had known about them when my dc were little (or that I'd had the sense they did).

 

IMHO the Ezzos' materials are abusive, not the Pearls'.

 

That's fair.

 

I've read a couple of their books, met both of them personally and suffered through all four sessions of a seminar starring them.

 

So I can comment, right?

 

When I read the first book I was at a place in my life where I was very open to their message. I was excited to have this wonderful fool proof formula that seemed like the ticket to the magic train that led to the land of perfect family life. We were going to tie heart strings and we were going to apply the switch and get those attitudes straight.

 

Fast forward a couple of years and life is awful. Truly awful. I have lost the heart of one of my children, thanks to a toxic combination of damaging punishment based parenting on my part and a real mental glitch on the part of said child. The craziness of the Pearls "wisdom" and a touch of Ezzo here and there masked the fragility of this child's psyche. It was a heartbreaking scenario, as I look back over my shoulder at those years.

 

The church we were attending at the time hosted the Pearls and we committed to attend the whole dang thing. I was nearly tingling with excitement. They would have the answers we needed, I just knew it. We would come out of that seminar better parents and we would fix the broken places and God would heal our family and someday it would be our letter of gratitude in their newsletter! And the birds would sing in perfect harmony and the skies would be blue all the time.

 

The first session of the seminar Mr. Pearl explained how to set your child up by leaving something tempting on the counter, cookies perhaps, and then when the child succombed to the temptation, sneaking up with your handy switch and administering blows to the back of the the child's legs. He demonstrated the proper hitting technique with a switch (it was not a plumbing line, just a thin wooden switch). He also demonstrated how to sit a child on your lap to read a story to him or her. During this sweet bonding time it is very important to make sure you have your handy dandy switch nearby because as soon as you the child gets the wiggles you need to be ready to immediately swat a couple of good ones across his legs. Because you are the parent and by golly he is going to enjoy story time with you whether he likes it or not. This was demonstrated to us with a chair, the doll, the switch, and of course, Mr. Pearl.

 

The second session dealt with teens. He explained to us how to deal with teens who express disappointment. Using his youngest daughter as an example (and she was there and had spent the afternoon playing ultimate frisbee with the youth of our church, so I am sure she was delighted to be the example in front of these new friends), he shared that sometimes she liked to go skating. Sometimes they said yes. Sometimes they said no. Pretty normal. However, if they said no and her face registered any disappointment then she was grounded from skating for 6 months. He also shared a story about using a tree branch to administer a spanking? beating? to his teenage son as his teenaged friends looked on. I don't know precisely what he meant by tree branch, he did not have a visual during this session, but my imagination leads me to believe it was probably a pretty big thing.

 

The third session dealt with being better wives. Good wives never expect anything from their husbands and want to have s#x all the time. Good wives never question their husbands. He used a story about a young girl who found herself married to a man who it turns out liked thinks a little kinky (in a way that was uncomfortable to her) and suffered from some hygiene issues. He also chewed tobacco and expected big kisses even with his mouth full of chaw. Mr. Pearl was proud to point out that thanks to the mentoring of Mrs. Pearl this young girl came to accept her lot in life and realize that she needed to change her attitude about this man, but she had no right to expect any changes on his part. And they lived happily ever after. Forever. Or maybe it just felt like forever to the poor girl.

 

The fourth session was the most fun. It was about being a good husband. Mr. Pearl went around the church to each wife and gave them a piece of paper and a pencil and asked them to write down three things that they would like to see their husband do differently. He took up the paper and then spent the next hour or so talking about how to be a better husband by sanctifying your wife by having a lot of s#x. Or something like that. There were a lot of smiling men. Then he read the slips of paper one by one and made fun of the heartfelt requests of the wives as the husbands did their best to guess which one was written by their wives. My husband guessed and he teased me and it was a very dark place in our marriage for a little bit. It was humiliating and I was not the only one who left feeling shamed.

 

I think they are dreadful people. I think their books, their website, their newsletter, and their seminars are dreadful. I base this on what I have personally heard and read from them. None of it is based on second hand information.

[Erica in PA]

I don't mean where did the idea of spanking itself come up. I realize that the Bible does mention corporal punishment in Proverbs. I do interpret that as a command in Scripture, which I know many disagree with.

 

But what I'm wondering where this *particular approach* to spanking comes from as I read these articles by the Pearls, and as I think about Christian culture where this is the predominant model-- basically the idea of spanking with an instrument, having a calm attitude, praying with the child afterward, hugging and showing affection, etc. That's so widely accepted as "the way to parent" by so many of us, and yet, the Bible doesn't say anything about *how* corporal punishment is to be carried out.

 

Does anyone know who first popularized this approach? I don't think Christians in past times and in other areas of the world have had this particular approach, although spanking itself has always been used. I'm just wondering where this particular mindset came from, that is so prominent in America's conservative Christian families.

 

Erica

[Plucky]

Kelli, that sounds truly horrible. Thank you for sharing.

[Quiver0f10]

Kelli, how terrible! :grouphug: Thanks for sharing.

[Amy loves Bud]

Here's more:

How young is too young?

Apparently its OK if you call it "using a training rod" rather than "corporal punishment."

 

From the same article, regarding a 6 month old baby.

It's also OK if you don't call it "punishment."

 

 

Okay, now I'm crying. And sick to my stomach. Why wouldn't you just take the 6 month old child's plate away before he dumps it on the floor? It seems cruel to put the temptation infront of the INFANT and then hit them for considering it. Natural consequences are if you dump the food, it is gone. Seems like a simple enough lesson to me.

 

I just can't understand the reasoning behind their methods. And I'm pretty smart, too.

[Sue G in PA]

I just thought I'd share this website/blog that I came across. I'm not saying I agree or disagree, but the blogger presents a different way of interpreting the "rod" in Proverbs...

 

http://aolff.com/

 

I read through most of the articles there and have to say that it is very interesting. I can't fully wrap my brain around the entire concept b/c it seems a bit too "lenient" to me. But, just thought I'd share.

[Scarlett]

Kelli, that sounds truly horrible. Thank you for sharing.

 

Yes thank you Kelli. I felt a little ill reading that first hand account by someone I trust. I read 'Babywise' when ds8 was 5 weeks old. Apparently, I read the revised edition and apparently I totally skipped over any wacko advice because I honestly do not remember anything remotely like what Kelli just described. All I remember was the order of things of sleep/nurse/wake time and it did work for me.

 

So I've always been a little puzzled by how much distain the name "Pearl" seems to generate. Now I get it. :(

[Serendipity]

Babywise is by the Ezzos. They're not the Pearls. The Pearls are another couple.

[Kelli in TN]

Yes thank you Kelli. I felt a little ill reading that first hand account by someone I trust. I read 'Babywise' when ds8 was 5 weeks old. Apparently, I read the revised edition and apparently I totally skipped over any wacko advice because I honestly do not remember anything remotely like what Kelli just described. All I remember was the order of things of sleep/nurse/wake time and it did work for me.

 

So I've always been a little puzzled by how much distain the name "Pearl" seems to generate. Now I get it. :(

 

Babywise is the Ezzo book.

 

I can tell you my Babywise story if you'd like. It's sad and troubling too.

 

Y'all probably think I must have been such a flake when I was a young mom, following this one and that one to the detriment of my children. Oh, wait, I was a flake!!!:lol:

[Erica in PA]

It doesn't take long in reading the Pearl's materials to get a good idea where they are coming from. I don't think I've read a single article by them and not been offended at some point (and I am a conservative, Bible believing Christian). Others, I'm sure, read their articles and agree wholeheartedly. Either way, you can see very quickly whether you're on the same page as the Pearls. There's not much gray area with them.

 

Here's a sample quote from No Greater Joy's newsletter. It doesn't involve child rearing, but it gives an idea of where they're coming from. This was the postnote to an essay Michael Pearl wrote about his daughter's wedding.

 

"None of my daughters or their husbands asked the state of Tennessee for permission to marry. They did not yoke themselves to government. It was a personal, private covenant, binding them together forever—until death. So when the sodomites have come to share in the state marriage licenses, which will eventually be the law, James and Shoshanna will not be in league with those perverts. And, while I am on the subject, there will come a time when faithful Christians will either revoke their state marriage licenses and establish an exclusively one man-one woman covenant of marriage, or, they will forfeit the sanctity of their covenant by being unequally yoked together with perverts."

 

Erica

[bkpan]

That's fair.

 

I've read a couple of their books, met both of them personally and suffered through all four sessions of a seminar starring them.

 

So I can comment, right?

 

When I read the first book I was at a place in my life where I was very open to their message. I was excited to have this wonderful fool proof formula that seemed like the ticket to the magic train that led to the land of perfect family life. We were going to tie heart strings and we were going to apply the switch and get those attitudes straight.

 

Fast forward a couple of years and life is awful. Truly awful. I have lost the heart of one of my children, thanks to a toxic combination of damaging punishment based parenting on my part and a real mental glitch on the part of said child. The craziness of the Pearls "wisdom" and a touch of Ezzo here and there masked the fragility of this child's psyche. It was a heartbreaking scenario, as I look back over my shoulder at those years.

 

The church we were attending at the time hosted the Pearls and we committed to attend the whole dang thing. I was nearly tingling with excitement. They would have the answers we needed, I just knew it. We would come out of that seminar better parents and we would fix the broken places and God would heal our family and someday it would be our letter of gratitude in their newsletter! And the birds would sing in perfect harmony and the skies would be blue all the time.

 

The first session of the seminar Mr. Pearl explained how to set your child up by leaving something tempting on the counter, cookies perhaps, and then when the child succombed to the temptation, sneaking up with your handy switch and administering blows to the back of the the child's legs. He demonstrated the proper hitting technique with a switch (it was not a plumbing line, just a thin wooden switch). He also demonstrated how to sit a child on your lap to read a story to him or her. During this sweet bonding time it is very important to make sure you have your handy dandy switch nearby because as soon as you the child gets the wiggles you need to be ready to immediately swat a couple of good ones across his legs. Because you are the parent and by golly he is going to enjoy story time with you whether he likes it or not. This was demonstrated to us with a chair, the doll, the switch, and of course, Mr. Pearl.

 

The second session dealt with teens. He explained to us how to deal with teens who express disappointment. Using his youngest daughter as an example (and she was there and had spent the afternoon playing ultimate frisbee with the youth of our church, so I am sure she was delighted to be the example in front of these new friends), he shared that sometimes she liked to go skating. Sometimes they said yes. Sometimes they said no. Pretty normal. However, if they said no and her face registered any disappointment then she was grounded from skating for 6 months. He also shared a story about using a tree branch to administer a spanking? beating? to his teenage son as his teenaged friends looked on. I don't know precisely what he meant by tree branch, he did not have a visual during this session, but my imagination leads me to believe it was probably a pretty big thing.

 

The third session dealt with being better wives. Good wives never expect anything from their husbands and want to have s#x all the time. Good wives never question their husbands. He used a story about a young girl who found herself married to a man who it turns out liked thinks a little kinky (in a way that was uncomfortable to her) and suffered from some hygiene issues. He also chewed tobacco and expected big kisses even with his mouth full of chaw. Mr. Pearl was proud to point out that thanks to the mentoring of Mrs. Pearl this young girl came to accept her lot in life and realize that she needed to change her attitude about this man, but she had no right to expect any changes on his part. And they lived happily ever after. Forever. Or maybe it just felt like forever to the poor girl.

 

The fourth session was the most fun. It was about being a good husband. Mr. Pearl went around the church to each wife and gave them a piece of paper and a pencil and asked them to write down three things that they would like to see their husband do differently. He took up the paper and then spent the next hour or so talking about how to be a better husband by sanctifying your wife by having a lot of s#x. Or something like that. There were a lot of smiling men. Then he read the slips of paper one by one and made fun of the heartfelt requests of the wives as the husbands did their best to guess which one was written by their wives. My husband guessed and he teased me and it was a very dark place in our marriage for a little bit. It was humiliating and I was not the only one who left feeling shamed.

 

I think they are dreadful people. I think their books, their website, their newsletter, and their seminars are dreadful. I base this on what I have personally heard and read from them. None of it is based on second hand information.

 

But couldn't this also be a really poor fit for you and your family? Michael Pearl has a very tongue-in-cheek sense of humor. I guess that maybe the reason I don't find it offensive is that I knew and loved several southern men in my family that reminded me of same. I don't feel belittled by his approach.

 

And the examples of his family. All of his children write articles and participate in their family ministry. They have high regard for their parents and in no way consider themselves to be abused. They do, in fact, seem to have great respect for their parents. His wife is in complete unity with him. She doesn't seem demeaned in any way.

 

It is awful that there was pain in your family from applying their teaching in your home. Honestly, my dh and I made some mistakes, too. However, our dc are younger and we have not suffered in the same way that you have.

 

I guess I'm just saying that maybe they aren't to blame for our mistakes. I also remember reading the Ezzos and hearing people at my church comment on their harsh teaching, and I would find myself thinking, "but that isn't what they are saying AT ALL!"

 

Anyway, I hope that my post isn't hurtful to you, Kelli. That is certainly not my intent.

 

Kim

[Scarlett]

Babywise is by the Ezzos. They're not the Pearls. The Pearls are another couple.

 

Ahhh....ok, well I feel a little better that I didn't totally miss that sort of teaching (the Pearls) when I read that book....ok. But still the Ezzos are suppose to be wacked too?

[Crissy]

In those days children were more obedient & well-behaved. And there were fewer discipline problems, children running wild, teens running the streets, and juvenile hall was MUCH smaller. Schools were more productive too. Johnny didn't have ADD, Johnny knew to keep his trap shut and his butt in his chair. *I* have ADD, without the hyperactivity component, and I made it through school without getting in trouble. *I* would get a whuppin when I got home. (Please don't slam me about ADD. It is real, I know, but it is also WAY overdiagnosed in the public schools).

 

 

It is possible to raise a well behaved, responsible, obedient child (teen) without spanking. It can be done by teaching right from wrong, with lots of guidance, love and mutual respect.

 

My boys behave well at home and in public, but not because they fear a 'whuppin'. They do so because they know it is the correct and responsible thing to do.

[clarkacademy]

I would like to hear a babywise story. I have never heard of any of this stuff. I just know that we cannot talk about the pearls on other groups.

[Kelli in TN]

I guess I'm just saying that maybe they aren't to blame for our mistakes.

 

Nope. They are not to blame. I am to blame. All the damage, all the brokeness, all the ruined childhood years. The joyful childhood that was stolen from my kids was stolen by me. I am not blaming the Pearls.

 

I just think their teachings are dreadful and hatefilled. But God entrusted these children to me and I ruined their childhoods. I know full well where the blame lies.

[Mrs Mungo]

Ahhh....ok, well I feel a little better that I didn't totally miss that sort of teaching (the Pearls) when I read that book....ok. But still the Ezzos are suppose to be wacked too?

 

What they teach in their lectures is quite different from what you will find in their mainstream books. As a former breastfeeding counselor, I have personally seen a Failure To Thrive baby because the mom was strictly following advice from the Ezzos.

[Serendipity]

Here's a website with Ezzo information.

 

http://www.ezzo.info/

 

Yeah, if you'd have read anything by the Pearls, you would have known it. It's pretty 'in your face'.

[Jennifer in MI]

Nope. They are not to blame. I am to blame. All the damage, all the brokeness, all the ruined childhood years. The joyful childhood that was stolen from my kids was stolen by me. I am not blaming the Pearls.

 

I just think their teachings are dreadful and hatefilled. But God entrusted these children to me and I ruined their childhoods. I know full well where the blame lies.

 

:grouphug: Oh Kelli - this made me so sad. :grouphug:

 

Just curious - you don't have to answer - have you talked to your kids about it? What has their reaction been?

[Scarlett]

Babywise is the Ezzo book.

 

I can tell you my Babywise story if you'd like. It's sad and troubling too.

 

Y'all probably think I must have been such a flake when I was a young mom, following this one and that one to the detriment of my children. Oh, wait, I was a flake!!!:lol:

 

I am kind of curious Kelli, because a) I can't imagine you being abusive and b) I can't remember anything in that book that seemed to be advocating abuse! But it has been a while since I read it.

 

Also, I was 35 years old when ds was born. So maybe I just filtered out the material that seemed excessive to me...I dont know. I do know ds slept through the night the first evening I tried their approach. I certainly continued to nurse on ds's demand....but the schedule/order of things really did work for us.

[Serendipity]

Oh, Kelli. My heart is being broken by the sadness I 'hear' in your post. :crying:

 

:grouphug:

[Twinmom]

Blaming the Pearls for what happened to that little boy is really no different than blaming it on the homeschooling. The cause of the child's abuse was an abusive mother, who herself had an abusive childhood.

 

I see the adoptive incentive add-in as the same sort of thing. Without those adoption incentives, many families (such as myself!) could not afford to adopt and raise special needs kiddos. I have four...only two came with assistance, and they weren't even the expensive ones! Also, having run an adoptive agency placing special needs kiddos in homes, I can say that the incensives only barely cover expenses, if that. The agencies are most definitely NOT making money on this deal.

 

Tragic. Awful beyond words. Abusive without question AND most likely preventable. To be blamed on adoption incentives or the Pearls? Nope...faulty logic, there. Blame should be placed where it belongs...on the abusive parents and the social workers who let him stay in that home.

[Erica in PA]

Whoa, Kelli, that is shocking!!! That does sound completely dreadful. I didn't think highly of the Pearls, but this sounds even worse than I thought. I am glad you posted, because it carries a lot of weight coming from you. Wow. That is truly sickening.

 

(Btw, I've gotten a creepy sexual vibe from him in his writing, as well. One example, I recall him describing his daughter dancing around her groom after the wedding until he was "well-salivated." I never want my husband looking at my future son in law as he gazes at our daughter and observing that he seems "well-salivated." Ick. Anyway, what you've said here bears that out as well.

 

Erica

[Scarlett]

But God entrusted these children to me and I ruined their childhoods. I know full well where the blame lies.

 

Awwww Kelli, don't say that! Remember, we do what we know and when we know better we do better.

[Serendipity]

That's a wonderful saying!

[Amy loves Bud]

 

What struck you as slanderous? I'm not seeing that.

 

I'm curious about this, too. Where is the slander?