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So what's so special about Star Wars?


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My son is of the age where the lore of Star Wars is beginning to permeate his world view and I'm getting pressure to let him watch. I recently rented the movie for a preview and was left to muse on how this movie has ever become a classic. The acting is completely incompetent, the directing wanting and the substance unbelievable.

 

Regarding it as a movie my children should see is questionable. There's certainly nothing morally objectionable and nothing that I can see that might bring about nightmares (only fantasies about Princess Leah for me). But what I find most disagreeable with the movie is the interaction between the characters. I'm having a hard time reconciling the fact that Luke, Han and Leah argue their way to victory; all they do is argue and b$%ch at each other. Is this something I want my children to learn?

 

But there's a greater pattern at work here. As I watch some of these children's programs, it strikes me how much modeling of arguing in occurring. Somehow in this alternate reality, participants in a dilemma can somehow bicker their way to a solution. It's no wonder siblings argue so much, that's what so often times gets modeled for them.

 

But back to Star Wars, it's just a bad movie.

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:svengo:

 

First a post questioning Firefly and now this? Is nothing sacred anymore? :001_huh:

 

Star Wars (and I assume here we are talking about the original three movies and not the garbage they've put out in my children's lifetime) is a retelling of a classic hero journey. It's myth relocated to space.

 

Bill Moyers did a PBS series with Joseph Campbell about myth, and Campbell talked about Star Wars as myth. Check it out.

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:svengo:

 

First a post questioning Firefly and now this? Is nothing sacred anymore? :001_huh:

 

Star Wars (and I assume here we are talking about the original three movies and not the garbage they've put out in my children's lifetime) is a retelling of a classic hero journey. It's myth relocated to space.

 

Bill Moyers did a PBS series with Joseph Campbell about myth, and Campbell talked about Star Wars as myth. Check it out.

 

:iagree: Agreed. We are all Star Wars fans here. LOL.

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I have seen a lot of things that I didn't agree with on this board, but I'm pretty sure this tops it all!!!!! ;)

 

Of course the main characters argue - they are coming from completely different backgrounds with completely different expectations. However, they all come together to fight against evil! They get past their differences to not only work for a common goal, but to realize that their differences don't preclude true abiding friendship.

 

Yes, I live with a Star Wars junkie and have listened to the greatness of Star Wars since I met him. :tongue_smilie:

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Star Wars (and I assume here we are talking about the original three movies and not the garbage they've put out in my children's lifetime) is a retelling of a classic hero journey. It's myth relocated to space.

 

I agree. It is campy & fun, imo (at least the original 3; the newer 3 are horrible).

 

Plus, they're a cultural institution. We've seen R2D2 & C3P0 in the Smithsonian.

 

If you do decide to let your dc watch it, you & your dc might enjoy Star Wars -- The Power of Myth (a DK book) to go along w/ it.

 

anthony_daniels5.jpg

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Garbage? I prefer the last 3. ;) :auto: I bought the PBS Moyers/Campbell series. Not just for the SW commentary...that whole series is good stuff. :001_smile:

 

:svengo:

 

First a post questioning Firefly and now this? Is nothing sacred anymore? :001_huh:

 

Star Wars (and I assume here we are talking about the original three movies and not the garbage they've put out in my children's lifetime) is a retelling of a classic hero journey. It's myth relocated to space.

 

Bill Moyers did a PBS series with Joseph Campbell about myth, and Campbell talked about Star Wars as myth. Check it out.

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You know, it kind of is a bad movie. But.... I have some huge fans in my house and as a sorta fan myself I will tell you what's cool about it.

 

1.) It begins somewhere in the middle of a story. You are meant to discover the story yourself. And there is so much they don't say that you are meant to guess now and maybe see later... that makes it rich.

2.) Mythic Hero. George Lucas was a fan of Hero with a Thousand Faces by Joseph Cambell. It's a great anthology of the Hero Myth told throughout history all over the world. Luke is that Hero. Unknown to him, he possesses a great gift that he will realize and ultimately save humanity. I mean, that's 'classic' stuff and Lucas was a true original when he gives it this science fiction twist.

3.) It's an old fashioned pirate/western movie. There is sword play and swinging the girl on a rope. A clear bad guy. The good guys are rough, but wear a white hat, if you know what I mean. Swashbucklersare always guys that are flawed and maybe not perfect, but good. Maybe they argue, but they are loyal.

Anyway, that's my take.

Margaret

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I think Star Wars is an important part of the sci-fi/fantasy culture and history. IMO it helped bring on a resurgence of myth and the hero's journey to the masses.

 

Plus Han Solo was hot! :tongue_smilie:And we have counted light saber battles as part of school before. :D

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:svengo:

 

First a post questioning Firefly and now this? Is nothing sacred anymore? :001_huh:

 

Star Wars (and I assume here we are talking about the original three movies and not the garbage they've put out in my children's lifetime) is a retelling of a classic hero journey. It's myth relocated to space.

 

Bill Moyers did a PBS series with Joseph Campbell about myth, and Campbell talked about Star Wars as myth. Check it out.

 

I was still typing my post when you posted this. Joseph Campbell really was the coolest.

 

I think the last three (first three? the most recently made ones) were kind of silly, too. But, my kids loooove them and think the older ones are the silly ones. I guess the dialog does improve for one thing. But, come on... Jar Jar?

BTW, My 14 yo ds is obsessed and reads all the novels so I am forever hearing about obscure Jedi, bounty hunters, rebel leaders, and other useless information. It would be nice if he focused that energy on math :rolleyes:

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You know, it kind of is a bad movie

 

Kind of a bad movie? It's terrible. With the exception of a few brief moments of fine cinematography, a few interesting scenes and some well-done, but not groundbreaking animation (remember 2001), it's just a bad movie.

 

As for the mythical Campbellian hero, I'll take Frodo, Neo or Bruce over whiny Luke any day.

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Kind of a bad movie? It's terrible. With the exception of a few brief moments of fine cinematography, a few interesting scenes and some well-done, but not groundbreaking animation (remember 2001), it's just a bad movie.

 

 

Yeah, maybe.

 

But in 1977, it was great. Realize that most of the parents here saw the originals as kids in the 70's and 80's. That colors our opinions now. There was a whole culture around Star Wars and the stories. I think the main reason they are still popular is obly because all of the parents that grew up in love with the movies and grew up playing with the toys for hours on end, want their children to have the same experience. And there is kind of a vacuum now for entertaining, clean action/scifi movies. So we look to the past.

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Kind of a bad movie? It's terrible. With the exception of a few brief moments of fine cinematography, a few interesting scenes and some well-done, but not groundbreaking animation (remember 2001), it's just a bad movie.

 

As for the mythical Campbellian hero, I'll take Frodo, Neo or Bruce over whiny Luke any day.

 

Yeah, but those guys aren't in PG movies, are they? Wait... who is Bruce?

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:svengo:

 

First a post questioning Firefly and now this? Is nothing sacred anymore? :001_huh:

 

:eek: Firefly? :crying: :svengo: :angry: Oh, man. I'll have to stay away from *that* thread.

 

Star Wars is a cultural touchpoint, there's no way around it. Sure I know people (well, two) who *think* they're doing just fine, never having seen it, but they're gravely mistaken. ;) However, with the younger kids it understandably seems to be not so much a transcendental experience and more about the merchandising and trivia and shared experience with their parents. However, don't talk to me about Jar Jar. :cursing: All flavours of wrong, that.

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Yeah, but those guys aren't in PG movies, are they? Wait... who is Bruce?

 

I quite agree with the PG status. With the exception of the scary sand people, the glowing Jawa eyes and the whining and bickering, it is a rather benign movie. But I still have a hard time with all the bi@#hing at each other. I'm working really hard on cooperation between my children and now I'm supposed to show them a movie where they somehow magically argue their way to a solution. I don't how it works on other planets, but the one I live on isn't conductive to solutions being found through argumentation. I know it's may sound like a trivial and overblown point, but I really despise arguing.

 

It was interesting to watch it again since my first and only viewing as a kid; there are some interesting subtleties.

 

Bruce = Bruce Wayne, Batman Begins (2005). (Edited because of hasty IMDB search). Now that's a good movie.

Edited by spradlin02
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Bruce = Bruce Wayne, The Dark Knight (2008). Now that's a good movie.

I thought you meant Bruce Campbell. He's my Bruce. :D

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Hated it in the 70's, hate it now. Agree with elegantlion about Han Solo, however. ;)

 

He's about the only redeeming quality of the movie. And Alec Guiness, of course. Although I don't think he was given a chance to his best.

 

And I don't know how in the world I developed a crush on Princess Leah.

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Guest rubilynne4
Garbage? I prefer the last 3. ;) :auto: I bought the PBS Moyers/Campbell series. Not just for the SW commentary...that whole series is good stuff. :001_smile:

:iagree:

i loved all the star wars movies myself. and i especially like the last three as well.

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What I find amusing is watching the first, original Star Wars again with the knowledge of Luke and Leah's true identity. :blink::001_unsure: There was all the love-triangle-banter of Luke, Leah and Hans. GAH! What a revelation! Poor Luke. Later, in a space-bar: "She's my sister?!" :svengo:

 

Ya know what series I'm delighting in watching again with my kids? Back to the Future. I still love that story!

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Big, huge Star Wars fans here. They are much more kid friendly then other sci-fi or fantasy movies- even LOTR.

 

This exactly!! My kids love, love, love Star Wars, and I have become a reluctant SW fan lol. My youngest son even took his wish trip to Star Wars Weekends at Disney. There are no other series out there like it that my kids can watch. They are not allowed to watch the 3rd one where Ani turns into Vader, but that is the only one with gross stuff in it. There is no way I would let my kids watch LOTR, and though Avatar was a cool movie the language is not ok for my kids.

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What's so special about Star Wars? The fans. :)

 

Yes, they argue with each other and even resort to name-calling. While those things are not always pleasant,

it is one way to discuss problems and differences and come to a compromise that will meet everyone's needs or at least solve the problem at hand. Knowing your partners weaknesses (money, desire, etc.) can help you see where YOU need to apply yourself to make up for those weaknesses while working together. Having someone point out your weakness, though unpleasant at times, can help you see where you could use some self improvement or learn to ask for help.

Isn't that really what WE do HERE on this forum? We 'argue and complain' (discuss situations from different POV's) and sometimes there's quite a bit of 'name calling' (labeling) to boot. But we all gain something from it, or we wouldn't be here doing it again and again, or at least observing it happen again and again.

:)

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You're kidding, right? Star Wars is part of cultural history. To not watch it (and by it, I mean the original, not the 3 newer films), is almost unthinkable. Sure, they're not the greatest movies ever made, but they were ground breaking for their time. Indy has recently become obsessed with Star Wars lately, though much to my and dh's distress it's with the newer movies. Ack! It's only because Anakin is a kid in the early film though. Hopefully he'll get over that quickly. Dh used Star Wars tonight in talking to his friend about something (I can't remember what). His friend made a comment about how good he (the friend) was at something and dh told him he (the friend) was a mere Padawan compared to dh's Jedi like skills. I know a ton of people who sprinkle SW references in their speech. How would you understand them if you never watched SW?

 

As for the arguing, I'm not sure how that's objectionable. If everyone agreed on everything, it would be pretty boring. They were learning about themselves as they went along; learning to cooperate for the common good. How is that bad? Yes, they argue, but everyone does at some point or another.

 

And as for the person who wondered what the point of Raiders of the Lost Ark was: there is no point! It's an homage to the B movies of the 30's and 40's that were all about action and adventure. Indy loves those movies (obviously) and has watched them all about a million times. For him it's all about the adventure and the thrill of the chase. Plus, except for that last one (don't get me started) who doesn't love to see the Nazi's get their comeuppance? :D

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Well, we are big Star Wars fans here. I really like the overall theme of all 6 movies. To me, you don't get that unless you know the full story. Maybe I'm reading too much into it but, it is really a story of redemption.

 

Anakin lives this torn life, wanting to be good, but fueled by fear of loss, rebellion, anger, etc. He succumbs to the dark side, losing what is most precious to him. He goes on to live a life of evil, but in the end is turned back to what is right.

 

I think it really teaches good lessons about those dark things inside of us that can lead us down paths we don't want to go.

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Well, we are big Star Wars fans here. I really like the overall theme of all 6 movies. To me, you don't get that unless you know the full story. Maybe I'm reading too much into it but, it is really a story of redemption.

 

Anakin lives this torn life, wanting to be good, but fueled by fear of loss, rebellion, anger, etc. He succumbs to the dark side, losing what is most precious to him. He goes on to live a life of evil, but in the end is turned back to what is right.

 

I think it really teaches good lessons about those dark things inside of us that can lead us down paths we don't want to go.

 

:iagree: Oh, oh, and what she said!

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So, thinking it would be fun to revisit some of our youth, dh and I rented Raiders of the Lost Ark to watch as a family. What a colossal waste of time. Am I right? Some of you movie buffs, please tell me: what was I missing? I'm sure there's something. Is there some bigger myth? Symbolism? Theme? Anything?

 

Thanks.

 

Now we're picking on my favorite movie of all time?! :svengo: what is the world coming to? Plus it has a great soundtrack.

 

 

Bruce = Bruce Wayne, Batman Begins (2005). (Edited because of hasty IMDB search). Now that's a good movie.

 

Okay, I'll agree with you there, my other favorite movie. Ds hates that version of Batman, so we debate its merit on a regular basis.

 

I thought you meant Bruce Campbell. He's my Bruce. :D

 

That Bruce is a hoot!

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My theory is that Star Wars is sort of the Hero's Journey for dummies. Not sayin' that anyone here is a dummy, just that it ain't Tolkien. I'd much (much much) rather my kids get it out of their systems now and move on to more complex viewing and reading material than that they discover it in high school and think it's the height of cinematic, spiritual and pseudo-mythological achievement, like some fellas my age I could mention. My kids have seen all but the "third" movie, in which Anakin goes bad. I'm not ready to explain to them what happens to all the little child Jedis.

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Star Wars is a cultural touchpoint, there's no way around it....... ;) However, with the younger kids it understandably seems to be not so much a transcendental experience and more about the merchandising and trivia and shared experience with their parents. However, don't talk to me about Jar Jar. :cursing: All flavours of wrong, that.

 

 

EXACTLY! Nmoira, you are my new Captain of the Universe. How can someone have watched the original Star Wars as a kid, and not have had that experience? I am floored. Somethin' wrong with that picture. :D

 

My sister and I came out of that theater staring into the starry sky and floating.

 

Batman Begins- gag. Give me the Micheal Keaton version any day!

Edited by jazzyfizzle
sp
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Honestly, I don't know what's so great about Star Wars, but because my son and Mom #2 LOVE them, I can pretty much quote all the movies verbatim.

 

They play on a pretty constant loop around here.

 

We all have light sabers and I find myself being sliced up while cooking dinner or washing dishes or what should be benign household chores.

 

Sometimes we have battles right in the living room . . . there are worse things Moms and Son could do together, I guess. :lol:

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Being a mother who is total protected from the Dark Side by a very, very dedicated Jedi warrior, I must take a stand for a good verses evil story that engages a boy and fires his imagination with hours of adventure after the movie is over. The minimum of blood, guts and bad language is a plus. I can't speak to the artistic and cinematic weight of the movies though I think for their time they were pretty forward thinking as far as special effects and story line.

 

And as far as setting, what better for a boy than something that hasn't happened yet and has very little basis in reality? Being a cowboy, Indian, gladiator, Hun, etc. are all fraught with victory and defeat. In Star Wars, anything is possible. It's a story to be written rather than re-enacted.

Edited by rwjx2khsmj
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Light Sabers.

 

Death Star.

 

Nerf Herders.

 

Han Solo.

 

One of the best villians of all time.

 

Jabba.

 

Wilhelm Screams galore.

 

I could go on and on. Sure it's uber campy, the acting is medicore and the story predictable, but somehow, especially for boys, it's magical :)

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The dialogue in the first SW movie is ridiculous. But I like SW. ;) The films get more sophisticated (some people are laughing:tongue_smilie:) as they progress.

 

Yeah. Some people ARE laughing (just a little). :laugh:

 

Just tonight we watched Episode VI and the scene where Luke tells Leia she is his sister. Her reply? "I know. Somehow I've always known". :ack2:

 

I love these movies but I hate that scene. They could have done that so much better. I felt kinda ripped off.

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And as far as setting, what better for a boy than something that hasn't happened yet and has very little basis in reality?

 

Actually, it happened "long ago in a galaxy far far away". Haven't you been paying attention? :D

 

 

 

 

:leaving:

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There are many times that I ask myself this same question. Then I look out my window and see my dh and our dds having a light saber battle or watch them playing Lego Star Wars or acting out parts of the movies with Legos. They have turned me into a SW geek and I don't mind at all!:tongue_smilie:

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Batman Begins- gag. Give me the Micheal Keaton version any day!

 

Gasp! No way. Over Bale? Over Gary Oldman as Gordon???? Over NINJAS????

 

Light Sabers.

 

Death Star.

 

Nerf Herders.

 

Han Solo.

 

Admiral Ackbar!

THE SITH!

What's not to like??

 

Actually, it happened "long ago in a galaxy far far away". Haven't you been paying attention? :D

 

 

 

 

:leaving:

 

*snort*

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my nephew, who is now 35, is the biggest Star Wars fan ever, from the time he was small and saw the original one. Anyway, at his wedding 5 years ago, the sound man (without telling anyone) played the theme from the original one when the bride walked down the aisle. Everyone loved it, it brought the house down. The bride and groom had both been extremely nervous and this lighthearted moment really calmed them down.

 

Regarding Raiders of the Lost Ark. I went to see it when it opened with my aunt and uncle. My aunt said that I did not move the entire movie nor did my eyes leave the screen from the very opening shot. I was mesmerized and still love that movie and the 3rd one with Sean Connery, hate the second one and did not care for the 4th one.

 

One of my cats is named Indiana Jones.

 

p.s. I was living in Los Angeles when Star Wars came out. People were waiting in line 4 hours to get in to see it. Everyone just brought playing cards and board games and played with other people waiting in line. It was def. an event.

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You also have to remember that when Star Wars first came out that it was quite advanced in film making for the time. They were making it up as they went along if I remember correctly.

 

My kids are watching Star Wars as I type this LOL

 

Totally!

It was the first movie that had different sounds coming out of different speakers in the movie theater. When I first saw it, you could hear the spaceships fly over head before you saw them--this is the VERY FIRST TIME that that was done. We researched which theater locally could even handle those special effects, and stood in line for hours to get in. The theater had to hire a guard for each driveway around the block to maintain locals' access to their own homes because the lines were so long so continuously. This was completely unprecedented.

 

Also, the graphics were unbelievably sophisticated for the times. Those video game type sequences of dogfights were unprecedented at the time.

 

And there were twists and turns to notice just about every minute. After all the hype, to see suddenly that this was intended to be movie number 4 was quite quirky and exciting.

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If you have to ask....

 

For some older folks (ahem) these films , when first released, where PHENOMENAL!!! Do they still stand up to the test of time? Well.... Lucas's dialog gets increasingly hokey with time, but the original trio - in particular Empire Strikes back, is still great filmmaking.

 

If you do not like the films, that is ok. But why deprive a kid of them? Star Wars is part of our cultural heritage now :-)

 

 

This from the person who, as a college student, made the midnight showing of Return of the Jedi on Hollywood Blvd. opening night.

 

PS - if you ever find a screening in a theater, GO! So much more of an impact on a BIG screen.

Edited by JFSinIL
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My theory is that Star Wars is sort of the Hero's Journey for dummies. Not sayin' that anyone here is a dummy, just that it ain't Tolkien. I'd much (much much) rather my kids get it out of their systems now and move on to more complex viewing and reading material than that they discover it in high school and think it's the height of cinematic, spiritual and pseudo-mythological achievement, like some fellas my age I could mention. My kids have seen all but the "third" movie, in which Anakin goes bad. I'm not ready to explain to them what happens to all the little child Jedis.

 

When this movie came out, my youngest at the time was not allowed to see it.

 

Another family of Star Wars fanatics proceeded to ask why...and then list all the bad things that happened in the movie. IOW, here are the only "bad" things...which one don't your parents want you to know about?

 

ARGH!:toetap05::ack2:

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My boys (including DH :tongue_smilie:) watched them, liked them...and then moved on...:auto:

 

The movies didn't capture their attention to the exent that they (the movies) became a big part of the boys' childhoods.

 

DH did take all the kids to Star Wars night at the baseball game...to "sightsee" all the costumes. "Fat guy in a jedi suit" has become a catchphrase around here. :lol:

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The sound and special effects were cutting edge at the time.

 

The costumes and C3P0 and R2D2 can stand up to the test of time. You don't totally snicker when you see them. They're still realistic enough.

 

The dialogue is bad, but in a good way. No one thinks the dialogue is any good. We all know it's bad, but are still affectionate to the movie, despite the bad dialogue. ("I've got a bad feeling about this...")

 

Do you know the whole story? In episode 4 (the first one with Luke and Leia and Han), you jump right in to the middle of the story. George Lucas had already written the entire series before he started filming. They didn't have the technology to pull off the first parts of the story (episode 1, 2, and 3.) So George had to film the last part of the story first. So, you don't know all about Luke's father and how he knew Obi-Wan and the Clone Wars. (until they finally had the technology to film them back in 1999--when Episode I finally came out.)

 

Arguing: Leia and Han argue so much because they're attracted to each other. Han argues with everyone else because he's trying to hide that he's really a good guy under his tough exterior. Luke argues because he really is just a kid (he's about 18 or so) and is very rough around the edges. He grows up over the course of episodes 4, 5, and 6. That's kind of the point of the arguing. About halfway through episode 5, the arguing starts to settle down. I can see where you don't want your kids to pick up on the arguing, but it's all part of the growth of the characters, and is somewhat of a plot device (I guess that's the term) to show the growth of the characters as they soften towards each other and learn to work together - again, not till the middle of ep 5, though.

 

And then when you study the whole "hero" part (as other people have mentioned,) you see even more clearly the underlying myth factor that draws people in. (For example, the idea that Obi-Wan will teach Luke what to do and then BAM! Obi-Wan is dead and Luke has to learn to walk on his own. That's classic myth/hero stuff.) It's not so much the movie itself. It's the deeper themes that have appealed to humans from the beginning of storytelling. It's just a classic myth/hero/adventure story.

 

And the whole thing with Darth Vader. He started out as the best Jedi ever. The elder Jedis were keeping an eye on him because they knew he was special and there had been prophecies that he would somehow unite everyone (blah blah blah). But Vader learned that his wife was going to die in childbirth (dreams) and in his desperate attempts to save her (by sacrificing himself to the dark side), he ended up being the one brought her death to her (Oedipal, Theseus' father jumping off the cliff...etc.) Completely snapped in mind and body, he became the evil Darth Vader. (But that's all episode 3 and most of us don't let our kids see that, because it's just too gut wrenching and when Vader loses his legs, etc, it's just too much for small children.) Anyway...if you knew the whole story, you might understand why we all love it so much....

 

I have to stop. I could go on and on and on....

Edited by Garga
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One of my cats is named Indiana Jones.
My eldest daughter is named in honour of Raiders of the Lost Ark. No, her name is not Indiana, Indy, Marion, or Marcus ;) though, and this part was inadvertent, if you say her first name and middle initial together it sounds like a state name.
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Raiders of the Lost Ark

...

It's an homage to the B movies of the 30's and 40's that were all about action and adventure.

 

Exactly.

 

I *love* Raiders of the Lost Ark. (Didn't care for any of the sequels.) Imo, it's the best action/adventure movie ever made.

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