Tardiness....GRRR! (CC)

[Marie463]

My dh and I have been discussing tardiness. At our church, it is very common for people to run late for meetings, services, etc. This is beyond just a few folks who may have been tied up due to unforeseen circumstances (stuff happens to everyone from time to time)...and is a large percentage of the attendees (40-50% maybe?) My dh has also noted the same thing at his workplace for scheduled meetings. Is this a cultural thing? Regional? We are in the Great Lakes area...mid-size city.

 

Here's an example: a women's event this past Saturday evening at our church was scheduled to begin at 7pm. At 7, there were exactly 4 people in the room so the organizers waited as others trickled in (which in retrospect, was probably a mistake)...between 7:00-7:20 an additional 40 people arrived....so the event that was supposed to begin at 7, did not actually start until 7:20! Even at our church's main services on Sundays, people trickle in to the service at their leisure (this is usually during a time of music...but still...it must be frustrating for our praise band and is distracting to those who are already worshipping). At the root of this, I can't shake that it is just downright disrespectful...and reflects the attendee's priorities or lack thereof.

 

So, I realize that there are much more pressing issues in the world...but what's your experience with this? Thoughts? Anyone who is chronically late want to knock me off this soapbox? :tongue_smilie:

[mommaduck]

I've noticed that there are cultural spots throughout the country where if you are 5min early, then you're late (military LOL!), where you had better keep an appt, and others where everyone runs on what we call "Greek Time" (trickle in). I wouldn't get worked up.

[Jean in Newcastle]

We have this problem at our church too. I think they should start on time even if there are only a few people there. If organizers keep on waiting until enough people are there to start, people start to think "It always starts a bit late anyway, so it's ok if I'm a little bit late." I think that it is a bad witness to the community if you say you're going to start at one time and then don't. Of course there are times when it's unavoidable (a key piece of equipment breaks down or there is a power outage) but those times should be very rare.

[Brigitte]

I think tardiness is disrespectful, unless something unavoidable happened, and it is getting worse. When I do home parties for Usborne, I was counting on starting at least 15 minutes late every time. Now, I inform my hostess that we will start on time and to let her guests know that. It has helped enormously.

 

I think that people assume things will start late and so they arrive late. If you start your meetings on time with only 4 people and the other 40 arrive late, but see that you did not wait, they will begin to get a clue. The next time they will make more of an effort to get there on time.

 

Caveat: It might also be necessary to see if there is a better time to start the meetings. So, at your next one, start at the scheduled time, but before you adjourn ask everyone if the time needs to change since so many are arriving late.

[Emilylou]

This happens at our church too. We belong to a large church and probably 30-40% of the people trickle in for each service. Makes Sunday school teachers upset.

Our homeschool group is the same way. There are about 4 familes that are always on time or a few minutes early and the rest are anywhere from 5 minutes to 1/2 hour late!

Makes our 1st class at co-op fun!

 

I have no insight- I literally have a panic attack if I am not where I need to go 5 minutes early. It just isn't inside me to be late.

[novagirl]

I live in an upper midwest city--not too big--and everyone is late here too. I think unless in emergency situations or with something that happens every great once in a while...it's RUDE!!!

 

You should see my dd's dance class. It's run by two homeschooled high school girls. The girls have to ask the Moms EVERY WEEK to get there on time. On top of that they are chatting so loudly that it's disruptive to the class. Yes, if a teenager has to tell you to shut up---do it!:glare::lol:

[SproutMamaK]

I am 5 minutes late everywhere I go. It's not intentional - something just ALWAYS happens as we're getting ready to go - a phone call, a blowout diaper, a skinned knee, etc. And I mean LITERALLY every time. I can't remember the last time I got somewhere on time.

 

I drive myself CRAZY. I HATE being late. I KNOW it's disrespectful, and I try to leave earlier, but for some reason it just never works. What's obnoxious is that I still look down on other people who are habitually late, even though I'm one of them! Maybe God is knocking me off my high horse about it by forcing me to be one of them. ;)

[Chris in VA]

I constantly run late because I misjudge how long it takes to get to wherever, how much I can pack in to the time before I have to leave, etc.

 

We would never start a church service late, tho. And, I found that when I taught Bible Study, I had to start on time or people did exactly what Jean said: assumed it started later and didn't show up on time.

[Danestress]

I am someone who is generally on time, but sometimes I am late and sometimes I don't feel badly about it. I do think it's important to be at church on time because it's disruptive to worship to come in late. At the same time, our praise band does too many songs before the service really starts, probably because people are late. Maybe it's a vicious cycle. Maybe if everyone were there on time, the band would do two songs and we could move on to the service. Instead they do what seems endless, and it makes me want to be late so I can miss some of it. Praise music isn't really my thing, but I adore my church.

 

As for meetings, I don't really want to be at most of them, and sometimes I am really prioritizing getting my kids settled or greeting my husband over being at a meeting that will be 50% blah blah. While it can be disrespectful to be late, it's also disrespectful to let meetings go longer than they need to be cause people just like talking and "sharing" and the same for bible studies. When the leader won't shut down the talkers, I start to not want to be there anymore, you know? Obviously I have a bad attitude:) But I would agree to being always on time if I could convince women who run meetings to do all the business right of the bat and then dismiss everyone and let the chit chatters stay AFTER. I have important things to do - feed my family, plan lessons, take care of a home. The time wasting parts of meetings are a low priority.

 

This week, just as an example, I have to attend a mandatory "sexual harassment" training one evenings. Our church is requiring it for every one involved in ministry to children or in prayer counseling. Fair enough - it's important and probably required by our insurance. But they scheduled it for THREE hours. Then it says that "a light dinner will be served." Well, really, I wish I had the option of just having the actual training with no frills. I wish I had the nerve to ask what time the actual truly required training will start and end so that I can be with my family the rest of the time. I know I will get there (on time) and feel like there is an hour of training and two hours of blah blah. I am just too busy to not mind that.

 

I know that wasn't really what you were asking, so sorry if I side tracked. I do agree with you that it's hard when people are tardy for things.

Edited April 13, 2010 by Danestress

[Garga]

1. It's rude in North America to be late (but not in South America or some middle eastern countries, I'm told.)

 

2. If you are in control of the starting time, start on time. Even if it's just you in the room!

 

3. If I'm late for some unavoidable reason, I do NOT expect anyone to have waited for me.

[lionfamily1999]

It drives me nuts., especially because I'm married to a chronically late person. Dh starts dragging his feet right when everyone else is ready to go. Then, he comes up with a list of VERY IMPORTANT THINGS that must be accomplished before we can leave. Often this involves rinsing off the engine of the car, cleaning windows, putting air in the tires, cleaning out the car, and sometimes making a fresh pot of coffee so he can make one travel mug's worth to take with us.

 

He doesn't mean to be disrespectful or rude. There are some things that dh will break his neck to get to on time (then, he's only a few minutes late), but for the most part there's a five to thirty minute (and in some cases HOURS) window before he'll get there. He calls it being responsible :shrug:.

[Sputterduck]

1. It's rude in North America to be late (but not in South America or some middle eastern countries, I'm told.)

 

It's not rude here to be late. If someone is working with an American person and they are actually understanding that they need to do something on time they'll say for example they'll do it at 11am English time. If not, 11am tomorrow means, "I'll probably get there tomorrow. If not, I'll show up eventually."

 

Things do get finished around here, but time doesn't really matter to anyone. The concept of getting something done in relation to a clock is just really foreign.

 

I tried to make an appointment to see the doctor and it confused the hell out of the lady who answered the phone. Apparently, you just show up when the doctor is in.

Edited April 13, 2010 by Sputterduck

[MyThreeSons]

I REALLY dislike being late to anything. I yell at my family more about this than anything else, I'm sure. My sons are teens, and I still give them countdowns to let them know how long until we have to leave.

[WTMCassandra]

So, I realize that there are much more pressing issues in the world...but what's your experience with this? Thoughts? Anyone who is chronically late want to knock me off this soapbox? :tongue_smilie:

 

I would rather not go to something than be late. :lol:

 

I HATE being late with a purple passion. And it bugs me when people are late, especially if they are chronically late. There's a family who is late to handbells every. single. week. It's hard to play handbells if you are missing two of the members!!! Also, I have to come 30 minutes and I am never late, but she lives right around the corner. Grrrr, indeed.

 

In most cases, I do think being late is rude.

 

Now, if the family in our church with nine children slips in a little late, I am a little more understanding. That's a lot of people to get out the door at a specific time.

 

So, I guess I'm an American clock slave, LOL. Being in another country with a "manyana" type of attitude would probably drive me up the wall. :lol:

[Elisabeth in IL]

Our church has a little count down window in the bottom right hand corner of the screen which in the front of the church. When it reaches 0:00, we begin our worship and the doors to the foyer close until there is an appropriate break that won't disturb the worshipers. Most people are on time because of it! I was stuck outside once and that was enough for me. We are always early now! :)

[MeanestMomInMidwest]

I am continually frustrated that every single one of my in-laws here in the MidWest cannot start something or arrive somewhere on time. My husband is former military, so he is prompt. I'm from the Pacific Northwest and was raised to be prompt. My in-laws who have been in the Midwest for generations...grrrr

 

They are so chronically late Easter Brunch was at 1:30 in the afternoon!

[swellmomma]

I am constantly late. It is a rare thing to be celebrated when I am on time somewhere. It is not because I aim to be late. In fact I start getting everyone ready 1.5-2 hours before we have to leave to be somewhere, but we are always late due to the kids putting up a fight. Ds will go into a rage and attakc someone, or dd will get defiant and refuse to get ready, ds6 will suddenly need to have a BM after 10 days of nothing, or my 2 yr old will need a diaper change just as we walk out, or is having a toddler tantrum etc. We are always always late. That said it is actually noticable because I am the only one straggling in 10-15 minutes late.

[WTMCassandra]

Early is on time, on time is late and late is inexcusable!

 

:lol:

 

I'm not that bad, but I'm close. Early is stress-free and a feeling of accomplishment, on time is pushing it and a stressor, and late, well, that makes steam come out of my ears!

[BigMamaBird]

I am 5 minutes late everywhere I go. It's not intentional - something just ALWAYS happens as we're getting ready to go - a phone call, a blowout diaper, a skinned knee, etc. And I mean LITERALLY every time. I can't remember the last time I got somewhere on time.

 

I drive myself CRAZY. I HATE being late. I KNOW it's disrespectful, and I try to leave earlier, but for some reason it just never works. What's obnoxious is that I still look down on other people who are habitually late, even though I'm one of them! Maybe God is knocking me off my high horse about it by forcing me to be one of them. ;)

 

You must be my long lost sister! My 19 month old has a sensor that tells him exactly when we all have our shoes and coats on so he can poop.

[mommaduck]

I would rather not go to something than be late. :lol:

 

I HATE being late with a purple passion. And it bugs me when people are late, especially if they are chronically late. There's a family who is late to handbells every. single. week. It's hard to play handbells if you are missing two of the members!!! Also, I have to come 30 minutes and I am never late, but she lives right around the corner. Grrrr, indeed.

 

In most cases, I do think being late is rude.

 

Now, if the family in our church with nine children slips in a little late, I am a little more understanding. That's a lot of people to get out the door at a specific time.

 

So, I guess I'm an American clock slave, LOL. Being in another country with a "manyana" type of attitude would probably drive me up the wall. :lol:

Maybe that's why I love being in a Greek church! *I* am THAT woman with 9 people to get out the door on Sunday morning!

[Nestof3]

My husband and I got pretty fed up at our house church. It was scheduled to start at 10, but we started between 10:30 and 11 all the time. People were still coming in during the teaching time. That was really annoying because we are talking about families of 10-12 people all walking around trying to find seats for themselves.

 

Eventually, the start time has been changed to 10:30. I don't know how that's going b/c we have stopped going. All I know is, except for one family, everyone else lives within 20 minutes while we live 45 min to an hour away. So, I got up at 7, prepared my meal (we always ate together) and we were never late. Some of the ladies actually prepared their meals there b/c they didn't take the time to do so before hand. The houses were hot enough as it was, and then adding oven and rice cooker heat during the meeting with over 100 people in one living area was getting crazy.

 

I agree that once in a while may happen, but some families were always nearly an hour late. The more people you have to get ready, the earlier you have to get up/start getting ready. It's pretty simple.

Edited April 14, 2010 by nestof3

[Guest Katia]

Here is a different perspective from one who is usually late. I am a leave-the-house-at-the-last-minute sort of person. And, it has nothing to do with disrespect.

 

I have social anxieties. I love to go to church to worship, but I break out in hives at the thought of having to converse with people. So, I get ready to go, and then I have to talk myself into leaving the house. Finding other things that 'need' to be done (laundry, dishes, etc.) are ways to keep from facing the social scene. Having to poop at the last minute is the sensitive gut saying it just can't handle the situation.

 

So, I get to church at the last minute or sometimes late. When I'm late, I don't have to chit-chat and can just find my seat and worship. Oh, and I'm also in the back that way and so one of the first people to leave (also avoiding the dreaded chit-chat).

 

Same goes for meetings. I try to avoid being in groups or situations where you have to go to a meeting, but once again, late is usually better. Forget Sunday School and small groups. Ack!!! Homeschool mom's meeting were torture. There were a few ladies there that seemed to delight in calling my name in front of the goupr and asking me questions just to see me squirm. And they talked about me behind my back because I was that lady that didn't 'help out' or 'carry my weight'. Sometimes, when the kids were at co-op, I would just have to leave and go sit in the car to be by myself and re-group. No one cared to understand. You fit in or you are not welcome.

 

If you don't have social anxieties, you simply will not understand. I'm sorry others think I'm being rude or disrespectful, but I'm not. I'm simply trying to cope with life the best way I can. The only other option is not to ever go to anything, and I don't want to completely withdraw from life. I do want to be involved, but it has to be what works for *me*. I tried for years and years to 'fit in' and ended up physically sick. Nope. Won't do that again. Trying to make someone else happy by following the time schedule that works for them is NOT worth hives, heart palpitations, extreme sweating (this is the worst at church when you are all dressed up/nice make-up, etc. and your face is a sweaty mess), and feeling sick to my stomach.

 

My advice is to stop feeling so self-righteous and judgmental because you are so able (to be on time/to plan ahead/to prepare/to be so involved/etc.) and try to understand that not everyone is the same as you, nor are they able to be, no matter how they may try. Love and acceptance goes a long way.

[Sputterduck]

I understand Katia. :grouphug:

[Sahamamama]

We have this problem at our church too. I think they should start on time even if there are only a few people there. If organizers keep on waiting until enough people are there to start, people start to think "It always starts a bit late anyway, so it's ok if I'm a little bit late." I think that it is a bad witness to the community if you say you're going to start at one time and then don't. Of course there are times when it's unavoidable (a key piece of equipment breaks down or there is a power outage) but those times should be very rare.

 

:iagree: That's what happens at our church, and yes, it's true, sometimes even WE say, "Oh, it's okay, we're not really late, they never start on time, anyway." So, the church bulletin says the service begins at 10:00, but after you've been there a week or two, you know that no one even goes IN to the sanctuary until 10:30, and the service doesn't start until "around 11:00." I hate this, but what can we do about it? We just always try to get there "on time," but that doesn't get anyone else there "on time."

 

Even with the service starting around 11:00, there are STILL people who walk in late... 11:30 or so. Grrrrrrr. What can you do about it? Not much.

[Sahamamama]

I am someone who is generally on time, but sometimes I am late and sometimes I don't feel badly about it. I do think it's important to be at church on time because it's disruptive to worship to come in late. At the same time, our praise band does too many songs before the service really starts, probably because people are late. Maybe it's a vicious cycle. Maybe if everyone were there on time, the band would do two songs and we could move on to the service. Instead they do what seems endless, and it makes me want to be late so I can miss some of it. Praise music isn't really my thing, but I adore my church.

 

As for meetings, I don't really want to be at most of them, and sometimes I am really prioritizing getting my kids settled or greeting my husband over being at a meeting that will be 50% blah blah. While it can be disrespectful to be late, it's also disrespectful to let meetings go longer than they need to be cause people just like talking and "sharing" and the same for bible studies. When the leader won't shut down the talkers, I start to not want to be there anymore, you know? Obviously I have a bad attitude:) But I would agree to being always on time if I could convince women who run meetings to do all the business right of the bat and then dismiss everyone and let the chit chatters stay AFTER. I have important things to do - feed my family, plan lessons, take care of a home. The time wasting parts of meetings are a low priority.

 

This week, just as an example, I have to attend a mandatory "sexual harassment" training one evenings. Our church is requiring it for every one involved in ministry to children or in prayer counseling. Fair enough - it's important and probably required by our insurance. But they scheduled it for THREE hours. Then it says that "a light dinner will be served." Well, really, I wish I had the option of just having the actual training with no frills. I wish I had the nerve to ask what time the actual truly required training will start and end so that I can be with my family the rest of the time. I know I will get there (on time) and feel like there is an hour of training and two hours of blah blah. I am just too busy to not mind that.

 

I know that wasn't really what you were asking, so sorry if I side tracked. I do agree with you that it's hard when people are tardy for things.

 

:iagree:It's funny, but I agree with this, too! Perhaps one reason why people may be habitually late (in a congregation, for example) is because we feel that "hanging out" before the meeting, service is a waste of precious time and/or because we know that so many others will be trickling in that the meeting will not begin when it's scheduled to begin. Why waste the time?

 

Good post, Danestress.

[Teachaheart]

Here is a different perspective from one who is usually late. I am a leave-the-house-at-the-last-minute sort of person. And, it has nothing to do with disrespect.

 

I have social anxieties. I love to go to church to worship, but I break out in hives at the thought of having to converse with people. So, I get ready to go, and then I have to talk myself into leaving the house. Finding other things that 'need' to be done (laundry, dishes, etc.) are ways to keep from facing the social scene. Having to poop at the last minute is the sensitive gut saying it just can't handle the situation.

 

So, I get to church at the last minute or sometimes late. When I'm late, I don't have to chit-chat and can just find my seat and worship. Oh, and I'm also in the back that way and so one of the first people to leave (also avoiding the dreaded chit-chat).

 

Same goes for meetings. I try to avoid being in groups or situations where you have to go to a meeting, but once again, late is usually better. Forget Sunday School and small groups. Ack!!! Homeschool mom's meeting were torture. There were a few ladies there that seemed to delight in calling my name in front of the goupr and asking me questions just to see me squirm. And they talked about me behind my back because I was that lady that didn't 'help out' or 'carry my weight'. Sometimes, when the kids were at co-op, I would just have to leave and go sit in the car to be by myself and re-group. No one cared to understand. You fit in or you are not welcome.

 

If you don't have social anxieties, you simply will not understand. I'm sorry others think I'm being rude or disrespectful, but I'm not. I'm simply trying to cope with life the best way I can. The only other option is not to ever go to anything, and I don't want to completely withdraw from life. I do want to be involved, but it has to be what works for *me*. I tried for years and years to 'fit in' and ended up physically sick. Nope. Won't do that again. Trying to make someone else happy by following the time schedule that works for them is NOT worth hives, heart palpitations, extreme sweating (this is the worst at church when you are all dressed up/nice make-up, etc. and your face is a sweaty mess), and feeling sick to my stomach.

 

My advice is to stop feeling so self-righteous and judgmental because you are so able (to be on time/to plan ahead/to prepare/to be so involved/etc.) and try to understand that not everyone is the same as you, nor are they able to be, no matter how they may try. Love and acceptance goes a long way.

 

Katia, I could have written this post! You are not alone.

[DarlaS]

I'm generally always 5 minutes early.

 

I'm finding though that I need to readjust my expectations of how long it takes to get places now that my teen is driving. He drives the posted speed limits. I had forgotten you could do that. :blush:

[Marie463]

Wow. I'm not sure how to respond, Katia, because you are right, I just do not understand social anxieties...and I'm exhausted...and should probably just go to bed before I type something ridiculous...yet I continue...

 

In any type of church, group, meeting, etc. there are organizers/leaders who have given their time, and perhaps even stepped out of their comfort zones, in order to provide a informative, worshipful or fun experience for others. As someone mentioned earlier, it is just as important for the organizers of such gatherings to respect of the attendees' time (being efficient with time and ending promptly). I guess in my OP, I should have stated that I am coming at this discussion from the vantage point of often being the organizer...it is a good reminder to remember that some are not as outgoing as others (particularly for extroverts like myself)...however, it is equally important for everyone to contribute and not just consume. Us extroverts/organizing types get burnt out and often feel used.

 

And to be perfectly honest, when one just shows up for the "meat" of the sermon (or the meeting or the event, etc.) and then leaves...I can see how that person can be labeled as non-contributor...because arriving late appears like you don't care....and because you (or others with social anxieties) may not spend time conversing much with others, the organizers/leaders/other participants, just don't understand the social anxiety issues with which you struggle. It all comes down to communication...and mutual respect.

[Nestof3]

I understand your social difficulties in that I too sweat a lot when around other people. I don't "feel" nervous, but I obviously am. It is frustrating. I also get incredibly hot and it drives me batty. It is difficult to find clothing that isn't hot and hides the sweat stains. No one at the meeting understood these difficulties I had either. This is one of the reasons why it was great to start the meeting on time b/c people's houses had a hard time keeping cool, especially when starting later in the day, and on top of that, with people cooking during the meeting. I can assure you that no one else there had these social difficulties, because as I said, I explained mine, and it was met with blank stares.

 

In this situation, I can assure you that it is a matter of lack of planning which is frustrating for those who rush like crazy to get there on time.

 

I was speaking of families that would cause such a disruption by arriving 30 minutes late, causing people to try to find chairs and move around -- all while someone was trying to teach.

 

Here is a different perspective from one who is usually late. I am a leave-the-house-at-the-last-minute sort of person. And, it has nothing to do with disrespect.

 

I have social anxieties. I love to go to church to worship, but I break out in hives at the thought of having to converse with people. So, I get ready to go, and then I have to talk myself into leaving the house. Finding other things that 'need' to be done (laundry, dishes, etc.) are ways to keep from facing the social scene. Having to poop at the last minute is the sensitive gut saying it just can't handle the situation.

 

So, I get to church at the last minute or sometimes late. When I'm late, I don't have to chit-chat and can just find my seat and worship. Oh, and I'm also in the back that way and so one of the first people to leave (also avoiding the dreaded chit-chat).

 

Same goes for meetings. I try to avoid being in groups or situations where you have to go to a meeting, but once again, late is usually better. Forget Sunday School and small groups. Ack!!! Homeschool mom's meeting were torture. There were a few ladies there that seemed to delight in calling my name in front of the goupr and asking me questions just to see me squirm. And they talked about me behind my back because I was that lady that didn't 'help out' or 'carry my weight'. Sometimes, when the kids were at co-op, I would just have to leave and go sit in the car to be by myself and re-group. No one cared to understand. You fit in or you are not welcome.

 

If you don't have social anxieties, you simply will not understand. I'm sorry others think I'm being rude or disrespectful, but I'm not. I'm simply trying to cope with life the best way I can. The only other option is not to ever go to anything, and I don't want to completely withdraw from life. I do want to be involved, but it has to be what works for *me*. I tried for years and years to 'fit in' and ended up physically sick. Nope. Won't do that again. Trying to make someone else happy by following the time schedule that works for them is NOT worth hives, heart palpitations, extreme sweating (this is the worst at church when you are all dressed up/nice make-up, etc. and your face is a sweaty mess), and feeling sick to my stomach.

 

My advice is to stop feeling so self-righteous and judgmental because you are so able (to be on time/to plan ahead/to prepare/to be so involved/etc.) and try to understand that not everyone is the same as you, nor are they able to be, no matter how they may try. Love and acceptance goes a long way.

[rafgaf4]

Tardiness drives me nuts. I am not talking about the people who are normally on time, and something comes up. I am talking about the people who are always late. You know the kind... you usually have to lie and tell them a time 30 minutes earlier than the actual starting time of the event. These are also the people that you ask to bring chips or trashbags to the family event or potluck because you know they won't be there on time with the food. When they do finally show up they still have to cook the food items because they had to go to the store to buy them before they came. Then they proceed to say that there were lines at the store and that is why they are late. Everybody knows someone like this. I always wonder why they think their time is more precious than mine. I personally think always being tardy is an insult to the people who are waiting for you. (Sorry to all the tardy people who read this!)

[PollyOR]

I've struggled with being late my whole life. I've worked on it and I've learned exactly what time to make myself leave home to be on time. I always add 10 minutes to forget something and have to return to the house, etc.

 

I feel for those who deal with social anxiety. My dd does also. She waits until the last possible minute to walk into a meeting.

 

We have a joke in our church (throughout the USA). So many people arrive late at LDS/Mormon meetings that we call it "mormon standard time."

[lllll]

....

Edited December 17, 2012 by ksva

[lionfamily1999]

My advice is to stop feeling so self-righteous and judgmental because you are so able (to be on time/to plan ahead/to prepare/to be so involved/etc.) and try to understand that not everyone is the same as you, nor are they able to be, no matter how they may try. Love and acceptance goes a long way.

:grouphug: Dh sends his thanks.

I hate being late and I'm married to a man who is chronically late and not an introvert. For me, it's more embarrassing to walk into Sunday school late and have everyone turn around and stare. I'd rather get there early, claim a seat and get comfortable before having to interact with people (I'm the introvert. :))

 

Anyway, one Sunday morning when our dc were toddlers and dh was running late as usual, I had an epiphany. I grabbed my keys, told him the kids were dressed and ready, and that I'd see them at church. Then, I left without them. It only took a couple of Sundays of this until we were arriving at church, as a family, early. ;)

I tried that once.... dh and the kids were just getting there as I was getting ready to leave :glare:

[Peela]

Dh used to be a business man and he taught me that being late is a definite sign of disrespect. I didn't used to think of it that way....but nowadays, even though I can belate myself sometimes, I do get irritated by chronic lateness.

I think being late is a way of saying " my time is more important than yours".

However, I think most people can be responsive to being told. In dh's work, which is running therapy type groups, he got to the point of not letting people in who came late. He trained his clients to come on time and to respect others by not being chronically late.

We teach others how to treat us.

[Cammie]

Wow - lots of you would be pushed off the edge by living in India! You think 30 minutes is late....you have NO idea! Here, if you are invited for dinner at 7 - you should understand that NO one will arrive before 9! I used to be a 5 minutes early person (not for parties but in general for appointments) and that HAD to end or I was going to SHOOT someone. I hate waiting and I was just giving myself more time to wait when I showed up early/ontime.

 

So now, I go two hours late to parties, try to breath and not get mad at DH, and put it down to cultural adaptation!

[ChristusG]

DH and I were that couple who were always early. Not annoyingly so, but just 5 or 10 minutes. It annoyed us to death that my parents are always late....to everything. Always. We were never late.

 

And then we had kids.

 

Now, we cannot be on time to save our lives. It seems that something ALWAYS comes up as we are trying to get out the door. Meltdowns, blowouts, lost toys, bathroom trips, lost keys/phone, etc. It's ALWAYS something. It annoys me that we are always late!!

[2cents]

Tardiness drives me nuts. I am not talking about the people who are normally on time, and something comes up. I am talking about the people who are always late. You know the kind... you usually have to lie and tell them a time 30 minutes earlier than the actual starting time of the event. These are also the people that you ask to bring chips or trashbags to the family event or potluck because you know they won't be there on time with the food. When they do finally show up they still have to cook the food items because they had to go to the store to buy them before they came. Then they proceed to say that there were lines at the store and that is why they are late. Everybody knows someone like this. I always wonder why they think their time is more precious than mine. I personally think always being tardy is an insult to the people who are waiting for you. (Sorry to all the tardy people who read this!)

 

:iagree:

It is frustrating. I personally find it more annoying when always tardy folks seem to attribute their tardiness to something they cannot change. Like it is a permanent personality thing. They show up and even call attention to their lateness by explaining that they are always late. What is up with that?!

[Ellie]

I hate that. IMO, there's no excuse for chronic lateness.

 

When I'm in charge of something, I start on time, regardless of who's there or not. People who work with me get used to it.:D I have zero tolerance for people who are chronically late. Sorry.

 

When all activities at a church start late, it all goes back to the leadership, specifically the pastor.

 

My dc learned to be ready on time, too. Maybe I just lucked out, or maybe it's because I only have two dc, or that I have a dh who's an on-time kind of guy, but we were almost never late because of dc issues (I say "almost" because there were a few things like the baby bomb as we were walking out the door to go to church :lol: but the dc pretty much outgrew that stuff).

[Jean in Newcastle]

Wow - lots of you would be pushed off the edge by living in India! You think 30 minutes is late....you have NO idea! Here, if you are invited for dinner at 7 - you should understand that NO one will arrive before 9! I used to be a 5 minutes early person (not for parties but in general for appointments) and that HAD to end or I was going to SHOOT someone. I hate waiting and I was just giving myself more time to wait when I showed up early/ontime.

 

So now, I go two hours late to parties, try to breath and not get mad at DH, and put it down to cultural adaptation!

 

But that's the culture. In my Western culture it is not acceptable to be late to a publicly scheduled event. With my Filipino ILs, we always ask if a starting time is "Filipino time" or "American time".

[Aubrey]

DH and I were that couple who were always early. Not annoyingly so, but just 5 or 10 minutes. It annoyed us to death that my parents are always late....to everything. Always. We were never late.

 

And then we had kids.

 

Now, we cannot be on time to save our lives. It seems that something ALWAYS comes up as we are trying to get out the door. Meltdowns, blowouts, lost toys, bathroom trips, lost keys/phone, etc. It's ALWAYS something. It annoys me that we are always late!!

 

Dh & I are more the opposite. We were *always* late *until* we had kids. Somehow, I guess they taught us to plan for the unforeseen? But I'm very laid back about tardiness, despite being mostly among the on-time crowd now.

 

If I'm meeting one or two people for something, I think it's *extremely* rude for one of us to be late beyond 5-10 min & beyond really reasonable reasons. Because one person's presence accounts for the majority of what's going on, kwim?

 

But a larger group? Esp w/ church, I think people need to take deep breaths & let it be. If the Lord convicts people about tardiness, they'll change. If not, He's probably working on something else.

 

But you know what happens to the chronically late when they are made to feel badly about their lateness? They quit going. After marrying dh (& having our lateness feed off of ea other & being *really* late), I got to where I was just too embarrassed to show up after the service started. If we weren't ready, we stayed home.

 

No one made a point about lateness to us, or it would have been worse. I was already embarrassed. Sometimes I think it's easy to forget about the point of faith & get caught up in programs & religion. People are usually struggling with a lot of things bigger than being on time, & I can tell you--showing up late to church when life is hard *can* feel like the last straw, like the last piece of evidence of what a failure you are.

 

I hope that doesn't sound harsh, but if you know what the person *might* be feeling (despite the fact that they show up laughing about their "tardy personality"), it might help to know what they need to hear. Sure, some people just don't care. Those people aren't likely to change, either, lol.

[mommaduck]

Dh & I are more the opposite. We were *always* late *until* we had kids. Somehow, I guess they taught us to plan for the unforeseen? But I'm very laid back about tardiness, despite being mostly among the on-time crowd now.

 

If I'm meeting one or two people for something, I think it's *extremely* rude for one of us to be late beyond 5-10 min & beyond really reasonable reasons. Because one person's presence accounts for the majority of what's going on, kwim?

 

But a larger group? Esp w/ church, I think people need to take deep breaths & let it be. If the Lord convicts people about tardiness, they'll change. If not, He's probably working on something else.

 

But you know what happens to the chronically late when they are made to feel badly about their lateness? They quit going. After marrying dh (& having our lateness feed off of ea other & being *really* late), I got to where I was just too embarrassed to show up after the service started. If we weren't ready, we stayed home.

 

No one made a point about lateness to us, or it would have been worse. I was already embarrassed. Sometimes I think it's easy to forget about the point of faith & get caught up in programs & religion. People are usually struggling with a lot of things bigger than being on time, & I can tell you--showing up late to church when life is hard *can* feel like the last straw, like the last piece of evidence of what a failure you are.

 

I hope that doesn't sound harsh, but if you know what the person *might* be feeling (despite the fact that they show up laughing about their "tardy personality"), it might help to know what they need to hear. Sure, some people just don't care. Those people aren't likely to change, either, lol.

:iagree:

[Aubrey]

Tardiness drives me nuts. I am not talking about the people who are normally on time, and something comes up. I am talking about the people who are always late. You know the kind... you usually have to lie and tell them a time 30 minutes earlier than the actual starting time of the event. These are also the people that you ask to bring chips or trashbags to the family event or potluck because you know they won't be there on time with the food. When they do finally show up they still have to cook the food items because they had to go to the store to buy them before they came. Then they proceed to say that there were lines at the store and that is why they are late. Everybody knows someone like this. I always wonder why they think their time is more precious than mine. I personally think always being tardy is an insult to the people who are waiting for you. (Sorry to all the tardy people who read this!)

 

The men in dh's family are like this, but it would *never* occur to them that they were insulting someone. People always smile & say how glad they are to see [dh or his guy family--btw, somehow, they only have boys, the girls all married in, at risk to their own sanity]. Dh believes the person.

 

These guys are so sincere, so much just...who they are, if that makes sense...that they don't read context clues & body language. They take people at face value, & since no one would ever complain about these people to their faces, they're left to argue w/ their wives that "nobody minds."

 

If you were to treat these guys the way they treat people--show up late w/ food that has to be cooked, etc.--they wouldn't mind. It's mind-blowing to see the things that just. don't. phase. them. Like puppy dogs who just wag their tales at everybody, kwim?

 

I'm not arguing w/ you or insulted by you *at all*--lol. I've learned a lot being married to one of these. :D

[Aubrey]

Wow. I'm not sure how to respond, Katia, because you are right, I just do not understand social anxieties...and I'm exhausted...and should probably just go to bed before I type something ridiculous...yet I continue...

 

In any type of church, group, meeting, etc. there are organizers/leaders who have given their time, and perhaps even stepped out of their comfort zones, in order to provide a informative, worshipful or fun experience for others. As someone mentioned earlier, it is just as important for the organizers of such gatherings to respect of the attendees' time (being efficient with time and ending promptly). I guess in my OP, I should have stated that I am coming at this discussion from the vantage point of often being the organizer...it is a good reminder to remember that some are not as outgoing as others (particularly for extroverts like myself)...however, it is equally important for everyone to contribute and not just consume. Us extroverts/organizing types get burnt out and often feel used.

 

And to be perfectly honest, when one just shows up for the "meat" of the sermon (or the meeting or the event, etc.) and then leaves...I can see how that person can be labeled as non-contributor...because arriving late appears like you don't care....and because you (or others with social anxieties) may not spend time conversing much with others, the organizers/leaders/other participants, just don't understand the social anxiety issues with which you struggle. It all comes down to communication...and mutual respect.

 

Katia is a pw. She knows about contributing, sacrificing, organizing.

 

Maybe it would be better to say that it's not about programs, it's about *people.* How many times has someone shown up, hoping to talk to someone, feeling desperately lonely, worried about their marriage/job/kids, only to get a sermon & not a single personal contact? Sometimes I think the "chit chat" before the sermon IS the meat. It certainly can be.

 

That sounds disjointed, lol. My point is simply that different people have different needs & different things to offer. If an organizer is looking at someone's attendance & getting their feathers ruffled, they're looking at the wrong Person & risking being judged by their own measure. Organizers are good at coming up w/ ideas that require people to volunteer to execute them & then get upset when no one else is "contributing."

 

God will lead people to do what they need to do. If that means a meeting doesn't happen or the nursery isn't staffed, that doesn't bother me a bit. If it's important to someone, they can volunteer w/out being guilted into it.

 

After all, if a meeting or venture or church or nursery fails, it's not *mine* to save. It's the Lord's. Pushing people to "contribute" the way that *I* think they ought is a sure way to kill the Lord's plan. (Much as I hate to admit that, because, by golly, my plans are GOOD.) :lol:

[Tabrett]

I haven't read the replies, but when dh started a church in FL, we said the service started at ___ time, but actually started 15mins after said time on purpose! It gave people 15 mins to come in, socialize and get settled. We never told people we did this:D, but it worked very well.

[Guest Katia]

Katia is a pw. She knows about contributing, sacrificing, organizing.

 

Maybe it would be better to say that it's not about programs, it's about *people.* How many times has someone shown up, hoping to talk to someone, feeling desperately lonely, worried about their marriage/job/kids, only to get a sermon & not a single personal contact? Sometimes I think the "chit chat" before the sermon IS the meat. It certainly can be.

 

That sounds disjointed, lol. My point is simply that different people have different needs & different things to offer. If an organizer is looking at someone's attendance & getting their feathers ruffled, they're looking at the wrong Person & risking being judged by their own measure. Organizers are good at coming up w/ ideas that require people to volunteer to execute them & then get upset when no one else is "contributing."

 

God will lead people to do what they need to do. If that means a meeting doesn't happen or the nursery isn't staffed, that doesn't bother me a bit. If it's important to someone, they can volunteer w/out being guilted into it.

 

After all, if a meeting or venture or church or nursery fails, it's not *mine* to save. It's the Lord's. Pushing people to "contribute" the way that *I* think they ought is a sure way to kill the Lord's plan. (Much as I hate to admit that, because, by golly, my plans are GOOD.) :lol:

 

Thank you, Aubrey. Your understanding is amazing (I'm actually crying), and I totally agree with you about Who we are to focus on. My dh could have written your last two paragraphs; he's been preaching that for 28 years now and firmly believes it.

[Sputterduck]

Katia is a pw. She knows about contributing, sacrificing, organizing.

 

Maybe it would be better to say that it's not about programs, it's about *people.* How many times has someone shown up, hoping to talk to someone, feeling desperately lonely, worried about their marriage/job/kids, only to get a sermon & not a single personal contact? Sometimes I think the "chit chat" before the sermon IS the meat. It certainly can be.

 

That sounds disjointed, lol. My point is simply that different people have different needs & different things to offer. If an organizer is looking at someone's attendance & getting their feathers ruffled, they're looking at the wrong Person & risking being judged by their own measure. Organizers are good at coming up w/ ideas that require people to volunteer to execute them & then get upset when no one else is "contributing."

 

God will lead people to do what they need to do. If that means a meeting doesn't happen or the nursery isn't staffed, that doesn't bother me a bit. If it's important to someone, they can volunteer w/out being guilted into it.

 

After all, if a meeting or venture or church or nursery fails, it's not *mine* to save. It's the Lord's. Pushing people to "contribute" the way that *I* think they ought is a sure way to kill the Lord's plan. (Much as I hate to admit that, because, by golly, my plans are GOOD.) :lol:

 

This is a wonderful post! I could not agree with you more!