"We don't say 'You can't play.' "

[myfunnybunch]

What is your house rule/guideline about playing together? :)

 

In our house that's the rule. Everyone is included, especially if we have guests.

 

Our neighbor, on the other hand, always schedules separate simultaneous play dates for her children (older sister, younger brother) or does a special activity with the child w/o a friend over because the sister never wants to include her brother in her play.

 

I'm not saying I'm right (or wrong) because I can see the benefits to both, just using them as an example of two extremes. I do wonder if it's because she has a boy and a girl, 4 years apart; I have three stairstep boys with the same interests.

 

What do you do? Does age/gender make a difference?

 

Cat

[MamaSheep]

Mine play together sometimes, and separately with their own friends sometimes. At my house age and gender do make a big difference (boy, girl 5.5 years apart). When one has a friend over sometimes the sibling joins in, sometimes not, depending on the activity. If one is feeling left out I will sometimes do something with them, sometimes I suggest that they call up a friend of their own, but I also sometimes let them just learn to amuse themselves on their own. I think it's important to learn to be happy and comfortable all on your own steam and not rely on other people to amuse you. Real life is generally not equipped with a cruise director. (But it's possible I'm just mean...lol...)

 

Play is fairly casual around here, though. We live in a very family-oriented neighborhood and most of their friends live within a few blocks. They pretty much arrange their own playdates, and I definitely don't insist that dd7 be dragged along to play legos and video games with the 13yo boys or that ds12 be forced to go play tea party and ponies with the short pink herd that roams the neighborhood (they're going to be dangerous in another 5 years or so...lol).

[phathui5]

Dd (6) had a 5 year old girl over to play today. The girl has two older brothers who came with her to play with ds1. If the girls wanted to play alone, I wouldn't have made them let the boys play too.

 

I won't let kids leave people out if they're doing it in a mean way, but if they want one-on-one time with a friend, I'm willing to honor that.

[cara]

At the park with a big wide range of friends, everyone is included and they all play together.

 

At home, they are 18 months (girl) and 8 (boy). They sometimes play together but really he's not interested in her toys and she's not interested in his. So they play apart. When DS has a friend over, he doesn't have to have his baby sister tagging along.

[Daisy]

Yes, age and gender make a huge difference.

 

My children do often play together in a large group when friends come over but at other times they just want to enjoy their special friend. I don't think my 10yo daughter and her girlfriend should feel obligated to include my 8yo son in their every conversation and activity. LOL. I imagine that would be a girl's nightmare.

 

On the flip side, sometimes my son goes to a friend's house, has a friend over, or goes to a birthday party where his older sister is not included.

 

I teach my children to be happy for their sibling and remind them that they have their chance for special company also. I also don't *make* my children play together. For example, they cannot purposely exclude their sibling from a game of Monopoly with Dad, but I am fine with one of my children saying to a sibling, "I want to be alone now so I can read. Please leave my room."

 

That said, rudeness is never acceptable so I'd expect my children to treat each other with respect and courtesy.

[woolybear]

I have two boys just over two years apart. They do have some friends in common. So sometimes I will arrange a play date for just one of them and I will tell that one that they can have some alone time with their friend, but then they also need to include the other person for part of the play date as well. I feel both sides are important. It's good to be able to share friends and be able to all play together. It's also important for them to develop close one on one friendships. Also, sometimes younger ds can be annoying to older ds and friend, so I make sure there is a built in time without him.

 

Wooly

[katemary63]

In our house, a girl whose friend is visiting would not be forced to let her little brother play with them. Little brother would do something special with mom or watch a movie or something.

 

However, if the siblings are same sex and closer in age, I would not allow "You can't play with us." My daughter has a friend who is 1 year older then she is and this friend has a sister 1 year younger then my DD. The older sister never wants the younger sister to play with them, but my DD is friends with both and it's very touchy for her. I wish her mom didn't allow it to go on.

[Ferdie]

My kids have one on one play time with their friends at our home.

[ReneTL]

Our rule is this: if one girl has a guest and the other wants to play what they are playing, she must be included. However, the non-guest-having girl can't dictate the games played, rules, etc. The girl with the guest can't intentionally make a game that the other girl won't want to play to manipulate the situation in their favor (make her go away).

 

It works for us, but I have friends all over the map. I have even had a young guest come and complain to me that they wanted to have alone time with so-and-so. After I scraped up my jaw from the floor, I explained our house rules.

[amy g.]

We never exclude anyone. My kids know that if they can't include their siblings, it will be a cold day in @#$#@ before they have another friend over.

[Night Elf]

Sometimes kids just want to hang out with other friends who aren't with them 24/7. Sometimes 3 or more really are a crowd.

 

My ds13 and dd12 are 20 months apart. I have never forced them to incude one another when they are playing with friends. They have played together with friends by their own choice.

[Sasharowan]

With the only two close in age being opposite genders and dd being the only girl, we do have alone time. For instance, tonight dd is sleeping over at her best friends house and bf's older brother is here with ds13. ds8 and ds4 are doing their own thing since the game the big boys are playing is too old for ds8. Since dd is ds4's major playmate he is kind of at loose ends, but enjoying dad too.

[HRAAB]

If my older dd is having a friend over for the day or for a sleepover, I do not make her include her twin sisters. Sometimes she needs to have time with a friend without her little sisters being part of it. She plays and includes her younger sisters all the time; they live together 24/7. She rarely gets a break from them since she doesn't attend school. She needs and has a right, I believe, to time spend time with friends. I do the same for all my girls. And they all get along fine. I do wonder if I forced her to always include younger sisters when she has a friend over, if that would be true.

[EarleneW]

My kids have their own friends and the siblings do not have to be included when a friend is over. Uusally they are, but My 12 year old boy should not have to include his sister and vise versa. They do play together alot too- but no way would I force that. I don't think its fair to not let them have thier own friends.

[Aubrey]

We don't have a lot of friends over, but the one family who comes most often has 4 dc like we do. For the most part, it's a pile of kids. My friend has: ds11, ds9, ds6, dd3. My dd2 & 3yo girl will kind-of pair up for a bit. Our 5 bigs mostly play all together w/ trains. Sometimes 11yo boy & dd6 will set up a board game in the dining room. Sometimes 11yo boy will do the same w/ ds9.

 

I try to make sure that kids who want to be included are included, that sharing happens, things don't get broken. In a kid pile, I wouldn't nec. help kids do anything that discluded anybody--it's just not going to work well. At the same time, w/ that wide of an age spread, I do tend to feel sorry for the biggest of the group, in this case, 11yo boy. Many times what the "crowd" is doing is outside his range of interest, if only slightly, so if he happens to find someone who wants to do something he's more interested in, cool. I'll help keep the littles off the table if I can.

 

Ds9 has had the 9yo boy over to play a couple of times. For the most part, the boys play w/ dd6 w/out it crossing anyone's mind that it should be any other way. But I talk to her ahead of time about needing to give them some boy time/friend time w/out her. Partly, she's likely to talk them into playing My Little Ponies, lol, completely unaware of how...inappropriate? it would be for her to..."direct" the play. Partly, it's good to learn to respect people's friendships.

 

Otoh, we don't know any girls dd's age really, so friends coming over could easily end up very lopsided if I were to hyperfocus on ds being alone w/ his friend. So I guess I believe in a casual blend of the two. Maybe even skipping the talk w/ dd & just inviting her to come bake w/ me for a bit & then sending her back to share some cookies over a board game. Simple, but respectful of individual needs & personalities. (Dd's definitely the dominant personality in that mix.)

 

Ultimately, my philosophy on this is a variation on the golden rule. How would I have felt about my sis & bro being included in every sleepover I had? A kid's feelings may not be mature or well-informed or even particularly hospitable, but I don't want to ignore them completely. And I want to foster good relationships between sibs.

 

For the most part, I think that means being able to play well together w/ or w/out friends. Occasionally, I think that means not having to play w/ sibs all. the. time. Mostly, I think it means knowing yourself & knowing your kids. As a firstborn, I'm going to tend to sympathize w/ the plight of the olders. 11yo boy's mom is a youngest, & she tends to favor the desires of the youngers. I think if we recognize those tendencies & try to work toward balance--hopefully our kids will forgive us when they're grown! ;)

[Tap]

I agree that age and gender do make a big difference, but personalities do also.

 

Ds15 is a quiet, mature teen and honestly, has always been this way. Dd11 is loud and immature, chattering away about everything, and nothing (one day we were driving down the road and she started talking incessantly about the guy walking down the road and what store he bought his groceries at... :banghead:) ) She just talks, to talk.

 

There have been a few occasions that I have asked ds and his friends to include her for an hour or so, but it is very rare. I don't think he would have friends coming over for long if I made them include her for long. It always includes a stern chat with her about appropriate amounts of talking. :lol:

 

Now it is the same for dd11. There are times when I ask her to let dd3 tag along, but it is almost always outside.

[Denisemomof4]

I don't agree with making siblings include each other during play time with friends. While family IS most important, families who homeschool are together ALL THE TIME and I think it's good AND healthy for kids to have time to enjoy with their friends when they don't have to include their siblings. Heck, I want some time away from my kids, why wouldn't they want some time away from each other?

 

I've always made sure that when each of my four kids have a friend over, the siblings leave them alone UNLESS they are invited to play. It's a rule here. Of course now that my boys are older it's no longer an issue, and with my girls, I'm fortunate in that most of their friends have a sibling the age of theirs so it just works out. BUT, if one has a friend over, the other is to leave them alone. Doesn't happen on a regular basis, but it does happen.

[Guest janainaz]

My boys are almost five years apart. My ds10 has twins that are his best friends. When they come over, ds5 joins in with them and my older son is always very nice about it. I don't remember that being the case when I was a kid. My only sister and I were almost five years apart and my mother kept me away from my sister and her friends when they came over and vice versa.

 

My ds10 is with his brother all day, every day. If he requested a break to play with his friends alone, I think I'd find something to occupy ds5's time. As long as my child was not going out of his way to single out someone or isolate his friends for insecurity reasons, I'd honor their wish for some one-on-one time with the friend. It just depends on the personality of the kid.

 

As for the gender difference, I don't know. Every situation has different dynamics.

[Haiku]

Does age/gender make a difference?

 

 

Absolutely. Can you imagine how my fifteen year old would feel if I made her include her seven and eight year old siblings in every get-together she has with friends? My oldest is very good about including her younger sibs and frequently invites them to play when she has friends over, but sometimes she needs time with her friends where she's not entertaining the littles.

 

Even my seven and eight year olds sometimes wants to play with another child alone (rarely, but it has happened). Every child likes to feel like the star sometimes.

 

I definitely DON'T plan a special something for any child who doesn't have a friend over at the moment. To me that just sets up the idea that not having a friend over to play is a tragedy that needs to be mediated.

 

Tara

[mom31257]

My kids play together fairly well considering the 6 year age difference and gender difference. If my older dd has a friend over, I do expect our ds to give them their space. I don't think pre-teen/teen girls should be expected to play with little boys. I will say that they do include him sometimes on their own, though, so it has not been a big issue at our house.

[Haiku]

However, if the siblings are same sex and closer in age, I would not allow "You can't play with us." My daughter has a friend who is 1 year older then she is and this friend has a sister 1 year younger then my DD. The older sister never wants the younger sister to play with them, but my DD is friends with both and it's very touchy for her. I wish her mom didn't allow it to go on.

 

I think kids who are close in age need time away from their sibs as much or even more than kids who are farther apart in age. Kids need some time to develop themselves out of the context of just being a brother or a sister or one of a unit. In fact, I would have to say that the sole downside to homeschooling for us is that my kids, who are less than a year apart, don't get a whole lot of time away from each other. I definitely want my kids to be close, and they are absolutely each other's best friend, but ... I like some time to myself without my husband around, too. I don't always want to include my husband in my social plans.

 

Tara

[Haiku]

Think of it this way: little sibs (of which I was one, having two older sisters and two older brothers) are far more apt to idolize and want to copy older sibs than vice versa.

 

If you have a hard-and-fast "everyone must be included" rule, you are basically allowing the younger child/ren to dictate how the older one/s spend their time.

 

If my fifteen year old had to include my little ones all the time, that would drastically limit the movies she and her friends could watch, where they could ride their bikes, etc.

 

Tara

[ChristusG]

I definitely think that the age gap and the gender of the kids play a big role.

 

I have two girls, ages 3 and 5. We don't have many friends over, but when we do, I expect them all to play together. And they do. My girls are very good friends and we've never had an issue with exclusion. My 5 year old has selective mutism and she very much relies on her little sister to be the "friend maker" and be the more assertive one in social situations.

[Sputterduck]

It's okay for them to be separate people. I grew up with a friend whose mother made her include her little sister in everything she did. It was horrible. Terrible. Horrible. My friend couldn't come to sleepovers often because little sister didn't have a friend's house to go to. We had to include her in our play even though she was too young to understand it, and it resulted in no one having any fun. If her little sister felt at all upset about anything, she would run to her mother and complain and we were in trouble, even though we did nothing wrong. If we wanted to be with Charleen, we spent the whole time catering to her little sister's whims.

 

All this because her mother was a younger sibling who always felt left out. It's okay for a child to have their own friends!

[Leighton Academy]

We don't have a rule about including siblings when friends are over. It has yet to come up when we would need one. Maybe it's because our kids are only 2 years apart and the same gender. At this point, we don't "arrange" playdates either though. We're blessed to have homeschoolers as neighbors on both sides. Even the public schoolers on our block come over to play. There are 3-4 kids over to play usually every afternoon. The age range is from 5-11 and they all seem to play well together. There is one girl in the whole group but she seems to hold her own against all the boys. My boys don't really have separate friends. Each seems to be closer to specific friends though no one gets excluded during play.

 

Honestly, I'm not sure how I'll handle the situation when it arises. I'll be "listening" to how everyone else deals with it.

[katemary63]

I think kids who are close in age need time away from their sibs as much or even more than kids who are farther apart in age. Kids need some time to develop themselves out of the context of just being a brother or a sister or one of a unit. In fact, I would have to say that the sole downside to homeschooling for us is that my kids, who are less than a year apart, don't get a whole lot of time away from each other. I definitely want my kids to be close, and they are absolutely each other's best friend, but ... I like some time to myself without my husband around, too. I don't always want to include my husband in my social plans.

 

Tara

 

You may be right here. I've never been in this situation with my own kids - different sexes, very different ages. But for my DD and these two girls, maybe the situation is bad because she is friends with both girls. My daughter feels horrible that the younger sister is excluded and actually, would, herself, prefer for them all to play together, but the older sister doesn't consent to it. :confused:

[myfunnybunch]

Interesting responses. :) Thank you.

 

I do think I should clarify a bit. I'm not talking about making all kids play together all the time, only doing things the youngest child can do, or everyone having to cater to one child. I'm talking about two or more children (not teens) saying to another child, "You can't play with us," with the intent of deliberately excluding that child. "You can't come in the fort. You can't play with Legos with us. You can't play in the play room." My boys share a room, so "You can't come in my room" is not an issue.

 

I was curious because it's rarely an issue on our house in the first place, and my neighbor, who is a lovely wonderful mom with great kids, goes to such pains to schedule separate play dates. Often we have to have one set of kids at my house and one at hers because her daughter gets upset when the younger kids want to play what she and my oldest son are playing. (Again, not a criticism, just an observation. It works for them and my kids don't much seem to care.)

 

I'm interested in the contrast, and it's interesting to read the reasoning behind many of the responses.

 

We usually play with sibling pairs or groups and the children usually combine and recombine naturally. It's not unusual to find my 9 y.o. playing trains with his friend's 6 y.o. sister while his friend builds a fort with the two younger boys, for example. Even when we don't have guests, the boys usually combine and separate naturally, and when they don't it's very deliberate. (Thus the rule, to deal with that kind of behavior.)

 

Cat

Edited April 3, 2010 by myfunnybunch

[myfunnybunch]

If you have a hard-and-fast "everyone must be included" rule, you are basically allowing the younger child/ren to dictate how the older one/s spend their time.

 

Oh, no. I don't mean the teens. I mean the children who still play, lol.

 

I don't think that saying "You can't say 'You can't play' " means everyone must be included in every activity. I don't expect my 9 y.o. to stop making arrows with his pocket knife because his little brother can't do it. It is appropriate to say, "You're too little for this."

 

It's not appropriate for the two older children to, for example, slam the closet door in their little brother's face and say, "Go away! You can't play with us!" That's the direction I was going, not that everyone must be together every waking moment. That would be t-o-r-t-u-r-e. :D

 

Cat

[2squared]

I think you need to have both - play dates where everyone plays and with some alone time for the friend pair. When one of my older kids has a friend over, everyone wants to play with the friend. All four kids gang up on the poor, unsuspecting kid. :D So, I make sure that the friend & my dd/ds have alone time to play if they want (usually in bedrooms even though they are shared) and they have time for group play. The kids can combine and recombine however they want, but alone play is respected as well. No one is allowed to hurtfully exclude my other kids, but the kids can obviously request alone time without being hurtful.

 

I can already see that alone time is a treasured commodity in bigger families. I think it's important for kids of all ages to be able to play in groups and also to have time to nurture friends as singletons.

[emzhengjiu]

My rule is similar for children who normally play together, no one is deliberately excluded. My daughters, 9 & 13, still play together. My older daughter is physically mature but loves creative play. So far both girls share friends of a wide age range but I know the day will come when my older daughter will want some privacy with friends her own age. If one girl has been invited for a special event, I treat the other girl to something simple such as an an ice cream cone, nothing expensive.

 

My problem is almost the opposite. My 9 yo is introverted and becomes stressed if she needs private time. She knows she can stop playing as long as I know about it even if shared friends are over. The only exception is when we've invited friends who don't live near us. I'm introverted as well so I understand people overload!

 

Ann

[Peela]

We go for balance. Mine are close in age, but opposite sex. I have found that in homeschooling communities, there is little segregation. But amongst schooled kids, it is expected they will play separately and only separately.

 

I have never made a rule about it either way. I just go by feel. If I feel the one with the friend over needs space with the friend, I give the other special computer time or something to do with me. As they get older, I expect them less and less to play together. Yet this afternoon, dd15's best friend invited both dd and ds14 over for the afternoon. But thats always been the case with those friends. Sometimes the girls just want to be alone together and be girlies. And other times they want to hang out in a group with girls and guys, and my two are included together.

 

I like to remain flexible about it and mostly its not been an issue.

[Haiku]

slam the closet door in their little brother's face and say, "Go away! You can't play with us!"

 

Well yeah. That's unacceptable rudeness. But that's not at all the picture I got from your original post, which stated, "

In our house that's the rule. Everyone is included, especially if we have guests.

 

Tara