Breastfeeding help for my sister

[Sarah CB]

My sister had her first baby on Sept 28 and is having a really rough time bfing. She's incredibly sore and last night was bleeding. She saw a lactation consultant four days ago and things seemed to really be improving until last night when things got really bad. She's been using an electric pump as well and feeding the baby from a dixie cup to give her breasts a break.

 

She's tried a shield, but it didn't work well for her. Is there anything else I can tell her to try? Anything that will help ease the pain?

[Caitilin]

lanolin is going to be her best friend. :) I wouldn't recommend the cup feedings often, as it will drop her milk supply, and make her suck harder when she does nurse. Cabbage leaves in the bra are supposed to help. I know there are some LLL mamas here who will know more--it WILL get better!:grouphug: to her

[runninmommy]

Have her get some pure lanolin to gently put on. I had problems with bleeding and cracking with all 3 of mine. It was almost worse than giving birth. Your poor sister, I hope she feels better soon.

[Dana]

I find the lanolin works best if you keep it in your pocket for 10-15 min to get it warm. Then it spreads easily.

 

Cabbage leaves didn't do anything for me. I was in PAIN at first. I don't have any suggestions (other than warming up lanolin - and it also works great for dry skin in the winter), but despite having cracked nipples when I nursed at first, we were very successful over the long run and although the first couple months were dreadful, then nursing became very easy.

 

And my son's dairy allergy made me very glad I had nursed!

 

La Leche League may be very helpful for support and advice (depending on your part of the country). Good luck to her!

[SquirrellyMama]

I definitly recommend LLL. They saved my bf'ing relationship with ds and dd#2. I wish I'd gone with dd#1. I had a horrible time with bf'ing. I would recommend a product that is a gel pad that you can put into your bra. I cannot remember the name though. They sell them at Target. Unfortunately those have a hole in the middle like a donut. I bought some at the pharmacy that didn't have th hole. It was awesome. You put them in the fridge so they are nice a cool. If I remember the name I'll let you know.

 

I found it. It is a product called Soothies. I think they are made by Lansinoh. I think these are a little different than the ones I had. Mine were reuseable and I think these might be disposable.

 

http://www.lansinoh.com/products/soothies-by-lansinoh-gel-pads

 

Kelly

Edited October 6, 2009 by kwiech

[SnowWhite]

kelly, they are soothies and a good lact cons should have them.

[txbloobonnet]

One thing that really helped me with my 2nd baby (the only one out of 4 to be difficult to nurse...her mouth is MUCH smaller than everyone elses) was to nurse her upside down. That gave me time to heal. It hurt so bad to nurse her that I would get a horrible taste in my mouth when she latched on, but I was sooooo determined. I also used those shields and then went around topless to make sure my books dried out. This whole thing was much more traumatic than the actual natural childbirth. :blink:

[Cera]

I would agree to skip the pumping and cup feeding. If she saw a lactation consultant and the latch is right the next thing to check would be baby's mouth for any signs of thrush. If nothing seems wrong it may just be a matter of grimacing through it for a week or two until her nipples get used to it. Before latching him (her?) on she can cover her nipples with lanolin and mentally prepare. The first two weeks nursing our first was HARD but once we got in our groove it was so worth it so encourage her not to give up for 4-6 weeks (because by then problems are usually resolved).

[Gretchen in NJ]

Green Tea bags soaked for a few minutes in hot tap water helped me. It has been a while (9 years:() so I don't know why it works. I would use them almost after everytime I nursed. They were very soothing and helped to keep my nipples clean. She needs to make sure that the baby is getting the whole nipple into her little mouth too. Sometimes, the babies only want to suck on the tip which is painful.

[amsunshine]

Ditto what the other posters said: I found lanolin to be an absolute must during the first month or two of bf -- make sure it is the type made specifically for breastfeeding.

 

Also, I haven't heard of feeding through a Dixie Cup. I did pump when mine were babies, but used Playtex nursers for my dh to do occasional feedings. I didn't find that pumping decreased my milk supply, but I was careful to limit the bottle feedings to once per day at most.

[SquirrellyMama]

One thing that really helped me with my 2nd baby (the only one out of 4 to be difficult to nurse...her mouth is MUCH smaller than everyone elses) was to nurse her upside down. :blink:

 

I remember doing that with one of my kids too. I had completely forgotten. I also laid down a lot to nurse. I could at least go to sleep and not feel the pain. That got me through nursing my son for the first 6 months.

[qfbrenda]

The best trick I've ever learned for nursing is the lower lip flip. Once my newborn is latched on, I reach in with my free hand and use my thumb to gently pull down on baby's chin. This teaches baby to open his mouth wide, and it makes sure that the lower lip is flared out.

 

I also found lots of airflow to the parts helped things heal a bit between feedings.

[Mrs Mungo]

I agree about lanolin and all of that.

 

I would agree to skip the pumping and cup feeding. If she saw a lactation consultant and the latch is right the next thing to check would be baby's mouth for any signs of thrush. If nothing seems wrong it may just be a matter of grimacing through it for a week or two until her nipples get used to it. Before latching him (her?) on she can cover her nipples with lanolin and mentally prepare. The first two weeks nursing our first was HARD but once we got in our groove it was so worth it so encourage her not to give up for 4-6 weeks (because by then problems are usually resolved).

 

I also agree with this, especially about the LC checking the latch. Make sure the LC is certified by the International Board of Lactation Consultants, not just a nurse who has taken a breastfeeding class. LLLLeaders are great but, technically, they are not supposed to train a baby's latch.

 

The one thing I will suggest in addition it to look at the baby's latch and see if baby's tongue is between baby's lip and the nipple. Some babies are tongue-tied, where the frenulum under their tongue is too short and it's not getting in the right place. It's really, really easy to clip in a young baby. It's usually done in the pediatrician's office. I'd have it checked.

[LaxMom]

I went through this at times with the boys and agree with LLL, the Lansinoh and position changes (cabbage leaves are for engorgement, and I've never used soothies so can't comment). They never had signs of thrush but would develop yeast diaper rash. If the Lansinoh doesn't work, she may want to try "Canadian Nipple Cream" (that's what my OB wrote for - scroll down to the "In the US..." formulation Dr. Newman recommends). She'll need a prescription and a compounding pharmacy (the hospital pharm will likely compound it) but it worked really well.

 

ETA: I did treat thrush with my daughter, using gentian violet, which my pharmacist didn't stock, but she ordered for me. I think it was $4.

[farmmom4him]

I agree check for tongue tie. It will cause all sorts of issues. :iagree::iagree::iagree:

[SquirrellyMama]

Another thing I remember is finding that when the "food source" was bigger than the baby's head we had trouble. Sometimes it just took a bit of growth of baby's head to help. That may have just been me though. I hope she can get through the rough patch. I quit with my first after 2 months and had and have so much regret and guilt still. Although not as much now that I'm not nursing a baby.

[Supertechmom]

OUCH! Been there. My third was so tiny that her mouth just couldn't latch on right. THe pain was way worse than anything I had ever had in 3 rounds of labor. I finally resorted to using Neosporion and a bandaid to keep the crack closed and endured. THe LC said we had proper latch and everything right but she was just so tiny.

 

The only thing that helped was letting her use my husband's finger as a pacifier. We did that for about a week to make her force her mouth open when she nursed. She just didn't want to open that mouth very far. It helped. It also helped to place my finger under the nipple and get her to suck on both at the same time. Then I could make sure her tongue was under and her bottom lip flipped out and keep some pressure off of that crack and that she wouldl open her mouth far enough.

 

Tell her to hang in there!

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

I agree with Lanolin. It saved nursing. Keep them moist, moist, moist. I cracked and bled for weeks, despite latch being perfect. The fact is that some babies just really have a very, very strong suck and that area of the body is obviously sensitive and tender. It might be some time before things get better though. I didn't supplement with anything and I don't really recommend it. Things started getting better around 6 weeks but I still had pain through 12. Encourage her not to give up.

 

The best thing for me was to have a friend tell me that she herself had the same problem and, as I did, actually had to steel herself, leverage her foot under the sofa and bite her lip every time baby latched on because ME TOO! It was so good to know someone else had made it through into a successful nursing experience after such a painful beginning. With my next two, nursing was a breeze, start to finish. I joke that my first killed all the nerve endings. :lol:

 

ETA: Oh, as much as it killed me, I did offer DS a pacifier. He was a very oral baby and just needed to suck all the time. Now, THAT's Not good for healing! The paci saved me along with the lanolin.

[Ellie]

I was that way with my second baby, so I literally feel your sister's pain.:grouphug:

 

Having said that, let me say this: the more she nurses, the sooner she'll toughen up. That means no breast pump (which may mess with her milk supply, BTW) and no Dixie cup. Lanolin, holding the baby in different positions so the pressure is on different parts of her n*pples, *frequent* nursing, letting her br*asts be open to the air as much as possible when she's home, can all help. She might call a LLL leader, if there are any in her community. Remember that LLL leaders were around long before lactation consultants were "invented," so I would call LLL first.

[Mrs Mungo]

She might call a LLL leader, if there are any in her community. Remember that LLL leaders were around long before lactation consultants were "invented," so I would call LLL first.

 

I'm one of the most pro-LLL people you will find but they are not supposed to do latch training with babies. Even some Leaders that know how won't do it because the League doesn't allow it. That's why I suggest a LC when it comes to latch training. ymmv, all of that.

[8circles]

You've gotten some good advice so far. I would only add that I know it's hard, believe me - I was bleeding quite a bit w/ my first - it's still early. It's he## at the time but it will pass. Also, a good website for lots of good BF information is http://www.kellymom.com/.

[msjones]

Did read all the replies, but I was in your poor sister's shoes and will never forget it.

 

Hospital grade second skin -- the ONLY thing that helped me. I had horrible pain and bleeding -- pink milk, and me crying and sweating in pain each and every time I nursed. The nursing was far far worse than my quick and easy labors. I have scars on both nipples to this day.

 

The tea bags, lanolin, none of it made any difference. (Applying the lanolin to my bleeding skin was just more agony for me. Terrible advice for someone who is truly bleeding...) Those second skin gel pads did the trick. My consultant told me the baby would just keep sucking the scabs right off and I'd start bleeding again until the wounds healed. That made sense -- more sense than the tea bags/cabbage leaves, etc!

 

So, I had to pump for days (3 or 4?) while using the second skin gel pads. It was exhausting to pump around the clock, but it actually worked, and I could see the improvement/healing quickly, which was very good for my morale.

 

I hope your sister can hang in there, but I'm quick to tell new moms that there's no shame in a bottle-fed baby --in my opinion.

 

You're a great sister for helping her out! I hope she's feeling better soon so she can enjoy her new little one.

[Katiebug_1976]

Have her get some pure lanolin to gently put on. I had problems with bleeding and cracking with all 3 of mine. It was almost worse than giving birth. Your poor sister, I hope she feels better soon.

:iagree: Tell her not to give up. I gave up w/ my 1st 2, but stuck it out w/ my 3rd. Now looking back, I wish I had stuck it out w/ my 1st 2. It will get better, just give it some time and LOTS of lanolin! Cold packs between feedings are soothing, too.

[Chris in VA]

Just wanted to say I've been there, and what helped me prevent the soreness with my 3rd that I had with my 2nd was to make sure the baby had the entire aereola (is that spelled right?) in the mouth--mine was big, and I felt I might be choking the poor girl, but it was great, because the pressure was entirely off the nipple--she was "milking" the breast by squeezing the aereola, not the nipple tip, and there was no soreness of any kind. I was able to nurse her for 40 minutes the second time she nursed, and she continued to want to nurse these marathon sessions, but I could because of getting the right parts into her mouth.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Oh, how familiar this sounds. I had cracked, bleeding nipples with my first child. He simply would not latch deep enough (plus I was recovering from some invasive procedures and could only nurse lying down - pretty difficult to correct a latch that way.) I was too independent to ask for help (and maybe a little too overwhelmed.)

 

A couple things to think about - a general rule is that the baby needs about a nipple and an inch. Some babies are resistant to that, especially if they have had a lot of pacifier use, or some invasive suctioning or just small mouths.

 

Dr. Jack Newman runs a breastfeeding clinic in Toronto. He has an excellent breastfeeding book called the Ultimate Breastfeeding Book of Answers. He has a latching technique that is different than what is often taught. I found that this technique worked very well at encouraging a better latch.

Here is a link to his website with some good (very graphic) videos.

 

With my oldest, I had to pull on his lower jaw to encourage him to keep his mouth open (he was a chomper.) My dd was a "nipple walker", that is, she would start out great, but pull back to get only the nipple. She seemed to have an aversion to having her mouth that full. We had to do a "tongue walking" technique to acclimate her to having the nipple far back enough in her mouth. Within a day, she was nursing great.

 

Good luck to her.

[Cammie]

I agree check for tongue tie. It will cause all sorts of issues. :iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

 

I had an EXTREMELY :eek: difficult time nursing DD. She was slightly tongue-tied and her frenulum needed to be clipped. It was a quick two-second procedure in the doctor's office. Also, I did use a shield ...for two years! I know LLL and lots of people say it is not recommended/possible but I did it. It was the only way I could nurse her and not be in excruciating pain.

 

I hope she also has a good lactation counselor. Joining a support group for nursing moms also helped me a great deal - they were kind of like my Hive for nursing!

[joannqn]

As others have said, check for tongue-tie (or have a lactation consultant or ENT check for it). Even if it is only minorly tied and latch looks good, it could still be an issue.

 

My oldest was tightly tongue-tied but it never caused a problem with nursing. She is still tightly tongue-tied.

 

My youngest was tongue-tied but not really bad. The pediatrician thought it would be fine because she could get her tongue past/above her lower teeth. The lactation consultant thought is could be an issue but thought her latch was good. The issue turned out to be the tongue-tie. When we had it clipped, the pain was completely gone within a few days (it took a couple days to heal). Clipping it was NOT traumatic on the baby AT ALL.

 

Please, tell her that if tongue-tie is even remotely possible to get it clipped. Many times the pediatrician will insist on an ENT doing it; it might be hard to find one who will do it but a lactation consultant should have some names. I watched my little one have it clipped In fact, I held her in my lap for it. We woke her up to get her to cry. You need to mess with them to get them to cry so the doctor has access to the bottom of the tongue. When he clipped my little one's tongue, she did not cry any more than the feeble "why did you wake up me" cry she was already doing. She was back to sleep in 2 minutes.

 

I'm telling you all this so that if tongue-tie is a possible issue, you can tell her not to stress about it hurting her baby. I wish I had clipped my oldest daughter's tongue.

[Peri]

So that means the baby is about 2 weeks old right now which is quite common for sore nipples. It will go away and she will have forgotten all about the pain. Aside from that Lansinoh and letting them air ... seriously ... tell her to go topless lol. The soreness is from the constant moisture (and from the baby sucking) so if she lets them air then she does give them a break. Once her nipples are nice and dry use lansinoh ... pure lanolin. It will act as a barrier between her nipples and the constant moisture giving her some relief. She should be ok within a week.

[babysparkler]

One thing that really helped me with my 2nd baby (the only one out of 4 to be difficult to nurse...her mouth is MUCH smaller than everyone elses) was to nurse her upside down.

 

:iagree:I had to change positions with my dd whose mouth was very small... it gives a break to the "usual spots". Also, I agree that Lanolin is her best friend... dry the nipple and load the nips up with lanolin and a breast pad to keep the bra clean. Do this religiously. It really does help. Doing bra-less also helps to dry them out.

 

It will all get better... it took me a couple of months for the pain/cracking/bleeding to get better, but it was always worth it to me.

[msjones]

So that means the baby is about 2 weeks old right now which is quite common for sore nipples. It will go away and she will have forgotten all about the pain. Aside from that Lansinoh and letting them air ... seriously ... tell her to go topless lol. The soreness is from the constant moisture (and from the baby sucking) so if she lets them air then she does give them a break. Once her nipples are nice and dry use lansinoh ... pure lanolin. It will act as a barrier between her nipples and the constant moisture giving her some relief. She should be ok within a week.

 

Peri,

If this worked for you, that's great. I wish it would have been that simple for me!

But my consultant suggested that the dryness was the problem -- it led to the scabs and then the scabs were pulled off and a painful cycle was set into place. That's why she suggested the second skin gel pads -- they allowed the wounds to heal without drying out.

 

Anyway, I'm no expert and have only nursed 2 babies, but that's what helped me when I was ready to quit from all the bleeding and pain.

[coffeefreak]

Green Tea bags soaked for a few minutes in hot tap water helped me. It has been a while (9 years:() so I don't know why it works. I would use them almost after everytime I nursed. They were very soothing and helped to keep my nipples clean. She needs to make sure that the baby is getting the whole nipple into her little mouth too. Sometimes, the babies only want to suck on the tip which is painful.

 

:iagree:

My 2nd dd did everything right. It was just really hard for me to get used to it again.:tongue_smilie: I used Lipton tea bags in desperation one night and it totally worked! I slept with them in my bra for the first 2 months:D

 

If her baby is doing everything right (good latch, no thrush, no inverted nipples etc) tell her to try it.

 

Blessings!

Dorinda

[ChristusG]

Two weeks is definitely not enough time yet for the nipples to "toughen up." Tell her to stick with it and it will get easier and easier each day.

 

I nursed DD #1 for 27 months with no issues whatsoever. My nipples really never even hurt in the beginning. When DD#2 came along, I thought that I would be a pro since nursing DD#1 for that long. Uhhh, no LOL. DD#2 had a correct latch, but a small one. She would not take the nipple deep enough into her mouth. Nothing really helped except for time. I went to see the lactation consultant at the hospital who checked her latch (which I already knew was fine). Other than that, I used lanolin a bit when they were cracked. It just took a few weeks of DD#2 adjusting to nursing and how to suck. It was a painful few weeks!

[WagsWife]

:iagree:I had to change positions with my dd whose mouth was very small... it gives a break to the "usual spots". Also, I agree that Lanolin is her best friend... dry the nipple and load the nips up with lanolin and a breast pad to keep the bra clean. Do this religiously. It really does help. Doing bra-less also helps to dry them out.

 

It will all get better... it took me a couple of months for the pain/cracking/bleeding to get better, but it was always worth it to me.

 

I highly recommend changing positions... Football hold, laying down...I would even nurse with the baby vertical. This will give her relief and take pressure off the sore areas...while also toughening her up everywhere else.

[Peri]

Peri,

If this worked for you, that's great. I wish it would have been that simple for me!

But my consultant suggested that the dryness was the problem -- it led to the scabs and then the scabs were pulled off and a painful cycle was set into place. That's why she suggested the second skin gel pads -- they allowed the wounds to heal without drying out.

 

Anyway, I'm no expert and have only nursed 2 babies, but that's what helped me when I was ready to quit from all the bleeding and pain.

 

I was under the assumption that if there are scabs involved then there is something wrong with the latch. I didn't get scabs until my son was 22 months old. His molars were coming him wich caused him to latch on wrong. I was lucky though. At 22 months, for me, I had BFed long enough that I didn't regret weaning lol.