Please tell me GOOD things about Saxon

[Macrina]

I have been using it for about two years, but I keep running into various issues. But I am scared to switch, at the same time, the issues I have are ones I CAN get around. But then I read all the negative stuff about it and I think I shouldn't be using it AT ALL. Here's what I like and don't:

 

I am very comfortable with the format

 

Not loving the review

 

I'm good with repetition

 

I feel it does do a good job of explaining HOW and WHY of math

 

I feel it it's taught in a concise and orderly manner

 

I like that it does a lot with money, calender, temperature, time and uses proper math language

 

The writing requirements are TOO much for my mathy 5yo at all levels

 

My 8yo is bored to tears with the beginning of 3, but I don't think she's ready for 5/4

 

I keep thinking about jumping ship to Singapore, but every time I go to do it I am confused with all the Singapore STUFF and the different versions and I really love how scripted Saxon is. I really do. It makes me feel safe. :tongue_smilie:I don't know what to DO!! :bigear:

[yslek]

I used Saxon's Algebra II and Advanced Mathematics in High School. It was the first time since Elementary school that math actually made sense to me. I really benefited from the constant review, as opposed to the learn it, drop it, move on to another topic approach that my Jr. High math classes employed.

 

I have to say, though, that even with my good experience, the negative Saxon threads are leaving me a bit nervous. I was planning on starting T with 5/4 this year, but now have doubts. So...some more reassurance would be great! :D

[Guest Barb B]

I like Saxon 5/4 and up. Review is great! You can't beat the constant review of previous lessons!

 

Barb

[The Girls' Mom]

We did not like Saxon 3. It seemed way beneath the girls when we started it (and it probably was) We dropped it half way through and went right into 5/4. It's not terribly FUN, but it is teaching them. I guess I feel more secure using Saxon.

[Laurel]

The writing requirements are TOO much for my mathy 5yo at all levels

 

My 8yo is bored to tears with the beginning of 3, but I don't think she's ready for 5/4

 

I keep thinking about jumping ship to Singapore, but every time I go to do it I am confused with all the Singapore STUFF and the different versions and I really love how scripted Saxon is. I really do. It makes me feel safe. :tongue_smilie:I don't know what to DO!! :bigear:

 

For your 5 yo, you can do all the writing.

For your 8 yo, give her the tests (1 or 2 a day) until she starts getting less than 80%, and then start lessons there (or 5 lessons before that). The first 30 lessons (at least) in Saxon are all review.

 

That being said, I like Saxon, but I LOVE Singapore. Saxon is thorough, and your dc will not be harmed by sticking with Saxon. If it's not broke, don't fix it! (We do both Saxon and Singapore, but if I had to choose only one, it would be Singapore. My student actually likes Saxon, though, so we do both, because not doing Singapore is not an option right now.)

[Ellie]

:iagree:A friend tried to give me the primary Saxon materials, several boxes of stuff, and I wouldn't take them.:tongue_smilie:But Math 54 and up...those are keepers.

[Donna T.]

Well, I've never used Saxon. I probably should have tried it with my older son. I think it would have fit his learning style well.

 

I only wanted to ask if you have read The Well-Trained Mind? I read the first two editions. I don't have the most recent one, so not sure what may have changed in regards to Susan's recommendations for math. However, every time I read a negative review of Saxon, I take it with a grain of salt. I can't imagine that Susan would recommend a math program that is not a "good" one. I have a few friends who have homeschooled many more years than I have and who have used Saxon and they have told me they would not even consider using anything else. They love it! And, guess what? They just happen to be the same moms I know who are not hanging out on homeschooling boards, reading every comment that comes by. My point is that we are all influenced by what we read. If you like Saxon, can teach it and your children can learn from it, you may want to avoid any more reviews.

 

Just my thoughts :).

[Guest Barb B]

I wanted to add that before 4rth or 5th grade we liked Abeka alot. Saxon algebre and up is terrific IMO.

 

Barb

[Moni]

We only use Saxon Math 54 and up.

Saxon Math 54 is the first math book my kids use

 

Before that, it's Math Facts only, all of them.

I don't use curriculum to teach the Math Facts.

We just have the kids memorize them and go right into Math 54.

 

I have nothing positive to say about Saxon Math K 1, 2, 3, ;)

I would suggst

1st grade Math facts, take all year if you need tto.

2nd grade Math 54.

 

If it's too much writing, do daily copywork in 1st grade, when the student is learning math facts (flashcards)

After 6 to 9 to 12 months of copywork, the student will be pencil-ready for Math 54

 

If the 8 yo knows his math facts, all of them, plus, minus, times and divide, then he is ready for Math 54.

Has he been writing copywork every schoolday for about a year already? He will be pencil ready for Math 54 then too

:seeya:

[Carol in Cal.]

She is bright, but the other programs I tried did not fit her.

 

Saxon has brought her up to proficiency and confidence, and although some consider it 'behind', she is scoring 'proficient' on the CA state STAR tests in math, which are relatively difficult tests. The CA math assumption is finishing algebra 1 by the end of 8th grade, so the earlier grade standards and testing reflect the need to prepare students to take Algebra 1 by that time.

 

We had been using Harcourt CA math, and she was actually going BACKWARDS in her math knowledge.

 

I switched to Saxon, gave her the placement test, placed her where it said (even though not on grade level), told her that we need to push to finish 3 books in 2 years, and she pulled it off and her test scores went up.

[LinRTX]

I like Saxon. I am now using it with my fourth child. I did my first 2 through Calculus (well the first did not start Saxon until Algebra 2 and the next 3 started in Saxon 2). Both my older ones did well in college math. My oldest almost had a perfect score on the SAT math section. He is a EE major working on his masters. He told me that it wasn't until his fourth semester at colleg (differential equations) that he felt there was anything in his class that he had not at least seen before.

 

I have a degree in math. I feel Saxon teaches the why behind the math, not just formulas. I also have very different learners and it has worked with all of them. I currently have a 16yo half way through Advanced Math and a 9yo working in 6/5.

 

My second started in Miquon (before I had even heard about Singapore) and actually new less at the end of 1st grade than at the end of K. I then bought Saxon 2 and have not looked back. Over the summer I will do review with a different math book, but our main program is Saxon. It works for all of them.

 

Linda

[gingersmom]

I love Saxon.

 

We used Saxon 2, 3 and now 5/4 and 7/6.

 

I love the review, I love the teacher (parent) support. I love everything about it!!

[Robin in DFW]

we are using Saxon exclusively.

 

Both of my dc have tried other programs, but Saxon is what we keep coming back to.

 

My son has used Saxon 3, 6/5, 7/6 and will be moving into 8/7.

 

Dd has done a self-imposed review of Algebra 1 with Saxon and will begin Algebra 2 next week...this is after doing TT Algebra 1 and Geometry and feeling a little less than excited about the difficulty level. She tried Saxon before (shortly after coming home in 7th grade) and after several fitful attempts at using it, finally decided she really likes it.

 

It has great explanations, especially if you have the Saxon Teacher at the upper levels.

 

The lower levels have excellent teaching right in the book. Very solid.

 

Many, many children have had great success with Saxon. Sticking with it is the key.

 

Robin

[fractalgal]

I feel it does do a good job of explaining HOW and WHY of math

 

I feel it it's taught in a concise and orderly manner

 

I like that it does a lot with money, calender, temperature, time and uses proper math language

 

 

I keep thinking about jumping ship to Singapore, but every time I go to do it I am confused with all the Singapore STUFF and the different versions and I really love how scripted Saxon is. I really do. It makes me feel safe. :tongue_smilie:I don't know what to DO!! :bigear:

 

How about doing Saxon for 4 days a week and then adding one day of Singapore. See how you like it.

I've been using both Saxon and Singapore with my kids from the start.

I use Saxon so that the math facts are automatic. I use Singapore for the way it more visually presents concepts and the logical order it presents them. The IP workbooks are my favorite part of the Singapore program.

I rarely do Saxon as directed though, and I recommend taking the placement test before purchasing a level. The first 20-40 lessons of a Saxon level are usually review.

I've been happy with both of them.

Good luck. :)

Edited September 9, 2009 by fractalgal

[Orthodox6]

Macrina, Singapore math is not the automatic alternative to Saxon ! In fact, it is so different a "mind style" from Saxon, you likely would feel all at sea with the program -- unless, of course, it turned out to be the "dream fit" you need.

 

Do you ever spend time at a home school vendor fair? That is a good way to explore other options. (Just vest yourself with your strongest "anti-used-car-salesman" attitude, and examine products in your own style.)

 

Alternatively, or in addition to a vendor exhibit, browse through reviews at this website: http://www.cathyduffyreviews.com/ Many people highly respect Mrs. Duffy's insights. I have checked out her remarks for years, and find them quite helpful.

 

http://www.homeschoolreviews.com/

 

http://homeschoolreviews.org/

 

I have consulted both of those websites, as well as others.

 

Over the early years of teaching, I shifted to my current belief that if a product or program is well suited for the individual child, that matters far more than whether it is well suited for me. I still have to pay realistic heed to my own "learning style" (else I cannot even teach at all from a product or program) -- but ultimately, the student's needs/abilities must rule the day.

 

It is true that I make no bones about thinking that Saxon stinks. At the same time, however, I recognize that Saxon can be the right choice for another family.

 

Meanwhile, over on the sidelines, I'll suggest that you take a look at Horizons math. It is a K-6 program, also based on "spiral method". Three of my four children were a happy match for this solid program. The fourth child was, too, until her math LDs seized control of her math life.

 

Keep collecting reviews and recommendations "from the trenches." You may decide eventually that you already have what works best for your dc !

[TwinMominTX]

I'm in the stick with it camp. What does your "Saxon day" look like?

 

I am at lesson 50 in Saxon 3 with my newly 8 year old twins and we all love it. Seriously, I am a Saxon groupie! Here is our day if it might help at all...

 

1. Meeting strip independently. I purchased the pre-printed meeting strips from someone at Lulu.com and put them in a binder. At the beginning of math time they open up the binders and get to work. I pass out money and write the time on a white board. They do the rest. I correct them with a red pen and we only discuss the ones they get wrong. This takes about 10 minutes.

 

2. I briefly and quickly go through the mental math stuff - counting by 10's, 7's, odd numbers, etc. This is quick quick and takes about 5 minutes.

 

3. We get to the lesson. I follow it pretty much, but when I see they've got it, I don't keep doing all the examples. I use a large white board to write the examples. I use different colors of dry erase markers and will often have my twins come up and do problems on the large white board. The lesson varies, but generally it takes us less than 20 minutes to do the lesson introduction.

 

4. We briefly review the appropriate flashcards that pertain the time tests. We then do the times tests. I do all the tests at 1 minute which has really helped one of my twins. She would freeze when I did them at 45 seconds. I keep track on the forms provided as my twins like to "best" their previous scores. I occassionally have them finish the test problems they missed, but don't make them do it everyday. I also correct them on my own as going through them together takes toooooo long! We take 5 minutes for review and the timed tests.

 

5. Last, I have them do the first side of the worksheet. If they miss more than 2 they must do the second side. They've never missed more than 2! I've found that things go smoother when I stay right there while they do this. I used to assign it and go do a chore. It seemed like it never went well when I wasn't right there. When they are fnished I correct them and give instant feedback. This takes like 10 minutes.

 

All that said, I am very big on starting with the end in mind and I want my girls to know math through calculus. I figure the best way to do this is to start off with Saxon. They've got the scope and sequence that I want my twins to have through all of their schooling. Additionally, I keep waiting for math to get tough and/or challenging for my girls and it never has. I see this as a good thing. They are learning math well in an incremental fashion to where nothing is ever hard or over their head. I see them daily applying what they've learned and even carrying it beyond what they've learned through Saxon 3. I like this aspect of it. I want them to have such a good grasp of math that they can apply it daily and extrapolate it out to their own lives. Does this make sense?

 

I too have considered moving head to 5/4. I think my twins could handle it with some work and dedication. However, I've decided to stick with Saxon 3 and make sure my girls know the math facts - backwards and forwards. Quickly and easily. I have a friend that teaches AP calculus. He says that the biggest struglle kids have even at that stage is not knowing their math facts really really well. I am determined that my girls will have the down by the time we are done with Saxon 3. Also, I only plan to go through lesson 100 in Saxon 3 before we switch to 5/4.

[Meriwether]

I like Saxon. My Dd6 will be doing Saxon 3 this year, so I don't have any experience with the higher levels. We haven't used any other math curricula, so I can't do a comparison, but my daughter has a very good grasp on math. She LOVES the manipulatives. I like the incremental approach. One of the things I like best about Saxon is the repetition of the problems. At one point, Dd had trouble ordering numbers. She might put them in this order 31, 35, 27 because the 7 was higher than the one and five. When she missed these problems repeatedly over a period of weeks, I knew I had to really work with her on that skill. (She would do them correctly if I had just gone over them with her, but would miss them days later.) If she had been in a mastery style program, I'm not sure I would have caught that skill problem.

[HSmom25andRN]

We attempted to switch from Saxon a couple of times when I would hear good things about other programs or I hit the slightest bump in the road. Now I have tried Bob Jones, MCP, Math u See, Singapore..... Now everyone is using Saxon except for my oldest who is starting geometry. If you are generally happy with Saxon (or any curriculum for that matter!) I suggest sticking with it.

I agree with the poster who said to give your child the tests for that book in the beginning of the year and start where they need to start. I also agree that it will be hard to find any program for any 5 year old that can't write and I would suggest either buying number stamps for your 5 year old or writing for her (especially the date!).

 

I find Saxon the most complete program that we've tried. I am one who doesn't mind skipping things when it has already been learned but I despise having to add things to a core curriculum. Angela

[lulubelle]

I have done K, 1, and am half way through 2. I really like it. Never thought I would get through 1 and am doing well getting through 2. It fits my sons methodical personality. I like how it moves the difficulty around. Ex. for many days the lesson is very easy and the fact sheet is quite challenging or the pattern is very easy for several weeks and then it is very challenging. A mix of challenging and easy works really well. I may feel differently as time goes by and math gets more challenging in the upper grades. Plus, my husband, who is a physicists, likes the fact that a physicist made it. He helps me stick with one math curriculum. Other than feeling that it just doesn't fit well with your child and they are not learning well enough, I would stick with it!

[s.z.ichigo]

I haven't hit 5/4 yet but people almost universally love it, so I say stick with it. If you just started your year, skip ahead to stuff that will be more challenging. The first 40 lessons or so are almost strictly review and that could be boring and unnecessary for someone who didn't forget what they learned in Saxon 2.

[lovinmykids]

My Dd is also bored to tears with the beginning of Saxon 3! Yes, I like the meeting stuff too but man is it like starting over and BORING!!!

I actually bought R&S 3 and just got it. I just started that yesterday to go along with Saxon. I think they will compliment each other nicely but I may eventually drop Saxon but I'm just not sure. I have to see how it goes.

I did hear that saxon 5/4 is alot different that S 1-3, they say it's better.

Maybe you can do what I'm doing and find something to throw into it like you said about Singapore. I couldn't use that one cuz it would be too hard for my Dd.

Good luck!

[EKS]

However, every time I read a negative review of Saxon, I take it with a grain of salt. I can't imagine that Susan would recommend a math program that is not a "good" one.

 

While I would be the first to say that SWB's work has changed my homeschooling life, her area of expertise is not math. Saxon on the surface seems complete. But having used several math programs extensively and having seen how things come out on the other side when teaching kids algebra and geometry, I have to say that the criticisms of Saxon are real and I believe that the problems with it can be insidious because they aren't readily apparent when the kid is scoring well on the tests.

 

Sorry--I know this is supposed to be a thread about the upside of Saxon. And there is an upside: continual review reinforces concepts and incremental development boosts confidence for some kids.

[Beach Mom]

How about doing Saxon for 4 days a week and then adding one day of Singapore. See how you like it.

I've been using both Saxon and Singapore with my kids from the start.

I use Saxon so that the math facts are automatic. I use Singapore for the way it more visually presents concepts and the logical order it presents them.

:iagree:

 

This is what we do at our house. It gives us the best of both programs and mixes things up to prevent boredom.

 

We do skip some of the early lessons in Saxon 2 and 3 if the dc test out of them. As mentioned by others we take the tests until they don't achieve 80% and then we start there. Even when my oldest was in school for 2nd grade they didn't start at the first lesson of Saxon 3.

[Heather in WI]

We love Saxon here, too.

 

My oldest did Saxon 1 and 2. I freaked out because of reviews I read and switched to Rod & Staff 3. After a horrible time with that, we switched to Singapore 2a. That didn't feel like 'enough', so we added in Horizons 3. After a year of that, he was floundering with math facts, so we headed straight back to Saxon and have stayed there ever since. DS recently took his first standardized test (the Explore test) and he scored in the 92 percentile of all children his age who took the test.

 

 

I am another voice that (now) takes the Saxon criticism with a grain of salt. There have ALWAYS been math wars on these boards. I remember there being moratoriums on the old boards of math discussions, LOL! (Just google math wars site:wtmboards.com to see for yourself!!!)

 

PS. I think it tacky, tacky, tacky to come onto a thread that asks for good things about Saxon to say bad things. But, that's just me!

[Leila]

We have been using Saxon Math from the very beginning. My eldest who is 9 y/o have been using Saxon consistently,from Saxon 1 and now he is in Saxon 7/6. I know there are a lot of good Math curriculum out there but I also believe that the root of messing up a child's understanding in math is the never ending switching. Every single one of them have a pattern of teaching, you switch it , you mess it. Unless it has become really painful for both of you, then stay with it. Saxon has a lot of practice and review. For me it is better to have more than less. You can always take something out if you feel that she has grasp the concept already. For summer, I try to use a different curriculum (Singapore,Horizon or TT) for review. Never had a problem with him doing those, which means he gets the lessons from Saxon and able to apply them. The only thing I use to supplement Saxon is using Challenging Word Problems by Singapore. I hope this helps.

[Macrina]

I appreciate all the wise wise comments that have been made here! Especially this:

 

PS. I think it tacky, tacky, tacky to come onto a thread that asks for good things about Saxon to say bad things. But, that's just me!

:lol:

 

I think I have officially been talked OFF my ledge and we're back on track! (with a few minor modifications, including testing dd further into 3 and leaving ds at the beginning.) I think I will continue to co-teach the meeting book and then do their seperate lessons. We'll see how it goes! I really DO <heart> Saxon and so do my kids. DD begs me not to switch any time I think of it. That should be a clear sign right there. Thanks Mamas for your help! :grouphug:

[Guest roble2007]

Did you know that Saxon is now offering "Saxon Teacher" - CD's with all the problems worked out step by step by a teacher who is explaining everything. I am excited about this addition. It will make algebra a lot easier and seems more user-friendly. :001_smile:

[Nestof3]

I've used it for over ten years. I love it.

 

This year, I have tested my boys out of several lessons. We've been in school for almost two weeks, and Ben is in Saxon 3, Lesson 27, while Nathan is in Saxon 5/4 lesson 47.

 

I just keep giving them tests until they reach something they don't remember. I will then touch on it, and if it comes back immediately, move on until the next test. I do this until I find the point at which we really need to do lessons daily.

 

The boys love that they don't have to do a bunch of unnecessary work.

 

Nathan also only does odd problems as long as he doesn't make many mistakes.

 

We used Saxon through Alg II; I used the DIVE CD that year.

 

I love Saxon.

[Tammyla]

For me, it works...it go up through high school. The teacher stress for teaching high school math is not something I worry about and I'm so thankful for that. Oh, and I like the DIVE CD or Saxon Teacher after 8/7. :001_smile:

Edited September 11, 2009 by Tammyla

[SoCal Sandra]

We use Right Start Math and Singapore math and I have always supplemented with other types of drill sheets such as Math Minutes, Spectrum, etc. I liked the quick review Math Minutes gave: an assortment of ten problems, each in a different area of math. Dss did two a day but they always seemed too light weight for the given grade level.

 

A teacher/friend gave me Saxon 5/4 to use instead. The "Problem Set" gives us exactly what we wanted. It's about two dozen problems taken from a broad area of math topics. I think this is why Saxon is noted for it's great use of review. We don't use any other part of the book, so I can't speak to the rest of the program, but I would say this is a good thing about Saxon.

[Janis in DE]

We used Saxon beginning with 1 all the way through 76. We then switched to Video Text Algebra for upper level math. Really just because my daughter wanted something different and I wanted something that taught Geometry seperate. I have just begun my grandaughter, who is 4, with Saxon K. I like the completness of Saxon. I don't follow the script with the younger levels and skip what I feel they know well.

 

Janis in DE

[scrappyhappymama]

I'm in the stick with it camp. What does your "Saxon day" look like?

 

I am at lesson 50 in Saxon 3 with my newly 8 year old twins and we all love it. Seriously, I am a Saxon groupie! Here is our day if it might help at all...

 

1. Meeting strip independently. I purchased the pre-printed meeting strips from someone at Lulu.com and put them in a binder. At the beginning of math time they open up the binders and get to work. I pass out money and write the time on a white board. They do the rest. I correct them with a red pen and we only discuss the ones they get wrong. This takes about 10 minutes.

 

2. I briefly and quickly go through the mental math stuff - counting by 10's, 7's, odd numbers, etc. This is quick quick and takes about 5 minutes.

 

3. We get to the lesson. I follow it pretty much, but when I see they've got it, I don't keep doing all the examples. I use a large white board to write the examples. I use different colors of dry erase markers and will often have my twins come up and do problems on the large white board. The lesson varies, but generally it takes us less than 20 minutes to do the lesson introduction.

 

4. We briefly review the appropriate flashcards that pertain the time tests. We then do the times tests. I do all the tests at 1 minute which has really helped one of my twins. She would freeze when I did them at 45 seconds. I keep track on the forms provided as my twins like to "best" their previous scores. I occassionally have them finish the test problems they missed, but don't make them do it everyday. I also correct them on my own as going through them together takes toooooo long! We take 5 minutes for review and the timed tests.

 

5. Last, I have them do the first side of the worksheet. If they miss more than 2 they must do the second side. They've never missed more than 2! I've found that things go smoother when I stay right there while they do this. I used to assign it and go do a chore. It seemed like it never went well when I wasn't right there. When they are fnished I correct them and give instant feedback. This takes like 10 minutes.

 

 

 

We are just like this, almost to the letter. We are using Workboxes this year, so I prepare the meeting strip ahead of time and my son does his meeting strip and meeting book independently. Then we work together on skip counting and facts review and the day's lesson and then he completes one side of the worksheet on his own.

 

I've never gotten the animosity toward the Saxon K-3. My boys love it. We do start it a year ahead- using Saxon K for our pre-k'ers, so I can see how if it were used strictly at grade level it might become boring. I've also started supplementing my 2nd grader with Singappore's CWPs.

 

I do get distracted by the alternate math options sometimes and am intrigued by some of the other programs, but so far see no reason to fix what isn't broken!

[...................]

Stick with it if it's working. For your 5 year old why don't you take a break from Saxon and try miquon for a year? Also how about using Miquon once a week for your 8 year old? It's fun and very critical thinking oriented, and inexpensive.... Just an idea.

[lauracolumbus]

Saxon was the first program we started with. Then I bought several of the others after reading so many reviews. After trying out MUS and LoF and looking over Singapore, we prefer Saxon. Actually ds prefers MUS and LoF b/c they're easier. DD9 loves Saxon. I've found it's the easiest for me to teach. Everything I need is right there. I love the spiral approach and the reference to previous lessons. My dd9 scored 99% on the WJIII b/c of Saxon and ds got a 91%. We did not use Saxon in the earlier grades. I am using MUS w/my dd5.

 

Laura

[branycbur]

I haven't read all the negative reviews, but I think I know what you mean about the stuff you don't like. I almost switched this year but decided to stick with it for one more year. And I really like Saxon 54...my daughter is liking it much better, too. It seems much more fluid and logical.