WWYD If you found a young child unattended in a running car in a parking lot?

[Scarlett]

The car was probably locked and alarmed. I don't see the child as being in danger in a situation like that. I know that's not a popular answer, but there you go. I would not do this myself, but in certain areas of my town, the were be little to no danger in doing this. Sure the car could catch fire, but the store the parent is in could also have a madman shooting it up.

 

What would I do? I would probably keep in eye on the car for a few minutes, assess the immediate danger, if any. I would probably not call the police. A sleeping child strapped in a car seat n a locked car w/ A/C for a very few minutes, depending on the place/time/etc is not likey to be in any danger at all, esp if there are people like us to help each other out. I am saddened that we live in a society where the first inclination is to report the parent to social servies or the police rather than be eyes for each other.

 

:iagree:

[Scarlett]

Note: Scarlett, you might want to check your state law as leaving a 9yo in a car unattended is also against the law here.

 

It isn't against the law here. I just checked. And as I said, my ds is 9 1/2 and I have only in the last month left him twice in a situation where I felt it was safe. The car was locked and the ac on. 1)He is big enough to not let a kidnapper in 2)Not engage the car to move 3) get out and come in the store if the AC inexplicably stopped working and he felt he was too hot for the 10 minutes I was gone.

 

Also, I would never leave him even for 1 minute in certain parking lots or certain parts of town.

 

Before now, I only left him strapped in his car seat in front of the drycleaners which was literally 5 steps to the front door. He was never out of my sight.

[Elizabeth Conley]

Originally Posted by LaurieNE

The car was probably locked and alarmed. I don't see the child as being in danger in a situation like that. I know that's not a popular answer, but there you go. I would not do this myself, but in certain areas of my town, the were be little to no danger in doing this. Sure the car could catch fire, but the store the parent is in could also have a madman shooting it up.

 

What would I do? I would probably keep in eye on the car for a few minutes, assess the immediate danger, if any. I would probably not call the police. A sleeping child strapped in a car seat n a locked car w/ A/C for a very few minutes, depending on the place/time/etc is not likely to be in any danger at all, esp if there are people like us to help each other out. I am saddened that we live in a society where the first inclination is to report the parent to social services or the police rather than be eyes for each other.

 

:iagree:I cannot adequately express how strongly I agree with this poster. Words simply fail me. It is arrogant and morally reprehensible to terrorize good parents under these circumstances.:iagree:

[Peek a Boo]

ok, my turn :)

 

If the child was in no immediate danger, i would wait off to the side, check the time, and wait patiently as an extra set of eyes.

 

If after two minutes the parent doesn't come out, i go in and get the manager to call the parent.

 

I'm not one for chastising the parent, but for letting them know that there ARE other people who will call the police and they absolutely are putting their children in danger of being confiscated because the law will see this as neglect.

 

Now if a parent started ARGUING with me? yeah, I'd get their info and call.

[Heather in OK]

Make a call to 911.

[Peek a Boo]

: snark hat on:

 

dh says he'd trip the car so it fell down. :D

[Kelli in TN]

I've never been in this situation, but my husband was recently. He called the police. It was in the high 90's and the windows on the car were rolled up tight, engine was off and the oldest child looked to be about 3 or 4. We would not leave our dog in that situation.:glare:

 

It's really not THAT hard to take your children into the store with you.

[sheryl]

I agree. If heat isn't a concern, I'd give it some time. Either that or not worry about it. Really. I remember waiting in the car for my grandmother or my parents hanging half-way out of the windows of the car in blazing heat.

 

There is no way I'd call the police unless I saw someone trying to abduct the kid or if the kid was locked in and it was too hot. What happened to just talking to parents about this stuff. If the kid isn't in danger, why make trouble for them?

 

 

Keep in mind that the parent may not be close by....s/he left the kid/s so s/he may be a few stores down so it would be impossible to talk to the parent. Danger has many faces: extreme hot, cold, running car, more than one child has the potential for more unsafe events to occur and wonder if the child is special needs and has an episode???????????

Edited August 12, 2009 by sheryl

[Jazzy]

I am the minority then. I will not leave them alone if I am going into the grocery store, walmart, the like because I'll be in there for over five minutes. But I leave them in the car all the time when I run into CVS to buy milk, or the gas station while I run in and pay or the library to get some books saved for me...and they are 5 and almost 3.

 

I do that, too if the errand is under 5 minutes (the law in my state), and I can see the car the whole time.

 

I wouldn't even think twice about a child in a car if I pulled up and ran into a store. Now if I was in there for a good 10 minutes and when I came out they were still alone in the car in the same spot, I'd worry. I wouldn't initially jump to conclusions that the parents are misfits. Bad things CAN happen to kids left unattended in a car, but so can bad things happen in your own home.

 

I agree.

[Joanne]

Actually it might be an unpopular view on these boards but that is exactly what the majority of people would do. There are so many case studies of people not advocating for a child because they thought they should mind their own business.

 

Sometimes it is just not a bad parenting choice..... it is the law, as in this case.

 

What about traditional schooling?

Messy houses?

Vaccines?

Siblings in the care of siblings?

Driving @ or below the speed limit?

Sunscreen?

Nursing beyond cultural expectations?

 

There are (or have been, in the case of traditional schooling) laws on these issues. What is the threshold at which strangers or tangent adults are to intervene?

 

In the case as posted, I would have waited at the vehicle in the retail situation for 5 minutes, and gone into the store at that point in search of Management or Security.

 

The daycare situation? The daycare HAD TO KNOW the released child was in the car, not next to mom.

 

I have left my kids, rarely, at gas station situations, dry cleaners without a line and with total storefront windows. Of course, they are legal to be left now. One soon can drive to the store himself. ;)

 

I lean towards an interpretation of crime risk- especially of children - that is generated by sensation rather than reality.

[Perry]

In my area, it is against the law to leave your car running even without a child in it!! Too many thefts.

 

I got a ticket for doing that once. I parked just outside the ATM and ran in, leaving the car running because it was -20 degrees and I wanted to keep the heater running. I didn't know it was against the law. I was about 15 feet from the car, but it didn't stop the cop from writing me a ticket. This was before I had kids; there was no one in the car.

[Pamela H in Texas]

VERY few people said they'd call the authorities immediately. Most of us would just look after the situation a minute, making sure mom really was just 5 cars down, ran in for milk, etc.

 

But at the point it became illegal (in Tx, 5 minutes) or dangerous (19 degrees gained in just 10 minutes!) there are concerns. The car running and a 4yo playing in a car is another consideration. How many kids have "driven" the car on purpose or accidentally, not realizing the risk? So forget the stranger stealing the kid, there are the issues of simply an unsupervised preschooler in a vehicle! And again, it's ILLEGAL.

 

On all the issues you mentioned Joanne, there are principles to consider that they may be part of, but that is different from cut and dry laws outlawing a "choice." Not using suntan lotion is a personal choice. Allowing your child to get severely burned to the point that they get ill or need medical attention is neglect, possibly abuse. Very few homes aren't a little messy, even fairly messy (being JWs, we see many homes that are downright atrocious; they aren't rare in the least!). But unless it's a health issue, it's not usually a cause for CPS. For that matter, I knew of a home where the family was constantly sick because of the filth but CPS still gave the family a family member child. This home so bad that I personally can't walk into it without being sick due to the smell...and then there is my huge fear of roaches that are friendly like puppy dogs!

 

Just one consideration for you though Joanne? If your child who doesn't even have a learner's permit is caught driving even with you beside him, he will not be driving at all until 18 and you will lose your driver's license also. Depending, you could end up with a CPS visit and if an accident is involved, you almost definitely will. Probably not what you need while fussing with ex. (and btw, no, I wouldn't contact the authorities. As your friend, I would simply do what I just did and let you know that it COULD be problematic as it's considered neglect and is illegal).

[Joanne]

Just one consideration for you though Joanne? If your child who doesn't even have a learner's permit is caught driving even with you beside him, he will not be driving at all until 18 and you will lose your driver's license also. Depending, you could end up with a CPS visit and if an accident is involved, you almost definitely will. Probably not what you need while fussing with ex. (and btw, no, I wouldn't contact the authorities. As your friend, I would simply do what I just did and let you know that it COULD be problematic as it's considered neglect and is illegal).

 

What the heck, Pamela?? I just mentioned the learner's permit to put his AGE in context. I never mentioned or implied that he'd ever be driving outside of legal boundaries. :confused::confused::confused:

[Cranberry]

I'm not sure if this point has been brought up, but many children around age 3.5 or so can unbuckle their own carseat! My son could at 3. Thankfully he knew he was never allowed to do it until I stopped the car and turned it off.

 

Leaving the keys in the car with it running and an unsupervised child is just asking for trouble. It isn't the heat or abduction or whatever that is the concern. To me the concern would be the curiosity of the child. Climbing out of the seat, hmm, what does this lever do?....

 

I would stay right next to the car and delegate someone else to go in and get the parent. I'd give them about 2 mins before I called the cops.

 

You know it is a pain to bring kids in for quick trips inside a store sometimes. But wow, what a small price to pay to be assured that your kid is safe.

[Renee in NC]

I've never been in this situation, but my husband was recently. He called the police. It was in the high 90's and the windows on the car were rolled up tight, engine was off and the oldest child looked to be about 3 or 4. We would not leave our dog in that situation.:glare:

 

It's really not THAT hard to take your children into the store with you.

 

I would call the police on that one. And if they took to long, or the child looked in danger, I would break the window and rescue the child/ren.

 

And I am *very* much a too each their own person.

[Pamela H in Texas]

What the heck, Pamela??

 

Joanne,

 

I apologize. I went back up and read your post again and noticed I missed a word. That one word missed along with your signature made it seem as if you were (as probably most people do) allowing your son to drive without a permit. I don't think most people realize how problematic that can be. Losing your license, kid having to wait longer, and CPS troubles are not worth letting preteens and young teens drive illegally.

 

But though it's probably good info to get out, I'm sorry to direct it to you. I see now that I misread.

[Renee in NC]

Joanne,

 

I apologize. I went back up and read your post again and noticed I missed a word. That one word missed along with your signature made it seem as if you were (as probably most people do) allowing your son to drive without a permit. I don't think most people realize how problematic that can be. Losing your license, kid having to wait longer, and CPS troubles are not worth letting preteens and young teens drive illegally.

 

But though it's probably good info to get out, I'm sorry to direct it to you. I see now that I misread.

 

Do most people let their underage children drive without a permit on state roads? I've never known anyone who did, but maybe they did and I just didn't know it.

 

We let my now 16yo drive at 12, but it was on private property, so therefore legal. And it wasn't a CPS issue - our good friend is a social worker and she had no problems with it. *This* was common where we lived (rural/farm area) and a good way to get them quite a bit of driving experience before hitting the road. I don't know of anyone who let their child drive on state roads, though.

[jujsky]

The car was probably locked and alarmed. I don't see the child as being in danger in a situation like that. I know that's not a popular answer, but there you go. I would not do this myself, but in certain areas of my town, the were be little to no danger in doing this. Sure the car could catch fire, but the store the parent is in could also have a madman shooting it up.

 

What would I do? I would probably keep in eye on the car for a few minutes, assess the immediate danger, if any. I would probably not call the police. A sleeping child strapped in a car seat n a locked car w/ A/C for a very few minutes, depending on the place/time/etc is not likey to be in any danger at all, esp if there are people like us to help each other out. I am saddened that we live in a society where the first inclination is to report the parent to social servies or the police rather than be eyes for each other.

:iagree: That's exactly what I would do. A couple years ago in a neighboring town, a woman left her sleeping toddler in the car while she ran in the house to get something. She was in-between errands and didn't want to wake the child who had just fallen asleep. The neighbor, whom she had a previous dispute with, called the police on her. By the time the police arrived, the woman already left with her toddler to finish her errands. She was charged with neglect even though the police didn't witness the incident, and even though the only "witnesses" were the children of the neighbors that this woman had a dispute with. Their mom called it into the police, but she didn't actually see it. There was a big article in our local paper about it, and it's really sad that this woman's name was dragged through the mud. I've left my sleeping kids in the running car in our driveway to run into the house, grab something, and run out (literally less than a minute). I would hate to think someone would have called the police on me :glare:

[Peela]

I would never call the police just because its against the law. I would use my own common sense and assess the situation as to whether I felt it was actually dangerous. If I felt it was, or the child ws distressed, I would stand by the car. If I felt there was an urgency in the situation, I would look for the mother and call another adult to watch the kid, or even open the car door and take the child out- if the car was hot.

 

I too have left my kids in the car. Rarely a running car, actually, because that seems too dangerous to me, unless it's in the driveway or something. The heat thing is huge here where I live in Australia. I cant imagine phoning the police though unless I coudlnt get into the car and teh car was obviously heating up.

I would do the same if I saw a dog in a hot car.

[MBM]

She was charged with neglect even though the police didn't witness the incident, and even though the only "witnesses" were the children of the neighbors that this woman had a dispute with. Their mom called it into the police, but she didn't actually see it. There was a big article in our local paper about it, and it's really sad that this woman's name was dragged through the mud. I've left my sleeping kids in the running car in our driveway to run into the house, grab something, and run out (literally less than a minute). I would hate to think someone would have called the police on me.

 

If I had read about that incident in the newspaper, I would not be thinking kindly of the neighbor who called.

 

However, the OP mentions that this was a 2- to 4-year-old who was alone in a car at a business--not a home--out of the parent's vision for over two minutes. I'd be very alarmed to see someone so young in Chicago where I live sitting alone in a car. In all my years here, I've never seen it in the city or the suburb where we now live.

[cajunrose]

I posted that I would call the police and have before. I do concider the situation though. One time was at the post office. I was outside in the car waiting on my mom. There was a 2ish year old and a 3 ish year old in the car next to me. The 3 year old kept getting out of the car and running around the parking lot. The mom was in there for 7 minutes when I called the cops. They got there 3 minutes later, she was still in the post office. The cop was VERY mad. He could see the 3 year old crawl out the window before he got his car parked.

 

The other time was at walmart. VERY young children left in the parking lot...car not on. You can't run into walmart and only take 5 minutes. You can't see your car from anywhere in walmart unless you are just going to shake the greeters hand..lol

 

So I do take it into consideration before I call. Most of the time, I just watch.

[Evergreen State Sue]

I will say what I did after I get some responses because I want to know what others would do.

 

Well, what did YOU do?

[LisaKinVA]

Sorry, but I'm a bit irritated right now to say the least.

 

I just returned from Michael's... where the manager had the "owner of a blue SUV" paged due to some busy-body (and yes, in this case, I'd say BUSY BODY") threatened to call the Sheriff, because her 12 yo boy was left in the SUV outside the store. The car was NOT running, the car was locked. The child was awake, windows part-way down, playing his game-boy in the car.

 

We aren't talking sleeping toddler. We aren't talking "in danger of putting a car in gear." Nor are we talking any heat related dangers either.

 

The boy asked to stay in the car, and good grief, if a 13 yo girl can be left by a school bus driver in an unfamiliar area because she "didn't belong to the bus." and it NOT be a crime -- this 12 yo was perfectly capable of being in his LOCKED car, playing his gameboy for the time his mom was in Michael's.

 

Oh, and no, there is no law regarding this in our state.

[Lovedtodeath]

 

Sorry, but I'm a bit irritated right now to say the least.

The woman was out of hand. I am sorry.

[Alicia64]

I apologize if someone has already posted this info, but just two days ago a five year old was taken from a parked car in Berkeley, Ca during the day.

 

Accd. to the media the dad left the boy for something like two or three minutes (but I bet it was longer) and when he returned the boy was gone.

 

The boy is a foster child and in the back of my mind I'm wondering if the biological parents who live in SF have something to do w/ the situation. So possibly not a stranger abduction. The media said that everyone involved was saying "no comment" about the bio parents.

 

Maybe everyone has already said this, but there's lots of things that can go wrong when a kid is left in a car -- and no, I'm not talking about a 12 year old. It just seems like a lazy thing to do, to leave children unattended in cars.

 

Alley

[Oak Knoll Mom]

I wouldn't interfere unless I truly thought the child was in danger (hot day with windows closed or an infant that may have been forgotten). Otherwise, I wouldn't call the police, wait for the parent, or lecture the parent. Frankly, I'm surprised at how many of you think it's your place to be responsible for these stranger's children. Not everyone believes that kids are going to be snatched up the minute they are left alone and I believe it's the parents' responsibility to decide whether or not it's safe.

 

I would, however, call the police and press charges against anyone who took my kid from my car in order to teach me a lesson. That's called kidnapping.

Edited August 13, 2009 by Oak Knoll Mom
added "otherwise" to the second sentence

[Lovedtodeath]

I would, however, call the police and press charges against anyone who took my kid from my car in order to teach me a lesson. That's called kidnapping.

:iagree: I wouldn't leave my DD but if I did someone trying to "help" in that way would tramatize her much more than anything else.

[Erica in PA]

:iagree:I cannot adequately express how strongly I agree with this poster. Words simply fail me. It is arrogant and morally reprehensible to terrorize good parents under these circumstances.:iagree:

 

Is calling the police really "terrorizing" a person? If it's not illegal, the police won't get involved anyway... if it is, then I can't see how telling the police that someone is doing something illegal terrorizes them. :confused:

[Erica in PA]

As for "being eyes for each other," no, I don't feel that I can serve in that capacity for a stranger these days. It's unfortunate, but it's reality. I think it's the rare person, at least in this area, that would be *grateful* for my concern about their child, when they are the ones who chose to leave him/her in that situation. Most people today do not take kindly to the suggestion that they might have done something to endanger their child, and will tell you so in a very confrontational way. I would have the police handle it out of concern for the child, rather than challenge a stranger about their parenting choices.

[Jorsay]

I would call the police.

 

This is dispicable.

 

If this is your answer, I thinnk you should mind your own business!

 

A child in a parked car with the motor running is in less danger than if he is removed from the car and walked through the parking lot.

 

How about if I visit your house and check on what activities you allow your kids to engage in? Do you allow them candy, McDonalds, TV, to walk to school alone, to swim in YOUR pool unsupervised, to stay up past 8pm? What books do you allow them to read? What movies can they see? What religion are they? If you are going to decide what is good and safe for my kids, then you will be allowing others to decide what's good and safe for your kids.

 

Mind your own business.

[Jorsay]

If it's not illegal, the police won't get involved anyway...

 

You are incorrect. I once went to dinner (1/4 mile down the road) with my wife and left my 9 and a half year old at home with the phone and my number. Five minutes after sitting down she called me to tell me the police were at the door. The policeman said it wasn't illegal and that he did it himself, but, since he was called, he was required to report it to child services. After a court appearance to get into my house, Child Services sent a young 20 something girl who inspected my home, interviewed my children without my presence and against my will. Without provocation, asked "where does daddy touch you?" "Does daddy hit you?" Then searched my body for drug tracks. This was completely without cause. Kind of retribution for me not giving them permission to search my house without a warrant.

 

When you call the police on someone, you are taking a serious step.

[sheryl]

Oak Hill Mom,

 

What would you do if you saw an unattended minor child in the car, windows up and it's over 90 degrees outside? Let's say you waited 5 minutes? How LONG do you wait? Is there a secret formula as to how long is the appropriate time to intervene?

 

I think it would be immoral for you "not" to act on the child's behalf.

 

We are not talking about rights here....we are talking about the "well-being" OR NOT of the said child.

 

Do you remember the baby boy? His father forgot he had him in the back of his car. Came out after work to go home and found baby son dead!! Some of the details might not be right...maybe it was the Mom....but that is the general overview of what happened. These were good people who forgot their son...look at the consequence, btw is not reversible.

[Oak Knoll Mom]

I wouldn't interfere unless I truly thought the child was in danger (hot day with windows closed or an infant that may have been forgotten).

 

I think you may be talking to me, but since you didn't use the quote feature and got my name wrong I can't be 100% sure. Anyway--did you even read the first sentence of my post?

 

I can see that my second sentence is not very clear, though, so I will go back and edit it.

 

Oak Hill Mom,

 

What would you do if you saw an unattended minor child in the car, windows up and it's over 90 degrees outside? Let's say you waited 5 minutes? How LONG do you wait? Is there a secret formula as to how long is the appropriate time to intervene?

 

I think it would be immoral for you "not" to act on the child's behalf.

 

We are not talking about rights here....we are talking about the "well-being" OR NOT of the said child.

 

Do you remember the baby boy? His father forgot he had him in the back of his car. Came out after work to go home and found baby son dead!! Some of the details might not be right...maybe it was the Mom....but that is the general overview of what happened. These were good people who forgot their son...look at the consequence, btw is not reversible.

[Mabelen]

Assuming you are very sure that there is no heat danger, I would wait with the car and the child until the parent returned. I would then comment that I had watched the child and was concerned about the heat. And then go on about my business. I find confrontation very very hard, but it is harder for me to think about the possible death of the child.

 

But I recently moved to CA from AZ and yesterday it was 94 degrees here in CA. I would call 911 for a possible heat related emergency. I witnessed a Mom accidentally lock her keys and toddler in a car in AZ in the summer. The car was running with the air conditioning on so no immediate heat danger but the Fire Department was called. They arrived in less than 3 minutes and popped the front door open in 30 seconds. They commented at the time that if it hadn't been super easy to get the front door open they would have broken the window. Heat related stuff can happen fast.

 

 

We did that accidentaly one hot Mid Atlantic summer afternoon. The AC was running and my dd was fast asleep in her car seat. We had to flag another driver because our cell phones were inside too! We called the fire department and they told us that if the AC had not been on they would have immediately broken the window, it's a matter of only a few minutes for the temperature inside the car to soar.

[JennC]

You are incorrect. I once went to dinner (1/4 mile down the road) with my wife and left my 9 and a half year old at home with the phone and my number. Five minutes after sitting down she called me to tell me the police were at the door. The policeman said it wasn't illegal and that he did it himself, but, since he was called, he was required to report it to child services.

 

When you call the police on someone, you are taking a serious step.

 

 

 

this is true and actually happened to me at the park last night. I was at the very small 'town square' park in our town of less than 2000 people selling produce at farmers market. We had a sudden thunderstorm and the temp dropped from 90 to 65 in a matter of minutes and everyone was wet from the downpour. My husband showed up to help, as he saw the weather was going to be a problem for me. He loaded up some of the extra items into the trunk of his car, which was then parked literally 50 feet from me within my clear view. He then stood 4 or 5 cars down the sidewalk visiting with another man who had taken shelter in his pickup. My 5 yo decided he wanted to stay in dad's car to read a book and to warm up.

Some nosy, busybody called 911 and reported a neglected child left in the car while the parents "must be in the bar across the street."

Yes the police came, and thanks to my son who gave mom's name, not dad's, told everyone they encountered at the market that they were looking for me because of a report of child neglect; when they found me, they interrogated me and made an official police report with my name, address, phone, license, etc. I asked the officer flat out "is there something wrong with my son being in the car?" He said no, but since some {busy},body called 911 they have to make a report. I cannot undo the damage of a police officer telling 50 people in a town of 1800 that I am neglecting my children. EVER.

Let me just tell you - mind your own business.

And fyi, no thinking person extrapolates that sentence to emergencies. Yes, if you see someone in danger, help out. Calling the police, by many of your own statements is a way for you to be sure the parent is punished, embarrassed or taught a lesson.

How do you know, in a parking lot, that the mom didn't just go to return her cart or get in the car and run into her neighbor or friend and stand behind an SUV, out of your line of sight, or something as innocuous as that and have a ten minute chat. How is this your business?

I find it interesting that many posters have an attitude of superiority about how "safe" they are. "I don't even shut the door when I am pumping gas", "I get out of the car to pump gas, but I lock the door behind me"

Whatever. I don't have any concept of how desperate a person would have to be to live in an area where your have to take your life in your hands to GET GAS. I wonder if people who need to be the safest mom in the world ever let their children take a bath without being watched. I mean ever, because even if a child can swim, they could still drown in an inch of water. And statistically, are you really willing to take that chance? I mean, even if only 1 in a million drowns, what if it's your child?

Yes, children walk to school. Millions of them every day. Most by themselves or with a similarly aged sibling or friend. Should we call the cops if it takes them more than 5 minutes? How about 10? What if it is raining? Snowing? I have before worried, because of the many people with this attitude of "I'll show her", that someone was going to take action against me because my children have walked to school when it was below 0 out. Let's just forget the fact that they have 3 recesses a day if it is above -25.

Now I know there is reason to worry.

[Erica in PA]

This is dispicable.

 

If this is your answer, I thinnk you should mind your own business!

 

A child in a parked car with the motor running is in less danger than if he is removed from the car and walked through the parking lot.

 

How about if I visit your house and check on what activities you allow your kids to engage in? Do you allow them candy, McDonalds, TV, to walk to school alone, to swim in YOUR pool unsupervised, to stay up past 8pm? What books do you allow them to read? What movies can they see? What religion are they? If you are going to decide what is good and safe for my kids, then you will be allowing others to decide what's good and safe for your kids.

 

Mind your own business.

 

Well, that is harsh. And responses like this are exactly why I would call the police if I were concerned in this sort of situation, and not wait to talk to the parent directly. I think you would hear something very similar to this from the parent in response to your concern.

[JennC]

I forgot to mention, that I personally don't think it's a good idea to leave children in the car with it running. For this reason I always (spring and summer, obviously) open the windows when I leave mine in the car.

 

Well, that is harsh. And responses like this are exactly why I would call the police if I were concerned in this sort of situation, and not wait to talk to the parent directly. I think you would hear something very similar to this from the parent in response to your concern.

 

The reason the parent gives you a response like this is that it REALLY is NONE of your business.

Would you call the police on a parent because her dc were selling lemonade at a corner stand down a few houses from their house on garage sales day? This is a serious question and I believe the answer would be very enlightening to me as to your - and similar posters' - point of view.

[Blessedfamily]

The Virginia Department of Motor vehicles instructs citizens to-

 

"Call 911 if you suspect that an unattended child left in a locked vehicle is in danger. Remain at the vehicle until authorities arrive."

 

Reading that seems to leave it up to the observer whether he/she feels the child is in danger. Not saying they should instruct people to do that, but as we see in this thread *danger* is perceived very differently by different people. To some, only a hot car in 90 degree heat qualifies. To others, an unattended 2 yo (that's w/in the age range of the OP) in a public parking lot is automatically in danger.

[Erica in PA]

I forgot to mention, that I personally don't think it's a good idea to leave children in the car with it running. For this reason I always (spring and summer, obviously) open the windows when I leave mine in the car.

 

 

 

The reason the parent gives you a response like this is that it REALLY is NONE of your business.

Would you call the police on a parent because her dc were selling lemonade at a corner stand down a few houses from their house on garage sales day? This is a serious question and I believe the answer would be very enlightening to me as to your - and similar posters' - point of view.

 

That's a total different situation.. Of course I wouldn't call the police over a lemonade stand. I wouldn't necessarily call the police even in the initial situation... it would depend on a lot of factors-- the age of the child, the temp. outside, the conduct of the child (i.e. is he/she crying, calm, etc.), whether or not the car was running, etc. However, my point was that if I felt the child *were* in an unsafe situation, I would call the police, and not wait to talk to the parent, because I don't think that I could trust the response of the parent. People are so quick to jump to "It's none of your business!" If I felt I had reason to be concerned about the safety of a child, I would rather call the police than get reamed out by a indignant parent.

[JennC]

That's a total different situation.. Of course I wouldn't call the police over a lemonade stand. I wouldn't necessarily call the police even in the initial situation... it would depend on a lot of factors-- the age of the child, the temp. outside, the conduct of the child (i.e. is he/she crying, calm, etc.), whether or not the car was running, etc. However, my point was that if I felt the child *were* in an unsafe situation, I would call the police, and not wait to talk to the parent, because I don't think that I could trust the response of the parent. People are so quick to jump to "It's none of your business!" If I felt I had reason to be concerned about the safety of a child, I would rather call the police than get reamed out by a indignant parent.

 

this view point does not jive with people who say "the child is in danger because he is out of the parents line of sight for more than 2, 5 or 10 minutes." this child could just as easily be abducted by one of the strangers perusing garage sales or just casually driving by looking for an unattended youngster to abduct. :tongue_smilie:

The seemingly prevailing opinion here is that it is "your" business when a child is involved. I assert that it ISN'T.

[Pajama Mama]

I'm surprised by the "mind your business" attitude. I think alot of parents have left their kids in the car while they pay for gas or get money from the atm. I've done it but I always took the keys and I could see the car at all times. But if you are away from your car long enough for the police to arrive then that's long enough for something to have happened to the child. There have been cases of kids being hurt or abducted when left in a car alone. I've heard of kids left in a burning hot car and freezing in a cold car. I've heard of kids getting out of the car seat and putting the running car in drive. There was a local case a couple years ago when the kids burned in the car when the a/c caught on fire. They were strapped in the car seats and couldn't get out. Those examples are more likely than being abducted but that could happen as well.

 

The person who called about a 12 yr old in the car was wrong. But if your kid is small and you are in Walmart for an hour then someone should call the cops on you. If it's 90 degrees outside and your car is off and windows closed then yes someone should call if you leave a kid in there. I would wait around if I saw a toddler in the car alone. If no one arrived within a few minutes I would call the police. If I'm standing next to your car and you don't know it; obviously you can't see your child. I'm sorry but the child's welfare is more important.

[JennC]

If no one arrived within a few minutes I would call the police. If I'm standing next to your car and you don't know it; obviously you can't see your child. I'm sorry but the child's welfare is more important.

 

If I'm standing by your child's lemonade stand and you don't know it; obviously you can't see your child (faulty logic). I'm sorry but the child's welfare is more important. (than what? My right to make decisions for my child?)

 

Now, I realize that you are talking about a child in the car - who is fine by the way, except for "well-meaning" dfs callers - and I am talking about a lemonade stand down the block from my house. But the principle is exactly the same.

And again I will say - a thinking person can tell the difference between mom went in to pay the florist and forgotten baby is strapped in a burning car.

[Urban Girl]

Is calling the police really "terrorizing" a person? If it's not illegal, the police won't get involved anyway... if it is, then I can't see how telling the police that someone is doing something illegal terrorizes them. :confused:

 

 

I've been watching this thread with interest, and have truly hesitated to join in, but I'll tell you how that can "terrorize".

 

Earlier this summer I left my 9 yo in the car while I ran in to the store. When i came out security was at my car. Someone reported my child in the car alone. Some background information: We had been out all day, and he was dragging and, as discovered later that day, coming down with a cold. Before I went to the store we ate lunch and we went to the bookstore where I bought him a few new books. He also had a new game for his Didj handheld (which he only uses on weekends and when on vacation). I was gone for 15 minutes, and that was verified by security and whoever called.

 

I waited for about 15 minutes before the police even arrived. When they arrived they decided to arrest me. I told the officers that my son thinks very highly of police officers and that they are the good guys. With him everything is black and white. There is no gray area. One of the officers told me that they would not do anything in front of him. My husband was about an hour away and since we were on vacation, he did not have his car with him. So, I told my son that he was going to "get to go to the police station and ride in a police car." He liked that and jumped at the chance. :glare: After they were good and gone, the officer handcuffed me and put me in the cruiser. After I was booked and had to post $25,000 bail, I was released. It took about 2 hours. (while waiting, the officer with my son offered to get him something from Burger King. My son told him, "No, i have to ask my mom, so they came to the cell and asked if he could have BK and a soda.) By the time I was released to go, ds was worried and had been asking the officer lots of questions about where his mom was.

 

DSS called the next morning -- evidently she was at my house and wanted to talk to us. I called her back and scheduled something for when we'd return. When she came, she was actually very nice. She said she couldn't believe they actually arrested me, and that I would not have been arrested in my home state. She asked questions about discipline, schooling and my relationship with DH. she wanted to know about drinking, smoking, illegal drugs etc. Then she talked to ds. She asked him about discipline. He asked her what she meant. She said, "What happens when you don't listen to Mom?" DS said, "I don't do that. I listen to Mommy & Daddy." She said what happens if you dont. He said, "I do listen. Except when I was 3, and I got spanked." She then asked about alcohol. He was unsure of what she meant, because we don't use alcohol. She tried to specify and asked about wine and beer. He told her that we take communion at church, and that sometimes he get to drink root beer. She then moved on to ask about anyone touching him and the like. When she asked about school, he said he would rather play baseball. (and to my surprise) she told him that he was a very lucky little boy to be homeschooled and that his mother was doing a wonderful job. She told him that she works in the public school system and he was getting the best by having mom homeschool him. That was the only good part of this ordeal.

 

The terror? Well, he used to like to watch police officers and talk to them. Shortly after this incident I was at the gas station, and two police cars pulled up to get gas. He panicked and wanted to know why they were there and what were they going to do? He doesn't wave to officers anymore. He was very clingy for the first few days, and as of late he's clinging to me and crying while saying, "Mommy, I don't want anything to happen to you." (it took a while for dh to get him to say what was really bothering him, that he didn't want the police to get me.) We never told him that I was arrested, but he's not stupid, he knows something happened.

 

Personally, I would have been greatly impacted to have had someone wait by the car and tell me that they were concerned for my boy. That would have brought immediate tears from me and extreme gratefulness. Having someone yell to me to "get out there now!" would have made that self-righteous person feel good, but would not have had the same impact as someone who would have waited and simply said, "I just wanted to be sure your boy was okay."

 

What has happened? Well, I went to court, and after 25 hours of community service the case was dismissed.

 

I choose to tell this because I hope my story will help someone to reconsider leaving their child in the car. Anything truly can happen. This is also to encourage the concerned citizens to think about the full impact on the child before acting. As disgusted or annoyed as you may be at the parent, understand that the impact is not on the parent only, and not all cases are a case of trifling laziness or neglect.

 

Signed,

 

Never Say Never

[unsinkable]

I've been watching this thread with interest, and have truly hesitated to join in, but I'll tell you how that can "terrorize".

 

Earlier this summer I left my 9 yo in the car while I ran in to the store. When i came out security was at my car. Someone reported my child in the car alone. Some background information: We had been out all day, and he was dragging and, as discovered later that day, coming down with a cold. Before I went to the store we ate lunch and we went to the bookstore where I bought him a few new books. He also had a new game for his Didj handheld (which he only uses on weekends and when on vacation). I was gone for 15 minutes, and that was verified by security and whoever called.

 

I waited for about 15 minutes before the police even arrived. When they arrived they decided to arrest me. I told the officers that my son thinks very highly of police officers and that they are the good guys. With him everything is black and white. There is no gray area. One of the officers told me that they would not do anything in front of him. My husband was about an hour away and since we were on vacation, he did not have his car with him. So, I told my son that he was going to "get to go to the police station and ride in a police car." He liked that and jumped at the chance. :glare: After they were good and gone, the officer handcuffed me and put me in the cruiser. After I was booked and had to post $25,000 bail, I was released. It took about 2 hours. (while waiting, the officer with my son offered to get him something from Burger King. My son told him, "No, i have to ask my mom, so they came to the cell and asked if he could have BK and a soda.) By the time I was released to go, ds was worried and had been asking the officer lots of questions about where his mom was.

 

DSS called the next morning -- evidently she was at my house and wanted to talk to us. I called her back and scheduled something for when we'd return. When she came, she was actually very nice. She said she couldn't believe they actually arrested me, and that I would not have been arrested in my home state. She asked questions about discipline, schooling and my relationship with DH. she wanted to know about drinking, smoking, illegal drugs etc. Then she talked to ds. She asked him about discipline. He asked her what she meant. She said, "What happens when you don't listen to Mom?" DS said, "I don't do that. I listen to Mommy & Daddy." She said what happens if you dont. He said, "I do listen. Except when I was 3, and I got spanked." She then asked about alcohol. He was unsure of what she meant, because we don't use alcohol. She tried to specify and asked about wine and beer. He told her that we take communion at church, and that sometimes he get to drink root beer. She then moved on to ask about anyone touching him and the like. When she asked about school, he said he would rather play baseball. (and to my surprise) she told him that he was a very lucky little boy to be homeschooled and that his mother was doing a wonderful job. She told him that she works in the public school system and he was getting the best by having mom homeschool him. That was the only good part of this ordeal.

 

The terror? Well, he used to like to watch police officers and talk to them. Shortly after this incident I was at the gas station, and two police cars pulled up to get gas. He panicked and wanted to know why they were there and what were they going to do? He doesn't wave to officers anymore. He was very clingy for the first few days, and as of late he's clinging to me and crying while saying, "Mommy, I don't want anything to happen to you." (it took a while for dh to get him to say what was really bothering him, that he didn't want the police to get me.) We never told him that I was arrested, but he's not stupid, he knows something happened.

 

Personally, I would have been greatly impacted to have had someone wait by the car and tell me that they were concerned for my boy. That would have brought immediate tears from me and extreme gratefulness. Having someone yell to me to "get out there now!" would have made that self-righteous person feel good, but would not have had the same impact as someone who would have waited and simply said, "I just wanted to be sure your boy was okay."

 

What has happened? Well, I went to court, and after 25 hours of community service the case was dismissed.

 

I choose to tell this because I hope my story will help someone to reconsider leaving their child in the car. Anything truly can happen. This is also to encourage the concerned citizens to think about the full impact on the child before acting. As disgusted or annoyed as you may be at the parent, understand that the impact is not on the parent only, and not all cases are a case of trifling laziness or neglect.

 

Signed,

 

Never Say Never

 

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

I am so sorry this happened to you!

 

I would have been hysterical. I probably would have cried myself sick when they put the handcuffs on. I can't believe you had to endure this.

[Urban Girl]

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

I am so sorry this happened to you!

 

I would have been hysterical. I probably would have cried myself sick when they put the handcuffs on. I can't believe you had to endure this.

 

 

I can hardly believe it myself. On the inside I was feeling absolutely sick, but I had to keep it together for my son. If I cracked, he would never have "gone along" and it would have been worse.

[sleepymommy]

HomeCOO- thanks for sharing your story. I'm sure it must have all been so hard for you and your family. My ds would probably react just as yours has and that saddens me so much.

 

I've left my boys in the car before, only when I can get a parking space right in front of our small neighborhood gas station/market. When I can see the car clearly (only about 10 feet away), my back is never turned away from the car. If its hot or cold out, I leave the car running with a remote starter from my keyring, so the ac/heat is on without any keys in the car and the doors are locked and the alarm would go off if it was opened and the car would shut down if by chance the kids jumped into the drivers seat and started to push the accelerator, brake or gearshift. I run in and run out (literally).

 

I can see how this may not be adequate justification for most, just sharing my experience. In this situation, I do not feel there is any harm being done.

 

I would never, however, leave them and go all the way into the far end of the same gas station that would require me turning my back to them, and never into any other store.

 

If I were in the situation of finding another person's child in a car, I would most likely wait nearby (not right by the car because I wouldn't want to freak the child out) until a parent came out. If it were longer than 5 min, I would start to get worried. If ten min. past, then I would call the store (411) and have them make an announcement. I'd call because I wouldn't feel comfortable leaving the child out of my sight.

[Harriet Vane]

I've been watching this thread with interest, and have truly hesitated to join in, but I'll tell you how that can "terrorize".

 

Earlier this summer I left my 9 yo in the car while I ran in to the store. When i came out security was at my car. Someone reported my child in the car alone. Some background information: We had been out all day, and he was dragging and, as discovered later that day, coming down with a cold. Before I went to the store we ate lunch and we went to the bookstore where I bought him a few new books. He also had a new game for his Didj handheld (which he only uses on weekends and when on vacation). I was gone for 15 minutes, and that was verified by security and whoever called.

 

I waited for about 15 minutes before the police even arrived. When they arrived they decided to arrest me. I told the officers that my son thinks very highly of police officers and that they are the good guys. With him everything is black and white. There is no gray area. One of the officers told me that they would not do anything in front of him. My husband was about an hour away and since we were on vacation, he did not have his car with him. So, I told my son that he was going to "get to go to the police station and ride in a police car." He liked that and jumped at the chance. :glare: After they were good and gone, the officer handcuffed me and put me in the cruiser. After I was booked and had to post $25,000 bail, I was released. It took about 2 hours. (while waiting, the officer with my son offered to get him something from Burger King. My son told him, "No, i have to ask my mom, so they came to the cell and asked if he could have BK and a soda.) By the time I was released to go, ds was worried and had been asking the officer lots of questions about where his mom was.

 

DSS called the next morning -- evidently she was at my house and wanted to talk to us. I called her back and scheduled something for when we'd return. When she came, she was actually very nice. She said she couldn't believe they actually arrested me, and that I would not have been arrested in my home state. She asked questions about discipline, schooling and my relationship with DH. she wanted to know about drinking, smoking, illegal drugs etc. Then she talked to ds. She asked him about discipline. He asked her what she meant. She said, "What happens when you don't listen to Mom?" DS said, "I don't do that. I listen to Mommy & Daddy." She said what happens if you dont. He said, "I do listen. Except when I was 3, and I got spanked." She then asked about alcohol. He was unsure of what she meant, because we don't use alcohol. She tried to specify and asked about wine and beer. He told her that we take communion at church, and that sometimes he get to drink root beer. She then moved on to ask about anyone touching him and the like. When she asked about school, he said he would rather play baseball. (and to my surprise) she told him that he was a very lucky little boy to be homeschooled and that his mother was doing a wonderful job. She told him that she works in the public school system and he was getting the best by having mom homeschool him. That was the only good part of this ordeal.

 

The terror? Well, he used to like to watch police officers and talk to them. Shortly after this incident I was at the gas station, and two police cars pulled up to get gas. He panicked and wanted to know why they were there and what were they going to do? He doesn't wave to officers anymore. He was very clingy for the first few days, and as of late he's clinging to me and crying while saying, "Mommy, I don't want anything to happen to you." (it took a while for dh to get him to say what was really bothering him, that he didn't want the police to get me.) We never told him that I was arrested, but he's not stupid, he knows something happened.

 

Personally, I would have been greatly impacted to have had someone wait by the car and tell me that they were concerned for my boy. That would have brought immediate tears from me and extreme gratefulness. Having someone yell to me to "get out there now!" would have made that self-righteous person feel good, but would not have had the same impact as someone who would have waited and simply said, "I just wanted to be sure your boy was okay."

 

What has happened? Well, I went to court, and after 25 hours of community service the case was dismissed.

 

I choose to tell this because I hope my story will help someone to reconsider leaving their child in the car. Anything truly can happen. This is also to encourage the concerned citizens to think about the full impact on the child before acting. As disgusted or annoyed as you may be at the parent, understand that the impact is not on the parent only, and not all cases are a case of trifling laziness or neglect.

 

Signed,

 

Never Say Never

 

:grouphug:

 

I have to say I am really, really appalled that you were actually arrested for this. Your child was NINE years old, for heavens' sake! Not a helpless infant by any stretch. At that age he can walk to school alone or go to the park alone, but not sit in a car? You handled this with more grace than I would have.

[tricia]

The LAST thing I would do is call police. I would be concerned for his/her safety but not to the point that I would get CPS involved. They are well known for their inexcusable acts of intruding and breaking up perfectly good homes. All because someone ran into a store quick to make a purchase. In my own personal opinion calling authorities is both selfish and judgmental. What I would do is take the time to sit in my car and think of my neighbor as myself and see that no harm would come to the child. In doing this there are exceptions of course. Of course I would have my limits. A few minutes is one thing but upwards to 15 minutes or more would cause a red flag and at that point I think I would like someone to know. Most likely a store employee would be my choice. But I sure as heck am NOT going to be the one to open up a nasty can of worms for anyone by alerting the authorities unless something were completely and obviously wrong. IE, the parents taking forever to return, the weather being totally unacceptable. Things like that.

 

For the record. I do not leave my children in our car unless they are in the car with an older sibling at least 15 or so. And this is coming from the most paranoid parent on the earth who rarely lets her 5 little girl out of her site.

[emmsmama]

If the child was in immediate danger (ex. windows rolled up on a hot day), I'd go into the store and have the person paged and if they didn't come immediately then I would call the police. However, if there was no immediate danger, I would wait 5 mins. and then go into the store to have the parent paged and then tell them how long I've been outside and that anything could have happened to their child during that time. I'm assuming that at that point the parent would get the child out of the car. If the parent could not be found and there was immediate danger then I would call the police. If the parent could not be found and there was no immediate danger, I would likely wait 15 mins. to make sure the child stayed safe and if the parent still didn't come back, then I would call the police. I wouldn't immediately jump to calling the police unless there was immediate danger and the parent could not be found.

 

I've left my kids in the car when running into the library (2-3 mins. tops) or into the gas station to pay when I can see them the whole time. I don't do it if it is a hot day because when I do it, I always leave the windows rolled up, turn off the car, and lock the doors. My kids were 5 and 9 when I started feeling okay doing this though. I wouldn't do it with a baby or toddler and never to go shopping or run a long errand.

[Scarlett]

The LAST thing I would do is call police. I would be concerned for his/her safety but not to the point that I would get CPS involved. They are well known for their inexcusable acts of intruding and breaking up perfectly good homes.

 

Of course I would have my limits. A few minutes is one thing but upwards to 15 minutes or more would cause a red flag and at that point I think I would like someone to know.

 

 

This is how I feel. I left my 9 1/2 year old in my car the other day while I went into a small grocery store for a few items. I was probably gone 15 minutes. I'm curious if any of you police callers would have called the police on me in that situation. After the horror story of the poster on this thread who was taken to jail I probably won't do it again.

 

Ridiculous the way our society is.