Soror Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Ds has handwriting issues so we've modified as needed to make it work as he loves playing w/ language. I certainly plan to continue CAP but I also plan to look at other programs, as it is I don't think it is enough for a full years worth of work for us and I can see value in doing other things as well. I'm curious about WWS but I don't think I'll be looking at it until year after next, at least w/ how it is going now. We've got a lot more work on sentences and paragraphs before I want to look at proceeding further. After we finish CAP this spring we'll be doing a combo of EPS and Killgallon I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommymilkies Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 We use IEW and I have looked extensively at CAP and I don't think it would work for my ds with similar issues either. Maybe it is the creativity element that Chelli mentioned? I'm only popping in to note this because there has been some chatter on other threads that "no one who has tried it dislikes it" and my point is just that some of us aren't even trying it because we can tell it wouldn't be the right fit. The funny thing is that my dd is very creative. But apparently not in this situation. I spent enough that I will try it with her again next year, but she cries if I bring it out. Seems like something my son would have loved, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco_Clark Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 I'm asking for a friend that doesn't use the Internet so please ignore my children's ages :). They are not old enough for this program....yet. My friend is looking for a third grade writing program. Her daughter has not done any writing yet; just narrations, copywork, and dictation. But heavy in all three of those. She uses WRTR for spelling and has another CM based program for grammar (can't remember which) and loves both, so she's looking for a pure writing program. She's a pretty steady CM/classical blend. Is this program just writing? Or does it also include grammar, spelling, ect? Is this program too difficult for a 3rd grade student that has not previously done "creative" writing? What other (similar) programs should she look into? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soror Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Gramar- Only small amounts, in order to work w/ playing w/ the sentences. Spelling- No, some vocab. Difficult- Depends on student I don't think ds would have been ready at 8yo but this year at 9yo it has been perfect and he only did dictation, copywork and narration previously. There is a 3 lesson sample on the site that is very representative of the program, I highly suggest looking at it and trying it out if possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 By the way Barnes and Noble coupon codes work for the CAP books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco_Clark Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Thanks, I didnt notice the sample, that helps a ton. I love when they give you a few lessons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelli Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I know this thread hasn't been updated in a while, but I finished my review of this program for the Virtual Curriculum Fair this year. I wanted to share it here since I figured some of you would like to see how it's been going. We've been using the program off and on for four months and I still love it! My Dream Writing Program Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardis Girl Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 I enjoyed your review -- thank you! I know I've asked this before, but now that people have been using CAP longer, I'm wondering what the thought is on skipping CAP Fable and going straight into CAP Narrative? My kids have done a good amount with rewriting fables already, and I worry that they are just going to be sick of it. Or will they be missing out on fundamental experiences or instruction if they skip Fable? Anyone know if they are keeping up with the publication schedule enough that the next set of books will be available before August? It worries me to be on the leading edge of the publication plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soror Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 tardisgirl - The next book is to be out in May of this year and then August for the following book, so everything is still on schedule. As to skipping the first book, I think you could just fine, although it is a lot of fun and a great intro. There is certainly more required in the second book in the first so I'd look at to see if you think they are ready for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloha2U Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 We're currently working through Lesson 7 of Narrative I. Imo, Fable was worth the time and energy. Being a progressive series that builds upon itself, it'd be best to start at the beginning—if possible—with CAP Fable. I wouldn't recommend skipping it. There's definitely meat in Fable that you won't want to miss, and the writing activities are truly beneficial. Oftentimes, Narrative I refers back to Fable, assuming that you've covered the material in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfeusse Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 we are all using the Fable book and I have a 13, 11 and 9 year old. How many books are available now? I didn't take the time to figure that out.....I knew I just wanted to start from the beginning. Oh, we are loving this program...my kids haven't had a formal writing program until now, and so this works well for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardis Girl Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 We're currently working through Lesson 7 of Narrative I. Imo, Fable was worth the time and energy. Being a progressive series that builds upon itself, it'd be best to start at the beginning—if possible—with CAP Fable. I wouldn't recommend skipping it. There's definitely meat in Fable that you won't want to miss, and the writing activities are truly beneficial. Oftentimes, Narrative I refers back to Fable, assuming that you've covered the material in it. Thank you for the couple of replies on this....so... what do you think about working through PARTS of Fable? Instead of the whole thing? Or is that just too much trouble and not effective? Thinking.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soror Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 We just finished L3 of Narrative here. I do agree that I think Fable has worthwhile work but I could also see someone picking up those skills elsewhere. The biggest challenge to ds has been the amount of writing. I could certainly see at least compacting some of the lessons that work on similar skills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ByGrace3 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 I know this thread hasn't been updated in a while, but I finished my review of this program for the Virtual Curriculum Fair this year. I wanted to share it here since I figured some of you would like to see how it's been going. We've been using the program off and on for four months and I still love it! My Dream Writing Program Thanks for the review. I took the plunge and ordered it a few days ago, and this encourages me! Thanks! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Did you buy the workbook as well as the teacher's book? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ByGrace3 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Did you buy the workbook as well as the teacher's book? I ordered both, yes. I like to make my life easier. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 I ordered both, yes. I like to make my life easier. :lol: I know what you mean. I've come to see the benefits of such things. Any little thing helps sometimes! I ordered the fables teacher's manual but then thought it might be a pain to implement without the workbook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clear Creek Posted January 12, 2014 Author Share Posted January 12, 2014 I know what you mean. I've come to see the benefits of such things. Any little thing helps sometimes! I ordered the fables teacher's manual but then thought it might be a pain to implement without the workbook. The student book is handy for some of the assignments, like when the student learns how to summarize by crossing out all the extra information in the fable with a pencil, but if you have a copier handy you can just copy the individual page. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soror Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I just had the teacher's book for Fable and it worked ok but then I decided to buy the student's book for Narrative, well we've finished 3 lessons and we've yet to use it, the only thing I use it for is to have ds read it w/out seeing the answers first. It hasn't been worth it to have it though and I'll not be buying it for the next levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I just had the teacher's book for Fable and it worked ok but then I decided to buy the student's book for Narrative, well we've finished 3 lessons and we've yet to use it, the only thing I use it for is to have ds read it w/out seeing the answers first. It hasn't been worth it to have it though and I'll not be buying it for the next levels. Thanks soror and ByGrace3 for both your perspectives! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soror Posted January 16, 2014 Share Posted January 16, 2014 Stripe- Perhaps try the sample and see what you think we do a lot orally here and I can justify the cost of the workbook. What we do write we use a separate notebook for, so it isn't any big deal. I never did get it coil-bound as well so it is hard for him to use as a lefty. We just finished Lesson 5 today, ds is loving the Greek Myths. I'm anxious to see what stories they have lined up for the next book as these have been such wonderful picks. I really appreciate the method they are using to get them up towards written narrations, focusing on identifying the beginning, middle and end and then rewriting each one at a time, it is so much less intimidating. I believe the program does an excellent job with provoking discussion and folding skills in at a steady progression. I've seen definite improvement in ds' writing and his confidence and willingness to write since starting. His writing is not as polished as the examples in the book but we are making good progress and enjoying it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsutsie Posted January 16, 2014 Share Posted January 16, 2014 Can anyone comment on this program compared to CW Aesop? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indigomama Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 My son is in 4th grade and finishing up WWE3, but it had become very dry for him, and he had lost some of his enthusiasm for writing. I came across this thread and decided to try CAP Fables. We are both loving it! It has sparked his interest again, and I think given him greater understanding of what we were doing in WWE. He almost cried when I told him we had to take a break because I had dropped the books off at staples to be spiral bound! Thanks for the recommendation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardis Girl Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Can anyone comment on this program compared to CW Aesop? I'm very interested in hearing an answer on this as well. My thought (without having CAP yet) is that CAP has a larger creative component?? But that's just a guess, really. Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clear Creek Posted January 17, 2014 Author Share Posted January 17, 2014 Can anyone comment on this program compared to CW Aesop? I used CW Aesop for a semester with my oldest child. I found it extremely convoluted in instruction and my daughter learned no skills that transferred to her writing outside of the course. It developed an intense dislike for writing in her that took a couple of years for her to overcome. It has more explicit grammar instruction than W&R, which can be a plus for someone that wants to use one curriculum to teach both grammar and writing. The program seemed to me to be the same lesson over and over, with instruction on how to go deeper with the re-writes as the child learns each skill - it was up to the parent to determine when the child had mastered each skill. Each week had the same routine...read the fable, outline it, discuss the grammar lesson, re-write the fable. As far as writing skills go, it goes much, much slower than W&R...painfully slow, IMHO. Both include copywork and dictation. W&R has variety in the lessons, teaches a broader range of writing skills with less of a focus on grammar instruction (though it definitely includes grammar in the context of writing, such as re-writing sentences with a different adjective or re-writing sentences so the direct object is the subject), and progresses faster through the progym at this level. The exercises are more interesting, there are thought-provoking discussion questions for the lessons, there are elocution lessons each week, and the copia exercises are just plain fun. My oldest (now in 6th grade) went through both books at a quick pace this past semester and I have since noticed a huge improvement in her writing - she has much more descriptive sentences, organized paragraphs, and can write natural-sounding dialogue. Towards the end of the second book, the student writes the middle of the fable, with the begining and the ending already there in the book...I had to look at the TM while my daughter was reading what she wrote aloud to me to find out which part of the fable was written by her because I never heard a noticeable drop in the quality of writing signaling the point where her writing began! If I can find the time in the next few days I will post a sample of one of her first re-writes and one of her last re-writes so you can see the difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardis Girl Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 If I can find the time in the next few days I will post a sample of one of her first re-writes and one of her last re-writes so you can see the difference. Thank you so much for the comparison! And I would LOVE to see some examples like you mentioned, definitely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Does anybody know when the next set of books will be released? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrysalis Academy Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 I read somewhere (here most likely) that Narrative 2 will be in May and the next one in August? That seems ambitious, but would be great! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrapbabe Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Last update was April and July. http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/501354-anybody-know-when-classical-academic-press-will-have-their-next-level-released/?hl=%2Bclassical+%2Bacademic+%2Bpress&do=findComment&comment=5428779 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 That's great! I was worried I had to wait longer. We just started Narrative 1 and I must say, so far, this has been a very enjoyable curriculum. I wonder at what level we will see the movement away from fables, fairy tales to lit and non-fiction. I am not familiar with the classical model outside of WWE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soror Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 So, I just read on their facebook page that book 4 will be teaching the 6 paragraph essay. I'm feeling excited and nervous, I'm not sure if ds will be ready. I guess we will see, it is working well so far so we will just take it a lesson at a time. We are on Lesson 8 now of Fable and all is well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrysalis Academy Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 So, I just read on their facebook page that book 4 will be teaching the 6 paragraph essay. I'm feeling excited and nervous, I'm not sure if ds will be ready. I guess we will see, it is working well so far so we will just take it a lesson at a time. We are on Lesson 8 now of Fable and all is well. Sweet! I've been wondering about book 4, and thinking that might be good to run my older child through if it comes out in time. It is hard to imagine the little one being ready for that in 4th grade, for sure! But they might surprise us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
My3girls Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Wow, if we started this next year in 3rd then they would be learning the 6 paragraph essay in 4th? That's a bit early isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soror Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 I read it as they will be working on it, not that they will be doing it entirely independently. It does help to keep in mind that there is a whole other book to be done between book 2 and 4 so I guess we'll see the progression a little more clearly when it is released. I am a bit curious as to how the books would compare to WWS, so I'm anxious to make a comparison. I like the idea of WWS but from what I've read and seen I don't know that it would be a good fit for ds so I'm hoping that WR continues to work. Even if ds is not ready for book 4 next year we can always come to it later after some work in other programs, I had already considered that option but we will continue to move ahead as long as it works. Right now I plan on doing more paragraph work when we finish book 2 here in a few weeks and I don't believe we'll officially start book3 until this summer. I had consdiered doing some BW next year in between WR but now I'm curious to get it in my hand to see how long the lessons will take since they are expected to take longer than these first year books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Last update was April and July. http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/501354-anybody-know-when-classical-academic-press-will-have-their-next-level-released/?hl=%2Bclassical+%2Bacademic+%2Bpress&do=findComment&comment=5428779 I think the books more-or-less "exist" already. In the Preface the author talks about how the program is used at a school in Indianapolis. I'm happy to hear the level of difficulty picks up. I'm teaching Fable to a couple of fourth graders, and they are not at all challenged. They are learning, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs. Lilac Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I am so excited to try this in the fall. It made me nervous at first, because it doesn't just jump in to copious amounts of composition like many other curricula, so I was wondering if they would be "behind." However, I sent the samples to my cousin, who has a masters' in rhetoric and composition, is teaching those at the college level, and is getting his Ph.D in rhetoric and composition. He was really excited by the samples, and said that if the college freshman he teaches had been trained this way, they would have a MUCH easier time of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama2two Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 Anyone using this in conjunction with Hake writing and grammar? If so, how is it going? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathryn Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 I was just reading this old thread this morning trying to learn more about W&R. I'm trying to choose between it and CW Aesop, which I already have waiting to go, for 4th grade after WWE4. Can anyone compare them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelli Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 I was just reading this old thread this morning trying to learn more about W&R. I'm trying to choose between it and CW Aesop, which I already have waiting to go, for 4th grade after WWE4. Can anyone compare them? There was this recent thread about the two programs: http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/504663-cap-writing-and-rhetoric-vs-classical-composition/?do=findComment&comment=5490266 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrissiK Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 I have been very interested in this thread. My boys (4th grade and 5th grade) are doing Memoria Press's Classical Composition and although I like it (and the price) I think doing Narration next year, which seems very similar to Fable this year, is going to get dry really fast. I have poured over the samples of CAP and it seems a more interesting curriculum and has more variety. I am so tempted to jump ship and go to CAP, but I'm wondering if I should start with Narration with my boys, since they have had a lot of Fables this year and do Fables with my rising third grader. I am also concerned, like other posters, that it's not complete yet. Although I did e-mail them and was assured by Joanne that the next 2 books are slated to come out this spring/early summer. Does anyone have any experience with starting with CC and then going over to CAP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highfamily Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 KrissiK, I'm in a similar spot...I am almost finished with CC Narrative with 2 girls, grades 5 and 6; we covered Fable first semester and Narrative this semester. Toward the end of Narrative, the selections get REALLY LONG - one thing for you to consider. Also, when I looked at the sample lesson for CC Chreia/Maxim, I felt dread. Not looking forward to teaching it, and I know the girls won't enjoy it much. Is school only about having fun? Certainly not, but I think we're going to jump ship and switch to CAP. It does seem more interesting, more varied(!), and I want them to LOVE LEARNING. Jana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama2two Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 KrissiK, I'm in a similar spot...I am almost finished with CC Narrative with 2 girls, grades 5 and 6; we covered Fable first semester and Narrative this semester. Toward the end of Narrative, the selections get REALLY LONG - one thing for you to consider. Also, when I looked at the sample lesson for CC Chreia/Maxim, I felt dread. Not looking forward to teaching it, and I know the girls won't enjoy it much. Is school only about having fun? Certainly not, but I think we're going to jump ship and switch to CAP. It does seem more interesting, more varied(!), and I want them to LOVE LEARNING. Jana I am in the opposite situation, I am considering a move to CC since that is what Kolbe uses and we will more than likely enroll with them for highschool. Would love to hear your thoughts on CC and more info on why you want to make the switch (We are almost done with Fable and have really enjoyed it! Dd WWE 1-3 before this) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrissiK Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 I am in the opposite situation, I am considering a move to CC since that is what Kolbe uses and we will more than likely enroll with them for highschool. Would love to hear your thoughts on CC and more info on why you want to make the switch (We are almost done with Fable and have really enjoyed it! Dd WWE 1-3 before this) I do like CC and I think the skills it teaches are really good. It seems very solid. It's just.... to me it seems monotonous. The books are plain, no nonsense, no frills. My boys actually haven't complained, but....maybe it's just me. I think it's a good curriculum, but I like a little more creativity and CAP appears to have that. Ugh! I've had this problem between MP and CAP before. I think they have great programs, both of them, but they seem to have different methodologies for achieving the same goal (I used CAP's beginning Greek Pregram, and had bought MP's Greek workbook, and they are as different as night and day) we use MP's Latin Program and the boys are doing well. I'm leaning toward sticking with CC, just because....we've started with it and I prefer to stick with a curriculum unless it really isn't working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathryn Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 There was this recent thread about the two programs: http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/504663-cap-writing-and-rhetoric-vs-classical-composition/?do=findComment&comment=5490266 I saw that one, but it's about Classical Composition. I'm interested in how Writing and Rhetoric compares to Classical Writing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelli Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 I saw that one, but it's about Classical Composition. I'm interested in how Writing and Rhetoric compares to Classical Writing. Oops. Sorry. That's what I get for trying to be helpful when I don't know what I'm talking about. :blushing: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathryn Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 Oops. Sorry. That's what I get for trying to be helpful when I don't know what I'm talking about. :blushing: That's okay! It's the thought that counts, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 My ds8 is working through WWE4 but I think we both want to jump ship at some point, probably at the end of this school year. He'll be about 1/2 way done. He is a strong writer and good at comprehension and dictation. From the looks of it, he is very familiar with all the stories in Book 1 and I don't want him to be bored. By the time I order, I think they will have published Books 4 and 5....I can't decide which level to get and would appreciate input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 The more I look at this, the more excited I am. I think we will start with Book 2. Would it be terrible to start right now??? :hat: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 My ds8 is working through WWE4 but I think we both want to jump ship at some point, probably at the end of this school year. He'll be about 1/2 way done. He is a strong writer and good at comprehension and dictation. From the looks of it, he is very familiar with all the stories in Book 1 and I don't want him to be bored. By the time I order, I think they will have published Books 4 and 5....I can't decide which level to get and would appreciate input. Maybe have him just work throughout the sample for Fable. If he can get the idea and easily do the amplification and summary exercises, he probably could start with the second book. The exercises increase in complexity, but other than writing an "original" fable, that's the main idea of the book. We are flying through. It's fun if you can find a friend to do it with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrysalis Academy Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 The more I look at this, the more excited I am. I think we will start with Book 2. Would it be terrible to start right now??? :hat: Of course not!! We just started Fable. What homeschooling police is watching to make sure you only start things in September or January? ;) I actually find spring a great time to start new things. We're either finishing stuff up, or just incredibly bored with it. Brings a new energy to add in something new! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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