The HBO series, John Adams- was this a miserable experience for anyone else?

[battlemaiden]

I just finished the third disc last night.

 

What a joyless, angry, bitter, grotesque creature they made John Adams. It was hard to look at him at times. Never in real life have I met someone as ugly as they made him.

 

I have read McCullough's John Adams, the letters between Abigail and John Adams, and quite a few, but not all, of the letters between Jefferson and Adams. He was cantankerous to be sure, but I think HBO's portrayal was a miss.

 

And as fine as the acting was (who was that actor that played Ben Franklin?- he cracks me up), I think the series was painful to watch past the first disc.

 

What are your impressions?

 

Jo

[Jen in NY]

:iagree:

 

We were in Williamsburg when they were filming some scenes and were really looking forward to seeing it... but I could not get past the weird speech impediment Paul Giamatti was putting on (or was it just from the fake teeth?) and the generally grim attitude of the entire film. I'm not sure what I was expecting, but that wasn't it.

 

~Jen in NY

[Pam Wilhelm]

I've read the book....... and have the dvd set....... but I'm reluctant to watch it. My Mom watched the movie and came away talking very poorly about John Adams and I can't bring myself to watch now. I loved the book..... and while it does seem that J.A. was not an easy man to like.... I don't want to see the movie that would make folks want to dislike him even more. Does that make sense?

[FlockOfSillies]

I haven't read the book (it's on my audiobook wish list) but I watched the whole series and really enjoyed it. If there was any grimness, I thought it had more to do with the times and how much Adams had to sacrifice. I liked how the characters actually grappled with the questions of how to best establish a government. I didn't find him hard to like/root for at all.

[Trivium Academy]

Oh, I almost rented this! I *just* put it back on the shelf just 15 minutes ago, I wasn't sure if it would be worth watching, now I know. :)

[TammyinTN]

Oh no...I just ordered this set yesterday. :rolleyes:

[abbeyej]

Oh, wow. That's not how we saw it *at*all*. I'm sort of amazed...

 

The kids and I watched it together. (I had to fastforward through two or three scenes in the whole series.) I thought they showed a man of strength, intellect and principle -- a man who was torn between duty to his country at a pivotal time for the whole world, and his love for his family and his small farm. A man with a rather gruff exterior, not openly affectionate or emotional...

 

There were times when I didn't like him much. I liked him best when he was balanced by the even temper and loving kindness of his wife. (Also not an outwardly emotional or affectionate person.)

 

But what I came away with was his love for truth, for justice, for the law... For what he believed to be right. For his country...

 

No, I wouldn't want to be married to him. ;)

 

But I felt great respect for the character as portrayed in the movie -- and I didn't think it was far off from the way McCullough and Adams' own letters portray him. Great virtues, great flaws...

 

And my children are now some of the biggest John Adams fans ever. DD tells me she's voting for him in the upcoming election. I told her there was some problems with this plan, but that doesn't seem to distress her much...

 

BTW, dh didn't watch the series with us. He found it boring. I will definitely agree that it's grim and rather slow.

[abbeyej]

Oh no...I just ordered this set yesterday. :rolleyes:

 

You may not be disappointed! We watched it on HBO, and ordered the dvds. The kids and I have watched some episodes three or more times.

[battlemaiden]

But what I came away with was his love for truth, for justice, for the law... For what he believed to be right. For his country...

 

BTW, dh didn't watch the series with us. He found it boring. I will definitely agree that it's grim and rather slow.

 

I agree his love of country, the law, and fair government were portrayed well.

 

My main problem with the series was the bleakness! The grey, the melancholy, his miserable side without much balance of hope and joy (until the brief scene before his death). And speaking of death....sheesh! I don't mind a little, but they spent so. much. time. on these events.

 

The first disc I watched with the children, and the reality of the difficulties of establishing a US government were wonderful.

 

How did you feel about Abigail's character? She seemed a bit flat, stoic, and reserved to me. Perhaps I'm resistant to early nineteenth century New Englandism. ;)

[abbeyej]

Perhaps I'm resistant to early nineteenth century New Englandism. ;)

 

Lol... I think that might be part of the problem. ;) Lol. I'm not terribly enamored of the idea of actually *living* in late eighteenth/early nineteenth century New England either! I like my colorful, cushy life and my affectionate, friendly family! :D

[Jenny in Atl]

We also loved it. But not everyone likes the same thing. Sorry you disliked it so much. :confused:

[valkett]

Our family loved it. We'll definitely be getting the dvds. I think he was a very principled man who worked hard. Like many men, he had a hard time with for lack of a better term, "office politics." I think the movie showed his true frustration with some of the way things were done. Also thought the movie was probably pretty accurate in portraying the way life was then. No thanks.

 

Again... sorry you didn't care for it.

 

Valk

[Susan A.]

I watched and enjoyed, although it was a bit grim at times - but probably realistic to the times (with the usual dramatic license for TV). I definitely could have skipped a certain scene toward the end regarding the health of his daughter. PM me if you want more information, otherwise I don't want to spoil anything!

[abreakfromlife]

I've been interested in watching this, but have been wary since it's HBO - how is the content of the movie - sex, swearing???

[abbeyej]

I've been interested in watching this, but have been wary since it's HBO - how is the content of the movie - sex, swearing???

 

Overall it's very "clean". Potential concerns that I remember...

 

-We see a fellow being tarred and feathered. It's from a distance, but the angry mob does rip off *all* of his clothing and he's seen completely naked. The nudity is brief and distant, but the act of tarring and feathering is extremely brutal.

 

-We see bloodied, injured soldiers and corpses after the Boston Massacre and a couple of battles. I think there is little or no actual fighting shown.

 

-Benjamin Franklin has a tendency to speak in double entendres. Went over my kids' heads completely, so I didn't worry about it particularly.

 

-At the French court, there is talk of mistresses and love-making. Adams is clearly disconcerted by this and swallows his objections only in an effort to maintain the political connections he needs. There was just one scene at a court dinner that I chose to fastforward through for my children (and they are young). Adams also walks in on Franklin in a tub (no nudity -- they're wearing bathing clothes) with a French woman.

 

-There's a smallpox outbreak and early vaccination attempts. My daughter found this pretty disturbing. It's fairly grotesque.

 

-John and Abigail are shown in bed together several times, just talking at the end of their day. There's nothing s'xual particularly, just a conversation between a married couple in bed in their nightclothes.

 

-At other times we see them kiss or hug.

 

-When Abigail comes to meet John in Paris after a separation of many years, they do have s'x. It's fully clothed, but there's no mistaking what is happening. I fastforwarded through the scene.

 

I can't remember anything else. I don't recall if there's any foul language. I assume that there is a little -- from John's fiery cousin, Sam, for instance. But it must not have been anything worse than the occasional "d*mn", or I think I would have noticed.

 

I don't think there was anything (except maybe the brief, distant shot of the naked fellow being tarred and feathered) that you wouldn't see on network tv. It was *not* like HBO's Rome, which I thought was tremendously well-made but so rife with sex, language and gore that I'm hesitant to recommend it to most people I know.

[MicheleinMN]

I really liked it and intend to have my 2 high school students watch it this year.

 

I did also read the book John Adams too, so maybe that helped fill out the characters for me?

 

Sorry you were disappointed. I thought it was very well done. (Though the last episode was very sad and hard for me to watch.)

 

Michele

[abreakfromlife]

 

It was *not* like HBO's Rome, which I thought was tremendously well-made but so rife with sex, language and gore that I'm hesitant to recommend it to most people I know.

that's what I was afraid of with this one. I read reviews of Rome, and yikes! I'll have to add JA to my queue!

[lovemyboys]

My Mom watched the movie and came away talking very poorly about John Adams and I can't bring myself to watch now. QUOTE]

 

to slam the founding fathers, Abraham Lincoln, etc. They weren't perfect, but what an amazing effort they made that we're still benefitting from. As Tony Blair has said, there's a reason so many people struggle so hard to get to the US to live. Again, not perfect, but better than many other options.

 

I haven't seen the series but I haven't cared for Paul Giamatti's starring roles -- he's often great in supporting parts, much less so as the star, imo.

 

Oh well.

[SFP]

We haven't watched the third disk yet, but we've enjoyed every minute that we've seen so far.

[Beth in SW WA]

 

What are your impressions?

 

Jo

 

We loved it! I respectfully disagree w/ your impressions of the series. Was it difficult to watch at times due to the realism? Sure! But the reality of history is not pretty. I don't want candy-coated Hollywood history.

 

My older kids were glued to the tv and have a new interest in American history due to John Adams.

 

I highly recommend the book AND the mini-series. :thumbup1:

[TammyinTN]

You may not be disappointed! We watched it on HBO, and ordered the dvds. The kids and I have watched some episodes three or more times.

 

 

This gives me hope!:001_smile:

[Jill- OK]

We haven't watched the third disk yet, but we've enjoyed every minute that we've seen so far.

 

I think it was after the third disc that we lost interest. (Whenever Adams' presidency started).

 

It felt to me like they were obligated to continue through his whole life, but the strongest storytelling in the series (imo) occurred in the years leading up to and directly after the Revolution.

 

We really enjoyed it up to that point, though.

 

And I have to wonder (in answer to Jo's OP)...did they *make* him look a certain way, or is it possible that he might have really been like that? I'd bet money that his best self was shining through when he was writing letters to folks like his wife and Jefferson (at least his best expressive self, not necessarily his best behavior, lol), but I don't have the expectation that all great men are great, personality-wise. I thought it made for a compelling view of him, and his relationships.

[Spy Car]

Oh, wow. That's not how we saw it *at*all*. I'm sort of amazed...

 

The kids and I watched it together. (I had to fastforward through two or three scenes in the whole series.) I thought they showed a man of strength, intellect and principle -- a man who was torn between duty to his country at a pivotal time for the whole world, and his love for his family and his small farm. A man with a rather gruff exterior, not openly affectionate or emotional...

 

There were times when I didn't like him much. I liked him best when he was balanced by the even temper and loving kindness of his wife. (Also not an outwardly emotional or affectionate person.)

 

But what I came away with was his love for truth, for justice, for the law... For what he believed to be right. For his country...

 

No, I wouldn't want to be married to him. ;)

 

But I felt great respect for the character as portrayed in the movie -- and I didn't think it was far off from the way McCullough and Adams' own letters portray him. Great virtues, great flaws...

 

And my children are now some of the biggest John Adams fans ever. DD tells me she's voting for him in the upcoming election. I told her there was some problems with this plan, but that doesn't seem to distress her much...

 

BTW, dh didn't watch the series with us. He found it boring. I will definitely agree that it's grim and rather slow.

 

 

:iagree: I'm late to the party on this one but we are watching DVDs from the library (which just got them).

 

I'm amazed (and completely engrossed) by this series. While I'm only through episode 5 (where Adams is sworn-in as Vice President) I love that a "real person" emerges in the portrayal (warts and all).

 

The series also brings to life those critical days of or nations founding in a very entertaining and intelligent fashion. And gives fine glimpses into the personalities of Washington, Jefferson and Franklin.

 

I think this is a marvelous production!!!

 

Bill

[Lux Et Veritas Academy]

Call me the black sheep- but that was one of my favorite series ever! I cried several times. I don't know if it is because I live near JA's home or if because I had just gone to PHL or what. But I loved it! My kids loved it! It brought it alive!

[Ria]

We just started watching it. We loved Disc 1 and can't wait to see more!

 

Ria

[Tammyla]

Another fan here, but I did groan a bit when the next disc kept arriving from Netflix.

 

Jo, it wasn't nearly as bleak as say...Bleak House.:001_huh:

[Annie Laurie]

Oh, wow. That's not how we saw it *at*all*. I'm sort of amazed...

 

The kids and I watched it together. (I had to fastforward through two or three scenes in the whole series.) I thought they showed a man of strength, intellect and principle -- a man who was torn between duty to his country at a pivotal time for the whole world, and his love for his family and his small farm. A man with a rather gruff exterior, not openly affectionate or emotional...

 

There were times when I didn't like him much. I liked him best when he was balanced by the even temper and loving kindness of his wife. (Also not an outwardly emotional or affectionate person.)

 

But what I came away with was his love for truth, for justice, for the law... For what he believed to be right. For his country...

 

No, I wouldn't want to be married to him. ;)

 

But I felt great respect for the character as portrayed in the movie -- and I didn't think it was far off from the way McCullough and Adams' own letters portray him. Great virtues, great flaws...

 

And my children are now some of the biggest John Adams fans ever. DD tells me she's voting for him in the upcoming election. I told her there was some problems with this plan, but that doesn't seem to distress her much...

 

BTW, dh didn't watch the series with us. He found it boring. I will definitely agree that it's grim and rather slow.

 

Ditto. Except that my dh liked it too and I didn't find it to be grim and slow.

[abbeyej]

Ditto. Except that my dh liked it too and I didn't find it to be grim and slow.

 

Oh, I think it's indisputably "grim". :) It was a rather grim time in a lot of ways -- hopeful too, but anything that includes that much war (even if Adams himself isn't actually doing the fighting), and mobs out tarring and feathering people and small-pox epidemics... Well, surely that counts as a bit "grim". :) I just thought that where it was grim, it was appropriate.

 

And I *do* think it was slow. Not in a bad way. Sometimes when we say a movie is "slow", it really is a criticism. It means nothing happened and there was no progress, and why on earth did I let it have those hours of my life. That's certainly not what I meant here. But it isn't a fast-paced action movie. It's thoughtful and takes its time to let the story and character unfold. I'm very glad it did! But it's still not a rollicking ride through history. ;)

[Legomom]

We are watching and enjoying here. We just finished watching the swearing in of George Washington as president.

[Beth in SW WA]

We are watching and enjoying here. We just finished watching the swearing in of George Washington as president.

 

Beautiful scene! He looks so uncomfortable in those teeth!

[threeturn]

Another vote in support of John Adams (the mini-series). We loved it here and couldn't wait for the next disc to arrive in the mail.

[tibbyl]

My partner gave the series a high rating.

[KidsHappen]

Watched again and then lent it to my brother who liked it so much that he lent it to my other brother. It has yet to make a return engagement at our house but there is a que waiting for it when it shows up.

[Bev in B'ville]

My kids and I watched it and while my dc didn't like it as much as I did, they still enjoyed it. I thought it was very well done!

[Annie Laurie]

Oh, I think it's indisputably "grim". :) It was a rather grim time in a lot of ways -- hopeful too, but anything that includes that much war (even if Adams himself isn't actually doing the fighting), and mobs out tarring and feathering people and small-pox epidemics... Well, surely that counts as a bit "grim". :) I just thought that where it was grim, it was appropriate.

 

And I *do* think it was slow. Not in a bad way. Sometimes when we say a movie is "slow", it really is a criticism. It means nothing happened and there was no progress, and why on earth did I let it have those hours of my life. That's certainly not what I meant here. But it isn't a fast-paced action movie. It's thoughtful and takes its time to let the story and character unfold. I'm very glad it did! But it's still not a rollicking ride through history. ;)

 

Right, it definitely wasn't cheerful subject matter. I didn't come away from it feeling like it was grim because there was an overriding message of hope and courage during very difficult times. The determination and faith of these people was engrossing and the series was exciting to me, even with it not being an action movie. ;)

 

Just the way I saw it, I wasn't challenging your impression of the series, just sharing one opinion among many. :001_smile:

[abbeyej]

Just the way I saw it, I wasn't challenging your impression of the series, just sharing one opinion among many. :001_smile:

 

Yeah, lol, I really didn't mean to *argue* either. ;) Just chatting. :)

[FloridaLisa]

Loved, loved, loved the book. We have so little time to watch tv/series/movies that I'll probably not get to it. And that may be a good thing given the mixed reviews I always hear on it. Though I've never heard mixed reviews on the book.

 

Lisa

[abbeyej]

Loved, loved, loved the book. We have so little time to watch tv/series/movies that I'll probably not get to it. And that may be a good thing given the mixed reviews I always hear on it. Though I've never heard mixed reviews on the book.

 

Lisa

 

Well, it takes more commitment to read the book. ;) So the people who read it really *wanted* to, you know? :) McCullough was heavily involved in the making of the tv series, and I felt it did a great job of closely following the book (though obviously it's a very different media and couldn't do everything just as the book did).

[Margaret in GA]

I thought it was really good. Joyful? No. But, good. And ...Thomas Jefferson! He was totally everything I wanted him to be and more. I thought it was a well made series.

Edited November 10, 2008 by Margaret in GA

[Nestof3]

I just started this today, and it is amazing, in my opinion. I admit I am pretty ignorant about John Adams, but this movie is making me want to read more about him and also about his marriage. Abigail Adams seems to be one smart cookie. I really like the actress who plays her (though I have seen her in a sleazy film a long time ago), and the man playing John Adams is doing a fantastic job.

[whitestavern]

DH and I enjoyed the series very much and thought Paul Giametti did an incredible job.

[Kanga]

I loved the book, which is why I think I was so disappointed with the series. I realize that they couldn't put everything in the series, but it did seem that they left some of John Adam's more endearing qualities on the cutting room floor.

 

Sad, but true story: I became so absorbed in the book that I actually cried when Abigail died. At the time, we were between homes camping out in a Navy Lodge and homeschooling from a box. My dh walked into our room and found me crying and assumed it was because of our living situation and said, "oh, don't worry hun, I am sure we will find a house soon". Between sobs I told him that I was crying because Abigail died. It took him a second to register what I said, then he got a twinkle in his eye and said, " I hate to have to tell you this, but I feel I should warn you...John's going to die too".

[KidsHappen]

I loved the book, which is why I think I was so disappointed with the series. I realize that they couldn't put everything in the series, but it did seem that they left some of John Adam's more endearing qualities on the cutting room floor.

 

Sad, but true story: I became so absorbed in the book that I actually cried when Abigail died. At the time, we were between homes camping out in a Navy Lodge and homeschooling from a box. My dh walked into our room and found me crying and assumed it was because of our living situation and said, "oh, don't worry hun, I am sure we will find a house soon". Between sobs I told him that I was crying because Abigail died. It took him a second to register what I said, then he got a twinkle in his eye and said, " I hate to have to tell you this, but I feel I should warn you...John's going to die too".

 

Sounds like your hubby has a wonderful sense of humor. :tongue_smilie:

[Kay in Cal]

I really enjoyed it as well. I've read a lot about Adams too, and I think Giamati did an amazing job portraying the truculent, abrasive person that he was. I thought parts of it were too violent for my kids, but I liked it!

[sleepy]

Loved the book and the HBO series. I think Paul Giamatti is amazing as John Adams. I never thought I would be able to stop thinking of him as "Pig Vomit" from the Howard Stern movie :lol: but he blew me away!

[skaterbabs]

A very close friend of our family is a research historian who worked on "Rome." I *think* she was involved with the JA series as well, but it's been a while since we talked about it.

 

 

According to her, the JA series is about as historically accurate as is possible to get, but the biggest mistake was that it was apparently TOO historically accurate. They portrayed him as being the (for lack of a gentler term) major jerk that he actually was. He was a great man, and brilliant man, and an important man - but he was never a NICE man. This of course made it impossible for the filmmakers to make you care about him as a character because he was never a likable person. :glare:

[Peri]

I rather enjoyed the series. I could not wait until sunday to catch it after the kids were asleep. I do wish that they would continue and not stop. I try not to look at it in a realistic portrayal and instead I look at it as just someone's idea of the time.

[Peri]

We loved it! I respectfully disagree w/ your impressions of the series. Was it difficult to watch at times due to the realism? Sure! But the reality of history is not pretty. I don't want candy-coated Hollywood history.

 

My older kids were glued to the tv and have a new interest in American history due to John Adams.

 

I highly recommend the book AND the mini-series. :thumbup1:

 

I agree and it has also roused an interest in american history for me too.

[Margaret in GA]

I enjoyed the series. While this was a very realistic approach that portrays these forefathers as very *human*, I can still hold these men in high esteem. They were great, no doubt about it.

 

My favorite character was Thomas Jefferson. The actor was fantastic.

 

Margaret

BTW I also *loved* Rome, so take this with a grain of salt ;)

[abbeyej]

BTW I also *loved* Rome, so take this with a grain of salt ;)

 

Ooh, is *that* my problem?!? I loved them both too. But I only watched John Adams with the kids. (Not sure I'd watch Rome with anyone under 25, lol...)