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Official Beast Academy guinea pigs thread!


Rivka

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After looking through Beast Academy 3A & 3B, I'd say this would not be a core spine, even for a particularly (but not exceptionally) mathy child. Almost right away, many of the concepts require a good understanding of elementary math fundamentals that can be found in a traditional math sequence, but not in BA. I can see why AoPS chose to introduce the third-grade sequence first; concepts like smallest weight possible given two weights require a level of abstract thinking that most children will not be able to meet in first and second grade without good coaching. BA 3A&B are truly intended as an in-depth exploration for children already familiar with elementary math (before exponents).

 

I may get shouted down by the others on the Hive, but I see BA as filling a niche within the math schooling community but not becoming core curriculum. Children using BA3 will already understand basic operations gleaned elsewhere and enjoy the play aspect of BA. In my view, BA3 is intended as a depth curriculum. If your child has mastered third-grade level arithmetic, you should add BA to increase understanding of math concepts.

 

I'm certainly not going to shout you down, and actually, I don't even know if I disagree. The tricky part about understanding how BA fits into a math sequence is that we're starting in media res, halfway through the elementary math years. Yes, they assume quite a bit of math knowledge. Is that because BA isn't meant to stand alone at a given level, or because kids, especially AoPS-bound kids, do have quite a bit of math knowledge by the time they reach third grade? It will be very interesting to see - hopefully in time for my 3yo - where they end up going with the second grade program.

 

Right now the Hive is taking an anarchic Wild West kind of approach to BA. Some people are backing up fourth- or even fifth-grade-level students, and at least one person has jumped her child straight from Singapore 1A to BA 3A. Some new BA users are accelerated and some are on age-level. Some people are using it as a fun supplement and some as a primary curriculum, and of course we all came to it from different curricula which prepared our children differently.

 

Lots of approaches are being tried. I think it will take a few years before it all shakes out, and we are able to develop some kind of consensus opinion about who it suits and how it prepares kids to advance.

 

I look through the books, and my head spins. At the same time it seems so very much and so possibly not enough. I guess I do wonder how thoroughly it lays the essential foundations. We're not the people to test that - the big foundational concept in 3A-B is multiplication, and we already did that thoroughly in MEP 2B. I will be very, very interested to hear from people whose children will see multiplication for the first time, or essentially the first time, in Beast Academy. Very interested. I think of it as a test case. :D

 

I do have questions about how much of it will stick, and about how much of it is building a framework of tools and understandings which will be used later (e.g., in algebra) vs. being neat but inessential and self-contained concepts to play with. I don't know how to answer that question. We don't have a testing requirement in our state (and even if we did, it would presumably mean testing at grade level and not at curricular level), so I feel as if we're playing without a net. With MEP it was so clear to me that they were systematically building the tools for algebra. With BA, I don't think I'll know yet for a while.

 

I was careful in my review to only talk about BA 3A&B and a generally mathy child. I could see a profoundly-gifted math child working through BA without need for a core, but a profoundly gifted child is very uncommon. For parents wishing to rush out and purchase Beast Academy as a core spine, I wanted to sound a note of caution. I love the BA books and I'm over the moon about them, but I don't think, as currently printed, they replace a core spine.

 

How do you think the need for a core would make itself evident? This is a serious question. I am fairly certain that Alex is not profoundly gifted :D, although she is certainly math-accelerated and quite bright.

 

My thoughts.... Judging only by topics that BA covered in 3A and 3B, I don't see a need for another core program to cover those topics. Do you really need to cover area/parameter, multiplication, angles with another core program? I think it's more than enough. My guess is eventually their 2nd grade program with cover all the addition, subtraction and place value work thoroughly and with plenty of practice.

 

I look at those sections and I also agree that they seem to be thoroughly covered. I don't know for sure, and I suspect that none of us can know at this point.

 

My biggest concern about BA 3A-B is that there just isn't enough of it. We did rocket off at a tremendous pace that is unlikely to be sustained (math twice a day, math on weekends, BA guide hidden under the pillow at night), but even if we hadn't I question how one is supposed to make one book last a whole quarter. With 100 pages in the practice book, assuming a 9-week quarter and various non-problem pages, we'd have to limit ourselves to two pages a day. Unless we're meant to be spending a lot less time on math than we're used to, we'd have a hard time sticking to that.

 

We were going to run out of books before they had more anyway, because of the speed of production, but even if that weren't the case I worry that it's just too slim to be a whole year of math.

 

So we will likely continue to work in MEP in the interstices, not because I am certain that it's necessary, but just because we'll need to fill up the space.

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My thoughts.... Judging only by topics that BA covered in 3A and 3B, I don't see a need for another core program to cover those topics. Do you really need to cover area/parameter, multiplication, angles with another core program?

 

No. We won't. BA will be enough geometry for dd7 for now.

 

I think it's more than enough. My guess is eventually their 2nd grade program with cover all the addition, subtraction and place value work thoroughly and with plenty of practice.

However, I think mix and matching different programs is a good thing, not because they aren't "enough" as standalone programs, but because different styles of instruction have an added benefit of "different vision".

 

That has always been my routine. Keeps math interesting.

That's why we aren't going to completely dump SM. While we won't redo work on chapters like area/parameter with SM,

 

Dd7 will skip SM3B for that reason.

 

We will probably press on with CWP and IPs because they are different and enrich learning.

:iagree:

 

Beast is a kick -- and will be a delightful supplement. My dds are thoroughly enjoying the books.

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In MEP...Things are mixed up together. It may be about addition, but there are problems about money, for example.

 

I actually prefer it that way. It lets the student see that the arithmetic they are learning has practical applications (in money transactions or measurements, for instance).

 

I hope no one minds this slight hijack about MEP, but I just want to say that MEP has succeeded in implementing a solid program in spiral format where programs like Everyday Math and TERC Investigations appear to have failed.

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I guess I do wonder how thoroughly it lays the essential foundations. We're not the people to test that - the big foundational concept in 3A-B is multiplication, and we already did that thoroughly in MEP 2B. I will be very, very interested to hear from people whose children will see multiplication for the first time, or essentially the first time, in Beast Academy. Very interested. I think of it as a test case. :D

 

My biggest concern about BA 3A-B is that there just isn't enough of it. We did rocket off at a tremendous pace that is unlikely to be sustained (math twice a day, math on weekends, BA guide hidden under the pillow at night), but even if we hadn't I question how one is supposed to make one book last a whole quarter. With 100 pages in the practice book, assuming a 9-week quarter and various non-problem pages, we'd have to limit ourselves to two pages a day. Unless we're meant to be spending a lot less time on math than we're used to, we'd have a hard time sticking to that.

 

We were going to run out of books before they had more anyway, because of the speed of production, but even if that weren't the case I worry that it's just too slim to be a whole year of math.

 

Well, we can be a test case for multiplication. Ds has figured it out on his own, but his first formal presentation of the material will be BA.

 

I agree we will run out of material before the next book. We typically do a couple of pages in a sitting and the format is so engaging for kids they just want to keep going.

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Beast should be here today!! I'm pretty certain we will keep Singapore as our spine and use BA for a fun, "depth" supplement. I already added it to my signature so it's official...lol!

 

:blink: ahhhh!! My BA arrived without the practice books! Emailed them right away to find out why!

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After looking through Beast Academy 3A & 3B, I'd say this would not be a core spine, even for a particularly (but not exceptionally) mathy child. Almost right away, many of the concepts require a good understanding of elementary math fundamentals that can be found in a traditional math sequence, but not in BA. I can see why AoPS chose to introduce the third-grade sequence first; concepts like smallest weight possible given two weights require a level of abstract thinking that most children will not be able to meet in first and second grade without good coaching. BA 3A&B are truly intended as an in-depth exploration for children already familiar with elementary math (before exponents).

 

I may get shouted down by the others on the Hive, but I see BA as filling a niche within the math schooling community but not becoming core curriculum. Children using BA3 will already understand basic operations gleaned elsewhere and enjoy the play aspect of BA. In my view, BA3 is intended as a depth curriculum. If your child has mastered third-grade level arithmetic, you should add BA to increase understanding of math concepts.

 

[snip]

 

I highly recommend BA3A & 3B as supplements, but not as the core spine.

 

:iagree:I don't think we'll use it as a spine at all. But as a playful, thought-provoking supplement, it's a good pick for a child who has mastered the mechanics for that level.

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We spent part of yesterday afternoon drawing different types of triangles on the sidewalk with chalk. We had to run some errands today. While at the bus stop, dd was pointing out obtuse angles on houses. :) While on the bus she was reading the book. I took this pic because she was laughing so hard.

post-12282-13535086447416_thumb.jpg

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We finished lesson one today. DS begged to do another; BA is definitely a hit here! The beauty of the graphic novel presentation was made clear as DS read the lesson on three different occasions this week, with no complaints.

 

I'm planning to use it as a supplement to Saxon, and if we move through it more quickly than the new books are released I'll fill in with LOF in between.

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We spent part of yesterday afternoon drawing different types of triangles on the sidewalk with chalk. We had to run some errands today. While at the bus stop, dd was pointing out obtuse angles on houses. :)

 

Yes, at dinner tonight Alex kept making triangles with two edges of her napkin and a fork handle. "Mom, do you think this is scalene, or isosceles? ...How about this one?"

 

Every chance she gets, she holes up with the guide and reads it. She's going to have that thing memorized by the time we finish. And then she'll probably still steal it. :D This is what I wanted. A child who loved math as much as she was good at it.

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This is what I wanted. A child who loved math as much as she was good at it.

 

:iagree:emphatically!

 

This is why I am going backward with DS9 and I just do not give a hoot! Who cares if you are academically ready for prealgebra in the 4th grade if you have come to dislike math? Really. Who cares!? What good will it do him?

 

I've lost so much sleep over this. DS9 is a math natural. He is so incredibly intuitive and just plain amazing at it. But he doesn't like it anymore, despite my many attempts to help his enjoyment match his potential in the subject (and, again, enjoyment here is measured not in terms of fun but of challenge!). If we forge ahead despite lack of enjoyment, I strongly believe we'll end up in a place where he will be ruling out career options because of the course load path to certain degrees. I can picture him saying no to veterinary school, engineering, architecture, or ________ because of a dislike for math.

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We ordered it today. I am kind of relieved to hear it described as possibly not enough for a core because I was going to use it alongside the MUS because my girls like it and retain it and then let BA show them what to do with the tools.

 

I went for priority shipping. :D

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I will plug Marilyn Burns's Brown Paper School books again -- "Math for Smarty Pants" and "I Hate Math! Book." (That's two books.) They're both good and fun and very mathy, and I have very fond memories of reading them when I was a kid. I'd put Math for Smarty Pants on my son's dresser but he hadn't paid attention to it. I told him I loved it when I was a kid, and helooked more interested. He fell asleep reading it last night. He's also learned a lot from The Number Devil.

 

(In case my recommendation isn't sufficient, Jason Batterman of Beast Academy told me he and a lot of other AoPS people liked them too.)

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I will plug Marilyn Burns's Brown Paper School books again -- "Math for Smarty Pants" and "I Hate Math! Book." (That's two books.) They're both good and fun and very mathy, and I have very fond memories of reading them when I was a kid. I'd put Math for Smarty Pants on my son's dresser but he hadn't paid attention to it. I told him I loved it when I was a kid, and helooked more interested. He fell asleep reading it last night. He's also learned a lot from The Number Devil.

 

(In case my recommendation isn't sufficient, Jason Batterman of Beast Academy told me he and a lot of other AoPS people liked them too.)

 

Thank you for mentioning these Stripe. I know neither one but your recommendations have always been enough for me.

 

Bill

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We ordered it today. I am kind of relieved to hear it described as possibly not enough for a core because I was going to use it alongside the MUS because my girls like it and retain it and then let BA show them what to do with the tools.

 

I went for priority shipping. :D

 

I caved and placed the order Thursday morning with priority shipping. It arrived today :)

My son has skimmed the guides. I don't know that he'll do anything from the workbook without being pushed, but I foresee the guides being read quite a bit :)

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Thank you for mentioning these Stripe. I know neither one but your recommendations have always been enough for me.

 

Bill

 

Aw, thanks.

 

Btw Jason at BA recommended Burns' books. I didn't discuss Number Devil with him, so I didn't mean to imply that, and I realize I may have.

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Well I started DD in BA3b and I am glad I did. (Though I am pretty sure now that I will backtrack and get 3a since it is THAT good).

 

3b is just about perfect for her challenge level. What I mean by this is she got about halfway through the books and discovered that in order to complete the guide and understand it she really must do the practice problems. At first I would ask her to do a page or two of practice problems and then we'd read the guide. She was pretty much hanging in there but she's at this point when she really needs a little practice mutliplying large numbers.

 

Anyhow I didn't have to convince her of this, she understood right away that if she wants to know what her little friends are talking about then she needs to go do the practice pages. So yay for that.

 

I was not planning on making the switch over completely but now that I have that little puppy in my hands I am a convert. "poop, poop, the only way to travel. Here today and in next week..tomorrow" Must have that grogg t shirt and plushie! <zombie voice> "Beeeaaaaast Academmmmmy..."

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Back to BA, I had expressed in one of the pre-release threads a slight amount of skepticism (if that's the right word) about "skip counting" given we'd introduced multiplication. For any doubts prior, I must say we are enjoying this chapter and it is working a skill I may have given short-shrift.

 

Bill

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Back to BA, I had expressed in one of the pre-release threads a slight amount of skepticism (if that's the right word) about "skip counting" given we'd introduced multiplication. For any doubts prior, I must say we are enjoying this chapter and it is working a skill I may have given short-shrift.

 

Bill

 

Looking ahead, I think it will be good for my DS also, even though he already does multi-digit multiplication and long division. He still sometimes has to think on a few facts, and that section will probably work it enough to really get those facts solid. :)

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Mine has been sitting here for a while now. We're going backwards and sideways and forwards in our math now, and I really need dd to be more comfy with her math facts and not freeze up when she doesn't remember one before we crack open BA. Hopefully we'll start it next year like I originally planned.

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:party: I got mine yesterday!

 

Took my time reading through 3A with a coffee - Impressed! Then I clear contacted it :D DD hasn't had a good look at it yet, but she saw it over my shoulder and said 'hey, I saw that on the computer!' - from when I had showed her the facebook samples :lol: Now that the 3A guide is contacted she can have a look, but I don't know yet when we'll actually start it. I'd really like to finish out some more of Miquon first, so we may leave it until July...

 

I'm intrigued with the pages in the practice book being perforated, I'm thinking of laminating them and putting them in a folder. The idea being I don't have to pay $50 postage for each of my younger children to work the problems when they get there...

 

ETA - DD just woke up and came and asked me for her new school book! She's sitting on the couch reading through it now!

 

ETA again - The creatures are adorable! I loved the octopug - wish his picture was bigger! I think I need an octopug coffee mug! *starts rambling about scanning picture to get mug made*

Edited by LMD
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Back to BA, I had expressed in one of the pre-release threads a slight amount of skepticism (if that's the right word) about "skip counting" given we'd introduced multiplication. For any doubts prior, I must say we are enjoying this chapter and it is working a skill I may have given short-shrift.

 

We got to the skip counting chapter at the end of last week, and Alex had the exact same reaction William did. "Okay, the flower petals are all 9's, so I can count by 10's and then subtract 1 for each."

 

"That's a great method, but here you're supposed to be skip counting by 9's."

 

"Well... look. Each of these pots is 36, and then I can just add 27."

 

"Yes, but you're supposed to be skip counting by 9's."

 

"And here, each of these is 15, so I can group them and count by 30's."

 

I wound up chasing her around the house shrieking "No grouping! No grouping! Don't you dare group!," as she ran off with the practice book and cackled with glee.

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We got to the skip counting chapter at the end of last week, and Alex had the exact same reaction William did. "Okay, the flower petals are all 9's, so I can count by 10's and then subtract 1 for each."

 

"That's a great method, but here you're supposed to be skip counting by 9's."

 

"Well... look. Each of these pots is 36, and then I can just add 27."

 

"Yes, but you're supposed to be skip counting by 9's."

 

"And here, each of these is 15, so I can group them and count by 30's."

 

I wound up chasing her around the house shrieking "No grouping! No grouping! Don't you dare group!," as she ran off with the practice book and cackled with glee.

 

One day, perhaps, we can play "matchmakers." These two deserve each other :D

 

Bill

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Were we the only ones frustrated with Practice Book 3A, #41 on page 15? (Chapter 1, Quadrilaterals)

 

We got the other three problems (connecting four points to make quadrilaterals), but couldn't figure out how to connect only four of the points to make a rectangle. (We immediately saw an answer that included a fifth dot, but I kept saying that it couldn't be that because that would include five dots, not four. Apparently, that wasn't a issue for the authors? Am I being too legalistic?)

 

 

Now that we've finished this section, I can say that neither my son nor I made this assumption. I didn't say anything about it to him and it never was an issue. Interesting.

 

What was interesting to me was the order in which he found the shapes!

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Our package #2 came yesterday after the USPS managed to lose the contents of package #1. My 4 kids have fought over who gets to read it ever since. They've read it alone, read it to each other, read it at bedtime, read it this morning first thing, read it tonight at bedtime, and are loving it. I'm delighted! Now to slow them down enough to have them working the problems. I see a few answers written down. But I can see that I'll have to be requiring a certain amount of pages done each day instead of allowing them to keep reading!

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I can see that I'll have to be requiring a certain amount of pages done each day instead of allowing them to keep reading!

 

Yes, I told my son not to read ahead. He needs to do the practice problems first, THEN he can read the next section (and go back and read anything he's already read). We do that with LoF too.

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Well I laminated the practice pages and put them in a 4 ring binder with plenty of reinforced loose leaf paper. DD is excited to get started.

 

Last night DD & I were discussing it and I floated the notion of holding off for a little while because it might be too hard for her, oh the withering look she gave me! She said "mama, I'm not a baby, of course it's not too hard!" mmhmm, little miss 6y/o full of attitude!

 

So we'll start, but go slow! I think we'll alternate 1 or 2 lessons of BA a week, 1 or 2 of Miquon, and 2 or 3 of Singapore... That should keep her busy!

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Please tell me my child is not the only one going around doing "splits" with their legs while saying: "I'm acute," or "I'm right," or (in a particularly unintelligent souring voice) I'm obtuse!

No, mine is giving lectures about the types of triangles to his younger sister, who has informed him that she already knows. Mine also has been arranging food in various angles.

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Please tell me my child is not the only one going around doing "splits" with their legs while saying: "I'm acute," or "I'm right," or (in a particularly unintelligent souring voice) I'm obtuse! :D

 

Bill

 

Yes. This also works with forks and knives, and is particularly fun when one's younger sibllings join in while waiting for the meal to arrive in a slow, quiet and not-entirely-kid-friendly restaurant.

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So what are folks plans for things to do while we wait. "What to expect when your expecting... the release of Beast Academy 3C?"

 

Ideas, suggestions...

 

Just thinking ahead.

 

 

We'll be doing Primary Grade Challenge Math and CWP 3. I also have Singapore texbooks up to 4B, so we might do those. And I'm considering buying Math Mammoth Blue books if I find skills that need more work when we come across them in BA. Oh, and maybe Khan Academy. And iPod/iPad math/logic games. And math journaling. OK, I think that's all!

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Because I've been following this thread, I made sure we were stocked up on toothpicks. However, after her first look at the books, DD raided the bathroom cabinet and spelled out the alphabet in Q-tips, all over her desk. Capitals and lowercase. Oh well, I guess I didn't need all of those Q-tips....

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So what are folks plans for things to do while we wait. "What to expect when your expecting... the release of Beast Academy 3C?"

 

Ideas, suggestions...

 

Just thinking ahead.

 

We're doing Singapore 4B 3 days a week and Beast Academy 2 days a week, plus LoF Fractions when we feel like it. So I think we should be ok getting there. We're still finishing up the quadrilaterals section (he had a tough time finding all those squares, rectangles, and rhombuses, and he basically gave up on the challenge problems, though he found quite a few, including some of the harder-to-find-ones... just not ALL of them).

 

I haven't calculated how long it would likely take us if we did BA everyday, but it's definitely longer than it will take to go through Singapore (we're easily doing 2 lessons a day in 4B, and then I add in a page or two of 4A IP so math isn't taking 15-20 minutes :tongue_smilie:).

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We're still finishing up the quadrilaterals section (he had a tough time finding all those squares, rectangles, and rhombuses, and he basically gave up on the challenge problems, though he found quite a few, including some of the harder-to-find-ones... just not ALL of them).

 

That was the hardest section for Alex, so far. Well, that and making crazy complicated shapes with tetrominoes, but we split that up over a few days, interspersed with a lot of fun toothpick puzzles, so it went pretty smoothly. We're sailing happily through the skip counting section now. I liked the activity with marking up 100s charts to see the patterns, and I especially liked the questions where you started from the pattern and tried to reason back to what the skip-counting number must be.

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I printed off MEP y 3 b when I meant to print the last section of 3a. I am rather torn. He's just finishing 3a, and there's a lot of repetition in 3b of things he already knows.

 

My daughter is mad she has no Beast Academy. MEP is moving a bit slow for her tastes, so we're supplementing with Russian Math for a change. However, I think I may wander back to the School Mathematics Study Group books. I used parts of y 3 between y 2 and y 3 of MEP with my son and it worked rather well. He loved all the graphing.

 

My son had a comment about the Guide, that it's not very effective to have a big stop sign to go solve a problem when you can clearly see on the lower half of the page what the answer is. He has a point.

Edited by stripe
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We are also trying to move somewhat slowly through BA. DS is just finishing up the last section with the Polyominoes and Polyiamonds. He has 2 practice pages left that go with that chapter and then we will move on to the Skip Counting chapter by the end of the week.

I am hoping that 3C will release in plenty of time for us. He is still working through Singapore and Life of Fred as well as BA, so there's plenty to keep him occupied. He also does Math Whizz and Khan Academy during the week!

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That was the hardest section for Alex, so far. Well, that and making crazy complicated shapes with tetrominoes, but we split that up over a few days, interspersed with a lot of fun toothpick puzzles, so it went pretty smoothly. We're sailing happily through the skip counting section now. I liked the activity with marking up 100s charts to see the patterns, and I especially liked the questions where you started from the pattern and tried to reason back to what the skip-counting number must be.

 

Yes, reading ahead in the guide, DS asked me to print out a 100 chart from the website so he could mark it up. He had so much fun! This isn't the first time he's done that either... :tongue_smilie:

 

Who knew that THAT was how I could get the boy to actually color? :lol:

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OK, tip for the tetrominoes exercises. Instead of trying to solve them freestyle, I traced the goal configuration on a piece of paper (true to size) and then my son worked by placing the pieces on top. It made it way, way more obvious what to do, for some reason. If anyone needs a photo, here it is:

 

BAtetrominoes.jpg

(As you see, my son assigned problem 74 an extra star.)

Edited by stripe
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OK, tip for the tetrominoes exercises. Instead of trying to solve them freestyle, I traced the goal configuration on a piece of paper (true to size) and then my son worked by placing the pieces on top. It made it way, way more obvious what to do, for some reason. If anyone needs a photo, here it is:

 

BAtetrominoes.jpg

(As you see, my son assigned problem 74 an extra star.)

 

We did the same thing and it worked really well!

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Is there any way to get printables of the triangles shapes on page 14? Ds wants to cut them out and manipulate them around with folding. I went to the BA website, but I didn't see any triangle printables and it looks like their Facebook page is set so that you can't make wall posts. Ideas?

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Is there any way to get printables of the triangles shapes on page 14? Ds wants to cut them out and manipulate them around with folding. I went to the BA website, but I didn't see any triangle printables and it looks like their Facebook page is set so that you can't make wall posts. Ideas?

 

Maybe e-mail them and ask for it? They might be able to whip one up and put it on the site. You never know. :)

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