Nakia Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) I am feeling frustrated by this thread, and so I'm going to post one last time to try and make myself heard. No one is trying to take away parental rights. We are trying to give parents the right to know that their infant is safe! Do you really want to have your baby in a hospital that lets people freely carry infants around the unit and off the unit as they please? If so, then please don't plan to deliver in Asheville, NC. I work at a huge teaching hospital with a diverse population. I had a 12 year old mother last summer and a Wall Street banker this past weekend, and neither were allowed to walk the halls carrying their babies or cosleep. I have taken care of many drug addicts and quite a few physicians and lawyers. It is not a matter of who has the most education or money; it's about the babies. And guess what? Not everyone is going to be honest on admission and admit there is a custodial issue. Heck, lots of time the "dad" in the room isn't even the real dad but just the latest boyfriend. We have a 40 bed postpartum unit and a 60 bed NICU. The nurses do not have time to police the unit. We are too busy providing direct patient care. That's why there are policies, a security system, video cameras, and frequent room to room rounding. That's why only one person (and no children) can spend the night with mom and baby. If you have never worked on a postpartum unit, then you simply do not get it. I have 6-8 patients every night, and my number one priority is keeping that mom and baby safe. I have been a nurse for 15 years (4 on postpartum) and with very exceptions, I have always had a great relationship with my patients, and I always respect their wishes, within reason. I will not risk my patient's safety or my job by letting the dad do as he pleases, or the mom for that matter. If I can't work it out, I get help. Sometimes that's my supervisor, sometimes it's security, sometimes it's the pediatrician. If a mother signs her baby out AMA (the father is not allowed to leave the postpartum unit with the baby, period, unless mom is with him), then CPS will get involved 100% of the time. That's just the way it is. The rules exist because somewhere right now a baby is being stolen from a hospital somewhere in this country. The rules exist because babies die in bed with mom. That's why the rules exist. I know I sound defensive, and I am, I guess. It irks me when people come to a hospital to have their baby and then act like they shouldn't have to abide by the policies that have been put in place for their protection. I absolutely love my job, and I wouldn't want to work anywhere else, even with all its craziness. Holding and caring for a brand new baby is the best feeling in the world. I would never forgive myself if I let someone "get around" the rules and something happened to that baby. Edited February 28, 2012 by Nakia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 How is OK to knock a nurse to the ground? This Douglas Kennedy seems like a self-absorbed jerk with an over inflated ego. How do people like this make a living? :D Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catz Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) I know I sound defensive, and I am, I guess. It irks me when people come to a hospital to have their baby and then act like they shouldn't have to abide by the policies that have been put in place for their protection. I absolutely love my job, and I wouldn't want to work anywhere else, even with all its craziness. Holding and caring for a brand new baby is the best feeling in the world. I would never forgive myself if I let someone "get around" the rules and something happened to that baby. Thank you Nakia. I've never worked in a maternity or NICU, but having been in a large hospital's ward for 5 days (complex c-sections) with each kid gave me enough sympathy. Parents are asked every day not to walk the halls holding their infants, and most are willing to follow security procedures. A nurse came into my room almost crying at one point during my daughter's final day in the hospital. I asked her what was wrong and I got enough info to know there was a baby on the ward that day going home she was extremely worried about. If this were a story about how an angered father stormed out of the hospital with his infant without anyone blinking an eye and disappeared, we'd be having a very different discussion. I really feel RFK felt he should be above the rules. Security procedures are in place for a reason and I feel like if you're using a hospital you can abide by their policies for a few days. Edited February 28, 2012 by kck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catz Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 This Douglas Kennedy seems like a self-absorbed jerk with an over inflated ego. :iagree: That about sums it up IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohdanigirl Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 :svengo: I'm sorry, I couldn't get past this. :blink: Does this mean I'm...*gasp*...OLD???? :scared: :lol: :lol: :lol: No not at all. I am 33 years young and knew exactly who she was talking about. Diane, you'll appreciate this story. When we first moved here we visited a church. After service a young couple came over to talk to us. Then another couple came over--older than the young couple, slightly younger than dh and I. The man reached out and as I shook his hand he said, "I'm Gerald Ford." I paused and said, "Really?!?" He just laughed; that really was his name. The young couple looked bemused. The young wife smiled and said, "Is that someone famous?" :blink: Oy! He was even still alive at the time! :svengo: I am not sure if this is funny, or sad. Yikes. Unfortunately this is not uncommon. I was recently speaking to someone who didn't know who the current Vice President is, or our last President. I thought they were pulling my leg, but they weren't. They also didn't know who Clinton (last name only, so either) is. Danielle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kathymuggle Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) The rules exist because somewhere right now a baby is being stolen from a hospital somewhere in this country. . 5 babies are kidnapped by stranger in hospitals in the USA yearly. Half are from the mothers room. http://www.ispub.com/journal/the-internet-journal-of-healthcare-administration/volume-7-number-1/preventing-the-worst-case-scenario-an-analysis-of-rfid-technology-and-infant-protection-in-hospitals.html It is too many and it is horrible - but it is not a regular occurrence. To me this whole issues begs the questions: should individuals have to give up their rights because a few crackpots exists? Edited February 28, 2012 by kathymuggle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kathymuggle Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 How is OK to knock a nurse to the ground? This Douglas Kennedy seems like a self-absorbed jerk with an over inflated ego. How do people like this make a living? :D Bill I think he inherited most of it….and he does sound like a jerk or was having a very jerky moment…. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Marple Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Stupidity knows no socio-economic boundaries. What an idiot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) That is crazy. Edited February 28, 2012 by LibraryLover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Why are the beds at Cedars-Sinai so small? The birthing rooms are so nice! And these are the "regular" ones, not the "celebrity" versions with hot-tubs and big screen theaters (for those who don't find the miracle of child-birth entertaining enough :tongue_smilie:). But then, when the moment passes you're wished off to sleep in the worlds smallest bed? I saw no rules against 3 people piling-in; who would be crazy enough to endure the discomfort? :D Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alice Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) I hear so many saying "rules are rules" but don't a parent's rights override a company's rules? Like I said earlier they are rules, not laws. yes, they have to tell him to stop. But he doesn't have to listen to them. He has no legal obligation to follow their rules. It is his kid, and he can leave if he wants to. Again, i understand the rules. I do. I even agree with them. But you can't reach out to take someone's kid from them and not expect an instinctual reaction. I'm not saying the nurses were wrong to try to stop him. I'm saying they were wrong to make it a physical interaction by trying to bar the way physically and grab the baby. And again, I agree the rules have a purpose. But I do not give up rights as a parent when I walk into a building. I just don't. Should he have told someone what he was doing? Yes, of course. But legally at the end of the day it is his kid and he can take it where ever the heck he wants to. There is a difference between rules of a company and the laws of the country. I think others asked this but how were the nurses supposed to know he was the father? And if he was the father that he was still not kidnapping the baby. As someone who works in a hospital, I would have no idea if a man walking out a door with a newborn is that baby's father and I'd find it incredibly suspicious and I would try and stop him. At the hospitals I work at and the one where I had my babies, we have the security bands that alarm. Each baby also has a coded ID tag and every single time the baby is brought to and from the mother or father we match the ID tag to the baby. That is partially to ensure that babies aren't "switched" but also for security so someone can't come to the nursery and just say "I'm the Mom or I'm the Dad" and take the baby. It sucks to be suspicious of people. But within my nice suburban middle class practice we've had kids kidnapped by the other parent and we've had kids there is a horrible custody battle going on where parents attempt to lie to us or use us against the other parent. We have a 2 week old newborn in the practice where one parent left the other and is engaged in a horrible custody battle against the other. It happens. Y'all do realize that a parent **does not** have the right to sign a baby (or any child) out AMA? Sometime a hospital will *allow* one to, but one does not have that *right*. Sure, they can investigate. I know CPS can certainly be problematic. However, I still assert it is absolutely ridiculous to involve CPS for all moms and babies who leave AMA. Again, if that is the case, CPS should be parked outside the door of every freestanding birth center or going after every homebirther. Leaving a FSBC 4 hours after a birth (although clients are certainly permitted to stay longer than that if they desire) is not medical neglect. If baby has had an exam, is stable, stable temp, etc. and the parent chooses to leave earlier than the hospital typically discharges patients, how is it dramatically different? Perhaps the family is going to have an exam done by their own pediatrician that day or the next after the initial hospital exams. I have a problem with a blanket policy of leaving early=necessitating a call to CPS. If a baby has been examined, is medically stable, etc. then it is going to be tough to demonstrate medical neglect. If the hospital calls it in to CPS, CPS is obligated to investigate I think, and I imagine in most cases the case would be closed pretty quickly. That isn't to say CPS can't cause problems, but this is why I have an issue with a blanket hospital policy that leaving AMA requires a call to CPS. Give birth and try to run out the door with the baby before he/she has been examined? Maybe. Give birth, have baby examined several times, baby is stable, and parents want to leave earlier than typical? Probably not a case of medical neglect. I guess this is why it is good to know your practitioner in advance, know whether they will agree to an early discharge that is not AMA, or explore alternatives like a FSBC, etc. Says who? I was under the impression that parents have the right to refuse ANY medical treatment for their children, barring court intervention. I can't imagine a hospital going to court because some parents want to leave earlier than the 24hr standard. I guess I'm the first one who mentioned that signing your baby out AMA means CPS will investigate. And I also said I don't agree with that 100%. But you all have to realize that not every parent who signs their baby out AMA is kind and loving and just wants the baby home early. We have drug addicts, prostitutes, homeless people, and the list goes on. Those women have babies too, you know. So for that reason there has to be a blanket policy (at my hospital) that if a parent signs a baby out AMA, CPS will follow up. It's up to CPS to determine if there is, in fact, neglect or abuse. Most of the time, CPS will already be following those cases, but that's only if we know the situation. Most people aren't going to be very forthcoming if they are homeless or a prostitute. Early discharges are a totally different thing from signing out AMA. If a parent wants to leave before 24 hours with a healthy term baby that is eating well, voiding and stooling, there is no reason to suspect neglect or abuse, and mom was not GBS +, then there really isn't any reason a pediatrician wouldn't allow it. It is then not against medical advice (AMA). No problem. Deciding you are going to take your baby out for "fresh air," removing the security tag, and assaulting nurses on the way out the door is neither signing your baby out AMA nor asking for an early discharge. It fits the criteria for infant abduction. Anyone can see that. Perhaps theoretically, but, practically, a hospital or medical practitioner can call the police and/or CPS to stop a parent from leaving the hospital or to pressure (or punish) a parent for not following that hospital's policies (even if the parent has support from another doctor for his/her approach). CPS involvement does not require any court proceedings. And it can be extremely traumatic for the family involved, even when the charges are ultimately dismissed as unfounded. Yes, AMA is very tricky in pediatrics. As a pediatrician the child is my patient. The parent's have rights but we have concerns if we think the parent is causing harm to the child. I wouldn't personally call CPS if a parent desired early discharge (and I don't believe our hospital has that policy). Nor would it be AMA, I sign the orders and document that the parents desired early discharge. I think that's what most doctors would do. The one time I called CPS for a newborn in a similar situation was when a parent was going to leave without a carseat of any kind. It wasn't a cost issue, we were able to provide them with one, they just argued that they didn't want one and it was their right to not have one. They wanted to leave AMA but we could not allow them to take the baby and called CPS. AMA to a doctor or nurse is basically a failure, at least as a pediatrician that's how I see it. It means that communication has broken down. I don't mean that a parent has to agree with everything I say but if it gets to AMA it would mean that somehow we can't come to an agreement at all. That to me would mean that I failed at an important part of my job. Edited February 28, 2012 by Alice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissad2 Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 That all sounds well and good but the reality is, when a parent accidently drops baby or falls, all the sudden the hospital is blamed. Then sued for millions of dollars. That is when the hospital can make their rules and become the kindgom. If people don't like it they can homebirth. :iagree: Just because it was the father doesn't mean he had the mothers permission to leave with baby. What if the father took the baby off the floor and tripped and fell injuring the baby? What if they had a disagreement and he just left with the baby? The hospital I work for...if you are a patient you are not allowed to leave the floor. I, as your nurse, am still responsible for you even if you choose to leave, go downstairs and fall injuring yourself. I cannot let myself lose my license because I let something happen to my patient. If you want to leave you have to sign out "against medical advice" thus releasing me and the hospital of all liability. Just think how those nurse would have been portrayed in the media if they did nothing and something happened to that baby! "Nurses did nothing while father abducts baby" or "Father takes baby for walk, trips, and infant dies of injuries." I have not read all the responses but I think most nurses will agree. We have heard it all and seen it all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissad2 Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 I am feeling frustrated by this thread, and so I'm going to post one last time to try and make myself heard. No one is trying to take away parental rights. We are trying to give parents the right to know that their infant is safe! Do you really want to have your baby in a hospital that lets people freely carry infants around the unit and off the unit as they please? If so, then please don't plan to deliver in Asheville, NC. I work at a huge teaching hospital with a diverse population. I had a 12 year old mother last summer and a Wall Street banker this past weekend, and neither were allowed to walk the halls carrying their babies or cosleep. I have taken care of many drug addicts and quite a few physicians and lawyers. It is not a matter of who has the most education or money; it's about the babies. And guess what? Not everyone is going to be honest on admission and admit there is a custodial issue. Heck, lots of time the "dad" in the room isn't even the real dad but just the latest boyfriend. We have a 40 bed postpartum unit and a 60 bed NICU. The nurses do not have time to police the unit. We are too busy providing direct patient care. That's why there are policies, a security system, video cameras, and frequent room to room rounding. That's why only one person (and no children) can spend the night with mom and baby. If you have never worked on a postpartum unit, then you simply do not get it. I have 6-8 patients every night, and my number one priority is keeping that mom and baby safe. I have been a nurse for 15 years (4 on postpartum) and with very exceptions, I have always had a great relationship with my patients, and I always respect their wishes, within reason. I will not risk my patient's safety or my job by letting the dad do as he pleases, or the mom for that matter. If I can't work it out, I get help. Sometimes that's my supervisor, sometimes it's security, sometimes it's the pediatrician. If a mother signs her baby out AMA (the father is not allowed to leave the postpartum unit with the baby, period, unless mom is with him), then CPS will get involved 100% of the time. That's just the way it is. The rules exist because somewhere right now a baby is being stolen from a hospital somewhere in this country. The rules exist because babies die in bed with mom. That's why the rules exist. I know I sound defensive, and I am, I guess. It irks me when people come to a hospital to have their baby and then act like they shouldn't have to abide by the policies that have been put in place for their protection. I absolutely love my job, and I wouldn't want to work anywhere else, even with all its craziness. Holding and caring for a brand new baby is the best feeling in the world. I would never forgive myself if I let someone "get around" the rules and something happened to that baby. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) Puhleeze. The nurses knew perfectly well who he was and that the baby wasn't being kidnapped. They were on a power trip and he didn't comply. It would never have occurred to me to bypass the hospital's rules, cuz that's just not how I roll. But the nurses' reactions were over the top, IMHO, considering the kid was his, and they knew this well and good. I didn't even think of that. I'm sure there was not a single employee in L& D that day who didn't know that a Kennedy was on board. Anyone can power trip. Such behavior is not limited to the egocentric infamous. Edited February 28, 2012 by LibraryLover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 :iagree:I am not a particular fan of the Kennedys but I would be inclined to side with just about anyone against L&D/Maternity nurses. Why? That's weird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucyStoner Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) How do people like this make a living? :D Bill Douglas Kennedy works for Fox News Being a jerk is a personality trait that can serve you well in that business at times. ;) Edited February 28, 2012 by kijipt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chepyl Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 I didn't even think of that. I'm sure there was not a single employee in L& D that day who didn't know that a Kennedy was on board. Anyone can power trip. Such behavior is not limited to the egocentric infamous. Yes, which probably meant they were being extra vigilant in their job. With a famous person in the ward, they may have expected some crazies to.show up. I would not know who any of the Kennedy's were if I saw them. Maybe they did not know who he was. I am not the kind to recognize stars, or anyone famous for being from a certain family. Star status does.not matter to me. Perhaps they really did not know. Either way, he was breaking a rule and they were trying to protect the baby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 5 babies are kidnapped by stranger in hospitals in the USA yearly. Half are from the mothers room. http://www.ispub.com/journal/the-internet-journal-of-healthcare-administration/volume-7-number-1/preventing-the-worst-case-scenario-an-analysis-of-rfid-technology-and-infant-protection-in-hospitals.html It is too many and it is horrible - but it is not a regular occurrence. To me this whole issues begs the questions: should individuals have to give up their rights because a few crackpots exists? What RIGHTS are we talking about here? People know the policies when they choose to deliver in a hospital. If they don't like it, they should go somewhere else. The have the right to do that. People just love to argue and prove they can do what they want. That's all this is. He felt like he was above the hospital's policies and was angered when he found out he wasn't. I would say if yours was one of the five babies stolen, you would want these "rights" you speak of to be given up. It's a couple of days. Lets get real here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) Yes, which probably meant they were being extra vigilant in their job. With a famous person in the ward, they may have expected some crazies to.show up. I would not know who any of the Kennedy's were if I saw them. Maybe they did not know who he was. I am not the kind to recognize stars, or anyone famous for being from a certain family. Star status does.not matter to me. Perhaps they really did not know. Either way, he was breaking a rule and they were trying to protect the baby. I suppose. But that is a relatively small hospital. It seems over- the -top for the area and situation. I''m not saying he was right, but the statistics of newborn abductions doesn't fit in with the hysteria over it. Ask to see his ID, sure. But in the end, it's his baby. Was he a jerk? Looks like. He has a sense of entitlement that most of us will never experience. Still. Common sense, coupled with FBI profile statistics, shows clearly that a person trying to abduct a baby is not going to be a man sauntering by the front desk in his street clothing, obviously cradling a baby. The miniscule amount (sad as they are) of newborn abductions are done by women...dressed as nurses, hospital workers etc., with the baby often hidden somehow. Big over-reaction by all. Edited February 28, 2012 by LibraryLover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommaduck Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 It boils down to this: If something happens to that baby while outside of the maternity ward, even with dad, the family will sue the hospital. The hospital has to protect it's rear end also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catz Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 It boils down to this: If something happens to that baby while outside of the maternity ward, even with dad, the family will sue the hospital. The hospital has to protect it's rear end also. :iagree: He wanders with the baby into infectious diseases and the baby gets something. He lets a stranger hold and admire the baby who then drops it or takes off. He got mad at his wife and disappears with the infant. These are all crazy, remote scenarios. But unfortunately we live in a litigious society as far as hospitals and medical staff are concerned. I can't imagine being stopped by a nurse and thinking the right solution to kick them to the ground while I'm holding a newborn? Disagreeing with policy, sure? Assaulting someone? Not so much. That is some pretty erratic behavior and I would be alarmed if I saw it in the father of a newborn. I'm starting to think him and his doctor friend were doing shots in a back room somewhere. If I were his wife, I would be beyond mad at him for his behavior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErinE Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Thank you to those of you who have been very supportive of nurses in this thread. I know I speak for all of the nurses on this board that it means a lot. It seems like every time someone on this board (and in life, really) has a bad medical experience, they decide nurses suck. I am not dumb; I know lots of nurses do suck. I have been cared for by a few awful nurses. But the vast majority of nurses are doing the very best they can, and they do care. Both times I gave birth (c-sections), I had fantastic experiences with my nurses. They were concerned about my care in the OR, they checked up on my pain levels in recovery, and they were truly joyful about the babies. The doctors were good, but briskly competent. I will always be grateful I had the care I did. Thanks to all the nurses for what they do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Both times I gave birth (c-sections), I had fantastic experiences with my nurses. They were concerned about my care in the OR, they checked up on my pain levels in recovery, and they were truly joyful about the babies. The doctors were good, but briskly competent. I will always be grateful I had the care I did. Thanks to all the nurses for what they do! Nurses have a tough job. The stories my nurse friends tell are quite interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 I just read the whole story a couple of places. I don't buy the 'baby's head bobbing violently' quote. But that doesn't mean I don't think the guy was being a jerk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kathymuggle Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) What RIGHTS are we talking about here? People know the policies when they choose to deliver in a hospital. If they don't like it, they should go somewhere else. The have the right to do that. People just love to argue and prove they can do what they want. That's all this is. He felt like he was above the hospital's policies and was angered when he found out he wasn't. I would say if yours was one of the five babies stolen, you would want these "rights" you speak of to be given up. It's a couple of days. Lets get real here. Where else are they supposed to go if all hospitals have the same policy? Sometimes you just can't "go elsewhere." I have no idea if he felt like he was above hospital policy (because he is a Kennedy) or if he felt the hospital policy was wrong. I am questioning the policy - and I am no Kennedy! Since when is the act of questioning a policy automatcally equated to "thinking you are above hospital policy?" Questioning things is how we assert our rights and improve things for ourselves and others. To be clear: I think everyone has the right to question a policy they think is intrusive or unfair, and I can see why a mother or father would question a policy that said they were not allowed to walk around with their own medically stable baby. I think RFK responded to a rule he did not like in a totally inappropriate way. There are proper channels one can go through to lodge a complaint or concern - running away from a nurse is not one of them :glare: Edited February 28, 2012 by kathymuggle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Where else are they supposed to go if all hospitals have the same policy? Sometimes you just can't "go elsewhere." I have no idea if he felt like he was above hospital policy (because he is a kennedy) or if he felt the hospital policy was wrong. I am questioning the policy - and I am no Kennedy! Since when is the act of questioning a policy automatcally equated to "thinking you are above hospital policy?" questioning things is how we assert our rights and improve things for ourselves and others. To be clear: I think everyone has the right to question a policy they think is intrusive or unfair, and I can see why a mother or father would question a policy that said they were not allowed to walk around with their own medically stable baby. I think RFK responded to a rule he did not like in a totally inappropriate way. There are proper channels one can go through to lodge a complaint or concern - running away from a nurse is not one of them :glare: If it is the rule EVERYWHERE and there is some common sense behind the rule, I think you just have to accept it. It's there for a reason. It's only a couple of days out of your life and it's such a minor thing. It doesn't hurt anyone. It is there to protect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cin Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 I think the nurses attempting to sue him is absurd. Yes, she was enforcing the standard hospital policy. I understand why the hospital has those policies but I also understand why some families would rather do it differently. He has a seemingly credible witness that says the nurses were the agressors in the altercation. There is a steep price to being named Bush and Kennedy or whatnot and that includes random people trying to scam you. I think it's horse snot too. The Dr. that was with him, who works in the hospital tried to tell the nurses it was OK. On the flip side, it is unusual for a baby to be carried out by a male. And just because you have that name doesn't mean you can randomly break the rules. But he had witnesses telling the nurses to lay off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissad2 Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 I think it's horse snot too. The Dr. that was with him, who works in the hospital tried to tell the nurses it was OK. On the flip side, it is unusual for a baby to be carried out by a male. And just because you have that name doesn't mean you can randomly break the rules. But he had witnesses telling the nurses to lay off. Trust me, doctors are wrong A LOT of times! These nurses may not have even known who this doctor was. There are Dr's in my hospital that I have never met...if by some off chance they come up to see one of our pts I'm asking the other nurses who they are. Just because a Dr tells them it's ok doesn't mean they can do it. Nurses in a hospital don't work for the Dr's we still have to follow hospital policy or risk being fired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Marple Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Trust me, doctors are wrong A LOT of times! These nurses may not have even known who this doctor was. There are Dr's in my hospital that I have never met...if by some off chance they come up to see one of our pts I'm asking the other nurses who they are. Just because a Dr tells them it's ok doesn't mean they can do it. Nurses in a hospital don't work for the Dr's we still have to follow hospital policy or risk being fired. :iagree: The doctor is not in charge! The hospital administrator or patient advocate is the "go to" person if one disagrees with the rules. No doctor can arbitrarily change the rules for anyone. This was a NY hospital if I remember correctly. Can you guess how many doctors they have on staff?!? To assume that all the nurses know all the doctors is naive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirth Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 I think it's horse snot too. The Dr. that was with him, who works in the hospital tried to tell the nurses it was OK. On the flip side, it is unusual for a baby to be carried out by a male. And just because you have that name doesn't mean you can randomly break the rules. But he had witnesses telling the nurses to lay off. How do the nurses know the father has custody, or did not just get into a big fight with Mrs. K and want to run away with the baby? How did they know this baby didn't have smallpox, need to be on O2, or had something ultra contagious? Seriously, I bet those nurses have just about seen it all. Just because a doctor has privileges at a hospital does not mean he may overwrite the hospital's rules. The baby wasn't even his patient. Suppose this was all a big sting to reveal how good security was at the hospital, "We just walked right out the door with a KENNEDY baby!" Actually, I find the doctor's quotes very measured, very careful. Anytime you assault a nurse, you should plan to be unpopular for a considerable while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renthead Mommy Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 I didn't even think of that. I'm sure there was not a single employee in L& D that day who didn't know that a Kennedy was on board. Anyone can power trip. Such behavior is not limited to the egocentric infamous. Even if they knew perfectly well how he was, if he go through a door, with an alarm braclet on the baby, and the alarm is set off, it can effect many more people than JUST that nurse and that dad. Security has to be called, other nurses, not knowing a dad had his own kid would come, (there by causing other patients to not get care at that moment), possibly a lockdown would happen, it could trigger a police response.... A lot of things can happen, a lot of people can be involved. One of the reasons to stop him, even if it was perfectly clear who he was and that he had HIS baby and his wife's permission, is because he didnt' follow procedure and it could cause a chain reaction effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oak Knoll Mom Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 and neither were allowed to walk the halls carrying their babies or cosleep. The rules must have changed. I gave birth there seven years ago and my baby never left my bed. I had to bring my baby back to the maternity ward the day after I was discharged to have his PKU stick (long story) and I had to be escorted onto the floor since neither baby or I had the little armband/footband alarms. We wanted to make sure that I wasn't accused of stealing my little guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer3141 Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Here are my random questions: 1. What kind of insurance did the Kennedys have that they got a three day hospital stay and the baby was healthy enough to need "fresh air." If I wasn't out of my bed on hour 49 with my son, they would have come looking for a credit card. :D 2. Who checks into a hospital in this day and age and doesn't realize the security measures there are around babies??? Really? Mr. Kennedy thought the bracelets and the alarms were for decoration? Where were the other 4 babies born? Were they homebirths?? Did they somehow not realize that there are protocols for everything in a hospital??? 3. One of the nurses said something like this was the most traumatic thing to happen to her in her career as a nurse so that why she is suing. I got a good laugh out of that because all the nurses I know have had MUCH worse days than this just this week. :glare: And the nurses decided to sue pretty darn quickly. Before I litigate against someone, I ruminate a few weeks or so. I stew. I ponder. If Mr. Kennedy were homeless, I suspect neither of these nurses would be contemplating litigation and they'd be back to work with smiles on their faces right now. 4. Putting your hands on someone on a stairway who is holding a 3 day old baby is DUMB. It was the STAIRWAY so there was an end to the stairway and security was already on the way. I think we should just tunk the heads of everyone involved in this and walk away because it sounds like crazy all the way around. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakia Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 The rules must have changed. I gave birth there seven years ago and my baby never left my bed. Yes, the rules changed last year when we had a sentinel event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5kidsforME Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Here are my random questions: 1. What kind of insurance did the Kennedys have that they got a three day hospital stay and the baby was healthy enough to need "fresh air." If I wasn't out of my bed on hour 49 with my son, they would have come looking for a credit card. :D She had a c-section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dansamy Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Here are my random questions: 1. What kind of insurance did the Kennedys have that they got a three day hospital stay and the baby was healthy enough to need "fresh air." If I wasn't out of my bed on hour 49 with my son, they would have come looking for a credit card. :D C-sections get a minimum of 72 hours post delivery. That doesn't count any time spent attempting to labor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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