confrontation. I. Can't. Do. It. and warning: I'm FUMING

[Denisemomof4]

I agree with the suggestion of bringing in their supervisor. If I were you, I would document everything and see if you can get any sort of supporting evidence. Otherwise, it is going to be very easy for the coaches to portray you as a helicopter crazy mom. Emotions and he said/she said are easy to ignore. Cold hard facts are hard to refute.

 

When you are in the actual meeting, remember that if you cry, yell or lose it in any way, you lose and they win. That thought usually helps me keep my cool. If you feel yourself losing it, excuse yourself.

 

Finally, try to remember your overall goal. You will not change these women. Most likely, you will not change the situation. What you can do is show your dd the right way to stand up for herself and her values. In doing so, you are a good example to your dd and the coaches. It's really hard to belittle a person who argues her points with grace (and really this is the only chance you have to change these women. People don't generally change because someone fussed at them. They change when they see a better example, imo.) Don't let them take that from you. Keep it together and be the better person no matter what!

 

You're RIGHT!!! THIS hit me like a ton of bricks! Awesome!!

 

You ladies are SO AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:grouphug:

[In the Rain]

I can't remember how old your dd is, but I'm assuming she's a young teen. Since she wants to attend, I'd consider letting her speak first and then have her leave the room. It sounds like this will get ugly, and things could be said about her that will damage her self esteem greatly. I'd make it clear at the start of the meeting that dd has something to say, will leave the room, and then the adults can discuss the matter further. If she is an older teen, then she should probably stay.

 

I'd write down the issues you want addressed at the meeting. Give a copy to the coach and the supervisor. This will give the supervisor a physical reminder of the issues, even if the conversation gets side tracked. If you are too upset to talk, it gives your dh a specific list of what to mention, and you could add in details if necessary.

:grouphug: Good luck!

[Sun]

A couple of months ago O magazine had a great article on body language and its affects on power. I highly recommend you read it before your meeting.

 

Body Language article

[OrganicAnn]

I can't remember how old your dd is, but I'm assuming she's a young teen. Since she wants to attend, I'd consider letting her speak first and then have her leave the room. It sounds like this will get ugly, and things could be said about her that will damage her self esteem greatly. I'd make it clear at the start of the meeting that dd has something to say, will leave the room, and then the adults can discuss the matter further. If she is an older teen, then she should probably stay.

 

I'd write down the issues you want addressed at the meeting. Give a copy to the coach and the supervisor. This will give the supervisor a physical reminder of the issues, even if the conversation gets side tracked. If you are too upset to talk, it gives your dh a specific list of what to mention, and you could add in details if necessary.

:grouphug: Good luck!

:iagree: I think this is a good idea.

[Mary in VA]

I remember a while back you mentioned other folks who told you they noticed how the coach was mean to your dd and treated her differently than the other swimmers. Is it possible any of them would be willing to provide statements about what they saw? It might just be added ammunition.

 

:grouphug::grouphug: I had to deal with a similar issue and my dd's dance teacher several years ago. Not such long term issues like you've been dealing with, but I totally understand the anger and emotion. I tend to cry when I get very angry. I wrote down everything I wanted to communicate. Stick to facts and leave emotion out of it. Be as business like as you can. I totally sympathize with your feelings about the coach's ugly behavior, it's terrible!!!! :grouphug: But you will be so much more effective for your dd if you can leave emotion out of it. I know it's SOOOO hard! I just had to stick with what I had written down to keep from getting upset. Our situation ended up being dealt with very professionally and we were happy with the outcome. I hope the same for you. :grouphug:

 

Mary

[Guest submarines]

I can't remember how old your dd is, but I'm assuming she's a young teen. Since she wants to attend, I'd consider letting her speak first and then have her leave the room. It sounds like this will get ugly, and things could be said about her that will damage her self esteem greatly. I'd make it clear at the start of the meeting that dd has something to say, will leave the room, and then the adults can discuss the matter further. If she is an older teen, then she should probably stay.

 

I'd write down the issues you want addressed at the meeting. Give a copy to the coach and the supervisor. This will give the supervisor a physical reminder of the issues, even if the conversation gets side tracked. If you are too upset to talk, it gives your dh a specific list of what to mention, and you could add in details if necessary.

:grouphug: Good luck!

 

:iagree:

[joannqn]

I remember a while back you mentioned other folks who told you they noticed how the coach was mean to your dd and treated her differently than the other swimmers. Is it possible any of them would be willing to provide statements about what they saw? It might just be added ammunition.

 

:iagree:

 

Having other witnesses willing to back you up will help. Otherwise, they might treat you as a crazy parent who is making things up.

[bookfiend]

Ask yourself what outcomes do you hope for - what do you want to happen?

 

An apology?

A reprimand from above?

A change in teams for your daughter?

A protocol for when she is weak?

Whatever it is, think it through in advance.

 

Because in addition to laying out the history, you also want to make a specific requests and have an set of action items/changes that need to occur. This should be something that will force them to respond with a tangible change.

 

If you don't have a plan, all that will happen is that you will be heard, they will ignore you and continue behaving badly until you leave.

 

You are already angry, just turn that into strength for your daughter.

[Pink and Green Mom]

I am so sorry for what you are going through. I hate confrontation, too. This sounds so ridiculous, but a trick I learned while in law school (yes, a lawyer who hates confrontation...) is to sit in front of the mirror and practice what you are going to say out loud. Look yourself in the eye and have the conversation with yourself (over and over if necessary). Saying things out loud is different than thinking them through in your mind. I'm one of those people who for days after an argument can think of the perfect thing I should have said - this way you know what you will be saying and those ideas may come beforehand instead of after.

 

Try to be as fact based as possible with little emotion. Can you jot down some bullet points to take with you? Make a list of everything you want to say, pick out the three or four strongest points, and make a little outline of how you want to the conversation to flow. This way, if you get flustered you can get on track easily. Make sure your husband knows what you want discussed so he can help steer the meeting if you start going off message or getting too emotional. Can he "make the case" and you supply the facts?

 

Since her supervisor is going to be there, use the words "bullying," "unsafe environment", "singling out" and "poor sportsmanship" more than once (my cousin, who is an elementary school principal, told me nothing gets their attention and action more than the words "bullying" and "unsafe environment"). Don't tiptoe around it - call it what it is. The coach is bullying and allowing others to bully your daughter and that, I'm sure, flies in the face of what the organization/team/league is supposed to represent.

 

I am not sure of the background story, but I took from your OP that you want to address the bullying moreso than your daughter's health. If I misunderstood, please disregard the rest of this. I would imagine the coaches are going to make it be all about your daughter's health and you need to steer it away from that if you want the meeting to be about their treatment of your daughter. Anticiapte that, and think of some ways you can re-direct the conversation, such as "we are here to discuss the continual mistreatment of my daughter" or "we are not here to discuss her health, we are here to discuss how she is treated during practice" something like that. Repeat as often as necessary.

 

Good luck to you. It is so hard, but the more prepared you are the better you'll do.:grouphug:

[Denisemomof4]

In the meeting try to remember they won't realized how difficult or upset you are unless you show them. Sometimes we think that we are in a position of weakness because everyone knows how terrified we are, but in reality they may not know that you are upset or terrified of confrontation.

 

If you decide that you are basically leaving, then I would point out to the management (and the other parents), that once your DD leaves chances are they (bullies) will find someone new to pick on. How many people will it take before they take the problem seriously? Will the next child have a mother that is watching out for her or will it end in tragedy? (That will leave them pondering about a bigger problem than just you and your DD).

 

I think once you think that coaches are so untrustworthy that you worry about your DD being physically harmed, then it is not worth being in that situation. I totally agree that you should speak up and put on record all the things that have happened. Unless they kick off the 2 coaches and the kid, then there is really no choice (in my opinion), but to leave. This would be the gist of the meeting for me. Are they going to get rid of the coaches or not. But I would not leave quietly.

 

I would definitely go to the meeting (don't send DH alone, don't think email can handle it). I would try to arrange for a friend or family member to sit outside with DD8 and if necessary your DD on the team. There may be things you will want to say with your DD out of the room. Afterwards, I would summarize the meeting in an email or letter and ask if you have summarized it correctly and require them to respond.

 

Good Luck

 

(say to yourself in the mirror 10 times a day - I am good at confrontation. I am a mama bear.)

 

this is excellent. Thank you. Dd is beginning to resolve that she will not be able to fulfill her synchro dream. Although this has been extremely painful, it's been a good experience for her to go through. I'm really glad that we are going to meet on Thursday. I can't believe how calm I feel after hearing from all of you here! (did I really just say that I'm glad we're going to meet?)

 

I doubt there's any way to make things work out any longer. But I hope the coahces get what they deserve at some point.

 

Dd thanked me for doing this for her. :001_wub:

[Denisemomof4]

Haven't read all the responses, but hugs to you and your daughter.

 

One thought- I would be very concerned about taking your daughter to the meeting because I think there is a big possibility that they will try to manipulate your daughter during the meeting to discredit your complaints. They have already shown that they have no qualms about actively and passively bullying a child. An 8 year old child will probably be no match for a seasoned manipulative adult.

 

Unfortunately, this is something I've seen happen before in a meeting between a bullied child/ parent duo and an authority figure.

 

I don't think this will happen because the two badly behaving coaches won't be there. It will be the lead coach and her supervisor.

 

And I do have to bring up that I no longer feel safe leaving dd there without staying.

[justasque]

Before you go, think about:

 

1. What do you and the coaches have in common? What are your common goals for your dd and for the team? If you can speak to this, it may be less confrontational. As an example, you all presumably feel that safety is critical. You can express your concerns about dd's safety in the context of your mutual desire to keep the team members safe and healthy. "I am concerned that my daughter may have felt pressured into x. I know that safety is of utmost concern to all of us, but I understand you may not have realized that dd felt pressure in this situation. How can we change things so that none of the swimmers feel pressure to do x and so that all of them feel safe doing Y when they feel they need to."

 

2. What are they doing right? What can you say you are happy with? When I complain, I try to use the "sandwich method" - praise, complaint, praise. Sometimes it's very hard to think of the praise, however, the exercise itself is useful.

 

3. What, as far as the coaches/team go, do you want the result of the meeting to be? What, specifically, would make you and dd happy? Make sure you can clearly communicate this. Warm and fuzzy chatting (or confrontational argument) isn't as productive as brainstorming specific ways to avoid problems in the future. "I feel that swimmers should be encouraged to express their concerns if they are not feeling up to a particular exercise, and that those concerns should be taken seriously by the coaches. Specifically, if a swimmer expresses a feeling of illness, etc., that swimmer should be taken out of the pool, and a parent should be consulted." (Or whatever it is you want.) Be prepared to listen to their concerns over logistics, etc., and to compromise where appropriate.

 

4. What, in terms of your child/family, do you want the result to be?

 

Looking at #4, I think it's good to model standing up to authority when they are in the wrong. However, it's also good to model extracting yourself from a situation when your efforts to make change aren't making any headway. When a situation becomes abusive, sometimes you need to do both. Sometimes it's not clear how you will replace the role the abusive situation played in your life, and yet to care for yourself, it's important to take that jump and have faith that you will be able to fill the hole in some way in the future. Leaving doesn't have to be slinking out, defeated, it can be strongly moving away from badness and into a as-yet-unknown place of goodness.

 

Techniques:

 

Make sure they know you are hearing their concerns (but not necessarily agreeing with them) by echoing them back. "So, you feel that swimmers should follow coach's orders, because they might just be being lazy. Hmmm. I see the concern, however I feel there's a middle ground, where a coach can gently ask the swimmer about how they are feeling, and gather more info from the swimmer instead of just ordering them back in the pool."

 

Do not, do not, do not engage in name-calling when it comes to the coach's child. Describe particular actions that concern you rather than labeling the child. Focus on feelings. Not "Jane is a bully", but "when Jane swims up on dd's back, dd feels bullied. I think swimmers of this age can and should control their swimming to avoid this. Of course, accidents happen now and again, but dd feels that Jane's actions have crossed the line and that they may be intentional."

[Denisemomof4]

I can't remember how old your dd is, but I'm assuming she's a young teen. Since she wants to attend, I'd consider letting her speak first and then have her leave the room. It sounds like this will get ugly, and things could be said about her that will damage her self esteem greatly. I'd make it clear at the start of the meeting that dd has something to say, will leave the room, and then the adults can discuss the matter further. If she is an older teen, then she should probably stay.

 

I'd write down the issues you want addressed at the meeting. Give a copy to the coach and the supervisor. This will give the supervisor a physical reminder of the issues, even if the conversation gets side tracked. If you are too upset to talk, it gives your dh a specific list of what to mention, and you could add in details if necessary.

:grouphug: Good luck!

 

excellent idea. Thank you!

 

Dd and I are already writing down our notes. We'll type them up and give everyone a copy.

 

A couple of months ago O magazine had a great article on body language and its affects on power. I highly recommend you read it before your meeting.

 

Body Language article

 

 

 

Oooooo! Thanks!

[Denisemomof4]

I remember a while back you mentioned other folks who told you they noticed how the coach was mean to your dd and treated her differently than the other swimmers. Is it possible any of them would be willing to provide statements about what they saw? It might just be added ammunition.

 

:grouphug::grouphug: I had to deal with a similar issue and my dd's dance teacher several years ago. Not such long term issues like you've been dealing with, but I totally understand the anger and emotion. I tend to cry when I get very angry. I wrote down everything I wanted to communicate. Stick to facts and leave emotion out of it. Be as business like as you can. I totally sympathize with your feelings about the coach's ugly behavior, it's terrible!!!! :grouphug: But you will be so much more effective for your dd if you can leave emotion out of it. I know it's SOOOO hard! I just had to stick with what I had written down to keep from getting upset. Our situation ended up being dealt with very professionally and we were happy with the outcome. I hope the same for you. :grouphug:

 

Mary

 

If I cry, they win. If I cry, they win. If I cry, they win.;)

 

I'm so glad things worked out for your dd. I'm not expecting the same, but at least I know I have done everything I possibly could.

[Denisemomof4]

:iagree:

 

Having other witnesses willing to back you up will help. Otherwise, they might treat you as a crazy parent who is making things up.

 

oh shoot! That's why I quoted Mary in Va and I didn't even address it!

 

I promised the other girl who spoke up to her mother that I would not bring up names. For the life of me I can't remember who referenced another comment about how the coach treated dd. I will hold the promise of anonymity but I will be sharing that fact again. Maybe the supervisor can pull some kids aside herself? I don't know.

[Denisemomof4]

Ask yourself what outcomes do you hope for - what do you want to happen?

 

An apology?

A reprimand from above?

A change in teams for your daughter?

A protocol for when she is weak?

Whatever it is, think it through in advance.

 

Because in addition to laying out the history, you also want to make a specific requests and have an set of action items/changes that need to occur. This should be something that will force them to respond with a tangible change.

 

If you don't have a plan, all that will happen is that you will be heard, they will ignore you and continue behaving badly until you leave.

 

You are already angry, just turn that into strength for your daughter.

 

this is good. Dh said the same, we need to tell them what we want out of the meeting. I'm going to tell them what I do want, making it sound like we will still be a part of the team. I doubt dd will be still swimming there next week.

[amey311]

I don't think this will happen because the two badly behaving coaches won't be there. It will be the lead coach and her supervisor.

 

And I do have to bring up that I no longer feel safe leaving dd there without staying.

 

Has the lead coach been there when any of these incidents with your daughter have occurred?

 

It's worth considering that they won't be able to tell you anything firmer than "We'll talk to Crappy Coaches and get back to you" at this meeting. They'll want to hear what CC say as well. They also may not tell you anything about personnel decisions (written or verbal reprimands, suspensions, firings) because they may not be allowed to.

 

I thought I'd read most of the replies already, but just in case no one has said it.... make a time line. Go thru old posts here, talk with your daughter or other friends and outline the dates and locations of various incidents. Even if you don't choose to mention all of them (it may not be reasonable to, depending on the way the meeting goes), it will be helpful to you. You can also decide if you want to make a copy for the supervisors. Bring it with you either way. You and DH can decide if you want to leave them with the document or not.

 

Take notes (or have DH do it) of what is said, who was there, the time of the meeting. When you get home, write an email to the Supervisors that recaps the meeting as you remember it and ask them to verify that yes, this is what was discussed. If any decisions were made or questions raised, include that ("We all decided that Child will be granted X minutes of break per X minutes in the pool." "Supervisor asked Parents if Parents would do ABC." "Parents asked Supervisor to attend the next 8 practices and. Supervisor agreed with this and said she would contact Parents if she would be unable to be at a practice. Supervisor agreed that if she misses a practice, she will attend a total of 8." "Supervisor and Parents agree to meet again by December 15." ). These aren't worded well, but YKWIM. It provides documentation and it serves as a double check. Did you mishear or misinterpret? Do they disagree with your notes or decisions?

[Denisemomof4]

I am so sorry for what you are going through. I hate confrontation, too. This sounds so ridiculous, but a trick I learned while in law school (yes, a lawyer who hates confrontation...) is to sit in front of the mirror and practice what you are going to say out loud. Look yourself in the eye and have the conversation with yourself (over and over if necessary). Saying things out loud is different than thinking them through in your mind. I'm one of those people who for days after an argument can think of the perfect thing I should have said - this way you know what you will be saying and those ideas may come beforehand instead of after.

 

Try to be as fact based as possible with little emotion. Can you jot down some bullet points to take with you? Make a list of everything you want to say, pick out the three or four strongest points, and make a little outline of how you want to the conversation to flow. This way, if you get flustered you can get on track easily. Make sure your husband knows what you want discussed so he can help steer the meeting if you start going off message or getting too emotional. Can he "make the case" and you supply the facts?

 

Since her supervisor is going to be there, use the words "bullying," "unsafe environment", "singling out" and "poor sportsmanship" more than once (my cousin, who is an elementary school principal, told me nothing gets their attention and action more than the words "bullying" and "unsafe environment"). Don't tiptoe around it - call it what it is. The coach is bullying and allowing others to bully your daughter and that, I'm sure, flies in the face of what the organization/team/league is supposed to represent.

 

I am not sure of the background story, but I took from your OP that you want to address the bullying moreso than your daughter's health. If I misunderstood, please disregard the rest of this. I would imagine the coaches are going to make it be all about your daughter's health and you need to steer it away from that if you want the meeting to be about their treatment of your daughter. Anticiapte that, and think of some ways you can re-direct the conversation, such as "we are here to discuss the continual mistreatment of my daughter" or "we are not here to discuss her health, we are here to discuss how she is treated during practice" something like that. Repeat as often as necessary.

 

Good luck to you. It is so hard, but the more prepared you are the better you'll do.:grouphug:

 

this is excellent! You make some VERY good points.

 

I like the idea of dh presenting the case and then my supplying the facts.

 

I had just told dh that I'm going to make sure the supervisor knows that dd is being bullied by the coaches daughter, bullying being key here, and that the coach herself has bullied dd, AND that not only has it become a hostile environment for my dd, but I no longer feel that it is safe for her to be at swim without my being present. I'm going to make sure ALL of this is heard.

 

I do suspect they're going to turn to dd's health. I'm going to tell them that i want to proceed for now, that we don't know what's going on with her. But I want them to know that if she has to drop out for the rest of the year, I will be enrolling her next fall. I probably will never do this, but I want dd to have the option if her health improves.

 

And I need to point out the fact that the lead coach had NO idea anything was going on when we met. She has had no issues with dd, and she had no idea the other coaches did. She was shocked when we met.

 

I'm so tired and hope I'm making sense!

 

Thank you SO much!

[Denisemomof4]

Before you go, think about:

 

1. What do you and the coaches have in common? What are your common goals for your dd and for the team? If you can speak to this, it may be less confrontational. As an example, you all presumably feel that safety is critical. You can express your concerns about dd's safety in the context of your mutual desire to keep the team members safe and healthy. "I am concerned that my daughter may have felt pressured into x. I know that safety is of utmost concern to all of us, but I understand you may not have realized that dd felt pressure in this situation. How can we change things so that none of the swimmers feel pressure to do x and so that all of them feel safe doing Y when they feel they need to."

 

2. What are they doing right? What can you say you are happy with? When I complain, I try to use the "sandwich method" - praise, complaint, praise. Sometimes it's very hard to think of the praise, however, the exercise itself is useful.

 

3. What, as far as the coaches/team go, do you want the result of the meeting to be? What, specifically, would make you and dd happy? Make sure you can clearly communicate this. Warm and fuzzy chatting (or confrontational argument) isn't as productive as brainstorming specific ways to avoid problems in the future. "I feel that swimmers should be encouraged to express their concerns if they are not feeling up to a particular exercise, and that those concerns should be taken seriously by the coaches. Specifically, if a swimmer expresses a feeling of illness, etc., that swimmer should be taken out of the pool, and a parent should be consulted." (Or whatever it is you want.) Be prepared to listen to their concerns over logistics, etc., and to compromise where appropriate.

 

4. What, in terms of your child/family, do you want the result to be?

 

Looking at #4, I think it's good to model standing up to authority when they are in the wrong. However, it's also good to model extracting yourself from a situation when your efforts to make change aren't making any headway. When a situation becomes abusive, sometimes you need to do both. Sometimes it's not clear how you will replace the role the abusive situation played in your life, and yet to care for yourself, it's important to take that jump and have faith that you will be able to fill the hole in some way in the future. Leaving doesn't have to be slinking out, defeated, it can be strongly moving away from badness and into a as-yet-unknown place of goodness.

 

Techniques:

 

Make sure they know you are hearing their concerns (but not necessarily agreeing with them) by echoing them back. "So, you feel that swimmers should follow coach's orders, because they might just be being lazy. Hmmm. I see the concern, however I feel there's a middle ground, where a coach can gently ask the swimmer about how they are feeling, and gather more info from the swimmer instead of just ordering them back in the pool."

 

Do not, do not, do not engage in name-calling when it comes to the coach's child. Describe particular actions that concern you rather than labeling the child. Focus on feelings. Not "Jane is a bully", but "when Jane swims up on dd's back, dd feels bullied. I think swimmers of this age can and should control their swimming to avoid this. Of course, accidents happen now and again, but dd feels that Jane's actions have crossed the line and that they may be intentional."

 

excellent. Excellent! Thank you for typing all of this out. I think I'm going to print the entire thread to reread!

 

As for the name calling..............:lol: I know it probably looks like I'd do that but I really wouldn't. I may call her names in my head, but I will not say them out loud.:lol:

[Denisemomof4]

Has the lead coach been there when any of these incidents with your daughter have occurred?

yes, she has been there. Dd and I figured out the pattern, though. When ever LB (little brat) :tongue_smilie: was bullying dd, lead coach was busy doing something. The two evenings dd was bullied by the coach, I was home sick AND lead coach was occupied. I'm always asking, "What was LC doing?" This is when we discovered the pattern.

 

It's worth considering that they won't be able to tell you anything firmer than "We'll talk to Crappy Coaches and get back to you" at this meeting. They'll want to hear what CC say as well. They also may not tell you anything about personnel decisions (written or verbal reprimands, suspensions, firings) because they may not be allowed to.

 

I understand this. I will be letting them know that I will be filing an official complaint because there is a pattern of recklessness which jeopardized my dd's safety. That shouldn't set well with the YMCA.

 

I thought I'd read most of the replies already, but just in case no one has said it.... make a time line. Go thru old posts here, talk with your daughter or other friends and outline the dates and locations of various incidents. Even if you don't choose to mention all of them (it may not be reasonable to, depending on the way the meeting goes), it will be helpful to you. You can also decide if you want to make a copy for the supervisors. Bring it with you either way. You and DH can decide if you want to leave them with the document or not.

 

we have started our timeline. thanks!

 

Take notes (or have DH do it) of what is said, who was there, the time of the meeting. When you get home, write an email to the Supervisors that recaps the meeting as you remember it and ask them to verify that yes, this is what was discussed. If any decisions were made or questions raised, include that ("We all decided that Child will be granted X minutes of break per X minutes in the pool." "Supervisor asked Parents if Parents would do ABC." "Parents asked Supervisor to attend the next 8 practices and. Supervisor agreed with this and said she would contact Parents if she would be unable to be at a practice. Supervisor agreed that if she misses a practice, she will attend a total of 8." "Supervisor and Parents agree to meet again by December 15." ). These aren't worded well, but YKWIM. It provides documentation and it serves as a double check. Did you mishear or misinterpret? Do they disagree with your notes or decisions?

 

excellent!!! Thanks!!!

[fhjmom]

I may have misunderstood but did you initiate the meeting or did the swim coaches? If it was initiated by them, have you considered that the purpose of the meeting may be to ask you to remove your DD from the program? It sounds like her health has been a big issue and they may be concerned about the liability if she is truly having trouble keeping up with the workouts. Have you kept the coaches in the loop about her health evaluations and has she been released by a doctor to continue swimming competitively? They may ask that she have a medical release so they are covered as well as have any medical limitations spelled out. I do not doubt that your daughter has some serious health issues going on but the coaches may not be so understanding of why she can't perform and may feel she is expecting "special treatment" - i.e. wanting to leave the pool when other swimmers are still working out, eating more frequently, etc. I am not saying she is expecting special treatment nor that her health concerns are not valid - please do not feel that way at all - but if they have not been documented by a health professional to the coaches, *they* may not see them as valid (channeling some of the experiences I have had with coaches from my past life as an athletic trainer). I just brought that up so you could be prepared if that is indeed their reason for calling the meeting.

[Laurie4b]

ok, what are power clothes?

 

Power clothes are clothes that convey power/status. Think about what female politicians wear, or what business women wear. Dress very classy. Don't wear a lot of jewelry, but do wear one or two pieces of quality gold jewelry. Black would be my color choice. Red is a power color, but in a situation in which you don't like confrontation, I wouldn't wear it. (It tends to convey/provoke anger.) If black is not a color you can wear, try a neutral. Don't wear pink, warm/fuzzy stuff, ruffles, etc. Wear simple lines. A blazer would be good if that works with the weather where you are. A lot of women will choose pantsuits (e.g. remember Hillary Clinton when she was campaigning.) Wear high quality shoes. You want to look wealthy but not glitzy.

 

My mother was a master at this when she was working. In fact, there was a guy at work who would take a look at her when she came in on certain days and ask who she was taking down that day. ;) He could tell by what she was wearing.

[Twigs]

:grouphug::grouphug:

[NanceXToo]

Denise, I'm so sorry you and your daughter are going through this. Those coaches sound horrid.

 

I admit I haven't read the 8 pages of responses and only read your thread, so I apologize if I'm repeating something somebody else already said.

 

But here is what I would do in your position:

 

I would type out everything that you have a problem with, everything that happened. Be very detailed, very clear, and try to stay at least somewhat unemotional- stick to the facts and don't go crazy with things that might seem like emotional/personal slights against the coaches. Ask people here to review it if necessary! If there's something positive/nice you can throw in there to show that you are balancing things out in your head and don't just come across as a miserable person who hates the class, the coaches, and everything about it (therefore leaving them wondering "well why are you still here?") that might be good, too. But say everything you want to say and make sure the supervisor knows everything that's been going on.

 

Get it to the supervisor today- by email or by dropping it off with her.

 

Explain that you want her to have all of the facts BEFORE your meeting tomorrow to keep things on track, relevant, and to help facilitate the actual meeting, and that you feel that she needs to know all the background before you can sit down to discuss it in person.

 

If she reads it, the meeting should go more smoothly for you, because she'll already know everything you want her to know and you can both use it as a jumping off point. She'll have some idea of whatever response she wants to give you, will be able to address the points you made, etc.

 

In this way you will not leave there thinking "I don't even remember what I said in there" or "I was so emotional and stressed, I forgot to say this, that and the other thing!" She won't feel attacked and on the spot because she'll have already had some time to process things and formulate a response to them and so on.

[Denisemomof4]

I may have misunderstood but did you initiate the meeting or did the swim coaches? If it was initiated by them, have you considered that the purpose of the meeting may be to ask you to remove your DD from the program? It sounds like her health has been a big issue and they may be concerned about the liability if she is truly having trouble keeping up with the workouts. Have you kept the coaches in the loop about her health evaluations and has she been released by a doctor to continue swimming competitively? They may ask that she have a medical release so they are covered as well as have any medical limitations spelled out. I do not doubt that your daughter has some serious health issues going on but the coaches may not be so understanding of why she can't perform and may feel she is expecting "special treatment" - i.e. wanting to leave the pool when other swimmers are still working out, eating more frequently, etc. I am not saying she is expecting special treatment nor that her health concerns are not valid - please do not feel that way at all - but if they have not been documented by a health professional to the coaches, *they* may not see them as valid (channeling some of the experiences I have had with coaches from my past life as an athletic trainer). I just brought that up so you could be prepared if that is indeed their reason for calling the meeting.

 

point(s) well taken. My dh thinks they will be asking her to leave due to her health issues. I will be letting them know that her issues leave after a few months and then she gets a three year break, and that she will be back next fall. I will tell them my dd has done nothing wrong and will not give up a sport that she loves because of being bullied by a brat and her mother.

 

I hope by next fall dd will decide not to return. I'm not sure if I will allow her to return, but these idiots will not be forcing her out because they are morons.

 

I know no doctor will prevent her from a sport since she has no diagnosis!!! I'm sure I can easily get a release. But if dd can't do a full routine, she will have to drop out.

[Denisemomof4]

Power clothes are clothes that convey power/status. Think about what female politicians wear, or what business women wear. Dress very classy. Don't wear a lot of jewelry, but do wear one or two pieces of quality gold jewelry. Black would be my color choice. Red is a power color, but in a situation in which you don't like confrontation, I wouldn't wear it. (It tends to convey/provoke anger.) If black is not a color you can wear, try a neutral. Don't wear pink, warm/fuzzy stuff, ruffles, etc. Wear simple lines. A blazer would be good if that works with the weather where you are. A lot of women will choose pantsuits (e.g. remember Hillary Clinton when she was campaigning.) Wear high quality shoes. You want to look wealthy but not glitzy.

 

My mother was a master at this when she was working. In fact, there was a guy at work who would take a look at her when she came in on certain days and ask who she was taking down that day. ;) He could tell by what she was wearing.

 

IO've got my outfit picked out but I will not be able to wear nice shoes. I have UGLY boots to fit my orthotics in. I'm working on getting a nicer pair of STYLISH boots custom made!

[Denisemomof4]

Denise, I'm so sorry you and your daughter are going through this. Those coaches sound horrid.

 

I admit I haven't read the 8 pages of responses and only read your thread, so I apologize if I'm repeating something somebody else already said.

 

But here is what I would do in your position:

 

I would type out everything that you have a problem with, everything that happened. Be very detailed, very clear, and try to stay at least somewhat unemotional- stick to the facts and don't go crazy with things that might seem like emotional/personal slights against the coaches. Ask people here to review it if necessary! If there's something positive/nice you can throw in there to show that you are balancing things out in your head and don't just come across as a miserable person who hates the class, the coaches, and everything about it (therefore leaving them wondering "well why are you still here?") that might be good, too. But say everything you want to say and make sure the supervisor knows everything that's been going on.

 

Get it to the supervisor today- by email or by dropping it off with her.

 

Explain that you want her to have all of the facts BEFORE your meeting tomorrow to keep things on track, relevant, and to help facilitate the actual meeting, and that you feel that she needs to know all the background before you can sit down to discuss it in person.

 

If she reads it, the meeting should go more smoothly for you, because she'll already know everything you want her to know and you can both use it as a jumping off point. She'll have some idea of whatever response she wants to give you, will be able to address the points you made, etc.

 

In this way you will not leave there thinking "I don't even remember what I said in there" or "I was so emotional and stressed, I forgot to say this, that and the other thing!" She won't feel attacked and on the spot because she'll have already had some time to process things and formulate a response to them and so on.

 

I have such calm and peace now because I brought this here! I really don't think I'm going to get emotional.

 

We will be away for the day but I was thinking that I want to have time to prepare everything. If we can't make the meeting tomorrow, we will make it on Monday.

[CalicoKat]

I would suggest a chat with your dd. What is she thinking about synchro. Is it still her passion. What suggestions might she have to improve for her role on the team. Listen to her. It might help in the discussions with the coach.

[Teachin'Mine]

:grouphug:

 

Totally aside from the coaching/bullying situation, I'd take this time to allow her to heal physically before allowing her to continue with any strenuous activity. How frustrating it must be that they can't come up with a diagnosis and a solution. There must be a doctor, maybe a pulmonary one?, out there who could offer some answers. :grouphug:

[ma23peas]

Let go of the bitterness against the child's mother/the child/and the coach...most of what you are getting emotional about is not the confrontation but as a mother seeing your child face a physical issue that you have no control over...so you're trying very hard to control every other area of her life...the brat child/the brat child's mother/the coach. It is not fair to you, your child or any others.

We all deal with injustices...but you must look at the bigger picture...love your daughter, be joyful in all things with her and help her find ways to focus. My daughters had a girl in their performance dance group that was taking on bullying issues (squeezing their hand so hard while dancing that it made one of my girls cry and she's the tough one!)...I kept trying to talk them through working it out...sometimes that is the bigger lesson...you do not get snarky about it, you do not get frustrated...you LOVE those who persecute you! We finally had a head to head with our thorns and it's been 2 months later and the girls are actually finding great value in each other! If we had gone to her or her mom with an angry attitude/frustration...it would have escalated...we went wanting to make it better for everyone..find out miscommunications and how we could help. It was tense for the first two weeks and awkward (we went to the teacher and let her talk it out with them) but now there is healing and my girls realized how to overcome bullying and even become friends with those who were not so nice. We ALL have issues, you have no idea the pressures the brat child is under....but go into it with love not that momma bear going to protect her child at all costs...b/c sometimes the lesson to be learned in these instances is how to love all kinds.

[MrsJewelsRae]

I am very much like you, I avoid confrontation at almost all costs. But I am getting better at it, I realized that people will walk all over you and my dd will never learn to be more assertive if she sees me cowing to anyone and everyone who treats me badly. The first time is so so hard, but you get a rush once you start going, yes, you will shake, you may cry even. But you will feel so empowered and it will get easier to stand up for yourself in other situations. I still have a looong way to go for standing up for myself, but I want to do it, I must learn to do this for myself and for my kids. Calm down, plan out what needs to be said and just get it done. Even if it doesn't go the way you want it to, even if you chicken out in the end, at least start it, baby steps!

 

IMO, you need to quit- BUT, make sure you put the guilt on them, tell them, even if you have to do it in writing, that they suck as coaches and you won't be supporting their team anymore, do it in a way that is very symbolic of "wiping the dust from your feet", kwim? I wish you courage and strength, and if you whip em real good, come back and tell us of your victory and we'll share in your pride! :001_smile: YOU CAN DO IT!

[sheryl]

Denise,

 

:grouphug::grouphug:

 

Hugs. No criticism from me. You did what you had to do....you had a lot on your plate with you Mom.

 

Is there "another" swim team on which there may be more fair playing ground?

 

I do understand about not leaving or leaving for the right reasons. Denise, pick your battles.

 

It seems like you are already doing everything. Have you kept written notes, etc..documentation of dates, events, etc?

 

Discuss with your dh your greatest concerns. Since it sounds like he's on board with you, I'd simply let him "carry" the conversation. Men are usually better at that than some of us wives. Let him question/answer. You interject only when you need to.

 

Talk some kind of naturally based calming agent.

 

Prayer!!!!

 

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

[Mynyel]

Here is what I would do. If you have a problem with confrontation. Which I totally understand, do this.

 

Write a *LONG* letter which *EVERYTHING* spelled out in black and white. Then when you get to the meeting, hand it to the supervisor and tell them this is what I have to say, read it and then ask me any questions you have.

 

That way all you are doing backing up what you write and have all your thoughts down before you go and get scatter brained by being in the meeting.

 

I know I forget things I want to say at Dr. appointments and that isn't even a confrontation.

 

So write it *ALL* down... or type it... whatever. Just get it on paper and you may feel more fortified!

[Scarlett]

(((Denise)))

 

What a terrible situation.

 

Others have already given great advice on staying calm. I just wanted to say I admire you for standing up for your dd and what is right the way you are doing.

[Avila]

point(s) well taken. My dh thinks they will be asking her to leave due to her health issues. I will be letting them know that her issues leave after a few months and then she gets a three year break, and that she will be back next fall. I will tell them my dd has done nothing wrong and will not give up a sport that she loves because of being bullied by a brat and her mother.

 

I hope by next fall dd will decide not to return. I'm not sure if I will allow her to return, but these idiots will not be forcing her out because they are morons.

 

I know no doctor will prevent her from a sport since she has no diagnosis!!! I'm sure I can easily get a release. But if dd can't do a full routine, she will have to drop out.

 

I don't think you can assume that her issues will go away and give you another three-year hiatus, since you still aren't sure what you are dealing with. I wouldn't want to say anything to them that they can use against you later in regard to this.

 

It wouldn't surprise me is stress isn't aggravating whatever is going on with your poor DD. I can't even imagine trying to physically perform under the circumstances. :grouphug:

 

I think you need to come up with several acceptable resolutions, for yourself, realizing that even if these people don't listen, you have been heard. You may not get satisfaction from THEM, so you may need to have, in your own mind, another set of criteria for determining success for yourself here.

 

:grouphug:

[gardenmom5]

:grouphug: Are the coaches certified? is there someone who licenses them this can be reported to? (e.g. certifying agency.) who is the "supervisor's supervisor"? and can you contact that person? Do you have someone who is calm and collected in a crisis you can bring with you? Aside from you DH I mean. can you consult a lawyer as to your legal options?

 

write down your notes beforehand so you can have something to help you stay on track as you get emotional.

 

I agree, they are bullies, and need to be held to account. It's possible these women want her out just because she is "different' and her lack of body fat (I have a neice who had zero body fat - she sank) requires accomodations they don't want to deal with. It could also be they know someone in the wings they want on the team and your daughter is seen by the coaches as the "weak link", and the easiest to force out.

[gardenmom5]

Sorry, but you've got the wrong tv show. Try Dynasty, and you pretend that you're Alexis Carrington.

.

:lol:

[gardenmom5]

ok, what are power clothes?

 

a sharp suit. think something a CEO would wear to a stockholders meeting, or a lawyer arguing a case in front of the supreme court.

[unsinkable]

Well, I might just have a few drinks before I went into a meeting like that. :lol:

 

From the outside looking in, I'd prepare myself to be on the defensive and well as offensive. I agree with those who said that they're going to ask you DD to leave the team due to her health issues or at least step down to a lower level of competition. It sounds like you think you're going to go in there with guns drawn...but be prepared for an ambush.

 

JMHO

[celticmom]

The first thing I would do is write all of my talking points out.

 

Write down what you have observed, how your DD performed for previous coaches, and what your expectations are from these particular coaches. If the organization has any type of parent rulebook, go through it and highlight areas in which the coaches have not met your DD's needs, and bring those with you as well.

 

The best way to keep the emotion out of your meeting is to NOT deviate from your agenda talking points. Read it as a matter-of-fact, NOT as opinion or suggestion.

 

I would not only have the name of the immediate supervisors with me, but I would find out who the President of the organization is, or who the 'top dog' is. I would inform the coaches that you are willing to take this as far as it needs to go in order to protect the health and safety of your child.

 

I would also inform them that you will be bringing a video camera to all practices/meets, and you will be more than willing to take it to the media should they choose to escalate their attitude toward you or your dd. Viral videos spread like wildfire.

 

None of this has to be said with any type of emotion. Just read the talking points, and most importantly, STICK to your talking points. Do NOT allow them to manipulate the conversation in any way (disarming you with sweet nothings that will change nothing).

 

That's what I would do.

 

I wish you nothing but the best of luck. I hope you wipe the floor with these b*tches.

 

:iagree:I was going to suggest the viral video if no one else did but I wouldn't be nice enough to give them warning.