Spin-off from Plaid Dad's food storage question: WHY??

[Aubrey]

On the one hand, I see what's going on around us, w/ gas prices rising, housing, food prices/shortages...

 

But otoh, I'm reminded of Y2K. Dh & I were engaged in early '99, & people in our church started trying to sell us big bags of food...I mean HUGE bags, that could feed 10 people for 6mos, or something like that, so we'd be "prepared for Y2K." They encouraged us to find other couples to split the bags w/, etc. (We didn't have that kind of $, so it was never an issue, lol.)

 

Anyway...I tend to hear impending doom w/...some caution & some doubt, does that make sense? So if there *is* a disaster, my house won't be where you want to come, but there's a chance that we won't be the panicked people banging down your door. Kwim?

 

So tell me. Am I missing something? Is there a reason to start a supply of food & water? I mean, I did watch the video about the city garden where the lady was talking about the avg. food supply in a given city being only 3 days worth & if the power grid goes down, we're in trouble, etc. Is that what everyone's thinking about, or is it something else?

[bkpan]

and "it" could be any number of situations... terrorist attacks, food shortages, natural disaster, economic collapse, etc. The point is that none of us knows the future and for us, I feel that it is simply prudent to not be completely dependent on society/government/others should something happen. We lead such comfortable, convenient lives that it doesn't seem probable that we could ever be in "real" need, but that is not an assumption that I am willing to live with. Everyone has to find their comfort zone. We are not farmers, and we won't stockpile 6 mos. worth of food, water, stuff, but I do want a plan. If disaster strikes, I am responsible for 6 little lives that completely depend on dh and I to meet their needs. That is the "why" for us.

 

Kim in TN (used to be in NV)

[Kate CA]

My father works for FEMA and he made a believer out of me with regards to emergencies: "it can happen any time and anywhere." It is just better to be prepared than to have nothing and to have to rely on the state (think Katrina) or your neighbors (who may not be any better off than you).

 

He has shared some of the details of the rash of emergencies he has worked this past year - some in communities that "never thought it could happen to them." From floods to hurricanes to tornadoes to fire to earthquakes - there isn't any one area of the US that is free from some sort of potential natural (or manmade as some of the fires in So. Cal.) disasters.

 

If you have small children and diapers, wipes, milk, food, etc. were not available for any lengthy period of time - would you be able to care for them?

This was huge for me when my children were babies. What about water for drinking or washing if there was an issue with the water supply?

 

It does not have anything to do with Y2K--just taking care of one's family for any unforseen emergency.

 

FEMA has a lot of information on their site: http://www.fema.gov/areyouready/basic_preparedness.shtm

 

It is always better to be prepared with something than not to have anything at all. :)

[Julie in Austin]

A lot (most? I don't know) of the people doing food storage are LDS and we do it in part because it is part of the teachings of our church, for the reasons outlined above (i.e., you never know what will happen). In my experience, most people who end up using their food storage do so because of personal economic hardship (such as job loss).

 

Here's the main LDS site about food storage:

 

http://www.providentliving.org/

 

I find that I save money buy buying in bulk anyway, so for us it is a win-win.

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

Maybe they are just good scouts. :D

 

From what I've gathered, each person seems to have his own reasons which are either related to natural disasters or economic collapse.

 

I am thinking of preparing for natural disaster, because the last time a hurricane went through I was woefully unprepared.

[G5052]

My father works for FEMA and he made a believer out of me with regards to emergencies: "it can happen any time and anywhere." It is just better to be prepared than to have nothing and to have to rely on the state (think Katrina) or your neighbors (who may not be any better off than you).

 

:)

 

We live on the outskirts of a major metropolitan area, and five years ago our power was out for FIVE DAYS following a major tropical storm. The local grocery stories were closed for two days and then were poorly stocked for another week. I was so glad that we had stockpiles of food and supplies (and a generator BTW).

 

After that my goal has been to have at least a month's worth of food stockpiled, if not more.

[dragons in the flower bed]

On the one hand, I see what's going on around us, w/ gas prices rising, housing, food prices/shortages...

 

But otoh, I'm reminded of Y2K.

 

 

That one possibility of disaster was based on faulty logic does not mean that every one is incorrect. I didn't worry a snippet about Y2K. It was programming, math, and it was simply mathematically impossible for anything bad to happen. I feel we are experiencing the beginning of a long emergency now, though, and I've come to that conclusion using the same logic. Mathematically speaking, we may not have enough fuel to use to power our research into and conversion to new sources of fuel.

[Sara R]

Prices have gone up significantly and most indications say that they will continue to rise. Because we buy in bulk and eat from our pantry, we have been able to continue to eat at yesterday's prices today. It's a personal inflation hedge with a lot less risk than gold. :)

[melissel]

Aw, for pete's sake. I was all set to post about how I agreed with you, Aubrey, but now I'm a little freaked out!

 

I was going to say that it depends a little on the area you live in, too. If you live in California, or in Tornado Alley, or in a potential hurricane zone, or where your winters are REALLY bad, you might be more concerned. For us, we're in central NJ, above the flood zone but near several sources of fresh water. The risk of natural disaster is extremely rare, but I suppose the slimmest of chances always exists. My parents have a generator, and we have a good bit of food stored downstairs just because I tend to buy a lot during sales, and because I try to buy enough so I don't have to go to the store more than every few weeks or so (with the exception of the farmer's market for milk and eggs).

 

But now I'll probably put some thought into stockpiling water, batteries, certain food items, etc. We're beyond diapers now, and use cloth for almost everything anyway. Thanks, Julie and Kate, for the links.

[Aubrey]

That one possibility of disaster was based on faulty logic does not mean that every one is incorrect. I didn't worry a snippet about Y2K. It was programming, math, and it was simply mathematically impossible for anything bad to happen. I feel we are experiencing the beginning of a long emergency now, though, and I've come to that conclusion using the same logic. Mathematically speaking, we may not have enough fuel to use to power our research into and conversion to new sources of fuel.

 

Well, see, I didn't mean to imply that people who prepared for Y2K were wrong. I was actually concerned about it, just not in a position to *do* anything about it, kwim?

 

The way you describe this as the beginning of a long emergency makes sense, but I hafta tell ya. I don't want to think about it that way. Because I might be able to do something about, say a week's worth of food & water. But not more. Kwim? Of course, I guess what you can do all depends on how seriously you take the threat. I have a vivid imagination balanced by a tendency to under-react. Does that make sense?

[apond]

We started stock pliling food a few months before our twins were born. I new I wasn't going to get to the store very often. We have never stopped it has been such a great thing. Since we started this we have never had to worry about having food in the house. In the 3 years we have really tried to do this we have had months where we have hardly any money for food. My husband was on commission and then bought a buisness and we have had many ups and downs. Some months we have had to rely only on our food storage ( except for a little milk and produce). It's the piece of mind more than anything. The other great thing is that because of the food storage We only go shopping once a month and I can usually make anything I want because I have everything we need. It has taken us a while to figure out what we need and will use but it is so worth it.

 

Also in the State of Nevada and Utah there is a shortage of flour and rice. My neighbors and friends are panicked. I have 4 bags of four and 3 bags of rice no worries here. Why do it? The peace of mind everyday, not just for a natural disaster.

 

Annmarie

[dragons in the flower bed]

The way you describe this as the beginning of a long emergency makes sense, but I hafta tell ya. I don't want to think about it that way. Because I might be able to do something about, say a week's worth of food & water. But not more. Kwim?

 

Seeing it as a long emergency actually comforts me. We'll all need to gradually make lifestyle changes kind of like Cuba made after most of their oil supply was cut off -- bicycling more, better public transportation, growing food instead of lawns, entertaining ourselves by singing and dancing instead of watching TV. Because of the recession, which should turn into a depression if I'm right, people will gradually and slowly put these changes into effect.

 

I am not preparing a food storage supply. I'm learning to grow and find food here in "the poor neighborhood" of my small city. By planting perennial edibles that are hardy (ie, that can take care of themselves, like dandelions and sunchoke) on the sides of roads, in vacant lots, in all the small forgotten spaces, we ensure that we have a supply of food after the grocery stores have become too expensive for most folks in city.

 

I'm also trying to form people resources. Some friends and I have begun to discuss an agreement to split up the learning of traditional skills, ie, I'll learn to spin, you learn to make candles, Jane'll learn to can, and if anything happens, we'll take care of each other. We're looking for folks in biking distance who have the supplies we'll need, like chickens and bees.

 

A long, slow, emergency in which people learn better habits appeals to me, much more than a sudden emergency in which numerous people die but then we all go back to being dependent on the same resources which were just cut out.

[melissel]

Seeing it as a long emergency actually comforts me. We'll all need to gradually make lifestyle changes kind of like Cuba made after most of their oil supply was cut off -- bicycling more, better public transportation, growing food instead of lawns, entertaining ourselves by singing and dancing instead of watching TV. Because of the recession, which should turn into a depression if I'm right, people will gradually and slowly put these changes into effect.

 

I am not preparing a food storage supply. I'm learning to grow and find food here in "the poor neighborhood" of my small city. By planting perennial edibles that are hardy (ie, that can take care of themselves, like dandelions and sunchoke) on the sides of roads, in vacant lots, in all the small forgotten spaces, we ensure that we have a supply of food after the grocery stores have become too expensive for most folks in city.

 

I'm also trying to form people resources. Some friends and I have begun to discuss an agreement to split up the learning of traditional skills, ie, I'll learn to spin, you learn to make candles, Jane'll learn to can, and if anything happens, we'll take care of each other. We're looking for folks in biking distance who have the supplies we'll need, like chickens and bees.

 

A long, slow, emergency in which people learn better habits appeals to me, much more than a sudden emergency in which numerous people die but then we all go back to being dependent on the same resources which were just cut out.

 

Rose, what a great post. I never thought of most of that stuff. Thank you!

[Kathleen in VA]

Maybe they are just good scouts. :D

 

 

LOL!:lol:

 

Kathleen in VA

www.homeschoolblogger.com/lavendersblue

[Carol in Cal.]

I don't have enough for 6 months, but I do have enough for about 2. Partly this is just because I hate to shop and like the time and money efficiencies of buying in bulk. So since I have the bulk storage set up, why not keep it pretty full? But also, I hate to feel like I have no options. I think that if there was a big earthquake, at least I would be able to get by until they started flying food in.

 

My big unaddressed issue is water. Whenever there is an earthquake the first thing I do after smelling for gas is fill the bathtub and every container in the house. That way if the water lines become contaminated later, as they sometimes can do, I already have water in some quantity. I used to keep water in those big plastic jugs--about 10 gallons. But they pick up that plastic odor after a while, and I hate to think about drinking from them after that. And glass could very well break. So I just feel that I don't have a good solution in mind for a really big quake when it comes to water. I should probably break down and build a solar still or something like that, just in case.

[8filltheheart]

Several reasons, actually.

 

First, the trucking industry is the backbone of our country. As diesel prices increase, the cost of food has no choice but to increase. I can't control the price of gas, but I can purchase at lower prices now.

 

Second, China is importing huge amounts of wheat. It is causng the prices of wheat to increase.

 

Third, I am not a reactionary, but I am concerned by the number of earthquakes there have been in combination with a volcano erupting that hasn't erupted for 9000 yrs. I think having enough food to feed 9 people for a couple of months is prudent, not crazy.

 

The way I view it is that everything I have stored will last indefinitely. If we need it, we have it. If we don't, we can eat it. :)

[Kari C in SC]

Prices have gone up significantly and most indications say that they will continue to rise. Because we buy in bulk and eat from our pantry, we have been able to continue to eat at yesterday's prices today. It's a personal inflation hedge with a lot less risk than gold. :)

 

This is EXACTLY why we have been stocking up. If the power went out for 5 days, my freezer would not help me for long term. Stocking up my freezer is helping my budget as prices continue to climb. If gas continues to go up, groceries will continue to go up. Now is a great time to buy in bulk because it will save in the long run.

[Frontier Mom]

Now you have me thinking!! I have water delivery here and try to keep lots of extra on hand.

 

I do have wheat berries so we would be good there. I need to pile up on some other things now that I'm reading this post. Thanks for the heads-up.

[Tracy in Ky]

I've learned that in a crisis situation, the store shelves would be empty in 12 hours. I think it is a good idea to always have some things on hand--ibuprophen for example. I fear my children getting sick with a super high fever and I not being able to do anything about it. High fevers used to kill, before asprin etc. I consider, in an emergency--long or short, how quickly we could revert to harsh living conditions of a century ago. Bleach, soap, cough medicine, ibuprohen, water, plastic bags to contain trash (plastic comes from oil), umbrellas (from oil), toilet paper--on and on.

 

Just sharing my thoughts. If the long emergency turns out to be true, life will be harsh, and we have lost self-suffienciency skills. The book I read talked about that land will be wealth and the education that matters will be agricultural and animal husbandry. Food production will be center stage and the foremost activity.

 

Will it happen? I don't know. But (1) Y2K was a bit different because then we weren't looking at a possible loss of a material that we don't know how to live without. (2) The signs seem to be happening--increase in oil prices, increase in food prices, world wide food shortages. (3) I've read enough of the alarmist materials to be at least aware of what could happen, and I feel like I have a responsibility to try to prepare for it, even if it doesn't happen. Learning to be a little more self-sufficient is always a good thing, and a good thing to teach my children.

 

I hope it is slow, because I have so much to learn. For example--I'm growing lots and lots of onions to store. But I noticed that a few of them have a seed head on the top. What to do? What does this mean? Even though I grew up in a gardening family, and have gardened myself for years, I don't even know how to grow onions. (I've been googling onion seedheads) Ditto for everything else. We *have* lost food production skills because we are consumers mainly, dependent on oil and industry. It is scary and unsettling to me. I don't like being in such a vunerable position.

 

Those are my thoughts, my opinions, my concerns. For what it's worth. I am glad we can have these conversations, because I learn from you all. :)

 

Tracy

[finding_sanctuary]

The way I view it is that everything I have stored will last indefinitely. If we need it, we have it. If we don't, we can eat it. :)

 

Yup. That, exactly.

 

Just over a year ago, a town not so very far from here was completely destroyed by a tornado. (Greensburg, KS ... you may have heard of it.) We're right in the middle of tornado alley, so tornaodes and storms with 60+ mph winds are fairly common. Assuming a similar storm hit our area and disrupted the food supply, we'd be fine. In the event of long-term income loss, we would still be fine. Our storage has already helped us stretch our food budget during lean times and Dh's layoffs.

 

Basically, our food storage is an investment in future well-being. If we never need it, we'll still be using it as we rotate things, so nothing has actually been lost. If we do need it, though, we'll have it when food will be harder to come by.

[Danestress]

Is that if there WERE a tragic food shortage and I had a lot of food stored up, I am not sure I could use it and not share. I'm not sure I could look at my neighbors and say "My kids are more important that your kids, so mine will eat and you just do the best you can." I don't think I would want that. Of coruse, I might want it if the other option were that my children went hungry. But everyone else's children would be hungry too.

 

I think I would almost rather all be in the same boat - helping each other, trying to take care of each other, rather than be one of the "haves" in a world of "have nots."

 

I remember when Sarajevo was just destroyed by war and there was widespread food shortage and no one had enough of everything. An NPR reporter did a special on dogs in the city. How they were abandoned and homeless. This one woman said that even though they didn't really have enough food, people tended to give a bit of this or that to the dogs. She said that it made them feel like they were still human.

 

I can see that. I really feel like I would end up giving the food away and casting my lot with everyone else.

[*anj*]

Is that if there WERE a tragic food shortage and I had a lot of food stored up, I am not sure I could use it and not share. I'm not sure I could look at my neighbors and say "My kids are more important that your kids, so mine will eat and you just do the best you can." I don't think I would want that. Of course, I might want it if the other option were that my children went hungry. But everyone else's children would be hungry too.

 

That reminds me of an episode of The Twilight Zone where a family was hosting a neighborhood dinner party when suddenly they thought there was an emergency. The homeowners immediately ran for the shelter they'd prepared for themselves while the neighbors pounded on the door. The neighbors cried about how they had babies and so on, so they deserved to be let in. The homeowners said "You laughed at us when we spent our weekends preparing and working on this place. We only have enough food and enough oxygen for ourselves, we didn't prepare for you."

 

It was really amazing to see how the people who were the best of friends in one scene were enemies in another. The ugliness came out.

 

Good thing that's just tv....right?

[finding_sanctuary]

Just sharing my thoughts. If the long emergency turns out to be true, life will be harsh, and we have lost self-suffienciency skills. The book I read talked about that land will be wealth and the education that matters will be agricultural and animal husbandry. Food production will be center stage and the foremost activity.

 

Yup. I live in a suburban neighborhood with lawns like golf courses, and I put in a good-sized garden this year. It's the only one I've seen in my entire area. Gardening and basic food production is not high on the skills list around here. Neither are many other basic survival skills.

 

I hope it is slow, because I have so much to learn. For example--I'm growing lots and lots of onions to store. But I noticed that a few of them have a seed head on the top. What to do? What does this mean? Even though I grew up in a gardening family, and have gardened myself for years, I don't even know how to grow onions. (I've been googling onion seedheads) Ditto for everything else. We *have* lost food production skills because we are consumers mainly, dependent on oil and industry. It is scary and unsettling to me. I don't like being in such a vunerable position.

 

My biggest concern is that if things *do* go the way some of the more alarmist among us claim, they will go there too quickly for most of us to catch up and adapt. Life could get difficult very, very quickly, and when it's a "learn quickly or starve" situation, I'd much rather already have the know-how, kwim?

[Tracy in Ky]

Is that if there WERE a tragic food shortage and I had a lot of food stored up, I am not sure I could use it and not share.

 

I've thought about this. I think that bartering and working together would come into play. For example, come over and help in the garden, repair a fence, clean the barn, etc--in other words, work, help us produce, and then share in the benefit. Or--say I've got milk and chicken meat, you have soap and water or firewood, or gas that I could put into my tiller, etc. We trade? Sharing, working. Again--just thoughts.

[finding_sanctuary]

Is that if there WERE a tragic food shortage and I had a lot of food stored up, I am not sure I could use it and not share. I'm not sure I could look at my neighbors and say "My kids are more important that your kids, so mine will eat and you just do the best you can." I don't think I would want that. Of coruse, I might want it if the other option were that my children went hungry. But everyone else's children would be hungry too.

 

I think I would almost rather all be in the same boat - helping each other, trying to take care of each other, rather than be one of the "haves" in a world of "have nots."

 

I remember when Sarajevo was just destroyed by war and there was widespread food shortage and no one had enough of everything. An NPR reporter did a special on dogs in the city. How they were abandoned and homeless. This one woman said that even though they didn't really have enough food, people tended to give a bit of this or that to the dogs. She said that it made them feel like they were still human.

 

I can see that. I really feel like I would end up giving the food away and casting my lot with everyone else.

 

Ok, I'm probably going to get run off the WTM boards for this, but... why should you give away the food in that situation? You worked for the money to buy it, you purchased it, you stored it, you planned for the future. If they didn't, that isn't your fault. If you chose to save and store so that your children and family wouldn't starve if something happened, and then something did happen, why then turn around and guarantee that they will suffer right alongside anyone else, just a little bit later on, by giving it all away? That defeats the purpose of saving/storing in the first place.

 

That said...I would have no problem sharing my food storage, for a price. Not a monetary price, necessarily, but a value-for-value trade. One person, one family, no matter how large, will likely not have all the skills necessary to survive the sort of extended crisis situation you're talking about. Trading our food for skilled help, trading our water for other necessities, or trading our skills for things we need from others...that is a situation in which I would be willing to share my food stash with others. I wouldn't, however, just give it away to whomever came asking simply because I stored food and they didn't.

 

This isn't directed just at you, btw, but at the general "you" as well. I cannot comprehend this concept, of storing back for such emergencies, only to give the food away and throw your lot in with everyone else. Would anyone be willing to explain why they would do this?

[Pamela H in Texas]

The only reason I've ever stockpiled was because it's a LOT cheaper to do so. I used the Grocery Game and the only time I tracked it, my average weekly expenditure from Oct to Dec (~3 years ago, btw) was about $31 for a family of 4 (and that included "that" time of year). I can't even fathom another way we could eat as well so cheaply. During that time, we had convenience foods but more, we had enough money for veggies, soy, beans, etc!

 

Anyway, I haven't read this thread yet, but I wouldn't guess I'm the only one in this regard.

 

I will say that I don't believe there will be a LONG period of time of need for us. (CC ahead!) The scriptures tell us otherwise and other times an end of a time period has come, the end event itself was practically "overnight."

 

I have SO considered going back to the Grocery Game for money reasons. It's just flusterating for us because we have to drive over a couple towns. And right now, it would include hubby driving us which would be worse. And yet I look at last week's grocery bill ($240) and though it'll last a little bit except we'll need to buy veggies again, it's hard to spend $400 per month when you know you could do it under $200...isn't it almost WRONG for us NOT to expend the time and energy to save that much?

 

ETA: EEK, I just skimmed the post above mine. There is NO WAY on the whole face of the earth I would deny someone else something they needed and I had. If something bad happened to us because of it, then God will take care of that (eg, if we died of starvation, I guess we'll just wait for the resurrection).

[Magnolia]

Yup. That, exactly.

 

Just over a year ago, a town not so very far from here was completely destroyed by a tornado. (Greensburg, KS ... you may have heard of it.) We're right in the middle of tornado alley, so tornaodes and storms with 60+ mph winds are fairly common. Assuming a similar storm hit our area and disrupted the food supply, we'd be fine. In the event of long-term income loss, we would still be fine. Our storage has already helped us stretch our food budget during lean times and Dh's layoffs.

 

Basically, our food storage is an investment in future well-being. If we never need it, we'll still be using it as we rotate things, so nothing has actually been lost. If we do need it, though, we'll have it when food will be harder to come by.

 

Since you live in tornado alley, and a tornado could completely wipe out your town, where do you store your food supply so that it is available to you?

[dragons in the flower bed]

. . . other times an end of a time period has come, the end event itself was practically "overnight."

 

The two that immediately come to mind for me -- the fall of Rome and the crossover into Nazi Germany -- were both slow and gradual, not overnight.

[finding_sanctuary]

Since you live in tornado alley, and a tornado could completely wipe out your town, where do you store your food supply so that it is available to you?

 

We have a fully finished basement, and a most of our food storage/extra pantry space is in our basement, carefully stored out of the way in the strongest part of the basement. We also have an emergency/weather radio because the storm sirens are too far away to hear in anything but perfectly calm weather.

[dragons in the flower bed]

This isn't directed just at you, btw, but at the general "you" as well. I cannot comprehend this concept, of storing back for such emergencies, only to give the food away and throw your lot in with everyone else. Would anyone be willing to explain why they would do this?

 

Because . . . what's the use of my body if I have given up my soul?

[Danestress]

I cannot comprehend this concept, of storing back for such emergencies, only to give the food away and throw your lot in with everyone else. Would anyone be willing to explain why they would do this?

 

Well, I'm certainly not saying that I *would* give it away in that situation. I might well be overcome by hunger and fear and not share.

 

But I think arguably, it's the Christ-like thing to do. The good Samaritan didn't say, "Hey, I EARNED my money, and time is money, and I am not wasting it on some guy lying at the side of the road." He freely gave his time and money. I don't think Christ inteded to say "But he only did this because he had plenty to spare." But maybe. I don't know. It's a great food for thought. I'm not sure what the right thing to do is.

 

I can imagine that if everyone decided, as food became scarce, to start buying in bulk and storing it up, that food would become MORE scarce. And the rich who can afford to go out and buy vaste quantities would have great stores, whereas those who were already too poor to buy in big quantities and who live paycheck by paycheck, would then be affected by food shortages more quickly then those who were wealthy and could save. So in other words, the very action of storing up could cause others to suffer sooner than they might otherwise, assuming that supply is having trouble keeping up with demand.

[Magnolia]

We have a fully finished basement, and a most of our food storage/extra pantry space is in our basement, carefully stored out of the way in the strongest part of the basement. We also have an emergency/weather radio because the storm sirens are too far away to hear in anything but perfectly calm weather.

 

Please forgive my ignorance regarding tornado damage/destruction ( I live in the East) but the flooring above the cellar will remain intact? Your items won't be sucked out or debris collapsing on them or soaked in rain? I have couple of more questions, if you don't mind: What is the best way to store these items-what types of containers/sealers (to keep bugs out, dry etc) should I use? And, what other necessary items do you have stored in your basement to cook/prepare the food or just to live your daily lives assuming loss of electricity too? And would you actually live/be allowed to live in your basement if the rest of your house is destroyed?

 

TIA

[lori in tx]

You know we just did the depression in history and we read many stories of neighbors that got together what they had and made a huge batch of soup or stew, I might not give my neighbors food but I would say o.k. your bring something and I bring something and we can all eat.

 

Honestly Aubrey again I am a lot like you (my long lost twin) and I don't stock up. We honestly can't afford much, that being said I do have a 20 lb bag of rice sitting in my freezer and 10 lbs of pinto beans sitting in my fridge with another 5 lbs of corn meal. I am trying to have a good stock because dh job he gets paid a little hourly but makes most of his money with comission. So some weeks are very lean (and we have to pay or save up for rent and or bills instead) and other weeks I can go and get somethings. The hard thing right now for us is the cost of meat. We are now down to about 3 night of no meat, which for my dh is very hard but it is what we got to and we have to be thankful dh has a job (he was unemployed for over a year and we went through everything).

 

My next thing I want to get a stock off is flour (plain not good for white flour for our budget) and stick it in the freezer. I have seen the price of it go down this last week and when it hits $1.25 (it was a $1.50 this week and $1.76 the week before) I will buy about 4 of them for the freezer (freezing kills the bugs and keep it from going rancid longer). Since I am now cooking from scratch a lot more we are going through flour quicker.

 

So I guess the reason we have alittle bulk is because of the $$$ we have coming in is not a set amount every week, it can vary so much. don't know if I helped or even answer your question.

blessings

lori

[finding_sanctuary]

Well, I'm certainly not saying that I *would* give it away in that situation. I might well be overcome by hunger and fear and not share.

 

But I think arguably, it's the Christ-like thing to do. The good Samaritan didn't say, "Hey, I EARNED my money, and time is money, and I am not wasting it on some guy lying at the side of the road." He freely gave his time and money. I don't think Christ inteded to say "But he only did this because he had plenty to spare." But maybe. I don't know. It's a great food for thought. I'm not sure what the right thing to do is.

 

I can imagine that if everyone decided, as food became scarce, to start buying in bulk and storing it up, that food would become MORE scarce. And the rich who can afford to go out and buy vaste quantities would have great stores, whereas those who were already too poor to buy in big quantities and who live paycheck by paycheck, would then be affected by food shortages more quickly then those who were wealthy and could save. So in other words, the very action of storing up could cause others to suffer sooner than they might otherwise, assuming that supply is having trouble keeping up with demand.

 

I don't want to get into this one too deeply, because it has been a LONG time since I opened a Bible, but as I recall, the Samaritan did not risk his life to save the man lying beaten on the road. Yes, he spent his time and his money, and those were naturally his by right to spend as he chose. He did not chose to help the man at the expense of his own quality of life. Food and water are necessary for life. When we speak of giving away our food storage, we are talking about giving away life, not just a bit of time or money, especially if the situation is one in which replacements for that food will be impossible or simply severly limited.

 

As for your second point, I can only address myself and my family's situation. I have been slowly stocking for a long time (years). I am not rushing out to buy simply because food is scarce. I am focusing my efforts somewhat more on things which are most important to me and which are most likely to be difficult to acquire for current prices later on, but I am not doing anything I would not be doing in better times. I do not see my actions/purchases adding to the sort of situation you are describing, but then I have not bought everything all at once. I have had to scrimp and save to do it, and during lean times when we were living paycheck to paycheck I had to scale back on adding to the storage and actually live off of it instead.

[Jenny in Florida]

. . . living in Florida--and moving here just about the time we had a string of hurricanes--has meant that we have become more aware of keeping our pantry stocked with at least some staples. Three years ago, we did lose power for almost three days, and we were awfully glad we had bottled water and some essentials on hand.

 

Currently, I'm moving toward buying in larger quantities and storing ahead mostly for the sake of convenience (cutting down on time spent going to the grocery store) and to get control of our grocery budget.

[finding_sanctuary]

Please forgive my ignorance regarding tornado damage/destruction ( I live in the East) but the flooring above the cellar will remain intact? Your items won't be sucked out or debris collapsing on them or soaked in rain? I have couple of more questions, if you don't mind: What is the best way to store these items-what types of containers/sealers (to keep bugs out, dry etc) should I use? And, what other necessary items do you have stored in your basement to cook/prepare the food or just to live your daily lives assuming loss of electricity too? And would you actually live/be allowed to live in your basement if the rest of your house is destroyed?

 

TIA

 

My house is pretty new (2001), with a concrete poured basement and foundation. The storage area is in the most structurally sound part of the basement. We're re-stocking our 72-hour emergency kits which include no-cook emergency meals and basic first aid materials, etc, and those are kept in our emergency storage space.

 

As for the how/what/etc. of our main storage...

We store in food-grade buckets with metallized liners and air-tight gamma seal lids for some of the more important items -- rice, beans, flour, sugar, etc. I have a 5-gallon food-grade bucket of honey, as well. (That's more for meadmaking than anything else, though.) We are currently putting together an emergency food prep kit in a rubbermaid tub...since we have both a gas and a charcoal grill available, it will include things which can be used for grilling, assuming we're simply without power for whatever reason and still have our house in one piece.

 

No, we're not likely to be allowed to live in a damaged structure, even if we wanted to. My husband has a travel trailer he uses for work, and assuming our house was destroyed, we'd take what we could of our food supplies and find somewhere to go until things were better.

[Tracy in Ky]

Another thing to think about is this: if things get as bad as they could (with life after peak oil), stockpiling food will only help for so long--until the stockpiled food runs out. That is why I think that concentrating on learning food production skills is so important.

[finding_sanctuary]

Another thing to think about is this: if things get as bad as they could (with life after peak oil), stockpiling food will only help for so long--until the stockpiled food runs out. That is why I think that concentrating on learning food production skills is so important.

 

See, that's where the stockpile helps, in this situation...it will get you through until you find your place on the learning curve. If you already have the skills, great, and you might not need so much put back. But, if you *don't* have the skills, you will (hopefully) have time to learn them before you starve/suffer. Not to mention, you can only grow food for so much of the year in a garden, and not everyone can have chickens, goats, cows, etc. (I wish I could raise some chicks and a goat...darn HOA :glare:) The stockpile isn't the long-term solution, it's the thing that will get you through until the situation gets better, or you learn how to grow/produce your own, whichever comes first.

 

So (and this isn't snarky) are you teaching your kids gardening basics, too?

[Night Elf]

After reading some of the replies, I am curious how people affected by Katrina could have been helped by stockpiling food and paper products. Wasn't all the food and stuff in the homes ruined because it was all under water? If I stockpile food in my house and a tornado smashes it to bits, how does the stockpiling help me? Or are we talking about burying things in a steel room like bomb shelters? Which still wouldn't have helped the homes under water in New Orleans (my birth place actually).

[Robin in Tx]

I do not store for the long haul... but I do like to have a couple of week's worth around, especially during hurricane season. The problem, though, is that if you do suffer a power outage then preparing food you've stored is difficult. No electricity, no oven to bake bread (and no power to grind that grain! LOL)... we have a generator but gasoline during a major power outage is very difficult to come by... propane for a gas grill only lasts so long... and clean water isn't always available. What you need in times like that are foods I normally don't like to purchase/eat - canned foods (fruits, vegetables, meats, pastas) - something that you can open and eat without preparation. That's not the same sort of thing as storing grains and dried foods, etc., in the event of a general food shortage problem. And boy howdy do I know what a huge mistake it is to have a freezer full of meats, etc., when a hurricane hits.

 

This reminds me of a really funny comment I heard last year at our homeschool convention... it was one of the speakers (I won't say which one :))... we were hanging around her booth talking and somehow the topic of Y2K came up. She said that everyone at her church purchased food for storage, but that she didn't... she said that her family are all big hunters, and they told their friends at church that they'd let them store up the food and if things got real bad they'd just come with their guns to get *their* food. LOL She wasn't really serious about that - her husband is an elder in their church - you would have had to have been there to understand how she was gesting... it was really, really funny.. But you know... there's a lesson there... if you really are worried about this, better keep your food storage hush hush!

[finding_sanctuary]

After reading some of the replies, I am curious how people affected by Katrina could have been helped by stockpiling food and paper products. Wasn't all the food and stuff in the homes ruined because it was all under water? If I stockpile food in my house and a tornado smashes it to bits, how does the stockpiling help me? Or are we talking about burying things in a steel room like bomb shelters? Which still wouldn't have helped the homes under water in New Orleans (my birth place actually).

 

Well, you plan and store according to your location and the likely threats. It would take a flood of literally Biblical proportions in order to flood my area, so I don't worry about that. People who have to plan for hurricanes would be going about things an entirely different way than my family is, simply because the threat is different. I would guess the storage location would likely have to be elsewhere than a basement or underground, everything would need to be watertight, and preferrably everything would be portable for evacuation if at all possible. But, as I said, that's just a guess. My focus is on preparing for threats that make sense in my area -- tornadoes, power and utility outages, job loss, economic downturn. My system wouldn't have meant much in a situation like Katrina, though the buckets would likely still be sealed and dry...just underwater.

[finding_sanctuary]

This reminds me of a really funny comment I heard last year at our homeschool convention... it was one of the speakers (I won't say which one :))... we were hanging around her booth talking and somehow the topic of Y2K came up. She said that everyone at her church purchased food for storage, but that she didn't... she said that her family are all big hunters, and they told their friends at church that they'd let them store up the food and if things got real bad they'd just come with their guns to get *their* food. LOL She wasn't really serious about that - her husband is an elder in their church - you would have had to have been there to understand how she was gesting... it was really, really funny.. But you know... there's a lesson there... if you really are worried about this, better keep your food storage hush hush!

 

You know, that's why I love that my food storage includes my husband's gun cabinet...and that he's a great shot. If they managed to take the food, it wouldn't matter to us anymore anyway. Over my dead body, in the most literal sense.

 

Yes, this person was joking, but that situation is not far from the truth...in the case of a long-term situation, a seriously BAD situation, where the dung hits the fan and our country ends up in the sort of situation you only see on TV, there are some who would turn bandit and robber to get by, and it wouldn't be the sort of person you'd think that was doing it.

 

ETA: I'm bowing out now...I have a lot to get done today, and this conversation is sucking me in too much. I'm off to do some gardening with the small one.

[Tracy in Ky]

See, that's where the stockpile helps, in this situation...it will get you through until you find your place on the learning curve.

 

I agree with you completely. I think it is crucially important to have a stockpile. (I was just noticing today that the can of salmon I opened was good until 2012!! I thought, "I can stock up on salmon!" lol).

 

I guess I was just thinking about long, long term, and what would we do when the stockpile ran out. The learning curve is what makes me so nervous--I have so, so much to learn!

 

You are so right--I was just talking to dh a bit ago about how much there is to learn. And we can't learn it all at once. It HAS to come slowly. Yes, a stockpile is crucial I think.

 

So (and this isn't snarky) are you teaching your kids gardening basics, too?

 

Yes, I am. They've been out there helping--ds tilling, planting, weeding, hauling dirt for me. Dd planting, weeding, digging, removing aphids from her peas.

 

I'm trying to make sure they learn what I learn. For example, I waited to cultivate the onions until after the rain, because by cultivating you allow water to get to the roots. In this case, we have had so much rain, that I didn't want to encourage too much water to soak in, so even though they needed weeding, I wanted to wait until after the rain. I explained to ds what I was doing and why (that particular onion patch is his! lol) Same thing with the seed heads on those onions--he knows what I learned, and what needs to be done.

 

I know so little, and I'm trying to bring them along as I learn.

 

You bring up great points.

[Tracy in Ky]

 

 

My biggest concern is that if things *do* go the way some of the more alarmist among us claim, they will go there too quickly for most of us to catch up and adapt. Life could get difficult very, very quickly, and when it's a "learn quickly or starve" situation, I'd much rather already have the know-how, kwim?

 

Yes, I agree completely. I'd rather have the knowhow in advance, too :)

[dangermom]

 

After reading some of the replies, I am curious how people affected by Katrina could have been helped by stockpiling food and paper products. Wasn't all the food and stuff in the homes ruined because it was all under water? If I stockpile food in my house and a tornado smashes it to bits, how does the stockpiling help me? Or are we talking about burying things in a steel room like bomb shelters? Which still wouldn't have helped the homes under water in New Orleans (my birth place actually).

What people affected by Katrina needed was more like the emergency 72-hour kit that is often considered part of food storage. It's supposed to be 3 days' worth of food, water purification tablets, a little radio, that sort of thing all collected in a backpack you can grab and take with you in an emergency. That way, if you're sitting on the roof of your house waiting to be rescued, at least you have a bit of food and so on to keep you going.

[Danestress]

I want to be clear, Angela, that I am in no way criticizing you for planning ahead, nor am I saying that you are required to give away food.

 

I am simply saying that all these threads are making me think about these things. Some have always stocked. But many are getting interested in it now because of the perception that there will be a food crisis. If half the nation gets on the storage bandwagon, might that hurt the poorest in our society? It might. Can't say. Just thinking out loud.

 

I am also not saying that I think you would be bad or wrong to keep your stored for yourself or to only barter it to those who have something valuable to give in exchange. I personally don't know how I feel about that for *myself* but that doesn't mean I have decided what is "right" and what is "wrong." I've just been thinking about what it would be like if I did have an attic full of food - say a 4 month supply - and people around me were starving.

 

Would I want to keep all of it for myself just in case? Would I give away some but keep enough in case things got even worse? Would I give to those who are shut-ins? Mother's who just delivered? Women who are pregnant and have no husbands? Would I help the orphans and widows or not? I really don't know. I just can't imagine living that way - having enough for my family, but watching others starve. Thinking about having all that food sounds like "security" but I wonder how secure I would really feel - how safe and at peace - if the streets were full of starving, dying people.

[Kelli in TN]

The problem, though, is that if you do suffer a power outage then preparing food you've stored is difficult. No electricity, no oven to bake bread (and no power to grind that grain! LOL!

 

 

We have a grill, a campstove and a dutch oven. So we could cook. I don't know HOW we would grind our grain though.

 

I was thinking it might not be a bad idea to buy some sort of grinding device that would work for grain and, more importantly, for coffee beans. I cannot bring myself to buy ground coffee, but in an emergency (ice storm, tornado damage, etc) I can't be facing the stress of the situation AND no coffee.:willy_nilly: We have a percolator from when we used to camp, but I would hate to have to sit there and grind those coffee beans with a rock. Mind you, I'd do it if I had to, but there has to be an easier way.

[*anj*]

I was thinking it might not be a bad idea to buy some sort of grinding device that would work for grain and, more importantly, for coffee beans. I cannot bring myself to buy ground coffee, but in an emergency (ice storm, tornado damage, etc) I can't be facing the stress of the situation AND no coffee.:willy_nilly: We have a percolator from when we used to camp, but I would hate to have to sit there and grind those coffee beans with a rock. Mind you, I'd do it if I had to, but there has to be an easier way.

 

I hear you!

If worse came to worse I would just chew on the coffee beans. You get a lot more bang for your buck! :D

 

Dh went and got me some coffee beans the other day. I told him that I wanted Verona (from Starbucks.) He brought me back Verona--but it was decaf!!!! :001_huh:

The next morning I took it back. When the guy handed me the bag of regular Verona he asked if I wanted it ground and I looked at him like he had three heads. Why would I do that? There is nothing like the smell and flavor of freshly ground coffee beans. Mmmmmm.....I'm feeling tempted to make myself a cup right now!

 

What kind of coffee beans do you buy? Didn't you tell me that you order yours from someplace online?

[Kate CA]

We have a grill, a campstove and a dutch oven. So we could cook. I don't know HOW we would grind our grain though.

 

I was thinking it might not be a bad idea to buy some sort of grinding device that would work for grain and, more importantly, for coffee beans. I cannot bring myself to buy ground coffee, but in an emergency (ice storm, tornado damage, etc) I can't be facing the stress of the situation AND no coffee.:willy_nilly: We have a percolator from when we used to camp, but I would hate to have to sit there and grind those coffee beans with a rock. Mind you, I'd do it if I had to, but there has to be an easier way.

 

This post *so* deserves some positive rep, but they won't let me give it to you. Wahh! I loved this. :tongue_smilie:

[Tracy in Ky]

I can't be facing the stress of the situation AND no coffee.:willy_nilly:

 

I hear you, Sister.