Mother not informed that her daughter left school for an abortion

[msjones]

Do you think anything illegal happened here?

 

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/88971742.html

 

I'm a bit surprised that this made the news here in my very liberal city.

 

The teen health clinic arranged for a student to leave school for an abortion. The mother had signed a consent form for her daughter to access care through the clinic. The clinic is on school grounds, but is staffed entirely by a local hospital. Abortion is legal. In this state a girl can obtain an abortion without parent consent at age 13.

 

I find it very disturbing -- depressing that this is what things have come to-- but I'm not surprised. Nor do I see that anything illegal happened. Thoughts?

[Orthodox6]

The moral and legal climate of the location is such that nothing illegal occurred. The state evidently does not require parental notification. What I believe about the events is an entirely different discussion.

[4wildberrys]

Illegal? Of course not----now if a teacher had DARE to utter a prayer in class or she had learned the Judeo-Christian heritage of America's founding father ins depth---now THAT would have been illegal and grounds for an uprising!! :glare:

 

Seriously sick.

[CatMomof3]

Legally nothing was done wrong. Now morally (I won't get into that - I am just sickened).

 

I do find it interesting that in the article it said "They just told her that if she concealed it from her family, that it would be free of charge and no financial responsibility." So if Jill wanted her mother there for support than it would have cost money. Also who is paying for the "free" abortion, Washington tax payers?

[Tiff in TX]

While I am disgusted that this can happen, the only thing that might have broken the law is that they put her in a taxi and sent her to the place to perform the abortion. Doesn't the school need a permission slip for the student to leave school grounds? Did no one escort her?

 

This certainly isn't the main thing wrong with the whole situation, but it is something.

[JeneralMom]

Doesn't sound like anything illegal happened.

[creekland]

It depends heavily on that consent form. At our school we can't give kids an aspirin (or anything else) without specific consent for it. They also can not leave the building for a field trip or other event (clubs, etc) without a consent form signed unless they are 18+ and living independently.

 

Pending what's in the consent form... it might be legal - or not.

[OhM]

They also can not leave the building for a field trip or other event (clubs, etc) without a consent form signed unless they are 18+ and living independently.

 

Pending what's in the consent form... it might be legal - or not.

 

:iagree: If she signed consent for unspecified "treatment" by the clinic - maybe no grounds to complain there, but our school district doesn't allow students to leave school grounds during the school day. If they turn up missing, parents are immediately notified. They also must have signed consent to leave w/staff supervision for field trips, etc.

[Crissy]

"We had no idea this was being facilitated on campus," said Jill. "They just told her that if she concealed it from her family, that it would be free of charge and no financial responsibility."

This sounds a bit like an angry mother telling only part of the truth. I would be curious to know what the clinic actually told the girl.

 

"Makes me feel like my rights were completely stripped away."

Based on the few details given, it appears that the mother 'signed away' her rights.

[Crissy]

but our school district doesn't allow students to leave school grounds during the school day.

 

I don't know about Ballard HS, but a number of schools and districts in our area have an open campus policy. Kids can come and go for lunch, etc.

Edited March 24, 2010 by Crissy

[titianmom]

I've been reading into HIPAA and other issues. See the following link, and for your info, you can browse Table 1 at the bottom of the page (pop up window for the Roe V Wade issues).

 

This has been a long time coming, folks and the laws have been around for decades. I don't like it, but they're there.

 

-----------

 

Link to report:

 

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/456472_6

 

Excerpt (to see Table 1, you have to follow link to the report, above.):

Minors now have access to confidential contraceptive services and the earlier cases set legal precedent for Roe v Wade in 1972 and legal abortion services.[48] The Court held a Texas law criminalizing all abortions except those to save the mother's life violated the constitutional right to privacy. Justice Blackmun stated, "The unborn have never been recognized in the law as persons in the whole sense."[48] It has been 30 years since the Supreme Court ruled that the relationship between a woman and her provider was a private matter, not subject to government interference in Roe v Wade. Justice Harry Blackmun declared that the Fourteenth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution extends the right of privacy to women "broad enough to encompass a woman's decision whether or not to terminate her pregnancy."[48] This landmark case, along with previous contraceptive cases, allows adolescents access to appropriate information and crucial contraceptive services including abortion. Table 1 outlines the legal history of the abortion debate.

 

 

FOLKS: This reminds me of the 1857 legal decision (Dred Scott) that said that Africans were not really people and owners can do whatever they want with their "property".

 

We're a messed up country IMHO.

 

Kim

Edited March 24, 2010 by titianmom

[smrtmama]

I'm glad this girl had access to a safe, legal abortion.

[Orthodox6]

The question is, if I understand OP's drift, that the MINOR child's mother was not informed. Very different issue, and an equally serious one.

 

I'm glad this girl had access to a safe, legal abortion.

[snickelfritz]

And signed away her right to be notified.......It's her own fault.

 

She signed the consent and knew that it went beyond a tylenol in the middle of the day (physical for sports and Birth Control Pills--which means female exams----were listed as things she EXPECTED her daughter to have access to via this clinic.)

 

Beyond that, it sounds like the daughter could have easily arranged it all herself or with the help of friends.

Edited March 24, 2010 by snickelfritz

[creekland]

The question is, if I understand OP's drift, that the MINOR child's mother was not informed. Very different issue, and an equally serious one.

 

Speaking of this issue, my oldest couldn't have his broken collar bone treated without my consent. He had to lie in pain until I was there (hospital)... I was told they needed parental consent to do anything that wasn't life threatening and if it had been something life threatening they could only do the basics needed to save a life until they had consent. Why is an abortion different? Or is it just because I live in a different state and those are state laws? Curious minds want to know.

[Ester Maria]

I'm glad this girl had access to a safe, legal abortion.

That, and nothing illegal happened if the mother in question willingly signed an agreement with a clinic for which she knew that it kept the information confidential (if she didn't know it, she can only blame herself for signing the contract without reading it), i.e. she must have counted on not being informed, from the clinic, about what's going on with her daughter.

 

Personally I find this a HUGE mother-daughter trust and overall relationship issue (note that her daughter chose not to tell her that she was pregnant and that she made one of the big life decisions), but not really a legal issue.

[asta]

Speaking of this issue, my oldest couldn't have his broken collar bone treated without my consent. He had to lie in pain until I was there (hospital)... I was told they needed parental consent to do anything that wasn't life threatening and if it had been something life threatening they could only do the basics needed to save a life until they had consent. Why is an abortion different? Or is it just because I live in a different state and those are state laws? Curious minds want to know.

 

Because the mother had signed a pre-existing consent-to-treat form.

 

 

a

[snickelfritz]

.

Personally I find this a HUGE mother-daughter trust and overall relationship issue (note that her daughter chose not to tell her that she was pregnant and that she made one of the big life decisions), but not really a legal issue.

[Mejane]

Based on the few details given, it appears that the mother 'signed away' her rights.

 

Yes, sounds like Mom should've checked out exactly what services the clinic performed before signing.

 

As an aside, I find it interesting Mom describes her daughter as pro-life.

Projection? Wishful thinking? Or perhaps daughter simply changed her mind when the argument wasn't quite so abstract?

[Scuff]

Doesn't look like anything illegal happened. But, I find it a bit crazy that these school officials and Drs thought it was a good idea. A 13yo girl is immature, especially in thought and reasoning. What if she has complications? If she doesn't have the guts to tell her parents about this in the first place, is she going to get the help she needs when something goes wrong? Even if they told the mother after the fact, someone needs to be there to look out for her.

[unsinkable]

Oh, the heartbreak of this world.

 

I am praying for this girl.

[HRAAB]

Doesn't look like anything illegal happened. But, I find it a bit crazy that these school officials and Drs thought it was a good idea. A 13yo girl is immature, especially in thought and reasoning. What if she has complications? If she doesn't have the guts to tell her parents about this in the first place, is she going to get the help she needs when something goes wrong? Even if they told the mother after the fact, someone needs to be there to look out for her.

 

The girl was 15 - not that it makes any difference. Other than that, this is my worry, too. The girl needs support. If she had that at home, would she have gone to the school behind her mother's back? I don't know that answer, of course. She especially needs support (medical and emotional) now. I hope she gets it from her family.

[Cera]

I'm glad this girl had access to a safe, legal abortion.

 

:iagree:

[babysparkler]

I'm wondering if the school clinic would provide the resources to treat (and pay for) any complications that would arise from this surgical procedure, or if they would then notify the parents to bring their insurance card and wallet. I'm surprised that a school district would take on such a liability.

[creekland]

Because the mother had signed a pre-existing consent-to-treat form.

 

a

 

I guess then it goes back to what the consent form says. I had signed a consent form for my son for ps and nurse, etc, (where he broke his collar bone - in gym class), but it was not ok for that to carry over to the hospital (apparently - I'd have had no problem with him having been treated due to it, but they required direct consent).

[astrid]

As an aside, I find it interesting Mom describes her daughter as pro-life.

Projection? Wishful thinking? Or perhaps daughter simply changed her mind when the argument wasn't quite so abstract?

 

Methoughts exactly, Mejane!

 

astrid

[msjones]

I don't know about Ballard HS, but a number of schools and districts in our area have an open campus policy. Kids can come and go for lunch, etc.

 

Yes. It is an open campus. Kids are free to come and go. A permission slip is only required if the kids are taken on a school-sponsored trip.

[Carrie12345]

 

Personally I find this a HUGE mother-daughter trust and overall relationship issue (note that her daughter chose not to tell her that she was pregnant and that she made one of the big life decisions), but not really a legal issue.

 

:iagree:

[RoughCollie]

I used this article as a jumping-off point for a discussion with my DD.

 

She said that she would not do anything to get pregnant, and told me her reasons for that. Knowing DD, she means what she says.

 

I asked if she would be afraid to tell me, and she said no.

 

She said she thinks my response would be, "You're an idiot [for getting pregnant]. Let's go buy baby clothes."

 

She knows me well, too, although I would not call her an idiot.

[babysparkler]

 

She said she thinks my response would be, "You're an idiot [for getting pregnant]. Let's go buy baby clothes."

 

She knows me well, too, although I would not call her an idiot.

 

:)

[asta]

Because the mother had signed a pre-existing consent-to-treat form.

 

 

a

 

OK, I just found out that I spoke in error.

 

In Washington state, the consent form was irrelevant. The girl had the right to have the procedure done as long as she was 13 or older.

 

In the best of circumstances, a young woman would be able to talk to her parents about an abortion decision. For some young women, however, doing so would expose them to abuse from parents an- gered by the fact they have become sexually active. We cannot know the circumstances every young woman faces regarding an unwanted pregnancy, and thus, we cannot legislate what she should do.

 

Abortion is not the only area where state law allows a minor to be treated without parental consent. For example, minors over the age of 13 years can obtain outpatient treatment without parental consent for drug and alcohol dependency, mental health problems, and sexually transmitted diseases. In these areas, the disclosure to some parents could harm the minor, and the minor might not seek treatment if parental disclosure were required. The abortion decision raises similar issues for some young women.

source

 

It's just sad all the way around. I would hope that I would have a better relationship with my daughter (if I had one).

 

 

a

[msjones]

I'm wondering if the school clinic would provide the resources to treat (and pay for) any complications that would arise from this surgical procedure, or if they would then notify the parents to bring their insurance card and wallet. I'm surprised that a school district would take on such a liability.

 

I believe that although these clinics are housed on campus, they are not district programs -- similar to childcare centers, night schools, churches or senior centers that meet on school campuses.

[edithcrawley]

I'm glad this girl had access to a safe, legal abortion.

 

 

:iagree:

 

 

 

 

I'm happy that the girl had a choice in what she wanted to do with her body.

[Jackie in AR]

 

I'm happy that the girl had a choice in what she wanted to do with her body.

 

Too bad her child didn't have that same choice.

[Jackie in AR]

I'm glad this girl had access to a safe, legal abortion.

 

And I am sorry that she was allowed to have her child killed.

[smrtmama]

And I am sorry that she was allowed to have her child killed.

 

I'm sorry you feel the need to turn this previously civil discussion into something incendiary.

[Rosy]

No, it's not illegal. Things like this have been going on in many states for many years. The lack of knowledge the public has about abortion laws is shocking to me.

 

I grieve for the girl (who, as I understand, now regrets her decision) and the mom. But the fact that the rest of this state is feigning outrage over access to abortion being too easy is irritating. We (not me personally) have been voting for this for a long time! Now we decide to get angry? What do people think it means when they support a candidate with a 100% NARAL approval rating?

[babysparkler]

Too bad her child didn't have that same choice.

:iagree: That is always my first thought when I hear people talking about freedom of choice. I guess there are many instances of people's freedoms taking others' freedoms away (ie smoking bans), but this one involves life/death in a closer way, I think. At least, that is how I feel.

Edited March 24, 2010 by babysparkler

[babysparkler]

I believe that although these clinics are housed on campus, they are not district programs -- similar to childcare centers, night schools, churches or senior centers that meet on school campuses.

 

Okay... that makes more sense to me, I guess.

[Crimson Wife]

What makes no sense to me is that the legal age of consent for s*x in my state (CA) is 18 but girls young as 12 can legally get contraception and/or abortion without parental notification. So how is that not either aiding & abetting a crime (for contraception) or concealing a crime (for abortion)? :confused:

[Melinda in VT]

What makes no sense to me is that the legal age of consent for s*x in my state (CA) is 18 but girls young as 12 can legally get contraception and/or abortion without parental notification. So how is that not either aiding & abetting a crime (for contraception) or concealing a crime (for abortion)? :confused:

 

Not all sex is consensual.

[lionfamily1999]

So the contraception is just in case they have non-consensual sex?

[Orthodox6]

Everybody stop and think, now. Don't just react with emotional reflexes.

 

Although the two posts, in tandem, do provide tinder for argument, which we have been reminded to avoid, fairness in this instance would have required your same remark to be posted in reply to the support expressed in favor of abortion. It is unjust to call one side of a divisive issue "wrong" for speaking her mind, yet allow the other side of a divisive issue to do the same thing and make no comment. I speak for nearly any topic, not just this one of abortion. If "A" may speak in favor of an issue, "B" possesses equal right to speak against. In the case of this thread, both parties expressed themselves with appropriate public manners. I have no problem with either person's style of post.

 

 

I'm sorry you feel the need to turn this previously civil discussion into something incendiary.

[Crimson Wife]

Not all sex is consensual.

 

Exactly! So rather than covering up the evidence of a rape by performing an abortion, the girl ought to be receiving psychological counseling and legal assistance.

[lionfamily1999]

Everybody stop and think, now. Don't just react with emotional reflexes.

 

Although the two posts, in tandem, do provide tinder for argument, which we have been reminded to avoid, fairness in this instance would have required your same remark to be posted in reply to the support expressed in favor of abortion. It is unjust to call one side of a divisive issue "wrong" for speaking her mind, yet allow the other side of a divisive issue to do the same thing and make no comment. I speak for nearly any topic, not just this one of abortion. If "A" may speak in favor of an issue, "B" possesses equal right to speak against. In the case of this thread, both parties expressed themselves with appropriate public manners. I have no problem with either person's style of post.

Just so we're clear... What you're saying is... everyone is entitled to their opinion? And, if someone's opinion differs then it doesn't necessarily mean they're picking a fight? And they even have the right to write said opinion?

 

Shocking.

 

Simply shocking.

[Melinda in VT]

So the contraception is just in case they have non-consensual sex?

 

It's possible that a teenage girl being repeatedly molested, for example, would choose birth control as a way to prevent pregnancy even if she can't extricate herself from the abusive situation.

 

I'll grant you that I don't think that's why the majority of kids on bc are on it. But I think cases like that are one reason minors have legal access to birth control and abortion in some states. Lawmakers are trying to cover the worst-case scenario.

[Melinda in VT]

Exactly! So rather than covering up the evidence of a rape by performing an abortion, the girl ought to be receiving psychological counseling and legal assistance.

 

I don't disagree about the counseling and legal assistance.

 

An abortion would not rule out evidence being gathered at the time.

[lionfamily1999]

It's possible that a teenage girl being repeatedly molested, for example, would choose birth control as a way to prevent pregnancy even if she can't extricate herself from the abusive situation.

 

I'll grant you that I don't think that's why the majority of kids on bc are on it. But I think cases like that are one reason minors have legal access to birth control and abortion in some states. Lawmakers are trying to cover the worst-case scenario.

That's a bit of a stretch. A girl, being abused, is unable to report the abuse, but will happily submit to a pelvic examination by a doctor that will apparently not notice signs of abuse, in order to get pills she has to take daily (and hide, I'm sure), just so the abuse can continue, but at least she won't get pregnant?

 

Wow, I wish excuses like that worked for everyone. I robbed the bank, because I thought there was a chance that someone using the bank was doing drugs and this way I could prevent them from over dosing! Really!

[Mrs Mungo]

I'm pro-choice but I don't understand why a minor can get contraception or an abortion without parental notification. I understand the sentiment and the various reasons teens may desire it (especially teens in troubled situations and/or homes) but I don't agree that it is *safe*.

 

Many teens are on medications or have medical issues of which the caregiver may not be aware. This is *exactly* why schools cannot give ibuprofen or something without parental permission. It makes no sense from a medical care standpoint.

 

What if their primary care doctor gives them a medication that interferes with bc? What if they start smoking?

 

It's a tough issue, imo.

[Melinda in VT]

That's a bit of a stretch. A girl, being abused, is unable to report the abuse, but will happily submit to a pelvic examination by a doctor that will apparently not notice signs of abuse, in order to get pills she has to take daily (and hide, I'm sure), just so the abuse can continue, but at least she won't get pregnant?

 

Wow, I wish excuses like that worked for everyone. I robbed the bank, because I thought there was a chance that someone using the bank was doing drugs and this way I could prevent them from over dosing! Really!

 

:001_huh:

 

Oops. Sorry. I thought we were having a discussion. I can see I was wrong.