Opioid epidemic

[rmtzc2009]

We're considering moving across the country to have access to medical marijuana for this reason. I have a very cut and dry, obvious condition that causes chronic pain, ie I'm not someone just claiming I have a vague pain somewhere for some unknown reason. My doctors acknowledge that I'm in a lot of pain, that they should be giving me opioids, but they can't risk doing it. Especially as a long term treatment with no other solution. So I'm in constant pain. Last night, I was sobbing on the floor for half an hour, unable to move.

 

I love our home. DH loves his job. We don't want to move. But medical marijuana may be our only recourse. We're going on a trip this summer to a recreational state to try it (I'm so boring, I've never smoked marijuana). If it makes a big difference, we might just have to move for that reason alone. (We live in the South, in a state that still has dry counties. We'll be the last to legalize it.)

Medical Marijuana has honestly given me my life back. I don't want to derail the thread but feel free to pm me if you have questions. Edited February 2, 2018 by Momof3IL

[PeacefulChaos]

I just wanted to say that I know exactly how you feel.  I have really really high pain with childbirth; pretty much a level of pain for each centimeter dilated.  By transition, I am incoherent.  I had my 3rd child  too quickly for an epidural (or anything else, of course) and also had a post-partum hemorrhage, and when I went into labor with my 4th, they were just as slow as molasses in triage.  I arrived at the hospital 4cm dilated with pain at a 4, and by the time I was in a room I was 6cm with pain at a 6.  They sent for the lady to come do the bloodwork but said the anaesthesiologist might be half an hour, he was at breakfast, etc.  I remember sitting on the bed and crying to DH, they're not going to make it in time.  I'm going to have to do it without meds again.  I can't do it again. etc.

 

They did get there in time for that pregnancy, but not for the next one, and the next one was much worse with a larger baby.  I had a mild form of PTSD for a long time afterward.\

 

Incidentally, I have dark hair and a decent pain tolerance otherwise.  I have taken I think one vicodin in my life, when I had 4 wisdom teeth removed (with only local anesthetic) at 18.

 

I liked but then wanted to let you know I'm liking for solidarity, not because I like what happened!  :grouphug:

[TravelingChris]

I am a chronic pain person due to RA mostly and started taking opioids after NSAIDS caused esophageal spasms (which feel like heart attacks) after I took them for many years.  It has been 18 years since I have had opioids as my primary pain reliever - now not only can I not take NSAIDS due to esophageal damage but also because I take Coumadin.  So it is basically opioids or nothing.  I get no high at all.  My pain does not disappear but lessens.  And I am not addicted nor dependent in that I can and do stop taking them for many days in a row when my pain is less. For the last few years as my arthritis has gotten under better control, I am taking less opioids.  But I do not get why people say it isn't any good for chronic pain- it sure helps me and with no side effects either.  I do not get sleepy, loopy, or anything else.  No one can tell if I had a pill or a half or not. I also don\t think that for non-addictive persons it is a bad drug category at all.  Much less harmful than steroids (which I also take and have caused weaken bones, cataracts, and high blood pressure in me)  NSAIDS can cause severe digestive issues and also raise the risk of heart attacks (except for good old aspirin). Tylenol not only doesn't do almost anything to pain, even slight overdoses cause liver damage and if not following dosing directions exactly, liver failure can occur/  Now ooioids can decrease breathing so care must be used with not taking too much and maybe not using when having breathing issues.

[Joules]

Probably because so many of them- as evidenced in this thread- think, "I would never get addicted to opioids. Only trashy/stupid/immoral people end up addicted to stuff like that. They're reaping what they sow and they deserve whatever happens to them, and I certainly don't want my tax dollars going to bail them out of their poor decisions." 

 

That's probably because most of us without personal experience only ever see the end result of addiction, where people are lying in their car unconscious from an overdose, unshowered, and generally looking like crap while CPS takes their kids. It's easy to think, "I'm not that kind of person, that could never happen to me."

 

Most of those people didn't start out that way, though, and they're at the tail end of a long, steep decline. Many of them were normal, middle class people until they got into a car accident. Or hurt their back. Or whatever.

 

 

As someone who is in group (and individual) therapy for chronic pain.  Many chronic pain patients, who aren't addicted, were normal, middle class, productive citizens until that car accident, illness, or whatever.  Many of them, with proper pain management can lead productive lives again.  Without proper pain management, they sit on the couch, draw disability, and become more and more depressed.  

 

Some of us really care about those people and see the "solution" to the opioid epidemic as taking away their lives.  It's really not that we don't care about the addicts.  

 

Chronic pain is different. The advil/tylenol thing can really help...but with constant use, many develop allergies to the NSAIDS and your liver can only take so much tylenol before the doc says no more.  For me the NSAIDS allergy was five years ago and now my liver numbers are up.  For some people careful opioid use is the best answer, and I feel for the people losing that.  One thing that isn't mentioned is that some people DON'T become addicted even with long term use.  It's 40-60% genetic, not under an individual's control.  Addicts aren't bad people any more than I am a bad person for developing an allergy to NSAIDS.

 

I just suffer with therapy and natural options.  It's been years since I used an opioid.  When I did, I took it two nights a week.  The pain is so horrible that sleep is rare.  Just a couple of nights sleep a week was enough to make me functional and productive.  Other people I know do take it daily, and it is enough to work.  They wouldn't be working without it.  As the opioid epidemic reaction increases, some of these people are having their lives taken away.

 

I wish I had a solution.  I think better medical care would help so much.  More contact with the patients to understand who is being helped and who is being hurt by the pills?  Maybe nurse practitioners that have time to talk to the patient, rather than a doc who spends 5 minutes and decides refill or no refill?  Treating marijuana just like any other drug in the system?  Insurance paying for constant therapy for chronic pain patients?  

 

I just wanted to share the other side to show that people who are concerned about the "solution" aren't heartless.  

[Joules]

I wish I could share more stories than my own, but this article is a window:

https://www.painnewsnetwork.org/stories/2016/5/27/are-cdcs-opioid-guidelines-causing-more-suicides

 

[Joules]

I am a chronic pain person due to RA mostly and started taking opioids after NSAIDS caused esophageal spasms (which feel like heart attacks) after I took them for many years.  It has been 18 years since I have had opioids as my primary pain reliever - now not only can I not take NSAIDS due to esophageal damage but also because I take Coumadin.  So it is basically opioids or nothing.  I get no high at all.  My pain does not disappear but lessens.  And I am not addicted nor dependent in that I can and do stop taking them for many days in a row when my pain is less. For the last few years as my arthritis has gotten under better control, I am taking less opioids.  But I do not get why people say it isn't any good for chronic pain- it sure helps me and with no side effects either.  I do not get sleepy, loopy, or anything else.  No one can tell if I had a pill or a half or not. I also don\t think that for non-addictive persons it is a bad drug category at all.  Much less harmful than steroids (which I also take and have caused weaken bones, cataracts, and high blood pressure in me)  NSAIDS can cause severe digestive issues and also raise the risk of heart attacks (except for good old aspirin). Tylenol not only doesn't do almost anything to pain, even slight overdoses cause liver damage and if not following dosing directions exactly, liver failure can occur/  Now ooioids can decrease breathing so care must be used with not taking too much and maybe not using when having breathing issues.

 

I took forever to type my response, so didn't see yours before.  I'm sorry that you go through this, too.  

 

Sometimes, I think the chronically ill and disabled are just as invisible as the addicts.  We hide it as best we can, and stay home when we can't.

[Scarlett]

I am a chronic pain person due to RA mostly and started taking opioids after NSAIDS caused esophageal spasms (which feel like heart attacks) after I took them for many years.  It has been 18 years since I have had opioids as my primary pain reliever - now not only can I not take NSAIDS due to esophageal damage but also because I take Coumadin.  So it is basically opioids or nothing.  I get no high at all.  My pain does not disappear but lessens.  And I am not addicted nor dependent in that I can and do stop taking them for many days in a row when my pain is less. For the last few years as my arthritis has gotten under better control, I am taking less opioids.  But I do not get why people say it isn't any good for chronic pain- it sure helps me and with no side effects either.  I do not get sleepy, loopy, or anything else.  No one can tell if I had a pill or a half or not. I also don\t think that for non-addictive persons it is a bad drug category at all.  Much less harmful than steroids (which I also take and have caused weaken bones, cataracts, and high blood pressure in me)  NSAIDS can cause severe digestive issues and also raise the risk of heart attacks (except for good old aspirin). Tylenol not only doesn't do almost anything to pain, even slight overdoses cause liver damage and if not following dosing directions exactly, liver failure can occur/  Now ooioids can decrease breathing so care must be used with not taking too much and maybe not using when having breathing issues.

  

As someone who is in group (and individual) therapy for chronic pain.  Many chronic pain patients, who aren't addicted, were normal, middle class, productive citizens until that car accident, illness, or whatever.  Many of them, with proper pain management can lead productive lives again.  Without proper pain management, they sit on the couch, draw disability, and become more and more depressed.  

 

Some of us really care about those people and see the "solution" to the opioid epidemic as taking away their lives.  It's really not that we don't care about the addicts.  

 

Chronic pain is different. The advil/tylenol thing can really help...but with constant use, many develop allergies to the NSAIDS and your liver can only take so much tylenol before the doc says no more.  For me the NSAIDS allergy was five years ago and now my liver numbers are up.  For some people careful opioid use is the best answer, and I feel for the people losing that.  One thing that isn't mentioned is that some people DON'T become addicted even with long term use.  It's 40-60% genetic, not under an individual's control.  Addicts aren't bad people any more than I am a bad person for developing an allergy to NSAIDS.

 

I just suffer with therapy and natural options.  It's been years since I used an opioid.  When I did, I took it two nights a week.  The pain is so horrible that sleep is rare.  Just a couple of nights sleep a week was enough to make me functional and productive.  Other people I know do take it daily, and it is enough to work.  They wouldn't be working without it.  As the opioid epidemic reaction increases, some of these people are having their lives taken away.

 

I wish I had a solution.  I think better medical care would help so much.  More contact with the patients to understand who is being helped and who is being hurt by the pills?  Maybe nurse practitioners that have time to talk to the patient, rather than a doc who spends 5 minutes and decides refill or no refill?  Treating marijuana just like any other drug in the system?  Insurance paying for constant therapy for chronic pain patients?  

 

I just wanted to share the other side to show that people who are concerned about the "solution" aren't heartless.

 

Ladies thanks for sharing your stories. I get that people react differently. Like Jean and I cannot take them at all without becoming instantly violently ill......and some people can take them off and on with no withdrawal symptoms....and others get addicted and it destroys their life.....some of those cut off from legal will go to buying them on the street and oftentimes even on to heroin. Since we can't know in advance who will react how it seems prudent to save the opioids for the absolute worst and unmanageable pain. That is for new situations. For ongoing cases they need to be dealt with individually and they need some real oversight as I think one of you mentioned.

 

My loved one has been in detox for almost 48 hours and he is really really sick. He said this is how he far he got on his own when he tried to quit and it is what sent him to detox for help. I told him just now to tell the doctor and nurses that and to hang on....that the sickness will end.

[MistyMountain]

We're considering moving across the country to have access to medical marijuana for this reason. I have a very cut and dry, obvious condition that causes chronic pain, ie I'm not someone just claiming I have a vague pain somewhere for some unknown reason. My doctors acknowledge that I'm in a lot of pain, that they should be giving me opioids, but they can't risk doing it. Especially as a long term treatment with no other solution. So I'm in constant pain. Last night, I was sobbing on the floor for half an hour, unable to move.

 

I love our home. DH loves his job. We don't want to move. But medical marijuana may be our only recourse. We're going on a trip this summer to a recreational state to try it (I'm so boring, I've never smoked marijuana). If it makes a big difference, we might just have to move for that reason alone. (We live in the South, in a state that still has dry counties. We'll be the last to legalize it.)

Have you thought of trying CBD? That is legal and I know some people have used it in place of opiods or to get off of them. I have no idea how it compares to the thc version for pain but there are people using it for that purpose with success.

Edited February 2, 2018 by MistyMountain

[Scarlett]

He just told me he has street drugs at his house.

 

So. I don't see how he will stay clean.

[Above The Rowan]

He just told me he has street drugs at his house.

 

So. I don't see how he will stay clean.

I am so sorry.

Is he still at the detox centre? Can someone go, with his permission obviously, and do a clean at his home and get rid of drugs/booze/whatever?

 

He's facing a long road, and I'm so sorry that your loved one (and you) are having to navigate this.

[Scarlett]

I am so sorry.

Is he still at the detox centre? Can someone go, with his permission obviously, and do a clean at his home and get rid of drugs/booze/whatever?

 

He's facing a long road, and I'm so sorry that your loved one (and you) are having to navigate this.

He promises me he will flush them as soon as he gets home. That he doesn't want to have to reveal his hiding place in which he hides things besides drugs. So yeah. Says he will send me a pic of drugs in toilet.

[skimomma]

FWIW, I *highly* recommend you get a small drug safe for your stockpile.

 

Trust me. 

 

Yep.

 

I have luckily never had to take any sort of serious medication at any time.  But dh had a serious injury several years ago and was prescribed some sort of opioid pain medication.  We filled the script for 8 doses.  Dh took one and discovered very quickly that it made him violently ill.  So he didn't take anymore.  His doctor directed him to another method of pain management.  I had stowed the bottle with the remaining pills in the very back of an overstuffed and disorganized mess of a laundry room cabinet to await the annual drug disposal date in our area.  At that time, and for all I know this is still the case, our local pharmacies did not take back unused meds for disposal.  I chose the location to stow it because it was out of reach of young children.....the same place I keep the bleach and handful of other toxic household products.  There was about a two month lapse between when I stowed the bottle and the date of the disposal.  When it was close, I went to get them to take in and found the bottle empty!  

 

Dd, at 3 years of age, was far too young at that time to have been a suspect.  And after watching dh violently vomit after taking the first dose, I was fairly certain he could not be a suspect.  Nor did he know where I put them (we never discussed it) and as far as he is concerned the laundry room cabinets do not even exist.  There is nothing in there of any interest to anyone but me.  I could have a million dollars sitting on top of the laundry powder and he would not find it.  The seven remaining pills would not have yielded enough street value to have been sold if, say, dh was hiding some sort of gambling or drug problem.

 

We had had a couple of small gatherings at our house during that time, mostly attended by people we know really well and trust.  Even so, I actually asked around in a I'm-not-mad-but-this-is-driving-me-crazy-so-please-fess-up-if-you-know-anything sort of way.  No bites except to find that two of my friends had had similar disappearances of meds, in much larger quantities, within the same timeframe.  We had also had a couple of babysitters and contractors in and out. The idea of any of these people going through my laundry room cabinet to find these seriously creeps me out. They would have been very difficult to find and there were no other meds or first aid type items in the cabinet to suggest it would be the place to search for them.

 

We never figured it out.  And my friends who had similar experiences did not either.  Lesson learned.  We have no need for those types of meds anyway but I would get a safe if we ever did.  It is very unsettling to know that someone I know well could have taken those meds.  I hope there is some other explanation but to be honest, I still wonder.

[Scarlett]

Yep.

 

I have luckily never had to take any sort of serious medication at any time. But dh had a serious injury several years ago and was prescribed some sort of opioid pain medication. We filled the script for 8 doses. Dh took one and discovered very quickly that it made him violently ill. So he didn't take anymore. His doctor directed him to another method of pain management. I had stowed the bottle with the remaining pills in the very back of an overstuffed and disorganized mess of a laundry room cabinet to await the annual drug disposal date in our area. At that time, and for all I know this is still the case, our local pharmacies did not take back unused meds for disposal. I chose the location to stow it because it was out of reach of young children.....the same place I keep the bleach and handful of other toxic household products. There was about a two month lapse between when I stowed the bottle and the date of the disposal. When it was close, I went to get them to take in and found the bottle empty!

 

Dd, at 3 years of age, was far too young at that time to have been a suspect. And after watching dh violently vomit after taking the first dose, I was fairly certain he could not be a suspect. Nor did he know where I put them (we never discussed it) and as far as he is concerned the laundry room cabinets do not even exist. There is nothing in there of any interest to anyone but me. I could have a million dollars sitting on top of the laundry powder and he would not find it. The seven remaining pills would not have yielded enough street value to have been sold if, say, dh was hiding some sort of gambling or drug problem.

 

We had had a couple of small gatherings at our house during that time, mostly attended by people we know really well and trust. Even so, I actually asked around in a I'm-not-mad-but-this-is-driving-me-crazy-so-please-fess-up-if-you-know-anything sort of way. No bites except to find that two of my friends had had similar disappearances of meds, in much larger quantities, within the same timeframe. We had also had a couple of babysitters and contractors in and out. The idea of any of these people going through my laundry room cabinet to find these seriously creeps me out. They would have been very difficult to find and there were no other meds or first aid type items in the cabinet to suggest it would be the place to search for them.

 

We never figured it out. And my friends who had similar experiences did not either. Lesson learned. We have no need for those types of meds anyway but I would get a safe if we ever did. It is very unsettling to know that someone I know well could have taken those meds. I hope there is some other explanation but to be honest, I still wonder.

Was either the babysitter or contractor working for the other people who had drugs come up missing?

[skimomma]

Was either the babysitter or contractor working for the other people who had drugs come up missing?

 

No.  That is why I still get shifty when thinking about it.  I cannot rule out that they are unrelated and that it could have been one of the contractors or sitters.  I was always home when the contractors were here and they were not working in that room.  They were primarily working outside and only came in to either use the restroom or turn the power on/off.  It would have been pretty hard for me to miss if any of them had been in the laundry room, especially long enough to find the meds.  The two sitters we had at the time were 14yo and extremely responsible.  Both are now successful adults.  Even if they were closeted drug users, I cannot see either of them looking in that particular location.  They would have had to have ransacked so many other more likely areas first.  But you never know.

 

At one of the gatherings, a friend brought her MIL.  MIL is the only common link between the three houses.  She often accompanies this family for holiday things and had been to all three houses during the time in question.  However, she is quite short and not very mobile.  She uses a cane to get around.  The only way to have gotten that far into my cabinet would have been to either climb up on top of the dryer or to have brought a chair or step ladder into the room.  I have at least 6 inches on her and I have to use a stool to get to the back of that cabinet.  So again, not impossible but quite unlikely.  

 

Dh and I have tried to solve this mystery for years.

[Scarlett]

No.  That is why I still get shifty when thinking about it.  I cannot rule out that they are unrelated and that it could have been one of the contractors or sitters.  I was always home when the contractors were here and they were not working in that room.  They were primarily working outside and only came in to either use the restroom or turn the power on/off.  It would have been pretty hard for me to miss if any of them had been in the laundry room, especially long enough to find the meds.  The two sitters we had at the time were 14yo and extremely responsible.  Both are now successful adults.  Even if they were closeted drug users, I cannot see either of them looking in that particular location.  They would have had to have ransacked so many other more likely areas first.  But you never know.

 

At one of the gatherings, a friend brought her MIL.  MIL is the only common link between the three houses.  She often accompanies this family for holiday things and had been to all three houses during the time in question.  However, she is quite short and not very mobile.  She uses a cane to get around.  The only way to have gotten that far into my cabinet would have been to either climb up on top of the dryer or to have brought a chair or step ladder into the room.  I have at least 6 inches on her and I have to use a stool to get to the back of that cabinet.  So again, not impossible but quite unlikely.  

 

Dh and I have tried to solve this mystery for years.

 

 

OMG, that would drive me INSANE!

[skimomma]

OMG, that would drive me INSANE!

 

Absolutely.

 

Now I have a squeaky-clean 14yo.  She has friends over.  Good kids that I know personally and trust.  Had this happened now, I would have to turn suspicious eyes towards them.  Which would be awful.  I shared this story to illustrate why locking up meds is important even if you trust your kids and everyone else who comes in your house.  Clearly, in my case, SOMEONE took them.  And the choices aren't great.  It is either a disabled-yet-some-how-capable-of-scaling-appliances grandmother, a very crafty contractor, a trusted sitter, someone who broke into my house while leaving everything else completely undisturbed, or sadly (and most likely) someone I continue to know well and trust.  It is not an awesome place to be.  And it could have been avoided had I known (and done) better.

[Hyacinth]

Encourage your friend to take advantage of every source of support available to him. His tolerance will already be lower as a result of this relatively short withdrawal period and his body will not respond well if he consumes the same amount he was using previously. Can he get someone else to dispose of the drugs in his house?

Edited February 2, 2018 by Hyacinth

[Joyofsixreboot]

Around here, he could seek help via subutex clinic. I don't mean he would get the medications for his pain, but the idea is subutex would stabilize the addiction to opiods component legally. If his area has lots of addicts, I imagine it also has clinic(s).

In my area, you've got heroin or nothing. This country hates addicts but has only very meager resources for help. Even fewer if you're poor or have no insurance coverage for rehab. And so people here die.

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

[Scarlett]

Absolutely.

 

Now I have a squeaky-clean 14yo. She has friends over. Good kids that I know personally and trust. Had this happened now, I would have to turn suspicious eyes towards them. Which would be awful. I shared this story to illustrate why locking up meds is important even if you trust your kids and everyone else who comes in your house. Clearly, in my case, SOMEONE took them. And the choices aren't great. It is either a disabled-yet-some-how-capable-of-scaling-appliances grandmother, a very crafty contractor, a trusted sitter, someone who broke into my house while leaving everything else completely undisturbed, or sadly (and most likely) someone I continue to know well and trust. It is not an awesome place to be. And it could have been avoided had I known (and done) better.

Ok, you have made a believer of me. That would drive me nuts.

[Scarlett]

Encourage your friend to take advantage of every source of support available to him. His tolerance will already be lower as a result of this relatively short withdrawal period and his body will not respond well if he consumes the same amount he was using previously. Can he get someone else to dispose of the drugs in his house?

Sure he could. He won't. He promises me he will flush them as soon as he gets home and send me a pic of him doing so. Which as we all know really means nothing. All I can do is hope for the best.

[Teacher Mom]

I am a chronic pain person due to RA mostly and started taking opioids after NSAIDS caused esophageal spasms (which feel like heart attacks) after I took them for many years.  It has been 18 years since I have had opioids as my primary pain reliever - now not only can I not take NSAIDS due to esophageal damage but also because I take Coumadin.  So it is basically opioids or nothing.  I get no high at all.  My pain does not disappear but lessens.  And I am not addicted nor dependent in that I can and do stop taking them for many days in a row when my pain is less. For the last few years as my arthritis has gotten under better control, I am taking less opioids.  But I do not get why people say it isn't any good for chronic pain- it sure helps me and with no side effects either.  I do not get sleepy, loopy, or anything else.  No one can tell if I had a pill or a half or not. I also don\t think that for non-addictive persons it is a bad drug category at all.  Much less harmful than steroids (which I also take and have caused weaken bones, cataracts, and high blood pressure in me)  NSAIDS can cause severe digestive issues and also raise the risk of heart attacks (except for good old aspirin). Tylenol not only doesn't do almost anything to pain, even slight overdoses cause liver damage and if not following dosing directions exactly, liver failure can occur/  Now ooioids can decrease breathing so care must be used with not taking too much and maybe not using when having breathing issues.

 

I could have written this post as could many others with a variety of diseases that cause pain and have no cure. If you have ever been in what seemed like unending pain that never lets you sleep or move, when the very air you breathe seems to be filled with pain, you can understand why opioids are a necessary treatment. It isn't that people haven't tried other methods, it is that those methods don't work for one reason or another. The opioids make the pain recede but the pain never goes away. 

[Joyofsixreboot]

I, too, get violently I'll when I take a narcotic. That was no fun to discover. I worry what will happen if I ever have bad pain. When I had horrible sciatica I got tylenol :(

 

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[Jean in Newcastle]

This thread has been in my mind. I wanted to point out that since my reaction to opioids makes them not an option, I am not posting from a “I could choose to take them but I choose not to†perspective. So my posting of other pain management strategies is not a matter of “ superior choices†but simply telling the remaining choices left to me and others like me.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[J-rap]

We're considering moving across the country to have access to medical marijuana for this reason. I have a very cut and dry, obvious condition that causes chronic pain, ie I'm not someone just claiming I have a vague pain somewhere for some unknown reason. My doctors acknowledge that I'm in a lot of pain, that they should be giving me opioids, but they can't risk doing it. Especially as a long term treatment with no other solution. So I'm in constant pain. Last night, I was sobbing on the floor for half an hour, unable to move.

 

I love our home. DH loves his job. We don't want to move. But medical marijuana may be our only recourse. We're going on a trip this summer to a recreational state to try it (I'm so boring, I've never smoked marijuana). If it makes a big difference, we might just have to move for that reason alone. (We live in the South, in a state that still has dry counties. We'll be the last to legalize it.)

 

Unfortunately, medical marijuana isn't the magic cure for everyone, so it's good that you can go there first for a short period of time.

 

My dd lives with chronic pain and because she is young with no ties, it was easy for her to move across the country for a year to give it a try.  In her case, though she could definitely feel her muscles relax, it didn't get to the pain.  I was glad she could try it though!

 

I'm really sorry for your pain.   :grouphug:

[J-rap]

In case anyone is interested:  I watched the series Nurse Jackie last year, and wow -- it's a good series, but also, it really gives you an inside look at how an average person can become addicted to opioids and how it can slowly destroy their life.  (not for children)

 

 

 

[xixstar]

Absolutely.

 

Now I have a squeaky-clean 14yo.  She has friends over.  Good kids that I know personally and trust.  Had this happened now, I would have to turn suspicious eyes towards them.  Which would be awful.  I shared this story to illustrate why locking up meds is important even if you trust your kids and everyone else who comes in your house.  Clearly, in my case, SOMEONE took them.  And the choices aren't great.  It is either a disabled-yet-some-how-capable-of-scaling-appliances grandmother, a very crafty contractor, a trusted sitter, someone who broke into my house while leaving everything else completely undisturbed, or sadly (and most likely) someone I continue to know well and trust.  It is not an awesome place to be.  And it could have been avoided had I known (and done) better.

I was that squeaky-clean kid, honor student, did what I was asked without complaint, very respectful and kind. I would have been the kid that went through cabinets and taken prescription medications and no one would have suspected me either. I was just really good at playing a role and showing people the side they wanted to see ... also really good at hiding when I was under the influence too. It helped that I had a sister that was always talking back, always getting into trouble for this and that. She was always suspected of everything and I was not. She escaped high school without having a baby, I did not, and it was probably my child that prevent much worse from happening to me. 

 

Just something I often mention when someone talks about their kids in a way that hints that they would never do something like _____. And all the super stupid things I did, were between the ages of 12 and 14, also when people don't tend to think of kids doing these things. I got pregnant at 14 so who knows what my teen years would have been had that not happened.

[shawthorne44]

They make different people feel differently. They make my mom loopy and anxious and nauseous. I on the other hand very much enjoy how say, vicodin makes me feel. Regular codeine just makes me sleepy (and doesn't work well...I'm an ultra rapid metabolizer so it wears off too fast), but hydrocodone, like in Vicodin, makes me feel all happy and relaxed and wonderful. Like a glass of wine only way better. It makes everything warm and fuzzy. My husband takes it and just gets sleepy. So how addictive it is probably depends on how it makes you feel. 

 

I won't lie. I've often been silly and said it's a shame people are talking about legalizing recreational use of weed but vicodin never will be, because it would be my drug of choice. But in all seriousness, I'm careful about taking it because I really really do like how it makes me feel. More than I should. 

 

That said, I've still got some from when i had a tooth pulled forever ago. I save them and use them only when really needed for pain. I've never used more than a day or two of them. 

 

 

This is me too.   I've hated every pain medicine I've been prescribed except Motrin (back when it was prescription-only) and Vicodin.   Motrin took the pain of cramps away.  Vicodin made me feel goooood.   First time I had it was after some major mouth surgery and it was "as needed".   I knew Vicodin was dangerous when I hit my funny bone and my first thought was "I need a Vicodin"    It has been prescribed to me twice since then and I've had the doctor reverse the refill and pill numbers.   So instead of 30 pills for 2 refills, I asked for 2 pills with 30 refills.  Then just filled one or none.   

 

The post-surgery pain medicine the hospital has given me has always made me feel worse than the pain did.  So, I always refuse it.  

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Along with xixstar's post - we've had people come through this house, including teens, who wouldn't really trip a trigger as far as snooping concerns. Mostly because they're in that in between category where you don't really know them but have no reason to worry about them.

 

1. Not "vetted" friends or relatives whom you've chosen to believe would never do that, and

2. Not suspicious or scary unknowns, just unknowns that you barely remember being in your home.

 

The grandson of a friend, who was out with her for the day when one of her errands included dropping off Sunday school materials at my house, who disappeared for awhile as we were chatting but was not playing with my kids, who weren't home.

 

The furnace repair man, who ended up washing out clogged parts in the bathtub (with permission, the hose outside was frozen). I'm pretty sure he opened the window and was smoking, and he was in there plenty long enough to go through the meds if I kept them in the bathroom (which I don't).

 

The eighth grader from up the street, living there temporarily with non-custodial parents or grandparents, not my kid's BFF but they'd been riding bikes and playing basketball in driveways - they came in for a drink of water, and I found him looking through bedrooms and bathrooms!

 

The husband of a music student, who came along because my house is a long drive for her, and they were going to a show in the city after her lesson. He was sitting in, listening to her lesson, but halfway through he excused himself to use the bathroom. Nothing happened, that I'm aware of; he and she are both definitely on my "do NOT suspect" list, but I was reminded of this thread...

 

point being, unless we are Y2K paranoid hoarders who never let anyone through our front door, I think most families don't even realize the vast swath of the cast of characters who come over for every day purposes.

 

So guns and pills should be locked up.

 

That's even before opening our minds to the possibility that our own children aren't too special and good to ever get into trouble under our own roofs.

Edited February 3, 2018 by Tibbie Dunbar

[G5052]

In case anyone is interested:  I watched the series Nurse Jackie last year, and wow -- it's a good series, but also, it really gives you an inside look at how an average person can become addicted to opioids and how it can slowly destroy their life.  (not for children)

 

Yes, very realistic. Not exactly, but it hits very close to home. Prescription opioids are the primary reason for the break-up of my marriage. Even when someone is off of them, years and years of daily use changes the brain and can bring about long-term personality changes.

[ktgrok]

This thread has been in my mind. I wanted to point out that since my reaction to opioids makes them not an option, I am not posting from a “I could choose to take them but I choose not to†perspective. So my posting of other pain management strategies is not a matter of “ superior choices†but simply telling the remaining choices left to me and others like me.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I'm curious if the newer synthetic drugs like tramadol and nucynta have the same reaction? They are not true opioids, and supposedly less addictive, but more to the point in your situation, I wonder if they cause the same violent reaction?

[Scarlett]

This thread has been in my mind. I wanted to point out that since my reaction to opioids makes them not an option, I am not posting from a “I could choose to take them but I choose not to†perspective. So my posting of other pain management strategies is not a matter of “ superior choices†but simply telling the remaining choices left to me and others like me.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, that is what I said about myself. I am not morally superior because I could nor become addicted to opioids.

[ktgrok]

This is me too.   I've hated every pain medicine I've been prescribed except Motrin (back when it was prescription-only) and Vicodin.   Motrin took the pain of cramps away.  Vicodin made me feel goooood.   First time I had it was after some major mouth surgery and it was "as needed".   I knew Vicodin was dangerous when I hit my funny bone and my first thought was "I need a Vicodin"    It has been prescribed to me twice since then and I've had the doctor reverse the refill and pill numbers.   So instead of 30 pills for 2 refills, I asked for 2 pills with 30 refills.  Then just filled one or none.   

 

The post-surgery pain medicine the hospital has given me has always made me feel worse than the pain did.  So, I always refuse it.  

 

Yeah, for me it was some TMJ pain....that really had I not had vicodin I wouldn't take vicodin. But I still had some in the cabinet. 

 

I didn't actually take it, but wanted to. 

 

I still have a few pills, but I self monitor and don't use them, or if I do for a real pain, I only take one dose at night to sleep. Never during the day. 

[Scarlett]

I'm curious if the newer synthetic drugs like tramadol and nucynta have the same reaction? They are not true opioids, and supposedly less addictive, but more to the point in your situation, I wonder if they cause the same violent reaction?

Not Jean, but I have wondered the same thing......my Dh is able take tramadol with none of the nasty side affects of other opioids.....he isn't like me....he just gets nauseous and has to make sure he eats....but I have no plans to test it out. Too big of a risk for me.

[Scarlett]

Yes, very realistic. Not exactly, but it hits very close to home. Prescription opioids are the primary reason for the break-up of my marriage. Even when someone is off of them, years and years of daily use changes the brain and can bring about long-term personality changes.

This what has happened to my loved one.....on so many drugs.....legal and illegal his entire life since early teen....he really is not the same person. I really limit my interactions with him. He often reaches out to me when things are going bad though and it pulls at my heart strings.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I'm curious if the newer synthetic drugs like tramadol and nucynta have the same reaction? They are not true opioids, and supposedly less addictive, but more to the point in your situation, I wonder if they cause the same violent reaction?

I don’t know. I know that I am allergic to codeine so all the drugs with codeine in them are out. Tramadol doesn’t have codeine so might be ok on that front. (The only ones in my family who have taken it are the dogs). I’m not as familiar with nucynta but googling doesn’t seem to indicate that it has codeine.

 

Both drugs are contraindicated for me though. I’m on daily naltrexone. That rules out any opioid, synthetic or not. I also have liver problems. That is also a factor that doctors have to consider.

 

I have no idea if I would be in less pain with opioids or not. Obviously I don’t want to be dealing with severe vomiting. But naltrexone has changed my life for the better. I’m willing to give up the possible use of synthetic opioids in order to stay on it.

[Scarlett]

He is suppose to go home today. He says if he gets really sick again he will asked to be sent to a full rehab ven though that will mean being 2 hours from home for however long.

[Catwoman]

This thread has been in my mind. I wanted to point out that since my reaction to opioids makes them not an option, I am not posting from a “I could choose to take them but I choose not to†perspective. So my posting of other pain management strategies is not a matter of “ superior choices†but simply telling the remaining choices left to me and others like me.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I didn’t think you were coming across that way at all, Jean — I just thought you were sharing your personal experiences, not acting superior or judging anyone or anything like that. :)

[Above The Rowan]

He is suppose to go home today. He says if he gets really sick again he will asked to be sent to a full rehab ven though that will mean being 2 hours from home for however long.

Keep us posted. I'll be cheering him on from afar. It's not an easy journey he'll be on but it sounds like he wants it, and that's a big part of the battle. I saw a sibling through detox and treatment from alcoholism - one of the things the addictions counsellor told our family was that slip-ups and bumps in the road are often a part of the journey to sobriety and that we should keep supporting as best we can (within our own boundaries). He's been sober now for the better part of a year, with a few slips here and there. He wants it, and he's turning his life around and back in school with his eyes on a career path.

 

All that to say, it's not easy. I hope he has a smooth journey and gets through these next days/weeks.

[ktgrok]

There have been a lot of stories on the news about this, and one thing that kept getting repeated by the social workers was that the first 24-48 hours are the most dangerous. They really still crave the drug, don't have new habits in place to use instead, and are HIGHLY at risk of overdose because their tolerance is suddenly lower. 

[Sandwalker]

He is suppose to go home today. He says if he gets really sick again he will asked to be sent to a full rehab ven though that will mean being 2 hours from home for however long.

If he's religious/spiritual, that's where help can be found. Will be open himself up is the question.

 

You, Scarlett are put in a very stressful spot when be reaches out to you in his darkest times, and of course there's nothing you can actually do. I hope the best for him.

[Scarlett]

If he's religious/spiritual, that's where help can be found. Will be open himself up is the question.

 

You, Scarlett are put in a very stressful spot when be reaches out to you in his darkest times, and of course there's nothing you can actually do. I hope the best for him.

 

 

Thanks.  He went home Saturday.  He sent me a pic of his hidden drugs and then another pic of pills in a toilet.  Sunday morning he told me he was really really sick and had a horrible night....and he thanked me for making him promise to flush the drugs as soon as he got home because he thinks he would have taken them in the night.  He is self medicating with weed, which he claims the doctor approved of.  Shrug.  I have no idea if that is true or if he is delusional, but for now I am glad he is off the opiates.  

 

To add to the suffering, he and his young son both tested positive for Flu.  the A strand.

[shawthorne44]

I heard something recently that is related, and not worthy of starting its own thread.   A friend of a friend is a pharmacist and we had lunch yesterday.  He said that once someone brought a prescription in from far away and the other pharmacist knew that it was fishy since he used to work in that area.  So, he called the doc to verify and it was fraudulent.  So, they called the police, who picked him up.   A half-hour later he was back causing a ruckus in front of the store.   They called the police again.  Pharmacist had to take off work (unpaid) 5 different days to testify because the trial was continued every time.  Eventually the guy was given disorderly conduct (I could be misremembering what he was eventually convicted of, but it was basically a citation).  

 

So, the next time someone came in with a bogus script, they certainly didn't call the police.   Instead they marked it in such a way that pharmacists know means it is bogus, but no one else would know what it means.  So, they say, "We are out of that."  So, the person goes away quietly and hopefully the next pharmacist notices the mark.