Moving speculations

[LucyStoner]

It's understandable to be fearful of the cold, but it would be nice to acknowledge a difference between cold and cold, if that makes any sense. Maybe I should just avoid this forum because there are so many people with cold discrimination who don't even know what cold is.

Hold up. Having a personal preference for the weather is "discrimination"? Against whom? Does this apply to other things that are not sentient beings in anyway affected by my bias? Is my preference for smoked salmon over Canadian bacon discriminatory? What about my preference for Converse All Stars over Vans?

 

This is hilarious to me.

 

FWIW, I am equally bigoted towards cold and hot weather. Give me temperate or give me death.

Edited April 18, 2017 by LucyStoner

[LucyStoner]

For the OP, as far as I know, nothing like that exists. Most countries have very strict immigration policies. I never understood why U.S. citizens are so angry about the U.S. immigration laws when most countries have similar or even more strict immigration policies.

1. Refugee policy relative to our size and resources.

2. Our dependence on foreign workers for many jobs while leaving the people we depend on (and are willing to use to help keep many prices down) in legal limbo.

3. Bias in immigration policies.

[Lady Florida.]

Of course it is. I never denied it was. In fact, I've been making fun of my ridiculous self for being too wussy about cold weather.

 

Yep. I mock myself as a wimpy Floridian when it comes to cold.

 

What the hell. Cold is temps that make my bones feel like someone is driving icy needles through them to the point it hurts to move my hands and leaving the house brings tears to my eyes.

 

So a hearty bleepy bleep to anyone who says my problem is I just don't know what cold is. Cold HURTS so yeah I don't like it and I really don't care if you or anyone else thinks my pain is justified enough for me to want to avoid it.

 

To others who don't feel that way, literally or figuratively, about cold weather - that's wonderful and I'm genuinely happy you can more comfortably live in colder climates.

 

And even so, I'd gladly endure ice picks being driven through my bones sensation to get my husband or children healthier places to live and maybe even prosper.

 

If it matters. The abundance of books and knitting comes darn close to making up for the cold in Iceland. Maybe I could live as hermit there. Just me and my books and knitting in an over crowded house. That's not a bad picture. Not sure Iceland would be particularly eager to have my clan come do that though....

 

Cold is cold and if you feel cold, you're cold (barring of course an illness or circulation problems that make you feel unnaturally cold). 

 

No no no. They are HOT. But it's okay. It's not like it's real heat. It's a dry heat. People just don't understand the difference between hot and *hot * because they are heat discriminators. 😜

 

Hey now. It's not the heat. It really is the humidity. :D

 

Seriously though. The air can only hold so much moisture. If your perspiration can't evaporate because the air can't hold any more moisture, you can't cool off. 

 

From the link:

 

According to the National Weather Service, the heat index is a measure of how hot it really feels when humidity is factored in with the actual temperature.

For example, if the thermometer in your yard reads 96°F and the relative humidity is 65 percent, the heat index — how hot it feels to your body —is 121°F.

Edited April 18, 2017 by Lady Florida.

[Lanny]

You are looking for a Paradise.  There isn't one on the planet.  Everywhere one might move to (within the USA, or emigrating to another country) there are pros and cons. You might trade one problem for another problem.  If the people in question have skills that are in critical demand (eg: certain types of Welders who are certified and have a lot of experience are needed in the USA) they would have a possibility of getting a Visa that would permit them to Work in another country.  

[LucyStoner]

I'm going to the store now. For more smoked salmon, in my Converse AND while shamelessly enjoying the neither hot nor cold 54 degrees fahrenheit weather. I even accept the 60% chance of rain as the price of living here.

[Liz CA]

I'm going to the store now. For more smoked salmon, in my Converse AND while shamelessly enjoying the neither hot nor cold 54 degrees fahrenheit weather. I even accept the 60% chance of rain as the price of living here.

 

Please be mindful of discriminating against Canadian bacon...maybe you could get a little of both?

 

[Guest]

Rather than looking for universal healthcare, look at countries with relatively cheap healthcare in the cash system. Many countries in the Caribbean and Southeast Asia would qualify. I know Thailand and Vietnam are both favorites of early retirees and relatively easy to immigrate to. Places like Bolivia or Grenada might not be a bad choice either.

 

I wouldn't leave the US for any of them, but my cost benefit analysis is different than yours :)

Edited April 18, 2017 by Arctic Mama

[ktgrok]

We've looked at Canada (we might actually have a shot) but the COL is prohibitive.  (Also, my hate of cold figures strongly in the background, so you're not alone!)

 

We're looking at Panama now.  But I also have a hate of humidity and bugs. :(

 

COL is the issue for us too. My husband's field is in demand, but the salary compared to COL where we are now makes it a real stretch. 

SaveSave

[Lanny]

Rather than looking for universal healthcare, look at countries with relatively cheap healthcare in the cash system. Many countries in the Caribbean and Southeast Asia would qualify. I know Thailand and Vietnam are both favorites of early retirees and relatively easy to immigrate to. Places like Bolivia or Grenada might not be a bad choice either.

 

I wouldn't leave the US for any of them, but my cost benefit analysis is different than yours :)

 

Many people move to Mexico or somewhere else in Latin America, where the Medical/Dental care is excellent and much less expensive than in the USA. Many people from the USA and Europe come to our city (Cali, Colombia) for Medical or Dental procedures. 

 

Bolivia?  No....  That's the country that Charter aircraft, with a Professional Soccer team from Argentina, was from, last November, while approaching Rio Negro Airport in Medellin, Colombia, with no fuel aboard.   How many basic common-sense rules, and aviation regulations, they violated, is a very very long list. .  I hope their regulation of Medical things is better than their "regulation" of Aviation related things.  However, I think Bolivia was already a "Category 2" country on the F.A.A. list, before that accident. You probably would not want to be flying on airlines based in a "Category 2" country... 

[Aelwydd]

 

 

As far as I can tell, Canada would not be open to average joes like us moving there. No desired degree field and a need for medical actually disqualifies us.

That's what my research has shown, too. Few countries are that open if you don't have a desired skill set, and the process costs $$$. Also, the US still taxes you while living and paying taxes elsewhere.

 

Unless you want to surrender citizenship - which costs have been skyrocketed in the last few years from $450 to now about $2400 per person. And you to to prove you're not doing it to avoid tax penalties. And are subject to audits going back 10 years. And all taxes are immediately due upon surrendering said citizenship.

 

Yay America.

 

That said, New Zealand looks promising, but the move there would be a bitch.

Edited April 18, 2017 by Aelwydd

[Murphy101]

Why would the move be a b?

 

I'd presume that if I moved to another country - I'd basicly pack a bag and go. Bc yeah. Dragging crap across the globe would be a pita.

[Wheres Toto]

That is very mild, actually, even when you take into account that these are averages. You just don't have any experience of what cold climates really are, I'm guessing. ;)

 

Subarctic/subpolar is more about geographic location, rather than actual temps. Tundra is vegetation, not temperature. The vegetation is limited because of the soil, winds, etc. not simply because of the cold. If it was really cold, you would see much lower temps in the winter months. 

 

The temperatures listed don't seem that bad and I HATE the cold.  The average low for the year was 26/22 degrees F.   Cold but not what I would consider frigid or unbearable.

[lewelma]

NZ fits your requirements if your job type is on the skill shortages list (which includes lots of construction jobs because of the Christchurch earthquake):

 

http://skillshortages.immigration.govt.nz/

 

NZ is a small country and can be wracked by global economic conditions, trade wars, currency fluctuations etc  (not to mention earthquakes).  So we use targeted immigration policies to help our economy.  We also take our share (by population size) of refugees. 

 

Ruth in NZ

 

ETA: if you are looking at the skill shortage list (some of the trades like bricklayer, floor finisher, baker),  NZQA level 4 is typically a 1 year polytechnic course after highschool (which is NZQA level 3). WOW, looking through the list, there are a heck of a lot of trades! Even things like horse trainer and snowsport instructor.

Edited April 18, 2017 by lewelma

[momacacia]

I've heard that it is Greenland that is really cooooolllllld and Iceland that is not as cold. Which is weird...so now I have to Google all that. 😂

[chiguirre]

Why would the move be a b?

 

I'd presume that if I moved to another country - I'd basicly pack a bag and go. Bc yeah. Dragging crap across the globe would be a pita.

But then you have to buy all new stuff all at once. Huge PITA!!! We've done this twice and I'd rather not do it again, ever.

Edited April 18, 2017 by chiguirre

[Jaybee]

NZ fits your requirements if your job type is on the skill shortages list (which includes lots of construction jobs because of the Christchurch earthquake):

 

http://skillshortages.immigration.govt.nz/

 

NZ is a small country and can be wracked by global economic conditions, trade wars, currency fluctuations etc  (not to mention earthquakes).  So we use targeted immigration policies to help our economy.  We also take our share (by population size) of refugees. 

 

Ruth in NZ

 

ETA: if you are looking at the skill shortage list (some of the trades like bricklayer, floor finisher, baker),  NZQA level 4 is typically a 1 year polytechnic course after highschool (which is NZQA level 3). WOW, looking through the list, there are a heck of a lot of trades! Even things like horse trainer and snowsport instructor.

 

I'm not planning to move to NZ (though I'd love to visit!), but I enjoyed reading through those lists!

[Aelwydd]

Why would the move be a b?

 

I'd presume that if I moved to another country - I'd basicly pack a bag and go. Bc yeah. Dragging crap across the globe would be a pita.

That's what I meant, packing and shipping stuff over. I'd probably ditch most everything and just get new stuff there. If you have a pet, that's also a real fun process, due to their requirements for quarantining up to a month from any countries that have rabies.

[Aelwydd]

NZ fits your requirements if your job type is on the skill shortages list (which includes lots of construction jobs because of the Christchurch earthquake):

 

http://skillshortages.immigration.govt.nz/

 

NZ is a small country and can be wracked by global economic conditions, trade wars, currency fluctuations etc (not to mention earthquakes). So we use targeted immigration policies to help our economy. We also take our share (by population size) of refugees.

 

Ruth in NZ

 

ETA: if you are looking at the skill shortage list (some of the trades like bricklayer, floor finisher, baker), NZQA level 4 is typically a 1 year polytechnic course after highschool (which is NZQA level 3). WOW, looking through the list, there are a heck of a lot of trades! Even things like horse trainer and snowsport instructor.

 

 

My dh did a lot of research into NZ, and we're both very impressed with the country. My hesitancy to move there is not just the distance, but it's also our of a real respect that NZ is not a mini US or alternate England. It is quite different and distinctive in its culture and its socio-political make-up. And I'm honest enough with myself to realize at this point in my life, uprooting and starting all over in a place that has many differences from what I am accustomed to would be hard emotionally and psychologically.

 

Hope that makes sense.

Edited April 19, 2017 by Aelwydd

[8circles]

I have to go with Murphy on this one. It's cold there. I've been reading a lot of Icelandic crime fiction which has sent me on rabbit trails looking up information on the country, including the climate. That's not mild to me. That's cold. Cold is relative LOL  :lol:

 

Book recs for Icelandic crime fiction? Please?

[8circles]

Hold up. Having a personal preference for the weather is "discrimination"? Against whom? Does this apply to other things that are not sentient beings in anyway affected by my bias? Is my preference for smoked salmon over Canadian bacon discriminatory? What about my preference for Converse All Stars over Vans?

 

This is hilarious to me.

 

FWIW, I am equally bigoted towards cold and hot weather. Give me temperate or give me death.

 

I liked wintermom's post. I thought she was joking. It made me LOL.

 

:gnorsi:

[Murphy101]

My dh did a lot of research into NZ, and we're both very impressed with the country. My hesitancy to move there is not just the distance, but it's also our of a real respect that NZ is not a mini US or alternate England. It is quite different and distinctive in its culture and its socio-political make-up. And I'm honest enough with myself to realize at this point in my life, uprooting and starting all over in a place that has many differences from what I am accustomed to would be hard emotionally and psychologically.

 

Hope that makes sense.

That makes total sense. I don't doubt it and I've talked with dh and our kids about it too. If we were to do something like that, I really think it would have to happen within he next 5 years. Because the older we get the deeper the roots and the harder it is to uproot. Especially as adult kids settle into their own lives.

[foxbridgeacademy]

May I come with you? :-) 

ME too?

[LucyStoner]

I liked wintermom's post. I thought she was joking. It made me LOL.

 

:

Then my hat's off for wintermom for a displaying a wit too dry for me to even detect. :P

[mominco]

Murphy 

A friend of ours is planning a move and she mentioned this site

 

https://internationalliving.com/

I don't know much about the site but thought you might want to look at it.GL

 

[Liz CA]

That makes total sense. I don't doubt it and I've talked with dh and our kids about it too. If we were to do something like that, I really think it would have to happen within he next 5 years. Because the older we get the deeper the roots and the harder it is to uproot. Especially as adult kids settle into their own lives.

 

There absolutely seems to be a point somewhere on everyone's timeline when moving to a drastically different environment does not sound appealing anymore. 10 or 15 years ago I would have still moved just about anywhere - for the adventure, the fun, the learning and what not. Now? Not so much anymore. My memories are here (as in the US), even in my state. Dh and I used to talk about moving north to Oregon or Washington but even that seems like uprooting now. If we had to for job reasons, we would and likely would adjust again. Our ds lives in another state and people often ask me if we have plans moving there - nope we don't.

 

[Happy2BaMom]

I don't know what job skills you/dh have, or if they would be relevant to what the expat advisor (& very experienced author) Tim Leffel covers, but I highly recommend his blog - http://www.cheapestdestinationsblog.com - and his book, "A Better Life for Half the Price". There are a number of countries in the world - Latin America, Central America, among several other countries on other continents - where health care coverage is more affordable and relatively comparable in quality (a lot of U.S.-trained doctors out there), and where your dollars will go much farther in general. If you need a job, that depends on what you have to offer and whether you can re-tool. 

 

I personally don't care for International Living...seems to focus on what's "hot" in the moment, without the nitty gritty cost focus that TL has.

[FaithManor]

I've heard that it is Greenland that is really cooooolllllld and Iceland that is not as cold. Which is weird...so now I have to Google all that. 😂

Iceland is temperate on the coasts due to ocean currents. Rarely below freezing, and rarely above 70.

[FaithManor]

We are considering retiring to the Aswan area of Egypt when the time comes. COL is very low, and there is a for cash private hospital and clinic that will provide what we need in a price we can afford...way less than just the deductible for Medicare which for a lot of retirees these days is $4000.00 a year. We have spent time there and are comfortable, as ex pat westerners, with the local culture.

[Lady Florida.]

Book recs for Icelandic crime fiction? Please?

 

I've been reading the Inspector Erlendur series. The numbers look off because they haven't all been translated into English. 

 

I heard about but haven't tried the Officer Gunnhilder series. 

[MysteryJen]

I've been reading the Inspector Erlendur series. The numbers look off because they haven't all been translated into English. 

 

I heard about but haven't tried the Officer Gunnhilder series. 

I have read both and they are very good. Iceland still seems cold and grey in my imagination.

I would move internationally, but dh loves being rooted in a place. Once our kids get settled, we may open the discussion again.

[Bluegoat]

Pretty much anywhere like that, you need sills that are wanted in the economy, or a job that you have been hired for.

 

A university degree isn't the point, really - a trade would be better if there is more reqirement for it.  Fire chiefs, for example, are an in-demand occupation in Canada, as are admin assistants.

 

 

Edited April 19, 2017 by Bluegoat