Sibling betrayal

[Scarlett]

My brother again. I guess I should not be surprised, but honestly I never thought he would outright steal from me.

 

Our dad died last fall after being on hospice for about 5-6 months. He lived with my brother and SIL during those months. At the beginning of that last 6 months dad was in the hospital and I called and talked to him. He knew he was dying and was very matter of fact about it. He told me he had prepaid his cremation, signed over his truck to my brother and that the only other thing he had was 12k in cash.

 

So. I said nothing to anyone. Just filed that under interesting information.

 

Dad died. I arrived about 30 minutes before. The next day brother asks me to go to the funeral home with him to finalize everything. The funeral home employee hands my brother an envelope with dads watch in it...he had been wearing it when he died. My brother takes it in his hand and after a moment hands it to me and says, 'I want you to have this. I have dads guns'. So I said thank you and took it.

 

I came home and sent my brother and SIL a card thanking them for their efforts in caring for dad in his final months. A very sincere thank you. I was in no position to do what my brother and SIL did.

 

I kept waiting for some mention of the money. Not a word. A few weeks later brother tells me they have decided to repair some things on their house. I expressed how glad I was he was able to do that. He tells me this big story about a Windows and door company and paying it out blah blah blah. Honestly he couldn't even lie convincingly. It was so very very clear to me he was spending the 12k on his house. Later in the remodeling process he told me via text about a worker breaking some tile in the bathroom and how it would be hard to find the tile to match up because it is old....and he told me since he was paying cash he was just going to withhold final payment until they resolved that issue. I just smiled. I texted back, 'yes paying cash gives you that advantage'

 

Crickets, I know he didn't intend to tell me that....he just got caught up in his problem with the company.

 

So. I have my dads Timex. It in in a decorative bowl on my bookcase with other keepsakes. I lovingly refer to it as my dad's $6000 watch.

 

So. When people show you who they are....believe them.

[bettyandbob]

Could your father have not known the costs of his hospice care. Could there have been some expenses beyond staying in their house during those 6 months. 

 

I hope you find some peace. 

I'm sorry this is causing you more pain beyond loosing your dad. 

[Scarlett]

Could your father have not known the costs of his hospice care. Could there have been some expenses beyond staying in their house during those 6 months.

 

I hope you find some peace.

I'm sorry this is causing you more pain beyond loosing your dad.

There was no cost. Zero. My dad was on Medicaid. Everything was paid for. In fact, my brother also got my dads small ss check for the 6 months he was there. I believe it was about $700 per month. My brother is on disability and his wife doesn't work. So they did not give up income to care for him.

 

Pain? Not so much pain. Just absolute disbelief that my flesh and blood would do this to me. If he had said to me, dad had 12k in cash. How do you feel about me keeping that since wife and I cared for him the last 6 months? I would have said, 'absolutely!'

 

I now know he is not trustworthy.

[lllll]

nm

Edited April 18, 2016 by _kathy_

[Pawz4me]

There was no cost. Zero. My dad was on Medicaid.

 

I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure anyone here has to have a LOT less than $12k in assets to qualify for Medicaid.  I think it's more like $2k.

[gardenmom5]

There was no cost. Zero. My dad was on Medicaid. Everything was paid for. In fact, my brother also got my dads small ss check for the 6 months he was there. I believe it was about $700 per month. My brother is on disability and his wife doesn't work. So they did not give up income to care for him.

 

Pain? Not so much pain. Just absolute disbelief that my flesh and blood would do this to me. If he had said to me, dad had 12k in cash. How do you feel about me keeping that since wife and I cared for him the last 6 months? I would have said, 'absolutely!'

 

I now know he is not trustworthy.

 

btdt.  I'm so sorry. 

 

even down to their taking things  that never belonged to them (things with my name written on them that my mother wanted me to have, things I had *given* to my mother), but if they'd *asked*, I would have said 'keep it' (I don't care.).  it's the fact they will lie, cheat, and steal from a sibling.

Edited April 15, 2016 by gardenmom5

[Laurie4b]

I'm not sure that you have enough info to know whether or not your brother stole from you. For instance, was there a will? And your dad could have gifted your brother with that $12,000 for caring for him and/or because he is on disability. Your dad may have thought he needed it more. Maybe your brother didn't want to hurt your feelings and not knowing that you were told about it, he hasn't mentioned it. 

Edited April 15, 2016 by Laurie4b

[ErinE]

:grouphug: I've very sorry about your dad's death.

 

Unless I was sending money regularly to pay my share, I'd consider the $6k as fair compensation for my brother taking care of my father during his last months. My parent and siblings have been sending my grandmother's primary caregiver monthly compensation for over a decade. Even beyond the medical costs, caring for the elderly can be expensive and exhausting.

[Scarlett]

I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure anyone here has to have a LOT less than $12k in assets to qualify for Medicaid. I think it's more like $2k.

That is why it was buried in a Mason jar in the back yard of his shack.

[Butter]

I take it your dad didn't have a will detailing his assets?  I'm sorry you feel betrayed (again?) by your brother.

[zoobie]

I'm sorry, Scarlett. 

[Scarlett]

I'm not sure that you have enough info to know whether or not your brother stole from you. For instance, was there a will? And your dad could have gifted your brother with that $12,000 for caring for him and/or because he is on disability. Your dad may have thought he needed it more. Maybe your brother didn't want to hurt your feelings and not knowing that you were told about it, he hasn't mentioned it.

No will, no need for one. Dad had almost nothing.

 

If Dad gifted him the money there is no reason for my brother to lie to me about it. None.

[bettyandbob]

OP I'm sorry this is part of a pattern by your brother. I couldn't imagine my siblings betraying me. 

 

:grouphug:

[Janeway]

As far as I am concerned, I have no siblings. Sibling day on FB the other day really bothered me. It is so dumb.

[Scarlett]

:grouphug: I've very sorry about your dad's death.

 

Unless I was sending money regularly to pay my share, I'd consider the $6k as fair compensation for my brother taking care of my father during his last months. My parent and siblings have been sending my grandmother's primary caregiver monthly compensation for over a decade. Even beyond the medical costs, caring for the elderly can be expensive and exhausting.

Sure if I had been given the option of saying 'hey you keep it all since you cared for him'.

 

Again though there was no monetary cost to my brother. He even had my dads ss check while he was living there.

 

It isn't about the money.

[Janeway]

To make matters worse, my sister kept borrowing money over and over again before I caught on. I knew what she was. I don't know how I was so dumb.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Did he actually lie? Did he say that you would get half that money? 

[Scarlett]

I take it your dad didn't have a will detailing his assets? I'm sorry you feel betrayed (again?) by your brother.

Seriously.....my dads truck might have been worth $500. And he lived in a shack on his brothers land. He had nothing. He was very impoverished.....except for the 12k he kept buried.

[prairiewindmomma]

Hugs!

[Scarlett]

Did he actually lie? Did he say that you would get half that money?

No. Dad didn't say anything about who would get that cash.

 

But yes I consider it a BIG lie for my brother to not mention he kept dads 12k in cash.

[Scarlett]

I am ok though. Melissa's post about her Dhs siblings fighting over stuff before the body was even removed from the home......just made me remember it.

[Scarlett]

I am sure my brother justified it to himself

 

1) Scarlett doesn't need it as bad as I do

2) I took care of dad for 6 months

3) dad wanted me to have it

4) I dont want to hurt her feelings by mentioning it.

 

It is still a betrayal.

[Scarlett]

As far as I am concerned, I have no siblings. Sibling day on FB the other day really bothered me. It is so dumb.

Now the day after Sibling day is only child day. That made me smile.

 

I do have a sister and step sister that are true blue.

[zoobie]

Did he actually lie? Did he say that you would get half that money? 

 

It sounds as though the brother lied to her as to the source of the money he is using to repair his house. Instead of just saying, yes, it was the money Dad gave me for looking after him. Or yes, it was the money of Dad's that I dug up and decided to keep all for myself. 

[Tanaqui]

No. Dad didn't say anything about who would get that cash.

 

But yes I consider it a BIG lie for my brother to not mention he kept dads 12k in cash.

 

Do you intend to confront him about it? Because if not, I think you're just going to have to let it go.

 

People are dishonest for all sorts of reasons. Your father was dishonest about his assets because he needed Medicaid. Your brother might have felt that if he talked to you about the money, it'd start a fight because you wouldn't agree with his claim on it since he took care of Dad during his final months.

 

Your choices here are confront your brother, cut off contact, or let it go. I don't know if there's any other history between you two that makes estrangement the wisest choice, of course.

[Scarlett]

Do you intend to confront him about it? Because if not, I think you're just going to have to let it go.

 

People are dishonest for all sorts of reasons. Your father was dishonest about his assets because he needed Medicaid. Your brother might have felt that if he talked to you about the money, it'd start a fight because you wouldn't agree with his claim on it since he took care of Dad during his final months.

 

Your choices here are confront your brother, cut off contact, or let it go. I don't know if there's any other history between you two that makes estrangement the wisest choice, of course.

No I am not going to confront him. He can live with himself. And I have let it go. Musing on it to you all because I was reminded of it this morning.

 

I won't cut off contact with him over this. But I don't trust him.

[8circles]

I'm sorry about the loss of your dad and your strained relationship with your brother.

 

Your brother is mentally disturbed in very serious ways (unless this is another brother you're talking about) so this seems like really small potatoes in comparison.

 

The 12K was dishonest money anyway.  Be glad you're free from it.  

[Scarlett]

I'm sorry about the loss of your dad and your strained relationship with your brother.

 

Your brother is mentally disturbed in very serious ways (unless this is another brother you're talking about) so this seems like really small potatoes in comparison.

 

The 12K was dishonest money anyway. Be glad you're free from it.

Yes true on all points. I had wondered how I would handle the money if I had been given the opportunity. No worry now....but my brother is still dishonest with me who he claims to love very much.

[dirty ethel rackham]

No. Dad didn't say anything about who would get that cash.

 

But yes I consider it a BIG lie for my brother to not mention he kept dads 12k in cash.

Perhaps your dad and your brother had an arrangement and your brother assumed you knew about it. It could very well be that since your brother took care of him while he was sick, that your dad told him to keep the $$.   Even if hospice is there, it can be a drain to the family that is housing the ill person.  I know that, if I were in that situation, I would feel that my sibling deserved the cash.

 

If he hasn't said anything about the money, he hasn't lied.  If the money was in fact supposed to go to you, he may be behaving shadily by using that money.  If that were the case, why would he fill you in on all the repairs he is doing?  But since there was no will and you do not have any word that you were going to get the cash, I'm not sure what more there is to say.  You could actually ask him about the $$ or you could let it go. 

 

ETA: I missed the part where he did imply a different source of the cash. 

Edited April 15, 2016 by dirty ethel rackham

[vonfirmath]

Note that if Medicaid finds out about that money (and posting about it on a public board might aid the process) they could come back after whoever got it. Since it should have been used to pay your dad's medical expenses.  I would not want the money in that circumstance.  Your brother could have just saved you a lot of aggravation.

 

 

 

Edited April 15, 2016 by vonfirmath

[8circles]

Yes true on all points. I had wondered how I would handle the money if I had been given the opportunity. No worry now....but my brother is still dishonest with me who he claims to love very much.

 

There is no honest or dishonest that can be relied on - he is mentally ill.  

 

I know you know this, but it can be hard when it smacks us in the face.  Hugs.  I'm sorry.

[Scarlett]

Perhaps your dad and your brother had an arrangement and your brother assumed you knew about it. It could very well be that since your brother took care of him while he was sick, that your dad told him to keep the $$. Even if hospice is there, it can be a drain to the family that is housing the ill person. I know that, if I were in that situation, I would feel that my sibling deserved the cash.

 

If he hasn't said anything about the money, he hasn't lied. If the money was in fact supposed to go to you, he may be behaving shadily by using that money. If that were the case, why would he fill you in on all the repairs he is doing? But since there was no will and you do not have any word that you were going to get the cash, I'm not sure what more there is to say. You could actually ask him about the $$ or you could let it go.

I have let it go. Don't mean it will never cross my mind again.

 

He told me he was paying out the repairs. He even gave me the payment amount and interest rate.

 

He filled me in on the repairs because he was giddy with excitement. He couldn't help himself.

[Scarlett]

Note that if Medicaid finds out about that money (and posting about it on a public board might aid the process) they could come back after whoever got it. Since it should have been used to pay your dad's medical expenses. I would not want the money in that circumstance. Your brother could have just saved you a lot of aggravation.

LOL....yeah, well that is not likely to happen. Brother would just deny it ever existed.

 

So I guess you are saying he was just looking out for me?

[Tanaqui]

LOL....yeah, well that is not likely to happen. Brother would just deny it ever existed.

 

And they're gonna say the same thing you did. "Okay, buddy, well how did you pay for the home repairs?"

 

[Miss Mousie]

That is why it was buried in a Mason jar in the back yard of his shack.

 

Ugh.  In that case, I would want no part of it.

 

I'd have wanted brother to have it anyway, for the care-giving, but knowing this too ... I'd want to be far away from it.

[Scarlett]

And they're gonna say the same thing you did. "Okay, buddy, well how did you pay for the home repairs?"

Shrug. I guess they could. Pretty sure it isn't likely to happen. Even if someone on this public board reports it to Medicaid.

 

And none of that changes the fact my brother lied to me.

[Scarlett]

Ugh. In that case, I would want no part of it.

 

I'd have wanted brother to have it anyway, for the care-giving, but knowing this too ... I'd want to be far away from it.

Sure me too. I would have liked the opportunity to tell him to keep it for his caregiving.

[lllll]

nm

Edited April 18, 2016 by _kathy_

[Spryte]

I'm sorry. Mental illness stinks.

 

Not sure if this is how you feel, but in your shoes - I'd feel like my brother took the opportunity away for me to say thank you to him, for caring for our father. I'd feel that he took the chance for me to give him the money. And that would bother me.

 

Sending you hugs.

 

FWIW, you're not alone. I have a brother that comes to mind when I read your posts. It's a disappointment. I wish he were different. It makes me sad.

[Scarlett]

I know people like I think you're describing. They're just the world's worst liars, or just don't even care that people KNOW they're lying. Either way, there's just no trusting them with things that matter.

Yes it was quite amusing.

[Scarlett]

I'm sorry. Mental illness stinks.

 

Not sure if this is how you feel, but in your shoes - I'd feel like my brother took the opportunity away for me to say thank you to him, for caring for our father. I'd feel that he took the chance for me to give him the money. And that would bother me.

 

Sending you hugs.

 

FWIW, you're not alone. I have a brother that comes to mind when I read your posts. It's a disappointment. I wish he were different. It makes me sad.

Yes this exactly. I feel robbed not of the money but if the chance to refuse it and say thank you.

[Reefgazer]

Why don't you just ask outright and very matter of factly when he is going to divide up dad's money?  You know, as if your dad had discussed themoney with you?

Edited April 15, 2016 by reefgazer

[G5052]

Pain? Not so much pain. Just absolute disbelief that my flesh and blood would do this to me. If he had said to me, dad had 12k in cash. How do you feel about me keeping that since wife and I cared for him the last 6 months? I would have said, 'absolutely!'

 

I now know he is not trustworthy.

 

That and more. I don't want to share all the details in a public forum, but my sibling ran off with a good amount of money following the death of my mother and actually cost me money because I had to hire a financial and legal help to deal with one aspect of it that could have been very costly to our family. Another relative was to inherit property that was never transferred, and they had to hire a lawyer themselves to do that because it was going to be sold at auction for unpaid taxes. So we had to pay for what was rightfully ours.

 

Finally it reached the point where three lawyers, a CPA, and two bank officers told me to drop it. And I did.

 

The other relative confronted my sibling 18 months ago on all of their duplicity, and my sibling said they'd make it right. Here we are, no change. My sibling emailed me in the fall to say that our other relative is crazy, and that they will never visit them again or answer the phone when they call. I talk to this relative several times a month, and they are NOT crazy.

 

The irony? My sibling is now in a horrible place with both their health and finances. And my family is doing well, all things considered.

 

You can ask your brother for the story here, but mental illness is mental illness. My mother was narcissistic mess, and unfortunately that passed on to my sibling. I just can't change who they are.

 

I call my sibling twice a year, at Christmas and on their birthday. I don't trust them AT ALL, and we actually took them completely out of our estate plans.

Edited April 15, 2016 by G5052

[Happy]

Hugs. I understand some of what you feel. My brother did some baffling and awful things after our last parent died. Said and did terrible things to me, my dh and my little kids....the whole mess just exposed how icky he is on the inside. Really--when someone tells you that a few thousand dollars ARE more important than you are....and when he says it on two separate occasions, you begin to believe him.

 

It took me a long time to accept he could do that to me, but once I did, I cut off all contact. I can never ever trust him again.

 

Sibling day on FB was painful. I much prefer being an only child now.

[G5052]

Hugs. I understand some of what you feel. My brother did some baffling and awful things after our last parent died. Said and did terrible things to me, my dh and my little kids....the whole mess just exposed how icky he is on the inside. Really--when someone tells you that a few thousand dollars ARE more important than you are....and when he says it on two separate occasions, you begin to believe him.

 

It took me a long time to accept he could do that to me, but once I did, I cut off all contact. I can never ever trust him again.

 

Sibling day on FB was painful. I much prefer being an only child now.

 

LOL. I tell people that I'm effectively an orphan and happy to be that way. My mother was a horror, and so is my sibling. I have one relative on my side that I keep in contact with. ONE.

[Scarlett]

He has gone from obsessing about our religion to now obsessing about surviving a global war.

 

So as someone said unthread this is really small potatoes.

 

It is just my brother.

[gardenmom5]

Sure if I had been given the option of saying 'hey you keep it all since you cared for him'.

 

Again though there was no monetary cost to my brother. He even had my dads ss check while he was living there.

 

It isn't about the money.

 

I think people who've never been betrayed in this way by a sibling can have a hard time comprehending the impact of such a thing.  it really isn't about  the money or stuff - it's about the dichotomy of this person who is supposed to be so close and you *assume* to have similar values to your own - can be so duplicitous.  it can require a whole new way of looking at reality.  and . . . you know you can't trust them.  you don't ever know what's rational, what's true - and what's a complete  lie.

 

To make matters worse, my sister kept borrowing money over and over again before I caught on. I knew what she was. I don't know how I was so dumb.

the disconnect really can be amazing.  my brother had some legal aide send me a threatening letter - then wondered why I didn't want to associate with him.  hello? get. a. clue.!

 

I am ok though. Melissa's post about her Dhs siblings fighting over stuff before the body was even removed from the home......just made me remember it.

My grandmother's family . . . my mother had double cousins.  when their mother died - the sisters locked the brothers out of the house.  they proceeded to take everything they wanted, then they allowed the brothers back inside.

so .. stuff is more important than relationships. . . .

I know people like I think you're describing.  They're just the world's worst liars, or just don't even care that people KNOW they're lying.  Either way, there's just no trusting them with things that matter. 

there's no trusting them on almost anything.  you never know what's truth and what's a lie. (or at least a completely warped perspective that has no bearing in reality.)  not sure they know the difference anymore.

[FaithManor]

Sorry Scarlett. BTDT got the t-shirt and mil isn't dead yet. Dh's sister is hovering big time over the money now. She keeps wanting to borrow all of MIL's savings with the promise to pay it back with interest, but in reality, as has been the case with her every time she borrow's money, she never pays it back. This is her way of making sure her two brothers do not get a dime, pay for the funeral out of their own pockets, and so forth.

 

MIL has a lot of nice antiques and artwork. Since she knows her daughter will go after the money, she made a secret agreement with dh and his brother to give her 2/3 of the savings that is left which should get her off their backs, deeded the house to us (it is worth more than her savings and dh does all the maintenance, our sons do the yardwork), and all the artwork and antiques to her other son.

 

She thinks this solves things. It won't. The narcissistic sister will hire and attorney and fight, fight, fight.

 

Dh gets along okay, but just barely, with his brother. His sister he does not acknowledge. On facebook "sib day" he referred to himself as an only child.

 

I have a sister not speaking to me because she thinks that I don't do enough for our parents. (ROLL EYES because she is in France doing nothing, and my brother and I are destroying our health and sanity taking care of their massively bad situation.) So I'm perfectly okay thinking of my brother as my only sibling these days.

 

I don't know why it has to be this way. But according to my counselor, it is actually very rare for all of the siblings in a family to act like decent human beings when a parent is aging/ill/dying. 

[G5052]

I think people who've never been betrayed in this way by a sibling can have a hard time comprehending the impact of such a thing.  it really isn't about  the money or stuff - it's about the dichotomy of this person who is supposed to be so close and you *assume* to have similar values to your own - can be so duplicitous.  it can require a whole new way of looking at reality.  and . . . you know you can't trust them.  you don't ever know what's rational, what's true - and what's a complete  lie.

 

Yes, it gives you a lifetime disconnect that people without it don't understand.

 

You just have to build up your other relationships and keep them at arms-length. No other way of handling it, really!

[G5052]

I don't know why it has to be this way. But according to my counselor, it is actually very rare for all of the siblings in a family to act like decent human beings when a parent is aging/ill/dying. 

 

Mine said the same. There's a lot that comes to the surface when that is happening. DH got closer to his brothers during that period, and estranged from his sister. His parents died much earlier than mine, and I had no idea such drama would occur. When my father and then mother died, I had a sense of how bad it was going to be. But it was worse!