Choosing between two good college options - help please

[Mom2boys]

Ds has narrowed his college choices down to two universities, but he can't seem to make a final decision. Both schools have their pluses and minuses. One school seems to be a better academic fit and the other seems to be a better social fit. Both schools have offered him renewable scholarships and there is a very small difference in cost between the two, but only because the out-of-state school has offered a much larger scholarship. If for some reason ds didn't have a high enough GPA to renew his scholarship, we wouldn't be able to afford to send him back to the out-of-state school. So here is my question:

 

Based on your personal experiences with your own dear children would you recommend school A - the better academic fit, in-state school, where he could afford to stay if he did lose his scholarship, but may have a hard time finding his "tribe", would live in an older dorm, and would have more freedom in courses he takes due to AP credits meeting gen ed requirements  or  school B - the better social fit, out-of-state school, where he would have to leave if he lost his renewable scholarship, and the academics overall aren't quite as strong, but he would live in a newly renovated dorm, would be in the honors program, but would have less freedom in the courses he takes due to honors required classes?  

 

(Geography, BTW, is not a factor. The out-of-state school is still only three hours from our home, so both schools are a fairly short car ride away.)

 

We just don't know how much importance to give to each of these factors, so it is hard for ds to make a final decision. Two weeks ago we revisited both schools and ds sat in on classes, etc, to aid in the decision making process. The result was that he is now more conflicted than ever. We would so appreciate advice from those of you who have walked this road ahead of us. 

[Home'scool]

From my experience I would choose college A. No matter how smart you child is there are so many factors that can affect their GPA and cause them to lose their scholarship that it becomes like the sword of Damocles hanging over their head. And to have to leave and transfer to another is a huge upheaval.

 

As far as the older dorm - eh. They only live there for a fraction of their time before they get off campus housing. And when they are all living together they don't really notice the age of the dorms just how much fun they are having.

 

I know you said that the out of state school is only 3 hours away, but distance makes a big difference!! Both my girls were excited about going to school "far away" and both now wish they were a bit closer. Their school is 2 1/2 hours from me which means I can do it in a day, or they can take a bus, but it is a process. They both now wish they were closer to an hour away so if they wanted to pop home for a weekend they could. They envy their friends that can go home and easily be back early Sunday for studying. 3 hours seems doable now but it will take on a whole new meaning when you do it over and over and over again.

 

If school B's academics are not as strong your child may end up bored. That is what happened to my youngest. She went with the "out-of-state not as strong academically but had a great scholarship school" and hated it. Nothing demotivates a student more than basic classes where they don't feel like they are being challenged. Plus the overall academic abilities of the students around them are lower and that can be hard She ended up feeling bad about herself because she knew her school was letting her down academically yet she chose it. She ended up transferring after one semester to the in-state school and loves it.

 

The transfer process is very painful. Do not discount that and think "well if he loses his scholarship he can transfer." It is hard to start at college and get settled in and meet people only to leave them and start at a new school behind everyone. I can't even imagine what it is like transferring after freshman year. Plus my DD had to explain over and over to everyone why she was transferring which to her was like explaining her big failure over and over. Transferring her credits and her financial aid was a red tape nightmare. 

[regentrude]

College A. Better academic fit plus freedom in course selection would be the deciding factors; staying if scholarship is lost woudl be a nice bonus.

 

Old dorm vs new dorm would not even enter the consideration for me. My DD lives in an ancient dorm and woudl not want to trade for the more modern one. 

 

It is difficult to count on "social fit" and  finding a "tribe" - that is a question of luck, even at a school that looks as if it would be a great fit. This is a gamble, and I would not compromise the educational quality based on the seemingly higher probablity of finding like minded people.

[FaithManor]

I would vote for A if the social fit is "okay". It doesn't have to be stellar, but just have opportunities to meet like minded people. The reason for this is that transferring can be a very dicey, thorny issue. Many schools do not have reciprocal agreements resulting in the student being required to take coursework over again at their transfer school. That is a lot of time and money down the drain. While I love the idea of a good fit socially, I still think that the main goal of college is the education so also prefer schools with very solid academic standards and most especially if I am going to be contributing funds to the cause. There is something to be said for "bang for the buck".

 

What I would probably do is make sure my student has some opportunities to visit campus again, have an overnight, etc., get to orientation early, and have him or her explore what clubs, study groups, social activities, and opportunities are available for finding that special tribe and then do everything I could to encourage my student to get involved in something right away in order to help find his/her niche. I would ask not only the admission's department, but the student union/activities department, the dean, and upper classmen in my student's major about what is available.

 

As for dorms, they don't need frills. When I was in college, I spent way more time in class, the library, the practice rooms, cafeteria, student lounge, and attending study groups than I ever did in my room. I think my room was simply the place I went to change my clothes and sleep, LOL! I would not worry about older style dorms with fewer amenities because that is not going to make or break his college experience.

 

 

[Jaybee]

From my experience I would choose college A. No matter how smart you child is there are so many factors that can affect their GPA and cause them to lose their scholarship that it becomes like the sword of Damocles hanging over their head. And to have to leave and transfer to another is a huge upheaval.

 

As far as the older dorm - eh. They only live there for a fraction of their time before they get off campus housing. And when they are all living together they don't really notice the age of the dorms just how much fun they are having.

 

I know you said that the out of state school is only 3 hours away, but distance makes a big difference!! Both my girls were excited about going to school "far away" and both now wish they were a bit closer. Their school is 2 1/2 hours from me which means I can do it in a day, or they can take a bus, but it is a process. They both now wish they were closer to an hour away so if they wanted to pop home for a weekend they could. They envy their friends that can go home and easily be back early Sunday for studying. 3 hours seems doable now but it will take on a whole new meaning when you do it over and over and over again.

 

If school B's academics are not as strong your child may end up bored. That is what happened to my youngest. She went with the "out-of-state not as strong academically but had a great scholarship school" and hated it. Nothing demotivates a student more than basic classes where they don't feel like they are being challenged. Plus the overall academic abilities of the students around them are lower and that can be hard She ended up feeling bad about herself because she knew her school was letting her down academically yet she chose it. She ended up transferring after one semester to the in-state school and loves it.

 

The transfer process is very painful. Do not discount that and think "well if he loses his scholarship he can transfer." It is hard to start at college and get settled in and meet people only to leave them and start at a new school behind everyone. I can't even imagine what it is like transferring after freshman year. Plus my DD had to explain over and over to everyone why she was transferring which to her was like explaining her big failure over and over. Transferring her credits and her financial aid was a red tape nightmare. 

For many of these same reasons, I would also choose College A, which is now running 3 for 3! :)

ETA: 4 for 4

[Pen]

School A, and look at what small group activities exist where he might find friends (school paper, a sport, outdoor action group, service group, singing group, etc., whatever he tends to like) and see about joining it.

[clementine]

I am going to choose the one not chosen yet  :tongue_smilie: "B" - based on my personal experience.  If the social fit isn't there, it is a little more difficult to be comfortable and be able to focus on the rest.  I didn't find my tribe & had to transfer schools after the first year.  I was out of state and the school just wasn't a good fit for me socially.   

 

The good thing is that he likes both schools almost equally, so he would be okay with either one.   

[lmrich]

School A - He will find his way socially. There is a group for everyone.

[katilac]

I agree with other posters that the distance can make a difference, even if it seems reasonably close at first, but 3 hours is well within in our comfort range for a kid who wants to come home several times during the semester (mostly because her target schools all have two fall breaks with 4 day weekends, and we know we could make 2 more visits happen even if we go up there to get her).

 

What are the requirements for keeping the scholarship? A 3.5 leaves very little wiggle room; I'm more comfortable with a 3.3 requirement (and I've seen several 3.0 requirements). 

 

Is there a probationary period or an appeals process? 

 

If the scholarship conditions are stressful, I'd go for the other college. 

 

If the scholarship conditions are more reasonable, I'd have him quit trying to reason it out at this point (bc it sounds like y'all have done that).  Have him quit thinking about it and talking about it for at least a day, like walking away from a paper he's trying to revise. Then he can close his eyes and think about being at college - where does he see himself? 

 

Yeah, that's my feel-good, new-agey advice for the day! 

[plansrme]

I also would choose A.  If it is a Big State U, he will find his tribe.  The freedom to choose a lighter course load would be a significant factor for me, as would the pressure of not having to maintain a specific GPA to stay, especially if he is in a difficult major known for low GPAs (engineering, etc.).  As for the dorm, will he really live on campus all four years?  Plenty of students don't when the school doesn't require it.

 

As for the bigger picture, though, my philosophy of tough decisions is that when it is really that hard to make a decision, i.e., so hard that you agonize over it, there is no wrong choice.  Also, keep in mind that the fact that, years from now, he may look back and wish he had chosen B over A or vice-versa in no way means that A or B was the wrong choice at the time.  You make decisions with the information you have now, not with hindsight, and the information you have now looks like either school would be a solid choice.  It is a nice problem to have!

 

 

 

 

[MomsintheGarden]

School A - He will find his way socially. There is a group for everyone.

 

Exactly.

 

[8filltheheart]

I'm with plansrme.  It depends on the school size.  If both schools are small, it would swing my decision in different directions.  

[JanetC]

One vote for not making this decision via a random internet poll.

 

Here is some advice on helping DS decide for himself:

 

http://wiselikeus.com/collegewise/2015/04/when-choosing-which-college-to-attend.html

 

Since both schools are within driving distance, I'd revisit both schools as well.

 

 

[TechWife]

School A, without a doubt. 

[TechWife]

One vote for not making this decision via a random internet poll.

 

Here is some advice on helping DS decide for himself:

 

http://wiselikeus.com/collegewise/2015/04/when-choosing-which-college-to-attend.html

 

Since both schools are within driving distance, I'd revisit both schools as well.

 

Goodness, I doubt OP is making a decision based on a "random internet poll." Likewise, I'm quite sure her ds will decide for himself, but that doesn't mean that parents don't provide guidance, nor does it mean the parents, in turn, can't seek advice or input from other parents who may have had to help their child make the same decisions. It is wise for a student to consult his parents, they know more about life than he does. It is especially wise if they expect the parents to foot part of the bill. It is also wise for people to ask others for input because no one knows everything. 

[JanetC]

Goodness, I doubt OP is making a decision based on a "random internet poll." Likewise, I'm quite sure her ds will decide for himself, but that doesn't mean that parents don't provide guidance, nor does it mean the parents, in turn, can't seek advice or input from other parents who may have had to help their child make the same decisions. It is wise for a student to consult his parents, they know more about life than he does. It is especially wise if they expect the parents to foot part of the bill. It is also wise for people to ask others for input because no one knows everything. 

 

Sorry if I sounded flip. I do think that getting a bunch of random opinions is not as good as thinking through this within the context of the family and a new visit to each school.

 

The people responding here do not know which schools A and B are, yet they are so sure one or the other is better for a student and family they may not even know in real life. Yes, parents should provide guidance. Parents can even consult with friends or experts who know their family and the schools in question. The OP did not post the names of the schools or the child's academic accomplishments, personality, intended major, or extracurricular interests. For the scholarship, we don't know whether the school has a reputation for grade inflation or tough grading. This leaves random strangers with very, very little to base an opinion on for college fit.

 

I did not mean to imply that the OP was simply going to tally the votes and send her son there.  I do think that we should be humble and cautious about recommending either school in these circumstances.  The article I linked had some good links for how to guide a student through making their own decision and I thought it might be helpful.

 

Again, apologies to OP if I came off as belittling your situation, and good luck to your son wherever he decides to study.

[creekland]

We let our kids decide, then we didn't look back.  It can be tough for them weighing pros and cons, but assuming all the places they applied to met with our approval (they did), and places were affordable, it was their decision.

 

I'd be content if my guy chose A or B.  The decision would be theirs.

 

If they remain in doubt, tell them to flip a coin.  Rather than looking at the coin, ask them whether they were hoping for heads or tails.

[Lawyer&Mom]

I'd go school A. Anyone can have an abysmal semester GPA-wise for all sorts of reasons. (Yes, I learned this the hard way.) That semester should really just be a bad memory, and not the reason you had to change schools.

[Pen]

Maybe having gotten thoughts without any knowledge other than the facts presented, it would help to say what the schools are, and what OP's ds hopes to go into, and what the perceived social issue with school A is.

 

To me the main thing in favor of school A is the issue of not losing the scholarship and having to switch schools.  The main thing in favor of school B is the idea that its social life may be better for him. Both are somewhat speculative. Both are significant potential negatives. Between the two, for me, the idea of being secure in not losing a scholarship and having to leave the school part way through seems to outweigh the issue of social life...  But that could change if I were convinced that school A would be a miserable experience socially.  None of the non-speculative matters such as age of dorms seemed significant to me.

[Jaybee]

We let our kids decide, then we didn't look back.  It can be tough for them weighing pros and cons, but assuming all the places they applied to met with our approval (they did), and places were affordable, it was their decision.

 

I'd be content if my guy chose A or B.  The decision would be theirs.

 

If they remain in doubt, tell them to flip a coin.  Rather than looking at the coin, ask them whether they were hoping for heads or tails.

Yes, I was thinking that if you say "most people said they would choose A" and he realizes he wants to argue with that or feels disappointed, then there is his answer right there--B.

[Pen]

 

 

We just don't know how much importance to give to each of these factors, so it is hard for ds to make a final decision. Two weeks ago we revisited both schools and ds sat in on classes, etc, to aid in the decision making process. The result was that he is now more conflicted than ever. We would so appreciate advice from those of you who have walked this road ahead of us. 

 

 

Going back like that is usually what is recommended in such cases if possible. Since he has already done that, can he articulate what is causing his conflict?

 

Maybe some of it can get sorted out, like if he really prefers B, but is worried about what would happen if he loses the scholarship, maybe he could come up with a plan for that.  

 

Or maybe he could contact people in fields he wants to go into and see how they regard the programs at A and B, and which would give a better chance toward the next step he wants to do.

 

Or if he really prefers A but is worried about the social issue, maybe he could call a Dean of students there and get ideas for dealing with that.

[Starr]

I'm not so sure about an overnight. We found they depend strictly on if you get along well with your host. It's not really informational.

[Mom2boys]

From my experience I would choose college A. No matter how smart you child is there are so many factors that can affect their GPA and cause them to lose their scholarship that it becomes like the sword of Damocles hanging over their head. And to have to leave and transfer to another is a huge upheaval.

 

I know you said that the out of state school is only 3 hours away, but distance makes a big difference!! Both my girls were excited about going to school "far away" and both now wish they were a bit closer. Their school is 2 1/2 hours from me which means I can do it in a day, or they can take a bus, but it is a process. They both now wish they were closer to an hour away so if they wanted to pop home for a weekend they could. They envy their friends that can go home and easily be back early Sunday for studying. 3 hours seems doable now but it will take on a whole new meaning when you do it over and over and over again.

 

If school B's academics are not as strong your child may end up bored. That is what happened to my youngest. She went with the "out-of-state not as strong academically but had a great scholarship school" and hated it. Nothing demotivates a student more than basic classes where they don't feel like they are being challenged. Plus the overall academic abilities of the students around them are lower and that can be hard 

 

The transfer process is very painful. Do not discount that and think "well if he loses his scholarship he can transfer." It is hard to start at college and get settled in and meet people only to leave them and start at a new school behind everyone. I can't even imagine what it is like transferring after freshman year. Plus my DD had to explain over and over to everyone why she was transferring which to her was like explaining her big failure over and over. Transferring her credits and her financial aid was a red tape nightmare. 

 

Thank you for sharing your dds' experiences. Your perspective is really helpful! I do worry about the pressure of having to keep a scholarship to remain at the school. And I do think there is a good chance my ds won't feel academically challenged at school B outside of his honors classes. 

[Mom2boys]

I agree with other posters that the distance can make a difference, even if it seems reasonably close at first, but 3 hours is well within in our comfort range for a kid who wants to come home several times during the semester (mostly because her target schools all have two fall breaks with 4 day weekends, and we know we could make 2 more visits happen even if we go up there to get her).

 

What are the requirements for keeping the scholarship? A 3.5 leaves very little wiggle room; I'm more comfortable with a 3.3 requirement (and I've seen several 3.0 requirements). 

 

Is there a probationary period or an appeals process? 

 

If the scholarship conditions are stressful, I'd go for the other college. 

 

If the scholarship conditions are more reasonable, I'd have him quit trying to reason it out at this point (bc it sounds like y'all have done that).  Have him quit thinking about it and talking about it for at least a day, like walking away from a paper he's trying to revise. Then he can close his eyes and think about being at college - where does he see himself? 

 

Yeah, that's my feel-good, new-agey advice for the day! 

 

He only needs a 3.0 to renew the scholarship, which is probably quite do-able. However, I know from personal experience that lots of things can happen to effect GPA. I would hate to see him have to leave after getting established there.

 

I agree that taking a step back and not thinking about this for a week or so would be good for him. But the fact that he doesn't know where he is going to college this fall is stressing him out. And it doesn't help that people keep asking him if he has made a decision yet!

[Mom2boys]

I also would choose A.  If it is a Big State U, he will find his tribe.  The freedom to choose a lighter course load would be a significant factor for me, as would the pressure of not having to maintain a specific GPA to stay, especially if he is in a difficult major known for low GPAs (engineering, etc.).  As for the dorm, will he really live on campus all four years?  Plenty of students don't when the school doesn't require it.

 

As for the bigger picture, though, my philosophy of tough decisions is that when it is really that hard to make a decision, i.e., so hard that you agonize over it, there is no wrong choice.  Also, keep in mind that the fact that, years from now, he may look back and wish he had chosen B over A or vice-versa in no way means that A or B was the wrong choice at the time.  You make decisions with the information you have now, not with hindsight, and the information you have now looks like either school would be a solid choice.  It is a nice problem to have!

 

He does have two great options. We've told him it is a good position to be in. But right now he wishes he could find a big flaw with one or the other so the choice would be obvious.

[Mom2boys]

I'm with plansrme.  It depends on the school size.  If both schools are small, it would swing my decision in different directions.  

 

Neither is small. They both have undergrad enrollments of around 17,000.

[Mom2boys]

Sorry if I sounded flip. I do think that getting a bunch of random opinions is not as good as thinking through this within the context of the family and a new visit to each school.

 

The people responding here do not know which schools A and B are, yet they are so sure one or the other is better for a student and family they may not even know in real life. Yes, parents should provide guidance. Parents can even consult with friends or experts who know their family and the schools in question. The OP did not post the names of the schools or the child's academic accomplishments, personality, intended major, or extracurricular interests. For the scholarship, we don't know whether the school has a reputation for grade inflation or tough grading. This leaves random strangers with very, very little to base an opinion on for college fit.

 

I did not mean to imply that the OP was simply going to tally the votes and send her son there.  I do think that we should be humble and cautious about recommending either school in these circumstances.  The article I linked had some good links for how to guide a student through making their own decision and I thought it might be helpful.

 

Again, apologies to OP if I came off as belittling your situation, and good luck to your son wherever he decides to study.

 

Never fear - my son will be making his own decision!  :001_smile: While I value the experience and wisdom of many on this forum, I don't give "the Hive" the final say in any decision in our lives. 

 

But thank you for sharing your concerns and the link to the article. I will pass it along to my ds.

[Mom2boys]

Goodness, I doubt OP is making a decision based on a "random internet poll." Likewise, I'm quite sure her ds will decide for himself, but that doesn't mean that parents don't provide guidance, nor does it mean the parents, in turn, can't seek advice or input from other parents who may have had to help their child make the same decisions. It is wise for a student to consult his parents, they know more about life than he does. It is especially wise if they expect the parents to foot part of the bill. It is also wise for people to ask others for input because no one knows everything. 

 

Yep. This exactly.

 

 

If they remain in doubt, tell them to flip a coin.  Rather than looking at the coin, ask them whether they were hoping for heads or tails.

 

Ohhh, good idea!

 

I'd go school A. Anyone can have an abysmal semester GPA-wise for all sorts of reasons. (Yes, I learned this the hard way.) That semester should really just be a bad memory, and not the reason you had to change schools.

 

Been there, done that, and thankfully didn't have to change schools because of it.

 

*Edited to add: Look! I figured out how to multiquote!*

[Lori D.]

Factors I didn't see mentioned that might be helpful in making a decision:

 

If the student is still undecided about specific degree program (or even if very certain!), which school has the better overall programs as options to switch to if the student changes his/her mind a year or two into college? In other words, which school would keep open more options for the student so that transferring schools would be less needful if the student switches majors?

 

What do the two schools offer as far as the possibility of internships? Working closely with a professor? Research opportunities as an undergrad?

 

Are there specific professors at one or the other school that the student would really "click" with or want to sit under their instruction?

 

How "party-oriented" are the schools, and will that make it more difficult for the student to study, or make friends if the student is not "party-oriented", regardless of other social opportunities?

 

Will the student need/want to work a part time job on campus while attending, and if so, does one school have more positions available for students than the other?

 

Is accreditation of the school going to be a factor for making a degree from one of the schools more desirable by future employers? (Esp. for medical, engineering, or STEM fields, specific kinds of accreditation of the degree program makes the student much more employable than without it.)

 

Will the student's degree field require a Master's degree? If so, how will the Bachelor degree from either school be accepted or looked on as adequate prep for admission to a graduate program?