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I was thinking the same thing.  I imagine it also depends on where in the country you live? In coastal CA and I imagine in other places with very hot summers, tank tops are pretty standard summer garb.  I've never understood what the thickness of a strap has to do with modesty? Surely it's not the strip of skin on the shoulder around the strap showing that is most problematic where modesty is concerned?

 

I assume it's because a thicker strap would cover the bra strap? Because seeing a bra strap is appealing somehow??  I saw a young homeschooled girl yesterday wearing one of those tanks tops with the thin straps but no bra and honestly that bothered me more than seeing her bra strap would.

 

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Suggestive of lingerie. I don't have a problem with sleeveless per se, but the overall look of the tank needs to be sporty rather than s*xy.

 

None of my lingerie ever looked like that!

 

Some girls don't want to look sporty. I don't see how showing your shoulder is sexy. But 150 years ago ankles wear sexy and I don't understand that either!

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Wider straps are more sporty and less suggestive. Compare the first one linked earlier (which looks like underwear to me) with this one: http://www.hanes.com/clothing/women/camis---tank-tops/hanes-wide-strap-tank-top--25839?cm_vc=PDPZ1

 

I think context needs to be considered. If thin straps are showing  in an otherwise rather everyday outfit then whomever thinks they're suggestive should likely recognize the problem is their own. If the straps are showing under a sheer top at party, there might be some intent to be suggestive. 

 

It's never been an issue with my kids and I don't intend to make it one. I've made a decision not to make my daughter (because we really are almost always talking daughters with these threads) responsible for what goes on in other people's heads.

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Oldest DD is doing an afterschool orchestra that our zoned high school is running for 4th & 5th graders (DD has an October birthday so I had no qualms about signing her up as a 5th grader). Anyways, I spent an hour yesterday afternoon waiting at the high school while she had practice. I was floored by the outfits that the school apparently lets the female students wear. They definitely wouldn't have passed muster at my high school back in the day.

 

One popular look was a sheer lace tank over a bra. Another was a tank with totally cut out sides so that it was basically a smallish strip of fabric running down the front barely covering anything and a smallish strip (or strips) of fabric running down the back. The bra was totally visible from the side and all the girls sporting this look wore brightly contrasting bras. Similar to this one: http://www.slimskii.com/blue-shredded-cut-out-muscle-tee/?gclid=CKXqg6_b6r0CFcaCfgodBBEA1g

 

This is why I pray that we'll figure out the financial logistics to do private or online high school...

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Oldest DD is doing an afterschool orchestra that our zoned high school is running for 4th & 5th graders (DD has an October birthday so I had no qualms about signing her up as a 5th grader). Anyways, I spent an hour yesterday afternoon waiting at the high school while she had practice. I was floored by the outfits that the school apparently lets the female students wear. They definitely wouldn't have passed muster at my high school back in the day.

 

One popular look was a sheer lace tank over a bra. Another was a tank with totally cut out sides so that it was basically a smallish strip of fabric running down the front barely covering anything and a smallish strip (or strips) of fabric running down the back. The bra was totally visible from the side and all the girls sporting this look wore brightly contrasting bras. Similar to this one: http://www.slimskii.com/blue-shredded-cut-out-muscle-tee/?gclid=CKXqg6_b6r0CFcaCfgodBBEA1g

 

This is why I pray that we'll figure out the financial logistics to do private or online high school...

 

Yea, ok, I'd have to be drawing the line at that. With a tank top under it? Yes. Just a bra? Heck no! And not in 4th or 5th grade!

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Well as most 4th and 5th grade girls I know so not yet wear a bra I would have to the above is fine even if highly impracticle .

Wait, did you just say you think a sheer lace tank or tank with cut out sides is fine for a preteen to wear in public?

 

huh.

 

I'm pretty sure these were highschoolers being referenced, but I would not see this as acceptable for anyone--female, male, adult, child...to wear to school or afterschool activities.

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Yea, ok, I'd have to be drawing the line at that. With a tank top under it? Yes. Just a bra? Heck no! And not in 4th or 5th grade!

Just to clarify, these were on the high school students, NOT the late elementary girls! So those wearing the sheer/cutout tanks were all presumably in the 14-18 age range.

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Homeschool for high school crimson!

We may very well wind up keeping her home, but I'm already starting to bump up against the limits of what I can teach her. Also California has extremely annoying admissions requirements for students applying to the UC and Cal State schools having to complete state-approved coursework. So it is difficult to HS independently unless you're willing to go the CC transfer route (my DH is against that idea).

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How do the poor teenaged boys focus on thei schoolwork?

I'm concerned not just about the effects on the boys, but on the body image issues in the girls themselves. I want my DD focused on her studies and extracurriculars, not whether she's got a flat enough stomach to show off.

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Wait, did you just say you think a sheer lace tank or tank with cut out sides is fine for a preteen to wear in public?

 

huh.

 

I'm pretty sure these were highschoolers being referenced, but I would not see this as acceptable for anyone--female, male, adult, child...to wear to school or afterschool activities.

Eh, I read on my phone while sitting next to the ice rink freezing to death as my son skates circles. I thought she said that the 4th-5th grade girls were wearing these. At that age they do not (well, none of the ones I know, and granted that is not many) need bras, so a shirt like that would be over a tank top or over a swimming suit.

 

Just to clarify, these were on the high school students, NOT the late elementary girls! So those wearing the sheer/cutout tanks were all presumably in the 14-18 age range.

Thank you for clarifying the age range. 

 

 

I still see nothing wrong with the clothes.

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How do the poor teenaged boys focus on thei schoolwork?

Because they have been raised to know and understand that girls should be respected for who they are and not their body, or that they have been raised in such a way to know that beauty is only skin deep and that to have respect for a female is to not treat her as an object to be stared at and drooled over. 

 

Why it is always the "poor teenage boys"? Boys can be raised to have respect for girls no matter what they are wearing. They can be taught to make eye contact, engage in conversation with girls and to not view girls and women as objects that are there for their visual and sexual satisfaction. These types of conversations about what girls should or should not wear is incredibly demeaning towards men because the underlying message is that males of all ages are nothing more than animals who have no ability to control themselves as they hunt to satisfy their uncontrollable sexual needs. 

 

I am happy to say that the teenage male figure skaters at the rink have none of the issues with self control that are so commonly associated with the teenage male and are able to focus to hours at a time on their skating while 'scantily' clad teenage girls are spinning and jumping around them. Even the boys doing ice dance and pairs who are in physical contact with said 'scantily clad' girls do not have an issue. 

 

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My dd15 goes to a Los Angeles public school for high school. I can't begin to tell you what I see on boys and girls walking out of those gates everyday. I put my foot down at a 3.5 inch inseam for shorts. I would prefer 5-7 inches. We fight constantly over clothes, and she is one of the more modestly dressed girls at her school. It doesn't help she wears a C cup. On a side note, I had to ask the cheer sponsor to add a couple of inches to my dd uniform skirt. She has a "Beyonce" butt, so her skirt gets shorter in the back.

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I still see nothing wrong with the clothes.

At a nightclub or on a beach boardwalk, they wouldn't have looked out of place. But there's a time and a place for such clothes, and I don't think a high school classroom is the right one. This is why I would support the district implementing a uniform requirement. Nothing expensive- just a plain polo or Oxford shirt with khakis that one can find at pretty much at any major store.

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At a nightclub or on a beach boardwalk, they wouldn't have looked out of place. But there's a time and a place for such clothes, and I don't think a high school classroom is the right one. This is why I would support the district implementing a uniform requirement. Nothing expensive- just a plain polo or Oxford shirt with khakis that one can find at pretty much at any major store.

 

Over that? Seriously? Wow. There is nothing wrong with that. 

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Over that? Seriously? Wow. There is nothing wrong with that.

You seriously think that wearing a sheer lace tank over a bra is an appropriate outfit for a classroom?

 

If you were a lawyer, would you want your client testifying in court wearing a sheer lace tank over a bra? Or would you want her to dress more appropriately for the occasion?

 

I wouldn't wear a business suit to the beach, and I wouldn't wear a sheer lace tank to court or to school. It's all about finding the look that is appropriate for the environment that one is in.

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My 9yo is developing and by 4th/5th will have full-on breasts so I've had to veto many an outfit lately.  Things that are perfectly appropriate on her flat-chested, bird-like buddies, no longer work on her.  Helping her adjust to her changing body is a process.  I do think it's important tho to make sure she understand that my objections have nothing to do with what boys or men might be thinking.  I couldn't give a rats behind what they think at this point.  I just want DD to be able to determine proper fit.  Clothes that ride up in the crotch area, or fit so snug that her buds are outlined, do not fit properly.  It's really that simple for me.  She is developing exactly as she should and won't be made to feel guilty/bad about that.  She and I just have to make sure that we are purchasing (and selecting from the closet) clothes that still fit properly.

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Over that? Seriously? Wow. There is nothing wrong with that.

I'd disagree there...sort of. A girl should not be ashamed for wearing clothes some might find questionable.But it's not unreasonable for an institution like a school to have some standards of dress. The difficulty is in navigating the two concerns because too often standards of dress DO simply become about covering up girls.

 

I know that if my daughter dressed for school in a bra and sheer top I'd make her change. That will never happen because that's not my daughter's style but I do have to send my son back to his bedroom frequently to get pants that aren't ripped, shirts that aren't stained etc. When he's going to Scouts or an appointment.

 

Clothing expectations should be based, I think, on the context, not on certain individuals. I've got to think more about this...My husband is bugging me for the phone. :D

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None of my lingerie ever looked like that!

 

Some girls don't want to look sporty. I don't see how showing your shoulder is sexy. But 150 years ago ankles wear sexy and I don't understand that either!

I went to a workshop on historical clothing once, and now know the answer to why showing ankles was once considered scandalous. It has to do with the design of women's undergarment that were worn under those many layers of skirts and petticoats. Most were not closed at the crotch.

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I thought of this thread this morning when I brought one of my old (skinny) dresses in for my oldest to wear to church this morning. She refused to wear it without a 3/4 sleeve jacket because the sleeves were too short.  :lol:

 

DD#1's modesty level is much more developed than mine is and I'm scandalized quite easily by the prom dresses I've seen lately. I'm NOT the one pushing the super-modesty, but I want her to feel comfy. At her request, I just ordered her swim shorts.  :huh:

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I am a mom to three young men 22, 20 and 16 and one beautiful girl, who is ten.  I used to be the girl who wore the shredded shirts as a teenager.  I had no respect for myself or others.  I grew up when I was twenty nine.  I understood that I had value and because I had value, no one else deserved to see my skin.   No more enticing clothes.  It wasn't necessary.  My husband values me for who I am....not what I wear.  My sons are continually challenged by the clothing choices of their school mates at college.  Barely there shorts...bikini tops in the classroom. Crazy stuff.  Some days they hate going to school, because they shift their eyes to look away, only to see another girl who came to school nearly naked. 

 

I've taught my daughter to dress comfortably and in a conservatively stylish manner.  We do have standards.  These standards protect my daughter from unwanted attention, and is respectful of the visual nature of men and also reflects the respect we have for ourselves.

 

Off the top of my head, these are our standards:

 

No bare midrifts, no bikinis. 

 

Sleeveless and tanks are okay, but we choose styles that are less form fitting. (We live in Florida)

 

Skirts and shorts must be fingertip length or longer

 

We avoid skin tight pants

 

When you bend over, your chest and backside must remain covered - no gaps. 

 

When you sit indian-style, there should not be any gaps that reveal anything

 

Leggings are worn with a tunic that covers the backside if we are at a church event, but if exercise is involved, we ease up.  Exercise is exercise...we just encourage each other not to flaunt stuff around.  LOL

 

This is what we do.  These are not rigid standards...more like a guideline.  For instance, if we find a pretty blouse, but when my daughter bends over you can see down her shirt, she is at the age, where she can be aware and avoid bending over, or placing her hand over her top as she bends over to stop the gap.  When she was little, I just didn't buy tops that had a gap.  We have never had an issue with clothing because I began teaching her as a four year old about appropriate choices.   She has been challenged by clothing advertisements from time to time, but when we talk it through, she comes to her own conclusions that the style would cause more harm than good in her life.

 

We have enjoyed The Secret Keeper materials, and Nancy Leigh DeMoss has a helpful booklet about modesty designed for teenagers.  I think it is called "The Look:  Does God Really Care What I Wear?"  Great resource.

 

Blessings,

Yvonne

 

http://www.yvonneferlita.blogspot.com

http://www.notperfect-justordinary.blogspot.com

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Well, we've always been picky about what clothes we bought the girls from the time they were born.  So as they've grown, some of that has just become our normal, typical, thing that we're comfortable with.

 

We  don't do bikinis, but tankinis are fine.

We don't do any writing on the butt, never have.

We don't do shortie shorts.  Mid-thigh is okay.  Skirts around knee length.

No bare midriffs!  No one-shoulder or off the shoulder tops.

 

I am not vetoing many things here - the girls have absorbed these standards and prefer them.  Rebecca is a bit scandalized by small bikinis!

 

 

However, Rebecca lives in leotards because she's a gymnast.  A time and a place!

 

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Guest callmequeenelizabeth

Our daughter never had many issues.  She does like the spaghetti strap tanks but will cover up willingly.  Like others, it's never been a problem.

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How do the poor teenaged boys focus on thei schoolwork?

 

 

Hopefully the same way they refrain from raping a young woman sometime in the future.   I am not focusing on you, I have seen this same argument many times, and each time I imagine a defense attorney explaining why his client didn't #really rape anyone, because, well, he just couldn't help himself.  

 

In a world where 1 in 5 women are raped or someone attempts to rape them, we as mothers of men must do better.  There will always be women who are considered immodest by others standards so we darn sure better be teaching our boys that clothing is not an indicator of anything.  

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I'd disagree there...sort of. A girl should not be ashamed for wearing clothes some might find questionable.But it's not unreasonable for an institution like a school to have some standards of dress. The difficulty is in navigating the two concerns because too often standards of dress DO simply become about covering up girls.

 

I know that if my daughter dressed for school in a bra and sheer top I'd make her change. That will never happen because that's not my daughter's style but I do have to send my son back to his bedroom frequently to get pants that aren't ripped, shirts that aren't stained etc. When he's going to Scouts or an appointment.

 

Clothing expectations should be based, I think, on the context, not on certain individuals. I've got to think more about this...My husband is bugging me for the phone. :D

 

 

I agree.  Schools do have dress codes but few enforce them for some reason.   I never had a problem with what my daughter wore as a child or teen.  She sometimes wore tank tops but didn't dress to be sexy because she was more interested in other things,  luckily.   I have seen the tank tops with the sides cut out at the high school and the girls aren't wearing bras.  Believe it or not they look like bras but the young women wear them without covers during sports, dance, cheering, or karate.  They are much thicker than bras, and they also keep their breasts from moving almost like a sports bra.  I guess they are half tanks with a built in bra shelf.  You can see the women's soccer teams wearing them when playing.  I am pretty sure their intention is not to be sexy?

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Hopefully the same way they refrain from raping a young woman sometime in the future. I am not focusing on you, I have seen this same argument many times, and each time I imagine a defense attorney explaining why his client didn't #really rape anyone, because, well, he just couldn't help himself.

 

In a world where 1 in 5 women are raped or someone attempts to rape them, we as mothers of men must do better. There will always be women who are considered immodest by others standards so we darn sure better be teaching our boys that clothing is not an indicator of anything.

 

This is a ridiculous comment on my question. I'm sorry but if someone's daughter walks around dressed trashy in a sheer lace tee/ bra my son will treat her like a person and he will certainly not harm her. But if he is uncomfortable it would be hard to focus on school work. That was an honest question.

 

Saying "hmmm I wonder if it's hard to focus?." Isn't saying "those boys have excuses now to demean and rape women."

 

Please. Eye roll.

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I have not read the other replies and my dd is only 5 but the standards she does/will live by are:

 

no sleeveless, tank tops, spaghetti straps, sun dresses. All must have a "Modest-Tee" underneath.

shorts to the top of her knees/mid thigh, 7-9 in. inseams

shirts cover her tummy when she raises her arms straight up

skirts touch the ground when she is kneeling on her knees with her knees at a right angle to the ground

play dresses have shorts/biker shorts or leggings underneath

no plunging necklines, cut out backs

 

one piece swimsuit or long tankini top/skirted bottom. {Her suits have all had a cute little skirt to cover her bum so far.}

long sleeve swim shirt over {We live in TX. Skin cancer is a threat.}

no flip flops or Crocs

no holes in clothes that shouldn't be there. {Like arm holes. ;p}

 

Lands' End and Gymboree are my favorite shops.

 

This is the way she has been dresed since birth.

 

Dress/groom kids the way/standards you want them to keep from the time they are small and talk about modesty {even to boys} and you will have fewer problems as they get older. Also, example says a lot. Just saying.

 

My boys have the same standards {not the skirts, of course :)}

no tanks, no rips, no holes, no falling down to their booty pants, no smart mouth/offensive sayings on tees, etc. Neat and tidy haircuts. Not on the ears or the back of the necks. No body piercings, no tatoos--not even temporary ones. Modesty goes both ways.

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This is a ridiculous comment on my question. I'm sorry but if someone's daughter walks around dressed trashy in a sheer lace tee/ bra my son will treat her like a person and he will certainly not harm her. But if he is uncomfortable it would be hard to focus on school work. That was an honest question.

 

Saying "hmmm I wonder if it's hard to focus?." Isn't saying "those boys have excuses now to demean and rape women."

 

Please. Eye roll.

Okay then I will expand my answer because this is an epidemic in our society.   You have called these young women, trashy and in another comment Jerry Springer types.   Do you really think it is a huge leap to wonder if your sons or others son don't pick up those attitudes and then treat young women like how did you say it......trash?   

 

That is how young women are sexually assaulted.  They first are either dehumanized like trash, or they are considered less than or deserving of abuse ie Jerry Springer types, because they brought it on themselves with their often horrible choices in how they dress. 

 

Those teenage boys are going to be uncomfortable during the day and have a hard time focusing because they are automatically getting 15 to 50 erections a day.  Boys who live where women wear burkas, covered from head to toe, are still getting them 15 to 50 times a day.  They are getting erections while wrestling with their brothers or male friends and they freak they might be gay.   They get them when they see Grandma bend over and they freak out they might be sick, and yes, they are going to get them when they see scantily clad young women.  

 

I wish young women, and men for that matter, valued themselves and didn't get caught up in sexualized behavior so early, but they are all confused.  Society is telling young women all day every day that their value is in their looks and they are experimenting and often following each other like sheep into wearing more and more revealing clothing.  They get attention some positive and some negative from their clothing choices.  But attention for sure.   Young women pushing the envelope to see where the line is from either their family, and their peer group, is as normal for a teen girl as erections are for teen boys.   But we slut shame the girls and worry about the poor boys.  That is my main issue.  

 

The young men gang raping or standing by video taping a girl being sexually assaulted are raised in normal families.   Young men going off to college and raping their dates are raised in normal families.  Maybe those poor boys never learned how to focus or to take responsibility for their thoughts or actions?  They get a differently but equally screwed up message about sexuality.  

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Okay then I will expand my answer because this is an epidemic in our society.   You have called these young women, trashy and in another comment Jerry Springer types.   Do you really think it is a huge leap to wonder if your sons or others son don't pick up those attitudes and then treat young women like how did you say it......trash?   

 

That is how young women are sexually assaulted.  They first are either dehumanized like trash, or they are considered less than or deserving of abuse ie Jerry Springer types, because they brought it on themselves with their often horrible choices in how they dress. 

 

Those teenage boys are going to be uncomfortable during the day and have a hard time focusing because they are automatically getting 15 to 50 erections a day.  Boys who live where women wear burkas, covered from head to toe, are still getting them 15 to 50 times a day.  They are getting erections while wrestling with their brothers or male friends and they freak they might be gay.   They get them when they see Grandma bend over and they freak out they might be sick, and yes, they are going to get them when they see scantily clad young women.  

 

I wish young women, and men for that matter, valued themselves and didn't get caught up in sexualized behavior so early, but they are all confused.  Society is telling young women all day every day that their value is in their looks and they are experimenting and often following each other like sheep into wearing more and more revealing clothing.  They get attention some positive and some negative from their clothing choices.  But attention for sure.   Young women pushing the envelope to see where the line is from either their family, and their peer group, is as normal for a teen girl as erections are for teen boys.   But we slut shame the girls and worry about the poor boys.  That is my main issue.  

 

The young men gang raping or standing by video taping a girl being sexually assaulted are raised in normal families.   Young men going off to college and raping their dates are raised in normal families.  Maybe those poor boys never learned how to focus or to take responsibility for their thoughts or actions?  They get a differently but equally screwed up message about sexuality.  

+1 

 

I have whore out all my likes for the day as a result of wearing too little clothing so I am +1 this.

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I have an almost 11 yo DD.  She knows the rules and I actually saw her checking for herself the other day and it was something I was ok with but it didn't quite reach her fingertips so she deemed it too small, haha.  That's ok with me.  We set the rules from the beginning, I hate seeing little girls in adult clothing, so we just always had base rules..when purchasing clothes, and when going through "hand me downs."  Our rules include:

 

Shorts/skirts to reach fingertips (exception:beachwear, short shorts are ok over a bathing suit for the ride to the beach)

Absolutely NO words across the butt, I cannot stand that..no one should be reading a little girls bottom.

No crazy rips/holes/stains..not even ripped jeans, I hate that style.

No make up, except for special occasions

No bare midrift

No strapless tops...thin straps are ok if doubled up or over a bathing suit

Two piece bathing suits are ok if most of the belly and back are covered (we always only did one pieces until she was in an awkward size where it gapped at the bottom, then we switched to tankinis, which are easier for dressing/bathroom/etc, and the bottom can be pulled up to fit properly.

Leggings are for under a long top/dress..or for pjs

 

I think that's all, or most, lol.  I kind of forget what they are because now the only question really is "is it apprpriate?" and she knows the answer based on ten years of helping to choose her cloths.

 

 

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I have whore out all my likes for the day as a result of wearing too little clothing so I am +1 this.

 

Had a giggle at your purposeful typo and follow-up reason. While I didn't 'like' the same post you did, I'm  :w00t: at yours.

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I took Shannon swimsuit shopping today and she was almost in tears - but, mom, I don't want a swimsuit! I don't want anybody to see my body! Can't I just wear shorts and a swim shirt?  We ended up getting her a cute tankini with shorts, and a swim shirt to go over it, and part of me is glad she doesn't want to strut her stuff, but part of me is also sad for her, because I don't want her to feel embarrassed and to feel like she has to hide her body, I want her to feel comfortable and confident in it.

 

I guess I have to give her the time to get used to her new self - she has grown so much so fast, and hasn't really come to terms with "becoming a woman" yet.  She kind of wants to hide the signs that she isn't a little girl any more.  I don't really know how to help her through this.

 

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I really do think that location matters. The camisole tank was completely acceptable when I was living in Las Vegas or Queensland. But I now live in small town Ohio, which is much more conservative and it is not particularly appropriate.

I don't necessarily consider myself a prude but if it looks like lingere, a camisole, night gown, it is not appropriate.

 

I am pretty mixed about tanks. I love how comfy they are. But the issue for me isn't about the shoulders themselves, as much as how they hug all those upper body curves and define the chest area. I think tanks and short shorts look better with slender boyish frames. Too many curves looks a little too provocative to me. More like Megan Fox in Transformers.

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