Shocked that this book is on the Grade 11 common core reading list. Scary!

[Mandy in TN]

I started the The Claiming of Sleeping Beauty and might have finished it if it weren't for Anne Rice's annoying writing.

Bwahaha and as a fetish book it is still better than 50 Shades.

[unfrumpable.]

See, I've never read Twilight.  I am not a fan of vampire stuff.   But I mostly keep my uninformed opinions about it to myself. 

 

I broke down and read it after listening to so many people rave about it. I will admit that while reading it, I was very much into it. Afterwards, I decided I would never read it again and wondered why I ever read it in the first place. I did find her take on vampires interesting and often defended her decision to portray them in that way. After all, vampires are fictional characters. So, yeah, I didn't get any intellectual boost from that, but I do understand all the comments and memes and what not. :) I never saw the movies either.

[LucyStoner]

Bwahaha and as a fetish book it is still better than 50 Shades.

 

I will grant you that.  And then some.  

[unfrumpable.]

I started the The Claiming of Sleeping Beauty and might have finished it if it weren't for Anne Rice's annoying writing.  

 

I've read the first two, I don't have the third. If I ever come across it at a thrift store (my favorite place to go book shopping), I will pick it up.

[LucyStoner]

I know. I know, but I live in the Bible belt and after so many ladies went on about how horrible it was I just had to find out.

 

I thought the main demographic for 50 Shades was ladies in the Bible Belt?!   :laugh:

[LucyStoner]

I've read the first two, I don't have the third. If I ever come across it at a thrift store (my favorite place to go book shopping), I will pick it up.

 

I wanted to like it as erotica more than I did.  

[Elfknitter.#]

Anne Rice is one of many reasons I stick with YA novels.

[NASDAQ]

 

The claim that the book is not worth reading seems to be coming from people who have not read the book or any works by this author.

 

The claim that Morrison is an important author is coming from the Pulitzer Prize committee, the Nobel Prize committee, "a couple of hundred prominent writers, critics, editors and other literary sages" (http://www.nytimes.com/ref/books/fiction-25-years.html).

 

I've read two works by this author. I still think that she's elevated in part because she fills a certain niche. That isn't to say that she's not a very good writer, because she is. But if she were an old white man writing abou the problem of grain rationing in 1850s Russia, she would not get very much play on American reading lists. As it happens she's a black (tick) woman (tick) writing about the black American (tick) experience in recent history (tick). Many schools are very interested in exposing their students to black women writers and the black American experience.

[Dory]

I am curious (seriously) what your son found brain bleach worthy in A Brave New World?

 

I'm curious too.

I remember being lividly mad at the book when I read it in 10th grade, but I didn't find it brain bleach worthy per say. A little dirty in some spots yes, but not graphic really, just really, really twisted. I received my best mark ever from that book, because it inspired me to pull out my moms nursing textbooks and some psychology manuals to thoroughly explain what angered me about the book.

[Mandy in TN]

I thought the main demographic for 50 Shades was ladies in the Bible Belt?! :laugh:

I think it was. One of them fessed up to having it and loaned it to me. :)

[Mandy in TN]

I've read the first two, I don't have the third. If I ever come across it at a thrift store (my favorite place to go book shopping), I will pick it up.

I was given them as gifts many, many, many years ago. ;)

[LucyStoner]

I think it was. One of them fessed up to having it and loaned it to me. :)

 

I remember reading that the advent of the e-reader fueled its success.   Soccer moms and literary snobs alike could get their hands on it without being seen as having it.  

[HRAAB]

I detest Hemingway. Would rather pick at my skin until I reach the quick than read him, because I'd find it more edifying and less excruciating. However, I acknowledge that many consider him to be A VERY IMPORTANT AUTHOR worth reading. :)

 

Heresy!  

[Pen]

 

 

I just don't understand why a book that MANY people don't approve of for their kids is on approved/recommended list. There are so many other great books. Can't this book be one that parents provide to their children if they feel it is important for them to read?

 

 

Personally, I like the idea of an approved list that is fairly wide for teachers to be able to choose from.   I did part of my high school at a Catholic school with a very narrow idea of what was okay, and it did not make for especially good schooling.   I did part at a more openminded school, and while some of the books might not have been what some parents would have liked, it also made for a much more interesting experience, and not an especially harmful one.   

 

I am also thinking to myself that there may be children for whom the things in TBE resonate deeply, and who might be personally affected by such issues and gain greatly by hearing something about that put into words where it can begin to be dealt with--but whose family would not at all approve of such a book--even while such events are happening right in the family.  

 

So, let us suppose that Cholly (it that the incestuous Dad's name in the book?) is a real person.  Does he provide a book with similar themes in it for his daughter to read and be able to understand better about her situation?   

[Elfknitter.#]

I've read two works by this author. I still think that she's elevated in part because she fills a certain niche. That isn't to say that she's not a very good writer, because she is. But if she were an old white man writing abou the problem of grain rationing in 1850s Russia, she would not get very much play on American reading lists. As it happens she's a black (tick) woman (tick) writing about the black American (tick) experience in recent history (tick). Many schools are very interested in exposing their students to black women writers and the black American experience.

Well, I should write a great novel then. According to all the affirmative action claims here, I should make bank: Female [check], Of Caribbean descent [check], and homeschooling (something not traditionally done by "my people.") I could easily win a ton of awards that are disingenuous and are easy to make people dismiss the importance of my view of American society all because I fit some need for multicultural tokenism.

 

:p

[Mandy in TN]

I've read two works by this author. I still think that she's elevated in part because she fills a certain niche. That isn't to say that she's not a very good writer, because she is. But if she were an old white man writing abou the problem of grain rationing in 1850s Russia, she would not get very much play on American reading lists. As it happens she's a black (tick) woman (tick) writing about the black American (tick) experience in recent history (tick). Many schools are very interested in exposing their students to black women writers and the black American experience.

I know that this is the umpteenth time I've said this, but TM has been on reading lists for a very long time and has always been controversial. Many schools and now CC have her own their reading list, but I don't believe that means she will be assigned as required classroom reading. Sure, she is on a lot of check lists and yes she is a very good writer, but, in the end, teachers are as concerned as parents about finding books that are a good fit for the group of students in their class and they are sensitive to the concerns of parents.

 

I am glad I homeschool and we can read what we want. :)

Mandy

[AlmiraGulch]

It appears you like to go through this thread accusing people of things. Not having ever perused a library or bookstore, not knowing what graphic detail is.... I'm pretty sure the previous poster knows what graphic detail is. You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

 

I have not read this book. As far as I can tell from your posts, you have not either. Therefore, neither you, nor I, have a leg to stand on regarding discussing or dissing this book. Not in any intellectual way, anyways. Please correct me if I'm wrong and you have read this book, as you alluded to in the post I'm quoting.

 

 

:lol:

[Χά�ων]

Anne Rice is one of many reasons I stick with YA novels.

Best known for her Christian literature, and erotica novels.

[Mandy in TN]

Best known for her Christian literature, and erotica novels.

Lol I thought she was best known for her vampire novels. Of course, that was pre-Twilight.

[Elfknitter.#]

Lol I thought she was best known for her vampire novels. Of course, that was pre-Twilight.

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyy pre-Twilight. I bet Ms. Meyers read Anne Rce as a teen.

[mommaduck]

I am curious (seriously) what your son found brain bleach worthy in A Brave New World?

 

The incest and the orgy.

[mommaduck]

I'm curious too.

I remember being lividly mad at the book when I read it in 10th grade, but I didn't find it brain bleach worthy per say. A little dirty in some spots yes, but not graphic really, just really, really twisted. I received my best mark ever from that book, because it inspired me to pull out my moms nursing textbooks and some psychology manuals to thoroughly explain what angered me about the book.

 

No, not graphic, but he did not like it. He's entitled to his opinion. He understood and was able to discuss the ideas in and around the book. But he stated that hindsight is that he could have done without reading it. Again, we are back to how people process things. See the thread about mental imagery.

[mommaduck]

Reported the spammer.

[Elfknitter.#]

The incest and the orgy.

?

 

You mean a line like this?

"When he is drunk asleep, or in a rage

Or in the incestuous pleasure of his bed..."

[readinmom]

If you haven't read it, maybe you should and make that decision for your own family. If you already have, great.  And btw, reading classics doesn't make you the end all expert.  Either way, I am blown away by the rudeness displayed in order to prove a personal point.  I feel like I'm at my in-laws for a family dinner.  :lol:

 

[Dory]

No, not graphic, but he did not like it. He's entitled to his opinion. He understood and was able to discuss the ideas in and around the book. But he stated that hindsight is that he could have done without reading it. Again, we are back to how people process things. See the thread about mental imagery.

 

I could understand that. I had forgotten about those in there. It's a mild enough intro into some of the harsher literature that for my own kids I might still assign it in 11th or 12th grade depending on the child. I found it harsh too as a teen, but it was mild enough that rather than overwhelm me, it spurred me into some pretty good critical thinking.

My youngest son is pretty sensitive, odds are he will never read any of these sorts of books. I need to make sure he is still aware of the harsh stuff in the world, but probably not through reading harsh literature and never with a book like TBE. That is so far over the top when it come to being graphic that it would be way too much. I didn't sleep last night after reading it and I'm an adult that is used to harsher topics.

[mommaduck]

?

 

You mean a line like this?

"When he is drunk asleep, or in a rage

Or in the incestuous pleasure of his bed..."

 

Apparently, there was a scene where there was an orgy and he had incest with his mother (the main character).

[mommaduck]

I could understand that. I had forgotten about those in there. It's a mild enough intro into some of the harsher literature that for my own kids I might still assign it in 11th or 12th grade depending on the child. I found it harsh too as a teen, but it was mild enough that rather than overwhelm me, it spurred me into some pretty good critical thinking.

My youngest son is pretty sensitive, odds are he will never read any of these sorts of books. I need to make sure he is still aware of the harsh stuff in the world, but probably not through reading harsh literature and never with a book like TBE. That is so far over the top when it come to being graphic that it would be way too much. I didn't sleep last night after reading it and I'm an adult that is used to harsher topics.

 

EXACTLY! My older children are very aware. They don't need to read certain books to know. We don't hide things from them and we do discuss issues.

[umsami]

You clearly don't know what graphic detail is then.  I have never read a book that had as much as this one does. 

 

I actually read a lot of erotica in my 20s... the aforementioned Sleeping Beauty Trilogy....lots of Anais Nin..."Tropic of Cancer", etc.  I've even read some Marquis de Sade ("Justine.")  Although, to be honest, 50 Shades has never interested me.  Yes, I really truly do know what graphic detail is. :)  Perhaps it's a quantity statement on my part as well.  The sex scenes are part of the book, but not the main focus of the book. But then again, it's obvious we have different experiences and this impacts our views.  I don't view the book as pornographic, either... but then again, I've read real "erotica" so that no doubt affects my judgement.  This is not designed to titilate or arouse anybody.  

 

The language in the book is there for a reason...it's to shock you...it's to wake you up...it's not to be erotic.  

 

And as an aside, my quote "It's not in graphic detail" refers to Biblical descriptions of incest in our earlier discussion.  You said that the Bible wasn't in graphic details, and I agreed with you.   

 

You guys have actually inspired me.  Am thinking of doing a "Banned Books Year" with my kids when they're older. :)  

[Irishmommy]

Can we just go back to bashing Algebra and Hemingway??????? Or dancing in red pants????

[Χά�ων]

Can we just go back to bashing Algebra and Hemingway??????? Or dancing in red pants????

I think it is easier to talk about a book no one has read and make outrageous claims as to it's content and worth.

[mamaraby]

You guys have actually inspired me. Am thinking of doing a "Banned Books Year" with my kids when they're older. :)

I love this idea. I've already done a bit of that with some of the banned picture books, but in part that was unintentional since we already owned some of them.

 

I was looking at the ALA banned book lists last night. They have the lists they published for each year from 2004 on at their website. TBE has been on the list every year. The shocker for me was that someone had a problem with Michael Pollan's "The Botany of Desire."

[Elfknitter.#]

I vote for just posting with excessive use of random punctuation!!!!!!!???????......&&&&&&&######+++++++!!!!!!!!!!!

[LucyStoner]

I think it is easiest of all to dance in red pants.  

[LucyStoner]

I vote for just posting with excessive use of random punctuation!!!!!!!???????......&&&&&&&######+++++++!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I don't think you have enough explanation marks there.  Here's some more:  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Luanne]

I think it is easier to talk about a book no one has read and make outrageous claims as to it's content and worth.

 

One doesn't need to read the entire book to know that they don't want to read it and definitely don't want their high schooler to read it.  I guess YOU have never glanced over a book, read parts of it, and decided you didn't want to read it.  Doubtful!

[Luanne]

I HIGHLY doubt any 10 year old would ask to read this. That is a silly argument.

 

I don't think so.  Several people have made it clear they would never keep any of their children from reading any book. 

[LucyStoner]

One doesn't need to read the entire book to know that they don't want to read it and definitely don't want their high schooler to read it.  I guess YOU have never glanced over a book, read parts of it, and decided you didn't want to read it.  Doubtful!

 

Isn't the difference between "want to read" and answering the question "is there value in this book for me/my student" the crux of the whole blasted discussion?  

[Catwoman]

Well, I should write a great novel then. According to all the affirmative action claims here, I should make bank: Female [check], Of Caribbean descent [check], and homeschooling (something not traditionally done by "my people.") I could easily win a ton of awards that are disingenuous and are easy to make people dismiss the importance of my view of American society all because I fit some need for multicultural tokenism.

:p

Go for it! I'll buy it and post a 5 star review on Amazon even if it's the worst book ever written. We'll all post 5 star reviews, except one person will only give you one star because Amazon didn't deliver it to her on time and she's bitter about it. ;)

 

And then we can all petition our school districts and demand it be put on the mandatory reading list so all high school students have to read it whether they like it or not.

 

Don't forget to put in some really lame symbolism. A lot of teachers really love obsessing about symbolism. And a couple of similes and metaphors wouldn't be a bad idea, either. Gotta cover your bases, you know. :D

[Luanne]

Oh, come one. If I told my 10yo that he needed to pick a book, he would go to the non-fiction children's section and grab a short, large font biography or book on some animal. At least that is is what he has been doing since this summer. <sigh>

 

Again, people on here have said it isn't good to ban any book from your children that might be in the library or at home.  I disagree.  I think parents are responsible to make sure their children are reading appropriate books.  I don't mean a child who is an advanced reader shouldn't read something above his grade level because I had to let my daughter or she would have been bored out of her mind, but I was very careful about what I let her read when she was young.

[Irishmommy]

Am I being harassed because of the use of excessive question marks?????

 

:0)

[Χά�ων]

One doesn't need to read the entire book to know that they don't want to read it and definitely don't want their high schooler to read it.  I guess YOU have never glanced over a book, read parts of it, and decided you didn't want to read it.  Doubtful!

You do not need to be rude.

 

Actually, the only book I picked up that I did not finish was a book I was reading at B&N when I was 19. I sat it down to go to the bathroom and when I cam back it was gone. I couldn't find another copy in the store before it was time to go to the movie and by the time I got home I had forgotten the name of the book. It still drives me nuts.

 

I cannot stand not finishing a book, newspaper or a magazine or even an article. Sometimes I read things 2-3 times.

[Catwoman]

Am I being harassed because of the use of excessive question marks?????

:0)

Well if you're not, you certainly should be!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

 

 

Uh oh. Was that an excessive use of exclamation points??????????????????????

[Elfknitter.#]

I don't think so. Several people have made it clear they would never keep any of their children from reading any book.

I'm included. At the same time, TEN YEAR OLDS ARE NOT ASKING TO READ THE BLUEST EYE. Show me one person who has said that. Ten year old interest will not fall to this title. While mine will one day read Harry Potter (mostly like) they are currently listening to Sisters Grimm. One child is mostly interested in non-fiction. The other is reading a title (I shudder to mention, oh wait no I don't because I feel the need to have to explain sarcasm) Heck. AND it was checked out from our public library. The same one that has copies of The Bluest Eye.

[Elfknitter.#]

Go for it! I'll buy it and post a 5 star review on Amazon even if it's the worst book ever written. We'll all post 5 star reviews, except one person will only give you one star because Amazon didn't deliver it to her on time and she's bitter about it. ;)

 

And then we can all petition our school districts and demand it be put on the mandatory reading list so all high school students have to read it whether they like it or not.

 

Don't forget to put in some really lame symbolism. A lot of teachers really love obsessing about symbolism. And a couple of similes and metaphors wouldn't be a bad idea, either. Gotta cover your bases, you know. :D

All that instaneuos PR should bring in more dough. w00t!

[umsami]

 In reading this discussion, it reminded me a bit of the film "Precious."  I really did not want to see the film.  The topic matter

did not attract me.  But I did watch it after hearing so much about it.  I'm so glad I did.  It was an important film to see... a

movie I don't think I'll ever forget.  There were disturbing sex scenes in the film....as it dealt with incest and rape.  And yet, those

scenes were necessary I believe to the story.  They were not erotic in any way.  

 

I can't say I enjoyed the film in the same way I enjoyed say "Strictly Ballroom" or whatever.  But I'm very very glad I watched it.  

[Irishmommy]

When I was in college, I didn't finish reading Great Expectations, and then wrote a completely horrid paper on it. I never did THAT again! I always tell that story to my kids too, to let them know how embarrassing it was to get a paper back with a note from the professor that said, "That last part was particularly depressing!"

[idnib]

I guess YOU have never glanced over a book, read parts of it, and decided you didn't want to read it.  Doubtful!

 

 

Can you please stop telling people what they have and haven't done or experienced? You've done this several times in this thread. (Yes, I know you were not addressing me, but it's...tiresome.)

 

 

I have certainly put books back on the shelf without reading them. But when I got in line and the person in font of me was buying the book I never told them that had loose standards or the book was terrible. I didn't know enough to judge them and could concede that there may be more to the book than I saw in my glance. Crazy, huh?

[mamaraby]

I don't think so. Several people have made it clear they would never keep any of their children from reading any book.

As one who does not keep my children from books or censor their choices, and whose oldest is 8yo, I guess we'll address that if it ever comes to that. Right now he isn't the slightest bit interested in anything but Harry Potter because I require the book before the movie and he wants to watch all of the movies. That requirement is not unique to HP, though, I require that for all books turned movies.

 

I suspect if he did pick it up, we'd talk about what it was about. We do that with all books. Again, though, he's not in 11th grade which is what the whole brouhaha is about and I have zero problems with him reading it then. 11th grade and 3rd grade are quite different, yes? If he picked it up I might suggest he wait until he's older, but that's mostly because I think he'd get more out of it then which is not the same thing as calling it "filth" or saying it's "of Satan."

 

If he was insistent? In reality, I suspect even if he did pick it up at 8 or 10, he'd probably start it and not finish it much like "The Killing Order" earlier this year. And it would be another opportunity for challenging dinnertime conversation where I try my best to answer whatever difficult questions my kids dream up which never happens when dh is home because apparently I am the fount of all knowledge.

 

*shrugs* Yes, I really do turn my kids loose in the library.

[Elfknitter.#]

we didn't have such explicit books then!

Then being....?