Try this family budget calculator (limited to US)

[4everHis]

Did anyone notice the comment that in all cases this calculator is more than twice the federal poverty line.

Did NOT catch that. Then what is the purpose of this calculator?

[Renthead Mommy]

Boy where they WAY off on housing.  But maybe they assume when you say two parents, one child you would only want a two bedroom house?  Cant' really imagine that, but hey, it's government. 

 

I did it for both Dayton, Oh, where we are now, and Long Island, NY, where we just came from.  Housing was super off.  But what was really crazy was it said the exact same amount for food, transportation, and health care for both places!  

[FairProspects]

Boy where they WAY off on housing.  But maybe they assume when you say two parents, one child you would only want a two bedroom house?  Cant' really imagine that, but hey, it's government. 

 

I did it for both Dayton, Oh, where we are now, and Long Island, NY, where we just came from.  Housing was super off.  But what was really crazy was it said the exact same amount for food, transportation, and health care for both places!  

 

Yeah, that housing budget would get you a 2 bedroom apartment here and maybe not even that.

[lea_lpz]

Daycare costs on mine were stated as $2006 per month for two kids. I don't think I have ever spent more than $200 a month on outside activities. So that is a huge difference and a huge savings. If they were in school and I worked I would have to pay for daycare for before and after school as well as summers and vacations. It still wouldn't be that much, but it would be a lot more than what I'm paying now (which is essentially nothing).

Childcare for 3 kids here is about 1,000 higher then estimated. For the most affordable childcare:

Preschooler: $1200 for full time preschool minimum

K'er: $589 mo.

3rd grader: $429 mo.

 

Grand total of 2,218 a month.

 

This is why we live in a smaller place then we'd like and I stay home. With what we'd pay for childcare, gas, business clothes, food out, etc, I don't see us being better off, and I suppose I don't mind the small house because we'd never be home to enjoy it, but if I worked full time we'd probably meet the income and monthly expenses right on the nail. The amount of money spent on a mortgage or rent is right about what we'd pay for the home size we'd like to be in.

[Laura Corin]

I couldn't find anything similar for the UK.  The nearest was this.

 

L

[Arcadia]

For my area, housing is too low regardless of rental or mortgage, monthly transportation is on the high side but makes sense for a long commute. monthly healthcare is in that range and monthly taxes are too low.

Childcare is too low even for just afterschool care which is above $500 per kid.  Afterschool care add-on for private school could cost less though depending on the private school.

For a family of four, we would have to rent a two bedroom apartment and it is hard to find a two bedroom in that price range.  The rent of a one bedroom already exceed that amount.

 

"San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara, CA HUD Metro FMR Area (CA)
Two Parents, Two Children

Item Cost
Monthly Housing $1610
Monthly Food $754
Monthly Child Care $953
Monthly Transportation $607
Monthly Health Care $1462
Monthly Other Necessities     $605
Monthly Taxes $614
Monthly Total $6605
Annual Total $79261"

[Um_2_4]

I found it to be way off on MOST people's housing in CA, unless you bought prior to the year 2000 or were renting. Same with taxes. In CA our taxes were lower only because we bought our home prior to 2000.

 

I hate how everything is reassessed here in NC and our taxes just keep going up based on the assessments.

 

Healthcare was off only because I carried all the healthcare for our family and it was 100% included in my benefits package. I paid nothing for any of us other than co-pays. My pregnancies were even 100% covered with no co-pays. I had it really good! Now that I don't work we pay much more.

 

 

I think maybe because I do not live in one of the big 3 in CA (OC, LA, SF) so housing is slightly lower. But the amount they gave for housing you could buy a house here in a good neighborhood even at today's prices (we bought 1 yr ago). Renting would be even less in our area (not house, but a condo or apt).

We also pay less in taxes I think because of 4 kids and I wasn't counting property taxes as part of that, I count that as part of housing.

The other necessities I counted as utilities and that was just about right on.

For the health insurance, we also have a very good employee program and they pay most of the premium, but even if we paid it all, it would be less then what they listed.

And obviously we don't use childcare, but for what they put, I could put all 4 in private school, so I guess that is about the same.

I think that if we had car payments we would be spending more on transportation.

[Scarlett]

Did NOT catch that. Then what is the purpose of this calculator?

Ha idk maybe to show people can't live at the poverty line? Don't people qualify for aid if they are near the poverty line? This calculator says it is for a modest standard of living. Maybe on the housing that means an apt rather than buying or renting a house. In my experience in general people live above their means ( and this board is not typical in that way) and that especially includes housing.

[AlmiraGulch]

I just looked at ours.  Our income is higher than what is has listed for our family size, but pretty much everything else is way off.  Plus, there are a lot of other expenses (as others have mentioned) that aren't even accounted for.  Strange.

[DianeW88]

It's right on for me, although I don't have childcare costs or transportation costs.  My dh has a company vehicle and his gas is paid for, and my vehicle is paid off.  My gas use is minimal.  Food is accurate, as is housing.  We do make more than what we need...supposedly what we need.  LOL

[Jackie]

It's actually a bit low for most categories in my area. There's no way I could find an average two bedroom apartment for the money they list. On the other hand, the health care costs listed must be assuming buying a NICE family plan fully out of pocket. I'd say the total is about on for my area, though.

[twoxcell]

 

Did anyone notice the comment that in all cases this calculator is more than twice the federal poverty line.

Yes I did and it is way over the median income for my area which is $49,850.

[Tap]

Yep, pretty accurate for us. Of course we shift some money from one area to another (childcare shifted  to college tuition), but overall I would say it was pretty typical for us.  

 

Portland-Vancouver-Beaverton, OR-WA MSA (WA) Two Parents, Three Children Item Cost Monthly Housing $1344 Monthly Food $921 Monthly Child Care $1518 Monthly Transportation $607 Monthly Health Care $1430 Monthly Other Necessities     $580 Monthly Taxes $452 Monthly Total $6851 Annual Total $82217

 

 

We can, and do live on less, but we save and invest a significant portion of our earnings. I would say that $80,000 is a reasonably comfortable amount to live on in our area that allows a family a vacation, 2 cars, expenses like smart phones, healthcare, and a savings account.  

 

 

[ThisIsTheDay]

For my area, housing is too low regardless of rental or mortgage, monthly transportation is on the high side but makes sense for a long commute. monthly healthcare is in that range and monthly taxes are too low.

Childcare is too low even for just afterschool care which is above $500 per kid.  Afterschool care add-on for private school could cost less though depending on the private school.

For a family of four, we would have to rent a two bedroom apartment and it is hard to find a two bedroom in that price range.  The rent of a one bedroom already exceed that amount.

 

"San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara, CA HUD Metro FMR Area (CA)

Two Parents, Two Children

Item Cost

Monthly Housing $1610

Monthly Food $754

Monthly Child Care $953

Monthly Transportation $607

Monthly Health Care $1462

Monthly Other Necessities     $605

Monthly Taxes $614

Monthly Total $6605

Annual Total $79261"

 

The amounts stated here are laughable.  To say that the COL in Silicon Valley is within a few thousand dollars of my small city in a mid-Atlantic state (and we're not talking near the ocean)!  Where are they coming up with these numbers? :lol:

 

If I recall, San Jose is one of the top three most expensive places in the country to live. 

 

(We always laugh when we watch HGTV and people are looking at million dollar homes in southern California. They get a lot more for their money there.  I grew up in the Bay Area, and my mom lived in Cupertino from 1980-2005.)

[Guest]

I can barely believe it's accurate for anyone. Our total annual for 3 kids and 2 parents is over $100K. I find that absurd! I know my area is high COL, but I'm pretty sure I can find 10 friends living on less than that, even with more kids in the family.

[Guest]

I don't know...I'm looking at the page a little more thoroughly and it bothers me that they are calling this a calculation of what "families need to get by." It makes no sense. For example, the food budget is pretty generous by my standards. It's enough for us to live high on the hog. If I'm trying to "get by," I can feed my family on half their estimate. Health Care: how can you possibly come up with an estimate for this? One family may spend almost nothing, while another may have extensive expenses.

 

I'm trying to understand the goal of the site, because it seems like it's a "living wage" concept and those kinda chap my hide.

 

ETA: It reminds me of those articles that calculate it takes $350,000 (or whatever amount) to raise a child to age 18. Those are so dumb.

[Guest]

"We can, and do live on less, but we save and invest a significant portion of our earnings. I would say that $80,000 is a reasonably comfortable amount to live on in our area that allows a family a vacation, 2 cars, expenses like smart phones, healthcare, and a savings account. "

 

Right, but they are not calling it that. They are calling it what families need "to get by."

[Tap]

I can barely believe it's accurate for anyone. Our total annual for 3 kids and 2 parents is over $100K. I find that absurd! I know my area is high COL, but I'm pretty sure I can find 10 friends living on less than that, even with more kids in the family.

 

It is just an average.  Yes you may know 10 families who make less, and 10 families who make more.  It isn't going to be truely accurate for anyone, just an approximate. 

I don't know...I'm looking at the page a little more thoroughly and it bothers me that they are calling this a calculation of what "families need to get by." It makes no sense. For example, the food budget is pretty generous by my standards. It's enough for us to live high on the hog. If I'm trying to "get by," I can feed my family on half their estimate. Health Care: how can you possibly come up with an estimate for this? One family may spend almost nothing, while another may have extensive expenses.

 

I'm trying to understand the goal of the site, because it seems like it's a "living wage" concept and those kinda chap my hide.

 

ETA: It reminds me of those articles that calculate it takes $350,000 (or whatever amount) to raise a child to age 18. Those are so dumb.

For healthcare, it isn't necessarily what people spend out of pocket that makes the number so high, it likely includes employer healthcare costs.  The general area average for healthcare would be the cost the employeer paid + what the employee paid in premiums +copays +cash payment for uncovered expenses.  

 

 

For food, yes you may be able to get by on 1/2 of what they spend, but again, some people spend more.  We had friends who made over $150,000 per year and had no kids. One of the benefits they enjoyed, was eating out or lavishly-home-cooked for every meal.  They routinely opened $50 wine for drinking with dinner.  Just their wine bill, probably equaled what you spend in food.  

 

It is just an average, it may not be an accurate snapshot of your family if you are an outlier in any area.

[DawnM]

Yes, you do need to run all the numbers, including childcare, wardrobe, reliable car if you don't have one, gas, added this and that.

 

For some people it still works out in their favor monetarily.   It did for us when I worked and had two kids in daycare, but for some it doesn't.  I made about 5 times the amount (net take home, not just gross) than what I paid for childcare.

 

It was a blow to our income when I stopped working.  It was still very much planned and calculated, but it was a big change.

 

Dawn

 

 

Yeah exactly.  According to the calculator my childcare expenses would be over $24,000 for the year.  So lets say I can get a job making twice that.  After taxes and other extra expenses I'm not making much money for full time work. 

 

[Tap]

"We can, and do live on less, but we save and invest a significant portion of our earnings. I would say that $80,000 is a reasonably comfortable amount to live on in our area that allows a family a vacation, 2 cars, expenses like smart phones, healthcare, and a savings account. "

 

Right, but they are not calling it that. They are calling it what families need "to get by."

Quote from first page: EPI’s Family Budget Calculator measures the income a family needs in order to attain a secure yet modest living standard...

 

 

To me, a 'secure but modest' lifestyle includes a couple luxuries. Having one vacation a year and smart phones are some of the most basic 'steps up' from living in poverty.  I am using smart phones as just a vague example of a luxury.  You could substitute it with any expense that is purely for any $3-50/month luxury (hair color, nails, Starbucks habit...).  

[Catwoman]

Health insurance was very high---1300? Wow who would pay that.

We would be thrilled to pay $1300 a month for health insurance. We pay considerably more than that -- and I think it's crazy. (I'm glad we have the insurance, though, especially since we found out about my dh's health issues, and I'm not complaining about the cost as much as I used to... :blush:)

 

Does anyone know what they mean by "taxes?" Because if they're counting property taxes in the number they quoted, their estimate is way too low -- and I already thought their housing cost estimate was too low, so if they are including property taxes in that number, it's totally unrealistic. In our area, it is not at all unusual to pay over $20,000 per year in real estate taxes, and that's not for anything huge or amazing. You definitely couldn't own a home with a mortgage, nor could you rent a house, for the number they listed, unless it was in a really dumpy neighborhood.

 

I think surveys like that might be helpful to someone who is trying to get a general idea about which parts of the country (or which parts of their state) are more affordable than others, but I definitely wouldn't put too much stock in the real accuracy of the numbers. I played around with it a bit, to see how different places compare with the NYC area, and I was glad to see that the places to which we may end up moving seem to be considerably less expensive than where we are now... but the family budget that the calculator listed for our area seems way too low, so I'm not really getting my hopes up that people can really live on the amounts listed for the other places, either.

[Guest]

It is just an average.  Yes you may know 10 families who make less, and 10 families who make more.  It isn't going to be truely accurate for anyone, just an approximate. 

For healthcare, it isn't necessarily what people spend out of pocket that makes the number so high, it likely includes employer healthcare costs.  The general area average for healthcare would be the cost the employeer paid + what the employee paid in premiums +copays +cash payment for uncovered expenses.  

 

 

For food, yes you may be able to get by on 1/2 of what they spend, but again, some people spend more.  We had friends who made over $150,000 per year and had no kids. One of the benefits they enjoyed, was eating out or lavishly-home-cooked for every meal.  They routinely opened $50 wine for drinking with dinner.  Just their wine bill, probably equaled what you spend in food.  

 

It is just an average, it may not be an accurate snapshot of your family if you are an outlier in any area.

I was just looking at the Methodology document on the site. (Although it's not like that is "lite" reading and if your eyes don't glaze over after a couple of minutes, you're probably the kid who aced Statistics.) I see how they figured some of these things and it just kinda bugs me that they're using this as a "What you need to get by" figure.

 

The Health category is calculated as you said. I am intimately acquainted with our insurance premiums, because dh is self-employed and I pay the premium myself.

 

I guess it's just bothering me that this is supposed to calculate "what you need to get by." It bugs me the same way as the estimates on what it takes to raise a child that I mentioned. If you're averaging what comfortably-financed people *do*, rather than what is strictly necessary, it comes out high.

[LucyStoner]

Right, but they are not calling it that. They are calling it what families need "to get by."

 

Homeless people who aren't dying from it are still "getting by" in a manner of speaking.  It is an estimate of a comfortable but not affluent life, not an estimate of the bare minimum needed to stay alive.  In my area, the amount they listed is actually less than the median income.    

[Guest]

The site on the whole is making a case for the poverty line being inadequate to describe what people living in different regions need to get by. The budget calculator is actually under the title of "What it Takes to Get By." To me, that means what you need to not go to bed hungry, leave the house with shoes and an adequate coat, have heat in the house and be able to buy some Penicillin when you have an infection. A vehicle that will get you back and forth to work with a reasonable amount of reliability. A safe place for your children if you must leave home to work. I like my smartphone, but if it was between having the phone and having dinner, I would pick dinner and have a Tracphone.

 

To Cat: Real Estate Taxes are not included because the housing category is based on rent. My property taxes are pretty atrocious here, too, although they have been worse before the bubble burst.

[Delirium]

Not accurate for my situation at all.

[LucyStoner]

Quill, it's EPI.  They have a clearly stated agenda around the issue of income inequality.  Some will agree with them, others not.  

 

If I go to the Family Research Council site I can't be surprised to find papers on how women should be homemakers or whatever. 

[Tap]

The site on the whole is making a case for the poverty line being inadequate to describe what people living in different regions need to get by. The budget calculator is actually under the title of "What it Takes to Get By." To me, that means what you need to not go to bed hungry, leave the house with shoes and an adequate coat, have heat in the house and be able to buy some Penicillin when you have an infection. A vehicle that will get you back and forth to work with a reasonable amount of reliability. A safe place for your children if you must leave home to work. I like my smartphone, but if it was between having the phone and having dinner, I would pick dinner and have a Tracphone.

 

To Cat: Real Estate Taxes are not included because the housing category is based on rent. My property taxes are pretty atrocious here, too, although they have been worse before the bubble burst.

I think that the phrase 'to get by' is vastly different depending on where you start in life, how you financed a lifestyle (including college loans) and what you want out of life. LOL  

 

I have friends who make double what I do, but when you add in things like mortgage (housing was vastly cheaper when we bought our home than when they did), college loans (she has a doctorate, he has a masters), daycare (2 young kids in daycare vs our 1 kid), etc.....my husband and I actually have more free money than they do.   One friend and I compared living expenses side by side one day and it costs her 2x the amount it does for my husband and I to pay our basic living expenses.  Our needs are very different and our version of 'getting by' are just as different.

[Scarlett]

We would be thrilled to pay $1300 a month for health insurance. We pay considerably more than that -- and I think it's crazy. (I'm glad we have the insurance, though, especially since we found out about my dh's health issues, and I'm not complaining about the cost as much as I used to... :blush:)

 

Does anyone know what they mean by "taxes?" Because if they're counting property taxes in the number they quoted, their estimate is way too low -- and I already thought their housing cost estimate was too low, so if they are including property taxes in that number, it's totally unrealistic. In our area, it is not at all unusual to pay over $20,000 per year in real estate taxes, and that's not for anything huge or amazing. You definitely couldn't own a home with a mortgage, nor could you rent a house, for the number they listed, unless it was in a really dumpy neighborhood.

 

I think surveys like that might be helpful to someone who is trying to get a general idea about which parts of the country (or which parts of their state) are more affordable than others, but I definitely wouldn't put too much stock in the real accuracy of the numbers. I played around with it a bit, to see how different places compare with the NYC area, and I was glad to see that the places to which we may end up moving seem to be considerably less expensive than where we are now... but the family budget that the calculator listed for our area seems way too low, so I'm not really getting my hopes up that people can really live on the amounts listed for the other places, either.

Ok re thinking the health insurance premium. Dh paid 300 for us and our 3 boys...including dental but with a high deductible....$2500. That was through his employer. So maybe $1300 direct premium isn't so bad. In fact we might be paying that soon. Getting by with nothing until October when dh's pre existing won't matter or at least that is what I am hoping.

[twoxcell]

 

Yep, pretty accurate for us. Of course we shift some money from one area to another (childcare shifted  to college tuition), but overall I would say it was pretty typical for us.  

 

Portland-Vancouver-Beaverton, OR-WA MSA (WA) Two Parents, Three Children Item Cost Monthly Housing $1344 Monthly Food $921 Monthly Child Care $1518 Monthly Transportation $607 Monthly Health Care $1430 Monthly Other Necessities     $580 Monthly Taxes $452 Monthly Total $6851 Annual Total $82217

 

 

We can, and do live on less, but we save and invest a significant portion of our earnings. I would say that $80,000 is a reasonably comfortable amount to live on in our area that allows a family a vacation, 2 cars, expenses like smart phones, healthcare, and a savings account.  

 

 

Do you actually spend that much on food a month for a family of 5? $921! That seems super high to me. We have 6 and don't spend anywhere near that in Southern Oregon. The amount they stated for rural Oregon for people to get by is really high compared to what most people actually make. We make just above the poverty line and I think we get by just fine. I guess it depends on your definition of getting by. ;)

[Catwoman]

To Cat: Real Estate Taxes are not included because the housing category is based on rent. My property taxes are pretty atrocious here, too, although they have been worse before the bubble burst.

Thanks -- I was wondering about that! :)

 

If someone was renting, the amount they listed would only cover a very tiny apartment in a not-so-hot neighborhood, but it might be do-able if a family was desperate. That price definitely wouldn't include any utilities, though, and no one could rent any kind of house for that price.

 

Even when the numbers come out really wonky, I still have fun at sites like that, because it's interesting to compare our current location with other places we have heard good things about.