Ask a Pagan Thread

[jar7709]

It isn't? I thought Atheists believed in no deity.

 

 

Athiests do not believe in a deity, right. The rest of your sentence is what confused me, about "life moving in its own rhythm". I am not sure what you mean by that. If you mean that athiests do not point to a supernatural cause for life, then I guess we're on the same page. :)

[Plink]

Yup. Same page. I'm just not doing a great job of speaking clearly today.

[jeninok]

I just realized that I have never thought about what the word Pagan means. I didn't even have any assumptions other than not-Christian. I know that sounds entirely ignorant, but it is true.

 

So taking my complete lack of knowledge into consideration, please forgive my very basic question: Is there a definite boundary between Atheist and Pagan beliefs? They are kinda' mixed up in my mind. Belief in evolution or the seasons doesn't really seem to be a belief in a higher power, yet that is what seems to be celebrated by Pagans.

 

 

 

I haven't finished reading the entire thread, but I personally fall somewhere in between pagan and atheist, in that I don't believe in any literal god or supreme beings, but I do see the power and wisdom in various gods. I see just as much wisdom value in Buddha, as I do in Jesus, but I don't hold either up as something to be worshiped.

 

I do however believe in some sort of something that is great than the sum of its parts. Very often I feel the most strongly connected to this something while out in nature, or when learning about science.

[jar7709]

No worries, LibertyH. It happens and I don't mean to be nitpicky. Clarity just seems really important in conversations like these. :)

[Mergath]

It isn't? I thought Atheists believed in no deity.

 

 

They do, and that's it. Period. Atheism isn't a life philosophy, it only means without (a-) belief in the existence of God (theism).

[mommymilkies]

 

 

 

Are there good sources for the pre-reconstructionist Celtic and Norse beliefs and practices?

 

 

There are others, but quickly:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtic_Reconstructionist_Paganism

http://www.paganachd.com/faq/misconceptions.html

[caroljenn]

Well, we aren't RC and we have a home altar. It is exactly what is described...a comforting place when you need it, a focusing spot, a place to remind yourself that as the world spins, there is a greater calling and don't forget it. Ours is an actual altar table left over from the church family that had to leave this building due to finances. So, I feel a special focus when lighting a candle, praying, or just passing by because it held the Lord's Supper Elements for so many years for so many devoted believers, and it sits under my BIG stained glass window. However, I will be honest, I only know a handful of protestants that have a home altar.

 

Even though the same beliefs do not apply, I would imagine that for other faith systems, the home altar as much of the same significance to the family that mine does.

 

I love this thread. One of the most important aspects of a respectful discussion like this is that it helps everyone lay aside their preconceived ideas about others. I think that if we had an "Ask a Buddist or ask a Protestant or ask an Atheist, or ..." whatever thread, what we would find is that regardless of which worldview system we were raised in, we were badly misinformed about all of the other worldview/faiths and that general terms are, exactly that, really very general. I know that for dh and I, we are stuck with the moniker "Protestant" and yet it does not describe us at all. We don't even fit the criteria really. We have a belief range within Christianity that includes some Orthodox/RC elements as well as some typically Protestant elements, but the blend is so significant that we don't really have a faith home that could be described as anything except maybe "Jesus follower."

 

So, I think this thread is amazing because hopefully we can keep it respectful and learn from one another. My ears are wide open and I'm going to print the responses so my boys can read them.

 

I too would be interested to have Rosie explain more about the wheel.

 

Faith

 

 

I think this is a great idea. And this is a fascinating thread!!

[caroljenn]

For me, I believe in the power of self and the power of the universe, not a deity. There is a certain type of magic (not spell magic) all around us, all we have to do is look for it. We have to connect ourselves to the universe in whatever way we feel comfortable. I love the wind. While it can be cold and biting, it can also be cool and comforting or warm and soothing. We currently live in a very, very windy area, and I love to stand outside and just feel it brush around me. It makes me feel calm and sometimes powerful. I also love fire and candle light. They calm me. If I'm really stressed, I'll light a bunch of candles and turn off all the lights and just...be.

 

I don't believe in Satan. That's an easy out IMO.

 

I do believe in reincarnation. I think we have more than one time to experience this world. It seems rather useless for us to live one life and then poof, our existence is at an end. While we, as we know ourselves, will be gone, I think we bring some part of our former selves with us when we are reborn. It's not necessarily memories of our previous lives, but feelings and ideas.

 

Here's the other thing I was wondering about. What do you think about life after death? Do you believe in reincarnation, or do you think this life is it? Just curious - and interested!

[DragonFaerie]

I agree with Mom in High Heels. I do believe in reincarnation. I believe we have many life lessons to learn and one go-round isn't enough for most of us. I also think that reincarnation can account for some of those folks, even children, who seem like "old souls." One day when he was about 5, DS told me that he voted for Abraham Lincoln. Who knows? Maybe he did. I told him, "Good choice." :)

[Rosie_0801]

Morning Everyone! :party:

 

This thread grew while I was asleep so I'm replying as I go through rather than reading it all first, so forgive me if I'm repeating what others have said.

 

 

I find the concept of a wheel of the year intriguing. I see people of various religions here anticipating different times of the year as it turns and there always seems to be something coming or current. In my (Christian) denomination, celebrating times and seasons has been sort of frowned upon. If you do celebrate certain times of the year, it must be in a secular way (ha).

 

Can't be celebrating evidence of God's creations, can we? People might think what? God is a Pagan? :p In a secular way? I totally agree with your ha, lol. I'm kind of wondering what is and isn't a secular way of observing seasons. I kind of think if the line is that fuzzy, someone must be making a mountain out of a mole hill...

 

I can see the need to have a ritual connection to creation in some way. It seems so stable and grounding to know that something concrete can be counted on and appears to be a permanent part of a lifetime, no matter what you believe.

 

Yeah, that's what I thought. It occurred to me that people spend so much time trying to make life stable and unchanging that they end up despondent because nothing ever happens. I feel that way when nothing ever happens, anyway. Why spend your autumn weekends raking leaves? They are not untidy. They are what autumn looks like. Nature, or God if you like, doing his/her/its composting. Unless you want them to mulch your veggie patch, leave them alone and take your wife and kids for a picnic or something and enjoy the weather before it turns crappy. Kwim?

 

Rosie, can you explain the wheel of the year thing? What exactly is that/does that mean? I'm intrigued...

 

Basically that the year turns and keeps turning, and there are times of year that should be devoted to certain ideas or practices. Some people include the supernatural in some or all of the 8 "holidays" with Imbolc being dedicated to the Goddess Brigid, aka the Catholic Saint Brigid and the veil between the world and afterlife being thinnest at Samhain, aka Halloween. But mundane pagans like me don't. I go along with those sorts of ideas minus the supernatural and more along the lines of what Alain de Botton said in his book (or podcast actually since I've heard that not read the book) about religion for atheists; that it is useful to have days marked on the calendar as appointments made to think about certain ideas. As adults, particularly women, we can have trouble taking time out for that kind of stuff because we may feel it is selfish or self indulgent or not really as important as whatever else might need doing, but if it is *scheduled* it has a different legitimacy, kwim?

 

For the actual Wheel of the Year dates and a rough idea on what each is dedicated to, you can read the Wiki article. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheel_of_the_Year What each means in detail or how it is observed specifically be any one pagan is up to them, but these are the general themes. There aren't any laws like thou must go to church on Sunday, kwim? Heck, there aren't any laws that say you must observe the wheel of the year or that you must do it with these themes (I was reading about a mob of druids in Sydney that have revamped it to suit themselves.) I've only been observing since last May (Samhain) so I am building my own values and traditions (ok, it's a bit soon for traditions when I've only done any of it once :p) A full answer as to what I am doing and why would be an essay of about 2000 words, lol.

[momto2Cs]

I agree with Mom in High Heels. I do believe in reincarnation. I believe we have many life lessons to learn and one go-round isn't enough for most of us. I also think that reincarnation can account for some of those folks, even children, who seem like "old souls." One day when he was about 5, DS told me that he voted for Abraham Lincoln. Who knows? Maybe he did. I told him, "Good choice." :)

 

Yep.

 

I really don't think one lifetime is long enough to learn much of anything, because there is so much out there in the way of life lessons! here I actually like the Hindu system of reincarnation, in that you continue reincarnating over and over again until you have learned enough to move on past reincarnation, and then who knows?

[Rosie_0801]

Rosie, I love you.

Just wanted to say that first. :D

 

You guys are all weirdies and I'm doing nothing extraordinary here. Merely earbashing people since they seem willing. :p Of course I'm fond of you too, but you knew that already. :p

 

 

Your wheel of the year sounds a lot like my liturgical year. We have a

that has 52 little wooden blocks set in a circular channel, and we use it to explain the Circle of The Church Year. (In this link, she is practicing the story, so it's a little longer than the actual one, but it gives the gist.) It provides a rhythm that I really appreciate.

 

Spiffy! I'll bookmark that for my religious calendar curriculum!

 

Yeah, it's the same idea but tweaked to suit your or my theology. :)

 

When I moved to Florida from Ohio, I realized how much I needed the 4 seasons to provide that rhythm, too--I missed the seasons terribly. I saw how some families created their own rhythms, from using holidays to having special nights or some traditions that they did every year, and some families didn't--and they seemed less grounded or something. It was like a dangerous place to be, somehow, living without a grounding cycle or rhythm. LOL--yeah, dangerous may not be the right word...a little too dramatic...But truly, it felt like not being in some sort of cycle or pattern or something just stripped people of something essential.

 

Makes perfect sense and is something Southern Hemisphere pagans devote a lot of thought to. There are generational witches (I think they identify as witches. Maybe they don't, but you get the drift) who are still working out how to Australianise the Wheel of the Year. Then I read a blog post by a Pagan Filipina who said the whole idea of the Wheel of the Year breaks down in the tropics. I tend to think she is not imaginative enough, but I can certainly see the challenge. It would be even harder to adapt there than it is down here!

[Rosie_0801]

How does the idea of an altar work without a god?

 

Lots, if not most pagans believe in gods. The pagan FB group I belong to has lots of pics of altars. Some are seasonal, some are devoted to one deity or another. The Egyptian goddesses seem surprisingly interested in Anglo Australians. Haven't thought of a polite way to ask why. :p

 

So seasonally is one way to have an altar without a deity.

 

Is it a reminder of things to you, or a "getting in touch" with something outside yourself?

 

Not outside myself for the most part. Perhaps I'll have seasonal altars in the future, when I am established in my own house, but not now. I use mine now as storage for my growing crystal collection. Eventually I'll have to put them somewhere else, but for now, since I am only new to collecting I keep them there. I have a few photos, a quilt patch, two pine cones and the candles. Other than the candles and crystals, the rest is rather Samhainy...

 

I guess I'm wondering what the candles "do" for you.

 

They provide a focus, just like Orthodox icons do. Like photos on a mantlepiece do. Like talking to a pot plant might. Mine happen to represent people so attending to them is a way of making room in my life/heart/something like that for them even though they are not here. It's less work to have a physical representation than just think, kwim? Especially since my love language is acts of service, not verbal! I can light a candle, clean up the wax, replace it when it runs out, whereas there's not much one can do for a thought except think it, lol.

 

It's not uncommon among Catholics to have a home altar. It's helped my kids understand the liturgical year, they like when it's their turn to change the color of the altar cloth (because they get to rearrange the rest of the stuff), and it's a nice focal point when our prayer time gets distracted, or a comforting place to hang out when things are tough. No wonder some people accuse Catholics of being anything but Christian. ;)

 

Altars are all the fashion. Haven't you heard? :p

[Rosie_0801]

I don't think it's "magic" in and of itself. It's a "psychodrama" in a way. I'm making the moment meaningful, and my mind and intentions can follow.

 

It fits the pagan definition of Magick. Or mine anyway. :p

 

But then so does Christian prayer. (Sorry Ladies ;))

[Rosie_0801]

Okay, I'm going to jump right in and ask what others might be thinking. Could you give a specific example of a ritual that you do connected with the wheel of the year? How does that look in real life?

 

Apparently the witches new year is Samhain. So there's a good place to start even if I'm not a witch.

 

Actually, I mark Samhain by making a candle for deceased persons of particular importance to me, and burning them while I eat brussel sprouts, French toast and apple pie with ice cream.

 

Sounds Satanic, doesn't it? :p

[Rosie_0801]

 

so, the wheel of the year would include things like celebrating the equinoxes, etc? changing of seasons, all of that? or is there more to it than that?

 

honestly seeking to understand, because it really intrigues me.

 

The equinoxes and the cross quarter days. Look up the Wikipedia article for general stuff and you could google for blogs if you want more examples of how it plays out on a personal level than what is being shared in this thread. I doubt anyone is going to spill *all* their beans. :)

[Element]

What is the difference between a pagan and an agnostic? Everything I'm hearing the pagans in this thread say, I relate to as an agnostic. I wonder if we just label ourselves differently?

[Onceuponatime]

 

Apparently the witches new year is Samhain. So there's a good place to start even if I'm not a witch.

 

Actually, I mark Samhain by making a candle for deceased persons of particular importance to me, and burning them while I eat brussel sprouts, French toast and apple pie with ice cream.

 

Sounds Satanic, doesn't it? :p

 

The brussel sprouts do, but the apple pie with ice cream sounds heavenly. :laugh:

[Rosie_0801]

For those who do not believe in Satan, do you believe in the concept of evil? If so, from what source does it originate? Should we work to combat it and how? To clarify, by evil I mean those humans who would intentionally terrorize, rape, torture or kill other humans or animals, especially those more innocent or defenseless.

 

My list of evil is very short. My list of things that are unhealthy is rather longer. I think "unhealthy" is a much healthier term than evil. The evil you are talking about is motivated by extreme selfishness and egocentricity, as far as I can tell. How do you combat that? How do you make people care? Big questions, eh? Some people seem incapable of caring or incapable of resisting those impulses. We tend to label them mentally ill in some way. (Not equating all mental illness with terrorist behaviour, obviously!) How do we cure/help them? Another big question. How do you make other people strong enough that the nutters aren't able to get into positions of power? I'm sure there are partial solutions that could theoretically be put into play, but I don't believe in Utopia.

 

I am a Christian, but IME, the closer I live with nature, the less I feel the need to mark its natural passage symbolically. Does that make sense? When we lived in the city, marking the seasons, etc was a really big deal to me. Now that I live on a farm, smack dab in the middle of it, I don't need rituals. I see the plants beginning to bud, I can smell the changes in the trees and earth, I hear different signs, I can observe which animals are now nesting and preparing to bear their babies. For me, it isn't a "celebrate the change today and tomorrow begins a new season". I see it more as a sliding scale. It never happens all in one day or at one special moment. (Sorry, just rambling here)

 

 

Perfect sense. We're doing the same in our life now we're back out of the city. It's fun and I'm enjoying it because I haven't lived anywhere long enough to be familiar enough with the local seasons that I'd notice any differences since I was a kid. We've only been here 7 months and I don't know how long we will be here, but I've been enjoying comparing the traditional Aboriginal calendar to what I see around me. :)

[Parrothead]

 

Apparently the witches new year is Samhain. So there's a good place to start even if I'm not a witch.

 

Actually, I mark Samhain by making a candle for deceased persons of particular importance to me, and burning them while I eat brussel sprouts, French toast and apple pie with ice cream.

 

Sounds Satanic, doesn't it? :p

 

Why the brussel sprouts?

[Parrothead]

What is the difference between a pagan and an agnostic? Everything I'm hearing the pagans in this thread say, I relate to as an agnostic. I wonder if we just label ourselves differently?

 

My understanding of it is that agnostics believe in some higher power but they cant identify what the higher power is

[Rosie_0801]

Regarding the pagan connection with nature...I always thought that pagans believed in nature as some kiind of diety or higher power in itself. Is that not correct?

 

Some do, some don't. I don't think nature is a higher power in that it is above me, because I am part of nature. On the other hand, the laws of physics are way less breakable than I am. :p

 

Or what purpose do the dancing/other nature rituals serve?

 

If they are not connected with a deity because to split nature and deities doesn't make sense in the the worldviews of some, I'd go with appreciation as a major purpose. Not that I think Nature cares whether I conduct an appreciative ritual or not, but if I did, it would still be good for my soul. It would remind me that I'm not the only one in the world (my mum was right about that, lol) and that is comforting for me. It is comforting to think that I both matter to the workings of the world (the people anyway) yet the world will trundle on when I'm dead and would have just as easily had I never been born. When the weather is stinking hot, one appreciates that winter will come, even while knowing that a few months later, one will be appreciating that summer will come so they don't have to freeze their bottom off forever! Apology may be another one. I did a small Lammas ritual as an apology to my garden, even though I don't think the garden was really paying attention. :p

 

Is the nature just a connection with "all things" so to speak, or does nature have some specific higher power in itself?

 

 

Both, I think.

[Rosie_0801]

Oh, and one more question...how does paganism relate to what is commonly considered "practicing magic" - by which I mean spells and rituals calling on some outside power to perform some kind of action. Is that separate? Is that mostly wiccan?

 

 

Definitely a Wiccan thing. I don't know all that much about other "denominations" like druids etc so I don't know what they do.

 

Some believe in Magick as calling on an outside power, like a deity to perform some kind of action. Some believe in Magick as calling on a power they are part of (the all connected idea) to perform some kind of action. For me, the minimal amount of Magick I do is to modify myself. Personal growth via an outside object or ritual, because sometimes it is easier that way, and it's not "tougher" or "more authentic" to smack one's head against a brick wall when there is another way of accomplishing something.

[delaney]

My understanding of it is that agnostics believe in some higher power but they cant identify what the higher power is

 

Agnostics believe that there is no proof of existence of any higher power.

[Ravin]

I practice Asatru. I fluctuate in how observant I am, though, as well as in whether I'm more agnostic, pantheistic, etc. Ultimately the important thing is how you conduct yourself, in this life, and religion is, if it is healthy, an aide to being the best person you can, and to helping find meaning in life so that you have the best life you can.

 

I had a conversation with a Christian today about good and evil. I agreed with him that if humans are inherently evil for some reason, redemption is necessary. An important and fundamental distinction I think most Pagans believe is that human beings are NOT fundamentally evil. We may be capable of evil, and may agree or disagree that evil exists, but humans are part of the natural scheme of things, not perfect, but also not an aberration that needs fixing at a cosmic level through divine intervention.

 

It was an interesting conversation, and we agreed that one will come to very different conclusions about the meaning and origin of human behavior, and its implications for society, based on whether or not evil is believed to be inevitably inherent in the human condition.

[Rosie_0801]

One question- her altar is near a window and outside, she has a garden that is reflective of some of the things within her altar. She considers them two sides of a whole. Is that common?

 

 

I don't know, but it is a lovely set up! I know lots of people have indoor and outdoor altars.

[Rosie_0801]

another Wheel of the Year question --- Rosie, you are Southern Hemisphere, right? so I totally understand shifting the festivals to be at dates that reflect the actual seasons down here, but does that impact, or how does it impact, moving Yule over? The reading (brief) I did this morning showed that Yule is also marking the end of the year/beginning of the new year; moving it to winter, it wouldn't be that anymore in the S. Hemisphere. Is that problematic? What do you do to compensate?

 

As I said in part with someone else's answer (I've woken up to a really long thread and it is easier to answer as I go along than read everyone else's and edit. Besides, I don't want people thinking I'm ignoring them,) it's a challenge! The Wheel of the Year as a structure was constructed in northern Europe where they have four seasons of roughly the same length. In most of Australia we actually have 6, which are not of the same length, even if we still teach our kindergarten kids the Northern European model. (:rolleyes: Will that ever go out of fashion?) Though, since Australia was settled by Europeans and they bought their deciduous trees, we have a seventh, which hides inside the native seasons. Cool huh?

 

I don't know what people do about Yule marking the beginning or end of the year. Somewhere I read that Samhain is the Witches new year. Jan first is the beginning of the calendar year. The school year begins late Jan/early Feb, and the financial year begins July 1. It seems one can start a year whenever one likes! I think some do Yule as a sort of Christmas in July, particularly if they identify with a European tradition like Celtic or Norse. Others make Litha a Christmassy equivalent. Since most people have non-pagan relatives, they do both. In fact there was one sassy, young thing who was carrying on like a pork chop late last year about the oppression of Litha and the co-opting of OUR traditions by those snaffling Christians, and for the most part she was counselled to calm down. I think she was rather surprised about how many of US also celebrate Christmas, why we do it and how we don't feel it compromises our pagan souls. I think her kid ended up quite popular at kinder because not only did Santa come like he did to everyone else, but the Litha fairy came too, a few days earlier. Heheh. Those kids wanted to know all about the Litha fairy. ;) (I don't know how widespread Litha fairies are around here. We don't have Santas or Litha fairies, but my kids don't have to compete at kinder either. :) )

[Rosie_0801]

Depending upon the type of Christianity, yes. There are those that insist that Catholic and Orthodox prayer corners are idolatry.

 

I know they think that. I happen not to agree with them. :p

[Karen in CO]

Agnostics believe that there is no proof of existence of any higher power.

To clarify, since I was just helping a neice on a paper, in general, agnostics believe that the existence of a deity is unknowable. And to further complicate the world, a person can be an agnostic, an agnostic theist, or an agnostic atheist. I like "unknowable" as it is a richer explanation than simply no proof.

[Rosie_0801]

Just a curiosity question here, too. Your element depends on when you are born like your astrological sign or you choose it by what resonates with you? If its when you are born I'm wondering what mine is and if my suspicion is true.

 

I was born mid-July. Any idea what I'd be? :)

 

FYI, I've heard of people who have felt little affinity with their astrological sun sign element and far more with another.

[Rosie_0801]

One thing I've been thinking about a lot lately is that I've noticed many pagan/atheists tend to say derogatory things about people of other faiths/worldviews (not just this forum~I think of Youtube comments and FB, etc.). Terms like whackadoodle, nutso, delusional, believing in "sky daddies" are very hurtful. Yet, when I read posts on "religious" threads, I don't see those people mocking or name-calling the atheists. (Of course there are religious people who say ugly things, but I just don't see it as a common occurrence).

 

What Mergath said.

 

And I would caution you from thinking of pagans and atheists as the same. They may or may not be.

 

If you have a question to clear up your misconceptions or ignorance about paganism, by all means ask it, but Bethany is on a budget and can't afford to host a Defenders of Christianity picnic this week. :)

[Guest inoubliable]

To clarify, since I was just helping a neice on a paper, in general, agnostics believe that the existence of a deity is unknowable. And to further complicate the world, a person can be an agnostic, an agnostic theist, or an agnostic atheist. I like "unknowable" as is a richer explanation than simply no proof.

 

In a very simple way of putting it - yes. Google "Dawkin's scale". It may help to explain better. There is a very large range to agnosticism.

[Karen in CO]

In a very simple way of putting it - yes. Google "Dawkin's scale". It may help to explain better. There is a very large range to agnosticism.

 

 

Yes, Indeed there is. Isn't the world a wonderful place. :) When Rosie closes her pagan picnic, a well-informed agnostic needs to open an ask-an-agnostic thread. The atheists should probably wait to see if the web implodes with the agnostic thread before they try.

[Rosie_0801]

That's difficult. Remember the winners write history, so much has been lost. And what was collected wasn't always unbiased information, and often propaganda. It also depends on which practice you are interested in. Many pagan cultures were in many ways absorbed into the church and you can find shreds of the traditions. And not all cultures kept written records. It's rather easy, however to find information on Greek and Roman beliefs before Christianity because they were highly literate. Same for Ancient Indian and Native American beliefs. Celtic beliefs have more recently been adopted by Pagans, but the records just aren't there for a complete understanding of their beliefs. Much was...put together by later anthropologists and pagan enthusiasts of the Victorian era. Not all of this has proven to be accurate, mind you.

 

 

And not everyone cares either.

[Guest inoubliable]

Yes, Indeed there is. Isn't the world a wonderful place. :) When Rosie closes her pagan picnic, a well-informed agnostic needs to open an ask-an-agnostic thread. The atheists should probably wait to see if the web implodes with the agnostic thread before they try.

 

 

:laugh:

[Rosie_0801]

 

Here's the other thing I was wondering about. What do you think about life after death? Do you believe in reincarnation, or do you think this life is it? Just curious - and interested!

 

 

I have information from an unreliable source that there is such thing as reincarnation. I find this kind of irritating so I have decided to be 'agnostic' on the subject and not care. Generally speaking, it doesn't matter anyway. If I was sitting with someone on their deathbed who was terrified of dying, I'd tell whatever pretty story I thought would make them feel better. Otherwise, life has enough to keep me occupied without worrying about death.

[delaney]

To clarify, since I was just helping a neice on a paper, in general, agnostics believe that the existence of a deity is unknowable. And to further complicate the world, a person can be an agnostic, an agnostic theist, or an agnostic atheist. I like "unknowable" as it is a richer explanation than simply no proof.

Yes, no proof to show that one exists as such. I do not believe there is a god because there is nothing to lead me to believe in one.

[Rosie_0801]

What is the difference between a pagan and an agnostic? Everything I'm hearing the pagans in this thread say, I relate to as an agnostic. I wonder if we just label ourselves differently?

 

Pagans can believe in any amount of gods they like/have experienced. An agnostic isn't sure whether there are gods or not and what they are like. An agnostic could be pagan since there is more to paganism than belief or disbelief in deities. Say there was someone else who believed exactly as you do and viewed the world exactly as you do. You call yourself agnostic and she calls herself pagan. What's the difference? The only difference is which word you each like to wear.

[Rosie_0801]

Why the brussel sprouts?

 

My ex father in law liked brussell sprouts.

[Audrey]

 

I don't know, but it is a lovely set up! I know lots of people have indoor and outdoor altars.

 

 

I have them all over the place, inside and outside. Most people don't spot the outdoor ones. I once had a semi driver back right over one at the base of a tree. When he got out to inspect his trailer, the tree threw a limb at his head to let him know how it felt about that.

[BigMamaBird]

I know this is Ask a Pagan, but now I'm curious and want to Ask an Australian. What are your 6 Seasons? :confused1:

[Ipsey]

 

Ok, seriously. Has there EVER been a more diplomatic answer/comment??

 

I want to be Rosie when I grow up.

 

Yes, indeed!

 

I couldn't even reply to that post because I knew I would blow it. Better people than I did a much better job. :)

[Rosie_0801]

I know this is Ask a Pagan, but now I'm curious and want to Ask an Australian. What are your 6 Seasons? :confused1:

 

That depends where you live, but this is for my area, more or less: http://home.vicnet.net.au/~herring/seasons.htm

 

Autumn hides out inside early winter. It's weird. Some days are definitely early winter and some are very autumnal.

 

But as I said, most people carry on as though we have four seasons of equal length, south of the tropics anyway, and complain that it doesn't match reality. I don't suppose most people have a good reason to go looking for other calendars so probably haven't thought about how there would be some. Here are a few more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australian_seasons

[mommymilkies]

 

And not everyone cares either.

 

But many do when they get further on the path. I know I had many Druid and Reconstruction friends and it was always a hot button. ;)

[Rosie_0801]

But many do when they get further on the path. I know I had many Druid and Reconstruction friends and it was always a hot button. ;)

 

Yeah. They are on my list of conversations to eavesdrop on and never comment!

[IsabelC]

There is more than one Indigenous Australian season system.

But down here in Tasmania we do usually get the traditional European four seasons.

My family follows the Wheel of the Year, we have an altar, we even do a few rituals, however we aren't religious and don't believe in God/Goddess/Magick, so I guess I'm not really Pagan as such.

[Marylou]

 

 

What Mergath said.

 

And I would caution you from thinking of pagans and atheists as the same. They may or may not be.

 

If you have a question to clear up your misconceptions or ignorance about paganism, by all means ask it, but Bethany is on a budget and can't afford to host a Defenders of Christianity picnic this week. :)

 

I don't have any misconceptions or ignorance about paganism. I saw in post 6 you said "I'm an atheist in that I don't believe in any literal gods. I believe in all of them as ideas with power". I guess I haven't spyed [sic] on the Atheist thread enough to have my question answered!

 

Didn't see Bethany's question; I'll have to go look. Thanks.

 

[Rosie_0801]

My family follows the Wheel of the Year, we have an altar, we even do a few rituals, however we aren't religious and don't believe in God/Goddess/Magick, so I guess I'm not really Pagan as such.

 

Unless you want to be.

[Juniper]

What is the difference between Wiccan, Druid, neopagan and reconstructionist? :D

[Jennifer3141]

I have them all over the place, inside and outside. Most people don't spot the outdoor ones. I once had a semi driver back right over one at the base of a tree. When he got out to inspect his trailer, the tree threw a limb at his head to let him know how it felt about that.

 

 

I have a rather feminist Celtic goddess tucked into the awning of my front porch. You have to look hard to see Her and you have to really pay attention to what she's doing to know who She is, but there She is.

 

Anyway, we once had someone over who told an incredibly offensive joke about women and I was irate. On his way out, this little Goddess clocked him on the head. She's uh, nailed up there. On three sides. Problem solved! :D