What made Americans fat..........

[LG Gone Wild]

Me too.

 

Can we start a support thread?

 

Nono has a lower carb recipe thread going.

[regentrude]

My first breakfast was very hard. I naturally age very late int he morning, and just some toast and coffee. What I did was I waited until I was starving, and then I had a small potion of full fat yoghurt, and then some scrambled eggs and cheese. Eventually I started being hungry so much earlier that it got easier to eat some eggs.

 

Thanks. I have to be out the door at 7:30am ... so no putting off breakfast or cooking. I could try the yoghurt.. if just somebody could promise me it takes only a few weeks...

[Alte Veste Academy]

ETA: Just remembered an important question: how does a high fat diet work for people who do not have a gallbladder? I had mine out a few years ago, and while I have no trouble with my present diet, I get sick if I eat fried foods like tempura.

 

I do not know but I would definitely not implement a change in diet before researching or discussing it with your doctor.

[justamouse]

No. Even things like scrambled eggs are not something I can eat first thing in the morning (the whole cooked breakfast thing)... after eating bread for breakfast for 43 years

 

ETA: Just remembered an important question: how does a high fat diet work for people who do not have a gallbladder?

I had mine out a few years ago, and while I have no trouble with my present diet, I get sick if I eat fried foods like tempura.

 

I wouldn't eat anything fried, anyway, unless I knew what kind of oil it was. Hmmm.

 

Perhaps stick with more of the sauces. That way it's not ONLY oil or butter. And the emulsification of ingredients might help.

[justamouse]

Thanks. I have to be out the door at 7:30am ... so no putting off breakfast or cooking. I could try the yoghurt.. if just somebody could promise me it takes only a few weeks...

 

Well, we can't promise. :-) Try it for a week and see how you do?

[DianeW88]

Sounds very intriguing...if you say it is easy, maybe I should try too, because I also have ten pounds that I would not mind losing. Unlike other posters here, however, I do not think I can make it happen in two weeks, nor can I pull off the amazing feat of losing three dress sizes in six months because I have not been that small since I was 11 years old.

My biggest obstacle is that I do not like meat. How would you propose to go about a low carb diet for somebody who does not eat meat?

 

I will preface this by saying that I do not have a weight problem. What I do have on occasion is an overeating on vaction and during the holidays problem. :D In order to get off that pesky five or six pounds that creeps up in January, I just use the Wonderslim program and it's gone in a week. Ten pounds in two weeks would be fairly easy on this program. Might take three if you don't have more than ten to lose, but I suspect two would do it. http://www.dietdirect.com/ There are options for veggie people. It's easy-peasy, the food is yummy, and the weight stays off.

[Stacy in NJ]

No. Even things like scrambled eggs are not something I can eat first thing in the morning (the whole cooked breakfast thing)... after eating bread for breakfast for 43 years

 

ETA: Just remembered an important question: how does a high fat diet work for people who do not have a gallbladder?

I had mine out a few years ago, and while I have no trouble with my present diet, I get sick if I eat fried foods like tempura.

 

I totally get where you're coming from here. I had by gallbladder removed in August of 2010. My diet change had no impact on my digestion other than I have less flatulance (sorry, tmi).

 

Previously my breakfast would be whole grain bread toasted with a bit of strawberry jam. I just did not believe I'd be able to stomach eggs and bacon in the morning. I was wrong. Initially, for about a week, it was difficult, but I found ways to make the eggs and meat really appealing to me. Now, I look forward to those eggs. I mix chopped red and green bell peppers in with my scrambled eggs. I sautee the peppers briefly in a butter then add the eggs. I don't add cheese, although by dss like it with chedder added.

 

You really can find away to change old habits.

 

ETA: Also, I really love a glass of ice water with my breakfast in addition to coffee. The bacon and/or sausages are salty and that water just tastes right.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Stacy in NJ

[Snickerdoodle]

Now, I look forward to those eggs. I mix chopped red and green bell peppers in with my scrambled eggs. I sautee the peppers briefly in a butter then add the eggs.

 

I like scrambled eggs with mushrooms, red peppers, zucchini, and chard (or kale). Yum. Sometimes I chop one or two pieces of bacon and cook that first and then saute all the veg in that. Oh yum.

[nono]

Try to think 1 egg with a lot of veggies. Get the portions to where you can tolerate them. Some folks will never be 2 eggs for breakfast people, and that is OK!

 

Also, Wendy has some great ideas on the muffins and pancakes.

[Free]

That was about a different issue (exercise not leading to weight loss). I believe that people have lost weight with LCHF.

 

Shudder... except for the nuts, I like those. But mayo, coconut, and coffee with cream make me cringe...

 

Gotta be a MAJOR paradigm shift because my diet is almost entirely carb based. The thought of a fatty breakfast makes me really nauseous; I am not sure I can digest anything high in fat or protein early in the morning and not feel sick.

 

This is going to be far from easy! this is going to be insanely hard.

If it was just two weeks, maybe...

 

Regentrude, if you want to try a new diet for a short period of time, I suppose there is no harm done. But before making a permanent switch, I would definitely suggest investigating the science a little bit further. Gary Taubes is not a scientist, he is a science journalist. And while he has definitely challenged conventional wisdom, there are also enough dissenting voices to give me a pause.

 

I am not educated enough on this issue to make an informed judgement. Here, however is one review of Taubes work by Dr. George Bray an obesity researcher, should you be interested to know more.

 

ETA: Here is another article I just found which should be interesting reading.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Free

[Quiver0f10]

Hi Jean,

 

I've been thinking about your post from yesterday (at least my yesterday--I live in Europe) about how confusing it all is and I agree! However, I have found two sources of nutrition info that I value:

 

Monica Reinagel (aka Nutrition Diva):

 

Main website: http://nutritionovereasy.com/ which works as a kind of hub of her various articles and podcasts. I like her because she is qualified (master's degree in nutrition science) and she reviews actual studies and not merely the newspaper reporting and THEN intelligently lays out what it might all mean. She has a great nutrition book out available at Amazon:

 

Nutrition Diva's Secrets for a Healthy Diet: What to Eat, What to Avoid, and What to Stop Worrying About (emphasis mine)

 

that understands there is NO ONE perfect diet for everybody and she helps you find out what is best for you and your family.

 

A second website: http://nutritiondiva.quickanddirtytips.com/carbs-and-weight-gain.aspx

 

This website actually came first and is a compilation of "tips"--what to DO with all the information overload. The most recent blog post talks about the carb-weight gain issue. And once you're on that page, you can click the links on her banner (Healthy Cooking, Weight loss, etc), and you'll get a whole list of former entries. These are also available as podcasts but I always just read them online.

 

Learning about Low GI foods:

 

As you correctly state, not all "carbs" are alike. Since the 1980's there has been extensive research into this, originally from the standpoint of how do specific carbs (baked potato, steamed rice, cooked pasta, almonds, etc) affect blood sugar levels (thus diabetes management) and now GI effects on metabolic issues, weight issues, pcos, and more.

 

There is way too much info for me to do more than a very brief summary, but in a nutshell, some carbs eaten in a meal cause blood sugar to rise slowly, some moderately, some rapidly. Eating a mix of carbs (low GI and high GI) creates a kind of average. Portions still matter (that is known as the Glycemic Load): eating too much of a low GI food can cause a quicker rise in blood sugar levels.

 

There are several leading research institutes, especially the University of Sydney. You can google search them-they publish a monthly newsletter, but their material is best absorbed through books. I especially like this one:

 

http://www.amazon.com/New-Glucose-Revolution-Eating-Made/dp/1569243859/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1342706312&sr=1-1&keywords=low+gi+eating+made+easy

 

Amazon was a great help in my initial studies: I used all the Look Insides and Free Samples for Kindle that were available. Just from that, you'll get a good understanding of carbs and how they react in our bodies. Thus, you'll be empowered to make good choices of your own.

 

Just so you know, with these basic nutritional foundations, NoS eating habits, and a pedometer, I've lost 50+ pounds and kept it off for 4 years now.... It really is a wonderful lifestyle for me.

 

I hope these help you navigate the nutritional waters,

 

Thank you! I am going to read over the links in a bit. Congratulations on the weight loss!

[Nestof3]

No. Even things like scrambled eggs are not something I can eat first thing in the morning (the whole cooked breakfast thing)... after eating bread for breakfast for 43 years

 

ETA: Just remembered an important question: how does a high fat diet work for people who do not have a gallbladder?

I had mine out a few years ago, and while I have no trouble with my present diet, I get sick if I eat fried foods like tempura.

 

I wonder if plain yogurt would be okay with berries and sliced almonds? Is that too much carbs?

 

I had scrambled eggs with cheese and nitrate-free ham with a side of plain yogurt, sliced almonds and a few berries for breakfast. Coffee with cream no sugar.

[justLisa]

I wonder if plain yogurt would be okay with berries and sliced almonds? Is that too much carbs?

 

I had scrambled eggs with cheese and nitrate-free ham with a side of plain yogurt, sliced almonds and a few berries for breakfast. Coffee with cream no sugar.

 

Have you seen the Mark daily apple site? He has this list of carbs. Maintenance vs losing, etc. It probably varies for some. I can eat loads of fruit. My every day consists of a whole banana, berries a couple times, and lots of veggies.

 

My favorite snack is yogurt, berries and nuts. I just stay under 100 carbs for the day. Right now I'm trying to lose 5, so I'm doing less.

 

ETA: 1 cup greek yogurt, 100 grams blueberries, and .5 ounce nuts is approximately 310-330 calories (depending on the yogurt), 24 carbs, .

Edited July 19, 2012 by 425lisamarie

[Quiver0f10]

Some folks who are more than a few pounds overweight or who have yo-yo dieted are possibily insulin resistant. When you're insulin resistant your body will hyper react to carbs by producing large amounts of insulin. It hyper reacts to all carbs whether or not they're complex. That extra insulin makes it really difficult to lose weight - not impossible, just difficult.

 

It's not that complex carbs are the original source of the problem; they're not. They're only a problem after you've already become insulin resistant. That's why some people and cultures can consume complex carbs in large quantities without weight gain. They've had very little sugar (fructose) in their diet so they've never fallen into insulin resistance.

 

In a nutshell, sugar is evil. If you've already been exposed to large amounts of sugar and are gaining weight or over weight, you're probably insulin resistant. Taking the sugar out of your diet will help, but it won't result in significant weight loss or the loss of the craving.

 

ETA: The book to read is:http://www.amazon.com/Good-Calories-Bad-Controversial-Science/dp/1400033462/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1342711999&sr=8-1&keywords=good+calories+bad+calories

 

Starred Review. Taubes's eye-opening challenge to widely accepted ideas on nutrition and weight loss is as provocative as was his 2001 NewYork Times Magazine article, What if It's All a Big Fat Lie? Taubes (Bad Science), a writer for Science magazine, begins by showing how public health data has been misinterpreted to mark dietary fat and cholesterol as the primary causes of coronary heart disease. Deeper examination, he says, shows that heart disease and other diseases of civilization appear to result from increased consumption of refined carbohydrates: sugar, white flour and white rice. When researcher John Yudkin announced these results in the 1950s, however, he was drowned out by the conventional wisdom. Taubes cites clinical evidence showing that elevated triglyceride levels, rather than high total cholesterol, are associated with increased risk of heart disease-but measuring triglycerides is more difficult than measuring cholesterol. Taubes says that the current U.S. obesity epidemic actually consists of a very small increase in the average body mass index. Taube's arguments are lucid and well supported by lengthy notes and bibliography. His call for dietary advice that is based on rigorous science, not century-old preconceptions about the penalties of gluttony and sloth is bound to be echoed loudly by many readers. Illus. (Oct. 2)

Copyright © Reed Business Information, a division of Reed Elsevier Inc. All rights reserved. --This text refers to an out of print or unavailable edition of this title.

 

I agree @ the sugar! Thanks for the link.

[Nestof3]

Have you seen the Mark daily apple site? He has this list of carbs. Maintenance vs losing, etc. It probably varies for some. I can eat loads of fruit. My every day consists of a whole banana, berries a couple times, and lots of veggies.

 

My favorite snack is yogurt, berries and nuts. I just stay under 100 carbs for the day. Right now I'm trying to lose 5, so I'm doing less.

 

ETA: 1 cup greek yogurt, 100 grams blueberries, and .5 ounce nuts is approximately 310-330 calories (depending on the yogurt), 24 carbs, .

 

No, I have not, but I will check. I need to go to the store to get some more avocado and such. I used what I had.

 

Here is the breakfast breakdown:

278 calories, 14 g. carbs, 16 g. fat, 20 g. protein

[justLisa]

No, I have not, but I will check. I need to go to the store to get some more avocado and such. I used what I had.

 

Here is the breakfast breakdown:

278 calories, 14 g. carbs, 16 g. fat, 20 g. protein

 

See that is perfect. Did you say you were wanting to lose 5 pounds or something? That' s where I am at. I have not needed to lose in a long time, but this is the way to do it for me. I use 2% greek right now because I can get it at Costco for sooo much cheaper. I still get the full fat at the store if I am there, but it's like twice the price and not a huge difference.

[Nestof3]

See that is perfect. Did you say you were wanting to lose 5 pounds or something? That' s where I am at. I have not needed to lose in a long time, but this is the way to do it for me. I use 2% greek right now because I can get it at Costco for sooo much cheaper. I still get the full fat at the store if I am there, but it's like twice the price and not a huge difference.

 

Ten is my goal. I wouldn't mind losing closer to 20, but I don't think I will ever be my 20-something self again.

[SitLongTalkMuch]

I think it is important to remember that not being "fat" doesn't necessarily mean someone isn't or won't experience the health issues of metabolic syndrome, which is also related to insulin resistance, and it is quite common. Again, as a woman who is not overweight, many people might look at me and say there's no way I'm at risk of type 2 diabetes. But I am insulin resistant, with a family history of metabolic syndrome issues.

 

Those of us with insulin resistance issues make up a pretty substantial part of the population. That particular subset of people may find it nearly impossible to lose weight or keep it off without addressing the carb and insulin issue.

 

This is my situation right now. In the past 2 years I have gone from a size 4 (my normal non-dieting size) to a size 12. I am 44 and have never had weight issues before.

 

I was diagnosed with hypoglycemia (sp??) in my early 20's, but was able to keep it under control until recently.

 

I am going to try lchf and see if it helps like it has Justamouse. It seems as though I am always hungry and craving white flour/white sugar foods.

[AdventureMoms]

No. Even things like scrambled eggs are not something I can eat first thing in the morning (the whole cooked breakfast thing)... after eating bread for breakfast for 43 years

 

ETA: Just remembered an important question: how does a high fat diet work for people who do not have a gallbladder?

I had mine out a few years ago, and while I have no trouble with my present diet, I get sick if I eat fried foods like tempura.

 

Neither my DW or I have a gallbladder (she had hers out 4.5 years ago, I had mine out 4 years ago).

 

We're both eating pretty high fat right now, both losing weight, and neither of us have had any digestive issues. Actually my digestion has improved markedly, if I eat sugar things don't go so well.

[Juniper]

Me too.

 

Can we start a support thread?

A check in for all paleo, primal, Atkin's people? That would be nice!!!!

 

 

and I could still use some more dessert and sweetener ideas.

[justLisa]

A check in for all paleo, primal, Atkin's people? That would be nice!!!!

 

 

and I could still use some more dessert and sweetener ideas.

 

Oh I'll bump the recipe thread! I make a yummy desserty thing

[swimmermom3]

I know some of you are opposed to a doctor offering nutritional advice, but for those of you okay with learning from former commissioner of the U.S. Food and Drug Administration under Bush and Clinton, a former dean of the medical schools at both Yale and University of California, San Franciso, and a graduate of Amherst College, University of Chicago Law School, and Harvard Medical School, you might read Dr. David Kessler's book, The End of Overeating: Taking Control of the Insatiable North American Appetite.

 

This is not a diet book; it is chock full of scientific studies on the brain chemistry and behavioral cues for the "conditioned hypereating" that so many of us Americans are involved with. There is also significant discussion on the food industry and its focus on the almighty triumvirate of sugar, fat, and salt. It was more than an eye-opener. There was one study cited where mice had to work by pushing a lever for access to some Ensure, which is both a sugar and fat solution. The mice would work continuously for about an hour to get the Ensure. Anything beyond that was the "breaking point" - the point where they were unwilling to work anymore for the reward. The breaking point for the mice with regards to ensure was just a little lower than it is for cocaine.:tongue_smilie: It makes me feel just great to know that this breaking point is what the food industry is aiming for.

 

Anyway, I found it to be a helpful read for looking at the mental end of eating and retraining habits. I know how to eat well and have no objections to exercising, but am clueless in the face of stress. This book has definitely given me a few more coping tools.

[AdventureMoms]

I know some of you are opposed to a doctor offering nutritional advice, but for those of you okay with learning from former commissioner of the U.S. Food and Drug Administration under Bush and Clinton, a former dean of the medical schools at both Yale and University of California, San Franciso, and a graduate of Amherst College, University of Chicago Law School, and Harvard Medical School, you might read Dr. David Kessler's book, The End of Overeating: Taking Control of the Insatiable North American Appetite.

 

This is not a diet book; it is chock full of scientific studies on the brain chemistry and behavioral cues for the "conditioned hypereating" that so many of us Americans are involved with. There is also significant discussion on the food industry and its focus on the almighty triumvirate of sugar, fat, and salt. It was more than an eye-opener. There was one study cited where mice had to work by pushing a lever for access to some Ensure, which is both a sugar and fat solution. The mice would work continuously for about an hour to get the Ensure. Anything beyond that was the "breaking point" - the point where they were unwilling to work anymore for the reward. The breaking point for the mice with regards to ensure was just a little lower than it is for cocaine.:tongue_smilie: It makes me feel just great to know that this breaking point is what the food industry is aiming for.

 

Anyway, I found it to be a helpful read for looking at the mental end of eating and retraining habits. I know how to eat well and have no objections to exercising, but am clueless in the face of stress. This book has definitely given me a few more coping tools.

 

Sounds fascinating! I just ordered the book.

[justamouse]

This is my situation right now. In the past 2 years I have gone from a size 4 (my normal non-dieting size) to a size 12. I am 44 and have never had weight issues before.

 

I was diagnosed with hypoglycemia (sp??) in my early 20's, but was able to keep it under control until recently.

 

I am going to try lchf and see if it helps like it has Justamouse. It seems as though I am always hungry and craving white flour/white sugar foods.

 

I hope it works as well for you as it has for me! I honestly feel like I was at a breaking point and this was my miracle. I had been praying my little heart out so that I didn't have to go on meds.

 

Also, on Mark''s Daily Apple today is this

 

As an added bonus, we’ve been fortunate enough to receive endorsements from world-wide scientific community including top doctors at the Harvard Medical School, John Hopkins, and UCLA, and have been approved as curriculum for registered dieticians (RDs) by the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics, so let’s just say that you’ll be quite equipped to assist those who haven’t yet seen the science.

 

Read more: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/ancient-wisdom-confirmed-by-modern-science/#ixzz215ySFgTS

 

It's an amazing article. It's like someone was listening to us...I swear, this place...people are watching everywhere...

Edited July 19, 2012 by justamouse

[nono]

you might read Dr. David Kessler's book, The End of Overeating: Taking Control of the Insatiable North American Appetite.

 

I mentioned this book way upthread. I read it awhile ago (which at my age might have been only a few weeks back but seems like years. ;)) Do you recall what he says about packaged foods nutrition labels? Basically I came away with that they are overstated by quite a bit sometimes to the point of being nutritionally void. Do you recall that part of the book?

 

I don't think too many of us are opposed to doctors for nutritional advice, as long as that is their focus. :) Dr. Atkins was a doctor. The new Atkins guys are are all doctors. The guy who wrote South Beach is a doctor. The Paleo guy has a doctorate ;) and is focused on Health and Exercise Science. I think the only one who's not is Gary Taubes, who tries to report on all of this without picking a team! And, he's not exactly a slouch. According to his bio on Amazon, Taubes studied applied physics at Harvard University and aerospace engineering at Stanford University (MS, 1978). Then he pursued a master's degree in journalism at Columbia University in 1981.

[swimmermom3]

I mentioned this book way upthread. I read it awhile ago (which at my age might have been only a few weeks back but seems like years. ;)) Do you recall what he says about packaged foods nutrition labels? Basically I came away with that they are overstated by quite a bit sometimes to the point of being nutritionally void. Do you recall that part of the book?

 

I don't think too many of us are opposed to doctors for nutritional advice, as long as that is their focus. :) Dr. Atkins was a doctor. The new Atkins guys are are all doctors. The guy who wrote South Beach is a doctor. The Paleo guy has a doctorate ;) and is focused on Health and Exercise Science. I think the only one who's not is Gary Taubes, who tries to report on all of this without picking a team! And, he's not exactly a slouch. According to his bio on Amazon, Taubes studied applied physics at Harvard University and aerospace engineering at Stanford University (MS, 1978). Then he pursued a master's degree in journalism at Columbia University in 1981.

 

Head -thunk. I did a search for his last name on the thread since I hadn't been able to keep up with all the posts and I was wondering if anyone had posted about it. Sorry about that Nono.:tongue_smilie:

 

As far as food labeling goes, one thing that he talked about was that federal law dictates that the main ingredient be listed first on the label. To avoid having "sugar" as the top ingredient, manufacturers will use four or five different sweeteners so that it gets split up and pushed down the list. The sugar content is less apparent. I think what he was proposing was seeing a percentage of the added sugars, refined carbohydrates, and the fats. The percentages we see on a box now are in relation to the percent daily values on a 2000 calorie diet, which is not particularly helpful if you are eating 1500 to lose weight or you are of an age where 2000 cal. a day is not viable. I would probably do some reconsidering if I knew that serving of crackers was 25% fat, 30% sugar, and 15% salt.

 

As far as doctors and nutrition, I had to go back to the first few posts. I just misunderstood. So what people were saying basically is don't go to your family doctor for nutrition advice?

[swimmermom3]

Sorry, low carb question for those of you who are doing it. How hard can you exercise?

 

Last summer, I played with the optimum combinations of where I would feel good. Below 40% carbs, I cannot for the life of me swim for an hour and anything over a two hour hike made my legs shake. Is that typical?

[nono]

Head -thunk. I did a search for his last name on the thread since I hadn't been able to keep up with all the posts and I was wondering if anyone had posted about it. Sorry about that Nono.:tongue_smilie

 

As far as doctors and nutrition, I had to go back to the first few posts. I just misunderstood. So what people were saying basically is don't go to your family doctor for nutrition advice?

 

 

Oh I.mentioned the book barely and no one picked up on it! Where have you been? :lol: Mostly that book scared me out of chain restaurants!

 

And yes the GP advice we are wary of...unless one has developed an interest... Would type more but I am at swim practice now on a Kindle Fire with no reading glasses. Will answer your athletics question later.

Edited July 19, 2012 by nono

[justamouse]

Sorry, low carb question for those of you who are doing it. How hard can you exercise?

 

Last summer, I played with the optimum combinations of where I would feel good. Below 40% carbs, I cannot for the life of me swim for an hour and anything over a two hour hike made my legs shake. Is that typical?

 

Mark's Daily Apple has TONS of stuff on that, because he was a competitive athelete.

[regentrude]

Regentrude, if you want to try a new diet for a short period of time, I suppose there is no harm done. But before making a permanent switch, I would definitely suggest investigating the science a little bit further.

 

Thanks for the heads-up, but I am not interested in any permanent change - I love bread and baked things and fruit too much.

I am just curious to find out if LCHF works for quick weight loss for me.

[besroma]

:lurk5:

[nono]

Sorry, low carb question for those of you who are doing it. How hard can you exercise?

 

Last summer, I played with the optimum combinations of where I would feel good. Below 40% carbs, I cannot for the life of me swim for an hour and anything over a two hour hike made my legs shake. Is that typical?

 

OK, so I'm in the middle of reading The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance from the docs who brought us New Atkins.

 

I'm still running through this transition back to my normal eating pattern, and there was no changeover fall-back of performance. I guess that is because I became a runner (and got back in the pool) when I was naturally eating the new Atkins way, but didn't know it! Anyway, I have postulated that I can easily go to 60 grams of net carbs a day without issue (though I'm still 20 under that presently). I just got to the point in the book where they ask "How low to go?" And the general guideline is 50 grams. They also focus on not over-consuming protein, which is where the new Atkins docs and Dr. Atkins recommendations part company, I guess.

 

And, the fact I eat a carb-balanced wrap before swim practice doesn't jive with their recommendations. But I LIKE to wrap up a simple meal before practice. So tonight it was a carb balance wrap warmed in a little bacon grease. I put in a boatload of lettuce, a couple think slices of roast beef, some Casique cheese, and 1/2 an avacado. It works for me. In the end, I don't think they'd argue much with me on it. ;) I'll let you know after I finish the book and email them! :tongue_smilie:

[AdventureMoms]

Sorry, low carb question for those of you who are doing it. How hard can you exercise?

 

Last summer, I played with the optimum combinations of where I would feel good. Below 40% carbs, I cannot for the life of me swim for an hour and anything over a two hour hike made my legs shake. Is that typical?

 

Definitely not for me. I have much more stamina and evenly high energy levels on low carb. With carbs I can get started but I crash after a half hour or so. I can lift more and push myself harder without feeling exhausted after also.

[Amy in TX]

Thanks for the heads-up, but I am not interested in any permanent change - I love bread and baked things and fruit too much.

I am just curious to find out if LCHF works for quick weight loss for me.

 

It would probably work for quick weight loss, but if you go right back to previous levels of carbs, the weight would probably come back too. Like any other weight loss method, it has to be a lifestyle change if you want to maintain the weight loss. (And I say this as a low-carber myself.)

 

That's not to say you must eliminate all bread and fruit to lose weight. Something less drastic might work for you. Everyone has their own tolerance. But whatever level of carbs you can tolerate and not regain, you would have to stay at that level, or, well, regain.

 

If increasing your activity level has worked for you in the past, why don't you try that first, since it seems that that would be much more appealing to you than reducing your carb intake very much?

[regentrude]

It would probably work for quick weight loss, but if you go right back to previous levels of carbs, the weight would probably come back too. Like any other weight loss method, it has to be a lifestyle change if you want to maintain the weight loss. (And I say this as a low-carber myself.)

 

That's not to say you must eliminate all bread and fruit to lose weight. Something less drastic might work for you. Everyone has their own tolerance. But whatever level of carbs you can tolerate and not regain, you would have to stay at that level, or, well, regain.

 

If increasing your activity level has worked for you in the past, why don't you try that first, since it seems that that would be much more appealing to you than reducing your carb intake very much?

 

I have once before lost weight I had put on over a short period and kept it off for decades without lifestyle change, so I was hoping I can do that again.

Of course I could go the eat-less/increase-exercise way, which is slow and takes time and determination (and quite honestly, I may not be determined enough to work on it right now), but the discussion about low carb was very intriguing, especially hearing how easy it seems to be for people to lose weight on it... so I was thinking of trying it out to see if that works. Still pondering, because of the dramatic diet change this would entail.

Edited July 19, 2012 by regentrude

[Jenny in Atl]

 

HEre's a mind boggling graph.

http://www.dietdoctor.com/stunning-saturated-fat-and-the-european-paradox

 

 

That would make a nutritionists head explode. And it's also WHY the Italians, French, and so forth are leaner. Full fats, moderate portions.

 

 

These are ((deaths)) from heart disease not the rates of... How can you compare first world Western European countries to Eastern European countries with very scary, at best, health care systems? The site given says the French only get 15% of their calories from high fat foods, so none of them eating bacon and cheeseburgers all day long. Why not just have a stick of butter for a snack? :tongue_smilie:

[Amy in TX]

I have once before lost weight I had put on over a short period and kept it off for decades without lifestyle change, so I was hoping I can do that again.

Of course I could go the eat-less/increase-exercise way, which is slow and takes time and determination (and quite honestly, I may not be determined enough to work on it right now), but the discussion about low carb was very intriguing, especially hearing how easy it seems to be for people to lose weight on it... so I was thinking of trying it out to see if that works. Still pondering, because of the dramatic diet change this would entail.

 

One thing that might make it easier (and easier to maintain) would be to do it backwards. Instead of eliminating all grains and starches at once and then gradually reintroducing to see what you can tolerate, do it the other way around. Eliminate one grain serving for a few days, then another, etc. Keep decreasing grains/starches until you start to see weight loss. Stay at that level. You might not ever have to get to the very low levels some people need.

 

Just a thought. Good luck in your decision.

[regentrude]

One thing that might make it easier (and easier to maintain) would be to do it backwards. Instead of eliminating all grains and starches at once and then gradually reintroducing to see what you can tolerate, do it the other way around. Eliminate one grain serving for a few days, then another, etc. Keep decreasing grains/starches until you start to see weight loss. Stay at that level. You might not ever have to get to the very low levels some people need.

 

Just a thought. Good luck in your decision.

 

Thanks for the advise, Amy. I appreciate it.

[Free]

These are ((deaths)) from heart disease not the rates of... How can you compare first world Western European countries to Eastern European countries with very scary, at best, health care systems? The site given says the French only get 15% of their calories from high fat foods, so none of them eating bacon and cheeseburgers all day long. Why not just have a stick of butter for a snack? :tongue_smilie:

 

That only shows that any set of numbers can be put on a graph to make it look like the numbers support your case. One needs to remember that correlation does not automatically mean causation.

[linders]

My children. Hands down. They both do competitive swimming, one is a new teen, one a pre-teen, and they need tons of food, good food and snacks. And I partake/

[LindaOz]

What cultures eat diets that are heavily based on carbs that don't have obesity problems? Perhaps the Japanese (much rice)? These cultures use practically no sugar. Carbs minus sugar can be eaten in moderation. Add sugar to the equation and any significant intake of all carbs leads to insulin resistence.

 

The physical activity issue is also unproven.

 

Agree!!!  Two books I highly recommend on this topic are:

 

Big Fat Lies http://www.amazon.com/Big-Fat-Lies-industry-ebook/dp/B007FVVCS6/ref=sr_1_8?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1380201127&sr=1-8&keywords=sweet+poison

Sweet Poison http://www.amazon.com/Sweet-Poison-ebook/dp/B007Y6B5QG/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1380201127&sr=1-1&keywords=sweet+poison

 

both by David Gillespie.  They are available on Kindle.

[mommaduck]

:iagree::iagree:...gmo.....Monsanto....Fast food...slow movement.

 

:iagree: Everyone messing with our food! Not being able to buy fresh and local easily or for less than processed garbage, particularly for the working poor and those on an extremely limited budget. Imported, corrupted meats.

[lamppost]

.

 

[wapiti]

I'd be interested to hear the progress of anyone else who's trying to increase fat and reduce carbs, and if anybody cares to know I can update y'all with my progress as well..

 

Note that there is a LCHF social group - hasn't been active lately but you're welcome to add some activity :) - it would be nice to hear some updates.

 

You might also like the two books by Phinney and Volek

http://www.amazon.com/The-Art-Science-Carbohydrate-Performance/dp/0983490716/ref=pd_sim_b_1

 

 http://www.amazon.com/The-Art-Science-Carbohydrate-Living/dp/0983490708/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1380220601&sr=8-1&keywords=art+and+science+of+low+carbohydrate+living

[umsami]

I think everybody should read "Pandora's Lunchbox", "Salt, Sugar, Fat", and "Wheat Belly."  You can hear two of the authors on NPR:

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/2013/03/live-chat-with-pandoras-lunchbox-author-melanie-warner.html

 

http://www.kera.org/2013/02/28/salt-sugar-fat-and-the-food-biz/

 

 

 

The science of addiction that is used by food companies in our food is astonishing.  Also, kind of remarkable, is that most of the execs in the books wouldn't eat their own company's food.

 

It's not just carbs...it's Frankencarbs.  There's no satiety factor with the new Monsanto-altered wheat, highly refined crap.

 

It's also becoming clearer that it's our gut microbiome.  You can feed two people the same foods and they will absorb calories differently because of the bacteria in their gut.  Research is just starting on this...but it's fascinating.  Now, what affected so many people's gut?  Is it all the antiobiotics in our food supply...the petro-chemicals...???

 

I'll also add...that fat is not necessarily bad.  Read up on the obesity paradox.  BMI up to 35 for many is fine...as long as their blood pressure, blood sugar, and cholesterol are in check.  

 

Inactivity is an issue...and some say that "sitting is the new smoking" in terms of just how bad it is.

 

 

[ktgrok]

I whole-heartedly agree with your post! Thanks for the links.

 

It makes me chuckle to see the food pyramid labeled the "old way of thinking" since for many of us 40 and above it was the "new way". I grew up learning about the "Basic 4" food groups. In school we were taught that a healthy diet was to be balanced between the 4 groups (meat, grains, fruit/veg, and dairy) and not majoring on grains/carbs. The idea that fat was bad was just being introduced when I was a kid.

those cultures generally eat very little sugar though. And the latest research shows that fructose (in sucrose or high fructose corn syrup) has a very different metabolic path than glucose, which is what rice and bread break down to. 

 

Also, yes, exercise offers a protection against insulin resistance, so attacks the same issue. However, for many people that level of physical activity is difficult to mimic in their every day lives, but a low carbohydrate diet is pretty feasible. 

[ktgrok]

Americans are fat because they eat too much. Just look at American restaurant portions vs. European portions.

 

Sorry, but I could care less where a calorie comes from. A calorie is a calorie is a calorie. It's the same whether it's from fat, sugars, or proteins. There is some minor processing differences, i.e. fat triggers satiety, proteins trigger some liver enzymes, etc. But it still boils down to too many calories in the American diet for the amount of expenditure.

 

Science is trying to make, "Close your mouth and get active" something more complicated than it is.

 

But science has shown that certain calories are metabolized differently. Such as alcohol. That has vastly different effects on your biochemistry and body than say, bread. And fructose does too. Sugar is not the same metabolically as protein.

[mommymilkies]

I saw this thread got bumped, and I just wanted to say thank you to the OP and to everyone who has recommended Good Calories, Bad Calories. I've read much of this thread, but not all, as I didn't think some of the discussion was that productive. Others shared the research, so all I can add is my own experience.

 

I've been a vegetarian for about half my life (early 30's now) and didn't have a weight problem until getting pregnant for the first time about 7 years ago. I gained crazy amounts of weight with each pregnancy and wasn't able to get it off. I worked out long and hard and cut calories a little, then more, then a LOT, but I still wasn't getting good weight-loss results and in the long run my body fat percentage was actually going UP. I did see some people in this thread suggesting that people who aren't losing weight with exercise don't know what hard exercise really is, or that they don't know what reasonable portion sizes are. Well, in the past I would measure my food and track all the calories and nutrients obsessively using websites like Sparkpeople and Loseit. At one time I kept a food diary where I took a photo of everything I ate before it went in my mouth.

 

I took up hard daily exercise, mainly in the form of group exercise classes that sort of forced me to work hard the whole hour because everybody's looking at you! I had friends in these classes and you better believe they'd be ragging on me if I took it easy. The classes were varied- step aerobics with weights, tae bo with abs, BodyPump and other full-hour weight training classes, circuit-training, boot camps, etc. There was one period of several months when I was doing anywhere from 12-18 hours of these classes every week, but 5-7 hours a week was more typical. I felt good, I slept well, but I was still fat. So I cut calories more, experimenting with different numbers, generally anywhere from 1500 down to 800 calories a day. I know most experts would advise no less than 1200 a day, but at that level I wasn't losing weight and my body fat percentage was still going up, but more importantly I was HUNGRY all the time and started feeling exhausted by exercise rather than energized by it. Bumping my calories up a bit so that I had more energy for exercise led to weight gain. I was obese according to my height vs. weight but more concerning was my really high body fat percentage.

 

I endured comments from doctors/nurses and a forced visit to a dietitian who told me my protein intake looked fine but my fat intake was too high at around 30% (while I was pregnant!) and that I should reduce that to closer to 25%. As for the type of food I was eating, we've never bought many packaged foods other than "healthy" whole grain cereals and 100% whole wheat bread- and for about 2 years I made my own whole wheat bread so it wouldn't have any extra junk in it. As a vegetarian, I ate plenty of fruits and vegetables, beans, and nonfat dairy. (No fake meats here- can't stand the taste or texture of real meat and the fake ones are pretty convincingly gross to me.)

 

Before I read Good Calories, Bad Calories, I really thought low carb/high fat was total bunk. The research in the book - which is NOT a diet book, by the way, in case anyone is not familiar with it - convinced me that it could actually be the sensible portions of Kashi cereal (As much protein as an egg!) homemade granola bars (no additives!) and brown rice (oh, the fiber!) that were keeping me fat. I'd been very suspicious recently that weight loss could not be as simple as eating less and exercising more, because I had been doing that for years and getting no satisfaction. The book is fascinating because it names the researchers who were responsible for certain trends in dietary recommendations in the U.S. and details the research (or lack thereof) that led to the recommendations. Although the book doesn't really make suggestions about what to eat, by the end I was convinced that I'd be a lot better off increasing my fat intake by a lot and cutting those "healthy whole grains" way down. Now if you're someone who thrives while eating sensible portions of healthy whole grains, then by all means continue to do so! I'm not addressing you, I'm talking to those who have made healthy lifestyle changes and have not been rewarded by returning to a healthy weight. 

 

I only increased my fat and cut my carbs about 3 weeks ago, but I feel amazing, have so much energy, and have lost about 10 pounds. Most importantly, I'm not HUNGRY all the time and I feel like this could be a permanent change. It's not like I'm eating no carbs, in fact I really doubt my carbs are low enough to count as something Atkins-like, which I think would be under 20 carbs a day (somebody correct me if I'm wrong- I don't do diet books.) I eat a lot of eggs and cheese with my veggies now, and any dairy is full-fat. I'm more likely to reach for nuts as a snack rather than fruit. I pan-fry my tofu (no breading though!) and use plenty of fat when making soups, stir-fries, curries, etc. 

 

I'd be interested to hear the progress of anyone else who's trying to increase fat and reduce carbs, and if anybody cares to know I can update y'all with my progress as well..

That's great! 

 

I am a pescetarian.  I just can't get over that emotional block to meat. I eat fish and I think I could do turkey if I really tried, but otherwise I just can't.  I was primal/paleo for almost 2 years and now that I can't eat meat, it's really hard.  I was also starving continuously when my carbs were lower.  Literally stomach growling pain all day, every day.  That's why I went back to wheat, but I need to cut it back out.  I also can't eat dairy without bad stomach pain.  I feel like I can't eat anything nowadays!  When I went back on gluten, I felt great for a month, now I have IBS symptoms, ulcer like feelings, and I gained almost 20 lbs!!  NOT cool! 

[ktgrok]

Personally I agree with Jillian Michaels on that one-- it's because people are eating so much highly processed crap/chemicals that the body does not recognize as food. So people eat and eat and are never truly "satisfied."

 maybe part of it. But I was a vegan for years and gained weight. I was a whole foods only, whole grains, fresh veggies, etc person and gained weight. The only time I don't gain weight is when I eliminate all sugar, and most grain. 

[ktgrok]

IN an interesting observation, I elimated sugar/grains and lost some weight. Then I eliminated diet soda, and something crazy happened. My calories eaten dropped by over 400 calories. with no hunger. I wasn't trying to eat less (or at least, I had always been trying to eat less, but was still hungry. But elminating the diet drinks made my appetite drop.