Selective service????

[Aelwydd]

I believe you are making very broad (and possibly unkind) generalization of people. That's a dangerous thing to do. There are lots of American pacifists and hawkish Europeans. Maybe even hawkish Canadians. I understand you aren't happy in the United States but I don't believe this is an appropriate place to air those thoughts. If I was living in Germany and hated it, I wouldn't continue on about it here for the sake of people that do love it and live there. It's offensive and unnecessary.

 

Sure, if I said I hated the US, I would totally agree with you. Since I specifically said it wasn't about hate, your comment is making a charge that is untrue. I've made criticisms about the US. That doesn't make me blind to the faults of other places, or idealistic. It's other folks assuming that I don't understand my choice, as if I'm some untraveled knave who is foolishly venturing beyond the safe and settled shores of the Homeland.

 

Look, I get that other people here disagree with my views. I don't feel though that that should mean I'm not allowed to express them.

[Aelwydd]

Cool. Maybe you can find someone in Sudan that would like to change places with you.

 

Because the dichotomy is always between the US and third world countries. It's never presented as a choice between the US and first world countries.

[Mama Lynx]

Nicely said, pqr.

[Aelwydd]

To the bolded: Why?

 

There are others on this same thread 'airing their thoughts' about how great the US is. How many freedoms we have, and how they believe the military is responsible for securing and/or maintaining those freedoms for US citizens.

 

So why is this an 'appropriate place' for supporters of the US/the US military to share their opinions, but not Aelwydd?

 

I suspect it's because you do not agree with her. I also suspect it's because she holds a minority view on the subject.

 

But I'd be very interested in hearing YOUR reasoning as to why this is not an appropriate place for her to state her opinion/viewpoint.

 

Thank you! :001_smile:

[5kidsforME]

I would think that most folks who don't like my position would be genuinely happy and pleased I'm taking myself, and my liberal vote, out of the country!

 

While I am almost 100% positive that you an I are on opposite sides of the sectrum on our political beliefs, I find it refreshing that you are putting your money where your mouth is.

 

I do wonder though, there would need to be a certain kind of hate for a country, to go to the lengths that you all are to get out.

[Mrs Mungo]

I believe you are making very broad (and possibly unkind) generalization of people. That's a dangerous thing to do. There are lots of American pacifists and hawkish Europeans. Maybe even hawkish Canadians. I understand you aren't happy in the United States but I don't believe this is an appropriate place to air those thoughts. If I was living in Germany and hated it, I wouldn't continue on about it here for the sake of people that do love it and live there. It's offensive and unnecessary.

 

I tend to agree.

 

Sure, if I said I hated the US, I would totally agree with you. Since I specifically said it wasn't about hate, your comment is making a charge that is untrue. I've made criticisms about the US. That doesn't make me blind to the faults of other places, or idealistic. It's other folks assuming that I don't understand my choice, as if I'm some untraveled knave who is foolishly venturing beyond the safe and settled shores of the Homeland.

 

Look, I get that other people here disagree with my views. I don't feel though that that should mean I'm not allowed to express them.

 

Whether it is allowed and whether it is the path of wisdom are different things. Of course, certain speech is not allowed in other countries the way that it is in the US. So, you should probably learn to regulate yourself better.

 

In Germany, the press is regulated by the government. Many political organizations are not allowed to disseminate information. You could potentially go to jail for displaying a hammer and sickle flag or disparaging the president or a public display of blasphemy. If you want to leave the US for Germany, that's fine. But, you can't claim it is because Germans have greater freedom.

[LucyStoner]

Frankly, I would support 1-3 years of military or civil/volunteer service for young people. Maybe then people would at least pay attention to the issues of the day and the wars. And FTR, I was raised by two pacifists, including a vet who helped set up Veterans Against the War. But how it works now, all volunteer, means that for people with many backgrounds, the military is a totally abstract concept.

[Word Nerd]

In Germany, the press is regulated by the government. Many political organizations are not allowed to disseminate information. You could potentially go to jail for displaying a hammer and sickle flag or disparaging the president or a public display of blasphemy. If you want to leave the US for Germany, that's fine. But, you can't claim it is because Germans have greater freedom.

 

Such as the freedom to homeschool, for one.

[Mrs Mungo]

Sure, if I said I hated the US, I would totally agree with you. Since I specifically said it wasn't about hate, your comment is making a charge that is untrue. I've made criticisms about the US. That doesn't make me blind to the faults of other places, or idealistic. It's other folks assuming that I don't understand my choice, as if I'm some untraveled knave who is foolishly venturing beyond the safe and settled shores of the Homeland.

 

The problem is that your statements show that you are untraveled and a little ignorant about the freedoms of other countries and other issues that you've mentioned.

[Xuzi]

While I am almost 100% positive that you an I are on opposite sides of the sectrum on our political beliefs, I find it refreshing that you are putting your money where your mouth is.

 

I do wonder though, there would need to be a certain kind of hate for a country, to go to the lengths that you all are to get out.

 

Why? How about just a general sense of it not feeling like "home"? Of feeling like an "alien" in your own "home"?

 

I'm not trying to leave the US, but I had similar feelings about the state of California, where I was born and raised. It never felt like "home". I never felt like the way I saw the world, and the way the other Californians around me saw the world, meshed very well, and the older I got the more strongly I felt that it wasn't the place where I wanted to set up a lasting home, and so the first opportunity I had to leave, I took.

 

I don't hate California. I'm perfectly okay with other people fawning adoringly over all that it has to offer, and being willing to put up with it's flaws (or even not seeing them as flaws). But it's no the ONLY place out there where one can live a happy, fulfilled life; and I'm sure America isn't either.

[Mrs Mungo]

But how it works now, all volunteer, means that for people with many backgrounds, the military is a totally abstract concept.

 

I agree with this. Even the idea of *service* to your nation is an abstract concept to many people.

[J-rap]

Living in other countries has done wonders for increasing our patriotism. So glad to be American despite all the problems.

 

Granted, I don't believe that America is God's favored country, as others might, and I certainly don't agree with all of the politics. But after spending so much time in other countries, I've come to really be grateful for so many things we do have, here. All in all, I think we're pretty lucky.

[Whitworth]

Hate? Re-locating on emotion is one of the worst things one can do. For us, expatriating makes not only philosophical sense but financial as well. Salaries for our chosen careers are higher. In the areas we are considering, housing and future education expenses for example make crossing the 49th parallel a win win.

[Mrs Mungo]

Why? How about just a general sense of it not feeling like "home"? Of feeling like an "alien" in your own "home"?

 

I'm not trying to leave the US, but I had similar feelings about the state of California, where I was born and raised. It never felt like "home". I never felt like the way I saw the world, and the way the other Californians around me saw the world, meshed very well, and the older I got the more strongly I felt that it wasn't the place where I wanted to set up a lasting home, and so the first opportunity I had to leave, I took.

 

I don't hate California. I'm perfectly okay with other people fawning adoringly over all that it has to offer, and being willing to put up with it's flaws (or even not seeing them as flaws). But it's no the ONLY place out there where one can live a happy, fulfilled life; and I'm sure America isn't either.

 

But, I think this is a fine way to express yourself. Claiming you want to leave the US to rid yourself of onerous taxes and restricted freedom (especially in favor of a nation like Germany) is ridiculous, imo. Claiming that Germans aren't hawkish is *completely* naive and ridiculous. Germany is one of the best allies of the US today.

[KungFuPanda]

Yes, but have you talked to the German people recently? They're pretty uncomfortable with anything smacking of military aggression, or even, just really strong words. They're terminally embarrassed for WWII.

 

In any case, Germany's not my first choice, especially since it takes 7 years to become a citizen there. Also, the SS isn't the main, or even a top reason, for why I want to high tail it out of the States. It's merely a rotten cherry on top of a really disturbing sundae. I just mentioned us wanting to leave in response to Wendy's post about her being skeptical regarding whether the US is actually the best place to live anywhere on the whole planet earth.

 

I don't begrudge anyone their own opinions, and I think if a move makes you happy, then it makes sense to take steps to make that move. I have a friend who became a Canadian. She's now in the process of becoming an Austrian. She's no happier, but she's taking the steps and DOING something about it. That counts for something.

 

I did live on one state that felt like a nation in itself. I wasn't sad to move from there. I'm glad I didn't have to go through any legal hoops to move. :001_smile:

 

I agree with this. Even the idea of *service* to your nation is an abstract concept to many people.

 

Service? What's in it for me ???

[LucyStoner]

I agree with this. Even the idea of *service* to your nation is an abstract concept to many people.

 

And there is something of a class issue in place. Most of the people I know who joined the military were either from military families so it was something they aspired to or who were from fairly low income backgrounds and did so in large part or wholly because of the financial need to do so. And the financial worries don't stop there because unemployment is higher for vets, which strikes me as a cold slap in a face.

 

We have Vista and Americorps in place for people not able to or willing to do to the armed forces. I really do think that some sort of service obligation would be a good thing.

[JennyD]

Because I cannot resist making book recommendations, I recently read and was enormously impressed by this book about the Army's transition to an All-Volunteer Force:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Americas-Army-Making-All-Volunteer-Force/dp/0674035364/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1332129479&sr=8-4

 

Ms Mungo, I suspect you would find it especially interesting, but really, it's a fascinating read for anyone even vaguely interested in these issues.

Edited March 19, 2012 by JennyD

[Mrs Mungo]

I did live on one state that felt like a nation in itself. I wasn't sad to move from there. I'm glad I didn't have to go through any legal hoops to move.

 

But, to me, that is one of the great things about the US? Unhappy in your conservative? Move to California or Hawaii or Vermont. If you don't like the hippie, sunny California style, then you could pick a different blue state. Not happy in sunny California and you tend toward the conservative side? Try Alaska or Arizona. We have choices.

 

And, yes, there is a certain conservative contingent that currently controls a piece of the conversation. But, there are lots of other conversations out there. Listen to NPR or John Stewart and block Fox.

[Mrs Mungo]

And there is something of a class issue in place. Most of the people I know who joined the military were either from military families so it was something they aspired to or who were from fairly low income backgrounds and did so in large part or wholly because of the financial need to do so.

 

This is not my experience. My dh is from a well-off background. He went to an exclusive private school in Dallas. He went to an expensive boarding school for high school and his first two years of college. We were in a unit once with a son of one of the founders of AOL. He eventually left the military and now he runs his dad's charitable foundation. We have known people from all sorts of backgrounds.

 

And the financial worries don't stop there because unemployment is higher for vets, which strikes me as a cold slap in a face.

I think this is partly true because of the types of people who get thrown out of the military.

 

We have Vista and Americorps in place for people not able to or willing to do to the armed forces. I really do think that some sort of service obligation would be a good thing.

I tend to agree.

 

Because I cannot resist making book recommendations, I recently read and was enormously impressed by this book about the Army's transition to an All-Volunteer Force:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Americas-Army-Making-All-Volunteer-Force/dp/0674035364/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1332129479&sr=8-4

 

Ms Mungo, I suspect you would find it especially interesting, but really, it's a fascinating read for anyone even vaguely interested in these issues.

 

Thanks, I will look it up and add it to my reading list!

Edited March 19, 2012 by Mrs Mungo

[catz]

But, to me, that is one of the great things about the US? Unhappy in your conservative? Move to California or Hawaii or Vermont. If you don't like the hippie, sunny California style, then you could pick a different blue state. Not happy in sunny California and you tend toward the conservative side? Try Alaska or Arizona. We have choices.

 

And, yes, there is a certain conservative contingent that currently controls a piece of the conversation. But, there are lots of other conversations out there. Listen to NPR or John Stewart and block Fox.

 

:iagree: I was just typing up something like this.

 

Aedlwydd, have you lived outside Texas just out of curiosity?

[Mrs Mungo]

 

Aedlwydd, have you lived outside Texas just out of curiosity?

 

Hell, just move to Austin if you want a more liberal community. You don't even have to leave Texas to get that, at least to some degree.

[cdrumm4448]

To the bolded: Why?

 

There are others on this same thread 'airing their thoughts' about how great the US is. How many freedoms we have, and how they believe the military is responsible for securing and/or maintaining those freedoms for US citizens.

 

So why is this an 'appropriate place' for supporters of the US/the US military to share their opinions, but not Aelwydd?

 

I suspect it's because you do not agree with her. I also suspect it's because she holds a minority view on the subject.

 

But I'd be very interested in hearing YOUR reasoning as to why this is not an appropriate place for her to state her opinion/viewpoint.

 

Because many Americans are patriotic and fully believe in that traditional value and find it offensive that someone who takes full advantage of the freedoms others have died for and are dying for would then disparage those people, this land, and our way of life.

[Whitworth]

:iagree: I was just typing up something like this.

 

Aedlwydd, have you lived outside Texas just out of curiosity?

 

Although we currently reside in Texas, the two of us have lived in every region of the US. We have traveled many times throughout North and South America and Europe. At one time I was near fluency in German, however, I am out of practice.

 

Currently, I am studying French and have attained toddler level in Russian. :tongue_smilie:

[cdrumm4448]

And, yes, there is a certain conservative contingent that currently controls a piece of the conversation. But, there are lots of other conversations out there. Listen to NPR or John Stewart and block Fox.

 

Oh, Mrs. Mungo, you had me until this. :D

[cdrumm4448]

Hell, just move to Austin if you want a more liberal community. You don't even have to leave Texas to get that, at least to some degree.

 

And I was just thinking we should move TO Texas. We live in IL, ya' know.

[Mrs Mungo]

Oh, Mrs. Mungo, you had me until this. :D

 

:D Well, you would probably want to do the opposite, lol. I'm a moderate. Which, makes me a liberal in the current climate. ;)

 

And I was just thinking we should move TO Texas. We live in IL, ya' know.

 

It's a different style of conservative there, I will warn you. But, might be a great idea. Start house shopping and you'll be convinced!

[cdrumm4448]

:D Well, you would probably want to do the opposite, lol. I'm a moderate. Which, makes me a liberal in the current climate. ;)

 

 

 

It's a different style of conservative there, I will warn you. But, might be a great idea. Start house shopping and you'll be convinced!

 

I was in Houston 20 years ago and the cost of living then was really very reasonable. Although, I do remember really nice homes right next to ramshackle houses with chickens in the yard (and not nice, Martha Stewart-ish chicken coops, IYKWIM)

[LucyStoner]

This is not my experience. My dh is from a well-off background.

 

I know that statistically it is income diverse by the zip codes of the recruits. I think that class is more complex than income levels and I should have said demographics. Fewer urbanites join, fewer people whose parents were not ever military join. Fewer people from the NE join than from the SE. As a poor kid who went to an affluent city high school, only 2 of my school friends joined up in the intervening 13 years (and one quite famously went AWOL, was a nationally publicized case, went to trial and is now at a prestigious college). Quite a number of my income peers from low income housing however did join, none for career purposes, nearly all went in and got out voluntarily 3-6 years later. None that I am aware of were kicked out. So my experience does match the overall situation.

Edited March 19, 2012 by kijipt

[Mrs Mungo]

I know that statistically it is income diverse by the zip codes of the recruits. I think that class is more complex than income levels and I should have said demographics. Fewer urbanites join, fewer people whose parents were not ever military join. Fewer people from the NE join than from the SE. As a poor kid who went to an affluent city high school, only 2 of my school friends joined up in the intervening 13 years (and one quite famously went AWOL, was a nationally publicized case, went to trial and is now at a prestigious college). Quite a number of my income peers from low income housing however did join, none for career purposes, nearly all went in and got out voluntarily 3-6 years later. None that I am aware of were kicked out. So my experience does match the overall situation.

 

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/joiningthemilitary/a/demographics.htm

[LucyStoner]

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/joiningthemilitary/a/demographics.htm

 

I don't disagree with this, I was saying much that this article says- for example urbanites are underrepresented. I also said that my experience did not match the full picture. I think geography plays a big part. In the city where I live and graduated high school, it has been almost unheard of for an affluent young adult to join the military. That is not the case everywhere. I do live in a big blue-tropolis however.

 

This breaks is down nicely and shows that the data backs up a very economically diverse military. But not a geographically diverse one.

http://www.freakonomics.com/2008/09/22/who-serves-in-the-military-today/

[Mrs Mungo]

I don't disagree with this, I was saying much that this article says- for example urbanites are underrepresented. I also said that my experience did not match the full picture. I think geography plays a big part. In the city where I live and graduated high school, it has been almost unheard of for an affluent young adult to join the military. That is not the case everywhere. I do live in a big blue-tropolis however.

 

This breaks is down nicely and shows that the data backs up a very economically diverse military. But not a geographically diverse one.

http://www.freakonomics.com/2008/09/22/who-serves-in-the-military-today/

 

Ah, I can agree with you there. Dh is from Texas, and I am from Oklahoma. We both knew lots of well-off kids who joined the military.

[JennyD]

This Congressional Budget Office report, from 2007, is also quite instructive about the demographics of the all-volunteer military. The findings include that recruits from bottom 10% and the top 10% of family incomes are underrepresented.

 

www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/.../07-19-militaryvol.pdf

Edited March 19, 2012 by JennyD

[Kate CA]

Look, I get that other people here disagree with my views. I don't feel though that that should mean I'm not allowed to express them.

 

I don't think people take issue with the fact that you have these views, as most of us are quite grateful for our ability to speak freely in our country. However, your wisdom in sharing them here in this way is suspect. Please remember that you are amid many women whose husbands are either ON or have recently been in the front line of warfare. They are the ones sitting at home wondering if their beloved will come HOME.

 

At least consider these ladies when you feel like sharing how much you dislike the country for which they are fighting.

[Pamela H in Texas]

They will register for SS. We do not participate in government except for obeying laws that do not cause us to sin. We are also pacifists. So, they will register, but they will note that they are conscientious objectors.

Oh yes. This is our belief also.

 

I just don't get why it even exists. The government already knows that most people exist and their age. They even usually have some fairly recent address for them should they need to draft people. So why have it mandatory for people to sign up? It just doesn't seem to serve a purpose. At least it takes seconds though. Could be worse.

[asta]

Well, are they all gung-ho for fighting like we are? I just don't get that impression for some reason. In any case, as I said before, the SS is not the main reason for why I want to leave. And Germany's not my first choice. Canada is.

 

And before anyone says it, if someone cites Canada's conscription service as a reason for not going, I should just like to point out that I fully endorse and support the NHL.

 

They don't need to be - it is an established fact that the US military has been the primary military support for the EU counties since WWII. Not a single one can match the US on technology - they don't even try - their budgets are apportioned to their welfare states, not their national defense.

 

If the US were to pull out of the EU tomorrow, all h3ll would break loose worldwide. The US isn't the 'aggressor' everyone would like to present them as; they are the glue holding most of the world together.

 

 

A

[pqr]

Well, are they all gung-ho for fighting like we are? .

 

 

Well a Canadian sniper has the world record for a distance kill. I found this out when several Canadians that I know (both men and women and not military) were crowing about it. It was quite a shot, took down one of the bad guys at over a mile. I am not too sure if the record has been beaten yet but the fact is that at least some Canadians are rather proud of it, so yes some are very gung-ho.

[garddwr]

I've been counting on my fingers: between my own family and my husband's (parents, siblings, spouses) we have family members who have lived in 9 European countries, 5 Latin American countries, 5 Asian Countries, 1 Middle Eastern country, and Canada. If you add in places visited, mostly for work, the tally would include at least two dozen more countries and every continent (yep, all 7!) Most are American citizens born, all are American citizens by choice. We tend to the conservative side, but there are a couple of liberal outliers in the mix. Without exception, I don't think you could pay any of us enough to surrender our citizenship. There are a few other countries out there where respect for liberty and human dignity are valued as they are in the United States, and those are the countries I would pick if I couldn't belong to this one. But at this point there is no country that has more to offer me than what I find here. We're not perfect, not by a long shot, but we have a solid foundation to build on.

[Mrs Mungo]

I don't think people take issue with the fact that you have these views, as most of us are quite grateful for our ability to speak freely in our country. However, your wisdom in sharing them here in this way is suspect. Please remember that you are amid many women whose husbands are either ON or have recently been in the front line of warfare. They are the ones sitting at home wondering if their beloved will come HOME.

 

At least consider these ladies when you feel like sharing how much you dislike the country for which they are fighting.

 

And to clarify, I don't mind specific disagreement with the government on specific issues. That is to be expected among such a diverse group. But, mindless charges against the US that could just as easily be leveled against the preferred countries? It isn't logical. That is the bigger problem for me.

 

I just don't get why it even exists. The government already knows that most people exist and their age. They even usually have some fairly recent address for them should they need to draft people. So why have it mandatory for people to sign up? It just doesn't seem to serve a purpose. At least it takes seconds though. Could be worse.

 

In my opinion only? It exists in order for young men to be aware of what *could* happen. It exists so that there is a small recognition of the sacrifice being made by others *every day*. It exists so that there is a participatory element.

 

They don't need to be - it is an established fact that the US military has been the primary military support for the EU counties since WWII. Not a single one can match the US on technology - they don't even try - their budgets are apportioned to their welfare states, not their national defense.

 

If the US were to pull out of the EU tomorrow, all h3ll would break loose worldwide. The US isn't the 'aggressor' everyone would like to present them as; they are the glue holding most of the world together.

 

 

I think this is mostly true, especially the bolded bit.

 

Well a Canadian sniper has the world record for a distance kill. I found this out when several Canadians that I know (both men and women and not military) were crowing about it. It was quite a shot, took down one of the bad guys at over a mile. I am not too sure if the record has been beaten yet but the fact is that at least some Canadians are rather proud of it, so yes some are very gung-ho.

 

Canada and the UK both have excellent sniper schools and special forces. I was a La Leche League Leader when we lived in Germany, many of our single friends had German girlfriends, we had a German "sister unit" that we did functions with, we spent lots of time on the economy. I've personally interacted with a diverse group of Germans. They are a diverse group. You cannot make sweeping generalizations.

[5kidsforME]

Why? How about just a general sense of it not feeling like "home"? Of feeling like an "alien" in your own "home"?

 

I'm not trying to leave the US, but I had similar feelings about the state of California, where I was born and raised. It never felt like "home". I never felt like the way I saw the world, and the way the other Californians around me saw the world, meshed very well, and the older I got the more strongly I felt that it wasn't the place where I wanted to set up a lasting home, and so the first opportunity I had to leave, I took.

 

I don't hate California. I'm perfectly okay with other people fawning adoringly over all that it has to offer, and being willing to put up with it's flaws (or even not seeing them as flaws). But it's no the ONLY place out there where one can live a happy, fulfilled life; and I'm sure America isn't either.

 

Oh, you are not alone in feeling that way about California. ;)

 

I am not saying that America isn't the only place that one can live a happy fulfilled life.

 

IMO, the way Aelywd (forget how to spell it!) feels about the US is close, if not totally, hate. One has to STRONGLY dislike their country to want to give up citizenship, and go to the lengths she and her family are going to to remove themselves completely from this country.

 

FTR, it is fine that she dislikes or hates the US. I would hope all citizens that feel as strongly as she does leave the country.

[Liza Lee]

I just heard a commercial on the radio that men must register for selective service within 1 month of turning 18. That's the draft, right? Is it the "law"? What happens if they don't? Is it just for men?

 

I thought that was long gone with the draft. Does anyone have any information or thoughts on this?

 

Hot Lava Mama

 

I know that your question has already been answered. However, to give the history of this, the draft was abolished in the '70s, but registration for Selective Service began shortly thereafter. I have a brother who was born in January of '59 who did not have to register, but there was only a very small window of young men who were never subject to the possibility of required military service. There was a lot of fear about it when the registration began since it was shortly after the end of the Vietnam War, but it has never been used.

 

Thanks for this thread. I have a 17yo son, and I need to make sure he registers this summer when he turns 18.

[aggieamy]

Oh, you are not alone in feeling that way about California. ;)

 

I am not saying that America isn't the only place that one can live a happy fulfilled life.

 

IMO, the way Aelywd (forget how to spell it!) feels about the US is close, if not totally, hate. One has to STRONGLY dislike their country to want to give up citizenship, and go to the lengths she and her family are going to to remove themselves completely from this country.

 

FTR, it is fine that she dislikes or hates the US. I would hope all citizens that feel as strongly as she does leave the country.

 

I'm not an expert in immigration but I find it ironic that the fact that she is even able to consider immigrating to Canada or many European countries is because she is a United States citizen. That would be a much more difficult thing to do if one was living in the Congo or Sudan.

[asta]

I'm not an expert in immigration but I find it ironic that the fact that she is even able to consider immigrating to Canada or many European countries is because she is a United States citizen. That would be a much more difficult thing to do if one was living in the Congo or Sudan.

 

::snort::

[Jenny in Florida]

If this country is truly so awesome, then I don't see a need for things such as forced registration for selective service. People should be lining up to do it on their own.

 

I agree, and I would also argue that a country as wonderful as all that should be accepting of a diversity of thought when it comes to war.

[Jenny in Florida]

Su. I've made criticisms about the US. That doesn't make me blind to the faults of other places, or idealistic. It's other folks assuming that I don't understand my choice, as if I'm some untraveled knave who is foolishly venturing beyond the safe and settled shores of the Homeland.

 

Look, I get that other people here disagree with my views. I don't feel though that that should mean I'm not allowed to express them.

 

Amen.

 

Back in my college student days, I carried a backpack with all kinds of pins and buttons on it. One of my favorites, which very few people seemed to get, read, "My Country: Right Its Wrongs."

[Mrs Mungo]

I agree, and I would also argue that a country as wonderful as all that should be accepting of a diversity of thought when it comes to war.

 

I have known military wives who have attended anti-war rallies. In general, I think the country is accepting of alternative points of view up to a point. I think people who get themselves in trouble because of their views do so when they talk about issues they aren't really ready to debate or they don't understand the complexities of certain issues or they are being idealistic and/ignorant when it comes to the policies of other nations *or* (and I know the feeling) they are talking to someone on the opposite side for whom the previous traits are true.

[Jenny in Florida]

I don't think people take issue with the fact that you have these views, as most of us are quite grateful for our ability to speak freely in our country. However, your wisdom in sharing them here in this way is suspect. Please remember that you are amid many women whose husbands are either ON or have recently been in the front line of warfare. They are the ones sitting at home wondering if their beloved will come HOME.

 

At least consider these ladies when you feel like sharing how much you dislike the country for which they are fighting.

 

I certainly respect that those husbands and fathers (and wives and mothers) are off doing what they believe to be right. In fact, I have a brother-in-law who has been in the Navy for many year.

 

My personal belief is that one of the things those folks are fighting for -- or should be -- is my right to express my own thoughts on exactly these kinds of issues.

[butterflymommy]

This website says a disabled person who is capable of moving about in public without assistance must register:

 

Thanks. DS has actually mentioned wanting to enlist, but I don't think they would take him.

 

I haven't read the 8 pages since I posted, but I don't think there will ever be a draft unless they're willing to draft girls too (because the male draft would be challenged on the basis of gender discrimination). And I don't think any politician wants to go there.

[Whitworth]

::snort::

 

I agree. Those of us who were fortunate enough to be born into western countries are indeed privileged to live and work where they please.

[In2why]

Well, are they all gung-ho for fighting like we are? I just don't get that impression for some reason. In any case, as I said before, the SS is not the main reason for why I want to leave. And Germany's not my first choice. Canada is.

 

And before anyone says it, if someone cites Canada's conscription service as a reason for not going, I should just like to point out that I fully endorse and support the NHL.

 

Wouldn't it be an easier process if you moved from Texas to the border of Canada? That way you could learn the language, and research living and working conditions easier. I would think it would be.easier to get jobs and meet their requirements that way.

[In2why]

I don't think people take issue with the fact that you have these views, as most of us are quite grateful for our ability to speak freely in our country. However, your wisdom in sharing them here in this way is suspect. Please remember that you are amid many women whose husbands are either ON or have recently been in the front line of warfare. They are the ones sitting at home wondering if their beloved will come HOME.

 

At least consider these ladies when you feel like sharing how much you dislike the country for which they are fighting.

 

 

Or their adult kids are serving. But she should be able to say what she believes. It is an interesting exchange of ideas, and this board is excellent at that. I have also lived all over the world, and as much as I love America and feel blessed to live here, there is often a knee jerk impulse by some to only want to examine the good points and brush over the negative by saying someone is.unpatriotic or should just leave.