Mormon Missionary question

[Dolphin]

OK, this is not a thread to bash missionaries or anything, so if you have problems, stories of annoying missionaries, please don't post.

 

So, there was a thread awhile back about missionaries. Someone posted that they were the mom of a missionary and something about that it was service based and her son would rather be pulling weeds in your garden than knocking on doors. Another posted to remember that the missionaries were someone's child.

 

Anyway, then Nance started this whole random act of kindness thing. Then some missionaries knocked on my door, and my husband got rid of them.

 

Thanks to you ladies I ran down the street after them and chatted with them a little. I asked if they were looking for service jobs, told them about the board and said if they came back in January I would have something for them. I asked what they were good at/liked doing and one immediately said gardening.

 

So here it is January 1st and they are on the doorstep. We have now exchanged numbers and they are coming back the weekend after next to help my husband fix a fence and dig some drainage holes (our house gets a lot of water pooling around it.) I asked if they liked beef stew and they said yes, so I will feed them lunch.

 

Here is my question. I am not LDS, I have no plans of becoming LDs (they know this). What do we do? What are some good topics to talk about? How much work should I have for them? (I don't want to have them do to much) Are they going to try and convert us even though we have said we are happy in our faith, and if so what is a good way to let them know that conversion won't be happening here?

 

I am asking out of a desire to be kind, and because I really don't know a lot about this.

 

Again. Helpful advice please (no, back out as fast as you can!)

 

Thanks in advance,

Nicole

[Melinda in VT]

I have no advice about how much work to give them.

 

I'd start by asking them where they are from and about their families. How long have they been out on their missions? What other towns have they been in? What were their hobbies? Unless they are very new on their mission, they won't have seen any recently released movies or TV shows, so those are not good topics of conversation.

 

Most Mormon missionaries are 19-21 year old guys. They don't always get subtle. ;) You might need to repeat the "we are happy in our faith and are not converting" message more than you would like. Or perhaps not. It really depends on the individual missionaries. It might help to remember that Mormons grow up hearing anecdotes about people who swore they would never convert and then did. Persistence is seen as a virtue. So you might be swimming against 20 years of conditioning.

[DawnM]

So very thoughtful of them!

 

I am not LDS so I can't really respond but I would imagine that any topic of interest, especially if you ask them about themselves, would be appropriate.

 

When DH and I first got married we had some missionaries show up at our door. We got to talking and they asked if they could come back. They came several times and we talked about all sorts of things. Yes, they did try to proselytize, but I admit that was mostly because I kept asking questions. I wasn't argumentative at all, just wanted to know more info. They were very polite in answering me and also adding info.

 

Dawn

[meggie]

Ohhh how sweet are you!!!

 

When they get there you can ask them how long they have until their next appointment or when they have to leave. I'm thinking two hours of yard work would be pretty good. (If another LDS mom thinks that's too much/not enough, let me know. It's just a guess). They might ask if they can leave you with a word of prayer; if you are uncomfortable with that you can say so.

 

Things to talk about: Where they are from, how long they have been out, how the phone call home went (missionaries are only allowed to call home on Christmas and Mother's Day, so they would have just talked to their families), if they did any college before coming out, if they're going to go to college when they get back, favorite Bible stories? Whatever you want. Having had lots of practice talking to strangers, I'm sure they'll be pretty good at finding things to talk about. The fact that they came right on January 1st makes me think they are excited to have a chance to serve!

 

Thank you for your awesomeness!:D

[Mrs Twain]

I have often told my testimony. I tell how I came to have a personal relationship with Jesus, and how God dramatically changed my life after that. I have found that a lot of LDS people are trying to get to heaven by doing good works, a.k.a. missionary service and other things like that in their religion. I tell them about what the Bible says regarding the concept that we can't work our way to heaven, but that it is only through faith in Jesus that we can be made right with God and go to heaven. I encourage them to read the Bible. If they would like to talk about spritual things with you, I think this is the important discussion to have.

 

As far as other topics, I think you could talk about whatever you are interested in.

 

Just my thoughts since you asked about topics to talk about.

[meggie]

I have often told my testimony. I tell how I came to have a personal relationship with Jesus, and how God dramatically changed my life after that. I have found that a lot of LDS people are trying to get to heaven by doing good works, a.k.a. missionary service and other things like that in their religion. I tell them about what the Bible says regarding the concept that we can't work our way to heaven, but that it is only through faith in Jesus that we can be made right with God and go to heaven. I encourage them to read the Bible. If they would like to talk about spritual things with you, I think this is the important discussion to have.

 

As far as other topics, I think you could talk about whatever you are interested in.

 

Just my thoughts since you asked about topics to talk about.

 

Just to clarify, LDS believe that it is through works AND faith that we are saved. We do all we can, but know that we are imperfect and know that with faith, Christ will make up the difference.

[Xuzi]

I have often told my testimony. I tell how I came to have a personal relationship with Jesus, and how God dramatically changed my life after that. I have found that a lot of LDS people are trying to get to heaven by doing good works, a.k.a. missionary service and other things like that in their religion. I tell them about what the Bible says regarding the concept that we can't work our way to heaven, but that it is only through faith in Jesus that we can be made right with God and go to heaven. I encourage them to read the Bible. If they would like to talk about spritual things with you, I think this is the important discussion to have.

 

As far as other topics, I think you could talk about whatever you are interested in.

 

Just my thoughts since you asked about topics to talk about.

If you went that route, they'd probably politely correct you about what it is we actually believe. ;) (and they do already read their Bibles)

[garddwr]

Hi Nicole,

 

First off, as a former missionary/sister to to a current missionary/mother of future missionaries I just want to say bless you for your kindness. Going to a strange place, knocking on doors of people you don't know, and trying to share a message that you believe wholeheartedly will bless people but that most of them will reject--well, it's not easy to do. And to keep doing day after day after day. I have a special place in my heart for those people who welcomed us with open hearts and hands as friends, even if they weren't interested in our message.

 

As for your specific questions, I think the elders themselves would need to answer them--just ask. It sounds like you've made your intentions pretty clear, which is good. As missionaries, their main job is of course to teach people about the LDS church, so you may be invited again in the future to listen to their message--if you're not interested just explain to them again that you only want to provide a friendly place for them. When I was a missionary we were expected to spend about 4 hours each week in service activities. Some of these were regularly scheduled, like going to an old folks home every week and playing games with them. Others were just things that came up, like the chance to help someone weed their yard. They might be happy to have an appointment to come to your house on the first Friday of every month, help out with a home or yard project, and maybe eat dinner--or whatever kind of arrangement you would like to make.

 

Do be aware that companionships change rather frequently--the same pair of Elders won't stay in one area for more than a few months. Usually one will be moved out and replaced, then maybe a couple of months later the other will be replaced. Areas around the country are organized into missions made up of maybe 150-200 young men and women under the directions of a Mission President and his wife. Every month some missionaries finish their term of service and go home and others arrive to take their place. This drives a general re-organization of companionships throughout the mission. Also, as long as it is young men missionaries in your area you should know they will only come in your home if your husband is there--but you may know that already. Of course young women missionaries (known as Sisters) follow the same rule in reverse--they would only come in the home if the wife is there.

 

Blessings,

Sarah

[Heidi]

Even when I invite the missionaries to our home they share a scripture and a thought with us, and we are already members (so its not to convert us).

 

They will probably like to share a quick message with you, even though you are not interested in becoming a member of their church. From their perspective they are not trying to convert or convince when they share a message (only the Spirit can do that), its more as way of serving you spiritually. They will invite you to learn more, and at that point you just say "no thanks, but you can come back tomorrow and pressure wash my driveway :)" no guilt. Remember its all about service for them: temporal and spiritual.

 

Our local missionaries have lots of "friends" they visit and serve that have no intention of ever becoming members. Its common.

[Melissa in Australia]

I saw some Mormon missionaries the other day. It is the first Mormons I have EVER seen. I was on a long distance country train. I was sort of disappointed to see they didn't offer to help an elderly lady ( late 70's)stow her luggage in the overhead rack. I would have loved to have had a discussion to them about their beliefs, but they spent the whole 4 hour trip getting chat up by a young woman.

[DianeW88]

Well, as the mom of a missionary who just returned home from two years in California in November, I can tell you what he said. He said a couple hours is good for the service, and just tell them you don't want to hear any missionary lessons. They are perfectly happy just to do service for people.

 

Talk to them about anything. Where they are from, their family, your family, faith, service, Christ, what we believe, and any other nagging questions you may have about our church. ;) (Of course we WTM LDS ladies are always happy to address those as well.)

 

It's perfectly ok to tell them you aren't interested in joining the church. You could just tell them a little more about this board, that you've "met" some LDS women on it, and we told you to put them to work. ;) I think they'd enjoy hearing about homeschooling and our little community here.

 

Thanks for your kindness to them!

[Aspasia]

I have no advice about how much work to give them.

 

Most Mormon missionaries are 19-21 year old guys. They don't always get subtle. ;) You might need to repeat the "we are happy in our faith and are not converting" message more than you would like. Or perhaps not. It really depends on the individual missionaries. It might help to remember that Mormons grow up hearing anecdotes about people who swore they would never convert and then did. Persistence is seen as a virtue. So you might be swimming against 20 years of conditioning.

 

This is important to remember. I was an LDS missionary, and i can tell you that there are a lot who are very...enthusiastic about what they're doing. persistence is encouraged because every now and then it is rewarded with success. It's kinda like slot machines: it pays out just frequently enough to keep them coming back for more. :lol:

 

But seriously, if you tell them politely that you're not interested, odds are they will respect that. I wouldn't suggest anything like pp said about teaching them about faith vs works or anything biblical. Trust me, those kids know very well what the Bible says, and that kind of conversation can either make them feel unwelcome or (if you get a really "enthusiastic" missionary) it could lead to a debate and that just makes everyone uncomfortable. But it doesn't sound like you're in this for any religious conversation so you should be fine.

 

Bless you for being so kind and welcoming. That alone is more than missionaries get from most people! I'm sure they're very grateful.

[MamaSheep]

I saw some Mormon missionaries the other day. It is the first Mormons I have EVER seen. I was on a long distance country train. I was sort of disappointed to see they didn't offer to help an elderly lady ( late 70's)stow her luggage in the overhead rack. I would have loved to have had a discussion to them about their beliefs, but they spent the whole 4 hour trip getting chat up by a young woman.

 

That's too bad. As a Mormon I'd have liked them to behave a little differently too. But we're all human. I just wanted to say that if you have questions about our beliefs, I'd be happy to try to answer them, and there are some really smart LDS ladies here who I'm sure would be happy to do the same. :)

 

[To the OP - put 'em to work. It keeps them in shape and out of trouble. ;) ]

[DianeW88]

I have often told my testimony. I tell how I came to have a personal relationship with Jesus, and how God dramatically changed my life after that. I have found that a lot of LDS people are trying to get to heaven by doing good works, a.k.a. missionary service and other things like that in their religion. I tell them about what the Bible says regarding the concept that we can't work our way to heaven, but that it is only through faith in Jesus that we can be made right with God and go to heaven. I encourage them to read the Bible. If they would like to talk about spritual things with you, I think this is the important discussion to have.

 

Just adding my voice to the other LDS ladies to clarify that we do not believe we are saved by works. We believe that it is only through the atonement of Jesus Christ that we are able to return to the presence of our Heavenly Father.

We believe in being obedient and that when Christ said, "be ye therefore perfect" and "let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works", that He meant it. We also believe that "faith without works is dead". Do we believe we can "good work" ourselves into heaven? No. Do we believe the Lord requires us to keep all of His commandments and "feed His sheep"? Absolutely.

 

And we do read the Bible. Regularly. The King James version is what our church uses.

[Dolphin]

Thank you ladies. Keep the advice coming. I know this is the right thing to do, I have just never done it before. Mormon missionaries are as you know a group a lot of people try to avoid. I feel I am going against the stream by inviting them in, but my eyes have been opened.

 

Just as I don't want them to convert me, I will not try to convert them either. I should explain that the faith my family is happy in is Episcopalian (Anglican). We are the nutty ones that embrace spirituality in all people. Very much a you worship your way and we will worship our way.

 

I will ask about the Christmas call,, and I will check with their schedule. We are doing this on a Saturday when my husband is in. So, if that is the case is it ok to have them inside for lunch?

 

Will they be okay being peppered with questions from little ones?

 

I will ask about their call home, that is a good one. I didn't realize that it was only 2 calls a year.

 

Would it be appropriate for my husband to offer them a ride home, or is that just weird?

 

I will talk to them, I know that they are real live people, but I feel I "know" you ladies more.

 

Oh, and other than kindness and some food, is there anything else I should offer?

 

Thanks again.

 

Once again can I say, can we please leave bad missionary stories off this post. I am trying to have my eyes opened and learn more about my LDS friends, both the ones on my doorstep, and here on the boards.

[In2why]

I would feel bad if I had them do service work for me when I know I don't want to become a LDS. I do enjoy chatting with them for a few minutes though about where they are from and how they like our area. I hope no one takes this the wrong way cause I am not trying to be facetious, but strangely enough the fruit I see with LDS and the beliefs they live by, I really admire, I just can't get there with Joseph Smith. Sometimes I wish I could though just for the likemindedness when it comes to life beliefs.

[Spy Car]

It never fails to amaze me that Mormons really get the Christian message in the Bible that "faith without works is dead," but get criticism from some quarters for not being Christian enough, or not understand scripture.

 

Pretty ironic methinks.

 

Bill

[sewingmama]

Will they be okay being peppered with questions from little ones?

 

In general missionaries adore little kids (remember they are just out of being kids themselves). They spend a lot of time messing around with them, playing with them etc when they visit people's homes that have them. My kids LOVE it when the missionaries come to our house because they act like playful big brothers - they will definately not be bothered by questions from the little people ;) My kids ask them all sorts of questions and they patiently answer all of them. There will be the odd missionary who may not be perfectly comfortable with kids but they are usually from a smaller family.

 

Keep in mind that LDS are known for having big families and a lot of missionaries have a ton of little brothers and sister's, nieces and nephews and cousins - they know how to handle them :D

 

Missionary schedules are usually pretty busy - I would keep the work to an hour or two -if they don't finish in the allotted time they will usually be happy to come back and finish.

 

And don't feel bad about asking them to help even if you have no intention to convert. A lot of their mission centres on doing service for others - for LDS or not -every service counts :D Our missionaries are always asking if we know of anyone who needs some help - they are happy to do it with no strings attached.

[Live2Ride]

Thank you ladies. Keep the advice coming. I know this is the right thing to do, I have just never done it before. Mormon missionaries are as you know a group a lot of people try to avoid. I feel I am going against the stream by inviting them in, but my eyes have been opened.

 

Just as I don't want them to convert me, I will not try to convert them either. I should explain that the faith my family is happy in is Episcopalian (Anglican). We are the nutty ones that embrace spirituality in all people. Very much a you worship your way and we will worship our way.

 

I will ask about the Christmas call,, and I will check with their schedule. We are doing this on a Saturday when my husband is in. So, if that is the case is it ok to have them inside for lunch?

 

Will they be okay being peppered with questions from little ones?

 

I will ask about their call home, that is a good one. I didn't realize that it was only 2 calls a year.

 

Would it be appropriate for my husband to offer them a ride home, or is that just weird?

 

I will talk to them, I know that they are real live people, but I feel I "know" you ladies more.

 

Oh, and other than kindness and some food, is there anything else I should offer?

 

Thanks again.

 

Once again can I say, can we please leave bad missionary stories off this post. I am trying to have my eyes opened and learn more about my LDS friends, both the ones on my doorstep, and here on the boards.

 

Questions from little ones are fine. Yeah they can only make 2 phone calls home, MOthers Day and Christmas. Getting a ride home is a good thing, but they may not accept at first. We drive our missionaries around some to help them save their miles. Many missionaries in areas are only allowed so many driving miles per week. They can come in for lunch as long as your husband is home. If it were sister missionaries, then it would be fine to come in with just you home, but they could not come in without you there. The missionaries love to eat and they love to serve. It gives them people to talk to and the ability to serve (and many times a meal and well boys...they love to eat, lol!)

[meggie]

 

Just as I don't want them to convert me, I will not try to convert them either. I should explain that the faith my family is happy in is Episcopalian (Anglican). We are the nutty ones that embrace spirituality in all people. Very much a you worship your way and we will worship our way.

 

 

 

This is one of our very basic and very precious beliefs:

 

11 We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may. (Article of Faith 11)

 

I wouldn't worry about them being overly enthusiastic. Most aren't. If they are, it's usually someone who's a little socially awkward. Most will be happy to serve you and do some good. Because really, it beats getting doors slammed in their face and dogs set on them. And heck, if you're giving them food, so much the better!

 

ETA: sorry for the links. I copied it off the LDS website and don't know how to get rid of them

Edited January 2, 2012 by meggie

[NatashainDFW]

I learned the hard way. Do not offer coffee as they will turn it down. I offered the neighbors coffee when we moved in and quickly learned that that was a no no.

[meggie]

I learned the hard way. Do not offer coffee as they will turn it down. I offered the neighbors coffee when we moved in and quickly learned that that was a no no.

 

Natasha!!! How the heck are you? I was thinking about you the other day, will PM you now :D

[NatashainDFW]

Natasha!!! How the heck are you? I was thinking about you the other day, will PM you now :D

 

I am alive. Not much else to say about that lol.

[Melissa in Australia]

Once again can I say, can we please leave bad missionary stories off this post. I am trying to have my eyes opened and learn more about my LDS friends, both the ones on my doorstep, and here on the boards.

 

sorry.

[Melissa in Australia]

That's too bad. As a Mormon I'd have liked them to behave a little differently too. But we're all human. I just wanted to say that if you have questions about our beliefs, I'd be happy to try to answer them, and there are some really smart LDS ladies here who I'm sure would be happy to do the same. :)

 

[To the OP - put 'em to work. It keeps them in shape and out of trouble. ;) ]

 

thank you

I will pm you :001_smile:

[gardenmom5]

We are doing this on a Saturday when my husband is in. So, if that is the case is it ok to have them inside for lunch?

With your husband there, it should be fine.

 

 

Will they be okay being peppered with questions from little ones?

 

some have younger siblings, and are quite familiar with being peppered with questions by little ones. :D

 

 

I will ask about their call home, that is a good one. I didn't realize that it was only 2 calls a year.

 

Would it be appropriate for my husband to offer them a ride home, or is that just weird?

 

 

I also got a brief phone call from my daughter from the airport during her layover at LAX - she was heading to Osorno, Chile. (beautiful country). It was an approved phone call specific to the circumstances. (it was a week before mother's day, and I think there was some information exchanged for setting up the mother's day phone call.) Honestly, I don't remember the specifics because I wasn't expecting it.

 

your husband can give them a ride home - assuming they are walking. ;)

 

I will be sending my two older sons off on missions this year, so it's always nice to hear there are people who want to be nice to them. (with any luck, we'll have call #1 by the end of the month. re: we'll know where he's going.)

[Melinda in VT]

I learned the hard way. Do not offer coffee as they will turn it down. I offered the neighbors coffee when we moved in and quickly learned that that was a no no.

 

Oh yes, this. Drinks get tricky with Mormons. :D Coffee and tea (herbal is ok, but not green tea) will be refused. Really hardline people like I was will also refuse any soda with caffeine in it. (On the other hand, I know plenty of Mormons who live on Diet Coke, so this really varies from person to person.)

[armymomma]

We often get missionaries stopping by when they would see our 15 passenger van and Idaho plates .... Far from Idaho. They always think we might be LDS. They are usually just happy to hang out and chat and ask where in Idaho we are from, etc. I tell them my dh's family was LDS and have converted, and I have never had them try to convert us or even bring up LDS teachings. I personally don't feel comfortable asking them to help ... But they are always very pleasant and polite and glad for a cold caffeine free drink.

[love2read]

I've learned so much from this thread, thank you. We rarely get missionaries and I usually just say "not interested" but next time I'll bring out some lemonade and cookies, chat and see if they want to stay for dinner.

 

And just where do they eat their meals normally?

[Xuzi]

I've learned so much from this thread, thank you. We rarely get missionaries and I usually just say "not interested" but next time I'll bring out some lemonade and cookies, chat and see if they want to stay for dinner.

 

And just where do they eat their meals normally?

 

Breakfast and lunch they usually provide for themselves.They have one preparation day, often called "P-Day", during the week that they use to go grocery shopping, do laundry, things like that, and they'll buy food for their breakfasts and lunches. Dinner typically comes from members of the LDS congregation whose geographical boundaries they're assigned to work in. A calendar is passed around to members of the congregation to sign up to feed the missionaries a meal. We fed ours the day after Christmas, and we'll be having them over again later this month. :)

[MamaSheep]

Breakfast and lunch they usually provide for themselves.They have one preparation day, often called "P-Day", during the week that they use to go grocery shopping, do laundry, things like that, and they'll buy food for their breakfasts and lunches. Dinner typically comes from members of the LDS congregation whose geographical boundaries they're assigned to work in. A calendar is passed around to members of the congregation to sign up to feed the missionaries a meal. We fed ours the day after Christmas, and we'll be having them over again later this month. :)

 

I miss feeding the missionaries. Where we live now we have one set of missionaries shared by three or four STAKES, so we rarely even get to see them at church. Where we used to live we had two companionships just in our one little ward, so we got to have them over all the time. It was fun hearing about wherever it was they came from, and interesting experiences they'd had during the week.

[Heidi]

I hope no one takes this the wrong way cause I am not trying to be facetious, but strangely enough the fruit I see with LDS and the beliefs they live by, I really admire, I just can't get there with Joseph Smith. Sometimes I wish I could though just for the likemindedness when it comes to life beliefs.

 

Well, I don't think anyone blames you for not believing Joseph Smith. ;) I certainly wouldn't believe him either! God appeared to him and called him as a Prophet to restore His church??? ... yeah... right.

 

But with the calling of a prophet, God also provided "fruit" by which we can know if he is false or not. (See Matthew 7:15-20)

 

If you really want to know what members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints believe, and how we can possibly believe the story of Joseph Smith, read The Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ. (or learn more about it here)

 

The Book of Mormon is the cornerstone of our religion. The church stands or falls on the truthfulness of that book. If the book is true, then Joseph Smith really saw what he said he saw, and this IS the Church of Jesus Christ. If the book is false, then run far away from it and call us all crazy, because it is just another church.

 

But you can't do either if you don't read the Book of Mormon and find out for yourself.

 

:D

[garddwr]

Whether the missionaries get meals from members and how often really varies from place to place. I served in an area without many members, and we were only invited to dinner maybe once a month, as often by non-members as by members. I sure appreciated those meals! Otherwise we were on our own...

 

--Sarah

[garddwr]

I would have loved to have had a discussion to them about their beliefs, but they spent the whole 4 hour trip getting chat up by a young woman.

 

Hi Melissa,

Your experience brought back memories. In my mission area we had a real issue with young women being more interested in the young Elders themselves than in their message. The Elders we worked with had a good solution--when they made contact with a young woman who seemed interested in meeting with them, they would ask for permission to pass her information on to us after the initial discussion. If the young woman was still interested in meeting with Sister missionaries, we knew she really was interested in the gospel message. A lot of them chose not to continue meeting--after all, it was the clean-cut, friendly young men in suits that had really drawn their attention!:lol:

I'm also happy to answer any questions you may have. One of my mission companions was from Australia--I ran into her a couple of years ago in Los Angeles of all places, we had lost contact but she was in the States for a visit with a friend.

 

Blessings,

Sarah

Edited January 2, 2012 by thegardener
fix a typo

[Mrs Twain]

Just adding my voice to the other LDS ladies to clarify that we do not believe we are saved by works. We believe that it is only through the atonement of Jesus Christ that we are able to return to the presence of our Heavenly Father.

We believe in being obedient and that when Christ said, "be ye therefore perfect" and "let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works", that He meant it. We also believe that "faith without works is dead". Do we believe we can "good work" ourselves into heaven? No. Do we believe the Lord requires us to keep all of His commandments and "feed His sheep"? Absolutely.

 

And we do read the Bible. Regularly. The King James version is what our church uses.

 

Just to clarify, LDS believe that it is through works AND faith that we are saved. We do all we can, but know that we are imperfect and know that with faith, Christ will make up the difference.

 

When the LDS people come to your door, they usually say what DianeW88 said. Of the LDS people I have known, though, what Meggie said is how they actually think. This was why I said that I like to discuss the faith versus works concept according to the Bible. If you study the Bible, it says that only a blood sacrifice can take away sins and make a person right with God. We can't get anywhere at all by trying to be good, doing good works, or making ourselves good enough. That is why I like to talk about how trusting in Jesus' sacrifice is the way to be forgiven of sin and be made right with God according to the Bible. Good works are what comes as a result of salvation, not what helps us get to salvation. The issue is that the guys at the door usually only want to say what DianneW88 said, so that it is difficult to have this discussion.

 

The Book of Mormon is the cornerstone of our religion. The church stands or falls on the truthfulness of that book. If the book is true, then Joseph Smith really saw what he said he saw, and this IS the Church of Jesus Christ. If the book is false, then run far away from it and call us all crazy, because it is just another church.

 

:D

 

What hmsmith said is also true. The Book of Mormon is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. However, after I tell the guys at the door that I am a Christian, they usually try to convince me that the Bible is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. They usually don't want to talk about the Book of Mormon.

 

This has been my experience after talking to a lot of LDS who have come to my door.

[Xuzi]

When the LDS people come to your door, they usually say what DianeW88 said. Of the LDS people I have known, though, what Meggie said is how they actually think. This was why I said that I like to discuss the faith versus works concept according to the Bible. If you study the Bible, it says that only a blood sacrifice can take away sins and make a person right with God. We can't get anywhere at all by trying to be good, doing good works, or making ourselves good enough. That is why I like to talk about how trusting in Jesus' sacrifice is the way to be forgiven of sin and be made right with God according to the Bible. Good works are what comes as a result of salvation, not what helps us get to salvation. The issue is that the guys at the door usually only want to say what DianneW88 said, so that it is difficult to have this discussion.

 

 

 

What hmsmith said is also true. The Book of Mormon is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. However, after I tell the guys at the door that I am a Christian, they usually try to convince me that the Bible is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. They usually don't want to talk about the Book of Mormon.

 

This has been my experience after talking to a lot of LDS who have come to my door.

 

We absolutely believe that it's the Atonement of Jesus Christ that takes away our sins, not our good works. Our good works are an expression of our Faith and Trust in our Savior, and in obedience to His Commandments. Of course we can never be "good enough" to qualify to enter the presence of the Father, which is why we need the Atoning Blood of Christ to cleanse us of our sins because we ALL "fall short". We'd be utterly lost without it. :confused:

[dangermom]

When the LDS people come to your door, they usually say what DianeW88 said. Of the LDS people I have known, though, what Meggie said is how they actually think. This was why I said that I like to discuss the faith versus works concept according to the Bible. If you study the Bible, it says that only a blood sacrifice can take away sins and make a person right with God. We can't get anywhere at all by trying to be good, doing good works, or making ourselves good enough. That is why I like to talk about how trusting in Jesus' sacrifice is the way to be forgiven of sin and be made right with God according to the Bible. Good works are what comes as a result of salvation, not what helps us get to salvation. The issue is that the guys at the door usually only want to say what DianneW88 said, so that it is difficult to have this discussion.

To a Mormon, those two statements look a lot alike; we don't spend a lot of time getting into fine distinctions, and what do you call ordinances like baptism--a work or a faith? It's both. An LDS person will agree with your statement about sacrifice--that's what the Atonement is for. But that doesn't mean that we aren't supposed to do the best we can in the way of works too.

 

What hmsmith said is also true. The Book of Mormon is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. However, after I tell the guys at the door that I am a Christian, they usually try to convince me that the Bible is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. They usually don't want to talk about the Book of Mormon.

 

This has been my experience after talking to a lot of LDS who have come to my door.

They're probably trying to take the first step by assuring you that we do, actually, believe in the Bible and have some common ground there. Many people think we've thrown it out. But you can't take the missionary discussions without reading the Book of Mormon, so I'd be surprised if missionaries didn't want to give you one. Giving out Books of Mormon is one of their favorite things to do.

[Kathryn]

I'm learning a lot on this thread! It never ever would have occurred to me to ask missionaries to do "work" when I have no intention of becoming LDS. May I ask a few questions? Where do missionaries stay? How is money worked out (like, housing, food, clothing, transportation, spending money, etc.)?

[MamaSheep]

What hmsmith said is also true. The Book of Mormon is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. However, after I tell the guys at the door that I am a Christian, they usually try to convince me that the Bible is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. They usually don't want to talk about the Book of Mormon.

 

This has been my experience after talking to a lot of LDS who have come to my door.

 

I've never been a missionary, but I have to admit that I talk more to Christians about the Bible than about the Book of Mormon. It's not because I don't want to talk about the Book of Mormon, though, it's just because the Bible is where we have common ground. Kind of like I try not to go on and on about homeschool when I'm with people who don't know much about it. Instead, I talk about the soccer team, or the community arts program, or whatever it is that we do have in common.

[Melinda in VT]

When the LDS people come to your door, they usually say what DianeW88 said. Of the LDS people I have known, though, what Meggie said is how they actually think. This was why I said that I like to discuss the faith versus works concept according to the Bible. If you study the Bible, it says that only a blood sacrifice can take away sins and make a person right with God. We can't get anywhere at all by trying to be good, doing good works, or making ourselves good enough. That is why I like to talk about how trusting in Jesus' sacrifice is the way to be forgiven of sin and be made right with God according to the Bible. Good works are what comes as a result of salvation, not what helps us get to salvation. The issue is that the guys at the door usually only want to say what DianneW88 said, so that it is difficult to have this discussion.

 

Disclaimer: I am a former Mormon. I was born and raised in the LDS church, graduated from BYU, was married in the temple, etc. I left Mormonism at the age of 30, but I was an active participant up until then.

 

Mormon teaching is that works without Jesus' atonement will get you no where. Without Jesus, none of us will ever return to the presence of God.

 

However, faith in Jesus will not get you back to the presence of God all by itself. You must also perform certain ordinances (baptism in the LDS church and endowment in an LDS temple being the two main ones). If you don't have the ordinances, you won't be a lake of fire and brimstone, but you also won't be with God.

 

Many non-Mormons latch onto the ordinances and proof that Mormons believe we are saved by works. However, unless you are a universalist (one who believes that Jesus' atonement saved everyone, believer or not), you also believe that there is something required of you.

 

To quote Marcus Borg and John Dominic Crossan, "For other Protestants, including even many descendants of Luther, Paul's theology has been understood not as the abolition of requirements, but as the new requirement--namely, believing his theology is what we must do in order to be saved."

[Heidi]

I'm learning a lot on this thread! It never ever would have occurred to me to ask missionaries to do "work" when I have no intention of becoming LDS. May I ask a few questions? Where do missionaries stay? How is money worked out (like, housing, food, clothing, transportation, spending money, etc.)?

 

Im quoting you so your question doesn't get lost and the other ladies can answer. Our local missionaries stay in an apartment in town. The missionaries pay for their own mission. It cost about 10k for the whole 2 years. Some young men save their pennies, some have family & friends donate towards it. They then receive a monthy allowance from it while on their mission.

 

I don't know the day to day details. Im sure others do. If no one anwers soon i'll get dh on here to explain it from what he remembers.

Edited January 2, 2012 by hmsmith

[meggie]

When the LDS people come to your door, they usually say what DianeW88 said. Of the LDS people I have known, though, what Meggie said is how they actually think. This was why I said that I like to discuss the faith versus works concept according to the Bible. If you study the Bible, it says that only a blood sacrifice can take away sins and make a person right with God. We can't get anywhere at all by trying to be good, doing good works, or making ourselves good enough. That is why I like to talk about how trusting in Jesus' sacrifice is the way to be forgiven of sin and be made right with God according to the Bible. Good works are what comes as a result of salvation, not what helps us get to salvation. The issue is that the guys at the door usually only want to say what DianneW88 said, so that it is difficult to have this discussion.

 

 

 

What hmsmith said is also true. The Book of Mormon is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. However, after I tell the guys at the door that I am a Christian, they usually try to convince me that the Bible is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. They usually don't want to talk about the Book of Mormon.

 

This has been my experience after talking to a lot of LDS who have come to my door.

 

I'm sorry, I think I'm being confusing or something. To me, my statement matches what Diane said. I agree with it 100%. I don't know what exactly you think are the differences in the statements. I'm sorry if I'm being unclear at all.

I'm learning a lot on this thread! It never ever would have occurred to me to ask missionaries to do "work" when I have no intention of becoming LDS. May I ask a few questions? Where do missionaries stay? How is money worked out (like, housing, food, clothing, transportation, spending money, etc.)?

 

They usually stay in an apartment in the area. Depending on how many missionaries there are in that area, they might share the apartment with them. For money, each month parents put a set amount of money in the mission fund (I think it's about $450/month right now). Every month the church puts some of that money into a bank account for each missionary. They spend it at their discretion. I think the mission office takes care of rent, utilities, etc. (Someone who's been on a mission can correct me if that is wrong.) Once a week they are able to go grocery shopping, do laundry, run some errands, email their families, etc. They try to set up appointments with people in the area for meals. If they don't have any, they're on their own.

 

Some missionaries ride bikes, some have cars provided by the mission office. For clothing, they usually wear suits, but they might have a few pieces of everyday wear. Not much, since they're moving all the time, they usually have about two suitcases worth of stuff.

[dangermom]

I'm learning a lot on this thread! It never ever would have occurred to me to ask missionaries to do "work" when I have no intention of becoming LDS. May I ask a few questions? Where do missionaries stay? How is money worked out (like, housing, food, clothing, transportation, spending money, etc.)?

 

Missionaries mostly live in rented apartments in twos or fours. It costs, I think, $350/month to be a missionary* and you're supposed to try to save up as much as you can beforehand. People also donate to a fund that supports missionaries who don't have enough, and it's pretty common for an older, wealthier couple to quietly help support a missionary from a less-wealthy family. You buy your own clothes--you should leave with a full wardrobe and then replace what you need to. Transportation varies with location--some missionaries have bikes, some cars (they belong to the mission office), and some walk/take the bus. Missionaries are not allowed to leave their districts without some special reason. You're supposed to have your own spending money (not much) but I'm not sure exactly how that works.

 

That's a short overview, hope it helps. :)

 

 

*the cost is averaged out for everyone regardless of location because it varies so much. When I was a kid, it was different and a mission in Japan cost way more than a mission in Chile, but you can't only send rich kids to Japan so they averaged it out.

[justamouse]

I think it was during the Spring two boys stopped here and we had dinner and about 3 hours of great conversation and lots of laughs.

 

They are wonderful kids. Enjoy your visit.

[DianeW88]

When the LDS people come to your door, they usually say what DianeW88 said. Of the LDS people I have known, though, what Meggie said is how they actually think. This was why I said that I like to discuss the faith versus works concept according to the Bible. If you study the Bible, it says that only a blood sacrifice can take away sins and make a person right with God. We can't get anywhere at all by trying to be good, doing good works, or making ourselves good enough. That is why I like to talk about how trusting in Jesus' sacrifice is the way to be forgiven of sin and be made right with God according to the Bible. Good works are what comes as a result of salvation, not what helps us get to salvation. The issue is that the guys at the door usually only want to say what DianneW88 said, so that it is difficult to have this discussion.

 

 

 

What hmsmith said is also true. The Book of Mormon is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. However, after I tell the guys at the door that I am a Christian, they usually try to convince me that the Bible is the cornerstone of the LDS religion. They usually don't want to talk about the Book of Mormon.

 

This has been my experience after talking to a lot of LDS who have come to my door.

 

What I have said in my statement is what I believe. It is not a "publicity statement" or something that we say to non-Mormons. It is our faith. It is a sincere expression of our deep-seated conviction. We believe that the ONLY way we can return to heaven is because of the sacrifice and death of His son, Jesus Christ. It is that simple. Yes, we believe in good works. Isn't that something all Christians, regardless of denomination, should do? Didn't Christ Himself tell us to serve others and do good to those around us? To love our neighbors as ourselves?

 

As a Latter-day Saint, frankly I'm confused when other Christians say it isn't necessary to do good works in this life. To me, Christ was pretty clear on that statement...it is. Will it redeem you in the end without faith in the atonement? No.

 

However, let me say it again, "Faith without works is dead." If you proclaim yourself to be truly converted and a follower of Jesus Christ, you will do good works. You will want to be like Him. You will want to show Christ-like love to others and extend yourself in service because that is how He wants you to treat people. It isn't your salvation, it is your expression of faith and devotion to your Savior. And if you are truly a believer.....by your fruits shall we know you.

[MamaSheep]

What I have said in my statement is what I believe. It is not a "publicity statement" or something that we say to non-Mormons. It is our faith. It is a sincere expression of our deep-seated conviction. We believe that the ONLY way we can return to heaven is because of the sacrifice and death of His son, Jesus Christ. It is that simple. Yes, we believe in good works. Isn't that something all Christians, regardless of denomination, should do? Didn't Christ Himself tell us to serve others and do good to those around us? To love our neighbors as ourselves?

 

As a Latter-day Saint, frankly I'm confused when other Christians say it isn't necessary to do good works in this life. To me, Christ was pretty clear on that statement...it is. Will it redeem you in the end without faith in the atonement? No.

 

However, let me say it again, "Faith without works is dead." If you proclaim yourself to be truly converted and a follower of Jesus Christ, you will do good works. You will want to be like Him. You will want to show Christ-like love to others and extend yourself in service because that is how He wants you to treat people. It isn't your salvation, it is your expression of faith and devotion to your Savior. And if you are truly a believer.....by your fruits shall we know you.

 

:iagree:

That confuses me too, Diane. How does a person "believe in" Jesus without really "believing" and taking to heart the things Jesus taught? Like "inasmuch as ye have done it unto the least of these ye have done it unto me" (this is a paraphrase, not an exact quote; I'm hurrying and not looking things up). Or like, "go the extra mile". Or "If ye love me keep my commandments". Or "by this shall all men know ye are my disciples--if ye have love one to another". It seems odd to me that some people who claim to "believe in" Jesus seem to think he didn't mean all that, or didn't mean them, or...I dunno. Something. Or they think they can take advantage of the atonement while completely ignoring everything else about Jesus. I mean, of COURSE one doesn't "earn" salvation through works, but how does one "believe in" Christ without "believing" what he said and trying to live as he taught? I mean...if he said that if we love him we should keep his commandments, then what are we saying when we don't keep his commandments? Anyway...it confuses me too.

 

ETA: You know, I think this is one of those areas where we often wind up talking past one another in discussions with Christians of other faiths, without either "side" really understanding what the other is trying to get at. They say, "Have faith and be saved," and we think they mean works are irrelevant, so we say, "Sure, and show that faith through your works," and they think we mean faith is irrelevant. So they put even more emphasis on faith in order to convince us of it's importance, which we take as a denial that works come into the picture at all, so we put more emphasis on showing faith through works, which they take as a denial of the necessity of faith, and it becomes a vicious cycle. In reality I think we're much closer to each other than we realize, as they generally (I know...generalizations can be dangerous) believe that when a person truly has faith it shows in how they live--that good works are the fruit of faith, and we believe that ordinances and service and whatnot are ONE way we express and strengthen our faith. But yeah...

Edited January 2, 2012 by MamaSheep

[mommaduck]

Please, please, please, let's not turn this into another debate!

 

I don't/won't agree with the LDS on many things. However, it is interesting to hear how they define terms and how they view things. This thread is not a debate thread. May we please save that for another thread in a few weeks or a few months from now? We just got a bunch of very good religious threads shut down, including some that were very personal and celebratory in nature (one where we should just be happy for those that are happy, kwim?).

 

*sigh*

[gardenmom5]

I'm learning a lot on this thread! It never ever would have occurred to me to ask missionaries to do "work" when I have no intention of becoming LDS. May I ask a few questions? Where do missionaries stay? How is money worked out (like, housing, food, clothing, transportation, spending money, etc.)?

 

Missionaries live in apartments, or spare rooms in members homes. varies according to mission and location.

Missionaries save money beforehand and are self-supporting. missionaries who can't pay for the whole thing (especially those from countries with low value currency), can receive financial help from members. they do have a "weekly allowance" (can't remember the term, but that's the idea) for groceries, sundries, souveniers, etc. that sum is adjusted according to where they serve.

 

some missionaries do their own wash and cook their own meals - other missions have someone who does it for them. (especially if the area is more primitive and more time is required to do those basics.).

 

as someone mentioned, they have several hours one day a week - Pday, to write letters, reports, grocery shop, sight-see within their area, wash, mend clothes, etc. it is not the entire day, usually they are back to 'working' in the evening. My daughter wrote her letters to us, and weekly reports at an internet cafe (she was in chile) where she and her companion spent about an hour once a week (and if she was sick - we didn't hear from her. Happend a few times, but I knew if something was really wrong, I'd hear about it. Although once she was just so busy that she never made it to the internet cafe.). Other letters could be printed off to be read later, and handwritten responses written during odd free moments.

 

transportation on a daily basis ranges and varies by mission from walking, bikes, cars, buses, commuter trains/subway, the back of a farmer's hay wagon (my nephew in romania - it was available.), to trains, airplanes or boats when transfering from one area to another depending upon size of area.

Edited January 2, 2012 by gardenmom5

[DianeW88]

Please, please, please, let's not turn this into another debate!

 

I don't/won't agree with the LDS on many things. However, it is interesting to hear how they define terms and how they view things. This thread is not a debate thread. May we please save that for another thread in a few weeks or a few months from now? We just got a bunch of very good religious threads shut down, including some that were very personal and celebratory in nature (one where we should just be happy for those that are happy, kwim?).

 

*sigh*

 

I promise I'm not trying to start a debate. Just correcting a previous poster's misstatement of my beliefs. I want everyone to be clear that what I said is indeed what I believe. I also wanted to expand on that so others can understand WHY we think good works are so important to our faith.

 

It is not my intention to stir up any controversy or debate anyone on the matter. I'm happy to answer any questions people have, but I won't argue the points. I truly believe that faith is a personal thing and everyone should follow their own convictions. I, too, love learning about other peoples religions and what their beliefs are...I find it fascinating and I always come away better for it.

 

So please folks....ask away! We're always happy to answer questions and clarify any misinformation about the LDS faith. And, hoo boy, there is a lot of misinformation out there. :lol:

[Kathryn]

Thank you to those who answered my questions!