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We are active members of a small Protestant church (experienced a split 2 yrs ago) and recently discovered that a family with upper elementary and middle school-aged dc left because "the dc were bored".

 

Here are my ?'s:

1. What do you expect from your Sunday School dept in relation to teaching your dc? I mean, what teaching style do you expect, ie: fun, light-hearted Biblical teaching or Bible study teaching?

 

2.Is boredom in a few kids at church something to address or not? If so, how should it be addressed? Who takes responsibility for it?

 

I would do a poll if I knew how...

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I think what you are seeing is a problem teachers in every venue - Sunday school, regular school, outside classes - are facing. With all the electronic media kids are immersed in, they are used to being "entertained" and have a hard time staying engaged if something isn't flashy enough. Our youth minister and I discussed this recently. She asked if my boys were "having fun" in their Sunday school classes. Fun? I'm not really sure. Each week afterwards I ask what they learned, not if they had fun. But yes, because my DSs are used to seeing learning as interesting, they enjoy the classes.

 

Off my soapbox. What I expect of Sunday school is Biblical teaching, and by middle school that teaching encourages discussion of how the teaching applies to the kids lives. Lecturing in the absence of that discussion would be "boring," but I think kids enjoy being offered the chance to explore and disucss topics.

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I expect Sunday School and Children's Church to keep my kids engaged. Entertained? Hmmm....that could be a part of keeping them engaged. But no, I do not expect them to be entertained. I expect them to find fun and kid friendly ways to teach my kids Biblical truths, stories, knowledge, and scripture. But, of course, my kids main way of learning of those things is here at home.

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I think what you are seeing is a problem teachers in every venue - Sunday school, regular school, outside classes - are facing. With all the electronic media kids are immersed in, they are used to being "entertained" and have a hard time staying engaged if something isn't flashy enough. Our youth minister and I discussed this recently. She asked if my boys were "having fun" in their Sunday school classes. Fun? I'm not really sure. Each week afterwards I ask what they learned, not if they had fun. But yes, because my DSs are used to seeing learning as interesting, they enjoy the classes.

 

Off my soapbox. What I expect of Sunday school is Biblical teaching, and by middle school that teaching encourages discussion of how the teaching applies to the kids lives. Lecturing in the absence of that discussion would be "boring," but I think kids enjoy being offered the chance to explore and disucss topics.

 

That's interesting: we've had the opposite problem. My kids are often bored in SS because they already know the stuff being taught & because there's so much hype. Yeah, sometimes it's fun, but a lot of the times, it comes across as trying too hard w/out any substance.

 

OP, I don't know the answers to your questions. I think it's important to accept that one church won't fit everybody's needs. Are the other children attending getting what they need? If so, I wouldn't worry too much about changing anything, necessarily.

 

If these were practically the only children in the church (a situation I've seen often), no amount of teaching is likely to make up for the lack of children or children's programming. (Please--nobody pick a fight based on the word "programming"--I mean it in a very loose sense.)

 

The most important thing, imo, is to respect children at the church level. They are not distractions to be swept into the other room; they are not miniature adults w/ the same needs as adults; they are not all the same as ea other; they do not need a bunch of volunteer baby-sitters. Sometimes I find it...funny? interesting? scandalous? that we'll pay a pastor, a co-pastor, a secretary, a music person, even a pianist, but not a children's pastor of some sort. I mean...I know most churches pay *somebody* for the children (ours didn't--guess how I feel about that?)--but there seems to *often* be a disparity. A huge one.

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I would want to know more about why they were "bored." My dc have recently been complaining about being "bored" at church. When we asked more in-depth questions about it they are bored with the silly, meaningless games. They are complaining that they are hearing the same lessons they heard when they were in pre-school and elementary school with no more depth than before. They want something more serious and more meaningful.

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I think what you are seeing is a problem teachers in every venue - Sunday school, regular school, outside classes - are facing. With all the electronic media kids are immersed in, they are used to being "entertained" and have a hard time staying engaged if something isn't flashy enough. Our youth minister and I discussed this recently. She asked if my boys were "having fun" in their Sunday school classes. Fun? I'm not really sure. Each week afterwards I ask what they learned, not if they had fun. But yes, because my DSs are used to seeing learning as interesting, they enjoy the classes.

 

Off my soapbox. What I expect of Sunday school is Biblical teaching, and by middle school that teaching encourages discussion of how the teaching applies to the kids lives. Lecturing in the absence of that discussion would be "boring," but I think kids enjoy being offered the chance to explore and disucss topics.

 

:iagree: and we ask the same bolded question.

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I expect Biblical teaching at an appropriate level and godly leaders who love the Lord and set a good example for the children in their care.

And if they can have some fun there as well, that's the cherry on top. I would never leave a Biblically grounded church for that reason. After all, we are there to worship Christ, not be entertained.

Edited by Nancy in SoCal
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We had a family leave our church because we didn't have a Sunday School option for their 8 year old son. At the time we were still a new church, fairly small and he was the only child in his age group (all the other children were 3 and 4 years old).

 

They (the parents) loved the church, loved the teaching and felt they were being spiritually fed.

 

I personally, don't get it. To be completely honest I think it's asinine. To me, Sunday School is a nice option for my child, I'm glad we are able to offer it, but it's not a mandatory prerequisite in a church.

 

Children should get most of their spiritual teaching at home, from their parents. If they get a little extra at church on Sunday, wonderful, but the primary responsibility should be with the parents. If there was no Sunday School option for ds and we were happy at a church - getting good teaching and fellowship there is no way we'd leave over Sunday School. He'd sit upstairs with us and that would be the end of it.

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I do not know how to quote multiple responses so I'll give a general Thank you for reminding me that there are many valid variables which can lead to boredom in SS. I am a SS teacher myself, so this hit close to home, although I had not taught the particular dc for a few years since I am a 1st - 2nd grade SS teacher.

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We left a church because there was nothing there for our 12yo dd. Dh had been feeling increasingly convicted over the last year. Then we finally decided to take the plunge and move. Dd went from maybe having only one other child in her class to having around 20. We didn't move so she would be entertained. We moved so that she could develop some good friendships with other young people who had the same religious beliefs. The teen years are hard and we wanted to fortify her with as many other kids of our religion as possible.

 

She told me about two months after we started attending the new church that she had felt a bit bad about how she used to wake up on Sunday mornings and try to come up with an excuse for why she shouldn't have to go to church. Now, she said, she starts getting excited around Tuesday about the coming Sunday.

 

No, we don't go to church to be entertained. But dd is at that age where she literally craves social interaction. By finding a church where she can get this, we no longer have to deal with any reluctance related to church attendance. And that alone is worth an awful lot in my book.

 

FWIW, the new church does have a paid Director of Children's Ministry, a wonderful woman who has created a very welcoming program.

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I think when people leave a church, it can be sad and awkward, and those who are left may not get a clear picture of exactly why it happened-- gossip, etc. Who knows why they were bored-- maybe they already knew the material, or maybe the teacher was not really into it, or whether that was the family's excuse.

I teach S.S.-- for the first time this year-- the first thing I did was refuse to use any workbooks. I don't do any crafts. I teach them and then I ask, ask, ask questions which elicit the material I taught. The first class the kids were surprised. Since then they have been engaged, all with their hands up. If I see them all looking bored, I change track fast. I let them ask me questions and then I address them. The first and most basic lesson I want them to learn is that God is interesting.

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I have been asking myself this question a lot lately. I recently began being a "teacher helper" for my DD's children's church. We have a small church and SS isn't available, and the age range is wide (grades 1-6). I think this truly make the job hard. However, I find the bought curriculum to be very babyish and watered down. I have a very hard time making the scriptures they come up with match the lesson they want learned (by "they" I refer to the curriculum makers). I think the whole program would be better off just reading scripture and having leading discussions. Possibly using this memory age group to learn the books of the Bible, the ten commandments, etc.... This doesn't mean lacking in fun or not being engaging, just being meaty.

Then here is the question I am facing... am I the instrument of change (Lara the boat rocker) or do I have faith that God will move the hearts of the leaders to make a better program?

 

 

Lara

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I personally, don't get it. To be completely honest I think it's asinine. .

 

That's too bad - As a parent I do consider the Biblical teaching of my children when finding a church. I value the input of other Christian adult mentors in my children's life. And I have been on the receiving end of it myself growing up in the church. I happen to feel very strongly that that church should not limit its preaching and teaching towards the adults only.

 

As to the questions posed by the OP:

1) I expect sound Biblical teaching of the scriptures and doctrines that is carefully planned out to benefit not only the individuals but also the life of the church body. Not a flashy, fun, entertaining kids program.

2) There will always be bored kids. Our job is to teach them the Word. It is not the church's responsibility to entertain, but the church can recruit and train up teachers that will be effective in communicating God's word to the children to whom they minister.

Edited by Brenda in FL
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1) I expect sound Biblical teaching of the scriptures and doctrines that is carefully planned out to benefit not only the individuals but also the life of the church body. Not a flashy, fun, entertaining kids program.

 

2) There will always be bored kids. Our job is to teach them the Word. It is not the church's responsibility to entertain, but the church can recruit and train up teachers that will be effective in communicating God's word to the children to whom they minister.

 

Both Points are well-taken and also what I would hope for my church. Both large and small churches are limited by those willing to serve.

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I have been torn over this.....we attend a small church that cannot always offer what the larger churches can offer....but I remind myself that Jesus told parables for lessons similar to stories we can tell but no where does it say he "entertained" his audience. I remember being "bored" in church when I was a kid....I also remember wanting to go to church more for a social event than learning (at least until I got older). Not that it is wrong to fellowship with other Christians but it can be construed wrong.

 

What I have noticed in the different children in our church, is the "entertainment" they are used to.....in this day of the world, the TV, radio, video games, etc., are all based on a "3 minute" time frame before they change direction.....so this may be why we get the "boredom" excuse.

 

I also don't think that the parents should allow their children to control where they attend church or what class they go to......unless it is Biblically sound reasoning.

 

I think if we just do our best, the Lord will do the rest.

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I would want to know more about why they were "bored." My dc have recently been complaining about being "bored" at church. When we asked more in-depth questions about it they are bored with the silly, meaningless games. They are complaining that they are hearing the same lessons they heard when they were in pre-school and elementary school with no more depth than before. They want something more serious and more meaningful.

I think there is a lot of truth to this. My son regularly invites other kids to our church on Sunday and Wednesday and to youth group activities. Our youth ministers do nothing fancy. After a directed Bible study there might be time for a game of catch and a snack, usually cheap cookies and water or koolaid. I can't tell you how many kids have come out with wide eyes and said, "Wow, I really like your church. They actually teach you stuff when you come here!" Kids want to be engaged and learn, at their level.

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I have been asking myself this question a lot lately. I recently began being a "teacher helper" for my DD's children's church. We have a small church and SS isn't available, and the age range is wide (grades 1-6). I think this truly make the job hard. However, I find the bought curriculum to be very babyish and watered down. I have a very hard time making the scriptures they come up with match the lesson they want learned (by "they" I refer to the curriculum makers). I think the whole program would be better off just reading scripture and having leading discussions. Possibly using this memory age group to learn the books of the Bible, the ten commandments, etc.... This doesn't mean lacking in fun or not being engaging, just being meaty.

Then here is the question I am facing... am I the instrument of change (Lara the boat rocker) or do I have faith that God will move the hearts of the leaders to make a better program?

 

 

Lara

 

This is exactly what I found with our church as well. I took over as SS Superintendant and I *really* didn't like any of the package materials. So, we're doing a WTM version of SS. I've mapped out a four year rotation so that we cover the Bible in four years. There is a strong focus on memory work (the kids are learning the books of the OT right now). For the youngers we use the Ergemeier's Story Bible, for the olders we use Scripture Adventures (it uses actual scripture). We have a 15 minute large group time before they split into smaller groups. So far I think we're doing Ok :)

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well, I think it's the generation. Kids want to be entertained. Mine are good at situations but they still get bored sometimes. And when we did the small church with no kid programs my kids started sitting with us instead and my son especially lost a lot of interest where he had been very strong in his faith.

 

We are back in a large church now with kid programs galore. My kids love church again, and my son has really gotten into the discipleship class and even joined choir last week! My dd just loves all things church b/c it involves lots of little girls. :-)

 

But I am not sure church should be entertaining. It should be worshipful. I struggle with it. For now, it probably is entertainment on a small level for my kids since it's big and shiny to them with lots of kids. About anything would fit that mold. They are getting some nuggets of the Bible but we teach it at home and they are retaining those lessons so I am ok with church and it's role in our lives.

 

I hope as they get older we can be in a smaller church where their options are Bible studies and not youth retreats. For us the main part of faith is taught at home.

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I expect my church's Sunday School to recognize the budding relationship that kids already have with God, because I believe he initiates that relationship.

 

I expect them to present evidence that he is their Advocate, cares about them personally, and invites them to a thrilling and satisfying life in which he has carefully planned work for them to do alongside him, and will equip them for. I want them to hear about forgiveness, the work of the cross, and the resurrection, and to realize the bible isn't just a bunch of stories of people's reactions to God.

 

I expect the teachers to be growing Christians, not just those who love kids, were talked into teaching, or want to keep an eye on their own kids. I once heard that a teacher of my older ones felt he believed b/c he wanted "fire insurance." That's not what I want.

 

I LOVE that we use Godly Play for our younger kids, and that our older curriculum is discussion and bible based, but it also includes opportunities to look at religious expression in our culture. Our youth group talks about the hole in the heart, and what we try to use to fill it, and what does fill it. We aren't perfect, that's for sure--we need fellowship and support, and the Holy Spirit! Kids at our church are experiencing, some of them for the first time, a revival in the youth leadership, and it's impacting the whole program.

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I have been asking myself this question a lot lately. I recently began being a "teacher helper" for my DD's children's church. We have a small church and SS isn't available, and the age range is wide (grades 1-6). I think this truly make the job hard. However, I find the bought curriculum to be very babyish and watered down. I have a very hard time making the scriptures they come up with match the lesson they want learned (by "they" I refer to the curriculum makers). I think the whole program would be better off just reading scripture and having leading discussions. Possibly using this memory age group to learn the books of the Bible, the ten commandments, etc.... This doesn't mean lacking in fun or not being engaging, just being meaty.

Then here is the question I am facing... am I the instrument of change (Lara the boat rocker) or do I have faith that God will move the hearts of the leaders to make a better program?

 

Lara

 

I think if God has given you a vision, then you begin to pray as to how to implement it. In our church, I approached our children's pastor years ago and got the go-ahead to bring a group of people together to create a Sunday school program.

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This is one of my biggest complaints with the church today--a culture of low expectations for children and youth programming.

 

Yes, kids ARE bored in church, because they are not being taught at the level at which they can learn. If you compare the average church curriculum to a good language arts text it's easy to see that the church materials are often over-simplified and shallow. Children in our churches are also being entertained to death at the expense of meaty teaching--and they also get bored and tired of that, believe it or not. It is all too common for churches to use cartoonish, immature curriculum paired with copious candy hand-outs and cheap toy prizes. The excess of candy and toys decreases their value as incentives (it's not special if they are constantly available), and the lack of meaningful learning and discussion results in boredom.

 

I have been in several settings (both church and home school group) wherein people expressed deep fear of raising expectations. Their fear, expressed to me numerous times by people of varying races and socio-economic status, is that if learning about God is "hard" their children will fall away. However, if you look at the rate at which young adults are abandoning the church, it's apparent that our current system is failing.

 

Good Bible study does not have to be "hard" to be meaty and interesting. I have spent years training and revamping church programs, and each and every time it has been a real success. This includes the first church at which I was Sunday School director--it was a struggling, inner-city church with a largely illiterate/semi-literate urban welfare population. It took literally YEARS to convince the leadership to try allowing actual, inductive Bible study. Once they did allow me to try with a small group of adults, the results were amazing! People actually really wanted to KNOW and understand what the Bible says, and loved engaging at a deeper level. The response was 100% positive. It was the same story with the Sunday School program--raising expectations for students and teachers alike (and supporting those expectations with good training) had a remarkable effect. Not one person complained about the extra work (training meetings, etc.), and children and teachers alike LOVED the beefed-up program. Attendance swelled dramatically, both in terms of numbers but more importantly, in terms of consistency of attendance.

 

Bottom line: If a child is bored at church consistently, then chances are the teaching is not developmentally appropriate.

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This, exactly.

 

I don't think fun automatically equals fluff. Being boring is not a virtue.

 

:iagree: Exactly. Bible memory and Bible skills lend themselves extremely well to games where learning takes place and the kids are having fun. Bible stories can be dramatized--again fun for the kids and deepens learning. Yes, you can have discussions and the depth of those depends on the caring relationship the adult develops with the kids. It is a false choice to say that one must choose between meat and happy, engaged learning including some fun.

 

But if kids were complaining of being bored, yes, I would say it is worth investigating if there is a problem. ("Bored" can mean a rather wide variety of things, and may be idiosyncratic to that family.)

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I have been asking myself this question a lot lately. I recently began being a "teacher helper" for my DD's children's church. We have a small church and SS isn't available, and the age range is wide (grades 1-6). I think this truly make the job hard. However, I find the bought curriculum to be very babyish and watered down. I have a very hard time making the scriptures they come up with match the lesson they want learned (by "they" I refer to the curriculum makers). I think the whole program would be better off just reading scripture and having leading discussions. Possibly using this memory age group to learn the books of the Bible, the ten commandments, etc.... This doesn't mean lacking in fun or not being engaging, just being meaty.

Then here is the question I am facing... am I the instrument of change (Lara the boat rocker) or do I have faith that God will move the hearts of the leaders to make a better program?

 

 

Lara

 

Take a look at my previous post in this thread about low expectations at church. If you want to pm me, I would be happy to talk to you about how to work with church leadership to change those expectations.

 

Two resources to suggest:

 

Follow Me As I Follow Christ, by Cheryl Dunlop

This book is a wonderful training tool for teachers in children and youth programming. It's main strength is in the way it teaches a more analytical mindset for Bible study and teaches the teachers how to evaluate a lesson and beef it up. It can be a great way to introduce church leadership to the ideas of meatier teaching and what it takes to achieve that.

 

As far as curriculum, I highly recommend Piper's Children Desiring God curriculum. It's truly a step above the rest. I have found, in the churches I have worked with, that the leadership will not consider NOT having a set curriculum. In that case, I do two things: train the teachers to supplement their curriculum (beef it up), and advocate for a better curriculum like CDG. If you look at it you'll see immediately that it's not cartoonish, the truths presented are meaty, and their are waaaaaaay more inductive Bible discussion questions than is usual for church curriculum.

 

Edited to add: I have NO objection to using games and "fun" to help a child learn. What I object to is low expectations for learning coupled with overuse of fun and candy. The book I recommend above reflects a healthy balance.

Edited by strider
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That's interesting: we've had the opposite problem. My kids are often bored in SS because they already know the stuff being taught & because there's so much hype. Yeah, sometimes it's fun, but a lot of the times, it comes across as trying too hard w/out any substance.

 

Disclaimer up front: We're Unitarian Universalists, so Bible truths aren't necessarily part of our religious education curriculum. However, I suspect that issues like teaching style and such are universal.

 

With that said, I wanted to say that my daughter had the same experience as Aubrey's children. She went to RE looking for substance and a chance to discuss real issues. What she got was a 10-minute lecture and a craft and a room full of other kids who didn't want to focus.

 

I tried working with our religious education director and speaking directly with the teachers, but it never really did get better.

 

Finally, she just sat out a year of RE. That year, we changed religious education director. The first thing I did once the new person was settled was to make an appointment to take my kids in to meet her. We were very candid discussing why my kids (By that time, my son had opted out, too.) were not active in RE. After meeting and speaking to them, the new DRE immediately said she would do whatever she could to accomodate them.

 

The following year, we arranged for both kids to move up one "grade." Since our classes most years are multi-grade (1-3, 4-6, middle school, high school), moving my daughter up one grade pushed her from upper elementary to middle school, which was a much better fit. Moving my son up one grade allowed him to stay in classes with his two closest friends, which made a big difference for him, too.

 

The following year, my daughter became an active member of the middle school youth group, which was a great experience for her.

 

Ultimately, what has been most helpful for my son, though, is to have me involved in or teaching his class. He is very clear with me that RE is better for him when I'm there, because I'm the one who "makes things happen."

 

As usual, I'm babbling. But Aubrey's comment reminded me of why I now teach RE.

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I expect Biblical teaching at an appropriate level and godly leaders who love the Lord and set a good example for the children in their care.

And if they can have some fun there as well, that's the cherry on top. I would never leave a Biblically grounded church for that reason. After all, we are there to worship Christ, not be entertained.

:iagree:

 

my thoughts exactly.

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We had a family leave our church because we didn't have a Sunday School option for their 8 year old son. At the time we were still a new church, fairly small and he was the only child in his age group (all the other children were 3 and 4 years old).

 

They (the parents) loved the church, loved the teaching and felt they were being spiritually fed.

 

I personally, don't get it. To be completely honest I think it's asinine. To me, Sunday School is a nice option for my child, I'm glad we are able to offer it, but it's not a mandatory prerequisite in a church.

 

Children should get most of their spiritual teaching at home, from their parents. If they get a little extra at church on Sunday, wonderful, but the primary responsibility should be with the parents. If there was no Sunday School option for ds and we were happy at a church - getting good teaching and fellowship there is no way we'd leave over Sunday School. He'd sit upstairs with us and that would be the end of it.

 

So church is to feed adults spiritually, not kids? If *I* am happy at a church, I should disregard my child's feelings of boredom or loneliness, even if they're appropriate?

 

I get that kids should be fed spiritually at home. But then...why make them go to church at all? One could argue that it's for the fellowship of the saints, but that doesn't seem applicable for the 8yo in your story above. If the kid's choice is to learn at a 4yo level or an adult level, then he's obviously not there to be taught.

 

The only thing left that I see is to worship the Lord, but...I think it's asinine to believe that can only be done in a particular building.

 

Parents who take their kids to a church where the kids are miserable are sending their kids the message that they don't matter w/in the church, & they are paving the way for their children to leave the faith when they're older.

 

I would have left your church, too. The lack of nurturing for my kids would have only been one reason, though.

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This is one of my biggest complaints with the church today--a culture of low expectations for children and youth programming.

 

Yes, kids ARE bored in church, because they are not being taught at the level at which they can learn. If you compare the average church curriculum to a good language arts text it's easy to see that the church materials are often over-simplified and shallow. Children in our churches are also being entertained to death at the expense of meaty teaching--and they also get bored and tired of that, believe it or not. It is all too common for churches to use cartoonish, immature curriculum paired with copious candy hand-outs and cheap toy prizes. The excess of candy and toys decreases their value as incentives (it's not special if they are constantly available), and the lack of meaningful learning and discussion results in boredom.

 

Bottom line: If a child is bored at church consistently, then chances are the teaching is not developmentally appropriate.

 

As a SS teacher, I can see that this is true for some curriculum. I don't give out prizes myself, but I have always thought that the brief craft section was a waste of time. I need to re-evaluate whether my expectations are where they need to be. I expect more from my kids at homeschool than I expect from them at church. I wonder why?

 

I appreciate the thoughts that remind me that God is big enough to reveal Himself to children wherever they are... in flashy, fun SS or small, struggling SS classes. If parents are teaching and praying for their kids, Jesus will answer their prayers.

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1. I didn't read all the replies but my response to "They were bored," is basically this. Boredom is a personal problem.

 

2. The bigger problem with churches today is that they see themselves as babysitters. They need to cut out all the stupid entertainment junk and teach the Word. God's Word is never boring. My kids go to adult church because they get more out of pastor preaching line by line from the Bible then they do all the fluff stuff taught in Sunday School.

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My thought is this-as long as my DD is enjoying herself, I can supplement her religious education. She doesn't go to the group Children's church, but to the main service, however she still enjoys being in the 1st-3rd grade Sunday School class, even though it's a little on the fluffy side for my taste.

 

She already goes to a women's bible study with me weekly, and has no trouble keeping up with the discussion, so when it's no longer enough for her to meet her social needs in Sunday School, I'll begin bringing her to the adult bible study class I'm in. I don't think anyone will mind-they're pretty used to DD, and the class I'm in isn't talking about "How to have a Christian Sex Life" or anything like that.

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I expect my children to be engaged & actively learning their Bible stories. Granted, we're on the "first round" of the Bible "stories," because mine are still young. (2 & 4) But I have found that every time they go through the curriculum (each year, they do basically the same rotation), they get a bit more depth in their lessons, and that keeps them engaged.

 

Spiral Bible learning, I guess.

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