rafiki Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snickerdoodle Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 STOP! It's like torture! Mine hasn't arrived yet. Mail man mail man do your duty... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrapbabe Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 So do you have to use the whole language arts program, or could one just use the grammar island part? Shalynn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5LittleMonkeys Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Okay, what is MCT and Grammar Island? Is it grammar, writing or both? Enough people are raving about it that I think I need to check it out. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Remember though.... it is NOT for everyone. Everyone can benefit from it, but if you aren't an outside of the box person, it could be very weird and intimidating. I think that for many people it is absolutely perfect (I am one of those), some can see the value.. even if it doesn't *seem* natural.... and others will look at it and say, uh, WHAT? what is all the hubbub about? Or What am I supposed to do with this? I ADORE it, love it, love it.. but I can honestly say that it might not be everyone's cup of tea. I only wish that I could find the MCT in each field of study! That would be my HS dream. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TKDmom Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Oh you're killing me! The curriculum junkie in me has spent too much money this year. I can buy this next year. Pleas remind me that it won't kill dd to wait until 4th grade to have this program. . . . ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MariannNOVA Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 :w00t::w00t::w00t::w00t::w00t: NO! Don't tempt me this way! It's NOT FAIR! Ha:leaving:Have to go find that website now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie Laurie Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 I've been trying to resist this but your description makes it sound perfect for us. My dd is artsy and she loves Miquon and creative thinking type programs. Well, off to go clean. Everything sounds good today and I must stop reading. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nd293 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 STOP! It's like torture! Mine hasn't arrived yet. It's even worse here! I'm overseas, so waiting for them to e-mail me a final postage figure (can't be done automatically) and then I still have to wait for 2 or 3 weeks. I'm checking my e-mail every hour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happygrrl Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 no program will fit everyone. And yes, my quest is to find the MCT type program in each area of study. So far MUS is it for math, Singapore for science, and MCT for LA's, I'm still searching for the others. Wait... Singapore for science? Sigh. Off to look it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrapbabe Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 okay, so frome the samples, I would be the one to say "I don't get it". Is there more to it - should I "get it" by just seeing the samples. i want to like it cause everyone else does - but I'm I missing something? Smiles, Shalynn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom-ninja. Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 I'm not reading, I'm not reading, I'm not reading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmichigan Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 I wasn't sure how I'd do teaching it, I don't get the whole diagram a sentence thing. So...I signed my DD10 up for Grammar Town/Ceasar's English I through Online G3. Now I get to do the fun stuff and follow along, maybe there is hope I will learn this yet. :) I'm so excited for her, it doesn't start until Spring semester, I'm having trouble not telling her yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie in MN Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 okay, so frome the samples, I would be the one to say "I don't get it". Is there more to it - should I "get it" by just seeing the samples. i want to like it cause everyone else does - but I'm I missing something? Smiles, Shalynn I can understand your reaction completely. MCT is new, it's not the way we were taught, and it's not really laid out for homeschoolers. But it's elegant, just the same. Maybe you have to be "unhappy" with your child's response to grammar in order to know right away that you'll be "happy" with this?! In the vocab book, my son is learning that big words are not scary and are in fact cool. Ds is seeing examples of those words used all over the world of literature. He sees the common roots and the comparisons to Spanish. He's working with analogies to see how words relate to one another. He's comparing the new words to one another to see which really means what. I mean, when else was he interested in the fine differences between visage and countenance, or serene and placid? Not in a workbook, I assure you. We have just started the "parts of a sentence" section in our grammar book, i.e. the subject & predicate. MCT has put into words what I so wanted to: "The person to whom we are talking needs to know both , and if either is absent, unclear, or otherwise disrupted, then we fail to communicate. The sentence is not an extra-human phenomenon of the world, it is made by the mind, it is an extension of the mind itself..." This kind of conversation is making my son reach up. Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Wait... Singapore for science? Sigh. Off to look it up. LALALA (fingers in ears...) :tongue_smilie: When I've looked at samples of Singapore science, in spite of loving the math, I haven't "gotten it" from the samples. Seemed very workbooky. But of course, years ago when I first looked at samples of MCT I was similarly unimpressed (for different reasons - what's with the big font and the silly story) and now am loving the Town level, and may very probably end up buying all three levels (so I can start my younger at Island) and maybe a couple of extra books to boot... So don't tell me this about Singapore science.... :willy_nilly: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amber in AUS Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Can't wait for my DD to get to this. Sooo many good comments! Nikki i will have to catchup with you sometime to see it IRL once it arrives :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 I just love reading these reviews :001_smile: When I settled on MCT, thinking it would be perfect for my son, and for my wife and me, it was still a pretty *obscure* program around here. Not that some people weren't using it, but.... It is exciting to see the response is just what I hoped it would be. But the thought of waiting 3 years till the little man is in 3rd Grade is killing me. There is no way I'll be able to hold out that long, and we'll just have to begin an "exposure pass" (or somethin' :D) Bill (I want it NOW!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annabel Lee Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 So... does MCT include spelling (and phonics-based spelling rule review)? TIA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiobrain Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 okay, so frome the samples, I would be the one to say "I don't get it". Is there more to it - should I "get it" by just seeing the samples. i want to like it cause everyone else does - but I'm I missing something? Smiles, Shalynn No... you aren't missing anything. I don't think that the samples are adequate, but he can't put the whole book on there...:D See, when I looked at a sample I had an immediate connection with it. I "got it" immediately. It was perfect for my particular way of thinking of things. I did understand though, that a lot of people might not have the same reaction. That is why I was trying to temper my (and other's) gushing reviews with the obvious fact that it is not for everyone. However, just because you are missing it from the samples, doesn't mean that you wouldn't "get it" after you had read through the book. But then again, it still might not be your thing either. I LOVE it. HAve you figured that out yet?;) I am not a big fan of singapore science. I like a lot of it, but I have super science kids, and it just has never cut it with me. It is better than a lot of other things though.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 okay, so frome the samples, I would be the one to say "I don't get it". Is there more to it - should I "get it" by just seeing the samples. i want to like it cause everyone else does - but I'm I missing something? Okay, I was one who didn't get it from the samples - at least not from the elementary level. I had looked at it a couple of times over the years and my reaction was "where's the beef?" What led me back to it was looking at the secondary series. I totally got that, and wondered how I could possibly get my kids there - then I looked "backwards" - I also 'got' Voyage better than Town from the samples, but it didn't look like my kids could jump into Voyage cold so I backed up one more level. And I also looked more closely at the other elements - poetics and vocabulary - I think I'd focused more on just the grammar and writing when I'd looked before. Well, I found the meat. It's in there, boy is it in there. The four books all work together to reinforce each other. I agree that it's probably not everyone's cup of tea (what is?), but I'm really glad I finally gave it a chance. I should add, though, that I am happy we did a year of Easy Grammar before starting it. EG breaks things down in to smaller chunks. A second year of EG would've numbed my brain, though - once was plenty. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie in MN Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 So... does MCT include spelling (and phonics-based spelling rule review)? TIA I haven't done the earlier levels, but my guess would be "no." Hopefully someone doing the first levels will chime in. But I wanted to mention that the word roots method of teaching will cover some things that spelling programs just cannot. Things like why "ph" is used instead of "f" in some words. Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 So... does MCT include spelling (and phonics-based spelling rule review)? TIA No. I use a separate spelling program for my younger dd (Sequential Spelling). Any spelling program you like would work, though. I've dropped separate spelling for my two 6th graders. As Julie says below, the roots method covers the spelling patterns of a lot of the more difficult words in English. But I wanted to mention that the word roots method of teaching will cover some things that spelling programs just cannot. Things like why "ph" is used instead of "f" in some words. I'm not sure I'd go that far, though - I'd think most spelling programs cover roots and etymology as part of their program?? Admittedly all I've used is Sequential Spelling, but I always hear complaints that SS doesn't include enough "rules" - but even it included that words spelled with "ph" come from Greek roots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie in MN Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 I'm not sure I'd go that far, though - I'd think most spelling programs cover roots and etymology as part of their program?? Admittedly all I've used is Sequential Spelling, but I always hear complaints that SS doesn't include enough "rules" - but even it included that words spelled with "ph" come from Greek roots. Well kudos to spelling programs that expand to include word roots! Often word roots function as whole units and not as individual sounds, so the two can be hard to combine. Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 I only wish that I could find the MCT in each field of study! That would be my HS dream. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i.love.lucy Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Ok. So I read this thread. Then I have spent the last hour looking at these materials online and trying to wrap my brain around it. My dd is in 4th grade, after having been pulled from ps mid-third grade last year. I put her in R&S but she was so bored that I moved her in to CLE. It's going well, but I know that I want to beef up the writing program. So for this year (4th grade) I am set ($$ spent) on CLE and Just Write and Megawords. Can I reasonably start MCT next year, in 5th grade? WWYD? I looks like complete grammar, vocab, writing and reading all in one, right? If so, would I still start with the materials designed for 3rd graders (which look pretty rigorous compared to what we have been going through)? Or would she be "behind" if I did that? And if I started her in the vocab books instead of grammar, assuming I am giving her a good grammar foundation, I would guess vocab is the minimum you would have to start with because it builds the classical vocab needed for the future reading and writing, right? Help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie in MN Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Can I reasonably start MCT next year, in 5th grade? WWYD? I looks like complete grammar, vocab, writing and reading all in one, right? If so, would I still start with the materials designed for 3rd graders (which look pretty rigorous compared to what we have been going through)? Or would she be "behind" if I did that? And if I started her in the vocab books instead of grammar, assuming I am giving her a good grammar foundation, I would guess vocab is the minimum you would have to start with because it builds the classical vocab needed for the future reading and writing, right? Help! We just started MCT in 8th grade. I got the 8th grade set but then decided I wanted to back up. I'm starting many things in the elementary 2nd level. And even "I" am learning new stuff, so I wouldn't worry at all. You don't have to use all of MCT language arts. You can use it just for vocab, or just for poetry, etc. He also has a literature book, but we're not using that piece. Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alison in KY Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 I don't get it either:glare:. It actually looked pretty difficult as a 1st grammar program (IMHO), but at one point it reminded me of a workbooky Winston Grammar. I'm sure I'll have to investigate further:). One thing I've figured out for myself...sometimes things look not so good one year, then in another year or two they are awesome...at least that was my experience with MUS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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abreakfromlife Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Well from just briefly looking it over........I am so sold. I can't wait for tax returns so I can buy it :D I lovelovelovelovelove how he has different parts of the sentences as different colors. That's one thing I just started doing with dd with her grammar worksheets....I can't wait to try this next spring! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen in SEVA Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 (edited) I suspect the writing portion is the most challenging for others to step outside of the box and trust MCT with. I haven't noticed any MCT users here who use MCT as their sole writing program. Me, and yes it was hard to take a leap of faith and commit to the whole program without adding in anything else. We have completed all of the Island level, and I will say that DS can write a pretty good sentence. :) We will be doing Paragraph Town starting in December, and the Paragraph Labs in the back do *seem* like they will have him writing a decent paragraphy by the end. I will let you know. ;) I listened to MCT speak at a conference 2 years ago, and was able to see all of the books at once -- I spent a long time looking through the progression between the 6 levels (ie all 6 grammar books, then all 6 vocab) and had Mr. Thompson and Mr. Kemnitz right there to personally answer my questions. I know you are all jealous. :lol: MCT does not cover spelling, punctuation, or any of the mechanics taught in other English programs because he feels that gifted students pick these things up intuitively from all the reading they do, or they are covered in yougner grades. That made me nervous. I have added AAS & Spelling Power, and also the Perfect Punctuation Pop-Up Book just to be sure the basics are covered. I also recently looked at Daily Grams from Easy Grammar (thanks, Dawn!), and this could be a painless way to be sure these things are covered also. I wish there was something like Daily Grams that wasn't 180 lessons, then we could alternate Daily Grams & MCT Practice. I have also considered doing the practice sentences as dictation, and discussing the punctuation as it comes up in the sentences. MCT is not for everyone. It is a big chunk of money to plop down (though good resale potential!), and I don't think I would have been as willing to jump in with both feet if there were anything else that would work as well for my oldest's learning style (there isn't, I looked). Edited November 19, 2009 by Colleen in SEVA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie in MN Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 MCT does not cover spelling, punctuation, or any of the mechanics taught in other English programs because he feels that gifted students pick these things up intuitively from all the reading they do, or they are covered in yougner grades. Magic Lens has several pages on punctuation, going over each punctuation mark & its problem areas, although a long time isn't spent on anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny_Weatherwax Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 (edited) Magic Lens has several pages on punctuation, going over each punctuation mark & its problem areas, although a long time isn't spent on anything. The companion piece, Advanced Academic Writing, includes discussions on the use of commas, quotes, etc. and most of the punctuation rules (26-31). My DS and I had a blast reading about all of the chickens used in the examples. AAW also has punctuation as a function of grammar quizzes. The Magic Lens also has punctuation as a function of grammar sections in the loops; page 184 in Loop 7, for example. Edited November 19, 2009 by The Dragon Academy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Alfred Academy Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 I am so loving this thread! We've used Island for only a week now, but my ds8 is *asking* to do grammar! We are both loving the interaction and discussions we are having as a result of doing it together. We've also come up with fun activities to go along with it. I mentioned in another thread about him making his own "male" version of the "She" poem on page 24 and this morning as we were working adjectives he drew what his five ducks would look like from the choice of adjectives on page 30...muscular duck, educated duck, ect. Just another way for it to solidify in his mind. We are working through it slowly, but it is a good pace for us. He likes coming up with and doing these different projects. I will say...I am nervous about the writing part and not sure if I can trust it over IEW. We'll just have to see about that. :001_huh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Magic Lens has several pages on punctuation, going over each punctuation mark & its problem areas, although a long time isn't spent on anything. The elementary series also talks quite a bit about punctuation as a function of sentence structure (at least starting in Town level). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nd293 Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Can't wait for my DD to get to this. Sooo many good comments! Nikki i will have to catchup with you sometime to see it IRL once it arrives :) Definitely! They still haven't e-mailed back, and I'm still checking every hour. I am also ordering their Philosophy for Young Thinkers... Nikki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hscherger Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 I am so loving this thread! I will say...I am nervous about the writing part and not sure if I can trust it over IEW. We'll just have to see about that. :001_huh: We are LOVING MCT for grammar, vocab, and poetry, but I won't give up IEW for writing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LBS Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 a lot of folk who are saying it is not clear how it works....be sure to check out his implementation slideshow, on the downloads tab....the downloads themselves are worth printing for reference (Some Elements of Poetry and Classic Words). I have a very hard time getting the gist of a new program's "delivery system", often. My 53 year old brain just wants to find consistency, one program, but my heart and spirit want to find the best, most exciting materials...and they usually are creative in their delivery/implementation. Hope this Helps one, Larkin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elfgivas Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 So...I signed my DD10 up for Grammar Town/Ceasar's English I through Online G3. Now I get to do the fun stuff and follow along, maybe there is hope I will learn this yet. :). hi - can you tell me more about online G3? its a new-to-me thing.... tia, ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom-ninja. Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Sigh. I had it all settled. FLL4 next year while also doing WWE3 and WWE4. Then move to JAG and AG. For writing after WWE4 switch to CW Aesop. Now, ya'll people have thrown a wrench into my plans. Have any of you that like MCT used AG? I'm drawn to MCT because of the vocab and poetry parts. Would the program still work if I did the vocab and poetry but used JAG/AG for grammar and CW for writing? Boy, do I wish I had all these books in my hands to compare. I want to see MCT compared next to JAG/AG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snickerdoodle Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Sigh. I had it all settled. FLL4 next year while also doing WWE3 and WWE4. Then move to JAG and AG. For writing after WWE4 switch to CW Aesop. Now, ya'll people have thrown a wrench into my plans. Have any of you that like MCT used AG? I'm drawn to MCT because of the vocab and poetry parts. Would the program still work if I did the vocab and poetry but used JAG/AG for grammar and CW for writing? Boy, do I wish I had all these books in my hands to compare. I want to see MCT compared next to JAG/AG. Yes, these are very good questions and I'd be interested in knowing too. We are using CW Aesop right now. I like it and will keep it. I had also planned on using JAG next year but decided to go ahead and purchase Island. It just came today, so I will have a look at it tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie in MN Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Would the program still work if I did the vocab and poetry but used JAG/AG for grammar and CW for writing? Yes. We're using vocab at a different level than grammar, and it's going fine. We haven't used the poetry yet & are finishing up Writing Strands 5 before starting their writing. Using a combo works fine. Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vida Winter Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Just wanted to chime in here. I've used most items in the lower levels of MCT (and a few items in the upper levels) and couldn't be more pleased. As we advance I keep ordering. At first we only used the grammar; now we use everything. One observation: at the earliest level it is sort of a leap of faith; the curriculum does not seem at all intuitive -- odd in fact. However as you progress it makes a lot more sense. Many of the concepts are enforced in different books at the same level. I didn't realize this at first. It also gets meatier, quickly. In my opinion, despite the "different" feel and tone of the materials, it is quite easy to use. Much easier in fact than many other programs I have used in the past. RFWP would do well to redesign their site and provide better examples of each book. In the meantime they are extremely helpful on the phone and each time I have asked their recommendations have been appropriate. I'd like to add that if you search around on the RFWP site (can't remember where) you can find some video clips of MCT speaking. They are inspiring. I think I'll hunt them up and watch them again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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