springmama Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 If your child is 15, what are the rules for them and the places they go with friends? My dd has a few friends whose parents are very very permissive. I am not. There is a constant battle in our house, about how horrible her life is because she's not allowed to _______________ like so and so. Are your 15 year olds allowed to- ride in cars with other teens? Go to places like the mall without you? use myspace and not share the password with you? visit friends whose parents you've never met? would you allow the following? There is a church nearby that offers part of their campus to Christian metal bands to hold concerts. They are organized by somebody in the church and lots of kids go, even those who smoke, cuss, and probably do lots of other things my dd will not be allowed to do. I have been to theses shows with my dd and i've personally spoken with the people in charge and with the bands who participate. the music is the hard core screaming type, but between songs the bands pray and preach a little. The purpose of this is to reach the kids where they are. i have no problems with the music or the church, but I do worry about all of the "cool kids" that hang out at these shows because my dd has made poor choices in the past and I worry about her doing somethign stupid. I'm aware that even though these are Christian bands playing at a church, very bad things can happen with the crowd of kids who like to attend these shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
love2read Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 (edited) I'm on my 4th 15 year old. The rules don't change until they are in college. ride in cars with other teens? They never ride with a driver under the age of 18 and then only if I know the driver is mature and has been driving for at least a year. Otherwise, the driver has to be 21. Go to places like the mall without you? Only with a friend or sibling who is at least 17 and who is mature by my standards. Only during the day and always with a cell phone. use myspace and not share the password with you? No. I have all passwords and a cyber security system until they are in college. No myspace. visit friends whose parents you've never met? No. Never. No rock concerts. Parties with as many as 50 kids if held in a home with parents or other place well supervised. Be tough. You are the one with the life experience and the hormone-free thinking skills. Don't let them wear you down. Ignore the drama about having a horrible life otherwise otherwise it will continue. Do not feel guilt. :) My kids hated me for awhile, but they all turned out fine. They aren't nerdy, backwards, sheltered, or weird as they feared. They're cool. They like themselves and in college and even after have thanked me. Edited March 30, 2009 by love2read Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In The Great White North Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I'm on my 2nd 15 year old and the answer is "No" to all of the above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
springmama Posted March 30, 2009 Author Share Posted March 30, 2009 Thanks. This is so hard. She has one friend with strict parents and the others pretty much do as they please. Major major tantrums haapen as a result of all of this. It is wearing me down big time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ria Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Are your 15 year olds allowed to- ride in cars with other teens? My 15-year old can ride home from certain events with one or two of my older son's friends (they are 17 and 18) Go to places like the mall without you? If there was a large group going, and I knew the kids, I'd probably allow it. He's a very responsible kid. His 16-year old brother can do this, with permission. use myspace and not share the password with you? Does Facebook count? My guys have Facebook pages. I don't want the password....that's none of my business. But I do require that I be their friend so I can access their pages if I want to. My kids spend 6 weeks each summer at a wilderness canoe camp in Canada, and their friends from camp live all over the US, Canada, and around the world. Facebook lets them stay in touch. My 15-year old doesn't talk to many school friends on Facebook, but his brother does. visit friends whose parents you've never met? Yes, I have no problem with this if the parents are home. I do try to walk to the door and meet them, if possible. would you allow the following? There is a church nearby that offers part of their campus to Christian metal bands to hold concerts. They are organized by somebody in the church and lots of kids go, even those who smoke, cuss, and probably do lots of other things my dd will not be allowed to do. I have been to theses shows with my dd and i've personally spoken with the people in charge and with the bands who participate. the music is the hard core screaming type, but between songs the bands pray and preach a little. The purpose of this is to reach the kids where they are. i have no problems with the music or the church, but I do worry about all of the "cool kids" that hang out at these shows because my dd has made poor choices in the past and I worry about her doing somethign stupid. I'm aware that even though these are Christian bands playing at a church, very bad things can happen with the crowd of kids who like to attend these shows. Yes, I'd allow it. I trust my kids. My 15-year old is mature and would be fine in this situation. If I may offer a bit of advice - and this comes from someone with older kids - at some point you need to start giving your child more freedom. Now, you know her best, and perhaps she's still too immature or easily swayed...you have to do what is best for her. My point, however, is that at some time in the not-too-distant-future, your dd is going to be on her own, away from you and your rules. I think it's best to teach kids how to handle that freedom gradually, rather than supervise their entire lives and then suddenly drop them at college. My twins (sophomores in college) have seen way too many kids go absolutely wild because for the first time they are not under their parents' thumbs. Ria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
love2read Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 It is wearing me down big time. It will be hard to do, but there needs to be some kind of consequence for tantrums and you need to talk to us old moms more so that you don't beat yourself up about being a good mom. The tantrums of a 15yo are like those of a 2yo. When you first discipline/punish they will increase, but if you stick fast to the no fresh mouth, yelling, crying, arguing rule for a week or so she will eventually give up. You may want to have her present her case logically and in writing when she disagrees with you. That has helped here with a few of my kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiCO Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 ride in cars with other teens? Some specific teens. I approve on a case-by-case basis. Go to places like the mall without you? Yes. During the day, with friends. I approve on a case-by-case basis. use myspace and not share the password with you? No. Dd does have my space and facebook, but I have passwords and I check her sites and her friends' sites. visit friends whose parents you've never met? Not in general, but I have allowed her to go to a friend's house to work on a school project when I had not yet met the parents. would you allow the following? There is a church nearby that offers part of their campus to Christian metal bands to hold concerts.... I would not allow my child to go to these concerts, because it's obvious that they are looking to "save" people (we're atheists.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagnfun Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 If your child is 15, what are the rules for them and the places they go with friends? Are your 15 year olds allowed to- Mine are 18- so the rules as they applied to HER when she was 15 & 13- so the rules as they apply to HIM now. ride in cars with other teens? only if I know in advance, & then only if the drivers parents know AND the child has had their license for over a year. The 13 yr old still wants me to load my suburban w/ his friends Go to places like the mall without you? yes b/c at this point, neither teen in my house has given me ANY cause for concern in ANY rebelious teen situation, both have cell phones & designated drop/pick up times. This also depends on which friend(s) they are meeting & for what reason- movie, eat, etc- they go for a purpose not just to "hang" use myspace and not share the password with you? no, you live in my house, I pay your cell, & internet access, I have all passwords & veto ability on ipod tunes. PERIOD. visit friends whose parents you've never met? not until college, then--- the world is open to them and you hope you both did it right and PRAY would you allow the following? There is a church nearby that offers part of their campus to Christian metal bands to hold concerts. They are organized by somebody in the church and lots of kids go, even those who smoke, cuss, and probably do lots of other things my dd will not be allowed to do. yes I'd allow mine to go, however at this point, they've asked dad to go with every time. He is a long haired rocker from the 80's turned cute bald worship band rocker & the kids want him to go. However, if you think the ONLY time they are exposed to smokers, those who use language you don't care for or "lots of other things you dd isn't allowed to do"- think again (ment nicely). In other words, it isn't just at Christian rock concerts that this activity goes on. My 13 yr old has ALWAYS been into screamo rock music ALWAYS. I encourage Christian rock b/c I know its what he likes & Im not to fond of the alternative screamo. i have no problems with the music or the church, but I do worry about all of the "cool kids" that hang out at these shows because my dd has made poor choices in the past and I worry about her doing somethign stupid. I'm aware that even though these are Christian bands playing at a church, very bad things can happen with the crowd of kids who like to attend these shows. Isn't parenting hard? and here I thought the terrible twos were tough-- they are NOTHING compared to teens in a house!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiCO Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Major major tantrums haapen as a result of all of this. It is wearing me down big time. This is not acceptable behavior. You need to talk to her about how adults communicate, and then help her practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaT Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I am on my third 15yo. I have to agree with Ria - she said everything I would say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagnfun Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 [quote name=Ria;865263 If I may offer a bit of advice - and this comes from someone with older kids - at some point you need to start giving your child more freedom. Now' date=' you know her best, and perhaps she's still too immature or easily swayed...you have to do what is best for her. My point, however, is that at some time in the not-too-distant-future, your dd is going to be on her own, away from you and your rules. I think it's best to teach kids how to handle that freedom gradually, rather than supervise their entire lives and then suddenly drop them at college. My twins (sophomores in college) have seen way too many kids go absolutely wild because for the first time they are not under their parents' thumbs. Ria Aahh.. oh wise Ria.... A friend of mine had a rude awakening when she realized her 17 yr old was graduating high school, & going away to college. It dawned on her half way through senior year that the girl wasn't allowed to go many places on her own, not date unsupervised, not attend "concerts" even Christian ones, not hang at the mall, -- the point was in 6 months the girl would be completely on her own with no non-mom life experiences. I want mine to experience a few bad none life changing choices before they leave my home so I can help them work through it while they are under my roof. I grew up in a conservative Christian school and agree with what Ria said, come college-- many of my peers spent the summer after freshman in rehab for drugs/alcohol. Surprisingly sad the number of friends I lost to drugs, lifestyle choices, etc. those first few years on their own... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirty ethel rackham Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Are your 15 year olds allowed to- ride in cars with other teens? Not unless I know the other driver, know where they are going and when they will be back, and feel very comfortable with how responsible and skilled that driver is. Hypothetical, of course, because non of my son's friends drive. Go to places like the mall without you? Possibly. Only with a small group of trusted friends, a phone, and purpose for being there. Not just to hang out. use myspace and not share the password with you? Absolutely not. No myspace at all. If he wanted a facebook account, I would have to have access. visit friends whose parents you've never met? Nope. would you allow the following? There is a church nearby that offers part of their campus to Christian metal bands to hold concerts. They are organized by somebody in the church and lots of kids go, even those who smoke, cuss, and probably do lots of other things my dd will not be allowed to do. I have been to theses shows with my dd and i've personally spoken with the people in charge and with the bands who participate. the music is the hard core screaming type, but between songs the bands pray and preach a little. The purpose of this is to reach the kids where they are. i have no problems with the music or the church, but I do worry about all of the "cool kids" that hang out at these shows because my dd has made poor choices in the past and I worry about her doing somethign stupid. I'm aware that even though these are Christian bands playing at a church, very bad things can happen with the crowd of kids who like to attend these shows. I would allow my child to possibly go to such a concert if I did not have reservations about my child's ability to make good choices and I felt that there was adequate security (to prevent serious accidents and mob behavior.) The fact that there would be kids who don't behave well would not concern me too much as long as my child has not given me reason to be concern. If my child had a history of falling under the influence of peer pressure, I would keep that child on a short leash. Perhaps with a chaperone (and I'm sure that would go over well ... NOT!) hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaT Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 We also tell our children that lots of freedom comes with trust. They break our trust and they will lose their freedom. So far, our 15yo has shown he is trustworthy and capable of making good decisions - thus he has lots of freedoms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JVA Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I've had 4 15 yr olds. I completely agree with 'Love2Read'. You are the parent...If she's shown that she makes bad choices, she has to earn the right to have priveleges. -Someone suggested it was okay to let their child go to someone's home where she didn't know the parents but that they were present in the home. That's not enough for us. We've had experiences where the parent was there, but had WAY different standards than we do- come to find out. No fun. There will be a point where they need freedom- we gave it little by little as they proved to us they could handle it. (for example- one of our sons did NOT get his liscense until he was 17 1/2 because of poor school performance and a bad attitude around home to us and his sibs) They also need space to make mistakes and fail... in small doses where the damage is not life-long is best. If they're not allowed to make choices and mistakes, and get out into the real world, then the results can be grave. When the liscense was earned, they first could only drive closeby, calling when they arrived and when they left someplace. If they didn't call, then they lost the privelege for a given time. No one was allowed to be in the car with them until they were 18. My dh also dismantled the radio/cd player in one of our boy's cars. He got too distracted. -We also discipline for lack of self control - ie: tantrums. 15 is WAY to old to allow that. They have to be able to handle being told no w/o a scene and with respect to all parties. They and you will live through this. This forum is a good place to get ideas, isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danestress Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Or at least I agree with her, and I know reasonable minds can believe otherwise. I think if your daughter has demonstrated over time that she's trustworthy and has good common sense, that you should be giving her more and more freedom at this age. At 15 I definitely let my son go to the homes of friends whether I knew the parents or not. I can't see why a kid can stop in for a coke and to meet a friend's parents without me being there. I trusted him overall. I also would let him go hear the band. My son was pretty anti-smoking, so I wouldn't worry that he would start smoking just because another kid was. He might have cussed if the other kids were, though. And I don't approve of that but I also wouldn't keep a kid home all the time just in case he might cuss. At 15, we have to give a little rope. I trusted that my son could be around kids who weren't perfect without copying them at this age. But my rule was always to give a little freedom and see how they handle it. I wouldn't let my child drive in a car driven by a 16 year old, though. I just think they need more practice than that. I would make that decision on a case by case basis depending on the maturity of the other child, where they were going, and the time of day, as they got older. But 16 is just pretty young to be driving other kids around. I also wouldn't allow a kid to have an online site I couldn't access. My son did have a Zanga account which was similar to Myspace. I could and did access it. I didn't let him have much time on the computer - he didn't chat or play online games or anything like that. But he did have friends in other places and 11 cousins who lived in another state, and it was okay with me if he kept up with them online, as long as it was an open book to his father and me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halftime Hope Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I will not let my children ride in a car with an inexperienced driver, i.e.: no one with less than two years driving experience, so effectively, they must be eighteen. I also will not let them ride with someone of the opposite gender who is significantly older (college driver with a 16 yo, for example). If something bad were to happen, I wouldn't want there to be an issue with under-age vs. adult, and have the older person be criminally suspect just because of their age. I protect my older guy in this way, as well as my younger daughter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remudamom Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I've been through two this age and the triplets will be there in a couple of months. No to all of them. Rules change when they go to college. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
springmama Posted March 30, 2009 Author Share Posted March 30, 2009 Thanks so much for all of the input. The main problem is that my dd has proven time and time again that she is willing to put herself at risk and engage in extremely risky behavior. I used to allow her more freedom, but I'm realizing now that I let her have too much too soon and it's not going over well. I've explained to her that I've made some parenting mistakes in the past, and as a result she has been in situations that were obviously too much for her to handle. Also, when she did have freedom, she made such horrible mistakes that she has completely lost my trust. I can't even tell you all about the things she did, I am completely embarrassed that this child has behaved in such a way. Her tantrums are something we have been trying to stop for years. I've always given consequences and have never allowed her to act this way. If someone has a magic trick to make the tantrums stop, please let me know because even if I don't allow it, she does it anyway. Her very best friend is allowed to come and go as she pleases, ride with whomever, and stay out late. This girl is very nice and respectful and seems to really enjoy being with my family (her mom passed a few years ago and she's an only child) but her father's permissive attitude is really having an impact on my household. I'm ready to tell my dd that if she continues to compare her life with other kids and then use that to make life miserable for the members of this house, she will no longer be allowed to be friends with these particular kids who have permissive parents. Sigh....my mother didn't mother me, and my dad was busy during my teen years and I did whatever I wanted. I'm actually lucky not to have died or gotten pregnant at a very young age. I really thought that my oldest would have an easier time with her teen years because I'm actually present in her life and I care enough to come down hard when needed. Sadly, she's trying to do the same things I did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettyandbob Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 My ds is 14 ride in cars with other teens? Not with teens driving. We had a law in VA. A teen driver can only have one nonrelated minor in the car. When my ds is old enough to drive, we will probably allow him to ride with another teen driver. The state law puts a limit on ride opportunities though. Go to places like the mall without you? I have no problem with this. Based on my experience with ds, he handles this opportunity appropriately. use myspace and not share the password with you? ds has a facebook account. I'm not his friend, but he is friends with some of my friends (wierd, huh?). Anyway, they check up for me. He also joined some groups set up be family members. visit friends whose parents you've never met? I'd make an excuse to walk to the door with ds and introduce myself. It's also a way to make sure a parent is home and planning on staying home. The metal concerts at church--I'd have no problem letting my ds go. My ds has a lot of "issues", but the things you are concerned about have not been problems in my home. You have to evaluate your dc individually on these things. Additionally, I pushed my dc to do independent things at a young age, so they could learn to handle themselves while I was still not so far away. When they were 8, that meant walking to the pool on their own. Now that they are older it means trying some of the things you've described. I'm a strong believer in children learning to handle independence, learning to recognize and respond to their own intuition (is this situation dangerous) while still living at home. They might make mistakes while learning these things, but the parent is there to help them recover and learn from those mistakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perry Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Are your 15 year olds allowed to- ride in cars with other teens? No. Go to places like the mall without you? Yes, with a phone and a purpose. Not to hang out. use myspace and not share the password with you? No myspace. She has facebook, and I have access. visit friends whose parents you've never met? Probably, unless there was something that concerned me. would you allow the following? There is a church nearby that offers part of their campus to Christian metal bands to hold concerts. They are organized by somebody in the church and lots of kids go, even those who smoke, cuss, and probably do lots of other things my dd will not be allowed to do. I have been to theses shows with my dd and i've personally spoken with the people in charge and with the bands who participate. the music is the hard core screaming type, but between songs the bands pray and preach a little. The purpose of this is to reach the kids where they are. i have no problems with the music or the church, but I do worry about all of the "cool kids" that hang out at these shows because my dd has made poor choices in the past and I worry about her doing somethign stupid. I'm aware that even though these are Christian bands playing at a church, very bad things can happen with the crowd of kids who like to attend these shows. No, but we are atheist and avoid all church events. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deidre in GA Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 i'm finding my own reaction interesting. i scanned the OP and assumed the 15 year old was a son. i had my answers relative to my ds 15. then i realized the OP's child was a daughter. this totally changed my now hypothetical answers. wow - at this moment i am so glad i don't have a daughter! my son already thinks i am too hyper vigilant. if only he knew! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ria Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Kathy, Given the information you shared, it sounds like you are doing a great job with your dd. It's hard to be seen as the mean mom, isn't it? Sometimes it's necessary, though, and it does sound as though you are being quite fair, given her past concerns. Hang in there. It will get better, and she will mature. I promise! Ria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonshineLearner Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 If your child is 15, what are the rules for them and the places they go with friends? Are your 15 year olds allowed to- ride in cars with other teens? My oldest are 17 & 15 and not at our house (we have them 1/2 time)] Go to places like the mall without you? Maybe with one child that we really trust. After all, if the other child wants to say...shoplift....your kid gets in trouble, too. More trouble...in numbers. use myspace and not share the password with you? Sure thing, when they are 18. visit friends whose parents you've never met? Probably not, maybe the first time, but especially the dad...I want to meet would you allow the following? There is a church nearby that offers part of their campus to Christian metal bands to hold concerts. As far as this, I would let my 17 year old, if she wanted to...but probably not my younger ones. If they wanted to go, my husband would chaperone. On some things, we're lax, like bedtimes. The go to bed when they want to between say....9:30pm and 1am. But, the company that they're in...is more important to us. You know how it goes...the group slips to the lowest common denominator. And, I've always been nervous with my kids in stores...with friends. Some things look like fun with friends...that you wouldn't dare do with a sibling. Carrie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peek a Boo Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I'm on my 4th 15 year old. The rules don't change until they are in college. ride in cars with other teens? They never ride with a driver under the age of 18 and then only if I know the driver is mature and has been driving for at least a year. Otherwise, the driver has to be 21. Go to places like the mall without you? Only with a friend or sibling who is at least 17 and who is mature by my standards. Only during the day and always with a cell phone. use myspace and not share the password with you? No. I have all passwords and a cyber security system until they are in college. No myspace. visit friends whose parents you've never met? No. Never. No rock concerts. Parties with as many as 50 kids if held in a home with parents or other place well supervised. Be tough. You are the one with the life experience and the hormone-free thinking skills. Don't let them wear you down. Ignore the drama about having a horrible life otherwise otherwise it will continue. Do not feel guilt. :) My kids hated me for awhile, but they all turned out fine. They aren't nerdy, backwards, sheltered, or weird as they feared. They're cool. They like themselves and in college and even after have thanked me. I've met many young adults who were raised w/ "strict" parents[like love2read, lol] and are demonstrating those same responsible decision-making skills as a young adult. I've had 4 15 yr olds. I completely agree with 'Love2Read'. You are the parent...If she's shown that she makes bad choices, she has to earn the right to have priveleges. -Someone suggested it was okay to let their child go to someone's home where she didn't know the parents but that they were present in the home. That's not enough for us. We've had experiences where the parent was there, but had WAY different standards than we do- come to find out. No fun. There will be a point where they need freedom- we gave it little by little as they proved to us they could handle it. (for example- one of our sons did NOT get his liscense until he was 17 1/2 because of poor school performance and a bad attitude around home to us and his sibs) They also need space to make mistakes and fail... in small doses where the damage is not life-long is best. If they're not allowed to make choices and mistakes, and get out into the real world, then the results can be grave. When the liscense was earned, they first could only drive closeby, calling when they arrived and when they left someplace. If they didn't call, then they lost the privelege for a given time. No one was allowed to be in the car with them until they were 18. My dh also dismantled the radio/cd player in one of our boy's cars. He got too distracted. -We also discipline for lack of self control - ie: tantrums. 15 is WAY to old to allow that. They have to be able to handle being told no w/o a scene and with respect to all parties. They and you will live through this. This forum is a good place to get ideas, isn't it? My oldest will be 15 in May. He has had several opportunities to build leadership skills and decision making in Scouts, 4-H, and local community events. None of those require a lack of adult supervision: in fact, in the real world, he will be interacting with...you guessed it!-- ADULTS. If he can't learn to communicate and work w/ adults now, he's not being set up for the rigors of the real world. While I do not let my dc just ride bikes all over, he rode ten miles yesterday through our little town: to landmarks we all knew, being passed by people who recognize him, w/ the cell phone, stopping and calling along the way. He'll do something similar today. dh took the two oldest to a Weird Al concert last summer, so we aren't against concerts w/ proper adult supervision. I do think the temper tantrums have pretty much reinforced that she's not ready for many privileges at all, but i might go out of my way to find opportunities where she can earn [easily at first] some smaller privileges. I do think it's important to give them goals they CAN reach. good luck :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingChris Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 My 15 yo dd currently does not ride with teenagers and wouldn't. When we lived on an island in Florida and she needed a ride to home from church, she did at times (one and a half miles away, 25 mile an hour driving, coming from a church event). Here that is a different story. SHe has more experience driving than the teens here since she has been driving for six more months than them at the same age. (We have FL driving licenses). She has a facebook account and myspace too but she hasn't been using them since she finds them boring. I have the passwords. She doesn't go to the mall since she finds shopping a horrible chore. I would let her go to the movies when we lived on the island. I can't see myself letting her go alone here now nor do she want to. She stays away from loud music concerts since they give her a migraine and she hates to be around misbehaving youths so that would be a no brainer. She wouldn't go. We all have our different problems with our kids. My kid isn't rebellious but she finds it very hard to make friends and she isn't very happy. People don't measure up to her standards (INTJ) and she is very serious. She will fit in much better when she is an adult and she currently fits in well with adult. Good luck with your daughter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisN in NY Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Are your 15 year olds allowed to ride in cars with other teens? Only if the other teen is their own sibling. We have LONG had a policy that you may never ride with a teen driver, and our own teen drivers may not take passengers -- other than their own family members. We have made exceptions twice - my oldest was 18 when he went with his over-the-top responsible friend for a particular purpose, during the day. My second son took his senior year at community college, and gave a ride to a girl from our church (who had no car) who had classes at exactly the same times. Go to places like the mall without you? To go and hang out at the mall? No. To go with a particular friend (or two) and a mother for a particular purpose? Yes, assuming I'm comfortable with those friends and that mother. Use myspace and not share the password with you? No myspace (or facebook) at age 15, period. Visit friends whose parents you've never met? You mean at their house? No. Would you allow the following? Probably not, but I really, really don't care for that kind of music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 My 15 yr old is driving me crazy. But he's not asking to do these things. He only goes to the mall with friends to see a movie, and I pick up and drop off. None of his friends are driving, and he's not asked to go in a teen friends' car yet. He has Facebook with controls, but not a MySpace. He says MySpace is crazy. We're not religious, but he once went to a teen group pizza gathering with a Christian friend, but he hasn't gone back. I'd be OK if he wanted to go again. He's old enough to have his own thoughts about religion. But he's still driving me crazy & bringing out the worst in me. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 I've had 4 15 yr olds. I completely agree with 'Love2Read'. You are the parent...If she's shown that she makes bad choices, she has to earn the right to have priveleges. -Someone suggested it was okay to let their child go to someone's home where she didn't know the parents but that they were present in the home. That's not enough for us. We've had experiences where the parent was there, but had WAY different standards than we do- come to find out. No fun. There will be a point where they need freedom- we gave it little by little as they proved to us they could handle it. (for example- one of our sons did NOT get his liscense until he was 17 1/2 because of poor school performance and a bad attitude around home to us and his sibs) They also need space to make mistakes and fail... in small doses where the damage is not life-long is best. If they're not allowed to make choices and mistakes, and get out into the real world, then the results can be grave. When the liscense was earned, they first could only drive closeby, calling when they arrived and when they left someplace. If they didn't call, then they lost the privelege for a given time. No one was allowed to be in the car with them until they were 18. My dh also dismantled the radio/cd player in one of our boy's cars. He got too distracted. -We also discipline for lack of self control - ie: tantrums. 15 is WAY to old to allow that. They have to be able to handle being told no w/o a scene and with respect to all parties. They and you will live through this. This forum is a good place to get ideas, isn't it? Since you've been there...how do you 'not allow' tantrums? Until this child (my third) hit 14/15, I was a wonderful parent. :lol: Nothing like this ever came up. He gets upset by the littlest thing. He's also not asking to do a lot things. He does well in school, he's active etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 Can I play even though my daughter is only 14.5? There is a constant battle in our house, about how horrible her life is because she's not allowed to _______________ like so and so. In our house the conversation goes something like this: DD: "All my friends at school get to watch This Show Is Really Violent And Sexually Inappropriate. I'm the only one who's not allowed." Me: "Too bad you don't live with them." or Me: "Oh." Are your 15 year olds allowed to- ride in cars with other teens? Nope. My kid won't be getting her license until she's 18, either. Go to places like the mall without you? Nope. She can ride her bike to the nearest library branch or walk to Taco Bell to get a burrito, but these are local places that aren't really hot spots for Teens Doing Bad Things. use myspace and not share the password with you? Heck no! She's not allowed to use MySpace AT ALL, and I have the password to her email account. She has to ask me or my husband before she opens any email that she doesn't know who it's from. visit friends whose parents you've never met? Nope. The rule is, You Want To Go Over There, You Arrange For Me to Meet the Mom or Dad. would you allow the following? Nope. Especially if you are concerned about your dd making bad choices. I used to date a PK and was involved in the youth group for a while ... and I can assure you that church kids can behave just as badly as the rest of us. If you dd has a hankering for music, take her a few friends to a concert you approve of where you can supervise their behavior. Tara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
love2read Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 About tantrums in 15 year olds- One consequence in our family is to have a conversation with mom or dad. A long conversation ;) This isn't mom or dad lecturing, but a "we'll talk when you are calm" followed by a discussion that usually starts with a simple comment like "Is it really productive to yell when you don't get your own way." We wait for an answer. We let them talk and talk and talk. I have learned not to lecture, but it's hard to just listen and only occasionally insert a question that will make the child review his or her behavior objectively. Over time they start to think before they throw a fit. A key thing for me to learn was to not be drawn into an arguement. It took me years to learn that one and I still slip up. It's better to just say nothing if you are upset, rather than defend yourself or show extreme irritation. If you find yourself doing that, pop a werther's original in your mouth and don't say a word until it's gone :) Our oldest was a trouble maker. She continued to throw temper tantrums on and off through high school and we were slow to learn how to get her to think before she acted---or reacted. She was the one that continued to have bad judgement in college and she only started to get it right at the end of her freshman year. I think if she had gone to ps, given her personality and need to live on the edge, she would have picked friends from the kids on drugs or who shoplifted :glare: It's very hard to raise teenagers especially if your views are counter cultural. It sounds like your dd has an especially strong personality, which will serve her well in life at some point. Keep telling her what you expect and why, even if she doesn't listen. Be sure to listen to her even when she drives you crazy. Check out the book Teen-Proofing: Fostering Responsible Decision Making in Your Teenager by Rosemond from your library. He's funny and I think he's right on the mark when it comes to understanding and raising teens. Lots of good ideas in that book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIch elle Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 (edited) I'm sure I will in the future but I'll take it as it comes - with a firm hand. He goes to school sponsored dance's and a parent drive both ways. That's about it for us! He likes to hang out with his family and just a few friends. :grouphug: Edited March 30, 2009 by MIch elle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mamaof2andtwins Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 My oldest just turned 15 last week. None of what you have mentioned has come across our radar screen yet. My son thinks Facebook and MySpace are pointless. My dd, on the other hand, is biding her time until she turns 13 to get an account. She will be able to do it, but I must be one of her friends. None of my children have friends who drive, so this has not come up yet. We will cross this bridge when we get to it. My son does go plenty of places without me, but it must have some purpose. I don't have really a great fondness for the mall. Our mall actually has curfews and age restrictions on certain days at certain times. I understand that teenage girls like the mall. I am not sure what I would do about that one. Jennie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pamela H in Texas Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 (edited) Are your 15 year olds allowed to- ride in cars with other teens? No Go to places like the mall without you? sure use myspace and not share the password with you? no visit friends whose parents you've never met? no Editing because it sounded possibly inflammatory....basically, no my kids would not be allowed to go though I really can't imagine them asking either. Edited March 31, 2009 by 2J5M9K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 There is a constant battle in our house, about how horrible her life is because she's not allowed to _______________ like so and so. I have been thinking about this. We don't have battles in our house about this because we have made it very plain to our dd that we don't give a rat's @$$ (as my dad would say) what her friends are or aren't allowed to do, and when she first started school and started complaining about these things, we bored her to tears with our long, long, long monologues about how we don't give a rat's @$$ about these things. Our dd mentions it occasionally, but she gets one of the two stock responses I wrote about earlier in this thread. She knows she'll get nowhere with it. I don't pretend to know why this issue has elevated to battle status in your home, but I just thought I'd put it out there that this might be a situation where you could take a page from John Rosemond. I generally don't like his parenting advice because I think he leans too far in the "Children are here to please me" direction, but occasionally I think he has something good to say. One of his ideas that I have used on occasion with my kids is the "We are going to sit down and talk about this recurring issue One. Last. Time. You may say whatever you like, as long as it is respectful, and you may talk about it for as long as you like, but once this conversation is over, we are Never. Going. To. Talk. About. It. Again." I used this with my son when he was five and started complaining frequently and vociferously about how some matter was horrendously and traumatically unfair. I finally sat down with him and said, "Son, I love you and I understand this upsets you. This is your chance to get it all out there One. Last. Time. Then we are Never. Going. To. Talk. About. It. Ever. Again." After that, if he tried to bring it up, I simply told him, "We are done talking about that forever" and walked away. This strategy is recommended for younger kids, but since your daughter is behaving immaturely, I'd give it a try with her. Tell her she can talk all she wants to as long as she likes about how unfair and restrictive y'all are, and then she's never to bring it up ever, ever, ever again. Because she's older, let her know what the consequence will be if she ever brings it up, even a single time, again. Tara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
springmama Posted March 30, 2009 Author Share Posted March 30, 2009 Tara, this is an excellent idea. When I say battle, I dont' mean that we engage in the argument. We have told her many times that we are not and will never be like her friends' parents and we do not get into a negotiation with her regarding our rules. The battle is trying to get her safely to her room when she's throwing a tantrum that results when one of her friends is allowed to do something and she is not. I need her to be away from the little ones if she can't control herself and it's impossible because she wants the audience and will go to great lengths to get one. I was discussing this with a friend today and she suggested that a new house rule might be to forbid dd from bringing up the fact that her friends are allowed to do things she can't do. I know it's normal for kids to whine "But so-and-so is allowed to go!" but in our case it's an all out temper tantrum that sometimes gets scary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peek a Boo Posted March 30, 2009 Share Posted March 30, 2009 ... but in our case it's an all out temper tantrum that sometimes gets scary. that right there would earn her a mattress on the floor, two changes of dull clothes, no electronic devices, and certainly no fun field trips w/ friends till she could behave at home. She'd have to earn them back w/ good behavior. my granny smacked me across the face Once when i smarted off to her. It made quite an impression. have you considered counseling for the family? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 (edited) If your child is 15, what are the rules for them and the places they go with friends? My dd has a few friends whose parents are very very permissive. I am not. There is a constant battle in our house, about how horrible her life is because she's not allowed to _______________ like so and so. Are your 15 year olds allowed to- ride in cars with other teens? No Go to places like the mall without you? I go to the mall with him but he is able to go were he wants. I don't drop him off use my space and not share the password with you? all his friends are on face book, he is just not interested. I would require access visit friends whose parents you've never met? no would you allow the following? There is a church nearby that offers part of their campus to Christian metal bands to hold concerts. They are organized by somebody in the church and lots of kids go, even those who smoke, cuss, and probably do lots of other things my dd will not be allowed to do. I have been to theses shows with my dd and I've personally spoken with the people in charge and with the bands who participate. the music is the hard core screaming type, but between songs the bands pray and preach a little. The purpose of this is to reach the kids where they are. i have no problems with the music or the church, but I do worry about all of the "cool kids" that hang out at these shows because my dd has made poor choices in the past and I worry about her doing something stupid. I'm aware that even though these are Christian bands playing at a church, very bad things can happen with the crowd of kids who like to attend these shows. My son loves Christian metal bands (oxymoron). I would not allow him to attend without me. The teens in our coop group go to the pop Christian concerts all the time together usually one of the parents chaperon and this is a group of kids from ages 13-17. . Edited April 1, 2009 by Cafelattee n Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
springmama Posted March 31, 2009 Author Share Posted March 31, 2009 that right there would earn her a mattress on the floor, two changes of dull clothes, no electronic devices, and certainly no fun field trips w/ friends till she could behave at home. She'd have to earn them back w/ good behavior. my granny smacked me across the face Once when i smarted off to her. It made quite an impression. have you considered counseling for the family? This is her life. She really has nothing right now and it doesn't seem to matter. We have been in counseling for years and she has been on meds for a year. It's only helped a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 This is her life. She really has nothing right now and it doesn't seem to matter. I am NOT trying to criticize you because I have a difficult child, too. Where does your dd get her positive reinforcement from? Is there a way that you can set up a recurring situation in which she gets positive reinforcement regardless of what has happened that week? Can you go on a date with her, watch a movie with her, eat ice cream with her, or do anything else with her that she would enjoy that doesn't depend on how well she behaved during the week? This post about being in counseling and on meds changes things a lot. This is not just a girl behaving bratty. It sounds like it's a much more pervasive issue, and the advice we give here is not likely to solve the problem. Have you discussed this with your counselors? :grouphug: Tara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
springmama Posted March 31, 2009 Author Share Posted March 31, 2009 Oh believe me, the girl gets positive reinforcement lol! She was an angel yesterday- cooked dinner for the family, did her chores after being asked only once, behaved well, and apologized to the entire family for her poor behavior the previous day. So, after dinner I was getting ready to go shopping at a local consignment sale (we have these huge sales 2x a year and they are BIG events), she asked to come with me and I allowed her to come and even bought her a few things that she didn't really need. Then we went to Starbucks. We have discussed this at length with her counselor and psychiatrist and basically their advise is to not put up with any bad behavior, be consistent with discipline and praise, which we try very hard to do but I'll admit we aren't perfect....who is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pamela H in Texas Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 (edited) It sounds like the punishment things aren't working if you're doing it long term (and with a teen!) and still having a really bad time of things generally speaking (though good days are nice, I'm sure). What I have found is that tougher kids are generally the ones that need stronger discipline but less (many times NO) punishment. We have to remember, esp when they are 15, that they HAVE to be able to function in a world with VERY few punishments (though PLENTY of real consequences), esp for law-abiding citizens. May I suggest you look at http://www.thetotaltransformation.com ? It seems pricey, but there is a trial and it's good (and works!). The associated website is http://www.empoweringparents.com This guy still DOES use punishment some, but a lot of it is about getting kids to stop using skills and tools that are inappropriate and start using ones that are appropriate. Really, kids use inappropriate things because they work on SOME level. Maybe it doesn't get them their way, but it causes some effect that either reiterates something they believe or meets some need. WE can see it's hurting them (and can cause long term issues), but they don't have what they need to do better even though we think we've given it to them. Hoping that makes sense. What I REALLY like about this program is that it is systematic, isn't into blaming, and the results are phenomenal in a fairly short time (not overnight...sorry). I hope this helps a little. Edited March 31, 2009 by 2J5M9K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peek a Boo Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 Oh believe me, the girl gets positive reinforcement lol! She was an angel yesterday- cooked dinner for the family, did her chores after being asked only once, behaved well, and apologized to the entire family for her poor behavior the previous day. So, after dinner I was getting ready to go shopping at a local consignment sale (we have these huge sales 2x a year and they are BIG events), she asked to come with me and I allowed her to come and even bought her a few things that she didn't really need. Then we went to Starbucks. We have discussed this at length with her counselor and psychiatrist and basically their advise is to not put up with any bad behavior, be consistent with discipline and praise, which we try very hard to do but I'll admit we aren't perfect....who is? okie doke - I'm out, lol :) here's to attaining perfection :D many prayers, and good luck!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonshineLearner Posted March 31, 2009 Share Posted March 31, 2009 No real other comments, except for I've read Love and Logic for parents of Teens. It kinda is a book about logical consequences and getting what you as a parents need, through encouraging your children in good choices... Carrie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptwoman Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 DS is 15 next week. Arrgggghhhh!! ride in cars with other teens? This is a non issue here because kids can't drive other kids around until they are 20. But the answer if it was an issue would be no. Go to places like the mall without you? yes use myspace and not share the password with you? Kind of yes and kind of no. I don't mind him using those things and not telling me the password up front but if I asked for it I'd expect to be given it. visit friends whose parents you've never met? yes would you allow the following? yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phathui5 Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 My oldest is only 8, but I went to the Christian metal concerts when I was a teenager and nothing bad ever happened. It was fun, in a safe setting. I would let my kids go when they get to that age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted April 1, 2009 Share Posted April 1, 2009 My oldest turns 14 Friday. I need to check state law on teen driving; we will comply at minimum. The mall? Yes, as long as school and chores are done well with a decent attitide. Myspace and Facebook? He has a Myspace; I am friends. The concert? Yes. Friends house with present but unknown adults? Possibly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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