Jenn in Mo Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Do you have health insurance? Yes, through my husband's job....it covers dental, vision, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenn in Mo Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I think it is also dependens on what "comfortable" means to you. For us, if all debt was paid, I would want enough money to just go out and buy, say, a flat screen TV on a whim. In order to have that kind of money, there is no way my dh could make less than what he currently makes with our family of 4. If comfortable to you is having what you want but not wanting the "extras," then it just all depends on what you mean by "comfortable." And what about savings/emergency fund/retirement? We put a lot into that because we want to continue to be comfortable. If dh made less than 100K, then taking out those things would take his bring home pay way down as well. I want extras. But I don't want them on a whim. This would be fun for, oh, maybe 2 weeks for me. We work toward our extras bit by bit. And then we realllllly enjoy them. We take a vacation every year, using our tax return to spend about $1000.00 to travel, visit family, see the sights....not a huge Disney vacation or anything. But you've got me on retirement. We've only recently reached debt-free, having gone through Dave Ramsey's stuff, and are working our way toward investing and retirement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenn in Mo Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I've wondered, watching this discussion...people who don't have enough probably don't know what it takes to get by. Either they underestimate because they're used to scrimping & they don't realize what's normal, or they overestimate because they've never had a chance to see how far $60K could go, much less $120K. I guess I'm slow....I'm not sure what you're saying here. I'm used to scrimping, but I'm not sure what's not normal about it. I don't have to scrimp, but I have expensive tastes :D and to get the things I want, I need to shop creatively. For instance, I could buy an average diet for my family at Wal-mart, but I shop at a Discount Grocery Store because for the same money I can purchase tons of fruits and veggies (many local) and lots of organic items. However, it means reading the expiration date on items before buying them because....you never know. Shopping someplace that sells expired items would not qualify as normal, I'm guessing, but I could go with normal....if I was okay with average. Shopping for clothes....well, you know us homeschooler's have to have the best shoes ;) and those are budgeted in. But I'll buy some things at yardsales and lots of things out of season. I bought shorts last month for my boys. Shorts in December. They were marked down from $14.00 to $2.00 and they were my boys' favorite style of shorts. I guess it's not normal to buy shorts in December, but even if I had the money to do otherwise....it just wouldn't feel right to waste it when I know it can go so much farther. kwim? If "normal" is average or wasteful....I'm not sure I wanna be there. No promises I would still say that if my husband's income suddenly doubled.:lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelli in TN Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 . We haven't been able to put anything aside for retirement. We tell the kids that we will just travel around visiting them for a couple of months each and then move on to the next. We suggest that they all live about a day's drive from each other:tongue_smilie: Glad to see someone else has the same retirement plan we do! We thought we would sell the house and buy a small, used RV and just drive around plugging into the electricity at our kids houses. We have six kids and have asked them to please live in interesting places when they grow up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeanestMomInMidwest Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Every year, after I do our taxes, I say to dh "Do you realize we mad $X last year? Where did all our money go?" Then we play the game of: Well, if we didn't have X, we could do X. As in, well, if we hadn't bought that extra 10 acres, we could afford a brand new car. Sometimes I say, "Look out the back door, there's your vacation." Like all families, we decide what our "comfort level" is. We live much better than some, but not as well as others, because of the choices we've made with our money. I have house envy like crazy....then I met someone who lived in a gorgeous house who envied my land. Go figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnnetteB Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Glad to see someone else has the same retirement plan we do! We thought we would sell the house and buy a small, used RV and just drive around plugging into the electricity at our kids houses. We have six kids and have asked them to please live in interesting places when they grow up. We tell the kids about our Retirement Plan when they are young:D When people dare to ask us if we have an IRA or Investments we reply, "Our investment is in our children." This thread has been interesting. We all have such different circumstances. We grew up and married in Orange County. We bought our first home with less than $3,000 down and a variable rate loan with an income of less than $30,000. We lived paycheck to paycheck. The house appreciated and we sold it 6 years later. A job transfer took us to the San Francisco Bay area, San Carlos. The cost of living there was ridiculous and we knew we would never be able to afford a home. Dh's roots were here in Oregon and we headed north. You get more for your housing dollar here than California. Our family has grown more in proportion to income over the years and we have struggled through layoffs and employer's closing the doors :( We do pay for our own medical insurance, auto insurance, home insurance, and life insurance(as long as we have dependent children). We don't have Rx, dental or vision. Our only debt is the mortgage, but we refinanced to lower the rate and added money to buy a reliable auto, so it seems sometimes like the house will never be paid off. What I worry about is: How are our children going to afford homes of their own? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aubrey Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 We tell the kids about our Retirement Plan when they are young:D When people dare to ask us if we have an IRA or Investments we reply, "Our investment is in our children." Here, too. We started telling them young, so they'd never think to question it. In fact, they're fighting over who gets us first. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 (edited) . Edited February 8, 2009 by LibraryLover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KidsHappen Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 We tell the kids about our Retirement Plan when they are young:D When people dare to ask us if we have an IRA or Investments we reply, "Our investment is in our children." Blah! One of my dds swore up and down she was never leaving home. In our old age she would live with us and take care of us. And then one day, out of the blue she anounced that she would put us in a retirement home instead. A nice one mind you, with our own apartment and lots of things to do but a retirement home non the less. She did say, "I will take you to Walmart though." One dd said we could live with her but would have to have our own in-law quarters because her dad would drive her crazy. She said, "Don't get me wrong, I love him but living with him would drive me crazy." Two others have said we could live with them forever, no strings attached. And we will be lucky if the last girl even speaks to us by the time she gets through puberty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aubrey Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Blah! One of my dds swore up and down she was never leaving home. In our old age she would live with us and take care of us. And then one day, out of the blue she anounced that she would put us in a retirement home instead. A nice one mind you, with our own apartment and lots of things to do but a retirement home non the less. She did say, "I will take you to Walmart though." One dd said we could live with her but would have to have our own in-law quarters because her dad would drive her crazy. She said, "Don't get me wrong, I love him but living with him would drive me crazy." Two others have said we could live with them forever, no strings attached. And we will be lucky if the last girl even speaks to us by the time she gets through puberty. Hmm...a retirement home w/ things to do? Like a mini-society? Plenty of opportunity for suspicion, espionage, & politics? Yeah, I guess I could be happy there, as long as dh is w/ me to roll his eyes & provide back-up. (I'd put a smiley here, except I'm serious. :D) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissel Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 In NJ, with no debt (cars paid off, smallish mortgage) I would say 85,000 is good. 2000/mo mortgage (including taxes and ins.) 1250/mo grocery bill for healthy eating (includes toiletries etc. 170/mo for two iphones 125/mo cable/internet/phone 115/mo car insurance on 2 cars 275/mo average utilities: heating/cooling/electric/water hmm... I'm not sure how much oil/gas would be... I have electric heat/well water so this could be off. Where I live, there is no gas/water but some do have oil heat. 350/mo Y memberships/kids lessons and sports, etc 500/mo into savings/misc. stuff like for example Netflix and school supplies. That is a take home pay of about 1200 a week or an annual salary of about 85,000. :) That is not including health insurance. I don't know... my dh's job covers it 100% but you may have to take a contribution out of the 500/mo savings or make more money! We're in central NJ, and this sounds about right, though our figure does include a few hundred $ a month for health insurance. DH's car is going to need replacing soon, though, and that will knock us for a loop :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissel Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Every year, after I do our taxes, I say to dh "Do you realize we mad $X last year? Where did all our money go?" Then we play the game of: Well, if we didn't have X, we could do X. As in, well, if we hadn't bought that extra 10 acres, we could afford a brand new car. Sometimes I say, "Look out the back door, there's your vacation." Like all families, we decide what our "comfort level" is. We live much better than some, but not as well as others, because of the choices we've made with our money. I have house envy like crazy....then I met someone who lived in a gorgeous house who envied my land. Go figure. Seriously! We do the same thing. We feel as though we struggled all last year, so when DH got his W2 and told me how much he pulled in, I about fainted! After we talked about it, though, we realized that we paid off our CCs and started paying my mom for childcare, so those took a big chunk right off the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KidsHappen Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 To live a moderate life style which I define as- 2 serviceable cars with at least one car that the entire family can fit into a home with no more than 2 persons per bedroom feeding you family healthy meals average amenities like a cell phone, internet, cable no government subsidiaries are received able to live with our the need of a credit card How much would a person need to make to support this lifestyle? I'm not intrest in what you would consider "survival mode" income. It really does depend on where you live. Ten years ago we lived in Plano, TX and made $120,000 a year. We only had one car but we were very comfortable. Then we took a pay cut of $40,000 to move to Green Bay, WI where we lived essentially the same lifestyle. Maybe not quite as comfortable but still pretty good. After that $110, 000 in Fort Myers, FL with the same lifestyle. Now we live in about an south of Nashville and are back to what we made ten years ago while still living the lifestyle. Of course, the cost of living has went up while we still earn the same amount of money so we are not quite as comfortable as we were ten years ago but we are doing pretty good. We still only have one car, we pay approximately $40,000 a years in taxes, our mortgage is $24,000 a year, our car payment $6000 and our student loans $8,500 a year, life insurance $900, plus utilities and finally we send familt members $3600 a year so our descretionary income is not very high but we have cable, internet, cell phones. My kids have activities, we don't have to overly worry about the cost of food, gas & medical care. We can go out to eat once in awhile. However, we buy clothes from thrift shops, rarely go to the movies, have never been on a vacation and have to plan household purchases very carefully. No video games, DSs, laptops and such. I have no complaints and feel incredibly blessed. My point though is that we have maintained the same lifestyle for the past ten years on widely ranging incomes based on where we have lived. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissel Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I guess it's not normal to buy shorts in December, but even if I had the money to do otherwise....it just wouldn't feel right to waste it when I know it can go so much farther. kwim? It's NOT??? :eek: :lol: I just bought fall/winter items for two kids for the next two years at my local Gymboree's clearance sale. Spent an average of $5 each. I love that store! And I totally buy thrift, yard sale, and eBay. Shopping for clothes....well, you know us homeschooler's have to have the best shoes ;) and those are budgeted in. Ever since I found Marshall's, I haven't paid more than $19.99 for a pair of the girls' shoes. They have Umi, Stride Rite, Merrell etc., so I stop in there every few weeks to see what they have. I'm picky about shoes too :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle T Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Here, just north of San Fran- 150k. Livable income really depends on where you live. Michelle T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tribemama Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Alright, I lived in the inland empire(or the armpit of socal) for 7 years growing a family of 6.... Totally scraping by - we were students. We moved to the Valley - and we make close to 60,000 and have 8 in our family. The housing market has really dropped and we have been looking at 4+ homes for under 150,000. Sacramento, and now inland empire are actually affordable. We have two cars (used - but I would never buy new - anyone else read Forbes?) and we live comfortably. We drive to the Bay Area quite often - and Yosemite for trips. We take the kids snowboarding quite often, and they are in/on sports team. Extra money would mean more things that I'm not sure would be needed - but maybe I would splurge for a maid :) I guess I do a lot of thrift - but I really enjoy it (I always ask myself - what do I really think something is worth). So, we are comfortable - but always could use more pillows :) Tribemama Mother to the Tribe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeanestMomInMidwest Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Alright,I lived in the inland empire(or the armpit of socal) for 7 years growing a family of 6.... Totally scraping by - we were students. We moved to the Valley - and we make close to 60,000 and have 8 in our family. The housing market has really dropped and we have been looking at 4+ homes for under 150,000. Sacramento, and now inland empire are actually affordable. We have two cars (used - but I would never buy new - anyone else read Forbes?) and we live comfortably. We drive to the Bay Area quite often - and Yosemite for trips. We take the kids snowboarding quite often, and they are in/on sports team. Extra money would mean more things that I'm not sure would be needed - but maybe I would splurge for a maid :) I guess I do a lot of thrift - but I really enjoy it (I always ask myself - what do I really think something is worth). So, we are comfortable - but always could use more pillows :) Tribemama Mother to the Tribe I found Northern California to be quite affordable, as well. But I must say, when I sold my little house (what folks in the midwest call a bungalow) out there and found out how much house/land I could get in Indiana I was shocked. But I do so miss the winter weekends in Tahoe and the summer weekends in Monterey (two places I could never afford to live, but loved to visit). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnnetteB Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I just started doing our taxes. Imagine my dismay when I totalled up the two W-2's and it is less than $49,000. Dh has had less overtime in the last year and it shows, but we aren't starving. Re: Retirement homes. No Way! Not going without a fight. Ds, 20, says he wants the house someday so he will have to put up with us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Governess Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I'm also north of LA and I would say a "good" income (meeting your criteria) here would be somewhere between $100k and $125k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Imo, there are just too many personal comfort zones within a so-called "moderate" lifestyle. As an example, my idea of healthy meals are probably more expensive than many others'. On the other hand, I don't consider two cars and cable to be a given when defining a liveable wage. Similarly, it's evident from the replies thus far that even people living in the same locale can have vastly different ideas as to how much money is required to live comfortably. I know families in my area who do well with $40,000 a year....And I know many more who would consider themselves paupers on such an income. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Two adults and 4 kids? I'd want to be making a minimum of around $150,000. Maybe 130,000 if we lived somewhere rural. I think I need to rethink my decision to have more kids. :confused: LOL the last vacation of any sort we went on was our honeymoon 14.5 years ago. Yup, I'm thinking my "comfortable" is others' "survival mode.":lol: Um, yeah. I'm sorry, this is a depressing thread. I guess as long as MY FAMILY is happy and comfortable it doesn't matter what we're making, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I'm sorry, this is a depressing thread. I guess as long as MY FAMILY is happy and comfortable it doesn't matter what we're making, right? I always find these threads...interesting. Of course the cost of living differs from one place to another, but there's no question that one person's comfortable is another's panic button. Don't let it affect your own contentment, though.:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I guess as long as MY FAMILY is happy and comfortable it doesn't matter what we're making, right? And THAT is really the heart of the whole matter. Some people will never be happy or comfortable, no matter how much stuff or money they have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joannqn Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Now I would say 65 to 100. Here is a fun link to play with http://cgi.money.cnn.com/tools/costofliving/costofliving.html According to that link, what I called comfortable in Tacoma is equivalent to $58,000 to $64,000 in Chicago. $100,000 in Chicago is equal to $93,000 here. For that we could live in just about any neighborhood we wished with the exception of the VERY upper class areas. We'd have a very nice, large home and have plenty of spending money for just about anything we desired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebeccaC Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 (edited) According to that link, what I called comfortable in Tacoma is equivalent to $58,000 to $64,000 in Chicago. $100,000 in Chicago is equal to $93,000 here. For that we could live in just about any neighborhood we wished with the exception of the VERY upper class areas. We'd have a very nice, large home and have plenty of spending money for just about anything we desired. Well I live in the N.W. burbs not Chicago and just outside Cook county :001_smile: Barrington and Inverness are just a stones throw and they are high end. Here is what the medium family income in Inverness IL http://www.muninetguide.com/states/illinois/municipality/Inverness.php $177,682 Hence back to the it is all relative. Our house in the town/burb we live in is 200,000+ or at least so it was 2 years ago, 450 square feet, one bath, one closet, built in 1938. We could not touch the same house in Inverness which is just a 10 minute drive NE from our house. If there were such a house in Inverness it probably was a carriage house or........ Medium income for my town is about the same as Cook county or just a little more. Edited February 9, 2009 by RebeccaC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 In my rural area, assuming you weren't also servicing other debt, you could have all of that for around $30,000CDN/year. Plus, here, you have the added bonus of not having to pay for health insurance. :D Alright! I am moving!! We have 4 people, but only one car... no payment, and no health insurance. Indiana. Hmmmm..... I'd say we would need $70,000 gross to meet your standards with 4 family members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tap Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Here in Portland, Oregon/Vancouver, Wa I would say between about 60-70,000 to meet all the requirements and what I consider 'good' living. Not great, but good. But I don't like car loans so I would expect to be actively saving towards another car, even if I don't have a payment now. I would expect to be able to afford to clothe myself and children from new stores (whether I chose to or not) not second hand stores. I would expect to not have to coupon shop. I would expect to put 20% away into savings and retirement, and 10% to tithe if I chose to. My children would have music lessons and at least one sport a year. I would expect a decent school district (affects home prices here) of choice for my family, (whether I chose to use it or not). In our area a 2,000 sq ft house on a 6000 sq ft, city lot would cost 250,000+, any house with property would be double that. So, a new mortgage alone would be over 2,000 per month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumping In Puddles Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 (edited) Alright! I am moving!! We have 4 people, but only one car... no payment, and no health insurance. Indiana. Hmmmm..... I'd say we would need $70,000 gross to meet your standards with 4 family members. That is why retirees often move from places like NYC to states where their retirement funds will go further. If my dh had a business (like say internet based) that he could do anywhere in the world, we would definitely move to somewhere with a lower cost of living. We can't move now though because we have debt that couldn't be repaid on a lower salary so we couldn't simply move - take a pay cut - live on the reduced wages. I also really like NJ :) BTW, I should have mentioned in my NJ cost of living estimate that those are some averages in my area and not my finances. For example: my dh makes more than that, my mortgage is only 1000/mo (we bought at the right time :)) we have no iphones but 170/mo is what my sil pays!, my dh works for the phone company and we have company paid for cell phones, our phone/internet/cable are half price, and we do not put 500 into savings every month, we do NOT spend 350/mo on children's activities. I was saying these are TYPICAL for that size family in this area. WE do: have only 1 car paid off, the other is not even close, we have a home equity loan, we have mandatory Lake dues because we live in a Lake Community, and we have a large loan (at 2% interest but I wish we did not have!). Edited February 9, 2009 by Jumping In Puddles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melora in NC Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 (edited) I think around $40,000 would be very comfortable for that size family in our part of NC. We get by on half that, but we only have one car (paid for), a paid for house, two kids (though I would love a couple more!), and we do have to be very careful. Edited February 9, 2009 by Melora in NC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StaceyinLA Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 we definitely live as you described. We are a family of 6 in a 5 bdrm house on 5 acres. We have 5 cars (hubby has one from his company that is paid by his company, I have mine and my 3 driving kids each have a car). We eat a healthy diet that includes a fair amount of organic, and a lot of local foods (meat, dairy, etc.). We also eat out a good bit. We have all the items you listed and a few more. We travel occasionally (not like I would like to). We have no ccs. We have health insurance. Our net income is around $4500/month (which does include $460 in child support, my part-time income and $100 each from 2 of my daughters for their car insurance - 3rd dd will start paying hers in about a month). This is in a rural area north of Baton Rouge, Louisiana. I do find living expenses in our area to be fairly low on the spectrum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrrh Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 It can be done the way you describe in the most expensive county in the nation for $80,000 (net). I'll send you my book when it comes out ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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