Blessedfamily Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 I have not read through 10 pages of posts... sorry. Is Edgar Allen Poe in SOTW or TWTM? Because if he isn't, then I wasn't planning on teaching about him. :lol: Carmen, you are too much. Ah good, I did remember correctly about K12: http://www.k12.com/our_approach/core_knowledge_section/ Faced with such variation, how can we be sure our children are learning what they need to know? To address this question, the curriculum experts at K12 have consulted with many experts in various fields to gain insights into what experts know and how they structure their knowledge. We’ve also examined many state standards, research reports, and model curriculum programs. In our judgment, one of the strongest, most thoroughly researched models comes from the non-profit Core Knowledge Foundation, founded in 1986 by University of Virginia professor E. D. Hirsch, Jr. (Our own John Holdren worked there as Director of Research and Publications.) Core Knowledge was founded by a mind educated at my beloved UVA? Forget what I posted before. This man gets to say what's great and what's not, and to disagree would be just ig'nant.:001_huh: Just kidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crissy Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 If one does not have some knowledge of Poe then one is not well educated. One may be a very nice person who likes to think of themselves as educated but they're not educated. Just nice. Why isn't just nice good enough? Nice is good.:) I'm enjoying people saying, on the one hand, that being industrious is just as good as being educated and then absolutely bristling when someone is called uneducated. Could it be that some equate the term uneducated with being stupid, rather than defining the word as not posessing a specific body of knowledge? I admit to being guilty of that when reading the early pages of this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pqr Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fivetails Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 If one does not have some knowledge of Poe then one is not well educated. One may be a very nice person who likes to think of themselves as educated but they're not educated. Well, you're certainly entitled to your own opinion...... Myself, I think that "educated" takes many shapes and forms and doesn't hinge on someone being familar with one specific author. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cathmom Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 It is a good point that many of the works we are made to read in high school are incredibly negative and about people going crazy etc. I remember writing a paper comparing a story (I think called "Silent Snow, Secret Snow") about a little boy going crazy where his hearing got worse with a Poe story about a man going crazy whose hearing got better. This is one of the reasons I like Seton's English courses. They teach the skills of literary analysis using positive, uplifting stories for the most part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted January 31, 2009 Author Share Posted January 31, 2009 It is a good point that many of the works we are made to read in high school are incredibly negative and about people going crazy etc. I remember writing a paper comparing a story (I think called "Silent Snow, Secret Snow") about a little boy going crazy where his hearing got worse with a Poe story about a man going crazy whose hearing got better. This is one of the reasons I like Seton's English courses. They teach the skills of literary analysis using positive, uplifting stories for the most part. I agree...but this might not mean very much...because I don't think I am educated...and I am also not a very nice person...nor am I an iron worker... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crissy Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 I agree...but this might not mean very much...because I don't think I am educated...and I am also not a very nice person...nor am I an iron worker... :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted January 31, 2009 Author Share Posted January 31, 2009 :lol: I did mean to be funny, in a black humor way. But I am also serious. I am sure that asking my octave question puts me in some people's "UNEDUCATED" category. And I struggle with being nice and fail, often. And I am definately not an iron worker...I am not even an ironing board worker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate CA Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 It's not just for personal satisfaction and getting inside jokes. The primary reason should be to gain wisdom. Ignoring 6000 or so years of human history and thought is not the expressway to wisdom. But some of us feel that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom and that wisdom does not come from the world's knowledge or even from history' date=' but from God's word. I am not discounting studying that history, nor am I discounting reading great literature - we do both. With that said, true wisdom, according to God's word, does not come from the world. [/size'] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate CA Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 Yes, and I'm not crazy about the threads where we sit around and chuckle about how poorly educated the masses are compared to us. They make me feel squirmy. Barb Me too. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessedfamily Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 I did mean to be funny, in a black humor way. But I am also serious. I am sure that asking my octave question puts me in some people's "UNEDUCATED" category. And I struggle with being nice and fail, often. And I am definately not an iron worker...I am not even an ironing board worker. Octave question? That's pretty fancy talk. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garga Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 Hey! I recently heard that EAPoe is credited for writing the first detective stories. No one had written stories from the police/detective pov before. I thought that was cool. Not sure if it's true, but it could be. We usually think of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle (Sherlock Holmes) as the first detective stories, but it was Poe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 I did mean to be funny, in a black humor way. But I am also serious. I am sure that asking my octave question puts me in some people's "UNEDUCATED" category. And I struggle with being nice and fail, often. And I am definately not an iron worker...I am not even an ironing board worker. :grouphug: me too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 But some of us feel that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom and that wisdom does not come from the world's knowledge or even from history, but from God's word. I am not discounting studying that history, nor am I discounting reading great literature - we do both. With that said, true wisdom, according to God's word, does not come from the world. I was looking to say something to that effect. You found the words. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugglin'5 Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 But some of us feel that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom and that wisdom does not come from the world's knowledge or even from history, but from God's word. I am not discounting studying that history, nor am I discounting reading great literature - we do both. With that said, true wisdom, according to God's word, does not come from the world. I don't disagree with you. The Bible is the most important, the greatest Great Book. I believe that the other books must be studied with a biblical view as a foundation. It is not an either/or proposition. Yes, if I could only study one thing, it would be the Bible. But that is not our only option generally speaking. And wisdom requires knowing thine enemy as well as thy friends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted January 31, 2009 Author Share Posted January 31, 2009 Octave question? That's pretty fancy talk. :tongue_smilie: oooh, that was really LOL funny to me! Now how do I get bean burrito off my screen? :confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Elf Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 If one does not have some knowledge of Poe then one is not well educated. One may be a very nice person who likes to think of themselves as educated but they're not educated. Just nice. Why isn't just nice good enough? Nice is good, not pretentious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelda Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Well, you're certainly entitled to your own opinion...... Myself, I think that "educated" takes many shapes and forms and doesn't hinge on someone being familar with one specific author. :) I don't believe in entitlements or relativism. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karenciavo Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 That's what I've learned as well. Hey! I recently heard that EAPoe is credited for writing the first detective stories. No one had written stories from the police/detective pov before. I thought that was cool. Not sure if it's true, but it could be. We usually think of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle (Sherlock Holmes) as the first detective stories, but it was Poe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelda Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Could it be that some equate the term uneducated with being stupid, rather than defining the word as not posessing a specific body of knowledge? I admit to being guilty of that when reading the early pages of this thread. I actually think some people just can't stand to admit that everyone isn't perfectly equal. So they take the word 'educated' and change the meaning so that everyone can wear it without doing all that exhausting reading. You know, someday I mean to be truly educated and I don't really want to be called educated until I've achieved it honestly. I'm okay with being things like "good with ______" or "knowledgeable about ______" until then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 There you have it, Zelda is uneducated. ::round of applause:: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 LOL! I need virtue too. How on earth do I teach my children good character qualities when I struggle so much myself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelda Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 So am I. I would give all the education I *do* have to fill the gaps in virtue in my life. I wish I had both education and virtue. If wishes were horses...beggars would ride. Someone educated said that but I forget who because I am not educated. It wasn't Mother Goose? I don't know about your gaps in virtue but I've yet to see gaps in your logic, like ad hominem fallacies and such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate CA Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I don't disagree with you. The Bible is the most important' date=' the greatest Great Book. [/quote'] Agreed. I believe that the other books must be studied with a biblical view as a foundation. It is not an either/or proposition. I do this because we do read other books' date=' but I am not sure you can prove your position from scripture - that studying history and reading "The Great Books" is what makes a wise person. It is what makes a person "educated" in the eyes of the world (or a classical homeschooler :001_smile:) but it does not mean they will be biblically [i']wise[/i]. And wisdom requires knowing thine enemy as well as thy friends. Since my position was that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom I will return to scripture to counter this. I don't think you can find scripture to support the idea that wisdom requires knowing our enemy. I am not sure how a reference to an enemy plays into this conversation because I didn't mention anything along those lines and I don't think it has anything to do with biblical wisdom. My two cents. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I don't think you can find scripture to support the idea that wisdom requires knowing our enemy. I am not sure how a reference to an enemy plays into this conversation because I didn't mention anything along those lines and I don't think it has anything to do with biblical wisdom. My two cents. :001_smile: No, it's from The Art of War by Sun Tzu. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elaine Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Yes, and I'm not crazy about the threads where we sit around and chuckle about how poorly educated the masses are compared to us. They make me feel squirmy. Barb I don't see anyone chuckling about the poorly educated masses. Quite the contrary, I think it's sad. I think that anyone who graduates from a public school without a knowledge of Poe or Shakespeare is poorly uneducated. This is not a mark on their character but rather the school in which they graduated from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted February 1, 2009 Author Share Posted February 1, 2009 It's funny, the connections that you make in life. There is an thread on complex partial & absence seizure on this board. When my daughter first developed complex-partial seizures I came across some theories that maybe Poe wasn't the fall-down drunk that his comtempories thought he was. Someone upthread mentioned Poe's dark, distrubed works and it reminded me of this theory. Here is a quick blurb: Neurological Disorders in Famous Artists Edgar Allan Poe: Substance Abuse versus Epilepsy Bazil C Bogousslavsky J, Boller F (eds): Neurological Disorders in Famous Artists. Front Neurol Neurosci. Basel, Karger, 2005, vol 19, pp 57-64 (DOI: 10.1159/000085603) Article (PDF 99 KB) Free Preview Abstract: Edgar Allan Poe was by all accounts one of the most talented of American storytellers, with many of his tales based on characters with episodic unconsciousness, confusion, and paranoia. Similar episodic behavior is well known to have taken place in Poe’s life as well, and is generally attributed to alcohol or drug abuse. There is considerable evidence, however, that Poe suffered not from simple substance abuse but from complex partial seizures, possibly followed by prolonged confusion and postictal psychosis. Complex partial seizures were not well described in Poe’s time, which could explain a misdiagnosis. Alternatively, he may have suffered from complex partial epilepsy which was complicated or caused by substance abuse. In any case, his personal experiences clearly influenced many of his major works. He represents a fascinating case of a neurological condition in a talented individual, who was then able to use his experiences to give deeper meaning and poignancy to his art. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovemyboys Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 (edited) Why? Why should everyone read Jane Austen? The dialogue alone is enough to bring me back again. Few writers turn a phrase as well as this author does. And she did it over 200 years ago. Amazing. This is reason enough that I want to be in "the great conversation" and I want that for my dc as well. If this conversation didn't exist, I wouldn't push myself to become acquainted with these voices, these characters. It's what drew me to them over 30 years ago and continues to intrigue me. Edited February 1, 2009 by lovemyboys eta: another thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugglin'5 Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Agreed. I do this because we do read other books, but I am not sure you can prove your position from scripture - that studying history and reading "The Great Books" is what makes a wise person. It is what makes a person "educated" in the eyes of the world (or a classical homeschooler :001_smile:) but it does not mean they will be biblically wise. Since my position was that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom I will return to scripture to counter this. I don't think you can find scripture to support the idea that wisdom requires knowing our enemy. I am not sure how a reference to an enemy plays into this conversation because I didn't mention anything along those lines and I don't think it has anything to do with biblical wisdom. My two cents. :001_smile: You're barking up the wrong tree here, Kate. I know what the beginning of wisdom is, and I know that a man can be very well educated and yet be a fool. Yet our greatest apologists for the faith have been widely educated - they didn't just stick their nose in a Bible and never bring it out again. You can't engage the world without understanding their ideas - just ask the Apostle Paul, C.S. Lewis, Francis Schaeffer, or Greg Bahnsen. I really don't know why I am having to defend myself against charges of exalting worldly wisdom. I would think anyone who has read any of my posts over the past year or so would think it a strange thing to charge me with. I thought you and I had a lot in common. I am perplexed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate CA Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 You're barking up the wrong tree here' date=' Kate. I know what the beginning of wisdom is, and I know that a man can be very well educated and yet be a fool. Yet our greatest apologists for the faith have been [i']widely[/i] educated - they didn't just stick their nose in a Bible and never bring it out again. You can't engage the world without understanding their ideas - just ask the Apostle Paul, C.S. Lewis, Francis Schaeffer, or Greg Bahnsen. I really don't know why I am having to defend myself against charges of exalting worldly wisdom. I would think anyone who has read any of my posts over the past year or so would think it a strange thing to charge me with. I thought you and I had a lot in common. I am perplexed. We do have a lot in common in many areas, especially our faith, and I am not trying to perplex you. :001_smile: I was not suggesting a person only read the Bible--not at all. I am having a hard time explaining what I am trying to say. Your quote above "The primary reason should be to gain wisdom. Ignoring 6000 or so years of human history and thought is not the expressway to wisdom." really struck me in a funny way. I don't think learning history or reading literature is going to make a wise person. I don't think they are mutually exclusive. I want you to understand that I do both - I agree that we should, absolutely, but that wisdom comes from someplace else. I am not saying you don't agree. Your statement just struck me in an odd way and I am trying to make us think about what our statements really are saying. I could teach my children nothing from the great books and if they know Christ and seek His word they would gain wisdom--whether they know EAP or not. This is what was missing, IMO, from your comment. Am I making any sense? I apologize for putting you on the defensive. I know we are sisters and I apologize for my poor wording. The idea of a core body of knowledge that all should be familiar with - why should we? I am honestly asking - why do authors like EAP matter? Why should they matter? Because something has been around for many years does that make it the best? What makes it worth knowing? Why is EAP worth knowing? I just want us to think about these things. Perhaps this is fodder for another thread. :001_smile: Again, I apologize. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugglin'5 Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 We do have a lot in common in many areas, especially our faith, and I am not trying to perplex you. :001_smile: I was not suggesting a person only read the Bible--not at all. I am having a hard time explaining what I am trying to say. Your quote above "The primary reason should be to gain wisdom. Ignoring 6000 or so years of human history and thought is not the expressway to wisdom." really struck me in a funny way. I don't think learning history or reading literature is going to make a wise person. I don't think they are mutually exclusive. I want you to understand that I do both - I agree that we should, absolutely, but that wisdom comes from someplace else. I am not saying you don't agree. Your statement just struck me in an odd way and I am trying to make us think about what our statements really are saying. I could teach my children nothing from the great books and if they know Christ and seek His word they would gain wisdom--whether they know EAP or not. This is what was missing, IMO, from your comment. Am I making any sense? I apologize for putting you on the defensive. I know we are sisters and I apologize for my poor wording. The idea of a core body of knowledge that all should be familiar with - why should we? I am honestly asking - why do authors like EAP matter? Why should they matter? Because something has been around for many years does that make it the best? What makes it worth knowing? Why is EAP worth knowing? I just want us to think about these things. Perhaps this is fodder for another thread. :001_smile: Again, I apologize. :001_smile: Okay, we'll make it pax.:001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I don't see anyone chuckling about the poorly educated masses. Quite the contrary, I think it's sad. I think that anyone who graduates from a public school without a knowledge of Poe or Shakespeare is poorly uneducated. This is not a mark on their character but rather the school in which they graduated from. I did not learn about Poe or Shakespeare in High School, but I know about them because of Public Television.;) No lie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I could teach my children nothing from the great books and if they know Christ and seek His word they would gain wisdom--whether they know EAP or not. This is what was missing, IMO, from your comment. Am I making any sense? The idea of a core body of knowledge that all should be familiar with - why should we? I am honestly asking - why do authors like EAP matter? Why should they matter? Because something has been around for many years does that make it the best? What makes it worth knowing? Why is EAP worth knowing? I just want us to think about these things. Perhaps this is fodder for another thread. :001_smile: In contrast, your children could be great historians and yet have no wisdom. I totally agree. I think that most names of men in history are of no consequence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovemyboys Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Why is it important to be well-educated/well-read? Well quite simply it is for your own personal satisfaction. Sure, it can be defended with lots of educational goals, job potential, future employment etc. But it is primarily because you (ideally speaking) enjoy the benefits in your own life. One of those benefits is being part of the conversation. In my opinion this is being culturally literate. Being culturally literate is typically defined in the USA in Western Cultural terms. I'm sure in other parts of the world there are variations on how to define cultural literacy. Taking part in the "conversation" is not confined to literally speaking to another person or contributing to societal/cultural growth. It involves understanding our past and present so that you can understand the references to a body of work when they appear both within and without that work. My elementary aged children participate in the "conversation" when they do the following: gain insight into Harry Potter via it's use/reference to Latin words, watch Bugs Bunny and understand the meaning of "Hug him and squeeze him and call him George" or the musical references to "Barber of Seville", when they visit an art museum and can discuss a painting that references mythological or religious stories they have heard, why a depiction of the Bayeux Tapestry was an inappropriate curtain for a production of Macbeth, why the Roman Playmobil ship has SPQR on the sail, etc. It goes on and on through the Simpsons, Monty Python, etc. In my opinion the actual works that need to be understood to make one well-educated may be larger than one person could fully study in a life time, they are constantly shifting and reinterpreted. It grows as exposure to other cultures grows in the West and as time passes and new works are included. To use a reference from such a cultural lexicon--it is conceptually similar to the difference between a British notion of a constitution and an American notion. Now for the "snobby" part...Being "well-educated" was never meant for everyone. Anyone can obtain such an education because it is certainly part of a lifelong process. However, not everyone would want to pursue such knowledge. I don't mean that in the sense that people who don't follow this path are any sort of lesser person just less educated by the above definition. They are a person with different interests, goals, and contributions to society. Of course your postal worker or plumber can be "well-educated" and your lawyer a mere technician of the law. That is perfectly possible in today's society. This of course leads to the next proposition-national curriculum based on a common understanding of being well-educated. While this notion is appealing from an education standpoint I would, if given the option, vote no. Simply because I would like to not witness the ensuing red tape such a federal bureaucracy would create and the potential difficulties of federal control over homeschooling. One final definition-being "culturally" literate and knowing pop culture are two very different things. A classic Venn diagram where there is some overlapping knowledge that will ultimately have pieces incorporated into the conversation and other will remain pop culture. There is nothing wrong with being well educated. Nothing wrong with trying to give your children a greater understanding of the Western Canon so that they may take part more fully in the conversation. I have the ability to give them some of the pieces that will allow them to fully pursue their interests as adults. They may want to gain other bodies of knowledge as well but they will still be able to laugh with a deeper understanding when Bugs gives Elmer a shampoo. I enjoyed reading your post, perhaps because I agree. I think it's important for us to read these great authors, to hear their voices and ponder their thoughts. I also enjoy the fact that the more culturally "literate" one becomes, the more one sees the interplay that occurs in our culture with these great works. It's dynamic and fascinating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I enjoyed reading your post, Me too. Glad you quoted it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate CA Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 In contrast, your children could be great historians and yet have no wisdom. I totally agree. I think that most names of men in history are of no consequence. Well, I love love love history so I don't think I can agree with your last sentence, but I know what you are trying to say. :001_smile: I just think there is so much to this kind of discussion that it is hard to say it via message board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I just think there is so much to this kind of discussion that it is hard to say it via message board. Yep! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I think that "educated" takes many shapes and forms and doesn't hinge on someone being familar with one specific author. Your thinking is right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosie_0801 Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I was pretty surprised to find out my year 8 English teacher had never heard of 'A Christmas Carol.' "Uh, you know Miss, Charles Dickens!" Uh. No. Charles Dickens may not be a necessary part of everyone's education, but surely for an English teacher! :) Rosie- who prefers Charles Dickens done by the Muppets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I was pretty surprised to find out my year 8 English teacher had never heard of 'A Christmas Carol.' "Uh, you know Miss, Charles Dickens!" Uh. No. Charles Dickens may not be a necessary part of everyone's education, but surely for an English teacher! Oh, dear. That is bad. The same may very well have been true of my own 7th/8th grade English teacher ("gifted" English, no less). I wrote a story in which there were some British characters, and their dialogue intentionally contained differences from American English. (They spoke of renting a flat, for example, rather than an apartment.) For added fun and interest, I also used the British spelling when they spoke. My teacher returned the story ~ no mention was made of the content itself ~ littered with red corrections. I explained to her that I was presenting the characters as British. She clearly didn't understand. "Well, yes, but we don't call sidewalks "pavements". And all this bad spelling is so unlike you!" Ahem.:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laylamcb Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Hey! I recently heard that EAPoe is credited for writing the first detective stories. No one had written stories from the police/detective pov before. I thought that was cool. Not sure if it's true, but it could be. We usually think of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle (Sherlock Holmes) as the first detective stories, but it was Poe. Yes! Many point to Poe's "Murders in the Rue Morgue" and his detective Auguste Dupin as the forerunner of Holmes--and, I suppose, of other literary detectives. Is this the place in the thread where I kill it by suggesting that no one can truly be called educated who doesn't know Sherlock Holmes?? :001_huh: :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Yes! Many point to Poe's "Murders in the Rue Morgue" and his detective Auguste Dupin as the forerunner of Holmes--and, I suppose, of other literary detectives. Is this the place in the thread where I kill it by suggesting that no one can truly be called educated who doesn't know Sherlock Holmes?? :001_huh: :D The pediatrician I worked for felt this way. He even went as far as to buy me a used copy of of Sherlock Holmes because while I heard of it and knew certain well used quotes, I had never read it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laylamcb Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 The pediatrician I worked for felt this way. He even went as far as to buy me a used copy of of Sherlock Holmes because while I heard of it and knew certain well used quotes, I had never read it. I believe it. Devout Sherlockians are just that. It's a religion of sorts. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFP Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I'm reading a science fiction novel right now that makes a passing reference to Poe. Lots of attention's paid to poet John Keats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laylamcb Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I'm reading a science fiction novel right now that makes a passing reference to Poe. Lots of attention's paid to poet John Keats. Do tell, SFP--what's the book? I love Poe and Keats, though I'm not always a sci-fi fan.... :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFP Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Dan Simmons' Hyperion. It's the first in a series of four. I've not read much straight-up sci fi since the 80s, but I LOVED Simmons' The Terror (about the 1840s Franklin expedition) a couple years back, and have a review copy of his latest Drood (a novel about Dickens written by Wilkie Collins) on hand, so I thought I'd give this one a go. I'm enjoying it a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laylamcb Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Thanks--I'll read up on those. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barb_ Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I don't see anyone chuckling about the poorly educated masses. Quite the contrary, I think it's sad. I think that anyone who graduates from a public school without a knowledge of Poe or Shakespeare is poorly uneducated. This is not a mark on their character but rather the school in which they graduated from. I was referring to the original thread here: I overheard the following conversation today Whether or not I believe there are various level of education wasn't the point to my post (and I actually agree wit you). Discussing the *idea* of education, I'm fine with, but I'm not comfortable with threads that begin with no other purpose than to express exasperation at the comments of a particular stranger in a public place. I don't see the purpose other than to giggle and feel superior. Barb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessedfamily Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 The tags on this thread are :lol:. Carry on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 I think that anyone who graduates from a public school without a knowledge of Poe or Shakespeare is poorly uneducated. Or would they be *well* uneducated? :D :auto: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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