I think I ate bad food yesterday

[Ginevra]

Went to a restaurant with my friends. I got a Turkey avocado sandwich, plus fries. I did not notice anything seeming off with the sandwich but before I even finished lunch (only could eat 1/2), my belly began to hurt. I continued all evening and again all day today with a very bad gassy-type belly. I am Still belching quite a lot, despite barely eating anything since then. 
 

I tried ginger rescue. I have taken Gas Ex several times. I had lemon ginger tea. But still my belly hurts. In addition, I have a headache. 
 

Any tried n true help for this? 

[prairiewindmomma]

Started to hurt in under a one hour time frame? If so, not likely food poisoning as in the toxin. Food intolerance maybe….

Any chance your overall gut health issues line up with IBS-C?

[Ginevra]

8 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Started to hurt in under a one hour time frame? If so, not likely food poisoning as in the toxin. Food intolerance maybe….

Any chance your overall gut health issues line up with IBS-C?

I have been dx’d before with IBS/lactose intolerance. But by avoiding dairy I have been symptom free of that for several years. Until now. 
 

It doesn’t seem like a good intolerance though, (in this case) because it has been around 30 hours since I ate that meal and I am still burping and have bad pains in my belly. Back when I was diagnosed, I could usually sleep it off and be okay by the next morning. 

[prairiewindmomma]

Do you have some allergy medicine hanging around the house? I’d pop it and see how it goes.

Did your sandwich also have sprouts?

[regentrude]

Could it be Sibo?

The onset is too fast for food poisoning.

I got symptoms like yours whenever I had factory bread.

Edited August 13, 2023 by regentrude

[Ginevra]

5 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Do you have some allergy medicine hanging around the house? I’d pop it and see how it goes.

Did your sandwich also have sprouts?

No sprouts. 
 

Like Benedryl? 

[Ginevra]

5 minutes ago, regentrude said:

Could it be Sibo?

The onset is too fast for food poisoning.

I got symptoms like yours whenever I had factory bread.

I have never heard of Sibo. Off to look that up…

[Pawz4me]

I have IBS and react like that to hush puppies (which is weird, I think). I've reacted to them from two different restaurants. It's not my normal IBS type reaction. The pain and bloating are different, and the bloating happens quicker than with my normal IBS reaction. I can almost feel my stomach and intestines inflating after a few bites, like blowing up a balloon. It's rather scary. Both times I've had to just wait it out and things got better after three or four days. My only suggestion other than waiting it out is to try peppermint--capsules, tea, or candy made with real peppermint oil.

Edited August 13, 2023 by Pawz4me

[Katy]

Did the sandwich have onions? You’re describing my reaction to too much onion. 

[prairiewindmomma]

Benadryl can be constipating itself…but yeah….Zyrtec, Claritin, whatever. It’s a H1 inhibitor. If you have any Pepcid AC or other H2 inhibitors around I’d take that too. 
 

Avocado naturally has higher histamine levels. 
 

But also, if you haven’t had a recent colonoscopy (your 45 or 50 year one), I’d lean towards seeing a doctor. Gut issues after age 50 make me nervous…I’ve had too many friends end up actually having serious issues.

[Ginevra]

3 minutes ago, Katy said:

Did the sandwich have onions? You’re describing my reaction to too much onion. 

No; it was meant to but I omitted them. I do not like raw onion. It was also meant to have cranberry Mayo but I omitted that too. So it was deli Turkey, avocado and tomato on marbled rye bread. With fries. 🤷🏻‍♀️ None of those are trigger foods for me. 

[Pawz4me]

3 minutes ago, Ginevra said:

None of those are trigger foods for me. 

That's what puzzles me about the reactions I've had to hush puppies. None of the traditional ingredients used to make them are ones that I typically react to, at least not in small amounts.

[Katy]

Hmmm, I have also had that reaction to higher histamine foods, which the turkey could be. But that would only make sense if you’ve had a lot of other high histamine foods and/or allergies lately. 

[regentrude]

18 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

 I can almost feel my stomach and intestines inflating after a few bites, like blowing up a balloon. It's rather scary. Both times I've had to just wait it out and things got better after three or four days. My only suggestion other than waiting it out is to try peppermint--capsules, tea, or candy made with real peppermint oil.

Yes! I had this painful bloating reaction every time I had factory bread. I'd swell up and look six months pregnant within minutes. It wasn't gluten; pasta and homemade bread are fine; it must have been some kind of additive. It would get better over the course of a few days.

 

[chocolate-chip chooky]

My guess is that it isn't food poisoning, due to the time frame.

I'm wondering if it was a reaction to the bread. Is it a type you usually eat? 

One of my daughters gets stomach pain after eating certain types of bread products, such as shelf-stable English muffins. A dietitian said it was likely a preservative causing the reaction.

I hope you feel better soon 🌻

[Ginevra]

27 minutes ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

My guess is that it isn't food poisoning, due to the time frame.

I'm wondering if it was a reaction to the bread. Is it a type you usually eat? 

One of my daughters gets stomach pain after eating certain types of bread products, such as shelf-stable English muffins. A dietitian said it was likely a preservative causing the reaction.

I hope you feel better soon 🌻

It’s a possibility. I don’t eat much store bread at all. I don’t want the insulin spike. I will eat sourdough or high-grain breads or my own homemade, which never seems to bother me. But I guess it could have had to do with the bread. 

[EKS]

It is possible to get food poisoning pretty quickly, but that is usually of the vomiting variety, not the gas variety.

What did you eat at the previous meal or two?  Perhaps something there was the culprit.

[Ginevra]

18 minutes ago, EKS said:

It is possible to get food poisoning pretty quickly, but that is usually of the vomiting variety, not the gas variety.

What did you eat at the previous meal or two?  Perhaps something there was the culprit.

Breakfast was just a very small bowl (like, 3/4 cup) of cold cereal with almonds and cranberries with oat milk. And a cup of black coffee. 🤷🏻‍♀️ Nothing much to see there. Night before was pizza night. Homemade pizza. Mushrooms, tomatoes pepperoni. Nothing different from what I would usually have. I did have red wine with the pizza, but that’s not unusual, either. It’s even a particular wine I have had several times before. 

[HomeAgain]

The bread is a distinct possibility.  There might have been a high yeast content.

I don't have any other remedies besides trying some Tums.  The chalkiness might help with the gas.

[bookbard]

I had the exact situation as you - ate food out, same symptoms - and looking back I think it was giardia. It lasted for quite a while - treatment for giardia is antibiotics. I would start with serious yoghurt, sauerkraut etc - anything with good bacteria to try and get rid of the bad - but if it doesn't help, ask the Dr for a test for giardia (I think it is a stool test). 

[Pawz4me]

11 minutes ago, HomeAgain said:

The bread is a distinct possibility.  There might have been a high yeast content.

Some researchers think that some people who believe they are gluten intolerant are actually reacting to the rapid rise yeast used in many commercial baked goods. That may be one reason some of us do better with homemade bread. 
 
But also—Rye flour is a big IBS trigger for me. I don’t really have trouble with commercial wheat bread, but I can’t tolerate more than a bite of rye bread. It’s very high in FODMAPs. 

[Elizabeth86]

Probably just the avocado. Avocado makes my tummy crampy and gassy sometimes. Other times not.

[regentrude]

7 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

Some researchers think that some people who believe they are gluten intolerant are actually reacting to the rapid rise yeast used in many commercial baked goods. 

But that yeast wouldn't survive the baking process. Doesn't yeast die at 160 F? 

Edited August 14, 2023 by regentrude

[Pawz4me]

3 minutes ago, regentrude said:

But that yeast wouldn't survive the baking process. Doesn't yeast die at 160 F? 

I don’t know. I don’t remember any of the articles I’ve read saying anything about that. 

[EKS]

44 minutes ago, regentrude said:

Doesn't yeast die at 160 F? 

140 even.

[Pawz4me]

So I shouldn't post after 9:00. 😉 

I did some more digging into the yeast issue this morning (when my brain works a little better), and the premise is actually that the rapid rise yeast used to make commercial bread and other baked goods rise so incredibly fast doesn't allow enough time for gluten to be "pre-digested" in the rising process, which results in final products that have very high gluten content. The commercial products often rise in as little as a few minutes, not the many hours it takes traditional or homemade products (including sourdough) to rise.

Stephen Jones, the chair of the Breadlab at Washington State University, is the main person behind this theory. He hasn't been able to prove it yet, thus if you research it you get articles and not studies. But I find the theory interesting, since so many of us do seem to tolerate homemade yeast bread or sourdough bread much better than commercial products. My sourdough bread takes 14--18 hours total to rise, not minutes. 

Edited August 14, 2023 by Pawz4me

[HomeAgain]

12 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

So I shouldn't post after 9:00. 😉 

I did some more digging into the yeast issue this morning (when my brain works a little better), and the premise is actually that the rapid rise yeast used to make commercial bread and other baked goods rise so incredibly fast doesn't allow enough time for gluten to be "pre-digested" in the rising process, which results in final products that have very high gluten content. The commercial products often rise in as little as a few minutes, not the many hours it takes traditional or homemade products (including sourdough) to rise.

Stephen Jones, the chair of the Breadlab at Washington State University, is the main person behind this theory. He hasn't been able to prove it yet, thus if you research it you get articles and not studies. But I find the theory interesting, since so many of us do seem to tolerate homemade yeast bread or sourdough bread much better than commercial products. My sourdough bread takes 14--18 hours total to rise, not minutes. 

This is interesting!  I always just assumed I had issues with yeast breads (I tend not to eat them much at all now) but now that I think about it, they're all what my kid calls "American bread", and they're also things he won't touch unless he has to. 

 

Adding - I never attached it to gluten but to the amount of 'bubbles' in the bread.  It doesn't look right.

Edited August 14, 2023 by HomeAgain

[Rosie_0801]

When my kids were small and uncivilised, they used to throw cheap white bread on the floor, along with the serviette. Possibly thinking it *was* a serviette? They didn't recognise it as food, anyway.

[Grace Hopper]

4 hours ago, Rosie_0801 said:

When my kids were small and uncivilised, they used to throw cheap white bread on the floor, along with the serviette. Possibly thinking it *was* a serviette? They didn't recognise it as food, anyway.

My pawpaw used to call it”wasp nest.” Grandma made everything from scratch until their old age when they started getting grocery store bread - which he wouldn’t touch. 
 

@Ginevra two things hit me like that soon after eating - corn chips and commercial white breads for sub-like sandwiches. It usually takes 18-24 hours to pass. I agree that food poisoning - aside from there actually being a toxin added to the food (like a cleaning product spill) - is a much later onset than just shortly after eating. 

Edited August 14, 2023 by Grace Hopper

[Grace Hopper]

13 hours ago, Pawz4me said:

Some researchers think that some people who believe they are gluten intolerant are actually reacting to the rapid rise yeast used in many commercial baked goods. That may be one reason some of us do better with homemade bread. 
 
But also—Rye flour is a big IBS trigger for me. I don’t really have trouble with commercial wheat bread, but I can’t tolerate more than a bite of rye bread. It’s very high in FODMAPs. 

This is really interesting to me as someone who has a non-Celiac gluten intolerance (that’s what my GI calls it, I have some symptoms of celiac with wheat intake but based on scope results no intestinal damage as is evident with celiac). 

[Junie]

No idea if you're dealing with a gluten issue or not, but when I have a gluten reaction, I often feel like you do now.  The only thing that I have found that gives relief (unfortunately) is to go on a liquid diet for about five days.

Hope you feel better soon!

[Ditto]

How are you feeling today?  

[Ginevra]

3 hours ago, Ditto said:

How are you feeling today?  

Better than yesterday; not perfectly fine yet. I was still more or less afraid to eat much today and I brought my lunch home untouched. 

[Ditto]

1 hour ago, Ginevra said:

Better than yesterday; not perfectly fine yet. I was still more or less afraid to eat much today and I brought my lunch home untouched. 

I am not sure how to "react" to your post, so I chose not to.  I am glad you are feeling better than yesterday (to which I would "like") but it stinks you didn't eat your lunch and are still a bit afraid to eat much today (to which I would react with "sad").    Hopefully tomorrow you will feel even better.  

[Shoeless]

I don't want to stress you, but I think you should see a doctor about this. You were having some other gi issues recently, too yes? Not being able to "go" like you used to. And now this...I am a little concerned there may be something else going on. 

[Pawz4me]

5 hours ago, Shoeless said:

I don't want to stress you, but I think you should see a doctor about this. You were having some other gi issues recently, too yes? Not being able to "go" like you used to. And now this...I am a little concerned there may be something else going on. 

That's a good idea. Although I think it's likely that since she already has an IBS diagnosis what's happening is likely a stress related exacerbation of that. But still a great idea to rule out other things.

[Ausmumof3]

I get like that when I have eggs more than once a week. I also have issues with too much shop bread but it’s more of a build up than instant reaction? Some breads have random stuff like pea flour or soy etc which can be problematic. Was there any kind of spread or oil on the bread?

[Ausmumof3]

Also do you have peppermint tea? Sometimes that helps 

Edited August 15, 2023 by Ausmumof3

[Grace Hopper]

13 hours ago, Shoeless said:

I don't want to stress you, but I think you should see a doctor about this. You were having some other gi issues recently, too yes? Not being able to "go" like you used to. And now this...I am a little concerned there may be something else going on. 

 

7 hours ago, Pawz4me said:

That's a good idea. Although I think it's likely that since she already has an IBS diagnosis what's happening is likely a stress related exacerbation of that. But still a great idea to rule out other things.

IBS and diverticulitis are often related. If you aren’t feeling better soon, if it happens again or you have an accompanying fever, definitely get it checked out. 

[prairiewindmomma]

2 hours ago, Grace Hopper said:

 

IBS and diverticulitis are often related. If you aren’t feeling better soon, if it happens again or you have an accompanying fever, definitely get it checked out. 

This is where my mind went too.

[Ginevra]

2 hours ago, prairiewindmomma said:

This is where my mind went too.

I thought diverticulitis is so painful you couldn’t possibly not go to the hospital. That was the case with a small sampling of friends who have had it. 
 

 

[prairiewindmomma]

17 minutes ago, Ginevra said:

I thought diverticulitis is so painful you couldn’t possibly not go to the hospital. That was the case with a small sampling of friends who have had it. 
 

 

In my sampling of friends and family, those with higher pain tolerances didn't go to the hospital during the first few attacks.  One thought she had been glutened from residual contamination (also has celiac disease). Other has a history of IBS also and only went in when a fistula developed.  Diverticulitis has various stages, and if you're earlier on and used to gut woes, it can be confusing.

But, also, I have had one friend with colorectal cancer at age 30, and a few in their 40s. Bloating, cramping, stooling issues.....it's worth getting scoped if you haven't recently. They were all healthy eaters, and while a couple of them had bad genetics, a couple of them were complete surprises. About double the people under 55 are getting diagnosed compared to ten years ago. It's why they've pushed the age for the first scope younger.

IBS already increases the amount of inflammation in your gut.  It bumps your colorectal cancer risk. https://www.cancer.gov/news-events/cancer-currents-blog/2020/colorectal-cancer-rising-younger-adults

 

 

[Grace Hopper]

4 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

In my sampling of friends and family, those with higher pain tolerances didn't go to the hospital during the first few attacks.  One thought she had been glutened from residual contamination (also has celiac disease). Other has a history of IBS also and only went in when a fistula developed.  Diverticulitis has various stages, and if you're earlier on and used to gut woes, it can be confusing.

But, also, I have had one friend with colorectal cancer at age 30, and a few in their 40s. Bloating, cramping, stooling issues.....it's worth getting scoped if you haven't recently. They were all healthy eaters, and while a couple of them had bad genetics, a couple of them were complete surprises. About double the people under 55 are getting diagnosed compared to ten years ago. It's why they've pushed the age for the first scope younger.

IBS already increases the amount of inflammation in your gut.  It bumps your colorectal cancer risk. https://www.cancer.gov/news-events/cancer-currents-blog/2020/colorectal-cancer-rising-younger-adults

 

 

What she said^

[Katy]

On 8/14/2023 at 5:31 AM, Pawz4me said:

So I shouldn't post after 9:00. 😉 

I did some more digging into the yeast issue this morning (when my brain works a little better), and the premise is actually that the rapid rise yeast used to make commercial bread and other baked goods rise so incredibly fast doesn't allow enough time for gluten to be "pre-digested" in the rising process, which results in final products that have very high gluten content. The commercial products often rise in as little as a few minutes, not the many hours it takes traditional or homemade products (including sourdough) to rise.

Stephen Jones, the chair of the Breadlab at Washington State University, is the main person behind this theory. He hasn't been able to prove it yet, thus if you research it you get articles and not studies. But I find the theory interesting, since so many of us do seem to tolerate homemade yeast bread or sourdough bread much better than commercial products. My sourdough bread takes 14--18 hours total to rise, not minutes. 

Well that's interesting for a myriad of reasons. I've heard several people who visited the US complain that they gained 20 pounds in 2 weeks. They thought it was the bread.  Well that and the lack of walking. So many places don't have sidewalks that it would be unsafe to walk even if you wanted to.  But you cannot gain 20 pounds of fat in two weeks. You can certainly stress your body and gain 20 pounds of inflammation though.

So the moral is either sourdough or use regular yeast?

[Pawz4me]

6 hours ago, Katy said:

 

So the moral is either sourdough or use regular yeast?

I'm leery of most store sourdough bread, both the branded stuff and the loves from grocery store bakeries. Most of the ones I've looked at that list the ingredients have yeast in them, so I'm guessing they're mostly yeast bread with a little sourdough thrown in for flavoring, and that it's enough yeast for a very fast rise.