Do you have your child master reading before you begin spelling?

[mo2]

My dd has really struggled with reading. She is almost 7 and is finally to the point where she can read CVC words. I plan on using All About Spelling, but I don't know when to start it. Should I wait until she is reading fluently, or would AAS possibly help her with her reading?

[Veritaserum]

:lurk5:

[sagira]

I know I do. While he's doing phonics he is looking at the formation of words and how they come together. As he becomes a more fluent reader, and especially writer, I'm going to see where his weak spots are and build a spelling notebook just for him. My plan is to use natural spelling methods and only use something more structured if I see the need arise.

 

Ds (5) is interested in how things are spelled and asks me all the time: how is this spelled? Is this spelled correctly?" So far so good :D

[LisaKinVA]

I would say, as a general rule "yes." However, the occassional child comes along who "wants" to do spelling :confused: -- and I've made that accomodation, making "spelling" words out of the sounds that were part of the phonics lessons.

 

For some reason, my children tend to get jealous if they aren't doing what someone else is... the grass is always greener, it seems (even, when it's only a can of spray paint!)

[Melissa B]

Yes. We do copywork until 2nd grade or so. My dd5 likes to sit in and try some of the words from Sequential Spelling from time to time. But I will probably start it "officially" with both my younger children when they are in 2nd and 3rd.

[Matryoshka]

Yes and no. I didn't begin a formal spelling curriculum till 2nd grade, but waay before that they would ask me to spell things for them to write down, and I'd always make them sound it out, sound by sound, asking what comes next (I'd help with tough chunks). I think this really helped reinforce the reading and decoding skills.

[Lisa in the UP of MI]

Nope. DD can sound out CVC, CVCC, and other similar level words. However she will only read words in isolation. She is quite interested in spelling, however, so I am going to start AAS this week. She can already spell many of the words in the first level but she needs to learn the rules and the multi-letter phonograms. I also answer any reading/spelling questions that she has. I'm not really sure where to go with her reading but I'm going with spelling for now since that is where her interest lies.

Edited November 16, 2008 by Lisa in the UP of MI

[G5052]

I begin spelling when they've finished the phonics program that we prefer (Rod and Staff), but at that point I'm not expecting mastery of reading, just the ability to deal with the phonetic sounds of English. Spelling then reinforces phonics and brings in words that they may not have encountered in their reading.

[Trivium Academy]

We started 1st grade with all the WTM recommendations, including Spelling Workout. In 2nd grade I began wondering why dd wasn't building reading fluency and if spelling was useful at all. I dropped SWO and concentrated on fluency, I traded SWO for Explode the Code and she's progressed well since. We will start spelling again after ETC 8 is finished.

 

Dd asks me to spell words for her, she likes to write captions for pictures that she draws. I'm glad we dropped spelling for a while, with our son- I won't have him start spelling until he's fluently reading on a 4th/5th grade level or done with the ETC books, whichever comes first.

 

I found comfort and understanding about this through reading Ruth Beechick and Christine Miller. I think spelling can be taught while phonics are being taught but the method is important. Gaining reading fluency was a higher priority to me than teaching my 2nd grader how to spell.

[ELaurie]

with ds 6, along with TOPG. It's working well here; he happens to like spelling better than phonics, and what he is learning in AAS reinforces his reading skills.

[Linda...inOwasso]

Yes. Read first, spell later. My dd5 is starting to ask "how do you spell....." which is my indication that she's ready to begin a spelling program. She's a strong reader.

[Penelope]

I wonder about this, too.

 

I have a 6 yo who is reading. I don't know how to assess reading level exactly, but he reads SL 2-intermediate books independently--I guess that is late 2nd grade level?

 

We are almost through AAS level 1 and up through lesson 19 or 20, it is mostly cvc and cvcc words, so we fly through a lesson and he hasn't learned anything new. But now that we are getting to the end of the book and encountering a few rules, I am feeling like it is a waste of time to do spelling now. I wonder if it is not only good to wait until they are reading well, but also really writing a lot and having something to say? My son does copywork daily and he might write a note or a caption or something once a week or so. But I think it might be better for a rules-based spelling program to be learned when he can apply it.

 

There is also the thought that some will be natural spellers and won't need a spelling program, but you won't likely know that yet in first grade. I have heard that spelling lags 1-2 years behind reading level. I am a natural speller and having to learn rules might have tripped me up more than helped (because there are many exceptions to the rules).

[JumpedIntoTheDeepEndFirst]

I think you need a good handle on phonics before you can spell. I waited with ds until he was good at sounding out the words he would be asked to spell and he understands spelling rules, vowel combinations much better than dd. She learned whole word reading (in a school) and has trouble hearing the sounds in words and using the spelling rules that are phonics based (ie-long vowel I combinations are made with...). However, I never discouraged writing-we just worked our way through the creative spellings the kids used, wrote second drafts etc. as needed.

[Annabel Lee]

...and based on what I've seen in all 3 of my kids, the two should not be separated (of course there's always kids that are exceptions to one's assumptions).

I used Abeka K4 and K5 with my dd and older ds. In this, the child learns to spell the sounds as they learn them via phonics charts drills that take 5 min. per day or less. My youngest ds in in kindergarden this year and we're using OPGTTR but I've retained use of those chart drills for both of my sons. We say them like so: " /st/ in stop, s t" (sound, word example, and spelling of the sound). Their K-3rd charts cover most sounds and some spelling exceptions. I'm sure there's other programs out there that offer this, but this is what I've got and it works, so we use it.

I don't implement a formal spelling program (Abeka still) until 1st grade, and even then, we're not all that formal about it.

[Laurie4b]

Reading and spelling are flip sides of the same coin. I would be teaching the encoding (spelling) of the very same words that she is decoding in reading. That reinforces both skills. Don't give her the same CVC words each day. Teach her the pattern instead. As she writes a word, have her say the sound as she makes the corresponding letter.

[ElizabethB]

Spelling actually makes learning the phonics easier and reinforces the phonics. I started with just reading with my daughter before K, for K we used Webster's Speller, which does reading and spelling at the same time. The syllables and the spelling in Webster's Speller really made her reading take off.

 

With my remedial students, I've always done some spelling, but I'm doing a lot more lately, oral spelling seems to be especially helpful, but I do both oral and written spelling and find it extremely helpful.

[Ellie]

on what you've used to teach your dc to read.

 

Spalding and its lookalikes teach children to read by teaching them to spell. There is never really a separation between reading and spelling.

 

When other more traditional methods are used to teach dc to read, I usually suggest that people wait until the dc are, oh, 8 or 9ish before doing Official Spelling, because that's when most dc are reading quite well.

[MerryAtHope]

AAS says that if your child is ready to begin learning how to read, they can begin to learn spelling with their program. Here's a link on readiness skills from their site: http://all-about-spelling.com/spelling-readiness

 

I think AAS would help a child with reading. Merry :-)

[Guest]

I'll be the dissenter. But I'm a newbie to hs-ing so what do I know?!? :lol: I'm using SWR with my son. It teaches the child to think to spell as soon as they know most of their basic phonograms. When they are able to understand the hows and whys to spelling, reading is *supposed* to come pretty naturally. (I'll let you know in a few years!)

 

Re: AAS, my sil started that this year with my nephew who is 7 and a struggling reader. It sounds like they have made leaps and bounds this year. HTH!

[JenniferB]

I'll be the dissenter. But I'm a newbie to hs-ing so what do I know?!? :lol: I'm using SWR with my son [daughter]. It teaches the child to think to spell as soon as they know most of their basic phonograms. When they are able to understand the hows and whys to spelling, reading is *supposed* to come pretty naturally. (I'll let you know in a few years!)

 

:iagree:

[Mere2]

I have a 6 1/2 yr old DD who has really been struggling in reading. So I purchased Dancing Bears (UK reading programme used with dyslexic children and Apples and Pears spelling programme). We only started the books about 5 weeks ago, started both spelling and reading at the same time and the difference is amazing!

 

I would definitely start spelling, I really think it helps a struggling reader with encoding and decoding.

 

Good luck

Fi

[FO4UR]

I am another SWR dissenter:tongue_smilie:

 

I think there are some kids who just "get it" better doing spelling first. I tried OPGTR and Bob Books with my ds5 and he HATED IT! When ever I inflict "torture reading" on him he cries for me to say the sounds. The boy is a serious auditory learner. He can audibly break down words into sounds and put sounds together to form words easily, but it's harder for him to associated the VISUAL symbol to the sound. When I make him do it, he can but I don't want learning to read to be associated with hours of torture:lol:

 

Funny thing, when I start with the sound and have him write the sound - he READS IT!!!

 

SWR just does things backwards compared to other programs, which is great if you have a dc who does things .....well, backwards.

[StephanieZ]

When my oldest was 6 or so, I started Spelling Power b/c she'd been reading for a couple years and was reading at a 3rd gr level or so. It was a bad idea -- didn't fly well at all.

 

From trial and error, I've figured out that for my dc:

 

1) formal spelling isn't needed until about 3rd grade. At that point, I use SWO (starting around level c).

 

2) if they WANT spelling earlier, SWO A, etc is fine. My Ker is using SWO A now and that is fine. I don't think it is really necessary, but is harmless and she likes it.

 

3) ETC is awesome for building spelling skills alongside reading. My younger two have had the benefit of ETC as part of our learn-to-read process and they're much better spellers than my oldest, who didn't have the benefit of ETC.

 

4) So, my basic spelling routine would be:

 

a) use ETC alongside a core phonics program for preK-2nd gr (atleast through ETC3 or 4, more if you like)

b) add in SWO around level C around 3rd grade (when ending ETC or alongside if you prefer)

c) can use lower SWO levels earlier if you wish

[JenniferB]

I think there are some kids who just "get it" better doing spelling first. I tried OPGTR and Bob Books with my ds5 and he HATED IT! When ever I inflict "torture reading" on him he cries for me to say the sounds. The boy is a serious auditory learner. He can audibly break down words into sounds and put sounds together to form words easily, but it's harder for him to associated the VISUAL symbol to the sound. When I make him do it, he can but I don't want learning to read to be associated with hours of torture:lol:

 

Funny thing, when I start with the sound and have him write the sound - he READS IT!!!

 

SWR just does things backwards compared to other programs, which is great if you have a dc who does things .....well, backwards.

 

:iagree:with this too. Well said regarding "torture reading" and the visual symbol problems, and reading from his/her own writing!

[Ottakee]

http://www.prometheantrust.org/soundfoundationsbooks.htm Here is the link to these books.

 

I am ver happy to hear that your dd is making great progress with the program. I LOVE the Apples and Pears spelling and have used a few of the Dancing Bears books as well.

 

I also suggest the I See Sam set of reading books for struggling kids. I took my kids through the first 4 sets of these and then started the Apples and Pears spelling and it has gone very well. http://www.roadstoeverywhere.com/3RsPlusRead.html

[cillakat]

My dd has really struggled with reading. She is almost 7 and is finally to the point where she can read CVC words. I plan on using All About Spelling, but I don't know when to start it. Should I wait until she is reading fluently, or would AAS possibly help her with her reading?

 

All About Spelling will very likely help with reading as it's an Orton-Gillingham based program and is designed based on those principles. it's sequential, incremental, systematic, comprehensive (for spelling) and thorough.

 

For a reading who's truly struggling, you can do All About Spelling in a way that focuses not just on the encoding, but the decoding....ie working on the reading and the spelling simultaneously.

 

:)

K

[Lovedtodeath]

I did not read all of the replies. I would start AAS. I would skip learning to spell any sight wprds or rule breakers. Teach her to read and spell with phonics at the same time, staying within the same set of phonics rules for both.

[TracyR]

Yes and No.

Yes I did wait until my oldest was up and reading before starting spelling. With that said she is my worst speller. My 2nd daughter started reading and spelling early and she is my best speller. My 5yr old is spelling words as she is learning to read. She likes to spell and is doing well.

I've learn the act of spelling and the act of reading are two different things. To me to start spelling the eariler the better.

Plus I've found that it helps with reading too :>)

[Jill- OK]

...I supplement our program (either Phonics Pathways or Reading Reflex) with workbooks from Explode the Code (phonics), and I think that exercises the same thinking patterns that spelling utilizes, it's just serving the additional purpose of cementing their phonics skills, first.

 

YMMV.