s/o dreams UPDATE Post #1

[EmilyGF]

UPDATE August: I got a job yesterday! I'm freelancing in a field that I've thought of working in for years but couldn't figure out how to break into. I had my first meeting this morning for a 6 week project! 

 

(Don't quote, I might delete.) The dying dreams thread has gotten me thinking about my own dreams.

 

I've always been one to juggle many competing dreams. I always wanted a big family. I also wanted to homeschool. I was always a top student in school and went to a college that was ranked #1 while I was in it. For a while I wanted to be a lawyer. I sang at a very high level in high school and contemplated opera (though my parents were too practical to ever consider that!). I ended up an engineer.

 

Yet, I turned 36 a few weeks ago and I realize that the windows on many dreams are going to be closing in the next few years. I could still go back into engineering (it would be hard, but I've reached out to people and I do think it would be doable from my contacts), but that won't be the case once I get into my forties. I could pivot into something else in the private sector, probably in the finance direction. But most interesting careers probably would be out of reach if I wait another 5 years. I think.

 

I could become a math or physics teacher (my major in college) at the high school level eventually because those are always needed where I live... but the windows are closing on things I'd actually like to do. 

 

Yet, I want a happy family and I have five kids. I sort of think a full time working mom and a happy and large family are pretty difficult to have at the same time. My mom went back to work when I was in high school and was always really grouchy after that; you'd just sort of stay out of her way when she was home. My kids would most likely go to private school so that the time I'd actually be home would be spent with me and not on the bus. So there goes any paycheck. 

 

And yet... the dream juggling has become harder. 

 

I don't know if I want suggestions; I'm not creative enough to come up with any ideas right now. This isn't a JAWM thread. I do realize I am privileged - my husband has a good job he loves, my kids don't have special needs that require me to be home all the time, I have a great degree from an awesome college, we live within our income, and my husband is totally open to me becoming a career woman. Generally, I'm happy. But I see the window closing and wonder if there is something I can do now...

 

My youngest is almost one. 

 

Theoretically, hubby is fine with me getting a masters degree if I want to.

 

ETA: Son had visit at private school that we thought would be a great fit on Tuesday - and it was a bomb. So no private school light at the end of the tunnel anymore... I'm going to be all in homeschooling next year.

 

Emily

 

 

 

Edited August 4, 2017 by EmilyGF

[bettyandbob]

Do you still want to be a lawyer. Patent law is really a good field and lots of people take circuitous routes. Depending on where you live you may be able to find work with a patent firm now and figure out if you like it. You can become a patent agent while working for a firm. Some forms may help you pay for law school (I think this is rare, but I do know people who got that).

 

 

Just an idea to explore and see if it fits you.

[fairfarmhand]

I think for full time working parents you're going to have to hire good help to cope and have joy. You'll need to connect with the kids after work instead of cleaning and doing laundry.

 

Especially if you're in a stressful position and commuting more than 10 minutes

.

Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkWho's in children's. Church in January?

Edited January 4, 2017 by fairfarmhand

[The Girls' Mom]

As a person starting over in her 40s, I hope all my interesting windows aren't closed!  I think you'll be surprised at what you can do past the age of 40.  It isn't as "old" as it used to be...

[Bluegoat]

I think that this isn't something that you can really overcome.  I mean, you can almost certainly have some sort of fulfilling second career, or enjoy yourself by becoming more involved in music as an amateur, or have some new ideas about things to do, and so on. 

 

But I think it's a necessary part of growing older for everyone to realize that as they some things will no longer be open to you or won't seem worthwhile, or things you were interested in or hoped to do won't come to fruition, and that some choices and circumstances will mean some paths are closed.  We are more limited than our imaginations and desires in most cases. 

 

It's part of accepting our mortality and I think there is really a kind of wisdom and calm that can come out of that  perspective.  Really, as young people the idea that there is time for it all is a sign of youth, and while its exciting and gets things done, it isn't true even at that age.  We just aren't wise enough to really know that, or maybe we know it in the abstract and many of us just haven't experienced it personally to the same degree.

[MomatHWTK]

My BIL was in his late 50's to early 60's when he decided to go to law school. At various times in the last 15 years, I've taken up cross stitch, singing, knitting, and most recently professional writing. 

 

In your situation, I think you need to make a list of the things you currently think you are interested in doing. Determine why each item is on your list-- do you want to make money or just have something to do? Decide what value to place on each activity-- slightly interested or really want to do it? Evaluate how much you are willing to sacrifice to achieve the goal. Law school is three years and lots of reading and writing. Singing would require finding an instructor and daily practice. Finally, examine your limitations--time, money, geography. For instance, if you feel strongly pulled to reenter engineering, then you need to work within your time limits. Singing is probably something you could study as a hobby. I'm sure you could find a local performance group that would appreciate your talents at any age. 

 

Too many options is a nice problem to have, but it can still be a problem.  :001_smile:

[shanvan]

I think I am not understanding....what windows are closing?  Why would interesting careers be out of reach in 5 yrs?

I had the same reaction.  None of us know the future.  IT is possible to pursue dreams even when you are older.  I know a 92 year old man who got a puppy to train.  He has that puppy competing now, two years later.   He does have people in place who will take his dog should anything happen to him, so he was responsible about it.  There are people who disapprove and think he is too old.  They need to get over it.  He is still living--and I think his dog helps him stay healthy.  Sometimes windows do close, but age (meaning a number) has very little to do with it.

[Bluegoat]

With doors closing - all kinds of things can make that happen.  Physical or mental resilience, for one, or lack of time or money, location.  A professional opera career is probably not a reasonable goal for people at 50.

 

Sometimes it is just that the trade-offs aren't worth it.  Taking time to get a law degree, while trying to run the family life you want, may not be possible, or the career shorter than would be worthwhile...

 

I think most people end up balancing all these things against each other.  Not many are the people with one clear goal or dream that trumps all the others, and even many of them have to deal with external limitations.

[maize]

I know a woman who went to law school in her fifties--when she was at the tail end of raising her eight children.

 

It is true that not every opportunity is always open to us, but we usually do have a great many choices and opportunities available. Raising and homeschooling five children is a choice, just like any other, that has its own opportunity costs; I think it is possible to accept that without also viewing the future as a series of closed doors.

[Bluegoat]

I know a woman who went to law school in her fifties--when she was at the tail end of raising her eight children.

 

It is true that not every opportunity is always open to us, but we usually do have a great many choices and opportunities available. Raising and homeschooling five children is a choice, just like any other, that has its own opportunity costs; I think it is possible to accept that without also viewing the future as a series of closed doors.

 

I'm not sure though if that was Emily's problem, that she sees it as only closed doors.  Maybe she can expand wen she comes back.  I though it was more a matter of seeing doors close for what were in fact personal goals for her.

 

I think for many people, that can be a bit of a startling thing, when it first hits you.

[Crimson Wife]

I think it's a good idea to think about what attracts you about going to law school and see what other career options offer those same attractions but without needing to spend 3 years and $$$ on getting a J.D. Paralegal training is relatively short and inexpensive, and there are probably many more PT options for paralegal work than lawyer work.

 

I think it can be hard for those of us who attended elite universities to reject the whole "YOU MUST HAVE A HIGH-POWERED CAREER!!!!!!!" mindset pervasive in that environment. It's perfectly ok to have a "medium-powered" career that offers a better work-life balance. :)

 

When I first started considering what I want to do with the next stage of my life, I looked into becoming a neuropsychologist. That turned out not to be a practical option due to requiring 5 years' worth of additional in-person schooling at $$$$. If I had been 28 at the time rather than 38, it would be a different story but c'est la vie. But a lot of what attracted me to neuropsychology is also found in speech & language pathology. That required only 3 years of FT schooling and the 1st year's worth of courses could be done PT via distance education fairly inexpensively. And even the 2nd and 3rd years can potentially be done in a hybrid format, with some coursework online and just the clinical practica done in-person. It's still TBD whether I will get accepted to the hybrid program but I'm a strong applicant so I'm cautiously optimistic.

 

I won't make nearly as much money as a SLP as I would've as a neuropsych, but OTOH, I won't have huge student loans to pay back either.

[regentrude]

Emily, I feel for you. I have no real advice; doors do close and no amount of wishful thinking makes that not so.

 

I think I am not understanding....what windows are closing?  Why would interesting careers be out of reach in 5 yrs?

 

Being a professional opera singer, for example - that ship has sailed. You won't get admitted to any conservatory; a voice ages and can no longer be formed and trained as in a young person. 

This was my one big dream, and I am still wondering what if... and I won't ever get a chance to find out. (ETA: And no, dabbling in amateur music is not the same and not a comforting substitute))

 

Also, it is very hard to get back into some fields after a longer break. For example, if I wanted to go back into research and obtain a job doing so, I would first need to spend years attempting to work in private without any funding (so only possible for a theorist!), and produce and publish results that are good enough to get a position in a cut throat competetive market where entry level positions go to young people who then can be an asset to their departments for decades. Nobody wants to hire a fifty year old on a tenure track position, that makes no sense for the department.

 

No, doors do close, and all the well meaning saying "it is never too late" does not change that. It's not too late for many things, but for some it is.

Edited January 4, 2017 by regentrude

[regentrude]

Emily, I found myself in a similar position recently. Not quite the same since I have always been working in a job that at least uses my degree, but with the empty nest rapidly approaching, I did a lot of soul searching what to do with the next half of my life.

I have contemplated getting another degree in an unrelated field, but our location does not make this feasible, since I have zero interest in an online program.

For me, the solution was to continue in my job but to also spend serious time pursuing my passion for writing which had fallen by the wayside. It took me two years to figure out that this is what I want to do, and I am much happier since I have decided to do this.

Best wishes!

[regentrude]

Someone might not get admitted to any conservatory, or their voice might not be trainable, but that doesn't mean they can't do SOMETHING with the opera.  Or perhaps musical theater.  Or just go try out for America's Got Talent lol.  But just because a specific goal and path isn't accessible, that doesn't mean the dream itself has to die....maybe just change somewhat. 

 

But that's not the same dream then. 

Telling somebody who wanted to sing opera they can still do musical theater at the community level is not comforting. It comes across as belittling. Even if the person were actually doing it, it might also painfully remind her every single time that it is not the same and that the dream is lost. Settling for third best is not necessarily fulfilling.

I still sing. But it does not even come close to the level that I would wish for, and at times painfully so.

 

If my goal was high altitude mountaineering, settling for hiking the Ozarks would have absolutely nothing to do with that dream. It would be something completely different that can possibly be enjoyable, but not "the dream changed somewhat". The two things have no resemblance.

 

Am I sounding bitter? yes, because some days I am.

Edited January 4, 2017 by regentrude

[EmilyGF]

Thanks for the input. I really like the idea of actually writing down the dreams bouncing around my head and the trade offs they would require. And I do think this is just a normal part of life, but I am trying to distinguish between the normal death of dreams and the unnecessary death of dreams.

 

My understanding from engineering people I talk to is that high level jobs effectively discriminate against older people and that there is a point where the idea of getting a job in the industries I have been considering is very far-fetched.

 

Yes, homeschooling is a choice and one that has enabled a lot of really cool things for me! I don't deny that. And I would feel a great sense of loss if I had been unable to have a large family. We actually lived next door to a two career/high powered large family for a while and experienced their stress (it wasn't pretty) despite their full-time nanny. So I do question the compatibility of various goals.

 

Regentrude, it is actually reassuring to think about the idea that doing some thing part time can be unfulfilling. Sometimes I wonder if I should have figured out a way to keep up my career part time, but what I'm yearning for is achievement at the excellent level again, I think. I tried to sing in college and just became sad because the quality was so low compared to what I had done before. It took ten more years before I could happily sing again.

 

I don't think I'm bitter, but I don't want to look back in a decade and see what I might have done now to keep some more doors open. I don't know that I want to go into law anymore, but I have two friends my age who also had kids young and are now in law school, so it has gotten me reflective. We also live near a top law school and have close friends in law school, so that is always something in the air!

 

Emily

[regentrude]

Regentrude, it is actually reassuring to think about the idea that doing some thing part time can be unfulfilling. Sometimes I wonder if I should have figured out a way to keep up my career part time, but what I'm yearning for is achievement at the excellent level again, I think. I tried to sing in college and just became sad because the quality was so low compared to what I had done before. It took ten more years before I could happily sing again.

 

I hear you.

 

About the job, though: I gave up my research career when I became a mom. For a while I had the illusion of keeping a foot in the door, even went back to work twice when each of my kids was 18 months (completely futile) and then stayed home again when we moved to another country. I was not cut out to stay home and had quite the crisis after a while, and I ended in a teaching position at 34, something I had never considered doing. As it turns out, I like it a lot, and I'm really good at it. It was not planned and just "happened" to me. 

I see those few of my colleagues who do the high power dual career families, and I am at peace with my decision. I see their stress and their overscheduled lives and would not want to trade. I know I could do it, because I am highly organized and efficient, but I see the value of a less hectic life with more time for family. Overall, the decision has been good for our family's quality of life, and so I am OK with it.

I am still bored and yearning for intellectual challenge. (I wrote about that early last year, and it became quite a long thread.) But I know that, for our family, it was the right choice for me not to pursue the same academic career as my DH. 

Best of luck to you figuring things out.

 

About music: are you currently singing somewhere? The university has some very good choral ensembles. 

[DawnM]

I am not sure I understand the kids being on the bus so long that they would need to go to private school.  How long would the bus ride be?

My kids are on the bus 10 min. in the morning and 20-25 in the afternoon.  Our neighborhood is the last picked up and the last dropped off.

 

If they were at private school (which we considered), we would have some issues with transportation as I have to get to work before they would be allowed to be dropped off, and I would  not be able to pick them up on certain days.  With the bus they can just come home.

 

 

[Crimson Wife]

 

My understanding from engineering people I talk to is that high level jobs effectively discriminate against older people and that there is a point where the idea of getting a job in the industries I have been considering is very far-fetched.

 

Regentrude, it is actually reassuring to think about the idea that doing some thing part time can be unfulfilling. Sometimes I wonder if I should have figured out a way to keep up my career part time, but what I'm yearning for is achievement at the excellent level again, I think.

 

 

I think you need to let go of the idea that the only things worth doing are those that are "high" or "excellent" level. It's hard when you've gone to an elite university and been in the environment that tells people if they're not aiming for the C-suite/partner at a top law firm/running a hospital department/tenured professor publishing in prestigious journals/etc. that they have somehow "failed".

 

Seriously, you'll be much happier when you come to the realization that it's perfectly ok to be ordinary and have a "medium" job.

 

[Carol in Cal.]

Thanks for the input. I really like the idea of actually writing down the dreams bouncing around my head and the trade offs they would require. And I do think this is just a normal part of life, but I am trying to distinguish between the normal death of dreams and the unnecessary death of dreams.

 

My understanding from engineering people I talk to is that high level jobs effectively discriminate against older people and that there is a point where the idea of getting a job in the industries I have been considering is very far-fetched.

 

 

 

Re. your first quoted paragraph, let me suggest that in addition to writing those dreams down, you write down all the things that you can ever remember enjoying, even as a kid.  You might stumble on a dream that is buried so deep or an idea that is so unconsidered yet intriguing that you'll want to pursue it.  The first rule of brainstorming is to cast a very wide net.  :)

 

Re. the second quoted paragraph, I live in Silicon Valley and used to work in tech, and what you described was the absolute truth.  It was like falling off of a cliff at a certain age--the head hunters stopped calling, the companies stopping returning your calls, and if you lost your job you would not find another one in your field for the rest of your life.  However, in the last 10 years that has shifted quite a bit.  There have been a few righteous lawsuits where age discrimination was proven and heavy compensation was made, and companies started to realize that those discrimination laws were, in fact, enforceable.  So there is a bit of something similar to affirmative action in hiring now, and experienced folks are finding themselves courted.  Whether this would enable an older person fresh out of school to find a good entry level job I am not sure, though.  But I would no longer rule that out, having seen what I've seen in the last 10 years.

[regentrude]

I think you need to let go of the idea that the only things worth doing are those that are "high" or "excellent" level. It's hard when you've gone to an elite university and been in the environment that tells people if they're not aiming for the C-suite/partner at a top law firm/running a hospital department/tenured professor publishing in prestigious journals/etc. that they have somehow "failed".

 

Seriously, you'll be much happier when you come to the realization that it's perfectly ok to be ordinary and have a "medium" job.

 

That is easier said than done if the "medium" job does not challenge and stimulate a person who needs to be challenged and pushed to her boundaries in order to thrive. This is a question of personality and not something one can simply decide.

 

Most people agree that gifted children need stimulation and challenge in order to fully develop their potential and be happy, and that their educational environment needs to be structured accordingly. Why should an adult be told to suck it up ?

 

I have a job that I love, find it definitely worthwhile and don't consider it a "failure" - but it does not challenge me intellectually, and I am craving a lot more stimulation.

Edited January 5, 2017 by regentrude

[regentrude]

Emily, I am linking my thread from last year. The issue was slightly different, but we had an interesting discussion that you might find beneficial

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/588827-bored-intellectual-challenge-so-sahm/

[Ravin]

(Don't quote, I might delete.) The dying dreams thread has gotten me thinking about my own dreams.

 

I've always been one to juggle many competing dreams. I always wanted a big family. I also wanted to homeschool. I was always a top student in school and went to a college that was ranked #1 while I was in it. For a while I wanted to be a lawyer. I sang at a very high level in high school and contemplated opera (though my parents were too practical to ever consider that!). I ended up an engineer.

 

Yet, I turned 36 a few weeks ago and I realize that the windows on many dreams are going to be closing in the next few years. I could still go back into engineering (it would be hard, but I've reached out to people and I do think it would be doable from my contacts), but that won't be the case once I get into my forties. I could pivot into something else in the private sector, probably in the finance direction. But most interesting careers probably would be out of reach if I wait another 5 years. I think.

 

I could become a math or physics teacher (my major in college) at the high school level eventually because those are always needed where I live... but the windows are closing on things I'd actually like to do. 

 

Yet, I want a happy family and I have five kids. I sort of think a full time working mom and a happy and large family are pretty difficult to have at the same time. My mom went back to work when I was in high school and was always really grouchy after that; you'd just sort of stay out of her way when she was home. My kids would most likely go to private school so that the time I'd actually be home would be spent with me and not on the bus. So there goes any paycheck. 

 

And yet... the dream juggling has become harder. 

 

I don't know if I want suggestions; I'm not creative enough to come up with any ideas right now. This isn't a JAWM thread. I do realize I am privileged - my husband has a good job he loves, my kids don't have special needs that require me to be home all the time, I have a great degree from an awesome college, we live within our income, and my husband is totally open to me becoming a career woman. Generally, I'm happy. But I see the window closing and wonder if there is something I can do now...

 

My youngest is almost one. 

 

Theoretically, hubby is fine with me getting a masters degree if I want to.

 

Emily

 

You could go to law school. An engineering background is a great launching point for law school.

[regentrude]

You do what most of the rest of the world does, and look for your challenges separately from your paid employment, which we generally engage in to live.

 

Well, in my circle of friends, most people do have their intellectual challenge in their jobs. I think the OP runs in similar circles, so it is much harder to see everybody else have the intellectually stimulating work while one is just going through the motions. 

Most of my friends don't work to live, they live for their work. 

 

Aren't you a poet now ? Isn't that an incredible opportunity to come out of an apparent closed door ( and if poetry doesn't challenge you enough, work harder!  :) )

...

"Medium" jobs can actually leave a lot of time and mental and emotional space to follow other passions. 

 

I do know what you mean here, and I really don't mean to be flippant, but if some doors are closed, what option is there other than reframing, and looking elsewhere ?

 

I completely agree, and as I wrote before, I am glad to have found a solution for me, after two years of soul searching. I personally no longer struggle - but I sympathize with the OP who does. (ETA: Even with my new found clarity and the serious work on writing, I am still missing some aspects, like a live community for exchange and critique. I am very extroverted, and internet communities do not quite have the same effect. I still yearn for people.)

 

Whether the "medium" job leaves energy and time, however, depends very much on the job. Some are so emotionally draining that they consume all of a person's resources. I personally did not have the mental energy for serious creative pursuits when I was in the thick of parenting young children. There was not enough "me" left over.

 

 

Edited January 5, 2017 by regentrude

[Crimson Wife]

 

Most people agree that gifted children need stimulation and challenge in order to fully develop their potential and be happy, and that their educational environment needs to be structured accordingly. Why should an adult be told to suck it up ?

 

Why can't stimulation and challenge be found in a job that isn't "high-powered" with a fancy title? I'm not suggesting to do something boring but rather to think about what attracts her about occupation X and see what other occupations offer similar things but with a better work/life balance.

 

Sheryl Sandberg and her cronies try to guilt-trip women into thinking that they are wasting their lives if they're not aspiring to the highest level. But it is entirely possible to find meaningful, satisfying work while rejecting the whole "Lean In" thing (for THEMSELVES, not other women). 

[regentrude]

Why can't stimulation and challenge be found in a job that isn't "high-powered" with a fancy title? I'm not suggesting to do something boring but rather to think about what attracts her about occupation X and see what other occupations offer similar things but with a better work/life balance.

 

Sheryl Sandberg and her cronies try to guilt-trip women into thinking that they are wasting their lives if they're not aspiring to the highest level. But it is entirely possible to find meaningful, satisfying work while rejecting the whole "Lean In" thing (for THEMSELVES, not other women). 

 

I don't think it is about a fancy title. Some jobs simply don't offer sufficient challenge and stimulation. Meaningful and satisfying is not the same as stimulating and challenging. It has absolutely nothing to do with "leaning in" or not. (Also, a job can be a lot of work and not be fulfilling intellectually, leading to no better work-life balance than a more challenging job.)

 

I find teaching calculus based introductory physics pretty darn boring after fifteen years. It is meaningful, satisfying, and a lot of work, but not intellectually challenging. My brain craves more.

Edited January 5, 2017 by regentrude

[Jenny in Florida]

It's not belittling.  The truth is I don't know much about opera, so I don't KNOW what other options there might be.  Saying something like musical theater is more about throwing out ideas, not necessarily saying that's what you should do. 

 

[snip] 

 

You (general you) can't really control what happens to you, but you can control how you react to it. 

 

For someone who cares deeply about achieving at a certain level, it is belittling and frustrating to be told she should, essentially, cheer up and settle for less. It just is. You ma not understand why, but that doesn't make the feelings any less true.

 

I, personally, also find your last comment infuriating, because it seems to imply that those of us who are facing the reality of having to give up on things we care about are behaving like out of control children. Sometimes, for some people, it really, truly is too late to pursue a particular dream or goal. And sometimes doing something that an outsider  might see as "kind of-sort of like" the original dream just isn't an acceptable substitute. In fact, sometimes being close but not there makes the loss more painful.

 

For those of us in that situation, to be told that we should "control how we react to" that pain is just plain insulting. 

 

Feeling grief is not unreasonable.

 

Expressing grief is not unreasonable.

 

Asking for support and commiseration from others having similar experiences does not indicate that one is "out of control."

[Jenny in Florida]

I don't think it is about a fancy title. Some jobs simply don't offer sufficient challenge and stimulation. Meaningful and satisfying is not the same as stimulating and challenging. It has absolutely nothing to do with "leaning in" or not. (Also, a job can be a lot of work and not be fulfilling intellectually, leading to no better work-life balance than a more challenging job.)

 

I find teaching calculus based introductory physics pretty darn boring after fifteen years. It is meaningful, satisfying, and a lot of work, but not intellectually challenging. My brain craves more.

 

Exactly.

 

I'm not in your league, regentrude, educationally or professionally. However, in my "encore" career, I have landed in a job that I absolutely find meaningful and that provides satisfaction in that I know the work I do genuinely helps people. 

 

But, oh my goodness, after almost a year, I'm getting almost unbearably bored.

 

I'm also lonely, because, although I like most of my co-workers, I am often aware of a pretty big gap between my own interests and theirs. I'm the only person in my office who follows/regularly attends/has any interest in discussing theatre/ballet/opera/classical music, for example. Despite the fact that we work in a library, I am the only one I know of who reads anything more challenging than popular fiction and self-help books. For reasons that would take too long to go into here, the name "Titian" came up recently, and it became clear that I was the only one in the group who recognized it as the name of an artist (let alone knew when he lived/worked, what he was most famous for, etc.). Two of the men in the group -- adults, mind you -- actually spent several minutes trying to figure out how to spell/pronounce the name and giggling over how it sounded if they pronounce it with a hard "t" sound on the second "t."

 

Please don't misunderstand me: Most of the time, I like my job just fine. I recognize the actual work I do as valuable to the community. I appreciate the paycheck and the fact that the organization treats its employees rather well by comparison to other jobs I've had. I genuinely like and respect the people I work with, and I am always looking for opportunities to grow.

 

But none of that makes my job intellectually challenging. I am painfully conscious of big chunks of my potential that are not being tapped.

[Jenny in Florida]

Oh my. Settling for less is sometimes just life. Even for smart people.

 

I've been the one in the corner 'mourning'. It was a giant waste of time, and self indulgent too. 

 

Better to acknowledge our great fortune at being alive, and healthy and privileged enough to have choices, even if they are not perfect choices.

 

IMO. Obviously, everyone works through this at their own pace.

 

For god's sake: Please point to anything I said that suggested I don't acknowledge any of those things?

 

I get up and go to work every day.

 

I'm grateful for my job.

 

I'm thrilled to death to have healthy, happy, functional kids and proud to have played a role in raising them.

 

I love my dog.

 

Blah, blah, blah.

 

That doesn't mean the other, legitimate feelings of grief can't co-exist.

 

I would really love for one of the people who keeps wading into these threads with these kinds of platitudes to explain why they perceive telling those of us who are having these feelings that we are wrong to have them is supposed to be helpful.

[Joules]

Emily, I hear you.  Except for having just turned 49(!), I'm in a similar place and not doing the best with it.  When ds became more independent (2011), I put a toe in the water of getting back to work.  It was hard because I have developed chronic health problems since his birth that mean I am just not as capable as I used to be.  Six months later my mom developed cancer and was in (my) home hospice until she passed.  Then I cared for my dad here 24/7 until I cracked (less than a year ago) and he is now in AL near my sibling.  

 

After five years of full-time eldercare (plus homeschooling ds high school and dealing with my failing health), I'm just a shell of what I used to be.  

 

I do have options.  Actually similar to you, I could teach physics or math in high school or maybe get an adjunct job, but for health reasons I made need something more flexible.

 

My lost dream is that I never finished my PhD.  I did doctoral work in two fields, but ended up taking a full-time instructor/research position so dh could finish his PhD.  Due to my changing areas and not ever quite finding the right thesis project, he was further along than me.  The director of the physics department was so worried that I would never come back (as I planned) and he warned me, but I was young and healthy and full of optimism...I would be different.

 

So though I have very diverse experiences in many fields, I'm hampered from doing what I really want by "only" having a master's degree (just call me Wolowitz).  I'm looking at industry, but as I talk to my contacts, I am getting the "You'd be a better fit in academia." And it doesn't help that I waited so long that my references are actually no longer living!

 

I'm trying...I'm taking online classes to update my skills (in a field that I never got a degree in, but worked and taught in).  I feel like I am in the same place as my 19yo son.

 

No advice, just commiserating [/vent] 

 

ETA - I may delete all of this, but OMG it felt good to say it out loud!

Edited January 5, 2017 by Joules

[Jenny in Florida]

Emily, I am older than you (in my 50s) as I head back to work. One of the things that has sort of surprised me is how much more common masterd degrees have become in the regular working world.

 

When I got my B.A., it was mostly only folks going into academic fields who were expected to go for a more advanced degrees. However, nowadays I find myself working for and alongside many people with masters degrees.

 

So, if I were you, I think I might invest the next few years whIle my kids were young in getting that second degree. It would keep my brain busy, keep me connected to my field and leave me with a more current and meaningful credential by the time I was ready to consider going back to work, even part time.

[Crimson Wife]

 (Also, a job can be a lot of work and not be fulfilling intellectually, leading to no better work-life balance than a more challenging job.)

 

I think we've got different definitions of "work-life balance". To me, if you're teaching PT and have flexibility in your schedule to take care of all your other responsibilities, you've got the kind of "work-life balance" that a lot of moms are seeking.

 

The typical "high-powered" career requires 60-80+ hours/week on the job plus the expectation that the person will be available 24/7 via email, even while on vacation. The job may be intellectually stimulating at times but it's exhausting and always has to come first, before family. There's no "work-life balance" at all. I was a jr. executive on the fast track in my 20's and quit when my request to come back PT after having my 2nd child got denied by sr. management.

 

Intellectual fulfillment is a different thing than "work-life balance".

[regentrude]

I think we've got different definitions of "work-life balance". To me, if you're teaching PT and have flexibility in your schedule to take care of all your other responsibilities, you've got the kind of "work-life balance" that a lot of moms are seeking.

 

The typical "high-powered" career requires 60-80+ hours/week on the job plus the expectation that the person will be available 24/7 via email, even while on vacation. The job may be intellectually stimulating at times but it's exhausting and always has to come first, before family. There's no "work-life balance" at all. I was a jr. executive on the fast track in my 20's and quit when my request to come back PT after having my 2nd child got denied by sr. management.

 

Intellectual fulfillment is a different thing than "work-life balance".

 

Completely agree on the bolded, but you were the one to bring up "work-life-balance"  in your post from last night. Of course, there are jobs that have great work-life balance (my FT teaching job does), but there are also plenty of non-stimulating jobs that don't.

 

(Btw, for most people, even in menial jobs, the job has to come before family.)

 

You don't need to explain to me about "high powered careers", but that also may have nothing to do with intellectual fulfillment. One can run oneself ragged doing 80 hour weeks with mind numbing stuff.

Edited January 5, 2017 by regentrude

[wintermom]

what I'm yearning for is achievement at the excellent level again, I think.

 

This is definitely doable! I'd make a list of a bunch of things you'd like to do and see what is viable. You don't have to limit yourself to one thing. You could take some time to do one thing, and then move onto another thing. 

 

They don't have to all be career or education related, they could touch on a variety of your interests. Some things I've done or heard other do:

 

- Grade 10 Royal Conservatory of Music piano exam

- Black belt in Taekwon-do

- Lead music at church

- Run a marathon (or qualify for a specific marathon)

- Play tennis at a certain level

- Teach a homeschool course

[EmilyGF]

I have some introspection to do before I can write much more. 

 

As I said in the first post, I am thankful that I'm in a position that is quite lovely and privileged. But I'm trying to be mindful of the consequences of actions I take. I want to think long term as I make decisions and am glad for the input from people who have also considered these things.

 

Emily

[EmilyGF]

See happy update in post #1!