Bill vs Pit Bull

[Scarlett]

Bill, I'm glad you and Chester are okay, but my heart sank when I read your post. Breaking up a dog fight can be deadly. I know.

 

I've alluded in the past on this forum to the fact that my mother died a horrible, accidental death. The truth is it was preventable. If she had called someone or let it go instead of trying to break it up, she'd be here today to see those great-grandkids (my brother's grandkids), twins who were barely 4 months old then and are almost 8 years old now.

 

Please, never try to break up a dog fight. I'm going to out myself (my maiden name) now. If it saves someone it's worth it. Notice none of the dogs were pit bulls any other aggressive breed. Do not click if you are squeamish.

 

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2008-06-28/news/maul28_1_titusville-animal-services-third-dog

So sorry for your loss. :(

[Daria]

What kind of dog attacks another dog with no provocation and won't stop attacking even when suspended in the air by his hindquarters, necessitating a human literally prying its jaws open? A dangerous dog. To me, that behavior automatically puts it in a dangerous category. Doesn't matter that it could have been worse. What it did was bad enough to make it dangerous.

 

If my dog bit another dog and tore its ear, I'd be mortified and would do what I could to make sure my dog didn't do it again. But if my dog bit another dog and wouldn't let go, to the point someone had to pry it off, I'd put it down.

 

A child who is close to me was badly mauled by a dog that jumped the fence into her yard.  The owners said they'd seen no warning signs.

 

In this case, you've either got a dog who attacks with no identifiable pattern, or you have an owner who isn't paying enough attention.  Either way that's a disaster waiting to happen.  Next time it could be a child.

[Daria]

Our unofficial off leash is about 29 acres, about half of which is lovely tended grass and trees. The other half is "the wild side" where there is brush and trails. Hunting dogs like mine enjoy both sides. Some owners don't allow their dogs on the wild side, but still there is plenty of park.

 

Being unofficial the park is not gated. There are fence railings (with openings) along the street, which any dog could get through (or under) if it wanted. So only people who can control their dogs come there.

 

No gates make this a nice place to bring well trained canines. If they added double gates and high fences the park would be ruined in no time.

 

Bill

 

I'm glad you find that people self police, because that has never been my experience with "unofficial" off leash parks.  The park behind my old apartment fit that category, and I can't tell how often I'd see a dog run off and into the children's play area with his owner running behind calling his name, trying to follow me down the trail that lead to a major highway.

 

I used to work at a school that didn't have a playground, where we'd take the kids to a public park that was also an "unofficial" off leash park, and we frequently had to leave with the kids and call the police because some idiot would be calling "he's friendly" while their dog was jumping or lunging at a child.  

[mumto2]

Spy Car, I have a couple of questions regarding Chester's breed. We have friends with a houseful of Rhodesian Ridgebacks (5) that are incredibly intelligent and high maintenance like your buddy. I know your dog at a distance would look just like one of their dogs, you have to get close to see the ridge. When you pet a dieback the texture is unusual, rough as opposed to smooth. I assume Chester has smooth fur?

 

Now for my behaviour question. When Ridgebacks are playing with each other they frequently go for each other's ears. They have some tussles that look really dramatic to an outsider but are really more of bored children entertaining themselves. I think pit bulls have the same behaviour which is why their ears were docked for years.

 

My Spaniel somehow ended up with a group of Rottweiler buddies that he knew from puppies. All male. It was the oddest dynamic, my little guy was always allowed to win. His Rottweiler friends were roll over and show him their belly at let my little dog growl and sniff. It was a hilarious sight. Unfortunately he thought he was superior to all Rottweiler's which was a huge problem. For some odd reason he wasn't the king of all Rottweiler's!

 

I think you probably know where I am going with this. I wonder if the pit bull may have a ridgeback for a friend that he played rough with and approached Chester thinking it was play. The ear grabbing is what is making me wonder. My friend's Ridgebacks are very well trained and great dogs, no worries ever about my kids with them or in public. They just wrestle rough with each other, frequently grabbing ears. It looks painful but I have been assured generally harmless. These dogs can also open doors, microwaves, ovens, and refrigerators to get food. :lol:

 

Everyone, this is a behavior question because dogs in general fascinate me.

[Pawz4me]

Spy Car, I have a couple of questions regarding Chester's breed. We have friends with a houseful of Rhodesian Ridgebacks (5) that are incredibly intelligent and high maintenance like your buddy. I know your dog at a distance would look just like one of their dogs, you have to get close to see the ridge. When you pet a dieback the texture is unusual, rough as opposed to smooth. I assume Chester has smooth fur?

 

Now for my behaviour question. When Ridgebacks are playing with each other they frequently go for each other's ears. They have some tussles that look really dramatic to an outsider but are really more of bored children entertaining themselves. I think pit bulls have the same behaviour which is why their ears were docked for years.

 

My Spaniel somehow ended up with a group of Rottweiler buddies that he knew from puppies. All male. It was the oddest dynamic, my little guy was always allowed to win. His Rottweiler friends were roll over and show him their belly at let my little dog growl and sniff. It was a hilarious sight. Unfortunately he thought he was superior to all Rottweiler's which was a huge problem. For some odd reason he wasn't the king of all Rottweiler's!

 

I think you probably know where I am going with this. I wonder if the pit bull may have a ridgeback for a friend that he played rough with and approached Chester thinking it was play. The ear grabbing is what is making me wonder. My friend's Ridgebacks are very well trained and great dogs, no worries ever about my kids with them or in public. They just wrestle rough with each other, frequently grabbing ears. It looks painful but I have been assured generally harmless. These dogs can also open doors, microwaves, ovens, and refrigerators to get food. :lol:

 

Everyone, this is a behavior question because dogs in general fascinate me.

 

It's very common for dogs in general to grab ears. IME it's not a behavior limited to or more common in certain breeds than others.  It seems more an individual thing than a breed thing.  I suspect dogs are more likely to want to grab drop ears than prick ears.  When my Shih Tzu was a puppy he would chew on our Brittany's ears, and as he's gotten older he's continued to exhibit a bit of an ear fetish-- he'll clean the cats' ears if they let him.

 

[Spy Car]

Spy Car, I have a couple of questions regarding Chester's breed. We have friends with a houseful of Rhodesian Ridgebacks (5) that are incredibly intelligent and high maintenance like your buddy. I know your dog at a distance would look just like one of their dogs, you have to get close to see the ridge. When you pet a dieback the texture is unusual, rough as opposed to smooth. I assume Chester has smooth fur?

 

Now for my behaviour question. When Ridgebacks are playing with each other they frequently go for each other's ears. They have some tussles that look really dramatic to an outsider but are really more of bored children entertaining themselves. I think pit bulls have the same behaviour which is why their ears were docked for years.

 

My Spaniel somehow ended up with a group of Rottweiler buddies that he knew from puppies. All male. It was the oddest dynamic, my little guy was always allowed to win. His Rottweiler friends were roll over and show him their belly at let my little dog growl and sniff. It was a hilarious sight. Unfortunately he thought he was superior to all Rottweiler's which was a huge problem. For some odd reason he wasn't the king of all Rottweiler's!

 

I think you probably know where I am going with this. I wonder if the pit bull may have a ridgeback for a friend that he played rough with and approached Chester thinking it was play. The ear grabbing is what is making me wonder. My friend's Ridgebacks are very well trained and great dogs, no worries ever about my kids with them or in public. They just wrestle rough with each other, frequently grabbing ears. It looks painful but I have been assured generally harmless. These dogs can also open doors, microwaves, ovens, and refrigerators to get food. :lol:

 

Everyone, this is a behavior question because dogs in general fascinate me.

 

Yes, smooth fur. They can get hackles that stand up when threatened. I saw Chester's go up as the pit bull was about on him. This wasn't one of those instances of misunderstood signals, or a mistaken play opportunity. Chester is pretty friendly. There is another young male Vizsla that Rocky plays with and gets on with well. Part of why it was so weird.

 

As an update, I decided to give Chester a nice rinse off on Friday afternoon and afterwards discovered he had a puncture on his neck (deep) that I'd missed. I think unseen blood had closed the wound, so a few minutes after speaking with Rocky's owner to let him know we were OK, I had to run off the vet for a couple stitches.

 

Bill

[Jean in Newcastle]

Watch those puncture wounds, Bill.  They can get infected.  Probably more so with a cat bite, but still. . . .

[Spy Car]

Watch those puncture wounds, Bill.  They can get infected.  Probably more so with a cat bite, but still. . . .

 

Chester is on antibiotics, just in case. Thankfully the wound (while deep) looked really clean. No obvious infection, Vet was not concerned. I felt like a bit of an idiot for missing it. 

 

Bill

[gardenmom5]

I'm glad you find that people self police, because that has never been my experience with "unofficial" off leash parks.  The park behind my old apartment fit that category, and I can't tell how often I'd see a dog run off and into the children's play area with his owner running behind calling his name, trying to follow me down the trail that lead to a major highway.

 

I used to work at a school that didn't have a playground, where we'd take the kids to a public park that was also an "unofficial" off leash park, and we frequently had to leave with the kids and call the police because some idiot would be calling "he's friendly" while their dog was jumping or lunging at a child.  

 

I like dogs.  I grew up with dogs, I've owned dogs - dh doesn't like dogs . . .

this is so infuriating to me.  dudeling is a scared of dogs (and when he was small - TERRIFIED of dogs) - and we'd have to leave parks because these idiots would take their dogs off leash in NON-off leash areas. "oh, he's friendly".  well, just having a dog running up to an anxious child who is smaller than the dog (or even the same size), can result in a panic attack by said child.

 

and the number people who think their dog jumping on someone is "friendly" (and the small dogs and their dominance games of trying to stand on my feet! control your dog moron.). . . . .we had a bichon frise puppy come in our yard, and dudeling was screaming like he'd seriously hurt himself.  even when I picked him up and he was out of reach of the puppy, he was terrified.  the dog was "very" friendly, jumping and licking and tail wagging - but this child was terrified of dogs.  even now - he will keep his eyes on a dog in his vicinity if he's outside, becasue he's still nervous around them.

[ThisIsTheDay]

Not going off topic, but rather thinking that this is right in line with unintended consequences. This has been on my FB feed a bit today, a Yorkie that was killed this week by two large dogs at a pet boarding facility.

 

http://www.dogsbitedecatural.com/2016/02/bradenton-fl-tiny-yorkie-was-killed-by.html

 

My own dog is a long haired beauty who little girls want nothing more than to hug and kiss her, but I know her looks are deceiving. We deliberately separate her from one of our cats when we leave the house, because I've witnessed their altercations and had to intervene in the past.  Before she came to live with us, she ran loose as a young dog, often searching out her own food. I know she'd easily kill squirrels and other small animals if given the opportunity. That instinct in her will never disappear.

 

Bill, so relieved to hear that all ended well on your outing today. 

[Liz CA]

I'm not anti-pit. I know many sweet pit bulls. I'm hearing Rocky has been a cool dog, up to today.

 

Stuff happens with dogs. The jaw strength is daunting when things go wrongly (like today) but I wouldn't want to condemn a whole breed or even this dog to never getting out in public and playing with other dogs. I'll be very careful around Rocky in the future, and it is the one thing I will expect of his owner too.

 

I may have to start carrying a C rod, or pencil, or long chopstick. Hand in the pit mouth, not an experience I hope to replicate soon :D

 

Bill

 

I once carried a 12 gauge up to the horse corral where 3 pits had my old gelding cornered. Even though my mastiff had alerted me that something was wrong and shot out of the door like a cannon when I opened it, I was not in time to prevent my horse from getting bitten deeply in the hind leg. The house and the corral were quite a distance from each other and I am not twenty anymore.

 

I am an animal lover. I have always said that pit bulls getting a bad rap because they often have bad owners - does not seem to be the case in your scenario - but more recently I have heard that certain pit bull blood lines have been bred specifically to produce unpredictable, aggressive dogs. These kind of dogs (again no fault of theirs but now they do exist) can be sweet as cream one moment and vicious the next. I do now approach most pits with caution if unavoidable. I have left the dog park once when a pit came who was already posturing at the entrance before meeting any of the dogs. My (then) Cane Corso would not have backed down in a fight and I was NOT anxious to witness this.

 

All this to say, I hope there are no lasting repercussions, physically or mentally. If you are so inclined, I give you permission for a stiff drink - may help the cold too.  :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Edited February 7, 2016 by Liz CA

[LucyStoner]

Are there owners in there too? I'm not seeing the difference.

 

http://maclaineuk.photoshelter.com/image/I0000.KtZhi.Sskg

Around here, leads/leashes are required unless you are at an off leash dog park. Off leash dog parks are fenced in and have a crap ton of unleashed dogs because there aren't all that many dog parks. Sh!t can get real fast with inexperienced owners and a lot of dogs in one small area.

 

The pit bull's owner is fortunate that a very experienced dog owner like Bill was there.

[gardenmom5]

Around here, leads/leashes are required unless you are at an off leash dog park. Off leash dog parks are fenced in and have a crap ton of unleashed dogs because there aren't all that many dog parks. Sh!t can get real fast with inexperienced owners and a lot of dogs in one small area.

 

The pit bull's owner is fortunate that a very experienced dog owner like Bill was there.

 

which doesn't stop people from taking the dogs off-leash.  rhododendron way at the aboretum is a notorious spot for people to UNleash their dogs.  

[Laura Corin]

Around here, leads/leashes are required unless you are at an off leash dog park. Off leash dog parks are fenced in and have a crap ton of unleashed dogs because there aren't all that many dog parks. Sh!t can get real fast with inexperienced owners and a lot of dogs in one small area.

 

The pit bull's owner is fortunate that a very experienced dog owner like Bill was there.

 

Our dog was born in the Pacific North West - I think she's having a nicer life here.  The only time she is on a lead is when a farmer might fear for his livestock or I fear cars.

[gardenmom5]

Our dog was born in the Pacific North West - I think she's having a nicer life here.  The only time she is on a lead is when a farmer might fear for his livestock or I fear cars.

 

there are alot of rural areas where dogs can, and do, run free - but not in the larger cities outside of dog parks and their own backyards.

[Laura Corin]

there are alot of rural areas where dogs can, and do, run free - but not in the larger cities outside of dog parks and their own backyards.

 

It's just a reverse mindset: in my two nearest towns, the parks are both for everyone - children play (in one case the play equipment is fenced off, in the other not) and the dogs are (mostly) off leads.  

 

In London, I don't know of any parks that are not for everyone, although there are some fenced areas just for children.  Here are the regulations for the Royal Parks, which include Hyde Park, Kensington Gardens, Green Park and Regents Park:

 

https://www.royalparks.org.uk/park-management/park-regulations-and-policies/dogs-in-the-royal-parks

 

I have to think that 'kettling' dogs in a small area might lead to more problems, not fewer.

Edited February 7, 2016 by Laura Corin

[LucyStoner]

which doesn't stop people from taking the dogs off-leash. rhododendron way at the aboretum is a notorious spot for people to UNleash their dogs.

which doesn't stop people from taking the dogs off-leash. rhododendron way at the aboretum is a notorious spot for people to UNleash their dogs.

Oh, you don't have to remind me. I have a son with ASD who is terrified of dogs. I mean seriously terrified despite our efforts to help him become accustomed to dogs. Thankfully he's mellowed about it considerably, but it used to be a big deal in our day to day lives. There are some parks we just don't even bother with because of the off leash and out of their owner's control dogs. It's not an issue if the dog owner is right there and the dog will respond to the owners instructions but much of the time, that's just not the case. There is not such thing as a "friendly dog" for my son. Once an owner laughed because her dog got really close to my son and he was freaking out. I pointedly reminded her that the law is on my son's side here- it was a leash only park and there were many signs to indicate this. My son sees a dog on a leash and makes a wide circle so the dog doesn't get close.

[LucyStoner]

Our dog was born in the Pacific North West - I think she's having a nicer life here. The only time she is on a lead is when a farmer might fear for his livestock or I fear cars.

While I don't doubt there's a different mindset about it, I think it's mostly a city dog/country dog thing. Dog ownership in Seattle is really high. And leash and scoop laws came into being for good reason. A minority, but a sizable one, of inconsiderate dog owners who either can not or will not train their dogs wrecked it for the others. There are a couple of very large off leash areas with trails, including one with a dog swimming beach so it's not like they are all caged in on a tennis court but even in the large parks there's A LOT of dogs because so many people have them. The one with the swimming spot is like a million dog march at peak times.

[Laura Corin]

It's not an issue if the dog owner is right there and the dog will respond to the owners instructions but much of the time, that's just not the case. There is not such thing as a "friendly dog" for my son. Once an owner laughed because her dog got really close to my son and he was freaking out. I pointedly reminded her that the law is on my son's side here- it was a leash only park and there were many signs to indicate this. My son sees a dog on a leash and makes a wide circle so the dog doesn't get close.

 

Absolutely.  I'm no supporter of ill-trained owners.

[LucyStoner]

Absolutely. I'm no supporter of ill-trained owners.

We had some dicey moments because our son freaking out can easily freak out the dog. I worried about him getting bit and then becoming even more rigidly terrified of dogs. If not for my son, we might own a dog but clearly a dog is a non-starter for us.

Edited February 7, 2016 by LucyStoner

[Lady Florida.]

It's just a reverse mindset: in my two nearest towns, the parks are both for everyone - children play (in one case the play equipment is fenced off, in the other not) and the dogs are (mostly) off leads.  

 

 

 

I agree it's a different mindset altogether.  When I visited the UK (stayed in England, visited Scotland and Wales), I was shocked at the places I saw cats and dogs. It didn't bother me and I would have loved for things to be like that here, but I didn't realize how strict we are about pets in the U.S. until I traveled outside the country.

 

So, while in your world parks are for everyone including dogs, here dog owners who don't live in the country have had to petition their local government (not always successfully) for at least one park where dogs are welcome. Instead of just making an existing municipal park dog friendly while still keeping it a regular public park, many cities have chosen to create a park specifically for dogs. Some cities also now allow restaurants to be dog friendly, which means if there's outdoor seating you can bring your leashed dog. Dogs still aren't allowed inside, but if you're willing to dine al fresco you can bring your dog.

Edited February 7, 2016 by Lady Florida

[gardenmom5]

Oh, you don't have to remind me. I have a son with ASD who is terrified of dogs. I mean seriously terrified despite our efforts to help him become accustomed to dogs. Thankfully he's mellowed about it considerably, but it used to be a big deal in our day to day lives. There are some parks we just don't even bother with because of the off leash and out of their owner's control dogs. It's not an issue if the dog owner is right there and the dog will respond to the owners instructions but much of the time, that's just not the case. There is not such thing as a "friendly dog" for my son. Once an owner laughed because her dog got really close to my son and he was freaking out. I pointedly reminded her that the law is on my son's side here- it was a leash only park and there were many signs to indicate this. My son sees a dog on a leash and makes a wide circle so the dog doesn't get close.

 

it was more for the benefit of those who aren't in this area who seem to think all the dogs are leashed. 

 

there was no such thing as a friendly dog for dudeling either.  we encountered an 8-wk old english sheepdog puppy.  even when the puppy was on his back for a tummy scratch, dudling would only look at him.

he did eventually adjust to my mom's papillion- but she was very well trained, very calm, and usually sitting near my mom's lap. 

 

dudeling would also do the wide circle thing.  not as much as he's gotten older.  in some ways, I think small dog owners can be the worst. it's a small dog - they think it's easy to control.  (the dog is controlling you idiot.)  trick or treating two small dogs, who bark at the slightest provocation, came bounding out of their house and the owner had to chase them to get them back in the house.  if those owner want to open their door on halloween - they should put the dogs in another room so they can't get out.

[gardenmom5]

I agree it's a different mindset altogether.  When I visited the UK (stayed in England, visited Scotland and Wales), I was shocked at the places I saw cats and dogs. It didn't bother me and I would have loved for things to be like that here, but I didn't realize how strict we are about pets in the U.S. until I traveled.

 

So, while in your world parks are for everyone including dogs, here dog owners who don't live in the country have had to petition their local government (not always successfully) for at least one park where dogs are welcome. Instead of just making an existing municipal park dog friendly while still keeping it a regular public park, many cities have chosen to create a park specifically for dogs. Some cities also now allow restaurants to be dog friendly, which means if there's outdoor seating you can bring your leashed dog. Dogs still aren't allowed inside, but if you're willing to dine al fresco you can bring your dog.

 

I don't want to see pets in a restaurant, a grocery story or the ballet (yeah - I just did.)  stores are starting to put up signs that say "service animals only" - but they can't legally challenge someone.   just because the law only allows service animals doens't prevent more and more people from bringing their "pets" into places they aren't allowed.  I know, and support people with service dogs - there's a difference.   people bringing their "pet" everywhere is making it harder for people with genuine service dogs (who perform an actual needed *service* for it's owner.)

 

there are national parks here where even service dogs are advised to not go on the trails - and it's for the safety of that animal in case of coming across a wild animal who sees it as a threat and attacks.

[Jean in Newcastle]

We have two dogs - in some ways specifically for our son with ASD.  He still doesn't like dogs but he can handle them.  We also got him a cat, which he adores.  (We love animals but did think very specifically about all of this too.)

 

I am in a pickle with Rocky when I take him out.  He needs more exercise than he can get in our fenced yard.  In the past, he did just great with other dogs at the dog parks, on leash on a walk etc  Now it is iffy.  Most of the time he will not react to dogs at the dog park but some dogs set him off.  He's never attacked another dog but I've seen fear based behavior from him and it would be irresponsible of me to leave him in situations where that could get worse.  So I go to dog parks when no one is there at odd hours and in the rain.  Not every day or anything but when I can.  Otherwise, he gets walked on the sidewalk on a lead and through city parks with leash laws.  He was actually on a lead when the unleashed Chow attacked him.  He is now super scared of unleashed dogs that rush up to him when he's on a lead.  I hate it when people call out "he's friendly!" about their illegally unleashed dog that is barreling up to me while I am trying to veer off so that they won't meet.  I call back, "But mine isn't!"  It makes me mad that I am penalized for trying to be responsible and for obeying the posted laws in our area. 

 

 

[Laura Corin]

Some cities also now allow restaurants to be dog friendly, which means if there's outdoor seating you can bring your leashed dog. Dogs still aren't allowed inside, but if you're willing to dine al fresco you can bring your dog.

 

Here I think it's up to the restaurant/pub owner.  Kitchens are off-limits to dogs, but, for example, our local pub-with-food allows dogs.  Husband often walks the dog over and has a pint.

[Lady Florida.]

 stores are starting to put up signs that say "service animals only" - but they can't legally challenge someone.   just because the law only allows service animals doens't prevent more and more people from bringing their "pets" into places they aren't allowed. 

 

 

Sadly, you can buy service animal vests online as there's not really one official vest. Florida  passed a law last year making it a 2nd degree misdemeanor to misrepresent your pet as a service animal (and limited service animals to dogs and miniature horses), but it's still hard for an establishment to determine whether or not a dog is a service dog. They still can only ask if it's a service animal and what service it's trained to do. 

 

I wish there was a better way, but I understand why they can't grill the person. We know a homeschool dad with balance issues related to a Gulf War injury. He's one of those people with an invisible disability and often has to endure dirty looks when he brings his service dog into places. 

 

It's unconscionable IMO for someone to pretend their pet dog is a service dog just so they can bring it into a store or stay at a non-pet friendly hotel. 

[Guest]

I wish there was a better way, but I understand why they can't grill the person. We know a homeschool dad with balance issues related to a Gulf War injury. He's one of those people with an invisible disability and often has to endure dirty looks when he brings his service dog into places. 

 

 

 

Which is doubly ridiculous, because service dogs in training (by healthy people) are out about in the world learning how to help the folks that need them.  So in addition to invisible disability, there are perfectly sound reasons to see a regularly-abled person with service dogs.

 

---------

 

I am extremely allergic to cats. Whenever I see someone bring their pet dog into the grocery store or something, just because they can't bear to be away (I guess??? I can't pretend to know why ppl do this. I think it's the height of both rudeness and bizarreness), it makes me furious for the ppl that are as allergic to dogs as I am of cats!

[Laura Corin]

Which is doubly ridiculous, because service dogs in training (by healthy people) are out about in the world learning how to help the folks that need them.  So in addition to invisible disability, there are perfectly sound reasons to see a regularly-abled person with service dogs.

 

 

Guide-dogs in training here have special uniforms.  I don't know if fake ones are available online, but it's pretty much always young Labradors, so faking would be of limited use:

 

http://www.guidedogs.org.uk/supportus/volunteering/what-can-i-do/puppy-walkers/#.VreHdJOLSRs

 

 

[Scarlett]

I once carried a 12 gauge up to the horse corral where 3 pits had my old gelding cornered. Even though my mastiff had alerted me that something was wrong and shot out of the door like a cannon when I opened it, I was not in time to prevent my horse from getting bitten deeply in the hind leg. The house and the corral were quite a distance from each other and I am not twenty anymore.

 

I am an animal lover. I have always said that pit bulls getting a bad rap because they often have bad owners - does not seem to be the case in your scenario - but more recently I have heard that certain pit bull blood lines have been bred specifically to produce unpredictable, aggressive dogs. These kind of dogs (again no fault of theirs but now they do exist) can be sweet as cream one moment and vicious the next. I do now approach most pits with caution if unavoidable. I have left the dog park once when a pit came who was already posturing at the entrance before meeting any of the dogs. My (then) Cane Corso would not have backed down in a fight and I was NOT anxious to witness this.

 

All this to say, I hope there are no lasting repercussions, physically or mentally. If you are so inclined, I give you permission for a stiff drink - may help the cold too. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Did you shoot the dogs who attacked your horse?

[Scarlett]

One time when Ds was about 8 we were in a dirt bike shop....very reputable business...the owner had two pits in the shop. I asked him if they were safe. He paused.....and nodded to one and said, "that one is most of the time".

 

Wow. How dumb can you be to have an animal in your place of business that is safe most of the time.

[Scarlett]

In our neighborhood......very much in the country so there are no leash laws.....we have a family who has three dogs......besides getting in my trash a time or two they have never given us problems. I do have mild concerns about the German Shepard.....she is fairly old and I just don't trust them.

 

And we have a new neighbor whose schnauzer wanders into our yard the other day. The owner came up our driveway to retrieve that dog and his Boxer was right behind him. My Brittany was outside so I went out and introduced myself to neighbor....Ds came out too....all of a sudden the the Schnauzer 'attacks' my Brittany....all growling and snapping...but it terrified my old girl. Ds picked her up and carried her inside and she had wet herself. :(

 

The Boxer was hilarious. As soon as the schnauzer started in the Boxer came running over....I thought oh no they are both going to attack my dog...but the Boxer just paced back and forth looking from us to the dogs and back again as if to say, 'what is going on here!'

 

I love Boxers. And this one is old and grey like my Brittany. If we could keep that pesky schnauzer out of the mix they would be fine.

[gardenmom5]

We have two dogs - in some ways specifically for our son with ASD.  He still doesn't like dogs but he can handle them.  We also got him a cat, which he adores.  (We love animals but did think very specifically about all of this too.)

 

all cats have aspergers . . . . dudeling dearly wants a cat.  WE have cat allergies (though I have thought about it.  a neighbor's cat was great at catching moles.  I liked that cat), and his piano teacher, whom he loves (and understands him well) has even more severe cat allergies. 

 

Sadly, you can buy service animal vests online as there's not really one official vest. Florida  passed a law last year making it a 2nd degree misdemeanor to misrepresent your pet as a service animal (and limited service animals to dogs and miniature horses), but it's still hard for an establishment to determine whether or not a dog is a service dog. They still can only ask if it's a service animal and what service it's trained to do. 

 

I wish there was a better way, but I understand why they can't grill the person. We know a homeschool dad with balance issues related to a Gulf War injury. He's one of those people with an invisible disability and often has to endure dirty looks when he brings his service dog into places. 

 

It's unconscionable IMO for someone to pretend their pet dog is a service dog just so they can bring it into a store or stay at a non-pet friendly hotel. 

I agree.  it's right up there with with non-disabled people parking in handicapped spots, and even with women who *falsely* cry rape.  (yes it happens.)  the fakers hurt those legitimately in those positions.

 

Which is doubly ridiculous, because service dogs in training (by healthy people) are out about in the world learning how to help the folks that need them.  So in addition to invisible disability, there are perfectly sound reasons to see a regularly-abled person with service dogs.

 

---------

 

I am extremely allergic to cats. Whenever I see someone bring their pet dog into the grocery store or something, just because they can't bear to be away (I guess??? I can't pretend to know why ppl do this. I think it's the height of both rudeness and bizarreness), it makes me furious for the ppl that are as allergic to dogs as I am of cats!

 

service training dogs have vests. usually

 

One time when Ds was about 8 we were in a dirt bike shop....very reputable business...the owner had two pits in the shop. I asked him if they were safe. He paused.....and nodded to one and said, "that one is most of the time".

 

Wow. How dumb can you be to have an animal in your place of business that is safe most of the time.

 

math is hard . . . /

 

back before I knew much about pits - I was responding to an ad, and went to the person's house.  her boyfriend had a pit "oh, he's really sweet".  well, I'm looking at stuff that she was selling, the dog started getting territorial.  at least she realized maybe the dog wasn't so safe afterall, and put him in another room behind a door.  I know more now, and would demand they lock the dog up or I wont' be buying from them.

Edited February 7, 2016 by gardenmom5

[Crimson Wife]

I don't want to see pets in a restaurant, a grocery story or the ballet (yeah - I just did.)  stores are starting to put up signs that say "service animals only" - but they can't legally challenge someone.   just because the law only allows service animals doens't prevent more and more people from bringing their "pets" into places they aren't allowed.  I know, and support people with service dogs - there's a difference.   people bringing their "pet" everywhere is making it harder for people with genuine service dogs (who perform an actual needed *service* for it's owner.)

 

I agree. I understand that there are medical privacy concerns but if the government can regulate disability placards and license plates to reduce abuse, then it can do the same for service animals. I think it's long past time for an official registry of service animals and issuance of ID cards.

 

We don't have a service dog yet for my DD because she is not mature enough at this developmental stage. But we do plan on getting her one when she is, especially since her hearing loss is progressive.

[Laura Corin]

In our neighborhood......very much in the country so there are no leash laws.....we have a family who has three dogs......besides getting in my trash a time or two they have never given us problems. I do have mild concerns about the German Shepard.....she is fairly old and I just don't trust them.

 

And we have a new neighbor whose schnauzer wanders into our yard the other day. 

 

Dogs are often off the leash here when out with owners, but they aren't generally allowed to wander.  I've had stray dogs in my garden twice in seven years: both times the same family's dogs, and each time they came to get them when I called to let them know.

 

I've twice found dogs on the street in our village without their owners - they had escaped and the owners were embarrassed when I brought them back home.

[Alessandra]

Bill, I'm glad you and Chester are okay, but my heart sank when I read your post. Breaking up a dog fight can be deadly. I know.

 

I've alluded in the past on this forum to the fact that my mother died a horrible, accidental death. The truth is it was preventable. If she had called someone or let it go instead of trying to break it up, she'd be here today to see those great-grandkids (my brother's grandkids), twins who were barely 4 months old then and are almost 8 years old now.

 

Please, never try to break up a dog fight. I'm going to out myself (my maiden name) now. If it saves someone it's worth it. Notice none of the dogs were pit bulls any other aggressive breed. Do not click if you are squeamish.

 

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2008-06-28/news/maul28_1_titusville-animal-services-third-dog

I couldn't 'like,' but I wanted to say that my heart breaks for you and your family.

[MrsWeasley]

In our neighborhood......very much in the country so there are no leash laws.....we have a family who has three dogs......besides getting in my trash a time or two they have never given us problems. I do have mild concerns about the German Shepard.....she is fairly old and I just don't trust them.

 

And we have a new neighbor whose schnauzer wanders into our yard the other day. The owner came up our driveway to retrieve that dog and his Boxer was right behind him. My Brittany was outside so I went out and introduced myself to neighbor....Ds came out too....all of a sudden the the Schnauzer 'attacks' my Brittany....all growling and snapping...but it terrified my old girl. Ds picked her up and carried her inside and she had wet herself. :(

 

The Boxer was hilarious. As soon as the schnauzer started in the Boxer came running over....I thought oh no they are both going to attack my dog...but the Boxer just paced back and forth looking from us to the dogs and back again as if to say, 'what is going on here!'

 

I love Boxers. And this one is old and grey like my Brittany. If we could keep that pesky schnauzer out of the mix they would be fine.

After one of my neighbor's dogs killed one of my chickens, I have no tolerance for neighborhood dogs in my yard, no matter how nice the dog allegedly is.

[MrsWeasley]

Oops. Dp.

Edited February 7, 2016 by MrsWeasley

[Alessandra]

Not necessarily. Vizslas are off-the-charts in their need for physical exercise. mental exercise/training/stimulation, and are very emotionally needy. I can't think of another breed that is as maxed out in all three areas.

 

They are affectionate (in the extreme) and ultra-athletic, but they are a breed with major needs. If one loves these qualities, yes a great dog to own. But I usually warn people who are struck by their beauty that Vizslas are a lot of work. Well run, provided mental stimulation, and given love they are great dogs. If these things are neglected they could be a nightmare.

 

Most people really don't want dogs that are this high maintenance. Vs are an extreme case.

 

There is not a dog I'd rather own. But....

 

Bill

I agree with your description.

 

I have a family member who has had Vizslas for the past 30 years or more, always form the same breeder. One dog tended to be overprotective and growled at a young child, was returned to the breeder immediately. The other dogs -- and there were many over three decades -- have all been angelic. Impossibly sweet and affectionate.

 

The story I was told is that, in Hungary during World War II, food was short and many owners had to put down their Vizslas, even though they were excellent hunting dogs and good companions. The ones that got spared were the ones that were the sweetest, most affectionate. Modern Vizslas are descended from those dogs.

 

Bill is spot on about the need for exercise. My relative lives in the Washington DC area. Every morning, the dog gets a long, 45 minute run through a local park that is basically undeveloped woodland. Another long run in the evening. No leash -- the dog runs fast and goes back and forth, circling, getting as much exercise as possible. A shorter walk at midday too. On Saturdays, everyone goes to un unofficial dog area in DC -- no fences, dogs are off leash. I have been many times. It is a dog-owner situation, not a dog walker thing.

 

I would love to have a Vizsla! But here are zero off leash places in my NJ suburbs. The small amount of undeveloped land is all nature centers covered in 'no dog' signs. I would have to go into the next state, I think, to find a place to let the run. :-(

 

One thing I notice about Vizslas is how excited they are at seeing another Vizsla. They run around each other in circles, around and around.

 

Bill, I am amazed at what you did, just speechless.

 

C-rods, Cosmo, Chester -- is there something with C, or just a coincidence?

Edited February 7, 2016 by Alessandra

[Scarlett]

After one of my neighbor's dogs killed one of my chickens, I have no tolerance for neighborhood dogs in my yard, no matter how nice the dog allegedly is.

So what do you do if one comes in your yard?

[MrsWeasley]

So what do you do if one comes in your yard?

So far, I have always resolved it with a phone call, but truly, I would call animal control if my neighbor didn't answer or refused to come collect the dog.

[Scarlett]

So far, I have always resolved it with a phone call, but truly, I would call animal control if my neighbor didn't answer or refused to come collect the dog.

Oh, I see. No animal control where I live. Glad I have had so few problems. Here though if your dog wanders it is likely to be shot.

[Scarlett]

Dogs are the single reason I would ever buy and use a gun.

 

Honestly, if you can't keep your dogs under control, on your own property ? And asking nicely or escalating to animal control doesn't help ? I can see myself using a gun.

 

That's how much I resent a culture of putting up with other people's ill behaved or dangerous animals.

 

Thankfully, I am able to live somewhere with reasonably effective laws instead.

Yep. Me too with the gun issue....

 

People don't tolerate dogs messing with their cattle or chickens.

[MrsWeasley]

Oh, I see. No animal control where I live. Glad I have had so few problems. Here though if your dog wanders it is likely to be shot.

Wow. I hate my neighbor's dog for killing my hen, but I couldn't imagine shooting him!

[Scarlett]

Wow. I hate my neighbor's dog for killing my hen, but I couldn't imagine shooting him!

You might if there was no other recourse. That is country life for you.

[StephanieZ]

Wow, that is really scary. I'm glad you and your dog are OK! All concerned are very fortunate you were there and could handle it so well. I can't imagine handling it any better. I doubt there are many people at all anywhere who could have down what you did. Nicely done.

 

Your dog is extra lucky that you are his owner since I expect you'll be able to handle any fear issues that come up. I love that you hung out for a while after all that to "normalize" things. I wouldn't have thought of that in the moment, but it seems really smart. I hope everything goes OK with your dog.

 

The pit's owner sounds like a "stand up guy" which makes me guess this is the first time such a thing has happened with his dog. These sorts of attacks can really come out of nowhere with certain breeds in particular. 

 

My dh, the vet, has had many sad moments in his career, but I think the most traumatizing for *him* was when he went in for an emergency case in which an owner's dog had attacked and mortally wounded their other dog . . . They'd been living peaceably together for years . . . She lost both of her dogs that night, the one that was killed by the other, and then had to decide to euthanize her long-time-beloved dog. (They had a small child in the house, too, so they weren't taking any more risks after such a gruesome and unpredicted incident.) I think it was a Weimaraner but it was years ago, so I might be remembering wrong. 

 

Following up on the s/o thread, I have to admit that dh loves his pit patients . . . but I've read enough and heard enough that I wouldn't personally allow a pit, a rottie, or a chow to live around my kids. The occasional exposure to a well known pet is one level of risk, but every day . . . nope. There are always risks with pets, but certain breeds definitely have a higher risk of seriously injuring people.

 

 

 

 

[lllll]

nm

Edited February 22, 2016 by _ oq?"

[Guest]

Wow. I hate my neighbor's dog for killing my hen, but I couldn't imagine shooting him!

 

I guess you don't rely on your hens for food.

[lllll]

nm

Edited February 22, 2016 by _ oq?"

[Daria]

Bill is spot on about the need for exercise. My relative lives in the Washington DC area. Every morning, the dog gets a long, 45 minute run through a local park that is basically undeveloped woodland. Another long run in the evening. No leash -- the dog runs fast and goes back and forth, circling, getting as much exercise as possible. A shorter walk at midday too. On Saturdays, everyone goes to un unofficial dog area in DC -- no fences, dogs are off leash. I have been many times. It is a dog-owner situation, not a dog walker thing.

 

As a former DC (now suburban) resident, I'll say that an "unofficial dog area" in DC is a polite way of saying an area where dog owners have repeatedly broken the law to the point that the people for whom the park was designed, particularly those with children, gave up and went away.  3 times, I've lived in areas in DC where a group of dog owners have decided to make a school's play area the "un official dog area".  In one case, the dog area was "Saturday only" but the area was so covered with poop that recess and outdoor PE were impossible, and 400 kids lost 1/2 of their outdoor playspace.  In the other 2 cases, where schools were located close to National Park service land with the plan to have the children play there, kids were routinely terrorized at recess.  The fact the the police didn't enforce the rules in no way made it OK. 

 

My honest opinion is that before someone chooses to live in DC and own a dog with a high need for exercise, that person has a responsibility to make sure they have a plan for legally and sufficiently exercising the dog.  If you live in the city and you want a Vizsla, great, but make sure that you have a large fenced yard, sufficient time and energy to run for hours with your dog on a leash, or enough money to hire someone to exercise your dog.  Otherwise, make a different choice.  

 

I'm not talking about Bill, because I don't know where he lives.  It sounds like some kind of utopia where there are so many parks that the humans can give up 29 acres, an enormous amount of space, and where no dog owner would take an untrained dog to an "unofficial" dog park, or leave the poop unscooped.  If it's really like that, then great.  DC is not like that.  

[MrsWeasley]

I guess you don't rely on your hens for food.

No, I don't. I mean, I love collecting eggs, but they are definitely pets.