Living with your older parents?

[Mom in High Heels]

My mom and step-dad proposed this to me this morning.  James Bond will be retiring sometime in the next 2-6 years from the , and will be getting a job in the civilian world (scary!), and my parents want to live with us when he does.  They want to build us a house, with a separate apt attached to the house or a guest house behind it.  They will pay cash in full to build the house, but have our names on the deed as well, with the stipulation that it becomes ours outright upon their deaths, and we would have to pay the taxes and insurance, with them contributing 1/4 of the utilities.  Now, this is a great deal for us, as the area we're look at retiring (where JB will likely work for his second job) this type of house, with the sqftage we would need would cost about $500K.  

I love my mom to pieces, but we get along much better from a distance, so this makes me crazy nervous.  She also tends to forget that my kids are MY kids and not hers, which has caused problems.  If JB retires in 6 years, Indy will be leaving for college (WHAT?  HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE???), and Han Solo will be 9, so it may not be quite as bad, but Indy is closing in on 12, and she still gives him whatever he wants, and tries to contradict me if I say no, so...

 

 

Does anyone have their older parents living with them? If so, how is that working?

[redsquirrel]

I wouldn't do it. My grandfather moved in with us when I was a kid and it was really, really difficult for all of us.

 

Plus, I have watched my BIL and all his friends retire from the military and go into the private sector. I wouldn't count on whatever job your dh gets will be his last. There is a very good chance that you will have to move at least once again. It isn't a given, just a very strong possibility. He is a retired colonel. Things just haven't been as smooth sailing in the private sector as they were expecting. He has a very high standard of living, don't get me wrong. His kids are going to top tier colleges and they take month long vacations to Italy. But staying in one place, in the dream house, isn't a given. Companies close or have massive layoffs or relocate or are bought.

 

 

[elegantlion]

I love my parents dearly and we have lived with them before. The parenting/grandparenting wasn't an issue, but the "stuff" of life was. They have a lot of stuff and maintain differently than I do. So even the exterior of their home is a reflection of that style and, again love them dearly, but I get a bit twitchy about clutter. 

 

That would be a consideration, as well as the above mentioned. We currently live about 30 minutes apart and I'm waiting for them to visit right now. I wouldn't mind living in the same town as them, but on the same property again would feel weird. 

 

There is a weirdly psychological issue that goes with it too. Even if the property will someday be yours, it won't be at the present. I'm not against intergenerational living, yet there seems to be something you lose (hard to pinpoint what I mean exactly) when you move back with your parents. 

[Luanne]

I think it really depends on your family.  It sounds like it would be difficult in your situation.  My daughter and I have lived with my parents off and on for my daughter's entire life and it has always been all right, but we get along VERY VERY well with both of my parents.  Yes, there are the usual small things that come up from time to time, but less and less since we have been here three years now and my daughter is 25 and is working. 

[Arcadia]

  They want to build us a house, with a separate apt attached to the house or a guest house behind it.  They will pay cash in full to build the house, but have our names on the deed as well, with the stipulation that it becomes ours outright upon their deaths, and we would have to pay the taxes and insurance, with them contributing 1/4 of the utilities

........

I love my mom to pieces, but we get along much better from a distance, so this makes me crazy nervous.  She also tends to forget that my kids are MY kids and not hers, which has caused problems.

 

My dad is similar to your mom.  I would be okay if it was a separate apartment or guest house because as parents age, it would be easier to render help if they are that near.  Under the same roof, no way.  Sharing the kitchen with my dad would be hard enough.  Besides my parents won't like my kids mess so it is nice for them to have their own private area to entertain their friends too.

[LMV]

Given what you have shared I think I would look into building a guest house for your parents to live in on the same property. That way you're close and can have some shared outdoor space but you also each have your own dedicated space.  The guest house with our main home was originally built with the intention that my DH's first inlaws might move in once they retired.  Sadly, their daughter died long before that happened but I think the idea was nice.  Actually, during the period DH and I were first married and trying to adapt to our own new family having a place for them to stay (because DSS is their only grandchild) when they visited that was close but still gave everyone their privacy was nice.  

[SebastianCat]

I'll share what's going on with my DH's parents right now...and ask the OP a few questions...

 

We just moved MIL & FIL 3 weeks ago into assisted living.   Their health has been declining and they lived at least 4+ hours away from each of their kids.    They moved to the city where my SIL lives, and it's been HARD on them AND on us.   The stress alone of them downsizing into a small apartment was awful.   They agreed on which pieces of furniture they'd bring, then kept saying "just one more thing" a half dozen times.   After hauling the furniture across 2 states to their new home, it would not all fit.   So half of it now sits in my SIL's garage/basement.   

 

So I'll ask - how easy will it be for your parents to downsize from their current home to a small apartment?   Will you end up storing 50+ years of their "stuff" in YOUR part of this new home?

 

The other thing going on is that because of their declining health (MIL's issues are physical; FIL has dementia and his issues are mental), they need to have access to 24-hour care.   This is EXPENSIVE.   Selling their former home has become necessary to help finance their care.

 

So I'll ask - what will your options be if your parents need this level of care?   Do they have long-term care insurance (which pays a portion, but not all) or a substantial retirement account to pay for assisted living or nursing home care?   What happens to your immediate family if they need to sell your jointly-owned home to pay for this?

 

These questions, plus the issue of job stability in the civilian sector, plus the hesitancy you raised earlier, would make me decline their offer.

[Butter]

The only way I would agree in your situation is if you have a long, honest talk about boundaries and who the parents are.

 

We lived with my parents for four years all crammed into a tiny 1800 square foot house.  It was *fabulous.*  Seriously.  We absolutely loved living all together and this past year since we moved last May has been hard for us and hard for them.  We miss seeing each other every day.  The kids, especially Adrian, miss having their grandparents right there.

 

When we moved to TX we bought a house way too big for the six of us because my parents are moving in with us soon.  We bought a house with no steps to the front porch and with the laundry room right outside of a huge master bedroom suite.  My parents will have a huge bedroom, gigantic bathroom, and humongous closet on the main floor all to themselves.  We planned where their furniture will go when they come.  Right now we are waiting on them putting their house up for sale, but that has been delayed a little bit because my uncle is critically ill and dying right now and as he never married, my mom has to be extremely involved in medical decisions right now.  They hope to be moved here within the next 6 months.  We are so excited to have them back with us!  It just works so well for us.  My mom is one of my very best friends and my parents absolutely love my husband (feeling is mutual).

 

That said, my parents have made it clear that the same living situation would not work for them if it was with my brother and his family and my sister has made it clear that it would not work for her if it was my parents living with them.  So definitely think long and hard about it before you do it.  It seems that our multi-generational household is more the exception than the rule.

[ThelmaLou]

My 2 cents is don't do it. It's better not to be related in any way other than blood. Not money. There might not be a spoken "catch" to this, but they're giving you this "great deal", as you mentioned. It would be hard for *anyone* not to fall back on "all we've done for you" if you have disagreements over things in the future. It will be hard for you not to guilt yourself into doing things you don't want to do. After all, "remember what they're doing for us?" All I can see is unspoken guilt and expectations. And also a sense of entitlement to have input with your kids.

 

My parents moved in with us almost 5 years ago. I think it was the right decision, and I'm glad we did it. AND, AND, AND, it can be very complicated.

 

You get along better from a distance? Ditto that with me and my mom. It's often very uncomfortable. If you know you have a good relationship at a distance, I would not sacrifice the relationship for a good housing situation. Maybe it would work really well, but if it doesn't, the relationship can really suffer. 

 

IMHO, family and money always clash. 

 

If you all decide that they should live with you (for caretaking purposes either now or down the road), I would try to find a place that you can afford with monthly "rent" from them, but it would be your house purchased with your money. We live in a house that we wouldn't have been able to afford had my parents not moved in with us. They have the downstairs master bedroom (my dad has Parkinson's and Dystonia, and he can't do stairs.) They also have an office and a small living area. We calculated all the expenses for the house, including utilities, taxes, etc...by square foot. We share the kitchen, of course, and the general downstairs living space. If they were to move out, we'd sell the house and downsize, because we not only don't need this space, but we can't justify the expenses associated with this home if they're not living here. I sincerely doubt they'll ever move out, because they can't possibly find any independent or assisted living for anywhere near the price they're paying us for their living expenses. 

 

Anyhow, that was way more loaded with opinions that you probably care to read. From experience, an arrangement like this produces lots of tension. It affects not just my husband and me, but my 5 boys, too. It really changes the whole feel of the household. I'm not saying that to talk down about my parents at all. It's just that merging two households or having any kind of relationship where money is swapping hands is complicated.

[Supertechmom]

Questions to consider....

 

Will the care of this couple fall upon you? From our experience, even a 30 min drive every. Single. Time. One of them falls, requires medical care (even when in assisted living) becomes an all mighty time sucking soul sucking way to live. The stubborn types are often the ones who refuse to seek the kind of care they need until long after they need it. You might be surprised at how much hand holding your parent may need as she gets older when her spouse is sick. My mil basically needs us to pick her up mentally and physically and be with her every time the other gets sick. It would be easier if they were living with us.

 

Is there any issue with your step father of any kind? My hubby's parents tended to remarry constantly. We could easily have a different step dad every few years. We are faced with a real scenario of having a stranger we have known less than a few months outlive the parent. Would that bother you to have the step outlive the parent and remain with you? It bothered my hubby enough to refuse this arrangment unless the parent agreed to not remarry. Your opinion maybe different but I thought I would throw that out there.

 

What is going to be the care arrangements of their old age? Are you able( physically and mentally ) to watch someone you love die? I'm a nurse in a field that has a high rate of death due to the type of illness and age of the patients. More than one family puts their loved one in the hospital because they can't handle end of life. Death is ugly. Are you going to handle it? Arrange care ? Round the clock? Or care to relieve you? Siblings that will share it with you? Comfortable opening your home to the step parent's family ( again ours came with a full grown competely unknown to us family) I would not be comfortable with strangers in my home but wouldn't deny them full access if their father was dying in my home.

 

Off of the above, what about long term illness? Slow decline type of illness that just take years even though you all know the end result will be death. How do you plan to handle it? This happened with my grandfather and my mom moved him in and it was a nightmare. I will never tolerate that situation, especially with children here. Even if they are living with us! I would still expect them to go to a place or have the money for 24 hrs skilled nursing. 24 hr care of someone in that situation is beyond hard especially if you are sole caretaker. My mil had other ideas that made me refuse.

 

Will paying for this house suck up the money they have to take of them medically forcing you to handle their care? Is there enough money for long term care?

 

There are no right or wrong answer. In my own life and those of my patients, I have seen way too much focus in the day-to-day living arrangements and no thought given to the end of life and how it is going to be handled. The answers we came up with to those questions played more with my decision than how we handled living together daily. Especially given that is a few years down the road.

[umsami]

We've looked at this regarding my parents.  There are more and more companies that are specializing in small homes (separate on the property) for elderly parents.  They run about $50K and up.   

 

Sharing the same home would be difficult…but would love to have my parents within walking distance.

 

This is kind of what we're looking at http://www.houzz.com/granny-flat

[Alice]

I have several friends who have done this and made it work. One family lives with both sets of grandparents.!

 

What seems to work well:

 

1) Clearly designated separate areas with boundaries. One friend's Mom lives in a downstairs part of their house with separate living room, bathroom, bedroom and kitchen. There is no door there but the kids are trained to "knock" on grandma's wall and ask if they can come down. They don't go in her kitchen and eat her food, they don't hang out in her area unless it's ok. She's a wonderful grandma and it usually is ok but this gives her a little privacy. She in turn, respects their boundaries. 

 

2) Treating the living situation like you would a non-family member roommate. Meaning things like rent/utilities/etc are clearly written out and agreed on. In your scenerio I'd wonder things like if it is "their" house that they built but has your name on it who has the right to make decisions about repairs or asthetics?Will kids be made to feel like they are living in someone else's house and they have to be extra careful? Do you have the right to do things they don't like to the house? Finances and expectations should be thought out and clearly understood. 

 

I think the thought about end-of-life care is a good one also. If this is their savings then what happens if they get sick and need care or to go to assisted living or something? 

 

Another issue I know was considered for one friend was what her other sibling thought and felt. The mother used her savings to help buy my friend a house that she (the mother) then moved into also. That meant in some ways that the other sibling was "short-changed" his inheritance. I believe that an older person has the right to do what they want with their money and it's not an inheritance until they die but sometimes those kind of perceived inequities can set up a lot of resentment later. 

 

 

[trinchick]

There was a thread on this a long time ago. Here's a link: http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/431693-multi-generational-housing-has-anyone-here-done-this-successfully-thoughts/

 

And I'll quote my very valuable contribution to the discussion at that time  :laugh: :

 

I've been in this situation from a couple of perspectives. Growing up, my mom and grandmother were both widowed, and we all lived together. From my perspective it worked great, but Mom has commented that she felt like there was never a lot of time that was "just us" without my grandmother. 

It also changed the dynamic, I think, between my grandmother and her other grandchildren with whom she did not live. She didn't have the same closeness with them, but nor did she witness the day-to-day pain-in-the-neck factor of the other kids.

Now as an adult, wife, and mother, we have my mom living with us. We bought a house specifically with intergenerational living in mind. There are two master suites (on separate floors) and two living rooms (with lots of space between them) so we can get some distance between us when necessary. The kitchen is shared, which is an occasional source of irritation but generally is OK.

Most of the time it works. I know my kids adore my mother and the time they spend with her. My DH feels a bit differently and many times should be a candidate for sainthood. My mother is very opinionated and now that she is aging doesn't get out much. Without other outlets for her ideas, we hear all of them. As her DD I can take it with a grain of salt, but sometimes it really grates on DH, who however always remains respectful, no matter what outlandish things she may say (including some thinly veiled criticisms). Like I said, candidate for sainthood.

She relies on me, as her only child, for all appointments and social activities. I can honestly say that it has been YEARS since I have been alone in the house. That is my greatest dissatisfaction with the situation. In some ways I have lost my own identity as wife/mother since there is constantly (CONSTANTLY!!) another adult female presence in the home. 

[TechWife]

From a financial standpoint, you need to talk to an attorney who works with estate planning. You would need to do this before the house title is drawn up. You also need to determine who is responsible for the upkeep of the building(s) and property. 

 

In the state where my parents reside, if one party in a married couple requires nursing home care and they are unable to pay, the state will pay for it through their Medicaid program, but they put a lien on any home owned by the patient. They cannot recoup the cost of care as long as there is a surviving spouse residing in the house. As soon as both spouses are in a nursing home, other care arrangement, or the one residing on the property dies, the state takes possession of the property, sells it and recoups the cost of nursing home care. If there is any money left over, it goes to the family. So, in that state, the scenario you are describing might not work to your advantage. It might be a best to create a trust or some other legal tool to protect your parents' financial interests. 

 

From a personal viewpoint, I think only you can answer that question. At the very least, some honest discussions about boundaries need to take place. 

[ThelmaLou]

After reading some of the other posts, I have to chime in and agree with others on additional points. "Stuff" is a huge issue. My pantry is half full of my mom's food and half full of mine. We have 7 people, they have 2. She has loads of stuff crammed into her living spaces, and would like to let it overflow. She also has a huge storage unit with more stuff. Crafts, very old clothing, who knows what else. She has an old, hand crank washing machine that she wanted me to keep on my front porch. She said I could use it as a planter (I don't garden) or a makeshift ice chest for sodas and waters when we have parties (for all those parties we have/) My sister-in-law didn't want it either. So it stayed in storage. Taking up space. It will never come to my house. When she downsized, she wanted me to want her stuff, and I didn't. "This younger generation just doesn't appreciate good furniture and anitques." Yes, I agree. I don't appreciate it. I love my mom. I don't love her stuff. The more she buys, the more of a reactionary minimalist I become. I wholeheartedly understand her appreciation for and attachment to these things. It was a very tough thing for her to give up all the freedom, space, autonomy. It must be really hard living here. Our boys are typical boys. Loud and rambunctious. We leave messes. We always clean them up, but we have to give extra special daily consideration to them in a way we wouldn't if they didn't live here.

 

Long Term Health Insurance. My parents both have this and have also prepaid and pre-planned their funerals. This is wonderful!!! The flip side of the Long Term Health Insurance is that now we have someone 5 days a week, 4 hours a day coming to assist with my dad. That makes 3 adult women in my household: me, my mom, and the helper. AAAARGGGHH! The lady is really sweet and unobtrusive. It's just that....there are a whole. lot. of. people. in. this. house!!!!

 

Kids: We had to have another talk recently with my mom to request that she not tell my kids what to do. They're bossed around enough by me and my husband. They don't need 2 moms. We told her by all means to ask for help from them if she needs it, or to ask them to be quiet if they're being too loud. But little things like, "whose turn is it to unload the dishwasher?" or "Leave your brother alone and stop whining!" No, this is not o.k. It's creating a problem for my boys, and I don't want them to have memories of being bossed around by my mom. They don't need that kind of relationship. They need a grandma.

 

On more than one occasion, I have found decorative items that have magically appeared in my living space or on my front porch. No comments, no questions like, "would you like this item for your kitchen or living room?" Knick-knacks appear on the mantle, pillows appear on the sofa. She pays for them, and I don't want them. Then it hurts her feelings that I don't want them, because after all, she was trying to be generous. So I owe her a debt of gratitude. The right answer is for me to say thank you and love the items with all my heart and to be humbled by her generosity. If I don't want it, though, I've insulted her. She doesn't want to give me something. She wants me to want something regardless of whether I like it. Complicated and stressful.

 

She set up appointments for the carpets to be cleaned and windows to be washed. This is something we wouldn't have paid for. We have a carpet cleaner and 5 capable boys with long reaches and a good work ethic. I don't mind if she wants to pay for a service like this. No skin off my nose if she wants to spend the money. The window washers wanted to know if we wanted some extra special services done for just a little more than what she paid. She called me downstairs and I said "no thanks." She was perturbed, I could tell. My sense from her was, "we paid to have the bulk of this done for you...the least you can do is pitch in a little more for the extra special bonus service." I really can't win. And I really have to fight hard against being guilted into doing things. My husband is a great help. He has a strong backbone. 

 

Running commentary: she chimes in on every conversation. She has something to say about everything. We avoid having any meaningful conversations downstairs because we like our privacy. It's hard not being able to talk significantly about life downstairs in my kitchen...the most natural place for such conversations happen. We sometimes slip up and do it any way. If she's around, she has to say something, solve the problem, suggest an idea, give "words of wisdom" to my boys. She's not only that way with us. She's just a really big talker and places herself front and center of every conversation with friends and family. We kind of react by clamming up, and I know she senses it. She told us recently that she and my dad don't really feel like part of the family because they feel like we don't share enough information with them and that we keep to ourselves a lot. She's right. We do. It's important for us to be a nuclear family and have boundaries. Not because we don't love them. We love them very much. She doesn't understand this and feels left out. She doesn't recognize that she crosses boundaries at all. I agree with what a couple of people said above, too. They really do start to lose their filter as they get older.

[itsheresomewhere]

No just no no no no.   I could not do it and I value my sanity too much to do this.  

 

 

Something to check/think about- I would check on what the taxes would be on a new home in the area and size of the home you want.  That new home could end up being so much more in the end than a home that was already built.  

[trinchick]

And here's another thread: http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/457038-multigenerational-same-house-dwelling/

 

And more wisdom courtesy of me:
 

We do it, and it works but it isn't perfect. My mom lives with us. In no particular order here are some thoughts on the positives and negatives of our situation. Many of these comments are specific to our personalities/situation, so not sure how helpful they will be to others.

What works:

Separate space - We have a large house (3800 SF) that was purchased specifically for intergenerational living. There are two living rooms on either end of the house, so we each have privacy. Our kids' toys aren't strewn all over Mom's living space making her crazy. Mom isn't rolling her eyes whenever DH turns on Star Wars for the umpteenth time. There are also two master suites. Mom's bedroom is on the 2nd floor with en suite bathroom. Our bedroom/bathroom is on the third floor. We share a kitchen, and that works out fine.

Division of Labor - I'm really lucky in that I work outside the home. Mom starts dinner every night which is a huge help for me and allows me to enjoy more time with the kids each night. Mom also minds DD after school in the afternoons - a cost savings, convenience, and load off my mind. She also minded DS when he was an infant, but had to stop when she became ill and he got to be too much for her.

Intergenerational Time - I love that DD and DS are so close to my mother. They all really adore each other, and it is really sweet.

Frank Understanding of Money Issues - We sold our previous separate homes and purchased our current home together in DH's and my name with the understanding that this is my inheritance. DH and I pay for all of the bills associated with the house; she is welcome to purchase things as she wishes (e.g., she recently replaced the fridge because she wanted in-the-door ice and water) but she isn't asked to contribute otherwise.

What Doesn't Work

Personal Space - I am never, ever alone in the house. My mom is retired and an introvert. She doesn't belong to any clubs or get out much besides when I take her someplace. Very occasionally she'll go out with her sisters, but this is rare. Mostly, I am OK with this, but sometimes I just yearn for a quiet hour in the house or the ability to clean my kitchen without my mother suggesting I go about it some other way.

DH/Mom Interaction - DH is awesome to put up with this situation. He really is. My mother isn't the easiest person in the world to live with. She is very opinionated and often critical. He doesn't rise to the bait, even though I can tell he is often irritated.

My/DH Relationship - I love my mom (despite all of the grousing above). I actively seek out her company and opinions. I think if she weren't so easily accessible (again, ALWAYS here), I would transfer some of my need for adult companionship to my husband which would be better for our relationship. 

[Mom in High Heels]

Thank you everyone for your comments.  They have given me a lot to think about.

I wouldn't do it. My grandfather moved in with us when I was a kid and it was really, really difficult for all of us.

 

Plus, I have watched my BIL and all his friends retire from the military and go into the private sector. I wouldn't count on whatever job your dh gets will be his last. There is a very good chance that you will have to move at least once again. It isn't a given, just a very strong possibility. He is a retired colonel. Things just haven't been as smooth sailing in the private sector as they were expecting. He has a very high standard of living, don't get me wrong. His kids are going to top tier colleges and they take month long vacations to Italy. But staying in one place, in the dream house, isn't a given. Companies close or have massive layoffs or relocate or are bought.

 

This is something for us to consider.  James Bond is looking at working for NGIC (National Ground Intelligence Center), which would be a permanent position in a permanent place.  He's also looking at the CIA and FBI, which could mean a move, so that might be an issue.  I had not thought about that, so thanks.

 

My dad is similar to your mom.  I would be okay if it was a separate apartment or guest house because as parents age, it would be easier to render help if they are that near.  Under the same roof, no way.  Sharing the kitchen with my dad would be hard enough.  Besides my parents won't like my kids mess so it is nice for them to have their own private area to entertain their friends too.

 

It would have to be an outbuilding.  My mom is crazy clean, and very particular, which would make me nuts.  The closeness if they needed help is one reason to consider this.

 

 

 

I'm going address this one in the quote.

 

I'll share what's going on with my DH's parents right now...and ask the OP a few questions...

 

We just moved MIL & FIL 3 weeks ago into assisted living.   Their health has been declining and they lived at least 4+ hours away from each of their kids.    They moved to the city where my SIL lives, and it's been HARD on them AND on us.   The stress alone of them downsizing into a small apartment was awful.   They agreed on which pieces of furniture they'd bring, then kept saying "just one more thing" a half dozen times.   After hauling the furniture across 2 states to their new home, it would not all fit.   So half of it now sits in my SIL's garage/basement.   

 

So I'll ask - how easy will it be for your parents to downsize from their current home to a small apartment?   Will you end up storing 50+ years of their "stuff" in YOUR part of this new home?  I have been thinking about this.  They have a freaking ton of stuff.  Their current house is about 4800 sqft, and full of chochkies, and heavy furniture.  Most of it would have to go, as they'd be living in 500-600 sqft.  I don't know how this would go, as my mom is very attached to stuff.

 

The other thing going on is that because of their declining health (MIL's issues are physical; FIL has dementia and his issues are mental), they need to have access to 24-hour care.   This is EXPENSIVE.   Selling their former home has become necessary to help finance their care. 

 

So I'll ask - what will your options be if your parents need this level of care?   Do they have long-term care insurance (which pays a portion, but not all) or a substantial retirement account to pay for assisted living or nursing home care?   What happens to your immediate family if they need to sell your jointly-owned home to pay for this?  They do have provisions in place for assisted living/long term care if needed

 

These questions, plus the issue of job stability in the civilian sector, plus the hesitancy you raised earlier, would make me decline their offer. 

 

 

The only way I would agree in your situation is if you have a long, honest talk about boundaries and who the parents are.

 

Absolutely.  

 

 

Answers in quote.

My 2 cents is don't do it. It's better not to be related in any way other than blood. Not money. There might not be a spoken "catch" to this, but they're giving you this "great deal", as you mentioned. It would be hard for *anyone* not to fall back on "all we've done for you" if you have disagreements over things in the future. It will be hard for you not to guilt yourself into doing things you don't want to do. After all, "remember what they're doing for us?" All I can see is unspoken guilt and expectations. And also a sense of entitlement to have input with your kids.  A very good point.

 

My parents moved in with us almost 5 years ago. I think it was the right decision, and I'm glad we did it. AND, AND, AND, it can be very complicated.

 

You get along better from a distance? Ditto that with me and my mom. It's often very uncomfortable. If you know you have a good relationship at a distance, I would not sacrifice the relationship for a good housing situation. Maybe it would work really well, but if it doesn't, the relationship can really suffer.   This is a concern

 

IMHO, family and money always clash. 

 

If you all decide that they should live with you (for caretaking purposes either now or down the road), I would try to find a place that you can afford with monthly "rent" from them, but it would be your house purchased with your money. We live in a house that we wouldn't have been able to afford had my parents not moved in with us. They have the downstairs master bedroom (my dad has Parkinson's and Dystonia, and he can't do stairs.) They also have an office and a small living area. We calculated all the expenses for the house, including utilities, taxes, etc...by square foot. We share the kitchen, of course, and the general downstairs living space. If they were to move out, we'd sell the house and downsize, because we not only don't need this space, but we can't justify the expenses associated with this home if they're not living here. I sincerely doubt they'll ever move out, because they can't possibly find any independent or assisted living for anywhere near the price they're paying us for their living expenses.  Hmmm... I hadn't thought about buying a house and having them rent a guest house from us.  Good thought.

 

Anyhow, that was way more loaded with opinions that you probably care to read. From experience, an arrangement like this produces lots of tension. It affects not just my husband and me, but my 5 boys, too. It really changes the whole feel of the household. I'm not saying that to talk down about my parents at all. It's just that merging two households or having any kind of relationship where money is swapping hands is complicated.

 

Answers in quote.

Questions to consider....

Will the care of this couple fall upon you? From our experience, even a 30 min drive every. Single. Time. One of them falls, requires medical care (even when in assisted living) becomes an all mighty time sucking soul sucking way to live. The stubborn types are often the ones who refuse to seek the kind of care they need until long after they need it. You might be surprised at how much hand holding your parent may need as she gets older when her spouse is sick. My mil basically needs us to pick her up mentally and physically and be with her every time the other gets sick. It would be easier if they were living with us.  This is my mom almost exactly.

Is there any issue with your step father of any kind? My hubby's parents tended to remarry constantly. We could easily have a different step dad every few years. We are faced with a real scenario of having a stranger we have known less than a few months outlive the parent. Would that bother you to have the step outlive the parent and remain with you? It bothered my hubby enough to refuse this arrangment unless the parent agreed to not remarry. Your opinion maybe different but I thought I would throw that out there.   They've been married a long time, so I'm not concerned about a divorce.  My step-dad is actually worried that we wouldn't want him anymore if my mom died before him, but we absolutely would.  I love him and my boys practically worship him.  I would not toss him out if something happened to my mom.  I get along with him much better.  :)  I hadn't thought about the remarrying thing, but it is something to consider.

What is going to be the care arrangements of their old age? Are you able( physically and mentally ) to watch someone you love die? I'm a nurse in a field that has a high rate of death due to the type of illness and age of the patients. More than one family puts their loved one in the hospital because they can't handle end of life. Death is ugly. Are you going to handle it? Arrange care ? Round the clock? Or care to relieve you? Siblings that will share it with you? Comfortable opening your home to the step parent's family ( again ours came with a full grown competely unknown to us family) I would not be comfortable with strangers in my home but wouldn't deny them full access if their father was dying in my home.  I have no siblings, and my step-dad has no family (no children, parents or siblings), so this wouldn't be an issue either.  If I had siblings, or he had a family, I would have to give this serious thought.  As for care, as I said above, they have provisions for long term care/assisted living.

Off of the above, what about long term illness? Slow decline type of illness that just take years even though you all know the end result will be death. How do you plan to handle it? This happened with my grandfather and my mom moved him in and it was a nightmare. I will never tolerate that situation, especially with children here. Even if they are living with us! I would still expect them to go to a place or have the money for 24 hrs skilled nursing. 24 hr care of someone in that situation is beyond hard especially if you are sole caretaker. My mil had other ideas that made me refuse.  See above.

Will paying for this house suck up the money they have to take of them medically forcing you to handle their care? Is there enough money for long term care?  Yes, there is money for long term care.

There are no right or wrong answer. In my own life and those of my patients, I have seen way too much focus in the day-to-day living arrangements and no thought given to the end of life and how it is going to be handled. The answers we came up with to those questions played more with my decision than how we handled living together daily. Especially given that is a few years down the road.  Something for me to think about!

 

[Starr]

I like this in theory. But I would think seriously about not being able to move. What if you want to be nearer to Indy? How old are you parents? TechWife has some good info to consider. 

[North Coast School]

We lived with my in-laws.  They purchased a very, very large home on acreage in the country, settled into part of the home, then we sold our house, and moved in with them.  The idea would be for us to help them with the property, and for us to have it willed to us upon their death.

 

It was HORRIBLE.  Plain and simple.  First, MIL flatly refused to get rid of enough stuff to make room for our family...AFTER we moved in.  So we ended up selling almost everything we owned to fit in the house.  After that fiasco, MIL and FIL both started freaking out about the noise and mess of children, pets and homeschool. Next came when my MIL started complaining about me and all of the horrible things she never realized about me until I moved in.  The last straw was when she started focusing her venom on DD.  She accused DD of stealing things almost EVERY DAY.  We realize now that she is in the early stages of dementia, but it was very painful at the time.

 

It all ended very badly.  They basically kicked us out after a year.  It was THEIR house and property, so we were left with nothing.  Luckily we had a nice little rental property that we owned in town, so we weren't homeless, but we literally had NOTHING.  No furniture, no dishes, no curtains, no pillows, nothing.  We had to start over like newly weds

 

My in-laws, both pretty much disabled, are living by themselves in a 4,000 square foot home with two garages and two master bedrooms and 5 acres.  My family of four and three pets are living in a 1200 square foot rambler with no yard.  I had to stop homeschooling for a while after the move because of the disruption and chaos.

 

The relationship is damaged and sad.  DD is afraid of her once beloved g-ma.  Grandpa misses us terribly and feels a tremendous sense of loss and guilt.  Hubby is embarrassed and angry.

 

ETA:  I read above that your MIL is attached to her stuff and has a ton of it.  This sounds just like my MIL.  She moved every single item from her old house to the new house, promising to "go through it all" and "get rid of most of it" when we moved in.  It ended up being much harder for her than anyone ever imagined...crying, sobbing, fighting, screaming EVERY.SINGLE.DAY.  

 

HOARDERS (and that is what someone who has 4,000 square feet of furniture for two people is, even when it is kept fairly tidy) can and will have major breakdowns when their stuff is threatened.  That is what happened to my MIL and it ruined things for the rest of the family.

 

 

[trinchick]

We lived with my in-laws.  They purchased a very, very large home on acreage in the country, settled into part of the home, then we sold our house, and moved in with them.  The idea would be for us to help them with the property, and for us to have it willed to us upon their death.

 

It was HORRIBLE.  Plain and simple.  First, MIL flatly refused to get rid of enough stuff to make room for our family...AFTER we moved in.  So we ended up selling almost everything we owned to fit in the house.  After that fiasco, MIL and FIL both started freaking out about the noise and mess of children, pets and homeschool. Next came when my MIL started complaining about me and all of the horrible things she never realized about me until I moved in.  The last straw was when she started focusing her venom on DD.  She accused DD of stealing things almost EVERY DAY.  We realize now that she is in the early stages of dementia, but it was very painful at the time.

 

It all ended very badly.  They basically kicked us out after a year.  It was THEIR house and property, so we were left with nothing.  Luckily we had a nice little rental property that we owned in town, so we weren't homeless, but we literally had NOTHING.  No furniture, no dishes, no curtains, no pillows, nothing.  We had to start over like newly weds

 

My in-laws, both pretty much disabled, are living by themselves in a 4,000 square foot home with two garages and two master bedrooms and 5 acres.  My family of four and three pets are living in a 1200 square foot rambler with no yard.  I had to stop homeschooling for a while after the move because of the disruption and chaos.

 

The relationship is damaged and sad.  DD is afraid of her once beloved g-ma.  Grandpa misses us terribly and feels a tremendous sense of loss and guilt.  Hubby is embarrassed and angry.

 

Your sad example raises a really good point. What happens if it doesn't work out? Is there an exit strategy?

 

As I said before, this arrangement is working for us, but if it weren't I think we'd be truly stuck. There would be no way out without major damage to our relationships and finances.

[Mom in High Heels]

There was a thread on this a long time ago. Here's a link: http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/431693-multi-generational-housing-has-anyone-here-done-this-successfully-thoughts/

 

And I'll quote my very valuable contribution to the discussion at that time  :laugh: :

 

I've been in this situation from a couple of perspectives. Growing up, my mom and grandmother were both widowed, and we all lived together. From my perspective it worked great, but Mom has commented that she felt like there was never a lot of time that was "just us" without my grandmother. 

 

It also changed the dynamic, I think, between my grandmother and her other grandchildren with whom she did not live. She didn't have the same closeness with them, but nor did she witness the day-to-day pain-in-the-neck factor of the other kids.  I am an only, so my boys are her only grandchildren.  This wouldn't be a problem.

 

Now as an adult, wife, and mother, we have my mom living with us. We bought a house specifically with intergenerational living in mind. There are two master suites (on separate floors) and two living rooms (with lots of space between them) so we can get some distance between us when necessary. The kitchen is shared, which is an occasional source of irritation but generally is OK.  I could NOT do a shared kitchen.

 

Most of the time it works. I know my kids adore my mother and the time they spend with her. My DH feels a bit differently and many times should be a candidate for sainthood. My mother is very opinionated and now that she is aging doesn't get out much. Without other outlets for her ideas, we hear all of them. As her DD I can take it with a grain of salt, but sometimes it really grates on DH, who however always remains respectful, no matter what outlandish things she may say (including some thinly veiled criticisms). Like I said, candidate for sainthood.  Bless your husband.

 

She relies on me, as her only child, for all appointments and social activities. I can honestly say that it has been YEARS since I have been alone in the house. That is my greatest dissatisfaction with the situation. In some ways I have lost my own identity as wife/mother since there is constantly (CONSTANTLY!!) another adult female presence in the home. This is a concern for me.  They are both really independent now, but I don't know about as they get older. 

 

 

From a financial standpoint, you need to talk to an attorney who works with estate planning. You would need to do this before the house title is drawn up. You also need to determine who is responsible for the upkeep of the building(s) and property.  We would absolutely talk to an estate planner.

 

In the state where my parents reside, if one party in a married couple requires nursing home care and they are unable to pay, the state will pay for it through their Medicaid program, but they put a lien on any home owned by the patient. They cannot recoup the cost of care as long as there is a surviving spouse residing in the house. As soon as both spouses are in a nursing home, other care arrangement, or the one residing on the property dies, the state takes possession of the property, sells it and recoups the cost of nursing home care. If there is any money left over, it goes to the family. So, in that state, the scenario you are describing might not work to your advantage. It might be a best to create a trust or some other legal tool to protect your parents' financial interests.  â€‹  I think the house should be in our names only, for this reason.

 

From a personal viewpoint, I think only you can answer that question. At the very least, some honest discussions about boundaries need to take place. 

[Mom in High Heels]

You guys are so amazing.  I love the Hive.

[Catwoman]

One of my biggest concerns is whether or not your parents truly understand how tiny a space 500-600 square feet really is. It's not like they're downsizing from 1500 square feet, so we're talking about a HUGE difference. It could even lead to problems between your parents if they're not used to living in such close quarters.

 

And what happens if the space turns out to be too small and they are unhappy? Would you be selling the property so they could buy something larger for themselves?

 

I'm not trying to be discouraging. I'm just thinking that because they want to be close to you, they might be underestimating their own needs.

[sbbulliv]

My parents have a condo down the street (less than a quarter mile) and we all love it. The familial closeness and convenience with helping are major advantages. They are able to help me with occasional childcare right now which is great. And it will be easy for me to help them in the future. I like the separate living space though. I think it is an advantage to having them downsize when they are younger and have the energy to make decisions versus being left with a full house of stuff when you are greiving. I agree with previous posters about figuring out the financial situation differently. Best of luck!

[Χά�ων]

I have watched my BIL and all his friends retire from the military and go into the private sector. I wouldn't count on whatever job your dh gets will be his last. There is a very good chance that you will have to move at least once again. It isn't a given, just a very strong possibility. He is a retired colonel. Things just haven't been as smooth sailing in the private sector as they were expecting. He has a very high standard of living, don't get me wrong. His kids are going to top tier colleges and they take month long vacations to Italy. But staying in one place, in the dream house, isn't a given. Companies close or have massive layoffs or relocate or are bought.

:iagree:  I have family who have done this and this is their experience. 

 

 

 

My parents and I live on the same property. We each have our own house and while most days either I go there or they come here for some reason or other it works with minimal hitches. My father has brain damage and there has been a struggle to learn boundaries. For example when I am cooking breakfast food in bulk he would come over and help himself to 3-6 days worth of what I am making or he would wander in and out to ask me questions or get something or do, who knows what in my house, while I am trying to teach DS. But, I would not change it. Economically it would be much harder on everyone if we lived elsewhere individually. 

 

 

For what you are describing, I would sit down and have a heart to heart with them. I would keep options open and look at possibly a large duplex, or maybe just living in two completely separate houses on the same property rather than them in a small attached apartment. There really are a lot of options out there that could make the situation work.

[73349]

One concern I don't think has been mentioned: What if they outlive you? Not a likely scenario, but if your kids are still underage and it happens, who would be their guardian? Would that person move in to take care of your kids? Or would the kids be moving out (of a house which they would technically own if the deed just listed you and DH)? Or would your mom move into the main house and be their caregiver?

[Heather in Neverland]

I would LOVE for my mom to come live with me. One day she will as I will take care of her when she is old. My dh loves her too and would be happy for her to live with us.

 

My in-laws on the other hand? Uh... No.

 

In your situation, I'm not sure. The are several red flags but they don't seem insurmountable.

[KatieJ]

I know someone who added an IN Law apartment on to their house.  It wasn't the greatest situation.  I think a guest house with no common walls would be easier. 

 When Gpa passed on and Gma remarried it was empty most of the time.It was hard to sell the house later as it wasn't zoned for a non related renter, so only family members could legally live there. 

[Danestress]

I would start by just talking to an attorney and an accountant about how to best structure this kind of arrangement.  If your parents put you on a deed, does the law allow it be the kind of deed where you automatically inherit?  In my state, only married couples can have that.  DH and I are both on a deed, and if he dies, his share in the  house is mine - not subject to probate or inheritance taxes.  But if I had the same house with my son and I on the deed, it could not be structured that way. He and I would be co-owners, and while I could designate him my heir, he would inherit that with the normal tax consequences of any other inheritance.  There are a lot of factors involved, but this would be the big one for me.  Having four people listed on a deed creates a lot of complications. I would not even consider doing this without some serious legal advice and taking into account all kinds of possibilities - you die, your DH divorces you, your Mom dies before you, your step-father remarries, you want to take equity out of the house to pay for college or some catastrophic illness not covered by insurance, your parents need expensive care in old age that they would normally sell a house in order to acquire, etc.

 

Also, if your parents put you on a deed for a house they paid cash for, would you need to count that as a gift during that tax year?  Because that would result in one heck of a tax bill.  Some of these issues are federal tax issues, others are state issues, and the laws concerning issues of deeds and inheritance require specific knowledge of the laws of the state, so don't take the advice of friends or boardie - except the advice that you should consult an attorney:)

 

I keep thinking of all the possible negative scenarios that probably would never happen, but might.  But any of us could have parents who live to be 100, and meanwhile, we are in our seventies with totally different lives than we expected, needs that may not be obvious now, and this could really affect your flexibility.

 

If you have siblings, this will affect them too.  You need to look at the whole picture. 

 

I personally wouldn't do it.  I'm not saying I wouldn't have an elderly parent live with me.  I might.  But I would want to keep it as simple in terms of finances and legalities as possible. 

 

I love having our Moms nearby  but not living with us.  Yes, we could save money by moving everyone into one house. But I think it's worth the difference in price to have separate homes for as long as possible.  And I will also say that as your parents age, in some ways, they become different people.  Not people you love less, but people who may be harder to live with for various reasons.  I think it is really important to take good care of our older parents, and moving them in may be one way you will do that, but I also think that doing that 15 years before you have to might result in 15 years of irritation and grumpiness.  It would for me.