College after gap year in jail?

[Just Another Jen]

I'm hoping that you all can help me with the logistics of this strange situation. My son will be released from the idoc bootcamp at the beginning of May. He will be 19 with a homeschool diploma from me dated 2011. He would like to attend college next fall and study literature/ philosophy. He has not taken the act or sat and won' t really be able to prepare for either until after his release. I 've been doing some preliminary research for him. He'd like a smaller school with a lot of discussion time.

So, a couple questions:

1. Should he go the community college route because I think he'll have missed most admission deadlines?

2. Does anyone have any schools we should look at?

3. This will make an interesting answer to- What did you do during your gap year? Or should he not say why he took the year off?

 

Thanks,

Jen

[readwithem]

I'm hoping that you all can help me with the logistics of this strange situation. My son will be released from the idoc bootcamp at the beginning of May.

:hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray:

 

 

That is all.

[readwithem]

Okay, I'll address your questions :)

 

I don't really know what to say about his gap year - but I would think there will be some colleges that will find it intriguing that he read all those books during his incarceration :) Maybe it will be helpful if he goes and interviews on campus?

 

St. Johns comes to mind, thinking about colleges with a lot of lit discussion. Keep us posted, okay? Hugs to both of you!!!

[Lolly]

I would go with community college. Find out what the entrance requirements are. Here, taking the ACT is required for people under the age of 21. It is what they use for placement into classes. If they have another way to enroll, I would go with it instead (usually untimed). If he needs the ACT, just have him take it right after he is released. I wouldn't worry too much about prepping; I would just have him start classes where he places. If that isn't acceptable, he could spend some time prepping and start school during the winter term instead. I doubt there will be any question about where he was or what he did.

[Just Another Jen]

:hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray: :hurray:

 

 

That is all.

 

 

 

Will you be my new best internet friend? That's exactly how I feel about it.

[Ohdanigirl]

I think community college is a swell idea. It will allow him to get used to all the positive changes happening in his life. Also, he could always study for the SAT/ACT and apply next year or transfer as a Jr.

 

As far as the reason for missing school. I do not think he needs to mention this now, but it may be the source of a great admissions essay sometime in the future. Just an idea.

 

Congrats to your ds on wanting to move forward and do good things.

[Jane in NC]

May I suggest that he look at Colleges that Change Lives? Many of the small liberal arts schools discussed in this book are willing to look beyond test scores or transcripts to find interesting students who don't necessarily fit into normal boxes.

 

And bravo to your son. I wish him well on his journey.

[readwithem]

Will you be my new best internet friend? That's exactly how I feel about it.

 

 

Of course :) :) :) :) :) :)

 

I know you are so proud of your ds. Heck, I'm proud of him.

 

What can we do to make the holidays cheerier for him? Can he accept any more books? Music? Let us know. :grouphug:

[readwithem]

Oh and I meant to add that I'm so proud of you AND him for looking forward to his future life!

[Just Another Jen]

Of course :) :) :) :) :) :)

 

I know you are so proud of your ds. Heck, I'm proud of him.

 

What can we do to make the holidays cheerier for him? Can he accept any more books? Music? Let us know. :grouphug:

 

We can't send anymore stuff. He should be being moved over to the camp within a couple weeks. It actually looks like he'll be moving on Christmas eve. While at bootcamp he can only have a minimum of possessions. He is already mailing books home in preparation for his move. He would love a Christmas card or note of encouragement. During bootcamp the only contact we will have is through the mail. PM me if you'd like his current address.

 

 

Jen

[swellmomma]

I would consider another year at home to prepare for required exams, get back into the swing of life, and mentally prepare for his future and apply for a January admission or wait until the following year. A 2nd gap year is not the end of the world.

[Starr]

I would think of a good living situation first. His education will come together. Will he be able to do well without structure? Would it be easier to have home support for a while? You could also graduate him a year later. So proud of him. Praying he does well the next few months.

[Just Another Jen]

That's a good question. He will have to live with us for awhile (I'm not sure how long) while he is on parole. I am assuming if he got into a school that wasn't local he could report to a parole agent around the school. But, it may be better to go to community college here and finish parole. Then he would have no legal restrictions. Our attorney has told us that the felony conviction can be removed from his record after bootcamp if we want to peruse that. Of course we do.

Thanks to all of you for the good ideas- it's really helping me to think this all out.

[creekland]

May I suggest that he look at Colleges that Change Lives? Many of the small liberal arts schools discussed in this book are willing to look beyond test scores or transcripts to find interesting students who don't necessarily fit into normal boxes.

 

And bravo to your son. I wish him well on his journey.

 

 

:iagree: If you want to have more time, how about having him start with a class or two at the cc this coming year while he also looks for (and hopefully gets) a job. Then prep for the tests, take them, and head to a 4 year school as a freshman the following year. It sounds like he will have a great future, so rather than rushing an "ok" path, it could be good to take time and set up a "great" path for him. The class or two will get him in the groove with studying and pace, the job could give him some extra $$ and more pacing. The test scores can give you an idea of good-fit schools. The year as a whole can make a nice family time during the transition. If he decides he likes the cc route, there's no harm in extending that either, but this way he'd have time and some experience to make his own choice.

 

Bravo to him. I also wish him well! As a mom, I rejoice with you too. :party:

[Candid]

Some colleges will probably screen him for criminal convictions, I can't really tell if this is what he has with what you've told us.

 

If you search on this you'll find a lot of articles. I'm going to put a few that came up when I searched:

 

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2011/05/report_colleges_increase_use_o.html

 

http://www.unchainingcivilrights.org/assets/documents/Education.pdf

 

http://www.communityalternatives.org/pdf/Reconsidered-criminal-hist-recs-in-college-admissions.pdf

 

While he is at boot camp, I think you would be wise to call places he might like to go and ask. You don't have to tell them his name, but it is possible they'll ask for details because I would assume that in their desire to protect other students knowing details would help them. There is no sense spending time, hopes, and expectations on a school that will automatically deny him.

[Nan in Mass]

First - This spring will be a true spring for your family, won't it? Hugs for the coming holiday season and wishing your son strength and grace to get through boot camp.

 

I had one that did something else (plumbing) after high school and then decided one Aug. to go to college. We didn't even try to get him in that fall and I spent the whole winter worrying that he would somehow get derailed from his plan. He had taken the SATs and had a ps transcript, so it was a bit easier than your situation. The wait worked out fine. He spent the fall making the app and waiting to hear, and the spring reviewing his math in a cc math class, so although I'm sure the year seemed longer to him than it did to me, he didn't feel like he was just waiting uselessly. He was working full time, though, so that might make a difference. He took some vacation in the summer so he started school more rested than he had been since he started high school, I think, and got to go on our family vacation.

 

If I were you, I would be worried about explaining the gap year also. Obviously, you don't want to lie, but obvously, what should be private information should be private information. I would weigh the need for your son to immediately move on to accomplishing something in his life (going to school right away) with the advantages of waiting a year (or half a year) to take the time to get his record cleared. I also would take a minute right now and look at some college apps. I think I remember my sons' college (two at the same place) app having a line that asked whether they had ever been accused (underlined) of a crime. Or something like that. I can't remember the exact wording - I just remember noticing the accused part and wondering. We have a friend who got into trouble for having an all-too-realistic gun model at a college party and spent the night in a police station for it and then had to deal with it in various situations forever because he didn't have the money to fight it. There also was a statement on the app that you had to sign saying that all the info was correct and complete. Anyway, you might want to go look at a few apps and at the common app and some of the suppliments for small liberal arts colleges, and talk to your lawyer about what exactly his status will be.

 

As far as what to do with the gap year, if he takes one, perhaps he could take community college composition, get his college math requirement out of the way, and work and save money for college? If he takes cc classes, he might or might not have classes where there are good discussions about literature. The discussions might be very interesting because people are coming from all over the place, or they might be full of half-dead students who just want to check off the box or are only there because it is easier than getting a job. If he stays at the cc, I would have him ask around at the college and try to sign up for classes with prof's who have a reputation for having lively classes. (This can happen at non-cc's as well.)

 

If you decide that it is important for his mental health to go to a 4-year college right away, is there any reason he can't apply now, from jail, for the fall? You'd have to scramble to get it done before he goes into boot camp, but you have a month. Is he homeschooled? If not, there are schools where he doesn't need SAT scores. (And there might be ones out there which will take homeschoolers without SAT scores. The few test-optional ones we looked at just happened to want SAT scores from homeschoolers.) There are schools with rolling admissions whose application window closes in July. There might not be very many, but they exist. If he were looking for a specialized program, then the program might fill, but literature would probably be ok. I think the biggest challenge with that option is going to be finding one where the students are lively and not half-dead. Well, other than figuring out how to pay for it. That is always a challenge these days.

 

You probably know all that but I just wanted to offer you some encouragement and tell you that it is possible to wait to go to college, even if you are an impatient young man.

 

Nan

[Barbara H]

I hope he's home for Christmas! Here are just general thoughts which may or may not apply to his specific situation but may help someone else.

 

Many colleges are going to be hesitant with a record particularly if it involved anything violent. That may be unfair, but it is reality particularly with liability colleges tend to tread carefully. For this reason, it may be a lot easier to begin with community college and in many situations that will also make it so he doesn't have to take the SAT or ACT

 

Felony drug convinctions can make it difficult to receive financial aid for a period of time. If he was on financial aid at time it can be a permanent suspension. So, if his conviction was for drugs that's something to look at carefully. http://www.iseek.org/iseek/static/FAFSA%20Drug%20Conviction%20Worksheet.pdf

 

Just a total long shot if this is a fit, but I see you are in the Chicago area so I will toss this out. There is a special scholarship at Wheaton that may be of interest. http://www.bgcprisonministries.com/index.php?id=7

[scholarly]

To share my knowledge: I worked at a college that asked on the application if a potential student had criminal convictions. They also required an essay describing the crime. However, this did not exclude the person from entrance to the college; it just meant he/she had an interview with the admissions director. Occasionally the admissions department would recommend the student wait another year before attending, if the conviction/incarceration had been very recent. Other than those items, it wasn't a barrier to the student. This was a small conservative Christian college.

 

And congratulations!

[Just Another Jen]

Well, it wasn't violent, or drug related. I (yes - I am biased) think it was a failure in the system. In most areas of the state he would have gotten community service. The guards even tell him that he got a bad deal. I think that he has made it into a good thing and I think he learned more from this experience than he would have with community service. I think it easily could have gone the other way for someone not from a supportive stable family. I think for those boys it starts a pattern of hating the system and they will be repeat offenders.

The Wheaton scholarship sounds great- but he wont have been in for a year. It will be about 9 months all told.

If we go back to court the felony conviction will be removed from his record. It will show that he was incarcerated and went to bootcamp.

I would like for him to go to a 4 year school right away, because I think it would make his new life very different from his old life. But, if we can't make it happen than we'll see what we can do. I'm getting used to waiting. :)

[Barbara H]

I understand what you are saying about the inconsistant punishments from one person to another. Often isn't a lot of logic or fairness.

 

If he's better to enter a four year school directly I would not rule that out. The most challenging part may be the financial piece because he's starting late. If you want it for next year, I would suggest....

Get his records together now if you have not done so already.

Getting him registered for ACT or SAT now. There is a Jan test for the SAT and a Feb for the ACT.

Fill out the FAFSA after Jan 1

Start looking at colleges who will likely have space and are less selective.

 

May 1 is the official day for college decisions. After this date there are always colleges that still have room. This often includes many good schools. Colleges are really just guessing when they accept students and they don't know ultimately how many will choose them. Also, particularly many mid tier liberal arts colleges and Christian colleges are hurting for students. The one difficulty is there can be less financial aid dollars open this late in the season.

 

But, if he's flexible about where he goes, there should be four year options open him. There are a variety of ways to handle his gap year - he can write about it the additional information section or you can write about in the counselor letter or he can decide to just leave it out and see what happens. The fact that it is not drugs or violence oriented does make it an easier sell if he wants to talk about it.

[kiana]

I would also look into taking a math or english summer course at the community college if he's up for it. It'll ease him into things, and he'll have a chance to start out with just one course.

 

Community colleges have some really good teachers and nearly invariably have small classes. He could knock out a fair number of gen eds in one year. The deadlines are also much later, and if he has the FAFSA filled out and ready to go (or you have it essentially filled out so all that's needed is data entry) he could qualify immediately.

[creekland]

 

I would like for him to go to a 4 year school right away, because I think it would make his new life very different from his old life. But, if we can't make it happen than we'll see what we can do. I'm getting used to waiting. :)

 

 

What major would he be interested in doing? What area of the country are you most interested in? Definitely sign up for the SAT or ACT as soon as you can so he'll have some scores. As mentioned before by a pp, there are always schools with room though the finances could be a concern (unless they aren't on your end). However, with some thoughts to the questions above, the Hive might be able to come up with suggestions to try. I can check with our school's college counselor for ideas too, but we'll need to know field, scores, and are Christian colleges an option? I'm guessing so since you thought the Wheaton scholarship looked interesting... (it could still be worth a try if his scores come back decent even if he's only at 9 months - you never know).

[lifesadream83]

I'm hoping that you all can help me with the logistics of this strange situation. My son will be released from the idoc bootcamp at the beginning of May. He will be 19 with a homeschool diploma from me dated 2011. He would like to attend college next fall and study literature/ philosophy. He has not taken the act or sat and won' t really be able to prepare for either until after his release. I 've been doing some preliminary research for him. He'd like a smaller school with a lot of discussion time.

So, a couple questions:

1. Should he go the community college route because I think he'll have missed most admission deadlines?

2. Does anyone have any schools we should look at?

3. This will make an interesting answer to- What did you do during your gap year? Or should he not say why he took the year off?

 

Thanks,

Jen

 

Jen,

 

I am not sure the background of what had happened to land him in the boot camp but my little brother also did time in one like that years ago. Throwing him into a 4 year college situation right away may not be the best option. I would put him in the Local CC and have him work on general education requirements or an AA in the same field. This will allow him to establish good standing in a college environment so that when applying to a 4 year college they will see progress from the boot camp. It will also give him the time needed to get back into the groove of doing school work, a shorter goal to work on which will give him a much needed sense of accomplishment mid way through his long term goal.

 

I don't have a college student but that is based on my experience with colleges these days (as I am working on my BA while homeschooling dd) and also with my brother back when he was at the tail end of highschool.

 

Good Luck to both of you!

-Jenn

[laundrycrisis]

Jen, I am also in Chicagoland, and the local CC in our area does not require the ACT. They have their own placement test, which the ACT can substitute for with certain scores, but without an ACT score, you just take their placement test.

[butterflymommy]

As another poster mentioned, many schools ask about criminal background in the application. I remember reading a story about someone whose acceptance to a competitive school was rescinded when they were arrested for something relatively petty toward the end of their senior year.

 

Some schools may also do background checks. You will probably have to look into this on a school by school basis. It wouldn't hurt to start doing the legwork now for him.

 

Also, some professions will be very difficult to find a job in with any kind of criminal record-- something else to keep in mind when choosing a program. For example any kind of work in a hospital would probably be out. So you could research this for him too, in the meantime.

[Tullia]

Now, that's good news! :hurray: I would suggest community college as the first step; ours has accomodations for a wide range of unusual situations. As far as the quality of discussion in classes--it varies. My son always found excellent instructors and exceopt for one course there was at least a small core group of people who brought a wide range of life experiences (both happy and unhappy) to the discussions. CC would give him time to get some basic requirements on his transcript, deal with legal issues, and look at likely options for transferring. If he does go the cc route with the intention of transferring to a private college or university he'd want to transfer sooner rather than later. State schools usually have articulation agreements that give you more leeway with transferring credits.

[Just Another Jen]

Thanks to everyone else who has weighed in. I am heading down to visit him tomorrow and we are going to talk in more detail at our visit. He Will be shipped to boot camp in the next 2 weeks so this will be our last visit for a long time. I' m hoping we can hash through a lot of these questions if it isn't too loud in the visiting room. I won' t be able to talk or see him again until March. Even then we will have a one hour visit until I pick him up in May.

Based on that I think I will encourage him to plan on Community college this Summer. He should be able to get signed up in plenty of time and he can take their entrance exam. I want him to take ownership of his future and he just can't get started until May when he is released. I will update on Wednesday.

 

thanks again, Jen

[laundrycrisis]

:grouphug: I hope you have a good visit with him. :grouphug:

[readwithem]

:grouphug: I hope you have a good visit with him. :grouphug:

 

 

:iagree:

 

Give him a big hug from his WTM aunties! We're cheering for BOTH of you. I think you have a fabulous plan!! Let us know how it goes. Prayers coming your way tomorrow!

[elegantlion]

:grouphug: I've followed your story and I admire the way you've handled the situation. I have no advice on the college issue, but I would advise doing whatever is necessary to remove the felony conviction from his record. That would follow him around and be more damaging than anything. Despite qualification some employers won't hire those with convictions. The lawyer fees could well be made up in the difference in salary from obtaining a better job without the conviction on his record.

 

I hope you have a pleasant visit and I wish you and him all the best.

[Colleen in NS]

Sooooooo glad to read your forward-looking, positive updates here!! Hoping you have a good visit with him, and I look forward to hearing more good news in the coming year.

[creekland]

Hope you have/had an enjoyable visit! Your plan sounds great - plus, remember, if you and he do want to pursue a 4 year school this coming fall, there will be a list of schools that still have openings starting in May - you could always check into those then if any seem appealing. Even if you want that route, I still recommend a cc class or two this summer - just to be solid and ready.

 

Regardless of the paths, we'll be wishing y'all the best!

[Kareni]

Best wishes to both you and your son, Jen.

 

Regards,

Kareni

[Dmmetler]

My first thought, as a former college faculty adviser, is that he probably has the background to write a really, good, compelling essay telling about the changes in his life and how he's worked through them and made this a learning experience-which might well make him a MORE interesting candidate than not. I know at least two college students off-hand who were on probation or parole who I had to report grades/progress to, just in recent years, so obviously the school I worked for didn't consider it an absolute bar to admission/attendance. Not to mention that I've gotten more calls than I'd like to admit that started out "Uh...I'm in jail...." from current students! Your son just got his "serious goof up" out of the way earlier than most!

 

I do think that he might be better off being at home in the short term, simply because college can be a really difficult transition in general and he's going to have a doubly tough one. But I do think that he's likely to be able to find a school that is willing to give him a chance.

 

Anyway, congratulations to him-and a celebration to you!

[Just Another Jen]

My first thought, as a former college faculty adviser, is that he probably has the background to write a really, good, compelling essay telling about the changes in his life and how he's worked through them and made this a learning experience-which might well make him a MORE interesting candidate than not. I know at least two college students off-hand who were on probation or parole who I had to report grades/progress to, just in recent years, so obviously the school I worked for didn't consider it an absolute bar to admission/attendance. Not to mention that I've gotten more calls than I'd like to admit that started out "Uh...I'm in jail...." from current students! Your son just got his "serious goof up" out of the way earlier than most!

 

I do think that he might be better off being at home in the short term, simply because college can be a really difficult transition in general and he's going to have a doubly tough one. But I do think that he's likely to be able to find a school that is willing to give him a chance.

 

Anyway, congratulations to him-and a celebration to you!

 

 

 

I agree about the essay- now if only it would pay off in dollars as well as admission. :)

[Just Another Jen]

Our visit went well. It's always entertaining. Um, so I won't rant about the stupidity of his fellow inmates ( one just lost his shot at bootcamp for stealing a pen) or the fact that I watched 7 state employees move one vending machine. One person was specifically there to carry the extension cord... I wonder why the state of Illinois is broke...

I'm not allowed to bring anything in so I memorized info about several area colleges and we talked about them. He is very interested in Colombia College in Chicago. They do not require a ACT score, and have rolling admission policies. That would be a reach school for us financially- but I'm going to investigate it further and see if there is any free money out there. They have a decent Lit program as well as music and art. He can take the train from our house and be at the door in under 30 minutes. If I drove him to community college it would take 20 minutes. I'm going to look at other schools downtown and see if I can find anything that would suit him.

We'll know Friday if he leaves this Monday or next. These guys ahead of him keep messing up and it's only moving him up higher on the list.

[Nan in Mass]

Thank you for the update.

Hugs

Nan

[Barbara H]

 

I'm not allowed to bring anything in so I memorized info about several area colleges and we talked about them. He is very interested in Colombia College in Chicago. They do not require a ACT score, and have rolling admission policies. That would be a reach school for us financially- but I'm going to investigate it further and see if there is any free money out there. They have a decent Lit program as well as music and art. He can take the train from our house and be at the door in under 30 minutes. If I drove him to community college it would take 20 minutes. I'm going to look at other schools downtown and see if I can find anything that would suit him.

 

 

I'm glad to hear he's doing well. (and, may I just say, how crazy that you can't bring in anything - like it would be in some way harmful to bring in papers with college information!)

 

For what it is worth, against my advice I had a student apply to Columbia College in Chicago last year. The financial aid and scholarship package was absolutely ridiculous. It was $30,000 less than what the student received from many other higher ranked colleges. This article may be of some interest: http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2012/07/02/faculty-unhappy-proposed-changes-columbia-college-chicago Columbia College appears to be a school that is really in transition right now.

[creekland]

Glad your guy is doing well! Thanks for the update.

[Just Another Jen]

 

I'm glad to hear he's doing well. (and, may I just say, how crazy that you can't bring in anything - like it would be in some way harmful to bring in papers with college information!)

 

For what it is worth, against my advice I had a student apply to Columbia College in Chicago last year. The financial aid and scholarship package was absolutely ridiculous. It was $30,000 less than what the student received from many other higher ranked colleges. This article may be of some interest: http://www.insidehig...llege-chicago�� Columbia College appears to be a school that is really in transition right now.

 

 

 

Thanks for the link. I think I will keep looking around. I was leary about the pricing there anyway.

 

jen

[readwithem]

Thanks for the update - I'm so glad the visit went well! Glad your sense of humor is intact ;)

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Glad you had a good visit. Hoping he finds a great place for school.

[Harriet Vane]

Glad you had a good visit. May God make his path clear.

[Reya]

Dug this up.....

 

Lit/philosophy is not an employable major. It just isn't. In times past, having a degree in anything was worth something. Today, it isn't. Given that he is at risk, I would go the CC route and would suggest that he find a major that prepares him for a job and do the lit/philosophy stuff for fun, as a minor or a second major. For a main major, I would suggest something like hard business, tech, engineering, or nursing. I also would NOT suggest a pure science.

[Just Another Jen]

Thanks for the suggestions. He may end up going back into the trades if he can't find something he wants to study. The idea for this kid is that he just doesn't want a degree, he's looking at it as just learning about something he loves. If the money doesn't follow he has his construction skills to fall back on. I would like to see him at a school because he is really very smart and I know a degree will help him grow as a person.

[Reya]

In that case, if he likes trade-type work, he could choose a high-paying tech degree and have time for lit/philosophy work on the side. There are 2-year degrees in the petroleum industry that pay $80k first year after 2 years of schooling.

 

Construction skills are well and good, but being an electrician or a master plumber gets way more money and stability and can eventually lead to running a pretty big company. I'd recommend one of those trades over tiling or general carpentry or drywall.

 

There is VERY little that you can learn in college that you can't learn outside of it, if you love something. If he likes the formality of courses, Coursera is an option, and there are similar programs. There are online forums and listservs with this kind of focus, too. I was a philosophy minor, so it's not that I don't love philosophy. :) It's just not worth $60,000 when you can get the same thing elsewhere.

 

At one point, I would have said that colleges tend to make people grow and mature. Being around college students frequently now, I would say this is no longer the case and that it actually tends to infantilize 20-somethings today. I don't see the intellectual or emotional maturity that there was even 10 years ago. The college experience tends to just be an extension of high school in most ways.

 

Yes, DH and I went to college, and yes, both of our kids almost certainly will. But it will be to check the box for a job, not because of expected intellectual growth. Not anymore.

[creekland]

Thanks for the suggestions. He may end up going back into the trades if he can't find something he wants to study. The idea for this kid is that he just doesn't want a degree, he's looking at it as just learning about something he loves. If the money doesn't follow he has his construction skills to fall back on. I would like to see him at a school because he is really very smart and I know a degree will help him grow as a person.

 

Just so you know... many of us agree with you that college (for the right person) is a path that is good for both the education and growing as a person. I'll vote for letting him do what he loves and keeping other skills on the side or for a backup. ;) While some majors aren't as financially rewarding as others, many of us feel that financial success isn't the only type out there. Plus, when you see things like 10% unemployment rate with X major, it does tend to mean 90% of those looking for employment are employed, perhaps using their degree, perhaps not, but nonetheless, getting a paycheck.

 

It may be just the circle I'm in, but IRL I don't know of anyone who regrets getting their degree as long as they went to a school that was a good fit for them.

 

In high school, when alumni return to share their stories, MANY have grown as people - far more growth than those who enter jobs right from high school. Don't get me wrong, those who enter jobs tend to get "life" down pat (paying bills, getting up for work, perhaps a family, etc), but many lose that "love of learning" and seem to quit being curious about things outside their "life circle." Many who go to college - esp going away to college (vs commuting) come back with enthusiasm for life including things they may not have thought of before (study abroad, new fields or hobbies, books, etc). It's far more fun to talk with them.

 

I hope you find the right fit for your guy!

[Dmmetler]

I would also add-I suspect your son could benefit from that sheltered transition to adulthood that college provides-basically, a chance to do adolescence again and hopefully avoid the difficulties he had the first time. I suspect he's seen far too much of the "real world" and needs the sheltered chance to grow as a person while not necessarily having to be a grown up.

 

I do agree with looking at the cost/benefit of getting a degree-but I think, in his case, he needs more than "Study a trade and do philosophy on the side". It's not the degree that's beneficial so much as the road taken to get there.

[elegantlion]

Thanks for the suggestions. He may end up going back into the trades if he can't find something he wants to study. The idea for this kid is that he just doesn't want a degree, he's looking at it as just learning about something he loves. If the money doesn't follow he has his construction skills to fall back on. I would like to see him at a school because he is really very smart and I know a degree will help him grow as a person.

 

 

I probably post this too much and sound like a broken record. My dh is a gifted construction worker, took some college, but the allure of good money kept him in construction. He in his 50s now and it's just harder. He regrets not going back and finishing his degree when we got married (he was 30s then). It's not difficult when you're 20 and fit. When your 50 and dealing with some chronic health issues, it's a pain. He's tried switching industries and without a degree (any type of degree), he's been unable to find anything. Returning to school now is not an option.

 

So from a "this is our experience" post, dh would have finished school in his 20s and probably still ended up in construction, just either in architecture or commercial management. It's not just about the money, it's the long-term thinking.

 

I admire how open you've been about all of this, I'm sure this has been so difficult. He is blessed to have you as a mother.

[Just Another Jen]

 

I probably post this too much and sound like a broken record. My dh is a gifted construction worker, took some college, but the allure of good money kept him in construction. He in his 50s now and it's just harder. He regrets not going back and finishing his degree when we got married (he was 30s then). It's not difficult when you're 20 and fit. When your 50 and dealing with some chronic health issues, it's a pain. He's tried switching industries and without a degree (any type of degree), he's been unable to find anything. Returning to school now is not an option.

 

So from a "this is our experience" post, dh would have finished school in his 20s and probably still ended up in construction, just either in architecture or commercial management. It's not just about the money, it's the long-term thinking.

 

I admire how open you've been about all of this, I'm sure this has been so difficult. He is blessed to have you as a mother.

 

 

I know. My father in law is a talented craftsman. He built cabinets for years and never made any money. My dh side of the family is full of talented guys who didnt go to college and now have worn out bodies and nothing to fall back on. It has really just dawned on me that I am just a bystander. I can see that spending time on required classes will pay off in a diploma that may help him down the line. I don't think he is seeing it the same way. He has 4 months left and then he will be on house arrest for awhile. We will have plenty of time to talk then. I did get my first letter from bootcamp and he said that he is happy to be paying the price for his stupidity. He has definitely matured. Before he left this was a kid who was never wrong and apologized only under duress. So- he'll figure it out.

 

Thanks again for all the support, my irl friends don't really seem to get it like most of you....

 

jen