Dinnertime aggravation

[Imprimis]

I don't think the whole discussion is about finishing what's on your plate, it's about trying what's on your plate.

 

While I will encourage my kids to try the food I prepare, I will not make someone try something they don't want to try. For instance, my son finds the smell of many cheeses unpleasant. Parmesan is one of them. The rest of us love cheese. So, when I make a pasta dish with cheese, it's quite easy for me to reserve some of the pasta for him to eat with just butter.

 

There were foods I didn't like (and would not eat) as a child that I simply love now. No one made me try them; I simply developed a taste for them over time.

[Jenny in Florida]

I'm actually not sure why I am more comfortable "forcing" my kids to practice violin (and arguably making them resent it) but not forcing them to eat curry. But if someone else forces her child, through not violent means, to eat curry, I think that's a parental choice.

 

I don't "force," but I do admit to something approaching coercion to get my kids to do things I truly believe they should do.

 

So, I can say things like, "I don't drive children to their very favorite, extremely expensive extracurricular activities if said children have not completed what I consider an appropriate quantity or quality of school work."

 

I actually can't quite feature how it would be possible to force someone to practice an instrument?

 

But, for me, the difference between coercing my child to complete a math problem or clean a room and employing similar tactics with regard to eating is that food is essential to my child's health. If my kid ends up resenting the piano and never plays again, well, that's a loss, but it's a survivable one. But if my attempts at coercing a child to eat broccoli turn out a child who refuses all vegetables for the rest of his or her life, I've compromised that child's health. And I've helped to create negative associations with food in general, which will affect him or her every day, three times a day, for the rest of his or her life.

 

I guess I also don't understand--and I wonder every time one of these threads begins--why it is that so many folks seem to consider it such a sin to be "picky" and such a virtue to eat what is served? There seems to be a whole morality thing at play here that I just don't get.

 

Yes, I want my children to eat well enough to be healthy. Yes, I want them to avoid having food habits or quirks that interfere with their lives. But, aside from that, I fail to see why this is all so very important?

[Lovedtodeath]

:iagree:Nice post.

 

Keep only healthy foods in the house. Then if he eats eggs or a cantaloupe instead of dinner, it is no big deal.

[*lifeoftheparty*]

:iagree: Even if the idea of my children being called spoils makes my hackles go up a little. All the same, when we were kids we were poor. Meaning, ketchup sandwiches were a luxery, it meant we had bread. I remember eating this bird seed looking stuff with freeze dried beef pellets for weeks. That was all we had. No one wanted to eat it. It was disgusting, but hey, we were hungry and it was something. While my kids may start moaning about starvation about bed time, they have no idea what they're talking about and WILL survive till morning.

 

Heck, by international standards, even when we were poor we were rich. We had food.

 

:iagree: Exactly.

 

Oh, HA, my kid is pretty spoiled! I mean, most kids in the US are, aren't they? He has NO idea how other kids have to live, in other parts of the country OR the world. However, what I was trying to say, is that it is our job to help them NOT to be so spoiled and be grateful for all that they have. With things going the way they are, there may come a time in their lives where food is just REALLY expensive and they HAVE to eat what's in front of them, or they really WILL starve.

 

For some reason, people think that it won't. They seem to think that food will always be this cheap and plentiful. How quickly they forget their history! The Great Depression was only 80 years ago; and if history has shown us ANYTHING, anything at all, it's that all great empires fall. "Things Fall Apart" To think that things will always be this way is ludicrous and the spoiled ones, the ones who are used to getting everything their way, will be the ones who fall the hardest. I have no intentions of setting my child up for failure.... I always try to get DS to see things from a bigger perspective.

 

Sorry to get so Apocalyptic, it is midnight after all ;)

[Sputterduck]

I, personally, would set dinner in front of him and if he didn't eat it that would be his choice. There would be nothing said one way or another about it. No battle, no nothing. That's how it's always been here since my son was able to eat after surgery at 15 months. And he had a bad case of oral defensiveness.

 

It's your job to provide healthy food, and it's his job to eat it. It's not your job to make him eat it, even two bites.

[lionfamily1999]

:iagree: Exactly.

 

Oh, HA, my kid is pretty spoiled! I mean, most kids in the US are, aren't they? He has NO idea how other kids have to live, in other parts of the country OR the world. However, what I was trying to say, is that it is our job to help them NOT to be so spoiled and be grateful for all that they have. With things going the way they are, there may come a time in their lives where food is just REALLY expensive and they HAVE to eat what's in front of them, or they really WILL starve.

 

For some reason, people think that it won't. They seem to think that food will always be this cheap and plentiful. How quickly they forget their history! The Great Depression was only 80 years ago; and if history has shown us ANYTHING, anything at all, it's that all great empires fall. "Things Fall Apart" To think that things will always be this way is ludicrous and the spoiled ones, the ones who are used to getting everything their way, will be the ones who fall the hardest. I have no intentions of setting my child up for failure.... I always try to get DS to see things from a bigger perspective.

 

Sorry to get so Apocalyptic, it is midnight after all ;)

Continuing to agree (and running back to fix my spelling mistake, I'll blame midnight for that).

 

I do wonder how it would be handled for a child that has never experienced food they did not want to eat should potatoes be all there is. My gramma used to tell us stories about eating corn starch (yes, starch, not meal). She told me about how the last bits of rice she got were full of maggots and they stopped pulling them out, because once the maggots were gone the bowls were practically empty. She told me about friends that had eaten someone's dog and how her mother decided it was better to starve than to eat "man's best friend." That's how I was cajoled to eat as a child, with stories of my gramma and her mother starving (literally). Sure, it was guilt food, but it was appreciated. Oma's (my gramma's mother) standards could have resulted in their death, what if the dog was the last thing left to eat?

 

I'm rambling now, I mean, where do standards end? :lol: it is definitely midnight and I meant to be asleep hours ago.

[Jenny in Florida]

It's your job to provide healthy food, and it's his job to eat it. It's not your job to make him eat it, even two bites.

 

Agreed. The one thing I would say is that I would not make it easy to fill up on other things.

 

The way it goes here is that, if the kid in question doesn't like what I'm serving, I will accomodate to the extent of keeping separate "components" of the meal I'm already making. So, if I'm making bean burritos, I have no problem setting aside a plate with some rice, corn niblets, tortilla and salsa. I'll also tip a serving of applesauce into a bowl and plunk a glass of soymilk on the table. Dinner served. The child who eats that has eaten dinner and is now eligible for dessert or a snack later in the evening.

 

If that's not going to work, the child has the option of eating left-overs from another meal he prefers, if there happens to be something in the fridge. My son will eat pasta with tomato sauce every day. So, if I'm serving cold peanut-sesame noodles for myself and my husband, the kid is welcome to warm up a plate of spaghetti, as long as he does so without getting in my way while I'm cooking and he gets his plate to the table to eat with us.

 

The child who declines either of those options (or is rude about them) gets to wait until breakfast the next morning.

 

That's how it works here. My kids are picky. I am not running a restaurant. They are not allowed to be rude. I treat them with respect and expect them to do the same for me. They are healthy, and they each expand their food repetoires at least a little bit each year. Life goes on.

[Mom2boys]

I was a picky eater as a kid. Then I went to live in Brazil for a year as an exchange student. I was served a bunch of food I didn't like every day. After a couple of weeks, I had lost ten pounds, and I was REALLY hungry. Suddenly rice and beans didn't seem that bad after all. I started eating them every day, and more than 20 years later, I still like rice and beans. Chipotle is my favorite restaurant. :D

 

My oldest son has texture issues with food. At first I thought he was just picky, and if I stood firm, he would come around. We had some major battles over potatoes when he was younger. Then I realized he had been this way from infancy (he would never eat rice cereal, no matter what) and that his issues were really legitimate, and not a matter of him just choosing not to like something. And I realized it didn't matter if he ate potatoes and rice or not, as long as he was eating healthy, well-balanced meals. Of course, if he ever goes to Brazil, he is going to be mighty hungry.:D

 

So, all that is to say, you should figure out if your child is just being picky, or if, as others have suggested, there is an underlying issue.

[LibraryLover]

I wouldn't argue about food with a child. I cook what I cook, making sure there are foods I know a picky child will tolerate (we're past that stage at this point, but all of mine went through times in early childhood where they were sensitive to new foods).

 

I'd suggest he might enjoy something, but I wouldn't like to turn dinner into a battle. Everyone in the family loses when that happens. I also don't buy foods that I don't want to see my family eat. Fruit and yogurt is always available, and cereal. There's nothing really unhealthy to choose from, so it's not that a picky child would be eating a bowl of ice cream if the main meal didn't appeal. It doesn't bother me if a child would chose to eat a banana with peanut butter instead of whatever it is I made.

 

If I had a child who was 9 and still upset at dinner, I would have them help me shop (with guidelines), and plan & prepare meals. Having a voice helps some children.

Edited April 12, 2011 by LibraryLover

[FriedClams]

I would separate the two issues.

 

Whatever you decide to do about the food (it's an issue that polarizes people regularly here!) - snack/no snack, one bite, a whole plate, an alternate food - lay down the rule that works for your family and stick to it.

 

But the minute the rude behavior begins at the table, send him away and don't let him return to the table that meal. Zero-Tolerance. I imagine that if you eliminate the drama associated with the meals, his selective eating will be less of a problem.

 

:iagree:

[melissel]

:iagree: Exactly.

 

Oh, HA, my kid is pretty spoiled! I mean, most kids in the US are, aren't they? He has NO idea how other kids have to live, in other parts of the country OR the world. However, what I was trying to say, is that it is our job to help them NOT to be so spoiled and be grateful for all that they have. With things going the way they are, there may come a time in their lives where food is just REALLY expensive and they HAVE to eat what's in front of them, or they really WILL starve.

 

For some reason, people think that it won't. They seem to think that food will always be this cheap and plentiful. How quickly they forget their history! The Great Depression was only 80 years ago; and if history has shown us ANYTHING, anything at all, it's that all great empires fall. "Things Fall Apart" To think that things will always be this way is ludicrous and the spoiled ones, the ones who are used to getting everything their way, will be the ones who fall the hardest. I have no intentions of setting my child up for failure.... I always try to get DS to see things from a bigger perspective.

 

Sorry to get so Apocalyptic, it is midnight after all ;)

 

So do those of you who think picky kids are a "first-world problem" also make your kids go barefoot in the streets and walk miles to get places every day, just to make a point? Do you only plan to school them for a few years until they have to go into the workforce to support your family? Do you only feed them maggoty rice to prepare them for the apocalypse so they know what to expect? Do you make sure their drinking water is unclean and do the laundry in the river? Do you sew all your family's clothes?

 

I don't understand this thinking. We don't live in a third-world country (OK, maybe a few of us do, but just a few). It's not the Great Depression (yet!). Your kids know you have a kitchen full of alternate food that you are simply withholding on principle, because someone somewhere once lived or is currently living a hard life. It seems so arbitrary an enforcement. Yes, if a depression occurs, things will be hard. Like Mom2boys pointed out, if that ever happens, they'll learn to eat what's handed to them, and they'll learn fast. In the meantime, this line of thinking makes no sense to me.

Edited April 12, 2011 by melissel
Missed a word!

[Melissa in Australia]

I don't understand this thinking. We don't live in a third-world country (OK, maybe a few of us do, but just a few). It's not the Great Depression (yet!). Your kids know you have a kitchen full of alternate food that you are simply withholding on principle, because someone somewhere once lived or is currently living a hard life. It seems so arbitrary an enforcement. Yes, if a depression occurs, things will be hard. Like Mom2boys pointed out, if that ever happens, they'll learn to eat what's handed to them, and they'll learn fast. In the meantime, this line of thinking makes no sense to me.

:D Never made sense to me when I was a kid either, I remember offering to send my disliked food to Ethiopia for the starving millions and go without . My mother wasn't amused.

[Joanne]

So do those of you think picky kids are a "first-world problem" also make your kids go barefoot in the streets and walk miles to get places every day, just to make a point? Do you only plan to school them for a few years until they have to go into the workforce to support your family? Do you only feed them maggoty rice to prepare them for the apocalypse so they know what to expect? Do you make sure their drinking water is unclean and do the laundry in the river? Do you sew all your family's clothes?

 

I don't understand this thinking. We don't live in a third-world country (OK, maybe a few of us do, but just a few). It's not the Great Depression (yet!). Your kids know you have a kitchen full of alternate food that you are simply withholding on principle, because someone somewhere once lived or is currently living a hard life. It seems so arbitrary an enforcement. Yes, if a depression occurs, things will be hard. Like Mom2boys pointed out, if that ever happens, they'll learn to eat what's handed to them, and they'll learn fast. In the meantime, this line of thinking makes no sense to me.

 

For some of us, the stocked kitchen is stocked of food planned for the week, or month. I cooked *dinner* for 5. The yogurt you want to eat is planned (budgeted down to the penny) for breakfast.

 

It's not a choice of all the food available in the home. It's respect for family resources, which includes the reality for some food budgets that the cereal that is still in the box is accounted for later in the week. If you eat it now, and do not eat the food I paid for and already prepared, it IS an issue, right here in the bounty of the USA.

[melissel]

For some of us, the stocked kitchen is stocked of food planned for the week, or month. I cooked *dinner* for 5. The yogurt you want to eat is planned (budgeted down to the penny) for breakfast.

 

It's not a choice of all the food available in the home. It's respect for family resources, which includes the reality for some food budgets that the cereal that is still in the box is accounted for later in the week. If you eat it now, and do not eat the food I paid for and already prepared, it IS an issue, right here in the bounty of the USA.

 

I get that, and that's not really what I was referring to. If every scrap of food in the house is budgeted for and already planned for use in something else, that's a different issue. I have no problem with telling the child, "Look, here's the deal. There's nothing else I can give you because if I do, someone goes hungry later in the week." I'm speaking more to the "You'll eat what I serve and like it because children in Africa are starving and someday you might be too" mindset. I don't see battling over food just to make that point.

[Joanne]

I get that, and that's not really what I was referring to. If every scrap of food in the house is budgeted for and already planned for use in something else, that's a different issue. I have no problem with telling the child, "Look, here's the deal. There's nothing else I can give you because if I do, someone goes hungry later in the week." I'm speaking more to the "You'll eat what I serve and like it because children in Africa are starving and someday you might be too" mindset. I don't see battling over food just to make that point.

 

I can agree with that. :)

[LibraryLover]

I've known Indian and Asian mothers and grandmothers who do cater to kids. :001_smile: It's not just a western thang.

 

It's also true that starving children do not have the luxury to be picky. :(

Edited April 12, 2011 by LibraryLover

[melissel]

:D Never made sense to me when I was a kid either, I remember offering to send my disliked food to Ethiopia for the starving millions and go without . My mother wasn't amused.

 

:lol: I'm sure! Smart alecks are definitely more annoying than picky eaters! (And by the way, :grouphug:. Your story is heartbreaking, and I'm glad your mom recognized what they'd done.)

[melissel]

I can agree with that. :)

 

:thumbup1:

[LibraryLover]

I get that, too. If the child eats his yogurt, he eats his yogurt. There's no more. I assume people explain this to their children, and shop accordingly as best they can. If a child is stealing his brother's yogurt because he can't/won't eat planned meals, it does need to be addressed. For me, good full fat yogurt is a food that can really fill and satisfy, so a little does go a long way here. It would be difficult if I could not afford it, as it is currently such a staple that works as a good snack or fill-in meal.

 

I also have a problem with people being rude to the folks who worked to prepare a meal. That's a different issue, and I am not indulgent there. You might not want to eat something, but you shouldn't be rude about it. I've told my kids that "No thank you' covers it. Sometimes rude behavior does happen at mealtimes. Often, kids (and adults too) are so hungry/tired/over-stimulated at the end of a day that they can't think straight. This brings out the beast in most people. A little cheese or other small protein as an 'appetizer' can often keep the grumpies under control during meal prep.

 

I get that, and that's not really what I was referring to. If every scrap of food in the house is budgeted for and already planned for use in something else, that's a different issue. I have no problem with telling the child, "Look, here's the deal. There's nothing else I can give you because if I do, someone goes hungry later in the week." I'm speaking more to the "You'll eat what I serve and like it because children in Africa are starving and someday you might be too" mindset. I don't see battling over food just to make that point.

Edited April 12, 2011 by LibraryLover

[Peela]

I dont think there is any one right answer to this issue.

 

But I do know that while I am good at eating a wide range of foods and always have been, there are some foods I really, really detest, and if you made me eat them (and i wasn't starving) I would probably really, really resent you. ANd i am an adult with full reasoning function and an adventurous palette. I have given my kids the same rights I take for myself.

I was a good eater as a child but my brother ate : potatoes, meat, bread, cereal, tomato soup, and sugar (eg icecream). Nothing green, his whole childhood. Nothing remotely looking like a balanced diet.

He actually grew up healthy and got sick more rarely than I did. As an adult he has gradually added in more variety.

 

Its not a life an death issue most of the time- and I agree with the pp who says, it's not our responsibility to make a child eat a balanced diet- only to prepare one and offer it (to some extent). I think the extent to which we are willing to cater to taste and allow alternatives (from a separate meal to cereal) is really personal and not worth splitting hairs over. We all have different tolerances for such things.

[kalanamak]

I grew up in a family of happy eaters, but I couldn't take boiled cabbage or boiled turnip (love them now, but they were "strong tasting"). My throat just closed up, and I fought back the secret tears. After I read Life With Father, I used Clarence Day's trick of sliding the food onto my lap when no one was looking, but got caught. After that I would masticate the dread stuff until it was a bolus behind my molars. I would finish my meal, skip dessert, and run out and spit it out under the forsythia bush.

 

When I see that misery in kiddo, I do not make him eat something. Since I have learned if he is pushed to eat something, he often has diarrhea or a red anus from it (e.g. tomato), I am happy not to push him. He eats A LOT, and loves all kinds of veggies, eats my WW bread and pasta, scarfs up tofu, and will leave candy unfinished, so I am happy to serve things he likes. It gets a little boring, but since I tend to cook ahead on the weekend, and leave containers of grains and WW elbows, sauces, and stews, stirfry and prepped salad, I can pull out and warm up what he asks for. Just as easy as pulling out something he doesn't ask for and warm it up. :) I even make a section for him in the fridge, without heavy spiced food, so hubby can pull out the right things to warm up when I'm not there. I'm sure I'd go nuts if I had several children like this, but after a couple bouts of those flaming red anuses or terrible gas (oh my goodness, limas blow him up like the Michelin Man), I err on the side of trusting his palate. His palate is slowly expanding on its own.

 

But, he doesn't whine. He gets the giggles and says "no, no, not that".

 

I'm sure there is worse, but the idea of trotting out food over and over until it rots seems barbaric and unhygienic.

[EthiopianFood]

Give him a pb & j. He did what you asked him to do - take a couple of bites.

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

[Sputterduck]

I once saw a tribe documentary where some men of the village were going down to the river to fetch the logs they kept tied floating in the water there. In the logs grow these giant (giant!) white worms. I'm talking like 12 inches long. Anywho, the children of the village ran down the hill after them screaming in delight. Little ones, at the age that our culture tends to have the most food issues with, proceeded to grab ahold of and slurp down raw and alive these giant slimy white worms with gleeful faces. The narrator noted that this was the children's favorite treat. That's when I decided that food issues have got to be cultural.:001_huh:;)

[Sputterduck]

And here? Kids eat tripe and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moronga. Not to mention the cow stomach. Mmmmm. It's quite popular here. And goat meat birria. There is a birria place on every corner. It's like Starbucks here.

 

My Korean exh? He loved raw beef as a kid. And jellyfish.

 

And my x-bil? Raw liver strips in hot sauce. Yum.

Edited April 12, 2011 by Sputterduck

[LibraryLover]

Most kids like what is familiar. If it's worms, it's worms. If it's tripe, it's tripe. Or deep fried chicks...each place has it's own particular foods. What is familiar is cultural. :001_smile: I have a kid who can't get enough sashimi. He's loved it since he was little, so it was a familiar food to him. Of course, I have to hold back thoughts on bacteria. ;) But he's never had an issue.

 

I'm thinking it would be interesting to know if some little kids go on tripe or worm jags. I'm thinking it's quite possible.

Edited April 12, 2011 by LibraryLover

[kalanamak]

Most kids like what is familiar. If worms, it's worms.

 

Could also be they were protein starved, and were desperate for it.

[Sputterduck]

Most kids like what is familiar. If worms, it's worms. If it's tripe, it's tripe. What is familiar is cultural. :001_smile: I have a kid who can't get enough sashimi. He's loved it since he was little, so it was a familiar food to him. Of course, I have to hold back thoughts on bacteria. ;) He's never had an issue.

 

Well, at least he's not eating raw beef from the grocery store. Exh's mom used to serve that a lot. I love Korean food, I promise, but I can't get past that one.

 

My son ate a whole plate of Basque pickled beef tongue. I had some. It was good. But a whole plate? My stomach turned.

[LibraryLover]

Could also be they were protein starved, and were desperate for it.

 

Could be.

 

My MIL cooked tripe at times. I love to eat, but i could honestly never eat that. I'd eat all around it. I did try it, but it was a terrible experience. My MIL was a wonderful cook...but that stands out in memory. If I could gag at it, I have great pity on children who are presented with difficult foods.

[LibraryLover]

I've known Western Price people who swear by raw beef. I can't do it myself.

 

I adore most Korean food, but put the beef in a hot pot, please.

 

Well, at least he's not eating raw beef from the grocery store. Exh's mom used to serve that a lot. I love Korean food, I promise, but I can't get past that one.

 

My son ate a whole plate of Basque pickled beef tongue. I had some. It was good. But a whole plate? My stomach turned.

[Sputterduck]

Could be.

 

My MIL cooked tripe at times. I love to eat, but i could honestly never eat that. I'd eat all around it. I did try it, but it was a terrible experience. My MIL was a wonderful cook...but that stands out in memory. If I could gag at it, I have great pity on children who are presented with difficult foods.

 

But, see, you were right up above when you said kids like what is familiar. If you'd been fed that when you were too young to know better, you might like it. :lol:

 

We have a little 11 month old whose aunts and mother are always slipping him things like chamoy. Poor unsuspecting fella is going to grow up thinking chilies and salt on fruit is normal. Well, it is, around here. But if you try to feed his aunt apple pie? She'll gag. She thinks it's strange food. I'm trying to get her to like it. And she's trying to convince me that menudo isn't a bad idea.

[Sherry in OH]

No, he is an intense child though and very bright. . Admittedly, I'm the same way with my meals. If food touches another food then I don't eat that part- i also eat one thing at a time. He couldve learned that from me.

 

I give him a small portion of the food I make. Then if he wants more he may have more. The biggest issue is his dramatics. Huffing, puffing, flopping around like a dying fish. I don't know why he can't just communicate. We role play situations- I make him TrY AGain till It is acceptable with him using clear politely spoken words

 

I really don't want food to be an issue.

 

My children are allowed to say "no thank you" to foods they do not care to eat. They are not allowed to whine or complain about the food. I give one warning and then the child is excused. My children know that they must eat what is offered or go hungry.

 

One of my children regularly opts to excuse himself from the dinner table. He does not ask for a snack, he knows that his next meal will be breakfast.

 

If food touching is such an issue for you and your son, have you considered divided plates or small bowls instead of dinner plates? That way the food never touches.

[SEP]

Kids will not starve themselves to death. You eat what I make or nothing at all. No picky eaters here.

 

ETA: I also do not agree with whining = more spoonfuls of food. I am very careful not to put a lot of food on DS's plate. I never make him clear his plate; that's how you get kids to stop listening to their body's full indicator and overeat = obesity/food issues. I put very small servings on his plate to begin with and he'll ask for more if he's still hungry.

 

 

I also do small servings b/c i eat small amounts and i hated being forced to eat too much as a child. however, my children are not allowed to snack between meals unless it's an apple. so they don't just eat a tiny dinner and expect dessert. we only eat dessert on the weekends.

[Tarreymere]

We live more like that third world family and we live in the USA. DH and I decided that it is more important to us for him to work in a profession that he finds challenging and rewarding than for him to focus on a more lucrative profession. I have chosen to be at home with my family instead of working. Our lifestyle reflects those choices.

 

So, we are also a family that has to carefully manage our food budget and I do not buy food that is not planned for. I can't. I am also not about to prepare a full meal for my family and then jump up from the table to fix something else for the picky child, even if we did have the resources for that. That is about respect for me as the cook, especially since everything I make is homemade (which is quite time consuming) including the bread, the pasta, the sauces, ect, and I don't have expensive packaged stuff around to hand out or microwave up quickly.

 

Like I said, no one in my family has starved to death and if someone chooses to forgo a particular food that person knows there is nothing else until the next meal. I don't have a stocked frig and freezer, I have a cupboard full of tvp and rice and beans and flour. Good luck nibbling on dried black beans as an alternative to a meal! Fresh fruit and fresh veggies are a treat and if they are store-bought they are expensive so no, they don't get handed out freely either.

 

Our mealtime 'policies' are not meant to be mean or to prepare for some coming apocalypse, they reflect our reality which is that no one HAS to be hungry unless that person chooses to be. I don't think being hungry now and then is such a terrible thing, either.

[Shannon in TN]

Have you read "Parenting with Love and Logic"? It was something I read a long time ago (at least 5 years ago) but some things stuck with me and dinnertime battles was one of them. I haven't read through all the pages of this thread but from the first page, it seems most follow the concepts presented in the book.

 

"This is what's for dinner. You can eat it or go hungry but there will be nothing else offered for dinner nor any bedtime snacks. If you choose to make yourself a PB&J, there will be a deduction in your allowance because money has already been budgeted and spent on dinner and that PB&J you're fixing tonight is taking away someone else's lunch tomorrow. And if you don't finish your dinner tonight, it'll be saved and you can have it for lunch/dinner tomorrow night."

 

Sorry if this is a repeated idea from previous posts :)

[EKS]

I just don't give snacks (or options for dinner). Being hungry is a consequence of not eating. Assuming this is a behavior issue and not a sensory one (which is a whole different thing) and that there are no medical concerns, I'd just let him be hungry.

 

ETA: I do try to provide at least one choice that everyone will like. For example, a child may not like the main dish but will like the rice that goes with it.

Edited April 12, 2011 by EKS

[Lovedtodeath]

As a child, my Dad was forced stay at the table to eat all of his vegetables. For hours. He is now emotionally allergic (its a natural medicine thing) to a great deal of them and will painstakingly pick bits of spinach out of my lasagna. I thought he would eat them if they were prepared correctly or hidden... no.

 

About the food budget: I tried budgeting my groceries down to the penny and I finally decided that I am happy with my kids eating tons of fruits and veggies. I don't buy junk food. If they are eating it then it isn't wasted. I actually have the money for this, of course, we just have less for books or our next car or the retirement fund.

Edited April 12, 2011 by Lovedtodeath

[Eleni]

WOw...usually I only get a maximum of 4 responses here..this is a bit overwhelming!

 

DH and I talked about it last night and how his "thing" with dinnertime has been worsening. Dh is rarely home at dinner so he hears it all secondhand from me.

 

A few things stuck out while reading these responses. Someone mentioned it being a control issue. Our home is pretty relaxed and happy, the ONE thing that has changed is he is in school this year. I know somedays he has a hard time in school and the other kids' behaviour bothers him, these seem to be the days he has the biggest upset about dinner, so there could be a connection there.

 

I am going to have him start leaving the table and come back when he can behave properly.

I have trimmed afterschool snacks down to one thing for the past few weeks...before he would come home and eat a bunch.

 

We always only have healthy foods in the house- fruits, veggies, yogurt, homemade bread. Even junk foods like brownies I make from scratch using our free range chicken eggs, ww flour and limit the sugar.

 

Dinner last night was ww rigatoni baked with sauce, ricotta and spinach. He LOVES spinach, but complained that there was spinach in the pasta and was very upset by this. After he got over his attitude and ate some he said it was good. :glare:

 

In hindsight I realize my original post was written in the heat of emotion after dealing with his outburst. The issue REALLY isn't about food...it is his attitude about it. I don't mind if he hates it and wants something else, just PLEASE ask nicely.

 

I take the kids to feed the homeless once a month and we missed the past two due to illness, we are going in a couple weeks, and that always brings about an attitude adjustment for him. He listened last time how all one man ate all day was a small piece of chicken, other men had no food, one guy caught his taco bell taco on fire in the microwave and had tears in his eyes that he couldn't eat the whole thing because the middle was scorched. It really impressed on him how much he really does have, and he said as much.

 

My other kids are grateful at dinner, and polite, and thank me for making the meal. It is just this one who feels the need to have an over the top ridiculous reaction to whatever I cook...even if he was happy and smiley and we were having a good time minutes before. I am also going to institute cooking lessons and have him help me make dinner so he can appreciate the work that goes into it. I did do that a few times last year and he said that cooking is fun but takes a lot of work.

[Princess Peach]

The issue REALLY isn't about food...it is his attitude about it. I don't mind if he hates it and wants something else, just PLEASE ask nicely.

 

Bingo!

 

I think limiting snacks before dinner is a great idea. I also would not offer an alternative (like pb&j). But that is only my opinion. I just think it gives him too easy of an "out". This is because I agree with you that this is a behavior issue. Again, JMHO!

[Sputterduck]

Have you read "Parenting with Love and Logic"? It was something I read a long time ago (at least 5 years ago) but some things stuck with me and dinnertime battles was one of them. I haven't read through all the pages of this thread but from the first page, it seems most follow the concepts presented in the book.

 

"This is what's for dinner. You can eat it or go hungry but there will be nothing else offered for dinner nor any bedtime snacks. If you choose to make yourself a PB&J, there will be a deduction in your allowance because money has already been budgeted and spent on dinner and that PB&J you're fixing tonight is taking away someone else's lunch tomorrow. And if you don't finish your dinner tonight, it'll be saved and you can have it for lunch/dinner tomorrow night."

 

Sorry if this is a repeated idea from previous posts :)

 

Why punish a child for not finishing? I strongly believe that it increases a child's risk for obesity. Making a child eat past the point that their body tells them to stop teaches them to ignore their own satiety signals. Eating beyond satiety is a really bad thing to teach someone.

[*lifeoftheparty*]

So do those of you who think picky kids are a "first-world problem" also make your kids go barefoot in the streets and walk miles to get places every day, just to make a point? Do you only plan to school them for a few years until they have to go into the workforce to support your family? Do you only feed them maggoty rice to prepare them for the apocalypse so they know what to expect? Do you make sure their drinking water is unclean and do the laundry in the river? Do you sew all your family's clothes?

 

I don't understand this thinking. We don't live in a third-world country (OK, maybe a few of us do, but just a few). It's not the Great Depression (yet!). Your kids know you have a kitchen full of alternate food that you are simply withholding on principle, because someone somewhere once lived or is currently living a hard life. It seems so arbitrary an enforcement. Yes, if a depression occurs, things will be hard. Like Mom2boys pointed out, if that ever happens, they'll learn to eat what's handed to them, and they'll learn fast. In the meantime, this line of thinking makes no sense to me.

 

No, I don't make him walk barefoot... although I think he would like that ;) But, when we go to Disney World past the age of 3, I didn't get him a stroller.... I made his butt walk the whole way.... b/c if kids in China can walk 4+ miles to school, one way, he can certainly walk a few miles through a theme park. When we go to DC, he doesn't get carried, he doesn't get a stroller and we don't cut our day short b/c sweet pea's feet hurt and he doesn't feel like walking anymore so he throws a hissy fit until we leave, yeah sorry, Homey don't play dat! And b/c we never catered to him that way, we have no problems in those areas. Our kid doesn't whine b/c we make him walk all day and he doesn't give us problems at the dinner table. (Unlike the many children I know who ARE catered to and DO have problems in those areas.)

 

Now, that is not to say that my child is perfect, b/c he is not. We, as parents, have fallen short in other areas. We give him too much stuff and don't make him do enough. We are working on that :)

 

It's not the conditions of the third world I am trying to recreate. I am trying to show my child to look at the world with a bigger perspective than a typical American. I feel that people in the US are just way too, what IS that word?? Not ethnocentric... but, only focused on our own little corner of the world, and vaguely aware that other people exist; though we have no idea about the conditions of their existence.... whatever that word is :)

 

This is a hot topic with me. We are "well-to-do" and live in an area where there are lots of wealthy people. I continually notice spoiled rotten kids and have seen my own child start becoming this way. I have no intention of raising a spoiled kid, so I'm working really hard to change that. I do NOT, under any circumstances, let him get away with stuff like that. I REALLY REALLY REALLY want to raise a servant-minded, charitable, caring, loving individual who will leave this world better than he found it. This whole "picky eater" thing is just one of the biggest pet peeves I have, I notice it. I also watch these kids grow up and notice that when a parent starts catering to kids preferences, it only gets worse. It sets a precedent. I can get mom to cater to my every whim just by being difficult.

 

It also can lead to bad eating habits and bad health. I try to explain to DS how every thing we eat affects our health, I show him how the things on his plate will help his body and what will harm his body. I show him that there is a reason we are eating all these different foods, and a reason WHY I keep making him try them. He may not completely understand, but at least he sees I'm not just doing it to be mean.

 

It's all about balance. I don't want to force my child to live in poverty when he doesn't have to, but I don't want him to be spoiled either. I think making separate meals for a child who is "picky" is just catering to a spoiled child, and you don't have to agree, and that's fine, I was just giving my advice based on my knowledge and experience.

[*lifeoftheparty*]

Most kids like what is familiar. If it's worms, it's worms. If it's tripe, it's tripe. Or deep fried chicks...each place has it's own particular foods. What is familiar is cultural. :001_smile: I have a kid who can't get enough sashimi. He's loved it since he was little, so it was a familiar food to him. Of course, I have to hold back thoughts on bacteria. ;) But he's never had an issue.

 

I'm thinking it would be interesting to know if some little kids go on tripe or worm jags. I'm thinking it's quite possible.

 

And this is kind of what I'm saying. If you prepare and serve a wide variety of foods for your kids and have them eat it, from an early age (instead of just making chicken nuggets for them and "adult" food for everyone else) then it will become familiar and you shouldn't have dinner time issues. There will always be things that your kid might not like after a trying it many times, and that's OK. But if every night, there is a battle, and making of extra food, that is catering/spoiling and will create bigger issues if it isn't nipped in the bud.

[Jenny in Florida]

I think making separate meals for a child who is "picky" is just catering to a spoiled child, and you don't have to agree, and that's fine, I was just giving my advice based on my knowledge and experience.

 

As parents, we all have our own pet peeves with the way other people raise their children. Personally, one of my hot-button issues is kids with too much stuff and too much access to inappropriate media. Lots of folks here probably don't want to hear what I say in private about children who have TVs in their bedrooms, for example.

 

However, I recognize that every family and, in fact, every child is different. Even with my own two, what works for one doesn't for the other. It's been true in terms of schoolwork and discipline and even food. So, just because we get some things "right" with one child or the other, I am not nearly arrogant enough to say that my way is "right."

 

Two things:

 

1. As far as I can tell, no one has yet actually explained to me why, as long as what a child is eating is resonably healthy, it matters one whit that the child might be considered "picky."

 

2. I wonder what you have to say to those of us who DON'T make separate meals for our picky eaters. Are we still doing it all wrong?

[*lifeoftheparty*]

 

I take the kids to feed the homeless once a month and we missed the past two due to illness, we are going in a couple weeks, and that always brings about an attitude adjustment for him. He listened last time how all one man ate all day was a small piece of chicken, other men had no food, one guy caught his taco bell taco on fire in the microwave and had tears in his eyes that he couldn't eat the whole thing because the middle was scorched. It really impressed on him how much he really does have, and he said as much.

 

 

 

Good for you, that is awesome!

[Jenny in Florida]

And this is kind of what I'm saying. If you prepare and serve a wide variety of foods for your kids and have them eat it, from an early age (instead of just making chicken nuggets for them and "adult" food for everyone else) then it will become familiar and you shouldn't have dinner time issues. There will always be things that your kid might not like after a trying it many times, and that's OK. But if every night, there is a battle, and making of extra food, that is catering/spoiling and will create bigger issues if it isn't nipped in the bud.

 

This has not been true for us. When my kids were little, they ate all kinds of things. My daughter's favorite food for a long time was lima beans, and my son used to beg for baby carrots at the grocery store like other kids begged for candy.

 

But, as they got older, they liked fewer things. We're vegans, so my kids have literally never had chicken nuggets or macaroni and cheese. They've never eaten at McDonald's (although they do eat fries from Wendy's or BK sometimes when we're on the road).

 

As I've said repeatedly, I don't make separate meals. Nor do I cater to them by buying or preparing specialty, kid-friendly foods as a substitute for what the adults are eating.

 

They, too, were out of strollers by age three. They've always had bedtimes and restrictions on the amount and kind of TV they watch and all sorts of other kinds of rules about behavior. They cannot be described as spoiled in any concievable way. They are just picky about food.

 

Honestly, why is that such a big deal?

[*lifeoftheparty*]

This has not been true for us. When my kids were little, they ate all kinds of things. My daughter's favorite food for a long time was lima beans, and my son used to beg for baby carrots at the grocery store like other kids begged for candy.

 

But, as they got older, they liked fewer things. We're vegans, so my kids have literally never had chicken nuggets or macaroni and cheese. They've never eaten at McDonald's (although they do eat fries from Wendy's or BK sometimes when we're on the road).

 

As I've said repeatedly, I don't make separate meals. Nor do I cater to them by buying or preparing specialty, kid-friendly foods as a substitute for what the adults are eating.

 

They, too, were out of strollers by age three. They've always had bedtimes and restrictions on the amount and kind of TV they watch and all sorts of other kinds of rules about behavior. They cannot be described as spoiled in any concievable way. They are just picky about food.

 

Honestly, why is that such a big deal?

 

:confused: I don't think it IS a big deal.

 

The OP came here and presented a problem she is having. We are all chiming in with our advice, advice that is based on our personal experiences. We are not posting to attack your parenting choices, or anyone else's parenting choices.

 

Not everyone will agree, obviously, and some people may not understand why a person feels the way they do... which is why we are offering explanations for why we feel the way we do and how we came to those conclusions.

[Lovedtodeath]

Thank you! I was about to say the same thing. I followed baby-led weaning in which DS was eating all kinds of adult foods at one year old. Courgette, broccoli, turkey, whole wheat pancakes and tortillas, a variety of legumes and exotic grains... According to the baby led weaning people this was to prevent pickiness. He has gotten pickier the older he gets and I can hardly get him to eat anything.

This has not been true for us. When my kids were little, they ate all kinds of things. My daughter's favorite food for a long time was lima beans, and my son used to beg for baby carrots at the grocery store like other kids begged for candy.

 

But, as they got older, they liked fewer things. We're vegans, so my kids have literally never had chicken nuggets or macaroni and cheese. They've never eaten at McDonald's (although they do eat fries from Wendy's or BK sometimes when we're on the road).

 

As I've said repeatedly, I don't make separate meals. Nor do I cater to them by buying or preparing specialty, kid-friendly foods as a substitute for what the adults are eating.

 

They, too, were out of strollers by age three. They've always had bedtimes and restrictions on the amount and kind of TV they watch and all sorts of other kinds of rules about behavior. They cannot be described as spoiled in any concievable way. They are just picky about food.

 

Honestly, why is that such a big deal?

:hurray::iagree:

[Lovedtodeath]

Bingo!

 

I think limiting snacks before dinner is a great idea. I also would not offer an alternative (like pb&j). But that is only my opinion. I just think it gives him too easy of an "out". This is because I agree with you that this is a behavior issue. Again, JMHO!

I disagree with this approach. If his attitude is the problem then the reaction/discipline needs to be about the attitude, not about the food.

 

In hindsight I realize my original post was written in the heat of emotion after dealing with his outburst. The issue REALLY isn't about food...it is his attitude about it. I don't mind if he hates it and wants something else, just PLEASE ask nicely.

[LibraryLover]

What I mean is that sometimes children who have a variety of experiences with food (as mine have had) still might go on a binge of smooth foods, or pasta, or all pale colored...lol something. Little children can be overwhlemed with all the new things of the world, and sometimes find comfort in the simple, in the repetitive. I don't worry about this. I've seen it happen, and I've seen it not be a big deal.

 

I don't think food should ever be a battleground.

 

And this is kind of what I'm saying. If you prepare and serve a wide variety of foods for your kids and have them eat it, from an early age (instead of just making chicken nuggets for them and "adult" food for everyone else) then it will become familiar and you shouldn't have dinner time issues. There will always be things that your kid might not like after a trying it many times, and that's OK. But if every night, there is a battle, and making of extra food, that is catering/spoiling and will create bigger issues if it isn't nipped in the bud.

[Jenny in Florida]

:confused: I don't think it IS a big deal.

 

You said:

 

"This is a hot topic with me. We are "well-to-do" and live in an area where there are lots of wealthy people. I continually notice spoiled rotten kids and have seen my own child start becoming this way. I have no intention of raising a spoiled kid, so I'm working really hard to change that. I do NOT, under any circumstances, let him get away with stuff like that. I REALLY REALLY REALLY want to raise a servant-minded, charitable, caring, loving individual who will leave this world better than he found it. This whole "picky eater" thing is just one of the biggest pet peeves I have, I notice it. I also watch these kids grow up and notice that when a parent starts catering to kids preferences, it only gets worse. It sets a precedent. I can get mom to cater to my every whim just by being difficult.

 

It also can lead to bad eating habits and bad health. I try to explain to DS how every thing we eat affects our health, I show him how the things on his plate will help his body and what will harm his body. I show him that there is a reason we are eating all these different foods, and a reason WHY I keep making him try them. He may not completely understand, but at least he sees I'm not just doing it to be mean.

 

It's all about balance. I don't want to force my child to live in poverty when he doesn't have to, but I don't want him to be spoiled either. I think making separate meals for a child who is "picky" is just catering to a spoiled child, and you don't have to agree, and that's fine, I was just giving my advice based on my knowledge and experience. "

 

Sounds like you think it's a pretty big deal.

[Susan C.]

I didn't read the replies, but I love Keven Leman's "How to Make Your Kids Mind without Losing Yours."

 

The kids were little. The MOST pickiest eaters EVER. Dh had lost his job and already moved to another state to work. I read the book and did what it said. It worked. He says to put the food in front of them. If they don't want it, take it away. No fuss, no scene. Announce the next meal will be breakfast. Don't give in. Some have even taken the dinner, covered it, put it in the frig. and then offered it for breakfast. It won't be turned down. Hunger works. I chose another approach. They fussed, I took the food and put it down the garbage disposal right in front of them. You should have seen their faces!! Priceless!! Their look said that mom had finally lost it..... But they ate their breakfast, lunch and dinner the next day and I only had to remind them to get compliance. I always tried to make kid friendly food and didn't use this for unusual foods.

 

Your ds cannot live on PB&Js. It doesn't have enough nutrition.