Am I being unreasonable in wanting to move?

[Mom in High Heels]

Ugh! Our post (Army) is closing in 5 years and for whatever reason they are now letting anyone E7 and above (dh is a CW2) move off post (including those who already live on post). When we first moved here, only O6 and above could live on the economy and everyone else had to live on post. I so want to move! I would love to live on the economy! Dh says no because we only have 18 months left. Who cares??? We currently live in stairwell housing (we're in Germany) in an 1100 sqft apt with 1 bathroom. We live on the 3rd floor. Walk up. With his OHA (Overseas Housing Allowance), we could afford to rent a single family 1900 sq ft house with 3 bedrooms, 2.5 baths, 2 terraces, a garden, garage, our own washer and dryer plus a small studio apt in the basement (which would be WONDERFUL for visiting family) with it's own small kitchen and bathroom. It's 10 minutes max from post and dh says he doesn't want to move. WHAT???? He says it's too much of a pain to set up a house. Guess who doesn't set up the house? Him! I do it! We would have to move ourselves and it would cost us about $1500 to have movers pack us out, but that's not an issue. The house I'm looking at is 150 Euro less per month than his OHA and we'd get more money for utilities than we'd spend (I have friends who live on the economy and they never use their entire utility allowance). I'm so irritated right now. I'm tired of having to haul laundry up and down 4 flights of stairs (the community washers and dryers are in the basement). I'm tired of having to lug groceries to the 3rd floor and walk the dogs up and down the stairs 4-5 times a day. I'm tired of living in a stairwell. I want a house. He's gone all day and usually at least 2-3 weeks out of every month, so he doesn't spend as much time in the apartment that ds and I do. I want some more space. I know it's only for 18ish months (though dh has talked about extending here), but still. Am I being unreasonable????

[Mrs Mungo]

I would move. We moved ourselves when we lived in Germany, it was a huge PITA, but we survived.

[fhjmom]

I know nothing about how military housing works but I am assuming that if you don't use all our alloted housing allowance, it isn't something that can go towards other expenses. In other words, the move would not take any $$ away from the family since it is still below the allowance and you don't get that money anyway?

 

If that's the case, then I would definitely think it is more than reasonable to move! I hate apartment-type living and would much rather be in a house. 18 months can be a *long* time in a place you don't like, especially when you know there is a better option that could be yours!

[elegantlion]

18 months is a long time to live in an unhappy spot. :glare:

[Mrs Mungo]

I know nothing about how military housing works but I am assuming that if you don't use all our alloted housing allowance, it isn't something that can go towards other expenses. In other words, the move would not take any $$ away from the family since it is still below the allowance and you don't get that money anyway?

 

A housing allowance is a set amount. If you live on post, the military keeps your housing allowance. If you live off post, you get the housing allowance in its entirety and it's your choice where you choose to live. You might choose a smaller rent and pocket some money, or you may choose a bigger house and pay some out of pocket.

[EJCMom]

I do not think you are being unreasonable.

 

Here is my situation: My DH is an over-the-road truck driver. He's home, maybe, one week out of every month. He absolutely hates where we live. We could have a higher standard of living if we lived somewhere else in the country. I don't want to move because this is where our family is. They are tremendously helpful to me while he is gone. I don't want to live somewhere with no support system and be even more of a single parent than I already am 3 weeks out of every month. One day he was complaining about my unwillingness to move to a buddy who is also a truck driver. The friend said, "I don't like where we live either. But, I figure the wife is there all the time. I'm only there one week out of the month. Since she's the one who is there the vast majority of the time, she gets to pick where we live." My husband hasn't bugged me about moving ever since.

 

Good luck in stating your case to your husband. Given that you would be the one to deal with all of the hassle of the move and that it would greatly reduce your burden...and that it wouldn't cost you any more to live off the base...I would think you could gently persuade him to come around.

[Mrs Mungo]

The biggest problem is renting a moving truck in Germany, at least it was a huge problem back when we moved. Granted, that was many years ago and both the post we moved *from* and the one we moved *to* have since closed. :lol:

[Mom in High Heels]

A housing allowance is a set amount. If you live on post, the military keeps your housing allowance. If you live off post, you get the housing allowance in its entirety and it's your choice where you choose to live. You might choose a smaller rent and pocket some money, or you may choose a bigger house and pay some out of pocket.

 

 

Exactly! Right now, housing (meaning the gov't housing dept) takes all of our housing allowance, so we never see it. If we live on the economy, the 1350 Euro/month (approx $1670) plus the 624 Euro/month (approx $775) would be added to dh's paycheck and we would have to pay the rent and utilities out of that. One of our friends, who has a MUCH larger house than the one I'm looking at (but her husband is higher rank, so they make more money), never spend more than 600 Euro/month on utilities. That means the 150/Euro left over from rent and anything left over from utilities would be ours to pocket every month. That's at least $200/month! Right now we're just giving all that money up to live in a small apartment.

 

I'm glad to see you all don't think I'm being unreasonable.

[TammyinTN]

MOVE!!! :auto:

 

I totally know what your going through. If we weren't already moving to another post we would have moved. We just got a contract on a 4 story house with more than 3000sq feet and just a few neighbors. We will be back in the country and I can hardly contain my happiness!:D Tomorrow I would go buy out the commissary and let him haul it all upstairs. Then say your back hurts and let him do all the laundry...make as many loads as humanly possible and then he must walk the pooch. I bet you could sway him in your favor...and it's going to be nice and hot tomorrow. :D:lol:

[Mom in High Heels]

The biggest problem is renting a moving truck in Germany, at least it was a huge problem back when we moved. Granted, that was many years ago and both the post we moved *from* and the one we moved *to* have since closed. :lol:

 

Oh, no, we would hire a company to do it (it's about $1500). There' is no way I'm going to carry all our stuff down 3 flights of stairs! That's just crazy. Heck, the movers don't even carry it. They use those little elevator platforms and bring everything in through a window. IMO, that would be $1500 WELL spent.

[Chris in VA]

What besides I don't wanna is your husband's argument?:001_huh:

[FaithManor]

Okay, here are my thoughts and I haven't had any chocolate and not enough coffee so this may be wonky!

 

I'd set Mr. Hubby down and say something like, "Darling, I love you but I do get worn out not having a yard for Indy to play in instead of having to plan for the park or playground.....It is exhausting to haul all of the laundry up and down those stairs and I've been doing that for a long time. I am willing to plan for the move and to execute the details. Since we will have movers, you won't need to do the heavy lifting and if I draw up a floor plan ahead of time, then I can have the movers place all of the furniture in its appropriate places. Your work will be limited and this will greatly enhance our lives." Use your sweet voice but give him the firm "wife really needs this voice."

 

Other than that, maybe bring it up after a carefully planned "tea" party.

 

Faith

[sassenach]

I would make him feel every day of that 18 months.

[Aubrey]

Without the details, I might have said it's not worth it. But here's the thing that I kept thinking: where are you going next? I realize you probably either don't know or can't tell, but my point is only this--what if it's another little apt on a 3rd floor somewhere?

 

We were in an apt (1st floor) for about 18mos. 900-ish sf, 4dc, sometimes no a/c. We finally decided to move. We're in a house, had to move ourselves, paying a little more $ in rent, & it's been about 18 mos here.

 

Now we're looking at possibly moving somewhere small again. If we do, it shouldn't have to be more than 18mos, but the only reason I can even *think* about it is because these 18mos w/ something like 1300 sf have been. so. nice. The kids being able to play outside, the washing machine in my own house, room to keep my sewing & scrapbooking out--have been...cathartic? :lol:

 

So, yeah, move. Maybe leave dh a note, so he can find you. ;)

[Debbie in OR]

I would move. We had two tours in Germany, living on the economy for one of them. It was the best possible experience for our whole family, but for myself and my brothers in particular. We learned more about the culture, language, people, etc...in the year we were off post than in all the other years combined living on post. What a fabulous 18 months it could be for your dd. (Tell your dh it's for your dd's schooling :001_smile:)

 

The headache of moving would be minor compared to the benefits.

[Mom in High Heels]

What besides I don't wanna is your husband's argument?:001_huh:

 

He has no argument other than he doesn't want to because it's a PITA to move. Now, I agree with him there, it is in fact a PITA to move, however, in the 14 years he's been in the army we've done it 10 times. 10! What is one more in the grand scheme of things? Really?

 

I'm so irritated right now. He's just dead set against it. Oh, his other argument is that he can walk to work now, where if we move off post he'd have to drive about 7 minutes. I love him, but right now, I could strangle him with a smile on my face.:banghead:

 

A few people have voted no to move. I'm really curious as to their argument. If you vote not to move, tell me why.

[Aubrey]

He has no argument other than he doesn't want to because it's a PITA to move. Now, I agree with him there, it is in fact a PITA to move, however, in the 14 years he's been in the army we've done it 10 times. 10! What is one more in the grand scheme of things? Really?

 

I'm so irritated right now. He's just dead set against it. Oh, his other argument is that he can walk to work now, where if we move off post he'd have to drive about 7 minutes. I love him, but right now, I could strangle him with a smile on my face.:banghead:

 

A few people have voted no to move. I'm really curious as to their argument. If you vote not to move, tell me why.

 

I think I'd let him spend the saved commute time carrying laundry up & down the stairs. (With a smile on my face!) ;)

 

Fwiw, my dh is like that w/ bookshelves. Bookshelves!?

[fhjmom]

Exactly! Right now, housing (meaning the gov't housing dept) takes all of our housing allowance, so we never see it. If we live on the economy, the 1350 Euro/month (approx $1670) plus the 624 Euro/month (approx $775) would be added to dh's paycheck and we would have to pay the rent and utilities out of that. One of our friends, who has a MUCH larger house than the one I'm looking at (but her husband is higher rank, so they make more money), never spend more than 600 Euro/month on utilities. That means the 150/Euro left over from rent and anything left over from utilities would be ours to pocket every month. That's at least $200/month! Right now we're just giving all that money up to live in a small apartment.

 

 

So you would be in a bigger, better place *and* be making *more* money!?! Here I was thinking it would just be a wash. Heck, yeah you oughta move! If he is complaining about the cost of the movers, you would have that paid back in 7.5 months! Tell DH you are going to start packing.:lol:

[dm379]

MOVE!!! We put in our request to the branch manager last night and the only reason why we didn't ask for Germany (we'd be at Ansbach) is because I can't take another 3 years in tiny housing. We have the same thing here in Korea. I'd give anything to be allowed to live on the economy. Bribe him if you have to.

[AHASRADA]

Write it all out---showing the differences in cost, savings, etc and present that to him. Maybe it will help him to see it all in writing.

 

:iagree: I would list the things you hate about where you currently live, compared to the hassle/negatives involved in moving. Also list the pros (if any) of where you are now, and the pros of moving. I might even color code the pros and cons, to symbolize whose pros and cons they are. He may honestly not realize how miserable you are now, and how much it means to you to live in a nice house, even for 18 months.

 

Hopefully, when he sees that there aren't many pros to where you live now, and that most of the cons on both sides are yours (living in a place you hate vs. the hassle of packing and setting up house), and that despite this, you would prefer the cons of moving, due to all the pros of moving, in addition to the financial factor, he will come around.

 

18 months is a long time, plenty long enough to justify moving. Have you ever lived anywhere for 18 months or less before moving? I would guess yes, so why is this time any different? What if you never end up with another assignment that allows you to live in such comfortable circumstances? And you missed this opportunity just because he doesn't "feel like it" ?? Sounds like he's setting himself up for a lifetime grudge to be held over his head in every future argument. Not worth it, IMO ;).

[MarinesWife]

Your current housing situation is one reason I voted NO NO NO to moving to Germany. The thought of living in a stairwell just made me run for the hills. I'd be moving in a heartbeat. I'm all for supporting my husband and trying to make his life easier but this is way slanted towards your side of things. The benefits 95% outweigh the staying benefits.

[Mommyof4ks]

I think hubby will be walking the dog, lugging the groceries, and doing laundry this week. ;)

[Pretty in Pink]

Uh, yeah. We'd be moving. In a heartbeat. My husband would probably moan and groan, but ultimately he pretty much leaves those sorts of decisions up to me.

 

I like the idea of a strategically timed 'tea party'... :D Sounds like a win-win scenario for you. ;)

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

I would move. We moved ourselves when we lived in Germany, it was a huge PITA, but we survived.

 

I agree. Move. Tell your DH you will do all the work (all the Army moms I know do all the work anyway).

 

I moved us from an apartment on the economy to a single family home on the economy when DH was in the field (with his approval, although he thought I was slightly insane but what's new?). I was expecting dd5 and DONE having no privacy or outdoor space. It was heaven, everything I thought it would be (yard for kids and dog, garden, my own washer and dryer, etc.). It was worth every bit of effort for the...wait for it and tell your DH...10 months before our next PCS! :)

[Starr]

Who is home all day? ;)

[Sebastian (a lady)]

I would move. We had two tours in Germany, living on the economy for one of them. It was the best possible experience for our whole family, but for myself and my brothers in particular. We learned more about the culture, language, people, etc...in the year we were off post than in all the other years combined living on post. What a fabulous 18 months it could be for your dd. (Tell your dh it's for your dd's schooling :001_smile:)

 

The headache of moving would be minor compared to the benefits.

 

I have to echo this one. We lived on the economy, far from a base in Germany and now live on base in Japan. I knew far more about Europe than I have learned about Japan, just because there are so many fewer little daily encounters with Japan.

 

I don't shop much in Japan except at the commissary. We don't even get off base much for dinner just because dh is so tired after work. I really feel like we've pretty much missed a big opportunity here. (Although, for commute and work hour reasons, I wouldn't move from where we are. DH works 14 hour days 6 days a week and half days most Sundays. He has a 7 minute walk from work. Even a half hour commute would be horrible for us and 45-60 minutes would be more likely.)

 

For the OP, would this mean you would need two cars? Would it make getting to the commissary, library, post office harder? Would it increase a sense of isolation from other on base homeschoolers? Would it make kids' sports or other activities more difficult?

[MotherMayI]

I think hubby will be walking the dog, lugging the groceries, and doing laundry this week. ;)

 

:iagree: Absolutely!! We just moved after living in a home less than 18 months and I don't regret those 18 months at all.

[asta]

I'd tell you to look at these things (which are common throughout the EU):

 

Look at how much your COLA was when you first got there vs what it is now (it should be 2/3 to 1/2). Many people relied on that to pay for utilities and got burned - and it is continuing to decrease.

 

Ask around about any "deposit horror stories". There are inevitably people on post who used to be off post. It is not uncommon to have to put up 1st, last AND a deposit. The gvt is more than happy to "loan" you that money and take it out of your check in easy monthly installments. It is extremely common to NOT get that deposit back. We're talking amounts to the tune of $8000.

 

Recognize that you will need all 220 v appliances and/or large transformers; you may need an entire kitchen (including cabinets), and you almost certainly will need all your own lighting.

 

And all of this is why...

 

People of HIGHER rank are being allowed to move off post; too many lower ranking individuals cannot afford to move into an apartment, and they can certainly not afford to lose those deposits. Housing offices will not "go to bat" for them.

 

This is a much more complex issue than simply more space.

 

 

asta

Edited July 3, 2010 by asta

[rookie]

18 months? That's a really long time to be filled up with either happy or unhappy memories! A move is a pain for a couple of days and then it's over and you get to enjoy your new place! Move and enjoy your life there! :)

[RanchGirl]

It sounds like moving would be a win win! I would ask him to do the laundry, walk the dogs, and haul the groceries up and down the stairs for the next week and then revisit in a week and see if he wants to keep doing that for 18 more months.

[mommytobees]

Move, honey, move!!!

 

Kris

[KidsHappen]

I have been a military dependent almost my entire life and then when my hubby got out of the military 17 years ago, he joined a career field that entails even more moves. There have been many times when I have only lived somewhere for 6 mos. I'd say at least half of our assignments were 18 months or less. When we lived in both Germany and Japan we had to live off base until base housing was available so we always ended up moving anyhow. Explain to your hubby that you are in the military and moving frquently is part of the deal.

[Parrothead]

I have no idea how it works, but if there is no problem being able to continue homeschooling off base, I'd find a way to convince dh to move.

[nd293]

Sometimes you just need to tell dh to face the facts - apart from distance-to-work and cost issues (neither of which seem an issue here) housing issues impact far more on stay-at-home family members than the working spouse. Tell him you'll move while he is away, and won't moan about any moving related issues.

 

We had similar issues when I wanted to move from a very, very hot apartment in a very, very hot country. He never saw the issue, as by the time he got home the sun was down, and not baking against the living room wall making us all miserable (despite a/c running full blast). We moved. He got over it.

 

Nikki (moving house again in 9 days)

[Liz CA]

Plead your case to your dh and see if he can be swayed. Wouldn't he rather live somewhere where his family is happy?

Will you have someone to translate if you have to hire German companies to assist, i.e. moving van, etc.?

[Liz CA]

Plead your case to your dh and see if he can be swayed. Wouldn't he rather live somewhere where his family is happy?

Will you have someone to translate if you have to hire German companies to assist, i.e. moving van, etc.?

 

Shucks, I just voted wrong in your poll. All I saw was the sentence beginning with "Yes..." and I clicked it thinking "Yes, go ahead and move." Deduct one from the poll results and put it on the other side. :lol:

[Liz CA]

Uh, yeah. We'd be moving. In a heartbeat. My husband would probably moan and groan, but ultimately he pretty much leaves those sorts of decisions up to me.

 

I like the idea of a strategically timed 'tea party'... :D Sounds like a win-win scenario for you. ;)

 

:lol: ..of course you are talking about a nice cup of Earl Grey?!??

[meet me in paris]

I'd tell you to look at these things (which are common throughout the EU):

 

Look at how much your COLA was when you first got there vs what it is now (it should be 2/3 to 1/2). Many people relied on that to pay for utilities and got burned - and it is continuing to decrease.

 

Ask around about any "deposit horror stories". There are inevitably people on post who used to be off post. It is not uncommon to have to put up 1st, last AND a deposit. The gvt is more than happy to "loan" you that money and take it out of your check in easy monthly installments. It is extremely common to NOT get that deposit back. We're talking amounts to the tune of $8000.

 

Recognize that you will need all 220 v appliances and/or large transformers; you may need an entire kitchen (including cabinets), and you almost certainly will need all your own lighting.

 

And all of this is why...

 

People of HIGHER rank are being allowed to move off post; too many lower ranking individuals cannot afford to move into an apartment, and they can certainly not afford to lose those deposits. Housing offices will not "go to bat" for them.

 

This is a much more complex issue than simply more space.

 

 

asta

 

:iagree:

We lived off base in Japan for part of the time, and it cost us $6000 out of pocket in deposits, "key money", etc. that we never got back. It was a good experience, but it cost us big time. Utilities are another PITA and you can get a whopping bill out of the blue.

 

I'm not saying "no", I'm just saying "think about it". The experience of living on the economy will be great in terms of immersion in the culture, but make sure you can afford any problems that may arise.

[RoughCollie]

I would move. It's a week or two of moving & associated work compared to 73 weeks of living in a better place.