Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 News that has completely rocked me is posted at my Stepford blog if anyone is interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tex-mex Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: Hang in there... not an easy choice. I think for the kid's sake, this needed to be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 Yeah...but I never for a moment thought it would be an issue, them visiting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakia Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 :grouphug: Bless you. I can't imagine. I just have to ask, though, is it really worth it? I mean, you have so much going on, do you really think you should put yourself through this? I would hate for you to be devastated by them again. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PollyOR Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 :grouphug: I don't have any advice, but I can give a hug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Honestly, having had to go no contact with npd family members, I urge you to reconsider your choice of meeting up with them. There is a good reason you have avoided them and are panicked about this meetup. Npd's do not change. They are emotional vampires continually looking for sources of narcissistic supply. Npd's are incapable of showing true empathy or remorse for past bad behavior. My advice: Don't do this. Keep your children away from the manipulation too. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornblower Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 I think for the kid's sake, this needed to be done. I came to exactly the opposite view. For the sake of the children, I would have nothing, nothing to do with these people. Why should children be exposed to someone who sounds like a sociopath - just because they contributed some genetic material? Nope. Why should children have to cope with the fallout, the stress on the family, the turmoil of parents being upset by the grandparents? I think too many people are buying into some Hallmark/Rockwell capital F 'Family is sacred' junk. Just my opinion but I wouldn't do this based on the info I've read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 :grouphug: Bless you. I can't imagine. I just have to ask, though, is it really worth it? I mean, you have so much going on, do you really think you should put yourself through this? I would hate for you to be devastated by them again. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: The sad fact is no more damage can be done beyond whats already happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakia Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 I came to exactly the opposite view. For the sake of the children, I would have nothing, nothing to do with these people. Why should children be exposed to someone who sounds like a sociopath - just because they contributed some genetic material? Nope. Why should children have to cope with the fallout, the stress on the family, the turmoil of parents being upset by the grandparents? I think too many people are buying into some Hallmark/Rockwell capital F 'Family is sacred' junk. Just my opinion but I wouldn't do this based on the info I've read. I agree. My bio father is a dangerous alcoholic who abused my mother during their marriage and abandoned us. He now wants a relationship with my children. That's a big fat no. Why would I let them be hurt the way my brother and I were hurt? Not going to happen. But I do realize we all have to make our own decisions in things like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthwestMom Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 This does not seem to be in anyone's best interest. I wouldn't do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakia Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 The sad fact is no more damage can be done beyond whats already happened. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: I want to cry just thinking about your situation. Please be good to yourself. You do not deserve any of their crap. Your heart needs healing, not more hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lara in Colo Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 I know some of what you feel--Very bad relationship with my mother. If you want to talk to someone "there" PM me. Lara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 This does not seem to be in anyone's best interest. I wouldn't do it. :iagree: None of my kids has ever met my father. He's toxic, he doesn't deserve their joy, and they don't deserve his pain. I don't feel an ounce of guilt over protecting my children. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthwestMom Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 The sad fact is no more damage can be done beyond whats already happened. Those are famous last words. Be kind to yourself. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 The sad fact is no more damage can be done beyond whats already happened. Oh yes it can get worse! Lots! Seriously, you are saying it can't get worse..therefore implying that the relationship is pretty bad. Why would you even consider putting this on your family at this point??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 :grouphug: I am so sorry. I agree I wouldn't allow my children around them until you feel comfortable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 My eldest child wouldn't forgive me if I didn't meet with them. They've done so much damage to the relationship btwn he and I, I can't allow more. Screw it. I am saying. Last time my mother was here, my eldest child returned with her, for what was supposed to be a month long visit. He was 12. I haven't seen him since. He refused to come back, and everyone was willing to swear my dh abused him (never, EVER happened...I was abused as a kid, I would leave anyone in a heartbeat if they hurt my kids). My parents bribed him, buying him things we couldn't afford, promising him hockey, football...stuff we couldn't afford. Wolf even was willing to leave our marriage, and we were told it wouldn't matter, he wasn't coming home. According to law, he's allowed to choose where he lives at 12, as long as there is someone willing to be guardian. He's refused to visit us since, out of fear that a) we wouldn't allow him to leave (abso-freaking-lutely) and b) We were used as a threat, how would he like to go back and live 'poor' again? Its because of HIM that I'm going. I won't allow them to make things even worse. I just don't know if I can look them in the face and see them as anything other than those who robbed me of my son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakia Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 My eldest child wouldn't forgive me if I didn't meet with them. They've done so much damage to the relationship btwn he and I, I can't allow more. Screw it. I am saying. Last time my mother was here, my eldest child returned with her, for what was supposed to be a month long visit. He was 12. I haven't seen him since. He refused to come back, and everyone was willing to swear my dh abused him (never, EVER happened...I was abused as a kid, I would leave anyone in a heartbeat if they hurt my kids). My parents bribed him, buying him things we couldn't afford, promising him hockey, football...stuff we couldn't afford. Wolf even was willing to leave our marriage, and we were told it wouldn't matter, he wasn't coming home. According to law, he's allowed to choose where he lives at 12, as long as there is someone willing to be guardian. He's refused to visit us since, out of fear that a) we wouldn't allow him to leave (abso-freaking-lutely) and b) We were used as a threat, how would he like to go back and live 'poor' again? Its because of HIM that I'm going. I won't allow them to make things even worse. I just don't know if I can look them in the face and see them as anything other than those who robbed me of my son. Wow, how long has your son been gone? That is so sad. I am just so very sorry. You are a good person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 5 years July 1. He'll be 18 in Dec. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Wow! I didn't know all that. What about just you going to meet up? I wouldn't allow them anywhere near the other children. They sound unpredictable. Will your older son be with them? If not, I wouldn't go. Is it possible that your son has decided to move back home? This is all so sad! :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 Wow! I didn't know all that. What about just you going to meet up? I wouldn't allow them anywhere near the other children. They sound unpredictable. Will your older son be with them? If not, I wouldn't go. Is it possible that your son has decided to move back home? This is all so sad! :grouphug: No, he's not coming. I'm going to hopefully hear more about him. I'm going to bring the kids if I get through the first visit, because along w/their wanting to meet my parents, I hope the stories of them will create a longing in him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dansamy Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 There are no words for what I'm feeling at the moment. Saying hell would freeze before they kept me from my child is an understatement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 I wish it had been that easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5knights3maidens Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Imp, I would only let them meet your other two children if there was 0% chance that they could take them away from you too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornblower Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 What if they want Diva now? What if they are going to plant the seeds of how wonderful life would be with them? And take her when she's 12? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Imp, I would only let them meet your other two children if there was 0% chance that they could take them away from you too. :iagree: I don't get a good feeling about these people at all. How do you know they won't show up with a crazy social worker and police in tow to exert some bogus grandparent custody order?? Crazy things happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 They won't be allowed alone with any of the three I still have at home, plus the kids are all too young for the law to make it anything other than kidnapping. Never, EVER again will any of my children go to the other side of the country to visit them. I wouldn't leave them alone with a gerbil I liked, let alone one of my kids, ever again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 What if they want Diva now? What if they are going to plant the seeds of how wonderful life would be with them? And take her when she's 12? They don't like her that much. They've wanted custody of my eldest from the time he was 2, and I was moving 2 hrs away for college. I never realized that that was simmering, and waiting all that time. Because we lived in a basement apt at their home from the time he was a baby, they felt like he was their kid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4besitos Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 I would not let them near my children.at.all. I would not let there be even a remote chance of planting "you could live with us" seeds. If your son isn't going to be with them......I wouldn't visit with them at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyndie Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Wow, all I can say is :grouphug: What a heartbreaking situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bookfiend Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 No one can choose for you. I can't imagine how heart-wrenchingly torn you must feel. Prayers to walk beside you; may discretion be your companion; may grace direct your actions and wisdom guard your heart; may God strengthen you to stand. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katemary63 Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Its the right thing to do. To deny my children this chance would be wrong. I'm sorry but I'm going to be blunt. This is a lie you are telling yourself. It is in no way true what so ever. If you really think it is, please give reasons, such as the amazing benefits your children will reap by meeting people so aweful that they nearly caused your suicide. I'm sorry, but you are being manipulated by your own false guilt. You DO NOT have to see them or let them meet your children. It is NOT the right thing to do. I am speaking from experience. I am estranged from my biological father for just reasons. I feel no compulsion what so ever to see or speak to him or allow him to see my kids. He has never met my youngest and he will die not meeting her. He will NOT be invited to my kid's weddings (one coming up next year) I sleep at night. I doubt he does, but this is as it should be. I am not responsible for his feelings. I am responsible to protect my family from evil people and that I am doing. Please don't put yourself or your kids through this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 They sound like horrible people. If your son isn't going to be with them, how can you trust them to fairly represent your life to him so that he would want to visit or come back? To be blunt, I think you are making a mistake by seeing them and letting them have anything to do with your youngers. Their track record speaks for itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katemary63 Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 . According to law, he's allowed to choose where he lives at 12, as long as there is someone willing to be guardian. I'm sorry, Impish, but this is rediculous. Grandparents can not legally take any child that is over 12 and says he/ she wants to live with them. I don't believe this is the law for a million dollars. Sorry. Regardless, this story is even more reason NOT to see them. As another poster said, HELL would freeze over before I'd see these people again outside a courtroom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 It is the law. Stupid, ridiculous, but true. Add in that my parents were willing and serious about lying about witnessing abuse, having my husband thrown in jail...I regret sharing the story, but its out now. I have to do what I can to preserve what relationship I have with my son. At the end of the day, its what I have to do. Not at the sacrifice of my other children, of course, but I at least have to see them. I don't even know how that will go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mynyel Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 About the law....I don't think you are in the states are you Imp? We Americans can't wrap our brains around other countries laws at times because, like in this case, it just seems so ludicrous. I wish we could take away some of the pain but perhaps just venting can help even if it does feel mediocre. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 No, I'm in Canada. I looked into everything at the time. I don't know if anything has changed in 5 yrs, but it was what it was at the time. I even called the RCMP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mynyel Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Ahh...ok I figured it wasn't the USA just because of the way your spelled cheque :) Truely :grouphug::grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornblower Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 I'm sorry, Impish, but this is rediculous. Grandparents can not legally take any child that is over 12 and says he/ she wants to live with them. I don't believe this is the law for a million dollars. Sorry. Um, yeah. Alberta law seems to give more credence to a child's wishes but still - that is only in custody cases between parents. In BC, the courts & the parents decide though the court will want to hear the child's wishes. I'm not familiar with other provinces but I don't think it's that different. There must be a whole lot more to this story. Well. Whatever. :confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuntieM Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 I would not let them near my children.at.all. I would not let there be even a remote chance of planting "you could live with us" seeds. If your son isn't going to be with them......I wouldn't visit with them at all. If I were you, the only way I'd meet with them would be if eldest WERE present. He's the one you want to see. Even if you meet with them and make nice, there is no guarantee they'll return to him with a report that in anyway resembles the truth. I believe they are on reconnoissance for your other children. After all, at 18 your son will soon leave their nest. Mom may be afraid he'll want to attend college cross-country like you did and wants some fresh child to mother. I am rarely this blunt, so sorry, Impish, but there's no way in bloody hell I'd send her photos of my children, let alone allow them in the same zip code. Isn't your MIL in town still? Why don't you arrange a nice little get-together for the three gandparental units while you skip out and take your beloved children out for some ice cream. In a different zip code. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dansamy Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 There must be a whole lot more to this story. Well. Whatever. :confused: :iagree: There's a lot to this whole thing. Most likely more pain/drama than is appropriate for such a public forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hen Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Imp, if it were me, I wouldn't do it. Their betrayal tore up the 'be civil' card. If you are hoping to hear more about your ds, look for other avenues. He is almost 18, maybe you can resume a relationship then. Meeting them is just going to make you crazy, they are toxic and did something unforgivable. In my opinion, you are setting your other children up to be fettered to a lifetime of bad feelings/manipulation by these people. You demonstrating that you still have to go through the good daughter routine by even meeting them/talking to them is modeling for them that this is what good people do...be emotionally manipulated and forever trying to offer up enough sacrifice to be acceptable. I am so sorry about what you went through. A very good friend went through something similiar here in the states, the grandmother got the oldest to state she was "afraid" of her dad- got cps involved, offered bribes, my friend was so horrified and humiliated she didn't tell me for a few months and as far as I know hasn't told many other people. I don't think you should ever feel guilty for considering them dead. I am sorry you are going through this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted June 20, 2010 Author Share Posted June 20, 2010 :iagree: There's a lot to this whole thing. Most likely more pain/drama than is appropriate for such a public forum. Yeah. I wish I had stuck to my initial stance of not going into it. They're in Ontario, Hornblower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jillian Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 No I wouldn't do it, no way in he-ll would I be doing that (the meeting). I would think the stress for you, your husband, your family and all that would be not good for you or your family. You shouldn't EVER feel bad for cutting them off and telling them to go f*** themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowWhite Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Imp, with Diva at age 11, going on 12 and your eldest at 17, soon to be 18, there is NO WAY I would let them meet your children. It is akin to bringing a food addict into your kitchen when you are putting the finishing touches on your perfectly decorated cake to enter in a contest... there is no way there wouldn't be finger swipes in the frosting. You personally could go visit, particularly if your son is able to be there. To repeat, NO WAY would they meet my other children. At best they are going to say something negative and put bad thoughts into your Diva's mind. At worst, they could try to pull something again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirth Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 Look at what power these people still have over you. They randomly call; your world is turned over. Why don't you have your lawyer meet with them when they arrive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 How does your dh feel about this? Is he ok with you having contact with them? I'm not implying you need his 'permission' but considering what she did with one child it would be a major concern that he might have that would carry a lot of weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwickimom Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 All I have to say is...you are WAY stronger than I'll ever be. I refuse to let MIL see my kids. ever. She has said and done horrible things and I would never ever allow her to meet them. No matter what. Even if she was on her death bed. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornblower Posted June 20, 2010 Share Posted June 20, 2010 They're in Ontario, Hornblower. In Ontario kids don't get to choose who they live with. The parents & judge will decide. http://www.attorneygeneral.jus.gov.on.ca/english/family/wheredoi.asp Also, a non parent who wants to obtain custody has to do it through the courts & the parents are the respondents in the case. There would have been a legal process involved. It's not like people can just swoop in. They would have had a fairly involved legal process to become legal guardians. http://www.attorneygeneral.jus.gov.on.ca/english/family/divorce/custody/non_parent_custody_applications.asp I'm bowing out of this thread. I merely wanted to assure board members that Cdn laws do not allow relatives to just yank your kids & you'd have no recourse. Non custodial abduction is treated seriously here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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