I *thought* I had outsmarted my 2 1/2 yr. old.

[ThelmaLou]

I was wrong.

 

He began climbing out of his crib a little over a week ago. It happens at least once each evening before falling asleep, and 2-3 times during his nap each day.

 

We spank for disobedience. He knows it's wrong. When I walk in the room, he immediately starts crying, "I don't like spankins!" We do it anyway. It's a clear safety issue.

 

So I ordered one of those tent/cabana attachments for his crib. I was so proud of myself when I fastened it on at naptime. He screamed bloody murder at first, but finally calmed down. Naptime concluded, and no escape.

 

Tonight, about five minutes after bedtime, my 10 and 8 year old boys (who share a room with aforementioned toddler) came running into the living room to declare that their brother was removing the tent. By the time I got there, he'd snapped 4 of the 12 clips upward and was working on the next one. Again, my mere presence in the room was enough for him to bellow, "I don't like spankins!" He knew it was wrong. I spanked and put him back, fastening the clips once more.

 

I'm open for suggestions. For those who don't spank, please don't suggest that I lay off the punishment. For those who do spank, don't worry, it's a thorough and robust spanking:tongue_smilie:. Been there and done that with four older boys. But this little guy's really something else.

 

How can I keep him contained? He shares a room with two brothers, so when he gets out, I find him (quietly) rummaging through their stuff. He's into *everything* around the house, and he's just not mature enough to be in a big boy bed. I'm afraid he's going to climb his brothers' bunk bed and get hurt. (The ladder can't be removed.) Also, when I go to bed at night, he's often still awake in his crib. He really would be the kind of boy to wander the house at night, or even walk out the door and down the street. Thank goodness we keep the house alarm set at night. Even so, I had to stay awake reading in bed last night and go check on him to make sure he was asleep before I felt I could doze off.

 

Any other devices to keep him in one spot? I do keep the baby monitor on so I can hear him, but he's almost completely silent. And with the noise of 4 other boys in the house, you'd hardly notice any sounds, even if you're listening. I thought about a video monitor, perhaps, so I can *see* what he's doing behind closed doors. Thoughts?

[4kiddies]

Well this won't help you inside the room but friends of mine put one of the doorknob things that you have to squeeze and turn at the same time on the inside of the door so their child couldn't get out of the room and wander the house.

[Lovedtodeath]

I'm open for suggestions. For those who don't spank, please don't suggest that I lay off the punishment. For those who do spank, don't worry, it's a thorough and robust spanking:tongue_smilie:. Been there and done that with four older boys. But this little guy's really something else.

:lol: You covered all bases!

 

Are you expecting him to sleep too much? My first suggestion would be less naps and an earlier wake time.

[ThelmaLou]

:lol: You covered all bases!

 

Are you expecting him to sleep too much? My first suggestion would be less naps and an earlier wake time.

 

Yes, I've considered no nap. But I feel like I really need that time with him down. (Would help if he were really down, though, wouldn't it?) My older boys carried "naptime" into their late elementary years. Kinda like SWB. They would each be in separate rooms of the house, reading, doing legos, listening to audio books. I'm able to accomplish so much during the time that he's resting, even if he's not asleep. But the key is keeping him in there. I don't know that he truly needs the sleep anymore, but I still need the reprieve. He's a very high maintenance fellow when he's up and around. Not to mention when he's pulling his stealth escape stunts.

[ThelmaLou]

Well this won't help you inside the room but friends of mine put one of the doorknob things that you have to squeeze and turn at the same time on the inside of the door so their child couldn't get out of the room and wander the house.

 

Yes, that's a possiblity during nap time, at least. I wouldn't do it at night, though, because his older brothers would have a cow if I closed their bedroom door. It creeps them out to be in the dark behind a closed door.:scared:

[EarleneW]

I think it's probably time for a bed.

[Lovedtodeath]

Do you think he could get out of a play yard? (I don't think I could...) http://www.thenewparentsguide.com/baby-playards-cribs-1.htm There are a bunch of examples here, maybe some are taller.

 

I put Jake's mattress on the floor b/c of him falling out of bed. He is usually loud when awake and we have the doorknob covers.

[Suzanne in ABQ]

Yes, I've considered no nap. But I feel like I really need that time with him down. (Would help if he were really down, though, wouldn't it?) My older boys carried "naptime" into their late elementary years. Kinda like SWB. They would each be in separate rooms of the house, reading, doing legos, listening to audio books. I'm able to accomplish so much during the time that he's resting, even if he's not asleep. But the key is keeping him in there. I don't know that he truly needs the sleep anymore, but I still need the reprieve. He's a very high maintenance fellow when he's up and around. Not to mention when he's pulling his stealth escape stunts.

 

 

I can relate to this. I REALLY wanted dd to take naps, or have "quiet time" until she was at LEAST 6yo (or 8, or 10!). :) But, the reality was that she was destroying something every naptime (a book, a toy, the wall, the bedding, whatever). She clearly wasn't sleepy, or restful (though she *was* quiet!). LOL. Anyway, I had to bring myself to accept that naps were a thing of the past. I had to figure out ways to get things done with her awake (or put them off till bedtime). Naps went bye-bye at 2yo.

 

Then, when she started climbing out of the crib, the crib rail went down, and a chair went next to the crib so she could climb in and out without falling. Interestingly, the freedom made the conquest much less enticing. She was only in the room at night, when her siblings were also there. She didn't get into their stuff with them there, and she didn't sneak into it during the day. She grew up when we stopped treating her like a baby. Not saying this would surely work with your ds, but it worked for us.

 

Incidentally, when my ds was that age, I had him in a toddler bed at night, with the door open, but a gate across the doorway to keep him from wandering around at night. Would that work?

[SonshineLearner]

When I mentioned that I loved tents, one lady on another list I was on mentioned that her son had strangled in one of those. I could probably "beat" my son and he wouldn't take a nap. He stopped right at 2. My daughter, on the other hand, took naps until kindergarten. BUT, she was in school. Busy... Have you looked at how much physical activity he gets? At almost 6, I have just started rest times. I need him to be able to "take a rest". I set a timer that he can see. I would say to try a one hour rest time. In his room, reading books or quiet things on his bed or on his floor. Cds in the cd player...quiet things.

 

I really came to the conclusion that 12 hrs of sleep at night...is enough for him.

 

Sorry:-(

Carrie

[Suzanne in ABQ]

Yes, that's a possiblity during nap time, at least. I wouldn't do it at night, though, because his older brothers would have a cow if I closed their bedroom door. It creeps them out to be in the dark behind a closed door.:scared:

 

 

How about keeping the door open, and using a gate to keep him from wandering around.

[Pamela H in Texas]

Seriously, I think you'll find that you have less issue if you just put him in a bed.

 

You might, temporarily, need to sit outside the door and go in and discipline if he gets out of bed. So you get less rest time yourself for a time but then more eventually.

 

And I'd seriously consider learning to discipline THIS child. Spankings work well enough for lots of kids (though there are better options). But they obviously don't help this child make better choices. Why keep doing something that isn't even working? Why not just learn better discipline?

[Amber in AUS]

Yes, I would do the hard yards for a week or so and put him in a bed. If that doesn't work then bye bye nap. My DD gave up naps at 18m, DS at 2 and littlest DD is still napping in a big bed.

[gandpsmommy]

I have to agree with Pamela. I know this isn't what you want to hear, but obviously the spanking isn't working, so even if you believe in spanking (I don't), it seems that it would be logical to try something else. I'm wondering if it seems like a power struggle to you, that you must win so that he will know who is in charge and will submit to your authority? To me it seems like a toddler who has learned a fun skill and doesn't have the cognitive ability yet to understand why it's not okay. Obviously the spanking is not keeping him from trying to get out, it's just making him upset when you enter the room. I honestly wonder if he even connects it to the crib-escaping at all?

 

I understand the dilemma: it appears that he hasn't developed the impulse control (to stay out of his brothers' belongings, to stay in bed, etc.) for you to feel safe having him in a regular bed, but he has outgrown the usefulness and safety of a crib. Have you considered putting a mattress on the floor beside your bed for him to sleep on? That way you would know he was asleep before you go to bed and you wouldn't have to worry about what he was doing at night (assuming you are a light enough sleeper that you would awaken if he started to get out of bed while in the same room as you.) We kept our kids in our room with us (in our bed, actually, but I know that is not a desirable option for everyone) at this age. And when they were mature enough to handle it, they transitioned very easily to sleeping in their own rooms.

 

If you don't want the mattress in your room, I would suggest what a few other already have: put him in a regular bed or mattress on the floor and just realize that for the first few weeks you will have to stay close by at bedtime to make sure he learns to stay in it. Is he the kind of child who would enjoy being read to or sung to at bedtime? Would he stay in the bed if it meant he would get a few minutes of mom or dad rubbing his back or telling him a story? Or is he the active type who would have to literally be held down to lie still and go to sleep?

 

I know that it's tiring having small children. I only have two kids, who are both well past the toddler stage, but I remember how frustrating it could be at times (especially at night when you are just exhausted and really need some rest yourself!) I think, though, that instead of spanking him to try to make the safety issues his responsibility (which isn't working anyway), you have to realize that his safety is your responsibility. And it sounds to me as if the tent is not a very safe option if he can get it unclipped. As someone else mentioned that could quickly become a strangulation hazard.

 

Also, you might want to think twice before using the squeeze-and-turn doorknob for the interior of the room. I see it as a safety issue as well. In the event of a fire it could make it much more difficult for the children to get out of the room. Even if your older boys are completely capable of opening it during times of normalcy, I would worry about what could happen in the tragic possibility of panic. You might also want to check on the laws in your area. I know in some places anything that would impede a child from getting safely out of a room in the event of a fire or emergency (lock on the outside of the door, etc.) is illegal.

 

I hope that you can hear the empathy in my post. I remember many a weary night of trying to get toddlers to sleep so that I could rest as well. And even though I don't share your philosophy of punishment, I don't want to come across as judgmental. I sincerely hope you come up with a solution that will allow you all to get some rest. Best wishes.

[ThelmaLou]

Do you think he could get out of a play yard? (I don't think I could...) http://www.thenewparentsguide.com/baby-playards-cribs-1.htm There are a bunch of examples here, maybe some are taller.

 

I put Jake's mattress on the floor b/c of him falling out of bed. He is usually loud when awake and we have the doorknob covers.

 

Yes, that's what he already sleeps in. We don't even have room for a full size crib because the room they all share is pretty small. He's in a Graco.

[Carrie12345]

Yes, that's what he already sleeps in. We don't even have room for a full size crib because the room they all share is pretty small. He's in a Graco.

 

My 2yo has been getting out of his for quite a while now. We've given up the nap fight. It just isn't worth it! Most days, he'll eventually pass out on the couch or living room floor for a couple of hours as long as we have an active day. That's usually enough to give me a decent break. Also, because he falls asleep amidst chaos, I don't have to worry about his sisters and brothers waking him by being too loud.

 

That hasn't solved our night-time problem, but it's much easier to deal with when it's only once a day!

[MamaT]

I also think it's time for a bed. It may be extra work at first to train him to stay in it, but it sounds like that's what he needs.

[Rebecca VA]

My daughter was very active and wild as a toddler. I turned her room into a playroom, complete with a large Little Tikes plastic slide, a Little Tikes picnic table, books (she never looked at them), etc. I would have put a small climbing wall in there if I'd been able to find one, as well as a wall covering that she could have drawn on with markers. There was a gate on the door so that she couldn't get out. It was a really fun playroom, and it gave her something to do during naptimes and when I was homeschooling her older brother.

[ThelmaLou]

couldn't figure out how to multi-quote, but in response to gandpsmommy:

 

"obviously the spanking isn't working, so even if you believe in spanking (I don't), it seems that it would be logical to try something else. I'm wondering if it seems like a power struggle to you, that you must win so that he will know who is in charge and will submit to your authority?"

 

What makes this an obvious conclusion ("obviously the spanking isn't working")? The fact that the spankings have thus far not prevented him from climbing out of the crib does not lead me to any "logical" conclusion other than the fact that he's persistent and has not yet decided to change his behavior. I don't believe spanking is the answer for every single situation. But like any other method (sitting outside his door, placing him back in bed repeatedly, taking away privileges, praising him for good behavior) I'd love to find the parent for whom any of these things always work the first time. It's only been a little over a week.

 

DS #4 intentionally placed his hand on a burner at the age of 5. He did this three times over the course of a few weeks and burned his hand each time. According to him, he wanted to see if it was hot. He found out...3 times in a row. For the life of me, I don't know why he didn't change his behavior after the first time. He was persistent, but he eventually learned to avoid the negative, natural consequences of his action.

 

Those of us who spank don't expect perfect behavior after the first punishment any more than those who don't spank. But we (at least I) believe that it's biblical when administered in a firm but loving way, not in anger. I believe and have evidence that it bears fruit in some children sooner than others, based on the behavior of my 4 older children.

 

Regarding the power struggle, I can definitely say it gives me no positive mental or emotional strokes to win a battle with a 2 year old. I can equally say that I believe it's wrong for the tail to wag the dog. Do I want him, as you mentioned, to know who's in charge and to submit to authority? Aboslutely. We all live under some degree of authority. It's no different for a two year old. As a Christian, my husband is the head of our house. And he and I both submit to God's authority. And God has ordained parents as the authority over children. It's a benevolent dictatorship. I mean that in the nicest possible way, but I don't know how to apologize for a home where, as you say, "he will know who is in charge and will submit to your authority."

 

"Is he the kind of child who would enjoy being read to or sung to at bedtime? Would he stay in the bed if it meant he would get a few minutes of mom or dad rubbing his back or telling him a story?"

 

This is, indeed, a good reminder. Yes, he gets read and sung to every night. He doesn't cry when we leave. He just gets out of bed within 10 minutes.

 

"instead of spanking him to try to make the safety issues his responsibility (which isn't working anyway), you have to realize that his safety is your responsibility."

 

I'm spanking him to try to make the safety issues his responsibility? What? "You have to realize that his safety is your responsibility"...did I say something to make you think I don't already operate under this assumption?

 

 

"I hope that you can hear the empathy in my post. I remember many a weary night of trying to get toddlers to sleep so that I could rest as well. And even though I don't share your philosophy of punishment, I don't want to come across as judgmental. I sincerely hope you come up with a solution that will allow you all to get some rest. Best wishes."

 

I don't think your post is void of empathy, but I'm honestly baffled that by spanking my child, I come across as someone on a power trip who's pushing responsibility for my son's safety off on him and thus shirking my own responsibility.

 

I honestly tried really hard in my original post to avoid a discussion on spanking. I'm a little perplexed that a couple of people chose to hone in on that anyhow.:001_huh:

 

I appreciate all ideas and suggestions from the hive regarding mattresses, gates, giving up naptime, using the bedroom as a playroom, safety devices, and other various approaches. I'm sure some combination of all of this will do the trick at some point. Gandpsmommy, I do believe you empathize and I'm appreciative in that regard. Thanks to all of you for your tips. Wish me luck!

Edited July 1, 2009 by ThelmaLou

[Rhonda in TX]

He could really hurt himself climbing out of his crib, plus you would still have the concerns (bunk beds, etc.) you do now. Figure out a way to make the room safe and put him in a bed.

 

I took both of my kids out of their cribs at about that age because it just wasn't safe for them anymore. It was rough, but we made it through.

[JFSinIL]

I had my twins, for a while, napping in sleepers. I had cut the feet off (sleepers, not kids ;)) so I could stick each kid in his sleeper with the zipper in the back and unreachable. Plus - I had taken very strong string and SEWN THE LEGS TOGETHER at the knee. The kids could not left their legs to get out of the crib!

[ThelmaLou]

I had my twins, for a while, napping in sleepers. I had cut the feet off (sleepers, not kids ;)) so I could stick each kid in his sleeper with the zipper in the back and unreachable. Plus - I had taken very strong string and SEWN THE LEGS TOGETHER at the knee. The kids could not left their legs to get out of the crib!

 

Brilliant. They'll enjoy that story when they get older.:)

[ThelmaLou]

He could really hurt himself climbing out of his crib, plus you would still have the concerns (bunk beds, etc.) you do now. Figure out a way to make the room safe and put him in a bed.

 

I took both of my kids out of their cribs at about that age because it just wasn't safe for them anymore. It was rough, but we made it through.

 

Yes, I need to figure out how to make the room safe. I'm in an odd situation right now, in that I can't make a lot of modifications to our current house. We're closing on the sale of this house in a week and a half, but not moving into our new house until the first of August. Hoping the extra space will help me get more creative with ideas. In the meantime, I'm thinking a video monitor might at least let me see (during the day and before he falls asleep at night) when the little guy is making his escape. Maybe if success continues to elude him, he'll give up.

[amy g.]

None of my first 3 ever climbed out of the crib, but Miss Bossy sure did. We put the crib up, and put a twin mattress on the floor for her. I made her a pretty horse blanket for a bed spread.

 

I let her give up naps which is hard on everyone, but I prefer it to the possibility of her getting hurt. We have to really work to keep her awake from about 6:00pm on. I usually take her swimming in the evenings ti help tire her out.

 

When it is time for her to sleep, my 14 year old gets in the twin bed with her and reads books and tells her stories. They usually sleep together all night. Yes, this cuts down what we can accomplish in a day, but she won't be little forever, and we can all hope that the new baby will be more calm and complacent.

[Irene Lynn]

I was wrong.

 

He began climbing out of his crib a little over a week ago. It happens at least once each evening before falling asleep, and 2-3 times during his nap each day.

 

We spank for disobedience. He knows it's wrong. When I walk in the room, he immediately starts crying, "I don't like spankins!" We do it anyway. It's a clear safety issue.

 

So I ordered one of those tent/cabana attachments for his crib. I was so proud of myself when I fastened it on at naptime. He screamed bloody murder at first, but finally calmed down. Naptime concluded, and no escape.

 

Tonight, about five minutes after bedtime, my 10 and 8 year old boys (who share a room with aforementioned toddler) came running into the living room to declare that their brother was removing the tent. By the time I got there, he'd snapped 4 of the 12 clips upward and was working on the next one. Again, my mere presence in the room was enough for him to bellow, "I don't like spankins!" He knew it was wrong. I spanked and put him back, fastening the clips once more.

 

I'm open for suggestions. For those who don't spank, please don't suggest that I lay off the punishment. For those who do spank, don't worry, it's a thorough and robust spanking:tongue_smilie:. Been there and done that with four older boys. But this little guy's really something else.

 

How can I keep him contained? He shares a room with two brothers, so when he gets out, I find him (quietly) rummaging through their stuff. He's into *everything* around the house, and he's just not mature enough to be in a big boy bed. I'm afraid he's going to climb his brothers' bunk bed and get hurt. (The ladder can't be removed.) Also, when I go to bed at night, he's often still awake in his crib. He really would be the kind of boy to wander the house at night, or even walk out the door and down the street. Thank goodness we keep the house alarm set at night. Even so, I had to stay awake reading in bed last night and go check on him to make sure he was asleep before I felt I could doze off.

 

Any other devices to keep him in one spot? I do keep the baby monitor on so I can hear him, but he's almost completely silent. And with the noise of 4 other boys in the house, you'd hardly notice any sounds, even if you're listening. I thought about a video monitor, perhaps, so I can *see* what he's doing behind closed doors. Thoughts?

 

Our son will be 2.5 in another month, but first, let me say that I am nearly jealous that you have had naps and that your son has stayed in a crib this long! Our dd was just very obedient and I required obedience pretty much first time obedience. Our son is very strong willed. As much as I believe in spanking, I have to be careful about the times I use it with him and I will tell you why. Teaching a strong willed child that they must obey because I am stronger than them or can outwit them is a set up for future battles. Working my tail off to get him to obey from within and working hard to build a bond of trust and love is essential for my son. I am convinced that he rarely looks at things in terms of obedience, though he hears about it A LOT. He seems to look at things in light of what the consequences will be rather than the heart issue of obedience. Our dd was COMPLETELY different. She had an internal desire to please those in her environment. Our son's primary motivation seems to be pleasing himself first and foremost. He is a pretty good kid, but I have worked HARD to develop trust, to let him know that I am on his side. He loves to help and can be very kind. He even likes to put things in their proper place a lot of the time. He can also throw a FIT! He is doing much better with that, but he has had some long scream it out episodes. After he is done with the fit he is ready to listen and cooperate. If I were to spank, when he is upset, it only escalates things. I have found that keeping him close and providing as many positive alternatives is far better than spanking. Lately, I have found that having to apologize for the pain he inflicted on others seems to affect his heart more. It requires him to take responsibility. Sometimes it is really hard for him to do. Oddly enough, I am a proponent of spanking, but I would have to spank the daylights out of our little guy to get him to behave with this approach. I have actually found that fewer spankings and using other techniques has been more effective.

 

Having said all of that, let me tell you a little about my experience as a child. My son takes after me. LOL I climbed out of bed over and over and over. Each time, I got spanked and put back in bed. Finally, my parents say that I was cowering against the wall trembling and weak, but still out of bed and they were not sure where child abuse started. In my opinion they crossed the line several times during my childhood because they were so intent on breaking my will, they couldn't see what was happening until it was too late. Anyway, they found an unused door and tied it on the top of my crib to keep me in it. What did this teach me? It taught me that they could "win" through brute force, but they couldn't break me. This just increased my determination to do "better"(at beating them) next time. It did not end pretty in the teen years.

 

Our son has his own room, so we haven't had the issues that you are talking about with the older brothers. We do keep one of those knobs on the outside of his big sister's room so he can't get in there. I don't know what you do for a bedtime routine, but that is a good time to have bonding moments. I try to recap the good parts of the day and let our son know how much I love him. I really try to let him hear that I do notice the positive in him, especially on those days that have been more trying to both of us. I read and sing to him. Also, in our son's case, I would not dare to put him to bed when he is not tired. It isn't worth it. I am influenced by my own experience here. I HATED to lie in bed for an hour every night before I went to sleep. Trying to get my son to do that, when he doesn't even have much control or understanding is a battle that none of us would benefit from. What is my goal anyway? I want him to get rest. I really, really love my alone time. I don't get much, so I am protective of it, but trying to keep a kid in bed doesn't give me any more alone time anyway. Our son often takes a nap, but not in his bed. He may fall asleep on the couch or on the floor or in the car. If I were to try to put him in bed he would probably wake up more. On occasion, I do put him to bed and read to him for a little bit, when I can tell he is really tired and won't be able to fall asleep downstairs. Some days he does not get a nap at all. He never goes to bed any earlier, but he usually falls asleep faster, when he does go to bed. I have also found that our son can relax faster (and settle down during a fit faster), when he is holding my hand.

 

If it were our particular son going through his brother's things, I would do what it took to make the drawers or anything else inaccesible. I don't think that battle would be effective with our son at this age. If you knew me and our dd, you would know that this would not have been my thought before our son. I was sure that it was a matter of obedience training. I still see it as a matter of training, but the type of training is different. His motivations are just plain different. I try to keep his opportunities to get into trouble minimized. Don't worry, he still has plenty of those ample for teaching self control and thinking of others, etc. Then I try to direct as much positive energy as possible. He loves to help, so I fix food that he can help stir or dump in items or I will ask him to put something in the trash or load the dryer as I hand him things. He always get the jelly out of the fridge for his peanut butter sandwiches. I have taught him how to do things the right way rather than fight with him to get him to stop. Because I tend to do this, he is better able to deal with the things that I just say NO! about. I try to follow a "No." with another option.

 

He is taking longer to train, but I see so much wonderful potential in the little guy it is going to be SO worth the effort. He does get little swats throughout the day, but they are rarely hard. He has a chair to sit in for whining and fussing or outright fits. He often chooses to stop fussing, when I calmly tell him to sit in the chair, because that is the place for fussing. He doesn't want to have to bother with going there. In other words, I have not outlawed fits, or whining. I have just created a "proper place" for that behavior. He is not allowed to get off the chair if he still wants to continue the fit, but I have found as time has gone on, that he will often welcome me to come sit next to him and hold his hand after his initial fuss or fit. This helps him calm down so much faster and lets him know that he is loved. I do not coddle the fit AT ALL, but I do offer love, when he is ready to have his tank filled. He is learning to gain control faster and his heart is softening. It would not be hard for me to harden his little heart either. It is a moment by moment thing to determine what he really needs. Our dd was much, much, much easier in this department. Each child is so different and each home is run differently, so I would just encourage you to sit down and assess what the goals are, how much he really understands, where his heart is, and what things are working and what aren't.

 

I wish you well and hope you find something that works well for your family.

[Lovedtodeath]

Yes, that's what he already sleeps in. We don't even have room for a full size crib because the room they all share is pretty small. He's in a Graco.

Not a play pen.... a play yard.

 

I suggest you look at the Baby Whisperer. She has a lot of good tips for getting toddlers to cooperate with sleep times. She has a book just for toddlers. There is a baby whisperer forum that has helped me more than once.

[Pamela H in Texas]

Thelma,

 

The discussion wasn't really about how horrible spanking was. It was simply that it wasn't deterring your ds so why use it, at least in this situation? It is possible if you tried other discipline (btw, even more supported by the scriptures) that he would come along more quickly. But even if he didn't. If it takes 50 times of SOMETHING, then wouldn't it be NICE if it wasn't 50 times of episodes of you hitting him?

 

A LOT of times things don't work in ONE time. I'll give you that. I do try to extinguish behavior though. I would not let him actually get to the point of out doing dangerous or destructive things even each time he got out for a week. Toddler behavior DOES go away more quickly if they aren't actually getting to follow through all the way.

 

Does that make sense? Hmmmm, maybe not...What I'm saying is that by taking the time and effort to catch him "in the act" (possibly the rule could be not to even sit or stand up which is what *I* would have the rule), then you can stop the further behavior (messing with stuff, getting in dangerous situations, etc) altogether. It's not NEARLY as much of a thrill to TRY to stand up as it is to actually mess with things for 30 seconds. So he's much less likely to go 50 times (spanking or not) for standing up.

 

Hopefully THAT makes more sense :)

[EKS]

There are tents that have complex Velcro arrangements that are unlikely to be undone by a 2 yo. We used one of these for my son until he was 3.

[FO4UR]

Well, the crib is not containing him - time for a big boy bed! (or just matress on the floor)

 

Then, continue with training him to stay in bed at bed/nap time. I think the climbing is fun....... Plus, if you are going through all of this now, you might as well make the switch while you are at it.

 

My youngest did this to me young - before he was 2yo:001_huh: I basically sat by his bedside for a week or two, training him to stay in his bed when he was told. Then I sat by the door....then I busied myself in the hallway...

 

Another option is sitting beside his crib and correcting him before he can climb. Either way.....I think it's going to take mom or dad correcting before he can actually get out of bed. Maybe move bedtime story location to right beside his bed, and he might fall asleep while you are reading......(never works for me, but it's worth a shot LOL)

[Colleen in SEVA]

For those who don't spank, please don't suggest that I lay off the punishment. For those who do spank, don't worry, it's a thorough and robust spanking:tongue_smilie:.

 

FWIW, (since this is SWB's forum I think it is ok to share this) at the WTM conference in May, Jessie Wise shared that she spanked her kids for climbing out of the crib. Her husband had seen many incidents of children in the ER with serious injuries from falling out of the crib, and from accidents while wandering around the house during the night unsupervised. Because of this, she kept her kids in cribs for as long as possible and when the child did climb out she administered a siwft, firm punishment (there were gasps from half the audience when she shared this, and the other half was nodding in agreement :lol: ).

Edited July 1, 2009 by Colleen in SEVA

[ekarl2]

I had my twins, for a while, napping in sleepers. I had cut the feet off (sleepers, not kids ;)) so I could stick each kid in his sleeper with the zipper in the back and unreachable. Plus - I had taken very strong string and SEWN THE LEGS TOGETHER at the knee. The kids could not left their legs to get out of the crib!

 

My son is 17 months old and climbed out of his crib at naptime a few weeks ago. He wears a sleep sack at night, but he wasn't during the day. Putting him in a sleep sack that was "just" big/long enough did the trick. It's comfy and keeps him from being able to lift his leg over the side of his crib. You can put it on backwards if you need to. Here's a link to toddler size:

http://www.onestepahead.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=535415&parentCategoryId=85179&categoryId=86181

 

The infant sizes cover the feet, too. If your ds is smallish, you may want to get an infant size (you can buy the infant sizes at babies r us, too.) The XL infant size is quite roomy for my ds, and he's a big boy. That's why he wears the medium one during naps, it allows him to stretch out, but doesn't give him any extra room to crawl out.

 

The other option is a bed. My dd (who gave up naps at 2) went to a bed at 23 months.

 

Blessings!

[ekarl2]

Our son will be 2.5 in another month, but first, let me say that I am nearly jealous that you have had naps and that your son has stayed in a crib this long! Our dd was just very obedient and I required obedience pretty much first time obedience. Our son is very strong willed. As much as I believe in spanking, I have to be careful about the times I use it with him and I will tell you why. Teaching a strong willed child that they must obey because I am stronger than them or can outwit them is a set up for future battles. Working my tail off to get him to obey from within and working hard to build a bond of trust and love is essential for my son. I am convinced that he rarely looks at things in terms of obedience, though he hears about it A LOT. He seems to look at things in light of what the consequences will be rather than the heart issue of obedience. Our dd was COMPLETELY different. She had an internal desire to please those in her environment. Our son's primary motivation seems to be pleasing himself first and foremost. He is a pretty good kid, but I have worked HARD to develop trust, to let him know that I am on his side. He loves to help and can be very kind. He even likes to put things in their proper place a lot of the time. He can also throw a FIT! He is doing much better with that, but he has had some long scream it out episodes. After he is done with the fit he is ready to listen and cooperate. If I were to spank, when he is upset, it only escalates things. I have found that keeping him close and providing as many positive alternatives is far better than spanking. Lately, I have found that having to apologize for the pain he inflicted on others seems to affect his heart more. It requires him to take responsibility. Sometimes it is really hard for him to do. Oddly enough, I am a proponent of spanking, but I would have to spank the daylights out of our little guy to get him to behave with this approach. I have actually found that fewer spankings and using other techniques has been more effective.

 

Having said all of that, let me tell you a little about my experience as a child. My son takes after me. LOL I climbed out of bed over and over and over. Each time, I got spanked and put back in bed. Finally, my parents say that I was cowering against the wall trembling and weak, but still out of bed and they were not sure where child abuse started. In my opinion they crossed the line several times during my childhood because they were so intent on breaking my will, they couldn't see what was happening until it was too late. Anyway, they found an unused door and tied it on the top of my crib to keep me in it. What did this teach me? It taught me that they could "win" through brute force, but they couldn't break me. This just increased my determination to do "better"(at beating them) next time. It did not end pretty in the teen years.

 

Our son has his own room, so we haven't had the issues that you are talking about with the older brothers. We do keep one of those knobs on the outside of his big sister's room so he can't get in there. I don't know what you do for a bedtime routine, but that is a good time to have bonding moments. I try to recap the good parts of the day and let our son know how much I love him. I really try to let him hear that I do notice the positive in him, especially on those days that have been more trying to both of us. I read and sing to him. Also, in our son's case, I would not dare to put him to bed when he is not tired. It isn't worth it. I am influenced by my own experience here. I HATED to lie in bed for an hour every night before I went to sleep. Trying to get my son to do that, when he doesn't even have much control or understanding is a battle that none of us would benefit from. What is my goal anyway? I want him to get rest. I really, really love my alone time. I don't get much, so I am protective of it, but trying to keep a kid in bed doesn't give me any more alone time anyway. Our son often takes a nap, but not in his bed. He may fall asleep on the couch or on the floor or in the car. If I were to try to put him in bed he would probably wake up more. On occasion, I do put him to bed and read to him for a little bit, when I can tell he is really tired and won't be able to fall asleep downstairs. Some days he does not get a nap at all. He never goes to bed any earlier, but he usually falls asleep faster, when he does go to bed. I have also found that our son can relax faster (and settle down during a fit faster), when he is holding my hand.

 

If it were our particular son going through his brother's things, I would do what it took to make the drawers or anything else inaccesible. I don't think that battle would be effective with our son at this age. If you knew me and our dd, you would know that this would not have been my thought before our son. I was sure that it was a matter of obedience training. I still see it as a matter of training, but the type of training is different. His motivations are just plain different. I try to keep his opportunities to get into trouble minimized. Don't worry, he still has plenty of those ample for teaching self control and thinking of others, etc. Then I try to direct as much positive energy as possible. He loves to help, so I fix food that he can help stir or dump in items or I will ask him to put something in the trash or load the dryer as I hand him things. He always get the jelly out of the fridge for his peanut butter sandwiches. I have taught him how to do things the right way rather than fight with him to get him to stop. Because I tend to do this, he is better able to deal with the things that I just say NO! about. I try to follow a "No." with another option.

 

He is taking longer to train, but I see so much wonderful potential in the little guy it is going to be SO worth the effort. He does get little swats throughout the day, but they are rarely hard. He has a chair to sit in for whining and fussing or outright fits. He often chooses to stop fussing, when I calmly tell him to sit in the chair, because that is the place for fussing. He doesn't want to have to bother with going there. In other words, I have not outlawed fits, or whining. I have just created a "proper place" for that behavior. He is not allowed to get off the chair if he still wants to continue the fit, but I have found as time has gone on, that he will often welcome me to come sit next to him and hold his hand after his initial fuss or fit. This helps him calm down so much faster and lets him know that he is loved. I do not coddle the fit AT ALL, but I do offer love, when he is ready to have his tank filled. He is learning to gain control faster and his heart is softening. It would not be hard for me to harden his little heart either. It is a moment by moment thing to determine what he really needs. Our dd was much, much, much easier in this department. Each child is so different and each home is run differently, so I would just encourage you to sit down and assess what the goals are, how much he really understands, where his heart is, and what things are working and what aren't.

 

I wish you well and hope you find something that works well for your family.

 

 

Your ds is SO like mine, I think. Thank you for your post; it was very helpful!

[ThelmaLou]

Not a play pen.... a play yard.

 

I suggest you look at the Baby Whisperer. She has a lot of good tips for getting toddlers to cooperate with sleep times. She has a book just for toddlers. There is a baby whisperer forum that has helped me more than once.

 

Forgive me if I misunderstood the difference. The original link you gave me had an item at the very top that's labeled a "play yard" and it looks just like a Graco pack 'n play, which is what my son sleeps in. If you're speaking of one of the larger paneled gate type items, then I misunderstood. We did have a Superyard XT, but that is easily knocked over, even with 6 panels. It would have been suitable for containing a crawler, but not a toddler. Can you clarify exactly which item you were suggesting? Thanks!:)

[ThelmaLou]

FWIW, (since this is SWB's forum I think it is ok to share this) at the WTM conference in May, Jessie Wise shared that she spanked her kids for climbing out of the crib. Her husband had seen many incidents of children in the ER with serious injuries from falling out of the crib, and from accidents while wandering around the house during the night unsupervised. Because of this, she kept her kids in cribs for as long as possible and when the child did climb out she administered a siwft, firm punishment (there were gasps from half the audience when she shared this, and the other half was nodding in agreement :lol: ).

 

So Jesse's one of *those* people, too, eh? I think we'd get along famously.:thumbup1: Thanks for this example!

[AndyJoy]

I don't have kids yet, but from personal experience I would recommend a mattress on the floor if he's determined to get out. I climbed out of my crib at 18 mo. and broke my arm. Not much fun for me or my 5 mo. pregnant mother! You can still discipline for getting out of bed, but you won't have to worry about broken bones or strangulation.

[Pink Fairy]

Thelma, I had the same problem with my now 2 yods, and I was going to buy a tent for his playpen (just like yours), but I changed my mind when I read these reviews on Amazon. I'm not one to overreact, but if your son is already undoing some of the clips, I think this could truly be a real concern for you. Here's the Amazon link, and the two reviews I'm referring to (they are fairly recent reviews).

 

By Rosemary E. Lewis (Ann Arbor Michigan) - See all my reviews

My son was getting out of his crib. I have to wait a week until I get the crib tent but found the pack n play tent at a store. I got it thinking I could use it at the pool and use it until I got the one for the crib a in week. With in one day my son could unclip the clips so he could climb out on what ever side he had unclipped or he would just unclip them all. One time when he did only unclip one side his head got stuck as he was trying to get out and he was just hanging there. Thank God I walked in when I did. I am very sad because I am a single mom and I do not sleep because he is getting out out bed all night long and will not take naps now. Maybe the one for the crib will work better. I just hope it does not have the clips and they use something else to hold it on. If anyone has used the one for the crib please let me know if they still use clips with that one as well. Thanks

Rosemary Ann Arbor MI

 

 

By Worried MotherPlease do not buy this product. On December 27th, a 2 year old died due to this tent - see for yourself in the local Harvard newspaper (we read about it in Boston and were horrified because we used to use the same tent).

http://www.wickedlocal.com/harvard/news/x1621227222/Toddler-dies-from-accidental-strangulation

The plastic clips do not safely adhere to the pack n play and your child could strangle him/herself between the bar and the netting.

Please, this story is so tragic, please do not use this product.

For the life of me I can not understand why it has not been recalled yet!

[ThelmaLou]

I don't have kids yet, but from personal experience I would recommend a mattress on the floor if he's determined to get out. I climbed out of my crib at 18 mo. and broke my arm. Not much fun for me or my 5 mo. pregnant mother! You can still discipline for getting out of bed, but you won't have to worry about broken bones or strangulation.

 

Yes, I may have to resort to a mattress for safety reasons. I'm still not willing to give up nap time, even if he only rests quietly or listens to books on tape.

[ThelmaLou]

Thelma, I had the same problem with my now 2 yods, and I was going to buy a tent for his playpen (just like yours), but I changed my mind when I read these reviews on Amazon. I'm not one to overreact, but if your son is already undoing some of the clips, I think this could truly be a real concern for you. Here's the Amazon link, and the two reviews I'm referring to (they are fairly recent reviews).

 

By Rosemary E. Lewis (Ann Arbor Michigan) - See all my reviews

My son was getting out of his crib. I have to wait a week until I get the crib tent but found the pack n play tent at a store. I got it thinking I could use it at the pool and use it until I got the one for the crib a in week. With in one day my son could unclip the clips so he could climb out on what ever side he had unclipped or he would just unclip them all. One time when he did only unclip one side his head got stuck as he was trying to get out and he was just hanging there. Thank God I walked in when I did. I am very sad because I am a single mom and I do not sleep because he is getting out out bed all night long and will not take naps now. Maybe the one for the crib will work better. I just hope it does not have the clips and they use something else to hold it on. If anyone has used the one for the crib please let me know if they still use clips with that one as well. Thanks

Rosemary Ann Arbor MI

 

 

By Worried MotherPlease do not buy this product. On December 27th, a 2 year old died due to this tent - see for yourself in the local Harvard newspaper (we read about it in Boston and were horrified because we used to use the same tent).

http://www.wickedlocal.com/harvard/news/x1621227222/Toddler-dies-from-accidental-strangulation

The plastic clips do not safely adhere to the pack n play and your child could strangle him/herself between the bar and the netting.

Please, this story is so tragic, please do not use this product.

For the life of me I can not understand why it has not been recalled yet!

 

Oh my! This is alarming. Maybe the tent isn't the answer after all. And here I was all excited that he's fallen asleep at naptime today without attempting to remove the tent. Foiled again.

 

Update: I've just ordered a digital video monitor from Amazon with expedited shipping. When ds gets up from nap, the crib tent comes off, goes back in the box to Amazon for a refund. Hoping the monitor will enable me to see him at all times during his nap. Though I won't be sitting outside his door, I'll know when he's getting into trouble. Not sure yet if I'm going to eliminate the crib altogether or not. I might try the video monitor for the short term to see my watchful eye and quick reaction will curb his escape attempts. I'm not nearly as concerned about an injury climbing out of the pack and play as I would be if it were a full size crib. I'm more concerned still with him climbing the bunk bed or destroying his brothers' things. When we move, I'm leaning toward a full size mattress on the floor. That won't be until the first of August, though. Not sure in the interim if we'll do the Graco or a pallet on the floor.

Edited July 1, 2009 by ThelmaLou

[Ravin]

I'd go with a bed at this point, possibly just a mattress on the floor if you're worrying about him maybe falling out, or with a railing. I'd probably take down any baby gates you have in the house at this point, too. Presumably if he can climb out of the crib, he can climb gates. I'd question the safety of putting a child lock on the doorknob inside his room. It could be a safety issue. Those things are great for keeping a child out of something, such as a bathroom you don't want him in unsupervised or a closet or basement, but preventing a child from being able to escape his room could be a very real hazard.

[ekarl2]

Oh my! This is alarming. Maybe the tent isn't the answer after all. And here I was all excited that he's fallen asleep at naptime today without attempting to remove the tent. Foiled again.

 

Update: I've just ordered a digital video monitor from Amazon with expedited shipping. When ds gets up from nap, the crib tent comes off, goes back in the box to Amazon for a refund. Hoping the monitor will enable me to see him at all times during his nap. Though I won't be sitting outside his door, I'll know when he's getting into trouble. Not sure yet if I'm going to eliminate the crib altogether or not. I might try the video monitor for the short term to see my watchful eye and quick reaction will curb his escape attempts. I'm not nearly as concerned about an injury climbing out of the pack and play as I would be if it were a full size crib. I'm more concerned still with him climbing the bunk bed or destroying his brothers' things. When we move, I'm leaning toward a full size mattress on the floor. That won't be until the first of August, though. Not sure in the interim if we'll do the Graco or a pallet on the floor.

 

I think this is a good plan. I really would look at a sleep sack, too. They have light ones for summertime so they don't get too hot, and it really gives a little more peace of mind to know they can't reach that little leg over the rail to get themselves out. It works like a charm, especially when it's on backward and they can't unzip it.

[kzdaisy]

My dd was the same way. Every one kept telling me to get a bed I did not think I could keep her in it though.Did get the bed after hubby decided we should try it.Well she sleeps in the bed and does not get up at night. I think she felt to confined in the crib.She will stay in the bed though.

[Hedgehogs4]

what about letting him have toys of his choosing in the crib, and letting him know that it's quiet time and he'll have to stay in the crib and sleep, play with his toys, or get a spankin'. that way he chooses a nap, and if he's really not tired he's not forced to sleep, making bedtime that much earlier (a favorite of mine!) :D

[Cedarmom]

Is he getting time outside? When my son was a toddler, he was very active. I would make sure he got at least an hour of outside time running around before nap, then he was ready for a rest. I also let him look at books, or play with some quiet toys ( flannelgraph book, a toddler puzzle)

[Lovedtodeath]

 

what about letting him have toys of his choosing in the crib, and letting him know that it's quiet time and he'll have to stay in the crib and sleep, play with his toys, or get a spankin'. that way he chooses a nap, and if he's really not tired he's not forced to sleep, making bedtime that much earlier (a favorite of mine!) :D

i definitely agree with this. OP said that the main reason for his naps was for her peace of mind and he may not need so much sleep. I would hate to go to bed and just lay or sit there. When I was a child, my bedtime was 8:00. I used to be awake for hours! One time I laid in bed until 3 AM unable to sleep. As adults with insomnia we are told to not lay there, but get up and do something for a time.

[Lovedtodeath]

Forgive me if I misunderstood the difference. The original link you gave me had an item at the very top that's labeled a "play yard" and it looks just like a Graco pack 'n play, which is what my son sleeps in. If you're speaking of one of the larger paneled gate type items, then I misunderstood. We did have a Superyard XT, but that is easily knocked over, even with 6 panels. It would have been suitable for containing a crawler, but not a toddler. Can you clarify exactly which item you were suggesting? Thanks!:)

I didn't know that they could be knocked over so easily. :( I was hoping that one of those on the page would do a better job. My DS takes his naps on my bed. We got rid of the crib a year ago. I just now put the bed back together. He was on a mattress on the floor for a while. We had one of those aquarium crib attachments that plays music and he would play with that until I came to get him. Now he cries and is out of the door and down the stairs within 1 minute!

 

One way for me to get some toddler down time is to let him play the V-smile or the Wii. I also have toys in the garage that are a rare treat to play with (one is a mail box) and a toddler toy that uses game cartridges (Learn Through Music). I bring that out and he is busy for a while. I even put them in the playpen and then he wants in there!

[ThelmaLou]

I think this is a good plan. I really would look at a sleep sack, too. They have light ones for summertime so they don't get too hot, and it really gives a little more peace of mind to know they can't reach that little leg over the rail to get themselves out. It works like a charm, especially when it's on backward and they can't unzip it.

 

O.K, I looked at the toddler sleep sack and now I'm hooked. Almost ordered one online tonight, but I can't get it here fast without paying an arm and leg for shipping. I'll be calling my ToysRUs or Babies R Us tomorrow to see if they have it in store. They do carry it on their website. What a great concept!

[Pamela H in Texas]

Carmen,

 

I'm kinda of both minds on the issue of "bedtime is at 8pm; stay in bed" vs "if you're not tired, you can get up and play."

 

Kimberly was a non-sleeper. She stopped naps as a tiny infant. By toddlerhood, she needed only a few hours of sleep each night. By about 3, I decided *I* needed less kid time and that there was a set bedtime (though I had to keep the other kiddo up to make it that "late"). The child had a BALL playing with her toes, making up elaborate stories, having no less than 100 make-believe friends, etc. I really think she BENEFITED by having to be in bed for a few hours of non-sleep.

 

We did try the idea of staying up but in her room where she could read, do experiments, etc but it just couldn't include me. She was probably 5 when we tried that. Honestly, it just wasn't for us. I couldn't just relax with hubby.

 

So we went back to a bedtime and she was fine with it. We did allow her to read all she wanted past that point though.

 

Oh, and through all this, she did have a quiet time daily also. I'm a big proponent of naptime :) My mom kept it til I was 11 (brother was 9). It didn't mean sleep but it was important. I agree. Our quiet time looked different after they were 7 and 5, but I'm glad we kept it. We still have a time of day that is quieter (though I guess that is changing next month when we have several young elementary kiddos here).

 

Anyway. So I don't like a kid just THERE doing NOTHING, but I do think a kid could choose to make it an adventure. But maybe that was just her personality and tendancy also?

[ThelmaLou]

Carmen,

 

I'm kinda of both minds on the issue of "bedtime is at 8pm; stay in bed" vs "if you're not tired, you can get up and play."

 

Kimberly was a non-sleeper. She stopped naps as a tiny infant. By toddlerhood, she needed only a few hours of sleep each night. By about 3, I decided *I* needed less kid time and that there was a set bedtime (though I had to keep the other kiddo up to make it that "late"). The child had a BALL playing with her toes, making up elaborate stories, having no less than 100 make-believe friends, etc. I really think she BENEFITED by having to be in bed for a few hours of non-sleep.

 

We did try the idea of staying up but in her room where she could read, do experiments, etc but it just couldn't include me. She was probably 5 when we tried that. Honestly, it just wasn't for us. I couldn't just relax with hubby.

 

So we went back to a bedtime and she was fine with it. We did allow her to read all she wanted past that point though.

 

Oh, and through all this, she did have a quiet time daily also. I'm a big proponent of naptime :) My mom kept it til I was 11 (brother was 9). It didn't mean sleep but it was important. I agree. Our quiet time looked different after they were 7 and 5, but I'm glad we kept it. We still have a time of day that is quieter (though I guess that is changing next month when we have several young elementary kiddos here).

 

Anyway. So I don't like a kid just THERE doing NOTHING, but I do think a kid could choose to make it an adventure. But maybe that was just her personality and tendancy also?

 

Yes, I feel the same way. My four older boys eventually transitioned from naptime to rest time. They were each in separate rooms listening to books on tape, building with Legos and K'nex, drawing, reading, etc... for 3-4 hours each afternoon. It was really only when my oldest completed 6th grade that we stopped doing this for him, and the other boys quickly followed. Even now, though, they're usually doing school work in the afternoon, or sometimes they have free time. But they're still generally supposed to be doing something maintenance free that is not mom-intensive.

 

For me, the idea of my youngest ds giving up "nap time" will not mean that I let him be out of his room and wander the house, for sure. He still does truly sleep for probably 2 hours each afternoon, but all told, he's in there for a total of about 3 to 3 1/2 hours each afternoon. Until last week, he'd just lay there and sing, tell himself stories, play with his stuffed animals, etc...He generally knows that it's not time to get up just because he wakes up. It's time to get up when mom or dad comes to get him. He's been completely content to stay there until last week.

 

Except for this crib escape "hiccup" we're having, I do think a little bit of boredom is a great precursor to creativity. My older boys look back with fondness at all the creative, independent things they did/made during those years of "rest time." They could pick whatever toys and activities they wanted at the beginning of rest time, and the rule was that they couldn't come out until I said it was time to get up. Otherwise, it was like the kitchen had a revolving door all afternoon. Did I also mention that they were all separate from one another, too? No arguing, no roughhousing (there's plenty of that during the rest of the day).

 

For the record, I know Jessie Wise did this with her kids, and I'm pretty sure that Susan does, too. I remember reading about it several years ago. Friends were always amazed when they found out that we had that mandatory "nap"/rest time for *so loooong* each day. Then they would always say they wished they had developed that habit with their kids.

 

So, while I've appreciated and understood the suggestions that naptime may be over for my son, I agree that he might not sleep as he gets older, but he will certainly follow in the footsteps of his older brothers with a rest time that will be just as long as his current "nap". This is simply mandatory in my house. But I'll be thrilled for him to be enjoying the same creativity (and occasional boredom!) that his brothers endured. It was worth every second in my book!

[Pamela H in Texas]

Friends were always amazed when they found out that we had that mandatory "nap"/rest time for *so loooong* each day.

 

Yeah, up to 4 hours IS really long. I don't think I could ever do that. But I do think there are ALL SORTS of benefits to a quieter time daily. I really think many stay at home moms miss out on those benefits with all their stories of "my kids outgrew naps by 2." ALL kids in daycare nap at 2 and even 3 and often at 4 even. It's not a choice. The teacher is insistent and it happens easily for 99.95% of kids! Only stay at home moms have kids that don't nap. Either kiddos aren't getting enough physical activity or moms aren't being firm enough about it. And for those that don't mind, that is fine, I guess, but a LOT wish their kids napped longer. VERY few kids won't nap and ALL can learn to do quiet time.

 

Anyway, I agree with you that ds needs to learn to follow the rules. Like Karin, my experience has been that getting a big-kid bed actually helps the problem, not adds to it. And I already suggested that you discipline sooner rather than letting him have the reward of making it out of bed and playing. I like the one legged sleeper idea too. Whatever it takes though I can see that some kids could still get out. I don't think that would have worked for my son.

[Lovedtodeath]

I like the one legged sleeper idea too. Whatever it takes though I can see that some kids could still get out. I don't think that would have worked for my son.

Yep, DD would just get out by falling on her head.

 

I will look it up in TWTM, but I believe their rest time is 2 hours. Pediatricians say that preschoolers should not sit for more than that for the entire day!

[AndyJoy]

Update: I've just ordered a digital video monitor from Amazon with expedited shipping. When ds gets up from nap, the crib tent comes off, goes back in the box to Amazon for a refund. Hoping the monitor will enable me to see him at all times during his nap. Though I won't be sitting outside his door, I'll know when he's getting into trouble. Not sure yet if I'm going to eliminate the crib altogether or not. I might try the video monitor for the short term to see my watchful eye and quick reaction will curb his escape attempts. I'm not nearly as concerned about an injury climbing out of the pack and play as I would be if it were a full size crib. I'm more concerned still with him climbing the bunk bed or destroying his brothers' things. When we move, I'm leaning toward a full size mattress on the floor. That won't be until the first of August, though. Not sure in the interim if we'll do the Graco or a pallet on the floor.

 

Sorry to chime in again, but I wrote "crib" for simplification purposes--it was actually a playpen that I was sleeping in that I climbed out of when I broke my arm.