Shooting at a Texas elementary school

[Shelydon]

Current laws include:

Age 21 to purchase a handgun

All guns must be locked in a safe or have a trigger lock when not in use

Guns may not be carried onto school property or any school event. 

 

 

 

So-- just like drug laws or DUI laws, criminals choose to violate. 

 

Not sure that more gun laws are the answer.  Somehow enforcing what is currently on the books would go a long way. 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Shelydon

[Heartstrings]

4 minutes ago, Murphy101 said:

If that’s true I think the prosecution should be brutal to send one hell of a message that no other business ever thinks it worth it to skirt that law again. 

I’ve been assuming that he lived with the grandmother that he shot and probably took the handgun from her.  

[Shelydon]

5 minutes ago, KSera said:

What do you propose? I think there's a heck of a lot we can do to make things better than they are right now. It won't stop all shootings and certainly not overnight, but over time there will be fewer weapons and thus fewer deaths. We could start with banning high capacity magazines and having a massive tax on ammunition. And tracking ammunition. The money to implement that could come in part from the ammunition tax. And I don't care about all the semantics about what different kinds of guns are called. We all know the kinds of guns that are used in mass shootings. Let's get a new name then to group them all together so we can stop the semantics game rather than doing something about them.

This kid bought these guns the day he turned 18. I don't know when that was, but that's what is reported. Had there been more roadblocks, waiting periods, training required, this may not have happened. Honestly, if people want to argue that there's nothing we can do to stop guns from killing so many kids each year, they're making an argument for overturning the 2A. Figure ut a way to make this better, or there just can't be guns out there at all.

Guns exist.  How do you make 'no guns at all' happen? That seems like it would then be an increase in criminal use of guns that are imported illegally or stolen from the armed forces. 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Shelydon

[Terabith]

"We Have No Prayer"

Rev. Dr. Philip Hobson

May 24, 2022

 

God of covenant, Lord of life, Gracious giver of all good gifts,

Do not console us.

Do not forgive us.

For we have not repented.

We have not turned from the sacrifice of our children to needless violence.

We worship death and not you.

We seek the good only for ourselves and not all your people.

We guard and protect only those under our own rooves, and only those who measure up among them.

We worship some strange, evil, purity of whiteness, while our hands are stained with the blood of people with skin of every shade and every beautiful hue.

We worship some idea of liberty that only allows for freedom from covenant, freedom from being our sibling’s guardian, freedom from the hope that all are precious in your sight.

We would rather arm the evil one than admit we have no power over our addiction to dead children.

We do not deserve your mercy.

We have condemned ourselves to a hell that you never intended for us.

Every omega and every alpha of the Gospel has been stained the with blood of innocents.

Every mouth that declares your praise has taken part in the conversation of hatred and violence.

Those who are enthralled to the sacrifices of children promise thoughts and prayers.

Damn their thoughts.

Ignore their prayers.

For we are not a people who enact justice, we have no love for our neighbor beyond mere sentiment, and we cannot humble ourselves enough to walk with you.

Speak no word. Let no breath of your Spirit fill the dry bones of our peoples. Do not raise us from dust.

Make for yourself some new people from the rocks and the stones. Raise up for yourself a new covenantal partner from the barren land. Submit your resignation for the covenant of Jesus Christ. We have grieved your Spirit and re-crucified you from Holocaust to battlefield, from sanctuary to grocery store, from school to school to school to school.

We have traded the glory of the image of your likeness for body bags and slogans.

We have dealt dirty with one another and with your gifts of life.

We declare ourselves to be other than what we are.

We ask too much of you that we could do ourselves, and we presume to think our worship covers our sin and our shame.

God of covenant, Lord of life, Gracious giver of all good gifts,

Do not console us.

Do not forgive us.

For we have not repented.

[Lillyfee]

I agree that the US is so gun infested that it would be hard at first to control it properly but it needs to happen.  They need to do something. It's going to get worse and I don't know if only I have the feeling but my feeling is that the US is getting passed by most countries when it comes to safety and they are going more and more backwards and this is a sinking ship right now because things don't change and stand still.

[Murphy101]

1 minute ago, KSera said:

What do you propose?

Oh my goodness. I’ve proposed LOTS of things over the years and sadly many other shooting threads. 

We could mandate smaller magazines.

Proof of registered gun safes compatible with guns owned

state and fed background checks

safety courses

wait periods of at least 2 weeks (which would be necessary with background checks anyways)

no loopholes to the avoid the above for private or gun show sales

limit number of guns allowed to be purchased within a time period. It could be based on number of guns or number of shots available in each gun. For example an old fashioned 2 bullet rifle maybe they can buy 3 of those or 1 6-bullet pistol.  It wouldn’t prevent gun collecting, but it would slow down the fanatic on a buying spree.

Make mental health evaluations no different than well child check ups and basic learning assessments.  Instead of waiting for kids to fail - let’s catch them before they are in a literal death spiral.  Because at some point every person on the planet is going to need help and acting like it’s this horrible thing and they are screwed up from feeling like a failure and broken is obviously not working well for anyone.

Is someone with better WTM searching skills able to link to my other posts with suggestions from past threads? 

[Sneezyone]

17 minutes ago, Shelydon said:

Current laws include:

Age 21 to purchase a handgun

All guns must be locked in a safe or have a trigger lock when not in use

Guns may not be carried onto school property or any school event. 

 

 

 

So-- just like drug laws or DUI laws, criminals choose to violate. 

 

Not sure that more gun laws are the answer.  Somehow enforcing what is currently on the books would go a long way. 

Drunk drivers can’t kill people without access to a car. Mass shooters need guns. Get rid of the guns. The Buffalo shooter’s parents knew he had a gun with hate written all over it. They did nothing. The MI shooter’s parents bought the child a gun. The guns are in the homes, unsecured, easily accessed. Mental health problems don’t cause this epidemic. Other countries have mental health problems. 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Sneezyone

[Heartstrings]

2 minutes ago, Lillyfee said:

I agree that the US is so gun infested that it would be hard at first to control it properly but it needs to happen.  They need to do something. It's going to get worse and I don't know if only I have the feeling but my feeling is that the US is getting passed by most countries when it comes to safety and they are going more and more backwards and this is a sinking ship right now because things don't change and stand still.

We are a country of guns with some people around to service them.  3+ guns for every man, woman a child.  

[KSera]

10 minutes ago, Shelydon said:

So-- just like drug laws or DUI laws, criminals choose to violate. 

What do you think makes the US a standout such that our gun death rates are so much higher than other otherwise similar countries? Why do we have 100 times higher gun death rate than the UK for example? We certainly don't have a mental illness rate 100 times higher. Is the US just so spectacularly, inherently crappy that other countries are able to have a handle on this by having gun laws and the US can't? I'd like to think it isn't.

8 minutes ago, Shelydon said:

Guns exist.  How do you make 'no guns at all' happen? That seems like it would then be an increase in criminal use of guns that are imported illegally or stolen from the armed forces. 

Australia did it. They didn't achieve "no guns at all" but they got 1,000,000 guns out of circulation when they changed their laws after Port Arthur. This again seems an argument that America sucks so badly that we can't achieve what other countries can.

[Heartstrings]

17 minutes ago, Shelydon said:

Current laws include:

Age 21 to purchase a handgun

All guns must be locked in a safe or have a trigger lock when not in use

Guns may not be carried onto school property or any school event. 

 

 

 

So-- just like drug laws or DUI laws, criminals choose to violate. 

 

Not sure that more gun laws are the answer.  Somehow enforcing what is currently on the books would go a long way. 

Where are you with gun storage laws?  I don’t have any of those.  “Recommendations” for proper storage, sure.  But no laws. 

[Heartstrings]

2 minutes ago, KSera said:

his again seems an argument that America sucks so badly that we can't achieve what other countries can.

I mean…we prove this with a dozen other metrics.  Maternal mortality, literacy rates, health outcome, deaths of despair, violent crimes of all sorts, proportion of population behind bars….

[Shelydon]

2 minutes ago, KSera said:

What do you think makes the US a standout such that our gun death rates are so much higher than other otherwise similar countries? Why do we have 100 times higher gun death rate than the UK for example? We certainly don't have a mental illness rate 100 times higher. Is the US just so spectacularly, inherently crappy that other countries are able to have a handle on this by having gun laws and the US can't? I'd like to think it isn't.

Australia did it. They didn't achieve "no guns at all" but they got 1,000,000 guns out of circulation when they changed their laws after Port Arthur. This again seems an argument that America sucks so badly that we can't achieve what other countries can.

Australia doesn't border Mexico with enormous drug cartels and high rates of illegally imported weapons.  It is far easier to regulate islands.  Uvalde is about an hour from the Mexico border.

[Murphy101]

3 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

Drunk drivers can’t kill people without access to a car. Mass shooters need guns. Get rid of the guns. The Buffalo shooter’s parents knew her had a gun with hate written all over it. They did nothing. The MI shooter’s parents bought the child a gun. The guns are in the homes, unsecured, easily accessed. Mental health problems don’t cause this epidemic. Other countries have mental health problems. 

That’s true that other countries have mental health problems. They also have stricter gun regulations. Almost no modern country is “gun free” but they do have regulations and they do have laws that are strictly enforced.  Those policies have created a social environment where people would be anxious and vocal over someone acting foolish about guns.

vs a state that has almost zero regulation or laws and the lack of enforcement has created a social expectation of it’s no big deal so even though we will likely find out that multiple people knew this 18 yr old had plans to get a gun illegally - no one did anything that would have changed this ending. 

[KSera]

Just now, Shelydon said:

Australia doesn't border Mexico with enormous drug cartels and high rates of illegally imported weapons.  It is far easier to regulate islands.  Uvalde is about an hour from the Mexico border.

You're kidding me. You want to make Mexico responsible for our gun problem? I can't get over that anyone would be standing up today for "let's do nothing and just sacrifice our children on the altar of gun ownership, it's just the price we have to pay." LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH of children in the United States.

[Shelydon]

10 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

Where are you with gun storage laws?  I don’t have any of those.  “Recommendations” for proper storage, sure.  But no laws. 

I don't know federal laws, but Texas has gun storage laws that prohibit a gun owner from storing a gun in any way that a child could gain access to the gun.  It must be in a safe or with a trigger lock.  It is only a misdemeanor  only though, 1 year jail plus a $$$$ fine.  This would be an excellent place to increase penalties and make jail time and huge fines for those that violate.

Edited May 25, 2022 by Shelydon

[Shelydon]

2 minutes ago, KSera said:

You're kidding me. You want to make Mexico responsible for our gun problem? I can't get over that anyone would be standing up today for "let's do nothing and just sacrifice our children on the altar of gun ownership, it's just the price we have to pay." LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH of children in the United States.

That's not what I said.

[Heartstrings]

2 minutes ago, Shelydon said:

I don't know federal laws, but Texas has gun storage laws that prohibit a gun owner from storing a gun in any way that a child could gain access to the gun.  It must be in a safe or with a trigger lock.  It is only a misdemeanor  only though, 1 year jail plus a $$$$ fine.

And I’m sure households with guns are regularly inspected to ensure compliance.  🤦‍♀️  

Edited May 25, 2022 by Heartstrings

[KSera]

Let's go all in on the 2nd Amendment then and freaking WELL REGULATE our militia. Let's regulate the hell out of it.

[Lillyfee]

In this area the US is a mess. You will not find any country in the world that thinks that the  gun laws here are good. They all hit their head against the wall and don't know what in the world is going on here that they can not regulate that mess properly or at least try it.

 

[Shelydon]

2 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

And I’m sure households with guns are regularly inspected to ensure compliance.  🤦‍♀️  

It would be easy enough for someone to report though, and if the fines were big enough or people faced significant jail time, then it might make a difference. 

[Shelydon]

2 minutes ago, KSera said:

Let's go all in on the 2nd Amendment then and freaking WELL REGULATE our militia. Let's regulate the hell out of it.

Mandatory firearm training like Sweden has would be great. 

[Murphy101]

1 minute ago, KSera said:

You're kidding me. You want to make Mexico responsible for our gun problem? I can't get over that anyone would be standing up today for "let's do nothing and just sacrifice our children on the altar of gun ownership, it's just the price we have to pay." LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH of children in the United States.

Hear! Hear!

This Mexico is our gun problem theory is just BS.  Mexico gets their guns from the United States.  This has been going on and fairly well documented since I was a kid.  You can get pages and pages of links if you don’t like this one that all say the same thing - most of the guns come from the US.

 http://www.borderlandbeat.com/2021/08/where-do-mexican-drug-cartels-get-their.html?m=1

1 minute ago, Shelydon said:

I don't know federal laws, but Texas has gun storage laws that prohibit a gun owner from storing a gun in any way that a child could gain access to the gun.  It must be in a safe or with a trigger lock.  It is only a misdemeanor  only though, 1 year jail plus a $$$$ fine.

How do they get that proof before allowing the gun purchase to complete?

Back when OK had similar laws it was literally nothing more than a question on the form of something like, “Do you have a safe place to lock and store guns?” And if you checked yes that’s all there was to it. It was a joke. 

[Murphy101]

4 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

And I’m sure households with guns are regularly inspected to ensure compliance.  🤦‍♀️  

I don’t think they need to be inspected though. I do think that would be over reach of govt. Mandate proof of purchase of be shown. At the very least it means someone going on a shooting spree will have to spend several hundred dollars on a safe first and that’s several hundred they didn’t spend on more ammo or guns. 

[Heartstrings]

4 minutes ago, Murphy101 said:

I don’t think they need to be inspected though. I do think that would be over reach of govt. Mandate proof of purchase of be shown. At the very least it means someone going on a shooting spree will have to spend several hundred dollars on a safe first and that’s several hundred they didn’t spend on more ammo or guns. 

Peepaw buys a gun safe and 4 generations show a picture of his receipt to buy guns.  And all the cousins, and drinking buddies.  

Edited May 25, 2022 by Heartstrings

[Murphy101]

Just now, Heartstrings said:

Peepaw buys a gun safe and 4 generations show a picture of his receipt to buy guns.  

Sure. And frankly that’s fine by me if they are using it.  Many gun safes have serial numbers. We could mandate they all do and have to be registered to an owner and address. If they can provide proof they have that safe in the residence of record for the owner of the gun - that works for me.

[Lillyfee]

Gun laws like Sweden would be great. 

The gun problem also leads to more problems like police violence.

In other countries police officers don't expect people to have a gun. Your officers need to expect everybody to have a gun and be in danger and act so much more extreme and shoot faster than anywhere else.

People need to understand that the freedom of having a gun takes so many good things away from them including freedom. 

 

 

[Stacia]

While you're busy arguing semantics over how hard it would be to reduce numbers of guns in the US...

 

https://twitter.com/ChrisMurphyCT/status/1529302094485803012?s=20&t=_N5sDCuGDU7nta6BwaNi0w

 

[Heartstrings]

5 minutes ago, Murphy101 said:

Sure. And frankly that’s fine by me if they are using it.  Many gun safes have serial numbers. We could mandate they all do and have to be registered to an owner and address. If they can provide proof they have that safe in the residence of record for the owner of the gun - that works for me.

Pretty sure you intentionally missed my point there, but oh well.   People of good faith arguing on the internet does nothing.  
 

We devolve into a gun debate, both sides entrench and NOTHING happens until a big enough massacre happens to restart it.   Today it was 21.  Next Tuesday when it’s only 3 or 4 it won’t make news.  

Edited May 25, 2022 by Heartstrings

[Murphy101]

9 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

Pretty sure you intentionally missed my point there, but oh well.   People of good faith arguing on the internet does nothing.  
 

We devolve into a gun debate, both sides entrench and NOTHING happens until a big enough massacre happens to restart it.   Today it was 21.  Next Tuesday when it’s only 3 or 4 it won’t make news.  

I did not intentionally miss your point. I got your point. No law stops all evil. But good laws absolutely do reduce evil acts and often by magnitudes.

You proposed a loophole.

I proposed a way to at least make it smaller.

That’s literally how legislation works when it works. That’s why all those legislators have so many clerks and staffers. Exactly so they can propose methods and ways to make laws work. 

But okay what I really missed in your point was that you don’t have one.  Okay then. Note to self that you didn’t actually want to discuss anything bc there’s really nothing to discuss to you. 

[Tanaqui]

29 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

Peepaw buys a gun safe and 4 generations show a picture of his receipt to buy guns.  And all the cousins, and drinking buddies.  

So how about periodic checks - no license unless you can show you have a freaking gun safe in your home, with a freaking lock?

This is not rocket science, and quite honestly, if people keep blocking sensible gun control laws, sooner or later the reasonable majority of the population who all *want* sensible gun control laws is going to get totally fed up.

[Murphy101]

15 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

So how about periodic checks - no license unless you can show you have a freaking gun safe in your home, with a freaking lock?

This is not rocket science, and quite honestly, if people keep blocking sensible gun control laws, sooner or later the reasonable majority of the population who all *want* sensible gun control laws is going to get totally fed up.

I am totally fed up.

[Heartstrings]

37 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

So how about periodic checks - no license unless you can show you have a freaking gun safe in your home, with a freaking lock?

This is not rocket science, and quite honestly, if people keep blocking sensible gun control laws, sooner or later the reasonable majority of the population who all *want* sensible gun control laws is going to get totally fed up.

I was replying to a comment saying any inspection was too invasive.  A sheriff deputy putting eyes on the safe in the home before a new gun acquisition would be a wonderful thing.  Especially if paired with fines if it was later shown that it wasn’t being used and led to something happening. 

Showing proof of purchase would be too easy to get around and almost meaningless, same as the box checking affirming its existence mentioned up thread.    

 

Also what license?  Guns aren’t licensed or registered where I live.   Last time we bought one it took 5 minutes in Sports Academy  and no one knew but us and Sports Academy.  Only need a permit if you want to carry concealed.  

Edited May 25, 2022 by Heartstrings

[Heartstrings]

33 minutes ago, Murphy101 said:

ut okay what I really missed in your point was that you don’t have one.  Okay then. Note to self that you didn’t actually want to discuss anything bc there’s really nothing to discuss to you. 

All that after I literally said you were making good faith arguments.  Hm.  
 

But to a certain extent you’re right.  There’s nothing to discuss with this other than outrage and heart break.  We can discuss and come together on a perfectly nuanced law, balanced perfectly for both our perspectives and it does NOTHING because ppl in power won’t care.   I guess discussing the idea that the discussion is pointless gets a bit meta and equally pointless, but there it is.    

[Murphy101]

10 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

I was replying to a comment saying any inspection was too invasive.  A sheriff deputy putting eyes on the safe in the home before a new gun acquisition would be a wonderful thing.  Especially if paired with fines if it was later shown that it wasn’t being used and led to something happening. 

Showing proof of purchase would be too easy to get around and almost meaningless, same as the box checking affirming its existence mentioned up thread.    
 

I do think mandating in home checks of any kind is going to far. It amounts to owning a gun means giving up due process wrt to searches.  

And as I pointed out, there’s other ways to verify without further stretching already understaffed police forces.

I think safe serial number ownerships with guns would pass legal sniff test but any kind of in home inspection would kill the whole shebang before the ink dries. 

[Heartstrings]

2 minutes ago, Murphy101 said:

I do think mandating in home checks of any kind is going to far. It amounts to owning a gun means giving up due process wrt to searches.  

And as I pointed out, there’s other ways to verify without further stretching already understaffed police forces.

I think safe serial number ownerships with guns would pass legal sniff test but any kind of in home inspection would kill the whole shebang before the ink dries. 

If you convince the people who are against any kind of gun database to sign on, I’ll buy the pens for the signing party.  I’m wiling to compromise on anything that inches us closer to living in a reasonable society again.  

[Grace Hopper]

I just cannot sleep. Not sure if this is an up to date report but it sounds like there may be two 10yo girls still unaccounted for? 
 

And my mind wanders… In that part of Texas I wonder if it’s possible that some of the victims/victim families are undocumented. I pray that any of their citizen statuses would not become an issue. Maybe that’s not an issue at all but it’s what comes to mind at 3am. 

[Heartstrings]

Just now, Grace Hopper said:

I just cannot sleep. Not sure if this is an up to date report but it sounds like there may be two 10yo girls still unaccounted for? 
 

And my mind wanders… In that part of Texas I wonder if it’s possible that some of the victims/victim families are undocumented. I pray that any of their citizen statuses would not become an issue. Maybe that’s not an issue at all but it’s what comes to mind at 3am. 

I saw a thing saying the families are doing DNA tests to help identify the victims. It’s possible they just aren’t matched yet?  I hope if it’s a matter of documentation someone does something, even quietly. God that adds awful to awful.  

[chocolate-chip chooky]

This is heartwrenching. I just can't comprehend how this can just keep on happening. It is so so so far from my reality. It's horrifying.

Explain it to me.

Is it really truly the case that more of your population care about the right to own a gun than the right to safely go to school/shops/concerts/church?

Is it really truly the case that your lawmakers care more about votes than lives?

Why in the world aren't there restrictions on gun ownership?

I'm clearly missing something obvious.

 

[chocolate-chip chooky]

Double post

 

Edited May 25, 2022 by chocolate-chip chooky

[Grace Hopper]

15 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

I saw a thing saying the families are doing DNA tests to help identify the victims. It’s possible they just aren’t matched yet?  I hope if it’s a matter of documentation someone does something, even quietly. God that adds awful to awful.  

Perhaps. I hope it’s that they were terrified and hid and will be found safe. 

7 minutes ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

This is heartwrenching. I just can't comprehend how this can just keep on happening. It is so so so far from my reality. It's horrifying.

Explain it to me.

Is it really truly the case that more of your population care about the right to own a gun than the right to safely go to school/shops/concerts/church?

Is it really truly the case that your lawmakers care more about votes than lives?

Why in the world aren't there restrictions on gun ownership?

I'm clearly missing something obvious.

 

Heather Cox Richardson’s letter tonight was excellent. It may help answer some of your questions. I think the basketball coach said it best. 
 

 

[KSera]

16 minutes ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

This is heartwrenching. I just can't comprehend how this can just keep on happening. It is so so so far from my reality. It's horrifying.

Explain it to me.

Is it really truly the case that more of your population care about the right to own a gun than the right to safely go to school/shops/concerts/church?

Is it really truly the case that your lawmakers care more about votes than lives?

Why in the world aren't there restrictions on gun ownership?

I'm clearly missing something obvious.

 

There is no explanation that makes any good sense. We have a very powerful gun lobby who funnels a lot of money to one party and they in turn do what the gun lobby wants. Most of the population wants more regulations, but not the people in power, because the gun lobby helps  keep them in power. Then there are those who have bought into what the gun lobby wants them to believe and so say we shouldn’t do anything because there’s no way to make any changes that will actually make anything better. So we shouldn’t even try. 
 

It’s insane. 

[lewelma]

I went looking to find countries like the USA with gun ownership, and found this list for the number of guns per capita, the USA is far far above all other countries. Double the next closest

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_civilian_guns_per_capita_by_country

But then I found this list with percentage of households with guns by country.  It shows the USA as number 1 at 42% of households but only slightly above the next highest Finland at 38%. If you look at the top 10 countries, most of them feel pretty safe to me. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Percent_of_households_with_guns_by_country

I guess I was just surprised that the USA is not the huge outlier that I thought it was, there are just certain households that have a ton of weapons. 
 

Edited May 25, 2022 by lewelma

[Laura Corin]

3 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

So how about periodic checks - no license unless you can show you have a freaking gun safe in your home, with a freaking lock?

 

https://www.scotland.police.uk/about-us/what-we-do/firearms-and-explosives-licensing/firearms-and-shotguns/

'On receipt of your application, your enquiry will be allocated to a local Firearm Enquiry Officer (FEO). They will carry our enquiry including interviewing your referees, background checks, and a home visit and security check.'

The certificate lasts five years, but any member of the public or doctor who is concerned about the fitness (eta usually concerning diagnosed mental illness that might affect ability to own a gun safely or documented violent conduct) of a licence holder to continue holding guns can flag this to the police for investigation.

Edited May 25, 2022 by Laura Corin

[chocolate-chip chooky]

1 hour ago, Grace Hopper said:

Perhaps. I hope it’s that they were terrified and hid and will be found safe. 

Heather Cox Richardson’s letter tonight was excellent. It may help answer some of your questions. I think the basketball coach said it best. 
 

 

So why won't those senators vote? What's holding them back? How will they lose their power if 90% of the population supports stricter gun laws?

ETA: just read a later reply. So it's about money?

Edited May 25, 2022 by chocolate-chip chooky

[Tanaqui]

It's always about money.

[chocolate-chip chooky]

7 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

It's always about money.

I feel physically sick thinking of the terror those children and teachers experienced, and the ongoing horror for those families.

And all those families from all the other times that we all lose count of.

And it's preventable. No guns, no gun deaths.

It's just all too horrible to comprehend.

Edited May 25, 2022 by chocolate-chip chooky

[Eos]

6 hours ago, Sneezyone said:

It's really not OK for people to blame mental illness when the individual who committed this crime was allowed to legally purchase a gun.

This.  Every time.

[DawnM]

This is all going to get far, far worse.   My current district has over 2,000 openings and it isn't even the end of the school year.    Many other staff are waiting until late summer to resign so that they can keep their benefits until August.  We are estimating a 20% teacher shortage in the Fall.

I know this is nationwide.

All that to say, it will make it easier for shooters in so many ways.   Untrained staff, not enough staff, etc....

The fact that elementary schools are being targeted is alarming.   

[Eos]

3 hours ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

Is it really truly the case that more of your population care about the right to own a gun than the right to safely go to school/shops/concerts/church?

Is it really truly the case that your lawmakers care more about votes than lives?

Yes.  Not missing anything.

[alysee]

I'm not going to wade into the stricter gun laws discussion as a Canadian. I just want to say that I am absolutely heartbroken that this keeps happening in the United States. Okay, you can keep on with your current discussion.