What to do now…

[Tanaqui]

Whether or not you should go no contact for the long haul, it does not sound to me like you are currently in a place where you should be having any contact with your mother. I do think you need to block her number, and any number of relatives and friends who try to carry messages for her, until you've had a real detox.

Which is going to take time. At the very least, it's going to take until the end of this holiday season. NO Christmas, NO New Year's, NONE OF IT.

Sometimes people like your mother can learn to behave themselves. But they aren't going to learn it over the course of a holiday weekend. And honestly, it requires a lot of work on the part of their family members, with a lot of backsliding. It may not be worth it and, again, you are not currently in a position to objectively evaluate this.

You need a break from your mother. Block her all over. Send her one final letter saying that for the time being, you will not be in contact. Don't waste your time JADEing - justify, argue, defend, explain. To your mother, those are just weak spots. Do like Nancy Reagan and just say no.

 

Once you've had a detox and some time to think - and hopefully therapy! - then you can decide how much contact, if any, to allow. I strongly recommend that if you do allow contact you do so on very strict boundaries, along the lines of: you decide when/if to call, not her. You decide how long the phone call is, not her. You determine what topics of conversation are unacceptable, and if she tries them more than once, you end the phone call. No wiggle room. If she's allowed to talk to your kids, you or your husband listens in - no private side convos.

[saraha]

I wouldn’t have answered it but dh’s was like just answer it. You know how she is now, you won’t be falling for it. But now I think that was wrong, because she is trying to normalize things. I did get to say that I was mad about canceling thanksgiving, that she was wrong to treat my sis this way and made her agree that she hears me that my kids have not been messing with my sister for years. So maybe it wasn’t wrong because I got to say what I wanted, whether she heard me or not and I can at least ignore her calls now more comfortably. I hope.

[saraha]

I feel like I’m crazy, but the longer I sit here post call the more I feel like, ok, if I don’t answer her, at least she knows it’s because I am mad and I feel like I have a sense of closure of sorts if that makes sense. 

 

Edited November 29, 2021 by saraha

[gardenmom5]

53 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

Fingers in your ears. You hear nothing, see nothing, say nothing. Be a wall, ignore. However she is trying to communicate, she may as well be reaching the answering machine of a total stranger.

Sorry Saraha, she has the narcissism very badly!

aka: gray rock.  yeah - it's a thing.

as exciting as a gray rock on a beach with nothing but gray rocks.

[fraidycat]

3 minutes ago, saraha said:

I feel like I’m crazy

 

This is what gaslighting does to you. It keeps you off balance and questioning your sanity. This is why you need to detox from her for awhile before you can make any long term decisions re: contact with her.

You are not crazy!

[gardenmom5]

29 minutes ago, saraha said:

I wouldn’t have answered it but dh’s was like just answer it. You know how she is now, you won’t be falling for it. But now I think that was wrong, because she is trying to normalize things. I did get to say that I was mad about canceling thanksgiving, that she was wrong to treat my sis this way and made her agree that she hears me that my kids have not been messing with my sister for years. So maybe it wasn’t wrong because I got to say what I wanted, whether she heard me or not and I can at least ignore her calls now more comfortably. I hope.

The more you answer - the more she will call.

you said you were angry - and you said why.   

I really think you need some distance for a while - you can think. she can think (maybe, but don't hold your breath).

if you need to block her number so the phone won't even ring, - do it.  When you're ready to talk, you can call her.

[prairiewindmomma]

Agreeing about Grey rocking and her trying to make you feel off balance.

It sounds like she is following the predictable cycle of explosion-denial-bribery-guilt-threats. You are in the bribery phase sliding into guilt. 

[saraha]

Yeah, with this call I feel like a burden has lifted. I was able to calmly tell her what I wanted to say and that she needs to stop punishing my sister. Now I feel like I can ignore ignore until I figure out what I want to do. So maybe answering it is a good thing.

I blocked her the other day on our house phone so the kids can’t answer it. I need to print out that bingo card because you guys seriously called it. Who said the next thing was going to be an illness?

[gardenmom5]

9 minutes ago, saraha said:

I feel like I’m crazy, but the longer I sit here post call the more I feel like, ok, if I don’t answer her, at least she knows it’s because I am mad and I feel like I have a sense of closure of sorts if that makes sense. 

 

Narcissism.  The only disorder where those around the patient seek mental health care. 

 

 

You're not crazy, this is the effect they have on those around them.   

[saraha]

Thank you guys for all of the support. I have watched a few of the linked videos so far and have been doing some reading, it’s creepy really that people can predict her behavior like that

[saraha]

She has called three times since yesterday. If her usual pattern holds now that I’ve answered it she will leave me alone for a couple of days to a week

[Rosie_0801]

And your stomach is going to plummet every time the phone rings. Just block her. 

You are the boss of you. She isn't the boss of you. You talk to her when *you* feel like it, which won't be every time she feels like it. 'Hard luck, Mother Dear. You're not the only one in the world.'

Keep her blocked until the thought of her calling no longer triggers a panic/fawn response, until it triggers nothing more severe than an irritated frown.

You don't need to worry about predicting her next move. It's going to be something jackassy and no more than temporarily sincere, and your response to whatever it is should be "Oh, sod off with your nonsense. I'm busy."

You are a busy woman! You have better things to do. ❤️
 

[LifeLovePassion]

1 hour ago, saraha said:

Haha where is the bingo card? Today brought both love bombing the kids with stuff she is buying from the store for Christmas and she has a crippling headache, so I should feel sorry for her. 

Here is a link to a bingo card.

Stay strong ☺️

https://bingobaker.com/view/3366846

[gardenmom5]

29 minutes ago, saraha said:

Thank you guys for all of the support. I have watched a few of the linked videos so far and have been doing some reading, it’s creepy really that people can predict her behavior like that

Narcissists are very *UNoriginal*, and play the same games.  They really have a lot in common.

14 minutes ago, Rosie_0801 said:

And your stomach is going to plummet every time the phone rings. Just block her. 

You are the boss of you. 

Keep her blocked until the thought of her calling no longer triggers a panic/fawn response, until it triggers nothing more severe than an irritated frown.

 

 

This.

[HS Mom in NC]

2 hours ago, saraha said:

I blocked her the other day on our house phone so the kids can’t answer it. I need to print out that bingo card because you guys seriously called it. Who said the next thing was going to be an illness?

Me on Nov. 23rd.  (Copied below.) I'm off to  collect my winnings....saaaaay one of those cookies on the top shelf of my pantry!   @gardenmom5, you called the love bombing, what are you going to enjoy for your winnings? @saraha, a year or two from now you'll be calling the plays for a future poster.  Everyone can all cover all the squares on each of our bingo cards with treats and every update we can all take a treat (Hershey's kisses, mini liquor bottles, whatever) off the appropriate square and enjoy them together. We're with you on this and we'll be here the whole time to support you.

Anyone want in a narc pool?  

I'm guessing Mommy Dearest will have a sudden medical (either physical or mental) crisis that she'll call Sis about so Sis can call saraha about to guilt her back into contact.  Of course in that situation saraha should reply, "Call 911." 

Or will it be a threat to write saraha and/or saraha's kids out of Mommy Deaerest's will. To which saraha should reply, "That's fine with me, it's her money, she can do whatever she wants with it."

Anyone else have a guess as to the next step from Mommy Dearest and/or Sis?

[gardenmom5]

3 minutes ago, HS Mom in NC said:

Me on Nov. 23rd.  (Copied below.) I'm off to  collect my winnings....saaaaay one of those cookies on the top shelf of my pantry!   @gardenmom5, you called the love bombing, what are you going to enjoy for your winnings? @saraha, a year or two from now you'll be calling the plays for a future poster.  Everyone can all cover all the squares on each of our bingo cards with treats and every update we can all take a treat (Hershey's kisses, mini liquor bottles, whatever) off the appropriate square and enjoy them together. We're with you on this and we'll be here the whole time to support you.

Anyone want in a narc pool?  

I'm guessing Mommy Dearest will have a sudden medical (either physical or mental) crisis that she'll call Sis about so Sis can call saraha about to guilt her back into contact.  Of course in that situation saraha should reply, "Call 911." 

Or will it be a threat to write saraha and/or saraha's kids out of Mommy Deaerest's will. To which saraha should reply, "That's fine with me, it's her money, she can do whatever she wants with it."

Anyone else have a guess as to the next step from Mommy Dearest and/or Sis?

I have some good chocolate  . . . (I stick to really dark stuff - like 85% - 90%).

My grandmother regularly threatened to cut us out of her will whenever we didn't do what she wanted.  One day I told her to go ahead and do it.  I wasn't selling myself for her mess of potage.  The next time she tried it, I was genuinely confused as I'd previously told her to do it. (I still didn't know anything about narcissism.) - I said: I thought you already did . . . . She started pushing me away after that.  I wasn't responding the way she'd trained me.

 

My money is on the next thing she'll try to flip sis into the golden and saraha into the scapegoat.

 

 

[saraha]

2 hours ago, Rosie_0801 said:

Thanks Rosie, I wish I could like your posts!

[saraha]

Aaaaannnnddddd now I am getting texts from my sister:

mom called and left a message. thanks for sticking up for me

And I don’t feel good.

Picture of a thermometer.

It’s been climbing all day.

I might have to go to the hospital 

 

You guys, I swear I’m not making this up

 

[theelfqueen]

You're gonna win BINGO! 

[LMD]

15 minutes ago, saraha said:

Aaaaannnnddddd now I am getting texts from my sister:

mom called and left a message. thanks for sticking up for me

And I don’t feel good.

Picture of a thermometer.

It’s been climbing all day.

I might have to go to the hospital 

 

You guys, I swear I’m not making this up

 

we know you're not making it up, because we've seen the exact script play out too. It is a relief to know you're not the crazy one!

You also don't have to be sucked in to the drama via your sister. Just keep it brief and boring and don't feel obligated to answer every text, just one "okay, feel better" is plenty. Your mom and sister know where you stand, you've said your piece, you're done for now.

[Faith-manor]

Narcissist bingo, never a dull moment, and enough drama to rival a day time soap opera!

[prairiewindmomma]

2 minutes ago, theelfqueen said:

You're gonna win BINGO! 

She’s going to win blackout before the year ends, I think. 😂

Seriously, we can all laugh/cry because we have been there.

Recognizing the pattern is helpful. Changing the behavioral response from what we’ve been conditioned for to do is harder. 😞  Hugs. 
 

 

[bluemongoose]

6 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

 😂

Recognizing the pattern is helpful. Changing the behavioral response from what we’ve been conditioned for to do is harder. 😞  Hugs. 
 

 

This! So much this! It won't be done quickly. It is so hard and such a slow process. Be easy on yourself when you get tricked and fall back into the old responses. Just recognize it and try again. 

[Eos]

10 hours ago, saraha said:

And I don’t feel good.

Picture of a thermometer.

It’s been climbing all day.

I might have to go to the hospital 

I truly hope you did not!  Hopefully your fever was just burning out the dross left by your talking with her.

[saraha]

2 hours ago, Eos said:

I truly hope you did not!  Hopefully your fever was just burning out the dross left by your talking with her.

Oh, thank you! But these are texts my sister (who also has narc symptoms) sent me, because my mom is getting g so much attention. She didn’t go, but thank you!

[Eos]

44 minutes ago, saraha said:

Oh, thank you! But these are texts my sister (who also has narc symptoms) sent me, because my mom is getting g so much attention. She didn’t go, but thank you!

Oh goodness, now I understand!  Argggg...

[saraha]

Ha! It’s like you all are psychic. She talked to my sister and before getting mad and hanging up on her she said it was my fault thanksgiving got canceled! 
Another x on the bingo card!

ETA: I know narcissism is not funny, I’m just trying to cope. Dh has lovingly shared his cold and people around here are all cranky, and I’m cranky, and it’s all a bit much

Edited November 30, 2021 by saraha

[gardenmom5]

1 hour ago, saraha said:

Ha! It’s like you all are psychic. She talked to my sister and before getting mad and hanging up on her she said it was my fault thanksgiving got canceled! 
Another x on the bingo card!

ETA: I know narcissism is not funny, I’m just trying to cope. Dh has lovingly shared his cold and people around here are all cranky, and I’m cranky, and it’s all a bit much

It's also helping you see narcissists/their-ilk, are predictable.   

I can now look back at it after many many years.  Yes, things still hurt and I'm still trying to put things back together, - but I'm grateful for the knowledge and insights.

[Rosie_0801]

1 minute ago, gardenmom5 said:

It's also helping you see narcissists/their-ilk, are predictable.   

Yeah. Next time you come across one you'll be kind of irritated with their lack of skill. "Ugh. I've seen this done better."
(Or maybe that's just me, lol.)

[Catwoman]

18 minutes ago, Rosie_0801 said:

Yeah. Next time you come across one you'll be kind of irritated with their lack of skill. "Ugh. I've seen this done better."
(Or maybe that's just me, lol.)

I just love this! It's such a great way to look at it.

[HS Mom in NC]

11 minutes ago, Rosie_0801 said:

Yeah. Next time you come across one you'll be kind of irritated with their lack of skill. "Ugh. I've seen this done better."
(Or maybe that's just me, lol.)

We can all use it as a prompt for a writing assignment: Imagine you're either writing a movie/theater review or a yelp review of the narcissist's performance in 3-5 sentences. 

There's a fine line between classic and cliche, and this latest performance was decidedly the latter.  As a Penguin of Madagascar once said, "Cliche is a French word that means I don't hear anyone else coming up with any ideas."  It was very by numbers and predictable.  2 out of 5 stars.

[GoodGrief3]

12 hours ago, saraha said:

Oh, thank you! But these are texts my sister (who also has narc symptoms) sent me, because my mom is getting g so much attention. She didn’t go, but thank you!

Excellent insight there! Do allow yourself distance from both. I get a strong sense that both mom and sis are trying to play you against the other.

[Faith-manor]

At this time, I recommend a lemon drop martini and a slice of cheesecake. But rum and rum cake works well too. Maybe have the drink and cake in the bathtub while you soak and unwind. Be sure to keep track of your bingo card, and have a few weeks of pretending mamma dear doesn't exist.