Help me with my dd, I'm lousy at this parenting thing sometimes

[plain jane]

Dd7 is a sweet little girl. She is loving, kind, thoughtful of others. She is usually very obedient but is a bit on the ditzy side.

 

I'm having some "problems" with her lately and I don't know what to do. Lately she doesn't want to share her things. We lent out our Wii to friends and she was VERY concerned that they would use her Mii. It upset her a lot that people would be using her Mii and possibly (accidentally) saving files on top. In fact, now that I think of it, she won't even let me use her Mii because she doesn't want me to earn points/medals etc. for her. The most recent example is: She is going to sleep over at a friend's this weekend and I was joking with her little sister about how she would be the oldest and would get to sleep on the top bunk. Dd7 immediately burst into tears and cried that she didn't want to have to share her bed with her sister. Even though she would be off having fun with friends, she didn't want her sister using her bed. (I should add that while she doesn't want to share her bed or her Mii, she is usually very generous with her little sister. She will let her play with birthday presents and will typically give her a smaller, less wanted present that she receives from her parties. She happily shares her craft supplies or any other goodies that are given to her in day to day life.)

 

This led to a big discussion with dh about love and sharing and somehow (I wasn't there) she admitted that she only shares things and obeys us because she is afraid of being punished.:confused: Now, she is distraught that she is a terrible person for not being kind because she loves us but only because she doesn't want to get in trouble. She is in tears and adament that she would not obey us if she knew she wouldn't be punished. FWIW, we do not punish harshly- 5 minute time outs, taking away of priviledges such as Wii time. We do not spank.

 

Yikes! She does ere on the very scrupulous side of things and is very unsure of herself at times. I do believe she has anxiety issues and I try to help her through them but I'm at a loss on this one.

 

Here are a few more background examples of what she is like: Often, she will give me an answer to something simple (Did you finish your supper?) and then hours later she will come and say that she left 2 beans on her plate so she isn't sure if she lied to me earlier. That type of thing. Or, if we are out at a friend's house, she will say that she had fun to her friend, not to hurt their feelings, but then she will admit to me that it wasn't that fun but she didn't want to hurt their feelings by saying it wasn't fun. I will prod her and ask if she had more fun than being at home (she'll say yes) and explain that then, in some way it must have been fun to be at that friend's house. Still, she feels that somehow she lied to her friend.

 

I'm not sure how to deal with her latest admission. I'll be honest here and admit that inside I'm freaking out that I've completely messed up as a parent. We are very attached parents and spend great amounts of time as a family.We have a very stable home life. I could really use some insight here.:bigear:

 

ETA: Do your kids obey you because they love you or because they too, fear the punishment? I'd like to know what other kids are like. :D

Edited December 4, 2008 by plain jane
adding something

[kalanamak]

Sounds like me at age 7, to be honest....I thought that was normal. My folks didn't make a big deal of anything, and I got much tougher at about age 12.

[happyWImom]

Is dd the oldest? Mine is, and she is the same way! Both with her little ds, and me. She tries to tell me I shouldn't have any ____ whatever if she can't, "it's not fair" is uttered a million times a day! She goes to a hs girls club, and ds usually goes with Nana to get his haircut, etc... Never fails that she complains that she didn't get to do what he did, etc... It is getting better. In the past there have been certain instances where I've thought "Oh no, I'm raising the Bad Seed" (I wish I could think of the perfect example for you, but nothing comes to mind right now).

 

Anyway, I know where you're coming from, but think about the times that she's done really thoughful things (without thinking it'll win her points).

 

You aren't failing. Go to the mall tomorrow after school and eavesdrop on some kids there. I guarantee you'll feel better. You're bound to see/hear kids acting worse than you think yours is.

[plain jane]

Is dd the oldest? Mine is, and she is the same way! Both with her little ds, and me. She tries to tell me I shouldn't have any ____ whatever if she can't, "it's not fair" is uttered a million times a day! She goes to a hs girls club, and ds usually goes with Nana to get his haircut, etc... Never fails that she complains that she didn't get to do what he did, etc... It is getting better. In the past there have been certain instances where I've thought "Oh no, I'm raising the Bad Seed" (I wish I could think of the perfect example for you, but nothing comes to mind right now).

 

Anyway, I know where you're coming from, but think about the times that she's done really thoughful things (without thinking it'll win her points).

 

You aren't failing. Go to the mall tomorrow after school and eavesdrop on some kids there. I guarantee you'll feel better. You're bound to see/hear kids acting worse than you think yours is.

 

 

Yes, she is my oldest. I know she is a very thoughtful child. She is extremely considerate, to a fault usually. I'm just unsure what to think about this "I only obey because I fear punishment" admission. I remember in the Dr. Sears book (I read as my baby bible when she was little), it states that you want your kids to obey you because they love you, not because they fear punishment. Whoops. I thought we were on that road. Apparently not.:001_huh:

[newbie]

Yeah, sounds like seven, about that time they get more territorial. That was about the time, I had to buy two of everything:glare:.

[newbie]

Btw, you are not a lousy parent.

[Frontier Mom]

Yep, my dd is 8 now but we have lots of these same issues. BTW, she is the youngest but the only girl and she is very concerned with being fair, efficient and right. It sounds pretty normal though.

[happyWImom]

Yes, she is my oldest. I know she is a very thoughtful child. She is extremely considerate, to a fault usually. I'm just unsure what to think about this "I only obey because I fear punishment" admission. I remember in the Dr. Sears book (I read as my baby bible when she was little), it states that you want your kids to obey you because they love you, not because they fear punishment. Whoops. I thought we were on that road. Apparently not.:001_huh:

 

I know-you want to "parent from the heart" so they will do the right thing because that's what's in their heart, right? But, knowing how defiant they can be, I can picture my dd telling me that just to bug me. I'm sure she obeys for a little of both reasons. I think she's trying to push your buttons a little. They are soooo smart, aren't they?

[tibbyl]

The Wii? Why shouldn't a 7 year old have a few treasured items that she does not have to share?

 

The bed? Not negotiable.

 

Time for her to learn about social white lies. Instead of saying she had at the friend's, she could say something like thanks for having me over.

[Rosie_0801]

The important thing is to get the right behaviour. You've got that. She sounds very generous with her sharing in my opinion! Right actions for the right reason comes much later.

 

Try reading up on Kohlberg's stages of morality:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kohlberg%27s_stages_of_moral_development#Continued_relevance

 

:)

Rosie

[Remudamom]

There's a fine line between private property and plain old stingy. I have the same problem with one of my girlies.

[flyingmommy]

I have a dd who is 7. Your daughter's behavior sounds pretty normal to me. My 7 yo is my third, so I've been through this with her brother (now 20) and her sister (now 12). She is starting to develop a real sense of ownership and territory. Lots of little kids go through the "mine" phase but when they get to be your daughter's age, they really do understand "mine" in a real sense.

 

I was the third of four children and one of my brothers was extremely destructive. My first memory is of being three years old and locking myself out of my bedroom because I had gotten 2 prizes in my box of cracker jacks (I'm really dating myself here) and I knew my brother would steal them. I was three and I KNEW that my 5 yo brother would steal from me. At Christmas, he'd break his toys, break my other brother's the next day, then start on my toys and my sister's toys. With childhood memories like these, property and ownership is a big deal to me. LOL

 

As far as your daughter only obeying out of fear and not respect, I have always kind of figured that's the way it works. When your children are small, they learn to mind or they have a time out, or a spanking, or whatever. They would much rather be doing what you told them they couldn't. When they get older, hopefully, they obey you from habit and respect. I'd be a lot more worried if she was 15 and only obeyed you out of fear.

 

Jeannie

[myfunnybunch]

she admitted that she only shares things and obeys us because she is afraid of being punished.:confused: Now, she is distraught that she is a terrible person for not being kind because she loves us but only because she doesn't want to get in trouble.

 

She does ere on the very scrupulous side of things and is very unsure of herself at times. I do believe she has anxiety issues and I try to help her through them but I'm at a loss on this one.

 

It sounds as though your dd is far more insightful into her own motivations than many children her age, and she is scrupulous about admitting it. That speaks to me of honesty and trust in her relationship with her parents. I doubt very much that a child only afraid of punishment would even admit such feelings. My guess is that she is confused because while she has a desire to obey out of love rather than fear of punishment, she does not always feel that desire to obey in the moment, and she's much harder on herself that you would ever be. :grouphug: I mean that to be encouraging, by the way. She's sharing very normal feelings, and she's at a normal stage developmentally. My just-turned 8 has been working on sharing and similar issues for a while, and he's starting to get it.

 

I have a guy who can be a little anxious and pretty hard on himself. (He is also very thoughtful, kind and sensitive.) What he needs most is positive strokes when he is showing his sweet sensitive side, and reassurance that feeling petulant, frustrated, angry, or not wanting to share or obey is normal, and guidance in appropriately dealing with those feelings. Letting him know that no one is perfect, and that issues like sharing and willing obedience are life challenges we all face, and that Mom and Dad's job is to help him with those challenges helps too, I think.

 

Taking new information that your child gives you, trying to help them grow into the wonderful people they are, and being willing to look at yourself as a parent in that process is a sign of a good momma. :) Don't you be too hard on yourself either. :grouphug:

 

Cat

 

ETA: Sometimes my kids obey because they love me or because it's the right thing to do. Other times they obey to avoid the consequences. It's life with children, I think, especially when they are young. :)

Edited December 4, 2008 by myfunnybunch

[bumbledeb]

I think your daughter sounds lovely. And so do you.:)

 

I don't think she is being unreasonable about the Mii, or the bed.

 

If I was going to be away for a night, I'd at least expect someone to ask if it was OK with me if they wanted to sleep in my bed. I'd feel a little miffed if someone just assumed it was OK. I'd say yes, of course, but I would want to be asked.

 

I'd also not want anyone using my Mii, without at least asking first. Again, I'd say yes, because it doesn't mean much to me, but I can perfectly see how it could mean a lot to your daughter. Much older people than she would care quite a lot. (I hardly ever play the Wii, so I may be wrong, but isn't it possible to set up many different Miis, making it quite easy not to have to use someone else's?)

 

I completely understand why you want to be obeyed out of love, not out of fear of punishment. I never punish my children, and they do obey me. They also love me, but I don't actually think that that is why they obey. They obey me because they believe that obedience to parents is required by God, and that such requirement is because of God's love for them. I don't think that most humans obey other humans purely on the basis of whether or not we love them. Your husband loves you, does he obey you? Would you expect him to? How about other adults with whom you have a loving relationship, is obedience expected as an evidence of love?

[Pamela H in Texas]

Jane,

 

I have a couple thoughts swimming through my head.

 

First, I don't think kids (or adults) have to share EVERYTHING. I have NO issue with her wanting her Mii and bed to remain HERs and hers alone.

 

But on to more important things....

 

Part of being 7 IS doing things or not doing things out of fear to some extent. Fear of punishment would be most common just because most parents use punishment to control their children. Really, by using punishment, a parent IS trying to deter their child from making that choice again.

 

Some kids are more sensitive than others. It may be that if you used non-punitive discipline, your daughter would still fear the consequences or disappointing you and daddy. Honestly, from your post, this sounds likely. BTW, my ds is similar. We don't use punishment, but that boy can take disappointment or consequences to heart like no one I've ever met!

 

And developmentally, these things make sense. If you look into moral development, you'll see that the most basic in moral development is fearing consequences (or reaching for positive consequences). Most 7yos, even though many parents wouldn't admit it, ARE in that first stage of development still even if they give all the right answers to thinking/problem solving/moral/spiritual questions.

 

It sounds as if your daughter may be, to some extent, emerging from that first stage of development though. SHe now has a conscience about the fact that she'd like to be motivated by more important things than simply avoiding punishment.

 

Honestly, I wouldn't use punishment with this child. She's obviously very sensitive to it and since it's not necessary, why not move on. Many parents naturally move away from punishment about the time the child is 8 anyway just because other options are easier to use with a more reasoning-capable aged child. I think you can feel pretty okay about doing it because your daughter is examining herself more closely anyway. She's entering into being able to think of real consequences and make better choices for better reasons. Well, and she'll gain better thoughts of herself and that she CAN and WILL make good choices for good reasons rather than fear of punishment.

 

And she STILL may be very sensitive about the better discipline even. That is okay to an extent. We ALL have things we do or don't do out of fear. Some are still stuck at fearing punishment, but most of us control ourselves SOMETIMES based on the real consequences, our faith beliefs, duties, even just habit. I'd allow that.

 

But she does need to learn to not beat herself up. That may take a great deal of conversation, encouragement, etc. It may, at some point, especially if she has ongoing anxiety issues, require some sort of additional outside help. But for now, I'd assume, it's just her own struggle with reaching for the next developmental step and she'll overcome it with a bit of support.

 

Anyway, generally, I see her revelation to be a good thing. I'd encourage her to grow :)

[Ruth in Canada]

This may be way off base, but do you think your daughter has concerns about germs? Does she wash her hands more than most kids? Do you think she's overly concerned about lying and "bad thoughts"? If you think these may be concerns, you may find it very helpful to read a book about obsessive-compulsive behavior. I would recommend "Talking Back to OCD". Again--this may be completely irrelevant to your situation--but if it's not, a book like this could be greatly reassuring and helpful.

[Tammyla]

She sounds sweet and like a seven year old to me, who is trying to figure out the complexities and subtle degrees of telling the truth with kindness, (The whole truth, and nothing but the truth!) in everyday old life.

 

You know what, I would happily speed (in great excess of the speed limit) down the highway..if I wouldn't get a ticket. I also do not like to share some of my things...Oldest child here, who had a destructive sister. Your dd sounds perfectly normal to me and just needs a little guidance. Is she a perfectionist? Sounds like she is a little hard on herself at times.

[Kris]

The Point: I don't blame her a bit. I don't want other people in my bed either!

 

The Babbling: A few years ago a neighbor kid called and wanted to borrow The Kid's headphones -- which he had purchased with his own money. He said no. I told him that was a lousy thing to do -- what was the big deal? Well, the big deal was, the girl got angry about something (not unusual) threw a fit, broke them in half, and when asked how she was going to remedy that situation, *she* said, "What's the big deal?" I felt like a heel and bought him some new ones. And I do *not* insist that he share anything with anyone anymore.

 

He's a kid and doesn't take care of all of his stuff, but he's very careful with most of it. He's had CDs for years that don't have a scratch on them -- games the same way. I'm thinking if he takes care of his things, and he knows his friends don't, it's no wonder he doesn't want to share this stuff. He buys these things with money that he has earned, and, so far, not a single item that has been damaged by one of his friends has been replaced.

 

So I don't see the need to force him to give his things away.

 

I understand how you're feeling, but a gift -- of any kind -- isn't truly a gift if it isn't given freely. You've said she's generous in other ways -- and so is my son -- so seems like that would be enough. I wouldn't, basically, open up my house to anyone and everyone who might want something that I have. And believe it or not, I do have neighbors who come down to "visit" and end up only giving me a laundry list of things they want to take home with them.

 

She sounds like a great kid, and you sound like a great Mom. I just wouldn't push it. Seems to me this all about her learning to set her personal boundaries.

[jamnkats]

 

ETA: Do your kids obey you because they love you or because they too, fear the punishment? I'd like to know what other kids are like. :D

 

I had to answer this if only to give you a different perspective. My kids don't obey me and we do not punish. My kids do what I request either because they want to help me, want to help my needs get met, agree that the request is reasonable and don't have a problem with it or a myriad of other reasons (I can imagine one might be because it is easier to comply sometimes :)).

 

We don't punish so my kids don't comply with a request out of fear. They also know that when I make a request, it is just that, a request, and they are free to respond with a negative (isn't there a word in English for this?).

 

And they aren't hell-raisers. And they don't push the boundaries of society. And they are definitely respectful. Sometimes, they are more respectful than I, the admitted rebel, are.

 

If you're interested, check out Consentual Living or NVC or, well, let me find you some links...

 

Ok, NVC here (Non Violent Communication - not a parenting "thing" per se, but a way of bringing peace to the world) http://cnvc.org/

 

and consentual living here http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Consensual-living/

Edited December 6, 2008 by jamnkats

[Mommyof4ks]

Your DD sounds just like my DD8. She does share some stuff, but she is not growing up in the same environment that I grew up in. I think she is selfish, because when I grew up we had to share with neighbors, friends and family, because we did not have money for things like video games or even beds at times so we all shared. No one had a problem with it because it was the only way we would get to use some stuff. My kids get lots of stuff and so do their friends, so they are living a totally different life than I did. We don't make her share personal things like her bed, favorite toys, or anything that she buys with her own money, but the Wii is a family item and is to be shared with those who cannot get one. We are blessed to be able to afford these things, and we need to share IMO. If you know someone well enough to lend out a Wii to them, then simply ask them not to use her Mii or set up Miis for the friends and let them use those. My DD is overprotective of her Mii too, because she wants to do everything herself which is valid I think. I make sure that my DD sees me lending out my stuff as well so she understands what it means to be a good friend and live as part of a community.

 

My DD has not really been punished since she was 5 or 6, but she still has fears of punishment (time out, spanking for running in the street sort of stuff). When we talked about it a few months ago she was really afraid of disappointing us. She has a huge need to please us, so we make a point to praise her often. Our sons do not require this constant praise for every little thing, but she does.

[sunshine]

[quote name=plainjane

 

ETA: Do your kids obey you because they love you or because they too' date=' fear the punishment? I'd like to know what other kids are like. :D

 

My 8 (gonna be 9 at 6:17pm today), is a sensitive child too. She gets just like you described your little girl. It sounds like she is a very sweet and sensitive little girl that gets upset with herself when she realizes that she has selfish inclinations sometimes. thinking hat you will be disappointed in her causes her more anxiety. you didn't do this. She is born with a nature that is sensitive to more things and thoughts than you or I may have, and she thinks about things deeply. She will need alot of extra hugs and smiles for just no reason, to help with her anxiety. You are not a bad parent. quite the contrary since she is so honest with you that she trusts you with her disappointments in herself. Encourage her to keep being honest and tell her when she admits to something that although it may not be a good way to be, she is not bad to feel that way. We sometimes cannot control what we feel in a situation but we can control what we do. there is a verse in the Bible if you are a believer that may comfort her 1 Cor. 10:13

"No temptation has overtaken you except such as is common to man; but God is faithful, who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation will also make the way of escape, that you may be able to bear it."

In other words, being selfish is something EVERYONE has felt before and there is nothing wrong with her, and fear of retribution is common also.

Hold your little angel tight. She is one that will need the extra hugs to get through this hard life. And let her stay home more, socialization at that age is WAY overrated. I never allow my young ones to spend the night away unless it is an emergency. they don't need to spend the night with friends, I don't spend the night at my friends house. We go home after we play. :D

[sunshine]

I think your daughter sounds lovely. And so do you.:)

 

I don't think she is being unreasonable about the Mii, or the bed.

 

If I was going to be away for a night, I'd at least expect someone to ask if it was OK with me if they wanted to sleep in my bed. I'd feel a little miffed if someone just assumed it was OK. I'd say yes, of course, but I would want to be asked.

 

I'd also not want anyone using my Mii, without at least asking first. Again, I'd say yes, because it doesn't mean much to me, but I can perfectly see how it could mean a lot to your daughter. Much older people than she would care quite a lot. (I hardly ever play the Wii, so I may be wrong, but isn't it possible to set up many different Miis, making it quite easy not to have to use someone else's?)

 

I completely understand why you want to be obeyed out of love, not out of fear of punishment. I never punish my children, and they do obey me. They also love me, but I don't actually think that that is why they obey. They obey me because they believe that obedience to parents is required by God, and that such requirement is because of God's love for them. I don't think that most humans obey other humans purely on the basis of whether or not we love them. Your husband loves you, does he obey you? Would you expect him to? How about other adults with whom you have a loving relationship, is obedience expected as an evidence of love?

 

:iagree::iagree:

[Danestress]

She just sounds very conscientious and honest.

 

I wouldn't want someone to sleep in my bed either. I'm very possessive of my bed. I wouldn't want someone to borrow my Wii either (I don't have one, though) and use whatever feature would change my records and earnings or whatever. Even at her age, I think some people need the security of knowing that their belongings are theirs and are not fair game for everyone else. It's great she shares. I insist on sharing to some extent, but I would not allow one child to move in on another's bed without asking, unless it was necessary to accomodate guets.

 

Saying, "I had fun" is good manners, and it's also lying. You could give her some lines to use that would not be lying, such as, "Thank you for having me over."

 

My kids do not just obey more for fear of "punishment" because we aren't big punishers around here, but I assume they do obey for fear of negative results. They obey me because they know they should and will feel badly if they don't. They obey me because they don't want to be in disfavor. They don't want me to be annoyed. THey don't want me to stand there supervising as they do something that could have been painlessly done without supervision. These are pretty much the reasons I try to do the right thing. I don't want to feel the quilt of doing the wrong thing. I don't want to make a jerk of myself. I don't want tension with the people I love. I don't think those are "bad" reasons to meet your obligations and duties. Of course we all have the oppositive, positive motive of wanting to do the right thing for the positive effects on how we feel and how our relationshps are.

Edited December 6, 2008 by Danestress

[Doran]

I don't have much to add here other than (((big hugs of understanding))). I've been where you are. You're doing just fine, I am quite certain. Others here have given you sound advice. I will just add one other little tidbit: notice that you are "beating yourself up" over the possibility of doing something wrong, and your daughter is doing the same. I'm betting if you relax, she will feel that coming from you and relax a bit herself. Ask me how I know. :o

 

Hang in there.