struggling with social anxiety

[caedmyn]

**Please don't quote**

I've had some problems with social anxiety for the past few years.  It's only at group events, and most of the group events I attend are church-related.  We got to a small church with about 85 members. We've gone to the same church for 11 years so we know most of the people.  It seems to be a combination of off-and-on issues with depression, low self-esteem, and some less-than-positive experiences at group events causing the social anxiety.  I feel like it's a vicious cycle at this point, where I hang back and have a hard time interacting with people at group events, which causes other people to think I'm stuck-up or something and avoid talking to me.  I feel like there must be something wrong with me, because other people don't seem to have this problem.

I am not good at small talk or at joining groups of people, and I am very quiet and a strong introvert by nature.  Typically when I attend a group event, it seems like everyone is in already talking to someone else and there is no one available to talk to.  Sometimes I go around and looked for someone that I want to talk to (sometimes I find someone, sometimes I don't), or I stand there by myself feeling stupid or trying not to cry, which makes it really difficult to even try to talk to someone.  People rarely come up and start a conversation with me on their own initiative, other than to say hi in passing.  I don't know why this is--for my whole life I've always been the one to initiate get-togethers with friends also, with the exception of one friend in my entire life.  It's not like I don't have friends, I do have a few.  Two of my friends have told me several times that they're really glad I'm their friend and they're thankful I initiate get-togethers with them. 

I feel like people like me, more or less, but don't really value me as a person, if that makes any sense.  We have a monthly potluck at our church and about 2/3 of the time DH and I and our younger kids sit at a table alone.  There are two or three "adult" tables (as opposed to the ones where the kids all sit) but people don't usually sit with us unless there are no open seats at the "adult" tables, which makes me feel like dirt.  I'm always one of the first adults to sit down because the younger kids get food first so I get food for my younger kids and myself and then sit down.

I also don't understand why people don't really open up to me (except for friends).  For example, we went to a Harvest party on October 31st.  I sat down next to a young adult that we know well.  I asked her a few questions and she talked a little bit.  Then DH sat down at the table and asked her basically the same things and she told him so much more than she'd told me.  I've noticed many times that I'll ask someone questions but they don't reciprocate by asking me questions.  This is even true of people I know like me just fine and are extroverts who talk a lot!

Anyway, I'm just wondering if there's something I can do to try to overcome this social anxiety.  I've thought about talking to a counselor about it but it's difficult to find one who's actually helpful (I've tried, for various issues).

[prairiewindmomma]

Can you build one on one relationships with people from church?  Can you bring a meal in to someone recovering from surgery or invite a family over for supper? I am Team Introvert and by building those relationships privately, I can cope with group chaos.

I wonder how many other families with small children are at your church. Honestly, I wonder if this is a large family of small children mixed in with an older congregation problem.

[regentrude]

Your description of the church potluck had me wonder: you say you and your DH and little kids sit together at one table, and there are adult tables and kids tables. Could it be that the adults simply prefer to eat and socialize with other adults and don't seek out a table with little kids unless there are no other seats? I honestly would not choose to sit with little kids who aren't my own unless their parent were a close friend of mine.

 

Edited November 14, 2019 by regentrude

[prairiewindmomma]

I have also noticed that most people are exceptionally bad listeners. They love to talk about themselves. I use this to my advantage as I don’t like the spotlight shining on me, so it doesn’t bother me when people don’t reciprocate by asking about me. 

Is the conversation otherwise unbalanced? If it is, I will sometimes start by giving my answer and then asking them the same question....ie...”I think we’re just going to hang out at home this Thanksgiving. Do you have travel plans? Or are people coming to you?” Another example: “I love period tv shows! I am so excited that a new season of The Crown is dropping on Netflix. I’d love to find someone to watch with me! My husband and kids won’t watch with me, they are really into sci fi and fantasy. What kind of tv shows do you enjoy?” 

[DoraBora]

25 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Can you build one on one relationships with people from church?  Can you bring a meal in to someone recovering from surgery or invite a family over for supper? I am Team Introvert and by building those relationships privately, I can cope with group chaos.

I wonder how many other families with small children are at your church. Honestly, I wonder if this is a large family of small children mixed in with an older congregation problem.

I think this is a great idea.  Maybe you could make a point to chat with someone who seems receptive to speaking to you for a few Sundays (or whenevers) in a row.  Then ask if she'd like to meet somewhere for a cup of coffee or invite her and her family over for pizza and games one night soon.  When you extend the invitation, make the time relatively brief: Do you want to meet at Starbucks for an hour or so on Tuesday?  Would you and your family like to come over for pizza and games for a couple of hours on Friday evening?  Keeping it brief might make you feel at greater ease and can make a meeting seem easier to manage, schedule-wise, for the other person.

Seeing someone outside of the official meeting times adds some heft to the relationship.  It will give you something to talk about when you see them again.

And you may have to keep at it.  If the first try doesn't work - she doesn't have time -- try for another time.  If she seems uninterested, try someone else.  

My mom had a wonderful friend whose husband worked for oil companies.  They moved all over the place, like military people, and were often the new kids on the block.  She would start in, trying to make connections by extending invitations over and over.  It can take some time.

I think I understand where you are in this, and I'm sorry you have depression to deal with and some anxiety.  Social situations are tiring for an introverted person -- they are for me, anyway -- but the effort might well pay off.

Edited November 14, 2019 by DoraBora

[kbutton]

With the conversation with the young adult--sometimes that sort of thing where the second person asks and gets more of an answer is just that the person has been primed already. They have more time to have thought of an answer, or feel more like, "Wow, a second person asked the same thing; must be people are interested, so let me be more detailed." 

Otherwise, I think this is probably a mismatch, and it's also a "problem" of having several kids, presumably boisterous ones at that. So, the kids...you have them, and some people don't really respond to big families until the kids are bigger. I am not sure why, but it's a thing. As regentrude mentioned, not everyone will sit with kids unless the relationship is already solid. That's not your fault, and in a small church, it sounds like people are not making the effort. 

The mismatch...we went to a church for a long time, and we had acquaintances, some friends, but as a whole, we were always the odd people out. Always. We left, and I don't have this same problem at all in the new church. I have made far more connections in far less time at my new church. It's bigger, and they create more low-stakes ways to get to know people. The social fabric has a lot of textures there, so to speak.

I also think that sometimes people peg someone a certain way, and then you don't really get over that. In our old church, I was struggling. I had kids with undiagnosed problems, and I was told I was a problem. This is a problem with their thinking and how things played out beyond my control. In my new church, I am a resource. The difference is night and day, and it's largely how the people in my old church viewed cognitive and developmental differences. Ironically, the church was full of kids with these issues, and what made me stand out is that I noticed. New church--people already know this and many of them care and want things to be different for their kids.

I really don't think this is you. It's the church. Find someplace that lets you be you. If you don't have options due to distance or not many churches, you might have to develop rhino hide or find a different social outlet.

 

[DoraBora]

Another thought:  Does your church have a volunteer ministry in which you could participate during the evenings (while your husband watches the children)?  Working with someone on a project can be a good way to get to know someone.  Then you could follow up with an invitation.

[katilac]

If most of the events you go to are church-related, it's quite possible it would be different if you went to different events. I'd try adding something to the mix if possible. 

21 minutes ago, regentrude said:

Your description of the church potluck had me wonder: you say you and your DH and little kids sit together at one table, and there are adult tables and kids tables. Could it be that the adults simply prefer to eat and socialize with other adults and don't seek out a table with little kids unless there are no other seats? I honestly would not choose to sit with little kids who aren't my own unless their parent were a close friend of mine.

Yeah, I'll admit I'm not going to rush to the table with six kids to enjoy my meal, lol. And if eight of you are already sitting at the table, how many more spots can there possibly be? I'm sure that plays into it to some extent. Some of yours are young enough that you're probably spending a fair amount of time tending to them, and people will often not walk up if someone seems busy. 

Can you try having your bigs sit with other kids? 

Don't compare yourself or the reactions you get to your dh. Be at peace with who you are. I'm never going to be the most popular person in the room, I'm never going to be the person tpeople are actively seeking out, and that's okay. It did hurt my feelings for a long time that there are things I'm not included in, but I realized that's likely because I'm not the person who is always out and about, socializing and doing things, so I'm not on their radar as much. Even if that's not the main reason, what can I do? I am who I am and I have other great qualities. You do, too! When I want to do something, I initiate (knowing I'm not going to get the response someone else might, lol). 

You said that it's different with friends - hey, congrats, you HAVE friends! Lots of people post on this board about not having friends, so you're ahead of many, lol. Try not to get hung up on this one thing that may be caused by a season in your life (lots of kids and most socializing is in the one same place). And  I've honestly never quite figured out why some people get more attention (it's obvious sometimes, of course, but plenty of times it's baffling). It has nothing to do with your worth as a person. It sounds like the friends you do have are good ones who appreciate you. Being a good friend and sustaining friendships is a wonderful, valuable quality. 

I know it's hard no matter what the reason, so hugs and cheers to you. 

[happi duck]

(Hugs)

At one point I had panic attacks at the *thought* of attending church.  I stopped attending for years.

I still can't eat at church.  I eat just enough to be polite but I end up sick from food plus nerves.

My very best thing is volunteering.  It is the best way I know people and if I'm working on something I'm not worrying about where to stand or what to say etc.

More (hugs)

[caedmyn]

35 minutes ago, katilac said:

Yeah, I'll admit I'm not going to rush to the table with six kids to enjoy my meal, lol. And if eight of you are already sitting at the table, how many more spots can there possibly be? I'm sure that plays into it to some extent. Some of yours are young enough that you're probably spending a fair amount of time tending to them, and people will often not walk up if someone seems busy. 

Can you try having your bigs sit with other kids? 

 

It's just the 1 & 3 yo sitting with us.  The older ones already sit with the other kids.  I'm not sure it's primarily a kid thing, because I first noticed that people weren't sitting with us at potluck about 6 years ago, and at the time there were two other families with babies and toddlers, and they didn't seem to have the same issues with no one wanting to sit by them.

[SKL]

I have similar issues, except that I don't even want to talk to people in settings like that.  I like people fine, just not in "social gatherings."

So first of all, I think you should try to accept that you are just not wired like everyone else.  It takes all kinds.  There is nothing wrong with being more introverted and your husband being more extroverted / charismatic.

Secondly, since you say people say less to you than to your husband even to the same questions, is it possible you have a distracted look on your face?  Like half of your mind is wondering if your kid is going to spill his milk?  Or are your kids trying to get your attention while you are talking to other people?  This would likely cause the other person to cut it short out of respect for the other demands on your attention.  Can you ask your husband if he notices this happening, and if so, discuss what you might do about it?  (Or could you be OK with just being happy attending to your kids and not worry about whether people are talking to you?)

[caedmyn]

1 hour ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Can you build one on one relationships with people from church?  Can you bring a meal in to someone recovering from surgery or invite a family over for supper? I am Team Introvert and by building those relationships privately, I can cope with group chaos.

I wonder how many other families with small children are at your church. Honestly, I wonder if this is a large family of small children mixed in with an older congregation problem.

I spent a lot of time doing those things the first several years we attended this church.  I've made a meal every time someone had a new baby or asked for meals after a surgery.  We've had most of the families in the church over for dinner.  I've done at least one playdate with most of the moms who have kids the age of my older ones.  I know most of the families reasonably well.

There is only one other family with a child under 5.  Then there are a lot of kids in the 6-11 age range.  But bigger families are really the norm here--most of the families in the church have 4 kids, one has 5, and one brings 5 or 6 grandkids every week.  I think it is partly that people get in their groups and then they don't notice people who aren't in their group. 

[Bambam]

I help with serving, setting up/out the food, helping people as they need while they are going through the line, pour the drinks, carry food/extra plates for those who need help (young kids, older/shaky folks). This allows me to interact and help people but doesn't put anyone on the spot. That may not be easy with young children though. 

I know when I see a family just sitting together with young kids, I wonder if I should sit with them. Does they want to eat together as a family? Will mom be embarrassed if another adult sits there and she has to help her kids or they are messy? If I go up and ask if I can sit with them, I'm pretty sure they would feel compelled to say yes because politeness even if they really don't want anyone else at their table, you know? 

I might try to find one easy-going accepting couple (older maybe?) and explain to the lady (or man or both) that I have trouble in this social situation, and ask if I can sit with them. 

What about the preacher? Can you sit with him? 

I'm not always a talker. Sometimes I'm just a sit-and-listen person. No one seems to mind that person because so many aren't interested in listening. 

I hope you find a solution. Good for you for continuing to go when you aren't comfortable! 

 

[EKS]

It's possible that you're sending out vibes that you don't want people to talk to you or sit with you or whatever.  I think that I have this problem, which is why I mention it.

[katilac]

3 hours ago, caedmyn said:

 I think it is partly that people get in their groups and then they don't notice people who aren't in their group. 

I think this is probably a big part of it!

[itsheresomewhere]

3 hours ago, caedmyn said:

I think it is partly that people get in their groups and then they don't notice people who aren't in their group. 

I was explaining this exactly to my DD recently.  Here it seems lately once they put the effort into the original group, they don’t into adding to the groups.  Perhaps, they are too exhausted mentally to add and learn about a new person but is frustrating trying to break into it.  

[SereneHome]

5 hours ago, caedmyn said:

I spent a lot of time doing those things the first several years we attended this church.  I've made a meal every time someone had a new baby or asked for meals after a surgery.  We've had most of the families in the church over for dinner.  I've done at least one playdate with most of the moms who have kids the age of my older ones.  I know most of the families reasonably well.

There is only one other family with a child under 5.  Then there are a lot of kids in the 6-11 age range.  But bigger families are really the norm here--most of the families in the church have 4 kids, one has 5, and one brings 5 or 6 grandkids every week.  I think it is partly that people get in their groups and then they don't notice people who aren't in their group. 

I can't really give good advice bc 1) I have never been a member of such organization and don't know the dynamics (I am not a Christian and 2) I truly don't care if people talk to me at social events- I actually prefer to sit and watch people - free entertainment right there.  But it was heartbreaking to read your OP and please don't be mad at me for saying this - but this congregation doesn't sound very nice.  I think you deserve so much better!!!!

 

[Ausmumof3]

I have similar experiences and particularly at church to the point sometimes it’s hard to handle going.  I actually wonder sometimes if the socialising at church was part of the problem.  When I was a kid people went for the worship then the socialising happened over a meal at each other’s houses.  This is so much less intimidating.  Unfortunately many people are so busy now there is no time for hospitality.  And I include is in that even though as a sahm it’s not entirely true for me.  For dh Sunday afternoon is often the only time he has home at all so the thought of hosting isn’t what he wants.

[teachermom2834]

I’ve been on both sides of this. I have gotten better at the small talk social stuff with practice. But it does take practice for me and I get rusty if I don’t put myself out there once in a while. I sometimes commit to some aspect (bringing an item, set up, etc) when I know I will want to balk as the time gets nearer. I don’t think I’m an introvert, exactly. I like to socialize I am just very awkward I guess and I have difficulty initiating. 
 

I also know that if I go to an event I have friends attending I will gravitate toward sitting with them. Now, I wouldn’t make a scene or tell someone we were saving half our table or pull chairs away to crowd another table but I do like to sit with my friends. I don’t see them often and of course we want to catch up and laugh or whatever. So I do see how that is the natural flow of things and people need to be very intentional to include others. 
 

In homeschool and women’s groups I have been involved in there seems a constant refrain of new people feeling excluded and unwelcome no matter how much the established folks focus on welcoming. It’s just tough. There is no way a new woman is going to fall in thick as thieves with a bunch of women who raised their now adult children together, for example. It takes time and no one is at fault really. 

Even though it looks so easy for most people I think more people struggle than you think. One of my best friends now reached out to me when we first moved here and I brushed her off. She actually found me on FB and messaged me and asked me to get coffee. I didn’t take her up on it but years later as our paths crossed we became friends and now I’m mad I wasted time getting to know her. She told me she was desperate for friends. She is confident and outgoing and you would never know it was like that for her. And we have now been accused of being part of a group that is so tight it excludes others. Which feels untrue and unfair.  Especially because after five years at our church and being involved in women’s and youth ministries I still get anxiety before a potluck or other social event. 

All that rambling just to say there are probably more people than you would ever know in any given situation that are struggling to be comfortable. So while that doesn’t change your situation, exactly, maybe knowing you are not alone might.