Deleted

[fairfarmhand]

Thank you!

Edited March 19, 2017 by fairfarmhand

[FaithManor]

On behalf of your 15 year old, I would bring it up to your 19 year old. Sister needs to have her own, special prom experience. The 15 year old after all did not tag along on older sister's prom just because "no one enforces the rules". It is also an ethical issue. Just because no one enforces them doesn't mean she should role model breaking the rules to the younger crowd.

[Barb_]

I think it would be fine if she were dating someone who was going. My 19yo boyfriend went to my senior prom. But trying to extend her high school years is different and I would discourage her. Your gut feelings are correct, IMO. I have a reluctant to grow up 17yo and I could see her doing something like this.

[Catwoman]

It's hard for me to imagine a college girl wanting to attend a high school prom. I also find it unusual that she still wants a group of 15 year-olds as her friends, and not other college kids.

 

Is she an extremely insecure or shy person?

[wintermom]

Depending on your older dd's class sizes, the fact that she's not in residence/dorm, and her personality being a little more reserved, it's probably quite challenging to find friends. Maybe you could help her find some activities or opportunities to meet with her peers in small-group settings. There are masses of activities on most campuses, she just needs to pick something and get out there and try a few things. It will take time, but it's good to learn how to do, even if the people she meets don't turn out to be life-long friends.

[Catwoman]

Could your dd find a part time job on the college campus? It might be a way for her to make some friends her own age.

[Faithr]

I think kids react to change differently.  Some can be very insecure about it.  A lot of kids shut down or they get to college and flunk out or get depressed.  It sounds like she is doing well at school and working (which is a lot!) but there's one area where she is trying to find her footing.  Is she nostalgic about her high school years?    As to the prom, I would check with the folks holding it, to see if they are ok with her attending.    My son had a gap year before he went away to college and he also had friends that were still homeschooling high school so he attended even though he technically had already graduated.  But they might want to make sure that your dd doesn't bump an actual high schooler if the attendance is full.  Personally, I would try to focus on what she is accomplishing.  Chances are things will smooth out as she adjusts and gets older.

[fairfarmhand]

Depending on your older dd's class sizes, the fact that she's not in residence/dorm, and her personality being a little more reserved, it's probably quite challenging to find friends. Maybe you could help her find some activities or opportunities to meet with her peers in small-group settings. There are masses of activities on most campuses, she just needs to pick something and get out there and try a few things. It will take time, but it's good to learn how to do, even if the people she meets don't turn out to be life-long friends.

The problem is the time.

 

She works part time, does work study and goes to class.

 

And she wants the friends to be instantly close like the friends she's had in the past.

 

[fairfarmhand]

I think kids react to change differently.  Some can be very insecure about it.  A lot of kids shut down or they get to college and flunk out or get depressed.  It sounds like she is doing well at school and working (which is a lot!) but there's one area where she is trying to find her footing.  Is she nostalgic about her high school years?    As to the prom, I would check with the folks holding it, to see if they are ok with her attending.    My son had a gap year before he went away to college and he also had friends that were still homeschooling high school so he attended even though he technically had already graduated.  But they might want to make sure that your dd doesn't bump an actual high schooler if the attendance is full.  Personally, I would try to focus on what she is accomplishing.  Chances are things will smooth out as she adjusts and gets older.

Yes, very much so.

 

[klmama]

Our local homeschool prom invites "alumni" to come up to age 20.  Some, like your dd, still like to hang out with their friends from high school, and they all like to dance.  There aren't many places for non-public-school teens to dance where we live, so attending a prom with younger friends doesn't seem terribly odd to me.  If grads aren't allowed, though, I don't think she should go.  It shows disrespect for those throwing the party, and it would be mortifying for the 15yo if suddenly someone did enforce the rules and kicked out her sister. 

[Hilltopmom]

Several of the local kids who have graduated still spend most of their free time with the younger (11-12 grade) homeschoolers....

We spent years being proud of them for playing with kids of all ages when they were younger, not just their age mates.. Right?

Some of them don't drive yet, we're in a rural area, so they just haven't made new older friends & still come to homeschool group stuff.

 

I'd encourage her to try out some clubs on campus.

 

prom may be ok with all the families, if all the kids hang out together.

[fairfarmhand]

For those who don't think it's that big of a deal, would it matter if younger dd didn't really want her there?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Seasider]

For those who don't think it's that big of a deal, would it matter if younger dd didn't really want her there?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think it matters quite a bit. I'd guess it's not just about the prom, either. My kids love each other, and enjoy each others' company, but they have their own established place in their own immediate peer groups. When older siblings graduate, youngers move up that social ladder. They've bided their time, and should have enjoyment in their older high school years being the big fish in the pond.

 

Did younger dd get to go to the prom all the years older dd went? Or were there some years she was told she was "too young"?

 

Is there perhaps a guy in the group older dd is interested in? I could see how that would be rocking the boat.

[MedicMom]

I feel for her. I had an incredibly difficult time making friends in college for similar reasons. I commuted, I worked, I didn't have time for on campus clubs or activities. Over a decade later I still regret it. Commuting was not right for me. I moved on campus junior year, but cliques had already been established and I was still going home to work on weekends. It was so lonely all the way through. Your DD is likely seeing the intense friendships many of the other students have that comes from living and working and studying together, which makes her miss her high school friendships even more.

 

I don't think she should go if younger DD doesn't want her there. Is there any way she can cut back her work hours to spend more time on campus and/or look into living on campus at some point? Frankly it sounds like she really needs to make a clean break, completely, from her high school life.

[EmseB]

This reminds me of how our high school church youth group would insist that the graduated seniors go on to the college/career group for Sunday school.  They were pretty firm about it too. You couldn't attend or hang out with the high schoolers or join in their activities if you had already graduated (I mean, over the summer there were still a few senior activities, sure, but after that you were done).  There were a ton of reasons for this, but a lot of it was because it was good to move on, even if you really liked high school youth group. Even if you weren't going on to college.  Point was, you weren't in high school anymore, and the kids in high school needed the same high school group that you had when you were a high schooler.

 

Maybe my experience with that colors my opinion, but I can see the benefits all around of her no longer attending high school events.

[Catwoman]

For those who don't think it's that big of a deal, would it matter if younger dd didn't really want her there?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well, I thought it was kind of a big deal, but it's an even bigger deal if your 15yo doesn't want her there.

 

This is interesting because I feel like if the situation was reversed and your 19yo didn't want her 15yo sister tagging along and hanging out with her and her other 19yo friends, people would probably say that the 19yo deserves her own life and her own friends, and she shouldn't have to entertain her younger sister.

 

This seems like the exact same situation in reverse. I think it's great that your two dds enjoy spending time together, but your 15yo deserves the chance to have her own group of friends and to enjoy her own high school prom without having to feel guilty that her older sister is sitting at home.

 

I feel sorry for your 19yo, but I don't think it's fair that your 15yo has to share her friends with her college-aged sister.

[zoobie]

Well, I thought it was kind of a big deal, but it's an even bigger deal if your 15yo doesn't want her there.

 

This is interesting because I feel like if the situation was reversed and your 19yo didn't want her 15yo sister tagging along and hanging out with her and her other 19yo friends, people would probably say that the 19yo deserves her own life and her own friends, and she shouldn't have to entertain her younger sister.

 

This seems like the exact same situation in reverse. I think it's great that your two dds enjoy spending time together, but your 15yo deserves the chance to have her own group of friends and to enjoy her own high school prom without having to feel guilty that her older sister is sitting at home.

 

I feel sorry for your 19yo, but I don't think it's fair that your 15yo has to share her friends with her college-aged sister.

I think that might be a great way to explain it to her too.

[fairfarmhand]

How does one explain this to my older without making out the younger to be "selfish." Because that's how my oldest will see it.

[MysteryJen]

She should not go. It is not her place anymore and her sister deserves to have her own circle and high school years.

 

Sent from my LG-H345 using Tapatalk

[Catwoman]

How does one explain this to my older without making out the younger to be "selfish." Because that's how my oldest will see it.

Your older dd had her time to attend the prom and now it's her younger sister's turn.

 

There is nothing selfish about that.

 

Do you know why your older dd is so resistant to growing up? There is usually a fairly large maturity gap between 15yos and 19yos, so it surprises me that your 19yo is happy with having 15yo friends and wanting to do the same things they do.

 

Edited to add -- I hope my post didn't come across as snarky! I'm honestly trying to understand why a 19yo college student would want to hang around with a group of 15yos. The concept is foreign to me because with the kids we know, once they're in college, the high school sophomore experience isn't something they want to re-live. They feel too grown up for that. I'm trying to figure out what makes it different for your dd, and how you might be able to help her move on to some friends her own age or activities for college kids instead of high school stuff.

Edited March 19, 2017 by Catwoman

[HSmomof2]

Could your dd find a part time job on the college campus? It might be a way for her to make some friends her own age.

If living on campus is a possibility for her, that would be a good way to get to know people. A job on campus may help with that as well. Does she absolutely need the part-time job? Or could she work less hours to allow her time to be involved in other activities with people her age?

 

As for the prom, if younger dd doesn't want her to go, and it's actually against the rules for her to go, I would discourage her from going. Our homeschool prom here allows alumni up to age 19, so it wouldn't be a big deal.

 

I empathize with your older dd. I'm quiet and prefer to stay with things I'm comfortable with. But, I also know it's been good for me when I've forced myself to get out of my comfort zone.

 

ETA: the prom thing would also be less of a big deal if older dd were going with her own group of friends. If younger dd doesn't want her to come, she shouldn't. Younger dd isn't being selfish at all.

Edited March 19, 2017 by Bethany Grace

[fairfarmhand]

 

Do you know why your older dd is so resistant to growing up? There is usually a fairly large maturity gap between 15yos and 19yos, so it surprises me that your 19yo is happy with having 15yo friends and wanting to do the same things they do.

 

She wants all the perks of grown up life (independence, making her own choices, not answering to anyone) plus all the good things of being a kid, parents suppoerting you, fun times, etc.

 

I can't figure it out myself.

 

In so many ways she's more mature than many 18 yo college students, she pays her own bills, makes wise choices, works so hard, maintains her car, does well in school.

 

But socially, she prefers the younger set.

 

I think mostly because it's HARD to make new friends. She's working so hard in every other aspect of her life that it's just EASIER to stick around.

 

We're working on a rental property this summer and she'll move in with a couple of roommates. I'm hoping this will help.

[fairfarmhand]

Your older dd had her time to attend the prom and now it's her younger sister's turn.

 

There is nothing selfish about that.

 

Do you know why your older dd is so resistant to growing up? There is usually a fairly large maturity gap between 15yos and 19yos, so it surprises me that your 19yo is happy with having 15yo friends and wanting to do the same things they do.

 

Edited to add -- I hope my post didn't come across as snarky! I'm honestly trying to understand why a 19yo college student would want to hang around with a group of 15yos. The concept is foreign to me because with the kids we know, once they're in college, the high school sophomore experience isn't something they want to re-live. They feel too grown up for that. I'm trying to figure out what makes it different for your dd, and how you might be able to help her move on to some friends her own age or activities for college kids instead of high school stuff.

 

I didn't think you were snarking. I can't figure it out myself.

 

[Catwoman]

I think having roommates her own age could help a lot!

 

It's hard to make friends. Even super-outgoing kids can have trouble finding a few close friends. I feel sorry for your dd because she sounds like such a sweet girl. :( But I feel sorry for your 15yo, too, because I have a feeling that when your 19yo makes friends her own age, she won't want her little sister tagging along with her, so it's not really fair that your 19yo assumes she should always be allowed to be with your 15yo's friends.

 

It must be so difficult for you to feel like you're stuck in the middle and can't please both of your dds. :grouphug:

[teachermom2834]

I think the fact that the 15 yo doesn't want her to go is the end of the discussion for me. I might debate the merits and be on the fence if the 15 yo wanted her there. But if the 15 yo doesn't want it that would make my decision.

[Catwoman]

I didn't think you were snarking. I can't figure it out myself.

 

Thanks. :) I was worried about that.

[Carol in Cal.]

I don't think this is so unusual for a year or so.

 

After all, one of the great things about homeschooling is how kids make friendships across typical societal age barriers.

 

At our local homeschool prom, kids come 'back' for a while if they want to.  

 

And there are 'family dances' where entire families attend.  There is usually a potluck meal, and a band or dj, and mostly it's the high school kids who dance, maybe a few middle schoolers, but there is quite an age range, including parents and younger sibs.  It works.

 

It sounds like that might not be typical in your circles, but I wanted to put it out there as a model that I have seen work out.

 

Usually at some point the older kids will just fade out completely, but no one pushes them to do so.

 

When I graduated from high school we were all determined to keep coming back for one big dance.  A few did, most didn't, no one did it twice.  Some of us had to go to understand how done with that we were.  Some already knew.  It was bittersweet.

 

Something to recognize--your daughter is actually being awfully mature, probably more so than a lot of her college peers.  And now she wants to have a little fun with friends, and she is not sure how to do this.  Chances are this will only happen once or twice, and she will realize that 'you can't go home again'.  I think your younger daughter is too young to be considered to 'deprived of her prom' if the older one shows up.  The younger one will have a couple more before she graduates.  She should be gracious this time. 

[wintermom]

She wants all the perks of grown up life (independence, making her own choices, not answering to anyone) plus all the good things of being a kid, parents suppoerting you, fun times, etc.

 

I can't figure it out myself.

 

In so many ways she's more mature than many 18 yo college students, she pays her own bills, makes wise choices, works so hard, maintains her car, does well in school.

 

But socially, she prefers the younger set.

 

I think mostly because it's HARD to make new friends. She's working so hard in every other aspect of her life that it's just EASIER to stick around.

 

We're working on a rental property this summer and she'll move in with a couple of roommates. I'm hoping this will help.

 

To be honest, I wouldn't stress about it too much. She's doing well academically, holding down a job and isn't isolating herself in a basement or anything. I love hanging out with my sister. My dh's siblings hang out together a lot. It's not a bad thing that your daughters have such a good relationship. 

[zoobie]

How does one explain this to my older without making out the younger to be "selfish." Because that's how my oldest will see it.

She attended the prom without her younger sister tagging along. She will seem like a chaperone to her younger sister. Would she have liked an older cousin (anyone who used to babysit her?) or you attending her proms?

[MercyA]

Okay, I'll be a voice of dissent here. Assuming that graduates are allowed to attend, I don't think it's polite or loving for your younger dd to say she doesn't want her sister there. I know she can't help how she feels, but she should still be gracious. It's really not kind to say someone shouldn't attend a basically open function because their attendance will somehow dampen someone else's enjoyment of it.

 

My two cents.  :)

[Annie G]

Assuming it's not breaking rules to attend, it doesn't seem like a big deal if she wants to go. If she and her sister were a year closer in age they'd both be in high school and would be going the same year anyway.  When we started homeschooling one of the benefits was that our kids weren't tied to friends who were just a year or two apart in age. Sometimes one of our kids was especially mature and preferred hanging out with older kids...sometimes one was immature or just socially not ready and wanted to hang with a younger crowd.  If she usually hangs with younger dd and her friends, going to prom doesn't seem weird. 

 

But part of how I feel about it might be because around here homeschool prom is pretty open- kids can bring dates who aren't homeschooled and there are kids from junior high to about age 20 in attendance.  

 

Hope it works out for the girls and they are both happy with whatever solution they find. 

[fairfarmhand]

I think it depends on the personality dynamic between your daughters. I don't have kids that old, but I do have dds close in age who are best friends. Over and over it happens, I meet a family with a nine yo gurl and think, "Oh, msybe she can be a friend for younger dd!" But because older dd is outgoing and younger is shy and older is "cool" because of being just a little older, the nine yo wants to be friends with older dd and younger is kind of on the edges of their play while older dd is totally oblivious to it. It looks like multi age play from a distance, but younger dd experiences it as repeated social slights and I think it just makes her shyness worse. And of course, by the time we know them well enough that she would bo ok going there alone, the damage is done.

 

So, if your younger dd is as or more socially confident than your older, and never gets overshadowed by her, that's one thing. But if not, I would absolutely tell my own older dd she needed to back off. And if she responded that younger dd was being selfish I would probably lose my temper and say " Are you kidding me? You are the one being selfish. She's been known as your little sister her whole life, she deserves a few years to be her own person. Suck it up and move on."

 

Wasn't there a thread on the high school board a while back on "what will I do when my oldest leaves for college?" And a bunch of middle children chimed in saying how even though they were really close to their older sibs how important it was for them to be able to come into their own? Maybe uf you can find it you can read her some of those posts.

 

Oh yes.

 

My middle daughter doesn't say much but I do know that it does bother her.

 

Her sister is smart, funny, and outgoing. She's good at everything and though she works very hard at stuff, most things just come easier to her than her sister.

 

(My oldest gets annoyed when people compliment her on being smart or talented something because she feels it negates her hard work. But she doesn't get that lots of people have to work twice as hard as she does to get the same result.)

 

Younger sister is sweet, creative and interesting, but she's the type whose talents and specialness have to be mined for. You don't see them on the surface, but as you get to know her you see how incredible she really is. My oldest's personality and interesting life is right there on the top.

 

My younger daughter often feels overshadowed by "My big sister is so good at everything." In fact, she refused to take music lessons until oldest was in college because she didn't want her sister hanging over her shoulder, taking the guitar and picking it up quickly with very little effort. That's just how my oldest is. She doesn't intentionally show people up, but she's good at so much that it happens a lot.

 

Younger sister really doesn't mention this dynamic at all. But I know it's there. I know she wishes that her older sister wasn't quite so good at everything.

[Catwoman]

I think that's all the more reason why your older dd shouldn't be going to the prom and why she really needs to work at finding friends her own age.

 

I know she wouldn't do it intentionally, but if she keeps overshadowing your dd15, that could have a long term negative impact on your dd15's self-esteem.

 

I think it's wonderful that they have a close relationship, but it seems like your dd19 is getting in the way of your dd15 having a chance to live her own teen years the way she would like, and may be keeping her from having her own individual experiences.

[Seasider]

Oh yes.

 

My middle daughter doesn't say much but I do know that it does bother her.

 

Her sister is smart, funny, and outgoing. She's good at everything and though she works very hard at stuff, most things just come easier to her than her sister.

 

(My oldest gets annoyed when people compliment her on being smart or talented something because she feels it negates her hard work. But she doesn't get that lots of people have to work twice as hard as she does to get the same result.)

 

Younger sister is sweet, creative and interesting, but she's the type whose talents and specialness have to be mined for. You don't see them on the surface, but as you get to know her you see how incredible she really is. My oldest's personality and interesting life is right there on the top.

 

My younger daughter often feels overshadowed by "My big sister is so good at everything." In fact, she refused to take music lessons until oldest was in college because she didn't want her sister hanging over her shoulder, taking the guitar and picking it up quickly with very little effort. That's just how my oldest is. She doesn't intentionally show people up, but she's good at so much that it happens a lot.

 

Younger sister really doesn't mention this dynamic at all. But I know it's there. I know she wishes that her older sister wasn't quite so good at everything.

All the more reason for older daughter not to go.

 

We had a similar situation with two of our children and I ran circles for a few important years to provide them with separate but equal activities in which they could both excel without one demoralizing the other.

 

Honestly, it sounds like older dd has quite a skill set, one that should result in successes in her own new, postgraduate sphere. In your shoes, I'd be letting her know in no uncertain terms that she was not to make plans to attend the event.

 

She doesn't have to be told anything about her younger sister's annoyance about the matter. It's enough to say that you have noticed that she, older dd, seems to be settling back into patterns she's already moved through during her high school experience and that she needs to move along to her next phase of life.