The Complete Writer: Writing with Ease (WWE) -- All separate threads merged here

[JeannineW]

Do you need both the WWE book and the WWE workbooks or can you get by with just the workbooks?

[StephanieF]

How long would you say each wwe lesson would take (for workbook 1) and also starting FLL. I'm trying to plan my first grader's schedule

Thanks

Stephanie

[Guest schowife]

Please help me understand... the web site (http://peacehillpress.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=111 ) says, "Writing With Ease builds a sturdy foundation of basic skills for grades 1–4 all in the same book." ... and then goes on to say "The workbooks will cover one grade each"

 

So am I correct in thinking that the Writing With Ease Instructor Text covers grades 1-4... and the Writing With Ease Workbook 1 only covers grade 1? Or did I misunderstand something??

 

Thanks for any help!

:confused:Diane

[Oak Knoll Mom]

So am I correct in thinking that the Writing With Ease Instructor Text covers grades 1-4... and the Writing With Ease Workbook 1 only covers grade 1? Or did I misunderstand something??

 

Thanks for any help!

:confused:Diane

 

Yes, the text covers grades/levels 1-4. The workbooks cover one grade/level each. So far there are only workbooks for grades/levels one and two with three and four coming out later.

 

HTH,

[Strawberry Queen]

Hello all. I will have first grader this year. I am trying to homeschool as close to TWTM book as possible. I am setting up my daily schedule and start in 1 week on a cycle schedule. I and am wondering...if I plan to use FLL and WWE, do I still need a separate reading and notebook time?

I have recreational reading time...

Handwriting

Spelling

Phonics/Ordinary Parents Guide - knows how to read, but reviewing.

Grammar/First Language Lessons

Writing with Ease?

 

I guess I'm confused on what WWE takes off my plate? I wasn't planning to do a writing program (outside of handwriting) until I heard about WWE. I know they reccommended Writing Strands in 2nd grade or so. Is that what it replaces?

 

The reading notebook was just reading passages, comprehension questions and making a notebook page on what they "got" from the story, right? It seems like that's what there is in FLL or WWE already. Am I wrong? Is maybe the reading notebook for things THEY are able to read and "report" on? Trying to figure out how to make this all work together...

 

Thank you for any input!!!!!

:001_huh:

Jina

 

Hi Jina,

 

I was browsing this thread and I came across your question. I'll attempt to answer it.:) The reading notebook for first grade is a record of their narrations, with the possibility of them writing if they're motivated and take the initiative. Your first grader will have lots of writing in doing WWE and FLL. So, for your reading notebook you pick how many days a week you want to do it-I'd say start with 2. Then, you have your child narrate from something you've read or if they're a fluent reader I'd get them to do it from something that they've read themselves. All you have to do is to write down what they tell you.

 

So, if you just read The Cat in the Hat get your child to start at a beginning point and then prompt- what happened next? Then what did Sally do? etc. if they need help. I guess with the reading notebook it's really about practicing their narrations. There are no comprehension questions. The narration is the evidence of their comprehension-or lack thereof.:D If they want to write something about what they read then that's fine, but most kids are happy just talking about it.

 

As far as reading goes...I would still schedule a time for required reading. The TWTM says that this is supposed to be a little difficult while the fun reading is supposed to be easier so that they can gain fluency. How this works for us is that my dd finishing K does an OPG lesson and then I have her read another phonics reader book, or easy library book. She looks at other books and probably reads them to herself but I don't count that. Once she gains some more fluency she'll still do OPG and a structured reading time (totalling about 15-20 min) and then other books will be gravy until she's done OPG. Hopefully this clarifies things and doesn't make it more confusing. I wish I had been consistent with my reading notebook narrations with #1, so dd #2 is going to do them every week.;)

HTH

[Mom-ninja.]

I actually just read this entire thread. Whew!

 

Somewhere someone posted that they would not think about doing writing with a child that is not reading fluently. Why?

 

Is everyone's child here reading at a level that they could actually read the copy sentences in the sample pages of the first year WWE workbook?

 

My ds is not at that level. He is 7 and technically starting 2nd grade next month. However, at his evaluation he is reading at a Kindergarten level. His reading comprehension is at a 4th grade level.

 

Reading lessons became a huge struggle with us. It even turned into a power struggle. At any rate he does not read on his own. Does this mean I'm not supposed to do FLL or WWE with him?

 

I've been doing FLL 1/2 with him and he does copywork and I write his narrations. He even dictates poems that I write down for him. Why would I not continue to do this because he does not read well on his own yet?

[Susan Wise Bauer]

I've been doing FLL 1/2 with him and he does copywork and I write his narrations. He even dictates poems that I write down for him. Why would I not continue to do this because he does not read well on his own yet?

 

If he can do copywork, you can certainly go on to do FLL and WWE. At the point where the reading becomes a problem, just take a break from it until his reading skills catch up. But I would think that the copywork and narrations would help to slowly improve his reading skills.

 

SWB

[Susan Wise Bauer]

Susan,

 

Don't know if you're still around, but will you be selling WWE at the TX conference? I'd like to order it now, if you're not. But if you will, I can buy it then.

 

 

We should have copies there!

[Susan Wise Bauer]

I noticed it said in WWE that there was a list of recommended writing programs for middle and high school at the peacehillpress website but I can't find it. Anyone know where it is?

 

 

Sorry--we haven't gotten it posted yet! It's on the way, promise.

 

SWB

[jg_puppy]

I was wondering when a sample of workbook level 2 will be posted.

 

Jan

[Lori in MS]

Do you need both the WWE book and the WWE workbooks or can you get by with just the workbooks?

 

I don't think just the workbooks would work. The lessons and explanations and narration passages are in the textbook. ALso there are instructions for each week. I think you need the text. If I could only get one, I would get the textbook only for grades 1-4 and have a notebook for them to write in.

[Capt_Uhura]

The workbook does have all the narration passages in it for that level. So workbook 1 has ALL the passages, dictation, etc for level I in it. The textbook has passages for grades 1-4 (ie, all 4 levels) but it's only a weeks worth. You then take their model and find your own passages for narration, dictation for the other 35weeks of the year.

[Mom-ninja.]

If he can do copywork, you can certainly go on to do FLL and WWE. At the point where the reading becomes a problem, just take a break from it until his reading skills catch up. But I would think that the copywork and narrations would help to slowly improve his reading skills.

 

SWB

 

 

Thank you so much. That was my thinking as well. I think copywork can only help his reading.

 

At his evaluation the teacher said he needed samples of "original writing" in his portfolio. So I tried it later that week and it completely stressed him out. He's very much a perfectionist (part of the issues he has with reading) and he gets very upset when he makes mistakes. So for him to not know how to spell a word made him very frustrated. After reading what you (SWB) said about teaching writing, I will not have him try to write on his own anymore until he wants to.

 

I just ordered the WWE text this morning. Can't wait to get it.

[farmwife]

I was wondering when a sample of workbook level 2 will be posted.

 

Jan

 

Diddo!

 

Hopefully soon!

[littlefurfamily]

I have not ordered my copy of WWE yet so maybe someone might be able to help me decide?? My son is a beginning "4th grader"and reaaaalllly needs to get started writing. Most all of our work is done orally. He really cannot/ will not put thought to paper. We are about a third of the way thru FLL3 and just starting Vikings in SOTW2. I know I need to get the main text, but from what I've read of these posts I'm thinking he's probably going to want to go ahead and do workbook 2. Does that sound right? So any idea when that will be out?

Peace & JOY

Cindy

[Lovedtodeath]

I was wondering how best to schedule FLL with WWE in order to keep the grammar in FLL cooridinating with our WWE work. From what I understand FLL is recommended 2-3 days a week and WWE is recommended 4 days a week, so how does this work?

 

Also, if DD is just starting a handwriting program (she writes sentences all the time, just mixing caps and lowercase and using any form she wants instead of italic, which is our program) and she has a very hard time and cries almost every handwriting lesson... is WWE too much for her right now? If so, should I wait on both programs or start FLL and just wait on WWE?

 

I do not have FLL in my hands yet, so forgive me if the answer is so simple that there should be no need to ask. TIA

[jina]

I just saw that WWE Workbook 1 is no longer on backorder!!! The text still is, but at least we'll be able to get something in our hands soon! :lol:

[Teachnmama]

Doing my happy dance - I just got notified that my Amazon pre-order of the WWE book shipped today. Just wanted those who were worried about their orders to know. :lol:

[Parabola]

Doing my happy dance - I just got notified that my Amazon pre-order of the WWE book shipped today. Just wanted those who were worried about their orders to know. :lol:

 

Me too! Doing a happy dance with you! Supposed to be delivered Monday.

[joy]

Me too! Me too! Doing the happy dance!!

[Beth in IN]

Did you gals order workbook 1 also? It looks as if my main book is coming but the workbook not untill August. But I am happy to get something.:)

[Mom-ninja.]

Really? My WWE book is supposed to ship between last week of Aug and beginning Sept. I guess I pre-ordered it later than you all.

[KIN]

I just have to tell you all that are waiting on your books: it is worth the wait!! I LOVE this! It is just what I need to help teach writing. I love how it helps the child learn to summarize what is important in a story or an essay, I love that it is simple, straight forward, it has the helps I need - oh I could go on! :)

 

Just had to tell you all that I'm loving it! And, I've altered my fall school for my 3rd grader to start with WWE level 2.

[nukeswife]

Does anyone know when in Aug Workbook 2 is supposed to be released? I'm not looking for an exact date, just wondering if it's beginning, middle or end of the month.

[melmac]

Would this work for a new 5th grader who hasn't been pushed in the areas covered in the book?

 

The advice I've gotten and followed over the years suggested that boys motor skills don't really kick in till around 10 yrs and not to really push them until around that age, do mostly everything orally in the meanwhile.

 

So we've done narrations and writing (not handwriting practice) orally by son, with me doing the actual writing for him.He does really well, he comes up with the nicest complete sentences, his oral narrations are really well done, he just has trouble getting it on paper, he's a bit of a perfectionist and his hw is only fair and he hasn't really been pushed so now we're sort of starting from scratch.Recently i've been trying to steer him in the direction of doing it himself and I am seeing some improvement( SO THERE IS HOPE :)) and after hearing about wwe it seems like this would be a great way to get him going.

 

He has completed FLL, EFTTC 1 and 2 and WS2 mostly orally and just started on WS3 ( which is self directed and gives a great intro to the student on getting going on their own, and is quite slow paced).

 

So, I guess I'm trying to ask if WWE could be used successfully for a struggling 5th grader? And do you think it would be okay to continue with WS3 (it's to be done once or twice a week every other week as recommended by the author)?

 

What do you think?

 

I really need some advice here. :)

 

 

 

[Lori in MS]

SWB gives instructions in the book on how to use it for an older child. I plan to use it for my 5th and 6th graders. I think it would work well for your son.

[PeterPan]

I don't have a boy, so I offer you my inexperienced opinion (yes, work through the steps in WWE and start to get more on paper, focusing on those skills and waiting probably on WS3) and an article by SWB that should be more helpful. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12280

[PeterPan]

Here, just in case the link ever rolls off, is the post JennW in SoCal typed up of SWB's comments on the "nibbled to death by ducks" approach to getting boys to write.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The old link doesn't work, so I'll see if I can type this out really quickly. This was posted back in September of 2002!

 

...........................................

 

In the first place, I would NOT do speling and grammar on the same day; I'd alternate. So every day do reading, a writing assignment and EITHER grammar OR spelling.

 

In the second place, don't do any of those A Beka writing assignments. A nine year old who's struggling should be writing for 20 minutes per day for one of his school subjects (history, science, or literature -- this writing assignment should be a brief summary of something that he's read, and by brief I mean whatever takes him 20-30 minutes to write -- three sentences in 20 minuets is NOT unusual for a nine year old boy). He should also be taking dictation (again, two sentences is fine) from you at least twice a week. If he's a reluctant writer, do this dictation twice a week in place of writing out those summaries, and dictate FROM his history, or literature, or science. So three days a week he might write a summary (which you help him compose orally before he writes), and two days a week he might do a narration.

 

Now you're getting things under control: Every day he is doing TWO writing-intensive assignments, either

 

dictation plus grammar

OR

dictation plus spelling

OR

a summary plus spelling

OR

a summary plus grammar

etc.

 

When you can do it without sending your son into hysterics, add a "formal writing program" 1-2 days per week. This helps you be certain that you are covering friendly letters, using adjectives, etc., etc., etc.,

 

This is the "Nibbled to death by ducks" method of teaching boys to write: You do it EVERY DAY for a short period and eventually they do GET it. (Have you ever heard my "All writing programs were designed for girls" tirade?)

 

....................

 

She went on to talk about grammar a bit, and I'd copy that out too, but I've got to get ready to head out the door!

__________________

Jennifer

homeschooling ds 16 and ds 13

[HRAAB]

I checked out FLL 1&2 from the library and did not care for the scripted lessons. I plan on using grammar material that I already have: Easy Grammar, Winston Grammar plus diagramming.

 

Question: Does WWE have a sufficient amount of copy work/dictation without needing to add more. I try to do at least one piece of copy work or dictation daily, usually.

 

Is it integrated with FLL or would it work with any grammar program?

 

Thanks,

Janet

[Capt_Uhura]

I just received my WWE textbook and workbook 1. I plan to use this with my son. He taught himself to write his letters. He now writes the same size I would write in a standard composition notebook. He does not want to write on the large spacing in the WWE workbook. Neither of my kids ever wrote that large. I'm wondering what the spacing will be for WWE workbook 2? I may just have him use the bottom line and the dash line as the top or else I make another workbook altogether and don't write in level 1 workbook at all.

 

Thanks! Counting the days until workbook 2 is available!

Capt_Uhura

[Lovedtodeath]

I checked out FLL 1&2 from the library and did not care for the scripted lessons. I plan on using grammar material that I already have: Easy Grammar, Winston Grammar plus diagramming.

 

Question: Does WWE have a sufficient amount of copy work/dictation without needing to add more. I try to do at least one piece of copy work or dictation daily, usually.

 

Is it integrated with FLL or would it work with any grammar program?

 

Thanks,

Janet

 

It will work with different grammar, but correlates with FLL in that the lessons seem to teach the same thing at the same time.

 

WWE workbooks have narration one day, copywork the next, so my guess is that it will follow the same pattern when narration is introduced, but I could be wrong.

 

WWE text has instructions for each week and you can have as much narration as you want from there. HTH

[arcara]

I just received my WWE textbook and workbook 1. I plan to use this with my son. He taught himself to write his letters. He now writes the same size I would write in a standard composition notebook. He does not want to write on the large spacing in the WWE workbook. Neither of my kids ever wrote that large. I'm wondering what the spacing will be for WWE workbook 2? I may just have him use the bottom line and the dash line as the top or else I make another workbook altogether and don't write in level 1 workbook at all.

 

Thanks! Counting the days until workbook 2 is available!

Capt_Uhura

 

 

You could just get him to do the assignments on separate paper. That's what I'm planning to do so that the workbook will be non-consumable and I can use it again for my other kids.

[joy]

It's here! It's here! I've been waiting all morning for USPS and they just came. I opened my box from Amazon and my 3rd grader said, "You've been waiting all morning for a BOOK?". I told her that was true. She said, "And it's a SCHOOL book?!". LOL

 

Now I'm off to read...

[melmac]

This is VERY helpful, I appreciate your taking the time to post this and the link to SWB'S article. Thank you!

 

 

 

 

Here, just in case the link ever rolls off, is the post JennW in SoCal typed up of SWB's comments on the "nibbled to death by ducks" approach to getting boys to write.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The old link doesn't work, so I'll see if I can type this out really quickly. This was posted back in September of 2002!

 

...........................................

 

In the first place, I would NOT do speling and grammar on the same day; I'd alternate. So every day do reading, a writing assignment and EITHER grammar OR spelling.

 

In the second place, don't do any of those A Beka writing assignments. A nine year old who's struggling should be writing for 20 minutes per day for one of his school subjects (history, science, or literature -- this writing assignment should be a brief summary of something that he's read, and by brief I mean whatever takes him 20-30 minutes to write -- three sentences in 20 minuets is NOT unusual for a nine year old boy). He should also be taking dictation (again, two sentences is fine) from you at least twice a week. If he's a reluctant writer, do this dictation twice a week in place of writing out those summaries, and dictate FROM his history, or literature, or science. So three days a week he might write a summary (which you help him compose orally before he writes), and two days a week he might do a narration.

 

Now you're getting things under control: Every day he is doing TWO writing-intensive assignments, either

 

dictation plus grammar

OR

dictation plus spelling

OR

a summary plus spelling

OR

a summary plus grammar

etc.

 

When you can do it without sending your son into hysterics, add a "formal writing program" 1-2 days per week. This helps you be certain that you are covering friendly letters, using adjectives, etc., etc., etc.,

 

This is the "Nibbled to death by ducks" method of teaching boys to write: You do it EVERY DAY for a short period and eventually they do GET it. (Have you ever heard my "All writing programs were designed for girls" tirade?)

 

....................

 

She went on to talk about grammar a bit, and I'd copy that out too, but I've got to get ready to head out the door!

__________________

Jennifer

homeschooling ds 16 and ds 13

[jina]

I just got the books for FLL (1-2) and WWE (1) and I don't see how they correlate. I've read several people say they go "hand in hand" or cover the same material at the same time. What am I missing? WWE has 36 weeks of lessons with 4 lessons a week and FLL has 100 lessons. How do I know which lessons of FLL go with what weeks in WWE? :001_huh:

[Lovedtodeath]

I just got the books for FLL (1-2) and WWE (1) and I don't see how they correlate. I've read several people say they go "hand in hand" or cover the same material at the same time. What am I missing? WWE has 36 weeks of lessons with 4 lessons a week and FLL has 100 lessons. How do I know which lessons of FLL go with what weeks in WWE? :001_huh:

 

I asked this a while ago and never got a response. The closest I can figure is 3 lessons a week in FLL and 4 in WWE, but does that really correlate? I don't want to go through the whole thing ahead of time and plan it out. Hopefully your wording will help. :)

[Susan Wise Bauer]

The closest I can figure is 3 lessons a week in FLL and 4 in WWE, but does that really correlate?

 

Yes--if you follow this schedule, the grammar and punctuation elements covered in FLL1 will be revisited two or three weeks later by the WWE copywork and dictation, which reinforces the grammar learning.

 

HTH.

 

SWB

[TN Mama]

This will be our first year to homeschool. My 7 year old (2nd grade) dd has had very little experience with narration and copywork (none at home). I received my copy of WWE and proceeded to go over the first year lesson 36 with her. The first day of copywork she misspelled two words and the first day of narration she struggled to answer the questions. The following day of copywork she made no errors and the last day of narration she answered all the questions easily. After the first two days I was thinking we needed to start with level 1, but the next two days she was much improved. Where would you start your dc?

[JenniferB]

Hi,

 

I just received my WWE book, which I have been greatly anticipating for months. I dug right into the how to's and now I have a question. My daughter is going into 4th grade, but she is not ready for the Level 4 assignments. I'm trying to decide where to start her. Last year we used Sonlight. Each week she had assignments involving copy work of her readers, grammar study of her copy work, and creative writing. She hated the creative writing, and now I understand why. She isn't fluent in the mechanics of writing, because we haven't studied the mechanics of writing enough, and we haven't practiced narration enough. So, she doesn't know how to order her thoughts into complete coherent sentences.

 

In anticipation of WWE I read the excerpt from your website, and worked a little with her on dictation and narration. She can dictate up to 2 sentences (though spelling and grammar are a problem). She can also narrate a story or history lesson, but she gives too many details, and often gives obscure detailed information that isn't relevant to a summary.

 

Do you have any idea where I should start her? I am very grateful for all your materials. I have 3 other children, who I will be using your materials with, and I'm hopeful that these things will be easier when they get to 4th grade, if I start out right.

 

Sincerely,

Jennifer

[Lisa M]

I'm sure if I read all 39 pages of posts I could figure this out, but I'm not getting it! I read WTM years ago and can't find current recommendations on the website.

 

Brief background:

 

I do need help in the writing area because it is "open ended". If I don't have a good guide to follow (open the book and do the lesson) it falls off the schedule. We are very consistent with copywork, dictation, and a weekly "freewrite" (using Bravewriter Arrow and Boomerang newsletters). Where I drop the ball is ANY actual writing project. I can assign it, but I don't know what type of writing I should expect at what age, and how to move them along. If anything, I'm sure I ask too LITTLE for their ages and stages.

 

I have done very little narration (except with the youngest - it was in her curriculum) and have never had them write it down.

 

My oldest, even with very little writing training, is showing great ability to use strong vocabulary and put her thoughts on paper. I attribute this too our diligent efforts to keep good literature in the home. But logical organization of thoughts is a struggle.

 

None of my kids have learning challenges. I'm thinking this year I need to stop relying on my failed planning, and instead use what someone else has written for me to do.

 

I have spelling covered (I strip Spell to Write and Read down to its spelling components and rules).

 

My questions for grammar and writing are:

 

My youngest will be 2nd grade. She worked through My Father's World first grade. I have picked up FLL 1/2 for her to do next year. Where should I start in that? and what else do I need?

 

What are the grammar and writing recommendations for 4th, 6th, and 8th grade?

 

I'll have more follow up questions, but I'll start here.

 

Thanks!

[Capt_Uhura]

At the end of each year, week 36 I think, there is an assessment. SWB recommends using these for placement. I would do the Year 1 assessment and if she makes the guidelines SWB gives, then try year 2 assessment. When she doesn't meet the guidelines, start her in that year. You will likely be able to go through it quickly or only do half before moving on to the next year or maybe not. Beauty of HSing is you can go at your DD's pace!

 

hth

[Pensguys]

At the end of each year, week 36 I think, there is an assessment. SWB recommends using these for placement.

 

These assessments.....they are in the WWE itself? I don't have this book yet.

[KIN]

I emailed Peace Hill Press and asked this question. They did not know at that time, but said to email back near the end of July.

[KIN]

These assessments.....they are in the WWE itself? I don't have this book yet.

 

 

Yes, Penny the assesments are in the WWE instructor guide.

[Oak Knoll Mom]

I emailed Peace Hill Press and asked this question. They did not know at that time, but said to email back near the end of July.

 

To which question are you referring? I can't view the board in threaded or hybrid mode, so I have to use linear. I can't tell what people are referring to unless they quote.

 

Thanks,

[KIN]

Does anyone know when in Aug Workbook 2 is supposed to be released? I'm not looking for an exact date, just wondering if it's beginning, middle or end of the month.

 

I'll try answering again with the original message copied. :) I emailed Peace Hill Press for a more specific date on WWE workbook 2 and they replied they didn't know at that time, but to email back at the end of July. They stated they may be able to give a more specific date at that time.

[nukeswife]

I'll try answering again with the original message copied. :) I emailed Peace Hill Press for a more specific date on WWE workbook 2 and they replied they didn't know at that time, but to email back at the end of July. They stated they may be able to give a more specific date at that time.

 

Thanks, I may just have to email them and ask. I'm getting a little anxious;)

[JenniferB]

Hi,

 

I had some time while dinner was in the oven to look over some of the posts on this thread, and I figured out where to start my daughter. I'm going to start her toward the beginning of Level 3, so that she can have plenty of practice in mechanics and narration.

 

Thanks to everyone for the helpful posts.

 

-Jennifer

[mamato3 all-boy boys]

I've given ds the mastery exercises at the end of year 3 in WWE.

 

He is doing well with the narration/ summarizing and can take his writing to dictation as requested at the end of year 3. He needs to remember to use proper names in his narrations, but that IMHO is minor.

 

His multi-sentence dictation, however, isn't so hot. I backed down to the end of year 2 dictation, and he struggled a bit with 12-15 words.

 

What would you do? Can I mix it up for him and back up his dictation assignments but continue on with the 4th grade narration?

[Oak Knoll Mom]

 

What would you do? Can I mix it up for him and back up his dictation assignments but continue on with the 4th grade narration?

 

I'm in a similar situation with my 3rd grader still having problems with narrations. I'm going to fly through as many of the 2nd grade narrating exercises *as he needs* and then start 3rd grade all together when I feel he's ready. We may end up doing all the 2nd grade narrations, but my hope is that he'll catch on quickly and we'll only need to spend several weeks on it.