Halcyon Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 If you ended up incorporating some circe stuff into your himeschool, can you tell me what "stuck" and seemed most helpful? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrdinaryTime Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 My biggest ongoing take aways from the Circe thread have been striving to teach from a place of rest and prioritizing finding truth over accumulating facts. It is SUCH a struggle for me to teach from a place of rest...to be a peaceful, patient, confident guide to my children. The days when I inch a little closer to that goal are by far the most successful days we have in our home. It helps me tremendously to let go of the anxiety to remember the second point - we are seeking truth and beauty in creation and our fellow man through our education. It is not a fact-accumulating race! The speed at which we get through material or the breadth of material we cover is not the point, but rather becoming a new person who has eyes to see and ears to hear the truth. The more I let these points form who I am as a teacher (and a parent), the better we seem to do as a family in every way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrdinaryTime Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 On a practical level, it has made read aloud time a non-negotiablein our day. I also work very hard at choosing good literature and the best illustrations I can find for our read alouds. I have tried to incorporate more visually beautiful activities into our math work, too. I let myself ruthlessly cut anything I feel I am doing just to have a "product" at the end - worksheets, coloring pages, unnecessary practice sheets, etc. I realized I was using many of these type of materialsjust to have the kids produce something, not because they actually gained anything from the work. I still use some of this type of material, but only if is actually an aid to our learning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForeverFamily Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 :lurk5:Listening in, I am very interested to hear everyones responses. I really enjoyed reading through the infamous long circe thread but I did find it a bit overwhelming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrysalis Academy Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Daily, obligatory read-alouds, including *a combination* of historical fiction with other wonderful children's literature - I haven't given up on historical fiction tied to the history cycle, but I am not married to it, KWIM? We've read a lot of great stuff over the last year that I wouldn't have included, though, if I hadn't been shaken out of that marriage. Other than that, it reinforced the idea of choosing quality materials, carefully, and making sure everything *earns* its place in our day. Nothing is busywork, nothing is designed just to fill time - it is all quality, things that are worth filling our heads with and spending our time on. Less is more, as long as the less is the best it can possibly be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momto2Cs Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 On a practical level, it has made read aloud time a non-negotiablein our day. I also work very hard at choosing good literature and the best illustrations I can find for our read alouds. I have tried to incorporate more visually beautiful activities into our math work, too. I let myself ruthlessly cut anything I feel I am doing just to have a "product" at the end - worksheets, coloring pages, unnecessary practice sheets, etc. I realized I was using many of these type of materialsjust to have the kids produce something, not because they actually gained anything from the work. I still use some of this type of material, but only if is actually an aid to our learning. Daily, obligatory read-alouds, including *a combination* of historical fiction with other wonderful children's literature - I haven't given up on historical fiction tied to the history cycle, but I am not married to it, KWIM? We've read a lot of great stuff over the last year that I wouldn't have included, though, if I hadn't been shaken out of that marriage. Other than that, it reinforced the idea of choosing quality materials, carefully, and making sure everything *earns* its place in our day. Nothing is busywork, nothing is designed just to fill time - it is all quality, things that are worth filling our heads with and spending our time on. Less is more, as long as the less is the best it can possibly be. Both of the above! I have gotten rid of so much general clutter in my new plans. No useless worksheets or activities, less historical fiction and more good literature in general. I am trying to incorporate more beauty into our homeschooling too, so we're going to start some Waldorf-style main lesson books for a couple of subjects. I've gone from thinking I need a lot of resources to realizing that if I choose carefully, we don't need that much--it is defintely quality versus quantity. I made (and add to regularly) a giant list of books I would like to read with/to the kids, and then I look for the nicest versions I can find, those with beautiful illustrations, good paper, and so forth. It is a work in progress. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosyl Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Cease endlessly striving for what you would like to do and learn to love what must be done. I dropped a historical literature list and we picked up good quality literature. I also picked more holistic curriculum, a less is more choice. What I would like to improve on is more science through experience like the garden for biology. I still lean towards a text when more experience would benefit. I have cut the fat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeker of Schole Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 we're going to start some Waldorf-style main lesson books for a couple of subjects. Can you explain what this looks like? :bigear: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaners Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 I'd love some more questions for my "toolbox" when we're discussing stories. Right now the "should he or she...." and "this story is like/different" questions have worked well with our wide range of reading levels. I have questions for individual stories, but nothing outside of the character/setting/etc box that works so well as a universal question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeker of Schole Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I'd love some more questions for my "toolbox" when we're discussing stories. Right now the "should he or she...." and "this story is like/different" questions have worked well with our wide range of reading levels. I have questions for individual stories, but nothing outside of the character/setting/etc box that works so well as a universal question. What do you think about ____? Why do you think _____ did _____? A search for Bloom's Taxonomy will also give you a list of good, open ended questions that can be used across age groups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaLisa Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I'd love some more questions for my "toolbox" when we're discussing stories. Right now the "should he or she...." and "this story is like/different" questions have worked well with our wide range of reading levels. I have questions for individual stories, but nothing outside of the character/setting/etc box that works so well as a universal question. I also love to ask: What do you think will happen next? What was happening when we last left the story? (this allows one of the kids to quickly bring us up to speed on the plot) The WTM also has a great list of questions. Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLittleWonders Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Like others have said, we have made read-aloud, using really good literature, a non-negotiable part of our day. I read to the kids a few times a day and then dh has his own book he reads at bedtime. I've also tried to eliminate as much busywork as possible. When they do independent work, I strive to make it meaningful (for instance, while I'm working with one on math, the other two are doing a mix of typing lessons, reading with their sister, quiet reading, or a daily narration). I'm also working on getting rid of the "check the box" mentality in favor of using materials and engaging in activities/lessons that guide us in the true, beautiful, and good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kfamily Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Like previous posters, the most important points I took from that thread were those which were related to learning which placed an emphasis on deeper and meaningful ideas. I recently ordered several books (for part of my Christmas present :)) such as Adler's Great Ideas and others which will help me find and focus on ideas like truth, beauty and good in all the books we read and conversations we have. I also like to try hard to include the interests of each of my daughters individually in book choices and topics to study as well as what they enjoy learning together. (And, of course, there are some subjects/topics that just must be studied....like it or not....but I try to at least choose curriculua/books or use approaches that make it as appealing as possible.) I also have realized, at least for our family, that there are no resources available that I know of yet that will meet our needs. Unfortunately, this means I have to create a lot of our work myself. While this is a big load with which to keep up, I do like the one advantage I gain from it. I have become a much more educated and, in turn, a better teacher by creating our work myself. I created a list of questions to help me have better discussions with them (and to have available when I create Book Notes to go along with our books). I still consider it a work in progress... but I would be willing to share it....I plan on adding to it over the years, and I especially plan to add to it when I've finished reading the above books I mentioned earlier (Adler's Great Ideas, etc.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imagine.more Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Which section of the WTM has the reading questions? I was wanting more of these too! I also love to ask: What do you think will happen next? What was happening when we last left the story? (this allows one of the kids to quickly bring us up to speed on the plot) The WTM also has a great list of questions. Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caraway Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Is the original thread gone? I can't find it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I think it must have been this one... http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/359457-how-does-one-provide-a-classical-education-circe-institute-lovers/page__hl__circe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alte Veste Academy Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Can you explain what this looks like? :bigear: http://images.google.com/search?num=10&hl=en&site=&tbm=isch&source=hp&q=waldorf+main+lesson+books&oq=waldorf+main&gs_l=img.1.0.0j0i24l9.4934.8530.0.9648.12.11.0.1.1.0.203.1184.5j5j1.11.0...0.0...1ac.1.zDLnnulVzJE&biw=1024&bih=672&sei=ysbjUKnJOeqIiwKrnoDoBg http://www.enchantedforesttoysak.com/sample-main-lesson-pages.html :) I'd love some more questions for my "toolbox" when we're discussing stories. Right now the "should he or she...." and "this story is like/different" questions have worked well with our wide range of reading levels. I have questions for individual stories, but nothing outside of the character/setting/etc box that works so well as a universal question. It's an investment, but Teaching the Classics has great questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLittleWonders Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I created a list of questions to help me have better discussions with them (and to have available when I create Book Notes to go along with our books). I still consider it a work in progress... but I would be willing to share it....I plan on adding to it over the years, and I especially plan to add to it when I've finished reading the above books I mentioned earlier (Adler's Great Ideas, etc.). I would love to see your list-in-progress. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLittleWonders Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 http://images.google...JOeqIiwKrnoDoBg http://www.enchanted...sson-pages.html :) It's an investment, but Teaching the Classics has great questions. I agree with the recommendation of Teaching the Classics. I let it slide this fall and plan on reincorporating it in our discussions this spring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kfamily Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Sure, here it is: https://workspaces.acrobat.com/app.html#d=n8jNlVNW1jrJ0IcfHXXanw :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLittleWonders Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Sure, here it is: https://workspaces.a...W1jrJ0IcfHXXanw :) Thanks! :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homemama2 Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Like others have said, we have made read-aloud, using really good literature, a non-negotiable part of our day. I read to the kids a few times a day and then dh has his own book he reads at bedtime. I've also tried to eliminate as much busywork as possible. When they do independent work, I strive to make it meaningful (for instance, while I'm working with one on math, the other two are doing a mix of typing lessons, reading with their sister, quiet reading, or a daily narration). I'm also working on getting rid of the "check the box" mentality in favor of using materials and engaging in activities/lessons that guide us in the true, beautiful, and good. This. I'm still trying to get over my "check the box" mentality. That's been the biggest struggle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homemama2 Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Which section of the WTM has the reading questions? I was wanting more of these too! In the 3rd edition of WTM the questions are on pg. 345-346 for logic stage. (I have the page dog-eared) ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizaG Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 The CiRCE thread and spin-offs have given me the encouragement I needed to keep going on my own path. As it turns out, this path has very little resemblance to any of the practical methods discussed on CiRCE's site (Good/Great Books, CM, MP, etc.), but that's okay with me. :) Our ideals are still pretty much the same, and I continue to enjoy some of their articles and talks that are more on the theoretical aspects of education. One concrete result of the discussion was that I went through our shelves and gave away several boxes of "just okay" children's non-fiction and picture books. It turns out that these books were so forgettable that the whole project left my mind completely until a couple of weeks ago, when I came across a stray box that hadn't made it to the thrift shop. I think it's probably time for another round of clearing out. Even with a house full of voracious readers, I've come to value quality over quantity. Another effect was that I became much more comfortable with writing in my own books (though I do tend to use pencil). :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanvan Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 It's an investment, but Teaching the Classics has great questions. This was going to be my suggestion too. The list is so long it is almost overwhelming! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyniffrec Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Is the Teaching the Classics being referred to the one that C.S. Lewis wrote? If not, does someone have a link to the one being discussed? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanvan Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Is the Teaching the Classics being referred to the one that C.S. Lewis wrote? If not, does someone have a link to the one being discussed? Thanks! Here it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang!Zoom! Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 My biggest takeaway from all things Circe is pretty simple, I just hear it every morning: "Why are you doing this?" Whatever answer (internally) that rises to the top is what I deal with that day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imagine.more Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Thanks :) In the 3rd edition of WTM the questions are on pg. 345-346 for logic stage. (I have the page dog-eared) ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momto2Cs Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Can you explain what this looks like? :bigear: Here is a link to a gallery of Waldorf work... Gallery of Homeschoolers' Work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassenach Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 I didn't participate in that thread, but I read the whole thing. I made several changes based on what I learned from it, and also from a series of Christopher Perrin lectures that I attended at GHC. My changes: 1. I walked away from boxed curriculums. I have used some form of boxed curriculum for my entire homeschool career. This was a big, scary step for me. The biggest benefit has been that I have eliminated dry, dull, pointless materials that were being used only to check off that box. It's eliminated the stress of keeping up with someone else's plan. The downside is that I'm not a great planner. We're a little on the fly by the seat of our pants end, which is working so far, but leaves us a little vulnerable to slacking. 2. I dropped the piles of historical fiction and missionary stories that had taken over our lives and have instead read a lot of fantastic literature to my kids. I can TOTALLY see the benefit. They are seeing the absolute beauty in words in a way that they didn't before. I've folded in some lit appreciation, I wouldn't call it lit study, because it comes so naturally when you're reading beautifully written works. I guess that's really it. There's a lot of other changes I made curriculum wise, but I'm not sure that they fit into this conversation. I made a lot of moves in the CM direction. I'm extremely happy with our year, so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLittleWonders Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 What I really find interesting in terms of my own transformation as a homeschooler thanks to the Circe thread and follow-up conversations, is that ironically I find that I can better teach from a state of rest when I am at least using some pre-done curriculum choices. This last fall I tried to go all me-written/me-inspired/me-decided. It really didn't help me teach from a place of rest. I felt I continuously didn't really see the whole picture and I often felt I was going day to day instead of having some master plan. It took a while to realize, and then admit, that I like having someone else's curriculum as my "spine" that I can then tweak and modify as we want. I don't plan on using someone else's curriculum for everything, nor do I plan on using anything as written (I never have :lol: ), but I do know that I feel much more at ease when I have a plan that I don't have to worry about writing myself. I find it interesting because what I first took out of the Circe thread/other threads is that "authentic" education didn't come from a pre-written curriculum. Ultimately, though, the Circe threads, et. al., helped me better understand who I am as a learner and a teacher, as well as better understand my children and what works for us all. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyniffrec Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Here it is. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizaG Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 MLW, I think we might be twins. :) Your post is helping me understand why I feel compelled to start with ready-made curriculum, even though I always make major modifications to it -- sometimes until it's almost unrecognizable. I used to "excuse" this somewhat mysterious tendency by saying that it was because I'm disorganized, but that never seemed quite right. It makes more sense that it's related to my need to start with an understanding of the big picture. Having a curriculum that's all laid out gives me a sense of comprehension of the goals and content that I can't seem to get in any other way. When I try to start from scratch, even if I'm familiar with the subject matter, I feel like I'm plodding along day-to-day. When I start with something that's already written, I'm actually able to be much more flexible, integrate different topics in a more meaningful way, and include more spontaneous discussion and enrichment. This was most obvious when we used K12. Oh my... I fantasize about having something like K12 that would be customizable for my whole family. :001_wub: :001_wub: :001_wub: And this also explains why those homeschool scheduling programs and lesson plan books do nothing for me. It's not the organizational help I need, so much as having the material already written down for me to skim through, rearrange, enhance, delete, etc. Thanks again for bringing up this interesting line of thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AStableBeginning Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Sure, here it is: https://workspaces.a...W1jrJ0IcfHXXanw :) Thanks for sharing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted January 3, 2013 Author Share Posted January 3, 2013 Thank you all for sharing your stories. I find it all so fascinating. IT is around this time of year that i find i need to recharge, regroup and switch up my approach a bit. Lots of read alouds is a big part of that right now. We really dont do much busywork at all, but the flip side of that is that everything we ARE doing i feel is essential, and there is just not that much room for slacking, does that make sense? Or else we will not get anything done. So i am torn between easing p tis time of year and realizing that everything we are doing has been vetted multiple tmes and has been deemed essential. Latin? Essential Math? Essential Spanish? Same Writing with skill? Very essential. Science? We have eased p on the writing requirements here, but reading and discussing is still essential. History? Ditto. Grammar? Ditto. Uing kiss which is short, sweet and tough. No busywork. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanvan Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Thank you all for sharing your stories. I find it all so fascinating. IT is around this time of year that i find i need to recharge, regroup and switch up my approach a bit. Lots of read alouds is a big part of that right now. We really dont do much busywork at all, but the flip side of that is that everything we ARE doing i feel is essential, and there is just not that much room for slacking, does that make sense? Or else we will not get anything done. So i am torn between easing p tis time of year and realizing that everything we are doing has been vetted multiple tmes and has been deemed essential. Latin? Essential Math? Essential Spanish? Same Writing with skill? Very essential. Science? We have eased p on the writing requirements here, but reading and discussing is still essential. History? Ditto. Grammar? Ditto. Uing kiss which is short, sweet and tough. No busywork. Warning...this got LONG --sorry! You are describing my thoughts too. First, I am with you on feeling that pretty much everything on our plate is essential. But what I've decided is that, while it may all be essential, it isn't necessarily all essential right now. So, I've put some things on hold to be covered later. I'm currently in the process of deciding just what is going to be put on hold. For example, I had grand plans of covering my old college grammar text with Ds this year as a final year of grammar. Ds has so much on his plate, I've put that idea on the back burner. His grammar is very good anyway, and focusing on writing this year is more important. H's getting some grammar review, but not what I had planned (even though I really did think it was essential). I find it helps me to just keep asking myself why. Why do I think this is essential? What will happen if we don't get to this subject/activity/project/event that I think is so essential? Where does it fit in the grand scheme of our lives/dc's education/lives? Will it come up again? Will the opportunity be there later? Is there something else that is more important? If at any point I start answering my questions with some version of "b/c everyone has to have ____ or do ____,' then I may not have a good reason for persisting in thinking it is essential (unless it's needed for a high school transcript---but even then there are times when some things can be postponed). Now on to what I took from the Circe thread (just in case anyone out there is dying to know). It's Hard to say b/c I read so much and think so much I don't know for sure where it all comes from. Several posts resonate with me (#2 & #8 to name a couple). Possibly due to the Circe thread I decided we needed to get back to learning that fits our family and our vision. I needed to stop listening to so many outside voices. We have always had the goals of pursuing truth and beauty. Read alouds have always been an integral part of our lives and discussion has never been a problem for me. I own Teaching the Classics and I discovered that I am already covering almost all of the questions they list in the back just through the discussions that naturally arise while we are reading. I'm not covering a ton of them every single time we discuss, but over time my Dc are being exposed to them just b/c I love analyzing literature. And, I've always used plenty of real life opportunities to educate Dc. I felt like the Circe thread just validated that approach for me. So, I decided we would not let curriculum and schedules dampen our learning. We took advantage of many outside opportunities and Dc have learned a ton. Dd has blossomed and turned into a personality I completely did not anticipate. My goals for her will be changing. OTOH Ds in 9th is floundering with organizing time and schoolwork and needs more structure. So, my vision now has to adjust. We can still pursue the same ideas, but we'll need to do it differently. In my quest to follow an education that is unique to our family and not based on what 'should be done', I've found that I have trouble choosing the best from the good b/c when you start looking around there are just so many possibilities and opportunities, and so much to learn it boggles the mind. And I can see that certain experiences can take Dc incredibly far. But there are soooo many. And besides curriculum/books, I've vetted all our outside activities and they are each essential to allowing Dc to become the people they were born to be. Each serves a purpose. Possibly the most important idea I took from the Circe thread is the validation of what I have always known....education, true education, requires a lot of time for contemplation. If the time for contemplation isn't there, it absolutely needs to be made, or I start floundering, which brings me to where I am now... clearing our calendar of almost everything for at least a month. The only thing they won't be stopping is 4H. As we start back up with schoolwork on Mon I need lots of time to evaluate and think about my ideas of what is essential and evaluate what is truly needed for me, for each Dc and for our family. I cannot have the interruptions that come with driving here and there. Once I feel like we've made reasonable progress toward pursuing what is truly needful at this time in our lives we'll add the outside activities back into our schedule. So, all of that just means that most of what I took from the Circe thread was to trust my own instincts and make sure I'm fitting the education to the values and needs of our family to just drop what doesn't fit and not allow myself to compare what we are doing with how other families choose to educate. 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Pod's mum Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Possibly the most important idea I took from the Circe thread is the validation of what I have always known....education, true education, requires a lot of time for contemplation. If the time for contemplation isn't there, it absolutely needs to be made, or I start floundering, which brings me to where I am now... So, all of that just means that most of what I took from the Circe thread was to trust my own instincts and make sure I'm fitting the education to the values and needs of our family to just drop what doesn't fit and not allow myself to compare what we are doing with how other families choose to educate. This is something I've put on our annual reviews for years,often amongst "Resources" Time: Time to think. Time to contemplate. Time to process ALL that reading and ideas. Time to dream, play and imagine. I too, classify conversation, non-structured and deep, as a prime educational tool. I'm studying another Philosophy topic myself, and this repeatedly comes up as THE way to educate thinkers. Coversations that get deep and go where neither of you know the answers; lead you both separately or mutually to find out more and continue later after more contemplation. Unlike the ancients, I find a lot of these conversations happen in the car. :) I have an almost middle-schooler, who reads and comprehends at a phenominal rate, and has regular deep conversations with other adults in many topics, I am happy to concede to her knowledge and let her teach me. So it is often at the edges of her, not my understanding that we need to find out more. Which very naturally follows that other educational tool, to consolidate learning through teaching. I loved that thread, it helped give me a boost when I was feeling very flat. Off topic-ish, a few months ago I picked a dandelion head and called my dd over to look at the beautiful Fibonnaci pattern, which she knows from Penrose the Mathematical Cat and others. A friend (semi-hermit, retired Uni lecturer) commented that she'll not be able to have normal conversations with the general public. I replied that I'm Home Educating her so that I have someone to have good conversations with. Not entirely true....but.... I've been reading through parts of TWTM again (first ed) along with again reviewing many of the good resources we own but don't use.* And similar to the other thread seeking questions to ask for literature questions, much of it it is seems to be a set formular of what needs to become natural. Which is fine as a start off. I've already gone right through with my first, 'practise child' and followed lots of texts to try and find what works best. But education really takes off, for us, when we graduate to unformulated education. Thanks for the recharge. .ETA: *I don't mean by this that we don't/won't use some of these resources at different times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birchbark Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Thanks for this thread. It's been a good refresher. I too was impacted by the CIRCE thread and made some changes as a result. The biggest one was reinstating read-aloud time as a priority in our schoolday. Placing less emphasis on history and more on quality literature. Leaving our boxed CM curriculum so I could custom-piece a lineup that met our goals. A lot of the changes were in mindset of course. Teaching from a state of rest, going for depth instead of breadth, focusing on truth, goodness, and beauty, asking "why am I doing this?" and cutting busywork out of our day. It's been a good year for us, which I really needed, being preggo with #4 with some complications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beaners Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 A lot of the changes were in mindset of course. Teaching from a state of rest, going for depth instead of breadth, focusing on truth, goodness, and beauty, asking "why am I doing this?" and cutting busywork out of our day. I already liked your post, but I'd like to double-like this particular part of it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 My kids have been sick the past few weeks (all staggered, of course, they can't just get it all over at once) so I've spent this time actually relistening to Circe audios and I think that actually helped me even more in being able to verbalize what we've changed. I now know WHY I'm homeschooling. I always had reasons (the regulars), but now I have one reason, and everything radiates from that. For us it is the pursuit of truth (I've also come to learn how hard that is in such a relativistic society). Because of this, I've been able to relax. I can rest, because I know that no matter WHAT we use, I can use it to teach truth. Like when I have to turn off history videos because of their unapologetic bias and we then discuss why the vid is unacceptable... No more history as a spine. Next to understanding why, this has been the biggest, most wonderful change. The literature we are reading, that we are focusing on ... it is powerful. I mean, I knew this as an adult, for myself, but I really never understood how excellent literature impacted a child and, I mean, DUH. They, most of all should be reading it, no? The oldest ideas SHOULD be taught to the youngest (my siggie)--I really get that now. Right now most of them have either read or are finishing Little Women. The discussions in this house have been *amazing*. Depth instead of breadth. All the way, baby. I am completely unapologetic in my dismissal of long books lists that line up with historical eras. If we only read 4 excellent books that year? I'm ok with that. Matter of fact, I can see the beauty in it. To dwell and ponder on a few excellent ideas is the most amazing tool for growing a child. I would say, too, that if you feel as though nothing has changed, that you wish more changed, that you're still digesting it all, I am too. I've not arrived. Going back and rereading the thread, relistening to the lectures *with time in-between* is a good thing to do. It's like digesting a 20 course feast. Eat slow and take lots of long walks. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janice in NJ Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Deleting. Don't want to insult anyone. Have a nice night, Janice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 End rant. Frankly, I don't think any of us are NOT doing those things? Just because I don't talk about math a lot, doesn't mean I'm not doing math, you know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Dup. Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Where do you all get the book lists for these amazing books you've started reading (and why is historical fiction not good?). Off to look for the Circe thread...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrdinaryTime Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 End rant. I certainly wasn't advocating not teaching practical study skills or not explicitly teaching writing or not spending serious time on math. Math is not busywork! :) To me the Circe thread (and I don't agree with everything Circe puts out) was focused more on the underlying philosophy of why I am homeschooling and articulating what the end of education is for our family, not on practical, nuts and bolts means of getting there. When you are discussing ends, it can often sound very nebulous and pie-in-the-sky, but that doesn't necessarily imply you are ignoring the means to get there. It is just a different discussion. I believe that may be why most of the moms who participated in the thread will be doing very different actual reading and assignments in their homeschools today, but with the same end in mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne J Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I also want to add, quite humbly, that I believe that the "singing" of math is the Truth of math. It requires much work, many years of practice, to get to the singing. But that is the point of *my* understanding of much of the Circe thread. To just put in one's 120 hours and call it good is to miss entirely the Truth of *any* subject, be it math, language, writing or whatever. Thoughtful, deliberate understanding of the subjects I teach, why I am teaching them, and consideration of how best to honor the "singing" of the subject is what I took from the Circe thread. Don't play scales all day and think the scales are the point, don't drill math facts all day and think that they are the goal, don't do Latin vocab flash cards and think they are Latin. (Which is not to say don't do scales, drills or flash cards. Just don't think they are the end.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faithr Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 The same people who promote this approach to education (Circe Institute) wrote a writing curriculum. Andrew Kern recommends Ray's Arithmetic for learning math. The idea that somehow this particular path to becoming a fully human person who strives to live virtuously means they won't be able to deal with details in college is just a preposterous assumption. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birchbark Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I've also come to learn how hard that is in such a relativistic society Ugh. Isn't that the truth. Where do you all get the book lists for these amazing books you've started reading (and why is historical fiction not good?). Off to look for the Circe thread...... Here is a post by 8filltheheart from the Circe thread that addresses this question. As for book lists, the Center for Lit website has some good lists by grade level. Also I want to say I do agree with Janice. I didn't bring this out in my earlier post but I was reading Ruth Beechick about the same time as the Circe thread and she reaffirmed for me the importance of basic skills. The thread talked about paring back but RB told me what to pare back to. Skills (3R's) + rich discussion became the new core of our homeschool. I agree with OrdinaryTime, math is not busywork. Nor is writing. They fit in under the categories of truth and goodness. The busywork I eliminated were things like making timelines or salt-dough maps or working through workbooks with little retention or reading snippets of a half-dozen books, many of which were historical fiction or biographies. This point hits close to home for me because I myself was homeschooled by parents who were all about character, to the neglect of higher skills. It is one of my bitterest regrets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizaG Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Frankly, I don't think any of us are NOT doing those things? Just because I don't talk about math a lot, doesn't mean I'm not doing math, you know? Hmm. I wouldn't be inclined to make assumptions about what any specific family is or isn't doing. This is the Internet. We haven't been in everyone else's houses; we haven't talked to their children; we haven't witnessed the real-world results. We have a natural tendency to "fill in the blanks" in people's posts with things that reflect our own ideas and behaviors. But I wouldn't be surprised if Janice's remarks did apply to some people on these boards. Getting away from that aspect of her post... even though I've found a lot of inspiration from some of the CiRCE speakers, I tend to feel out of place in the discussions with fellow homeschoolers. This is partly because I do have somewhat of a "get 'er done" approach to the basics -- and for us, the basics include subjects beyond the 3 R's, like religion, Latin, and geography. Janice's mention of what we'd expect (at a minimum) from a private school is on point for me, and I do think about this when planning and looking at what we've done. I don't know if the way we do these subjects would be considered "box-checking" -- and frankly, I don't care :hat: -- but I think it might be helpful to have a discussion about what, exactly, is meant by that term. It seems to be used as a sort of coded in-group language, which is something I'm very uncomfortable with in general, as it tends to marginalize or exclude people who see things differently. Another reason I'm not very active in those discussions is because we aren't using children's novels at all in our studies. There, I've said it. There's plenty of good literature on our shelves, and the children like to read (or listen to) and talk about it very often, but I believe that this would be happening even if we weren't homeschooling. To me, having a "book culture" at home is just part of being an educated person. And after thinking about this long and hard, I see no reason for us to add the Narnia series, Arthur Ransome, etc. to our curriculum, and several compelling reasons not to. YMMV. I don't think this is an "un-CiRCE" approach. Their organization is just a gathering of people who are interested in Christian classical education, and they have diverse views about many subjects. Dr. Taylor, and his late mentor Dr. Senior, seem to suggest that enjoying classic story books should be part of a normal home life, and so teaching children's literature at school is remedial. To the extent that our own education is deficient, and our home environment is under the influence of modern media and technology, we're going to need to do this deliberately to some extent. This is a significant challenge for school teachers who have children from a variety of backgrounds. But for homeschooling families, I would hope that just providing the books and a supportive family atmosphere would be enough, at least in many cases. And I certainly don't see it as something we need to make into a cornerstone of the curriculum. Again, I realize that others see this differently. Just wanted to give my two cents, storybook heretic that I am. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Twain Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 In general, good teachers take a no-nonsense approach when it comes to reading, writing, and math. They just teach it without any emotional uproar tied to the whole thing. They just teach it. Everyday. If you sent your child to a private school, or as a taxpayer you support the public school, you would expect that school to teach its charges reading, writing, and mathematics. If, however, the teacher said that she was going to spend the year focusing on "truth", would you be OK with that? Seriously. If the teacher allowed days and months to go by with no firm plan/due diligence in the direction of reading skills, writing skills, and math skills, would you be fine with that? It's January. Take a look at your reading, writing, and math track record for the first half of the year. (Not for the purpose of trashing your self-esteem, but for the purpose of PROTECTING your self-esteem long term. This is a BIG deal with home-education. Long-term self-esteem matters MORE than short-term self-esteem. This is a LONG road. Don't be short-sighted with this one.) Are you half-way to your year-end goals? (Do you have firm goals with the big three? If not, you should.) If you are way behind, please re-evaluate. Don't turn this into a personal-character issue. Wrong tool for the job. You are not a bad person, but you may need to adjust. Just take an objective look at your progress. If you find yourself arguing that you have not met your goals objectively, but that you have good intentions as a mother, you may be using the wrong tool for the wrong job. Janice in NJ, Great post!!! I quoted only part of it here because of the length, but I enjoyed the whole thing. I feel inspired to keep my nose to the grindstone. You are absolutely correct about the reading, writing, and math. Maybe you should get on the homeschool convention speaking circuit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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