If people comment on your children being well-behaved ..

[J-rap]

I think it's a combination of nurture and nature, but moreso nurture. I do know that constant, hands-on parenting (and guiding/correction) is a huge part of it.

 

Another part is that our oldest happened to be super easy and obedient; it was just kind of his nature. He kind of set the tone for his younger siblings, and they followed his lead.

[ktgrok]

Most of the bratty, rude kids I see are only children or have at most a single sibling. Very few families in my neck of the woods have 3+ kids. And the ones who do often are better behaved than average. The Mormon and devout Catholic families I know who have large families typically have very well-behaved, polite kids.

 

My thinking on that is that if you have a really hard to manage kid you are less likely to want to have another right away. If your kids are easy and content you are more likely to be on board for adding more. There is a 10 year gap between my oldest and middle child for a reason :tongue_smilie:.

 

Seriously though, if my DD had been the first kid I'd have a lot more kids.

[WagsWife]

Our kids are complimented on their behavior/manners all the time...I have even had people tell me that I should write a parenting book. :001_huh: Like others have said, I think it is a combination of the things you mentioned. In our case I also think that DH and I have certain expectations for our children's conduct which for our family is the bare minimum, but evidently is quite a few families it is over and beyond expectations. There have been times where the kids have been complemented and I have been taken aback, because they were just doing what was expected of them.

 

I do not think I am anywhere near qualified to write a parenting book...I have one who I am in a constant struggle with knowing what to do for her, but I will say that I do not think parents expect enough out of their kids today. They can be taught manners, they can be taught to sit quietly and NOT run around a room/building like banshees, and they can be taught to be helpful. Those are the top three minimum expectations on our list...and are the one people comment on the most.

[Soror]

I don't think it is homeschooling. I know too many horrid HS children and lovely PS children. I just don't see any correlation IRL there.

 

I don't think it is family size. Again, I know awful and nice large family dc and the same for onlies.

 

I don't think it is just biology, unless we are talking about a severe disability.

 

We get comments all the time. My dc have pretty manners, but they also have the giving hearts that we instilled in them, and that is what people notice more. They will give you whatever they have, they will let you go first, they don't ask or grab or anything like that. They give their time to others and don't keep much for themselves.

 

My middle dd had severe behavioral issues for many years, and she is lovely now but still a challenge I have to stay on top of. If someone looks at my three well-behaved dc and thinks I got lucky and don't know what it takes, they are *wrong.* Whenever someone tells us how lucky we are that we just happened to get well-behaved dc, I have to bite my tongue until it bleeds. They weren't there, crying and worrying through the rages, fits, arguing, etc. Even the other two, a lot less challenging, required constant correction and guidance. I don't know who the people are who get automatically lovely dc, but I'm jealous.

 

Anyway, I personally think it's about 40% modeling and 60% being willing to put in the work and having the confidence to parent. I don't need my dc to like me, I don't need their approval or anyone else's. I do what is right for them in the long term no matter what it costs me. I never majored on the minors. We taught them to love others and think of them, and that covered everything. In each situation, we pointed them to that, and instead of learning a list of rules, they learned one principle that they can use in any situation.

 

I think education has helped. I think it is easier to move about happily and kindly when you understand the world around you - when you have the big picture - and a strong education frees you to do that.

 

But mostly I think it's about sacrifice. You put in the time, you give up other things, and you get the results.

:iagree: That is what we try to focus on here as well. Modeling what is good and expected. Try not to stress about the little things and focus on character and the heart more than anything else.

 

I do think with a non-NT kid all bets are off. I have a friend with an autistic child and I can see it is a challenge. I also try not to judge others in public but always be thankful that it isn't my own :) My ds was a HUGE challenge up until 4 when we took gluten out of his diet, so I'm thankful every day and haven't forgot those challenges. It didn't matter what I did or didn't do some days. My 2nd dd is a very sensitive child and I'm just starting to figure her out.

 

I don't expect perfection from them or myself either though. Sometimes we all mess up and we have to try again. I had thought that being a *good* parent meant that I had this vice grip on all their behaviors and I finally realized I was missing the forest for the trees. If I focus on the modeling, looking to the virtues, our connection as a family the other things fall into place much more easily. The relationship comes first, not the behaviors.

 

I can also see more clearly things that are developmental and those that are not and I'm starting to enter the *fun* time with my almost 3 yo. I can see that some of my parenting in the past just made things worse with trying to make them into what I thought they should be.

 

Being a non-spanking parent in the midst of an area which is nearly 100% spanking I've felt lots of pressure but am finally getting past that point. I can see the fruits and I care less and less about what others think. I do try to watch others that are good parents and see what I can learn. I talk to my friends if I feel stumped and we bounce ideas off of each other, it is sometimes so valuable to have that outside objective opinion. I realize I don't have to have all the answers at one time.

 

However, I would say that I don't think most kids or parents are horrid. I think most do the best they can. I think all parents and kids are a bit different though and we all have to figure out what works for our own.

 

I think also in the realm of compliments for kids some kids just stand out more than others in their personality, it just isn't behavior that garners praise. We often hear at church what a lovely family we have and how well-behaved they are and I also find it funny sometimes when it is after a service in which they didn't behave up to my standards, but I take whatever compliments I can get :)

[Crimson Wife]

they can be taught to sit quietly and NOT run around a room/building like banshees

 

Or at least taught to know that *IF* they start running around like a banshee they will at minimum get put in "time out" and most likely get taken home :tongue_smilie: I have high-energy kids and sometimes they get so excited they forget how they're supposed to act. I don't fault parents when that happens to their kids- I fault them for turning a blind eye to it.

[MommaOfalotta]

Dd gets complimented on her behavior frequently. Everyone says we are great parents which makes me feel... :D. Especially since I was a teen mom. BUT I think it is due to her personality type as much as it is parenting.. and I think our decision to homeschool has helped.

 

We have never approved of her being wild, or rude. She was always corrected when she would get a little out of hand. But she is also very quiet (in public anyway;)) and very sweet, naturally.

 

Homeschool has helped because she hasn't been exposed to all of those children who dont have parents that actually... Parent. (Not saying all PS kids have parents that aren't involved. Not saying that at all!)

 

That being said, there are extremely well behaved PS kids, and very unruly HS kids. We've seen them both, and dd usually looks horrified. She always responds with "Those kids are wild, mom."

 

Im blessed to have her, thats for sure. However, Im sure we will get a run for our money with our ds. ;)Ive heard boys are totally different!:lol:

[MommaOfalotta]

Or at least taught to know that *IF* they start running around like a banshee they will at minimum get put in "time out" and most likely get taken home :tongue_smilie: I have high-energy kids and sometimes they get so excited they forget how they're supposed to act. I don't fault parents when that happens to their kids- I fault them for turning a blind eye to it.[/QUOTE]

 

 

:iagree:

 

ETA: Blast. I messed up the quote. I'm on a roll today.

[Lovedtodeath]

I do not think I am anywhere near qualified to write a parenting book...I have one who I am in a constant struggle with knowing what to do for her, but I will say that I do not think parents expect enough out of their kids today. They can be taught manners, they can be taught to sit quietly and NOT run around a room/building like banshees, and they can be taught to be helpful. Those are the top three minimum expectations on our list...and are the one people comment on the most.

I think that is part of my problem. I have never been sure why these expectations are important.

 

Like avoiding "foul language" for example... why is it so important? I have often struggled with the why? of certain expectations and then I don't enforce anything.

 

I also put my children's rights and feelings on the same level as other people. I understand that when I had PPD my emotions ran high and I did quite a bit of yelling. I understand that children have insomnia and fears... should my children receive LESS grace and understanding than me?

 

I let them cry and do not expect them to be silent because I was a miserable robot as a child.

 

When they are young with speech problems I let them say "I want milk" for example, instead of "May I have some milk please"

 

I let them run around in public because where else are they going to run? Their needs include running and playing.

 

Being helpful... yes, absolutely. But they do so out of love and knowing how much it helps, not out of obligation or training.

 

I am not saying that I am in the right here. I still don't know. :confused: Just sharing some thoughts.

Edited October 14, 2012 by Lovedtodeath

[Ghee]

My thinking on that is that if you have a really hard to manage kid you are less likely to want to have another right away. If your kids are easy and content you are more likely to be on board for adding more. There is a 10 year gap between my oldest and middle child for a reason :tongue_smilie:.

 

Seriously though, if my DD had been the first kid I'd have a lot more kids.

 

There's also the fact that, if you have 3+ kids, you have a small group. You typically employ more group methods for managing them. I can't do a bunch of "oh, well s/he is in THAT stage right now" excuses because I have 3...they are all in different stages. I can't let them ALL get away with causing chaos and how do you choose who CAN? So I crack down on all of it. I think people with one, or sometimes two, kids can let more slide simply because the kids don't outnumber the parents ;)

 

That said, if my youngest had been born first he'd have probably been an only :D

 

OOPS, edited I *can't* do a bunch of excuses!

Edited October 14, 2012 by Ghee

[Crimson Wife]

I think that is part of my problem. I have never been sure why these expectations are important.

 

Like avoiding "foul language" for example... why is it so important? I have often struggled with the why? of certain expectations and then I don't enforce anything.

 

I also put my children's rights and feelings on the same level as other people. I understand that when I had PPD my emotions ran high and I did quite a bit of yelling. I understand that children have insomnia and fears... should my children receive LESS grace and understanding than me?

 

I let them cry and do not expect them to be silent because I was a miserable robot as a child.

 

When they are young with speech problems I let them say "I want milk" for example, instead of "May I have some milk please"

 

I let them run around in public because where else are they going to run? Their needs include running and playing.

 

Being helpful... yes, absolutely. But they do so out of love and knowing how much it helps, not out of obligation or training.

 

I am not saying that I am in the right here. I still don't know. :confused: Just sharing some thoughts.

 

When you allow your children to act like complete brats, you are infringing on other people's rights to not be disturbed by kids who are screaming, crying, foul-mouthed, running around like wild animals, etc.

 

There is a time and a place for running, playing, being loud, etc. Take your kids to a playground if they need this type of outlet. But when they are in a situation where the norms are for more civilized behavior, then you will have to buck up, and PARENT your wild little hellions.

[justLisa]

I think that is part of my problem. I have never been sure why these expectations are important.

 

Like avoiding "foul language" for example... why is it so important? I have often struggled with the why? of certain expectations and then I don't enforce anything.

 

I also put my children's rights and feelings on the same level as other people. I understand that when I had PPD my emotions ran high and I did quite a bit of yelling. I understand that children have insomnia and fears... should my children receive LESS grace and understanding than me?

 

I let them cry and do not expect them to be silent because I was a miserable robot as a child.

 

When they are young with speech problems I let them say "I want milk" for example, instead of "May I have some milk please"

 

I let them run around in public because where else are they going to run? Their needs include running and playing.

 

Being helpful... yes, absolutely. But they do so out of love and knowing how much it helps, not out of obligation or training.

 

I am not saying that I am in the right here. I still don't know. :confused: Just sharing some thoughts.

 

 

*LOVE* your post. I have the same thoughts and my children are loving and well behaved. But yes, they are kids and real people and I don't wave a magic wand at them and expect them to walk single file like robots.

Edited October 14, 2012 by 425lisamarie

[Mommy22alyns]

I really don't think it has anything to do with family size. :confused:

[justLisa]

Oh never freaking mind.

Edited October 14, 2012 by 425lisamarie

[Soror]

I think that is part of my problem. I have never been sure why these expectations are important.

 

Like avoiding "foul language" for example... why is it so important? I have often struggled with the why? of certain expectations and then I don't enforce anything.

 

I also put my children's rights and feelings on the same level as other people. I understand that when I had PPD my emotions ran high and I did quite a bit of yelling. I understand that children have insomnia and fears... should my children receive LESS grace and understanding than me?

 

I let them cry and do not expect them to be silent because I was a miserable robot as a child.

 

When they are young with speech problems I let them say "I want milk" for example, instead of "May I have some milk please"

 

I let them run around in public because where else are they going to run? Their needs include running and playing.

 

Being helpful... yes, absolutely. But they do so out of love and knowing how much it helps, not out of obligation or training.

 

I am not saying that I am in the right here. I still don't know. :confused: Just sharing some thoughts.

 

I don't want mindless robots either. Personally those parents I strive to emulate aren't those with just perfect children, it is about how they treat their children and the interactions between family members. I want to be a parent who respects their children, just like I respect other people and I don't always see that in those parents with "good" children.

 

I do however think that there are appropriate times and places for various behavior. My standards are higher than some I'm sure and lower than others. I think it is a disservice to the kids to take them to places where calmness is expected and just let them run loose. I also think it disrespectful to others as well.

 

I think as far as specifics I think that I don't see the value in dictating exact phrasing my kids should practice or behaviors but more the attitude and heart behind those things, that is for me the ultimate goal. I've met many adults who I thought were nice, upstanding and respectful adults and none of them have acted in exactly the same way, so I don't expect that from my kids either.

[MommaOfalotta]

I think you can have very well behaved kids and not have them be robots, or disrespect them. There are certain times in life when you have to behave a certain way, especially as adults. I just feel like you are doing a service to your kids by teaching them appropriate behavior early in life.

 

You can't always give into your every inkling. By all means, let them be kids. Let them run, play and have fun. But teach them that there are times when they have to use restraint. :001_smile: It doesn't mean you have to be rigid and strict. Teach them good behavior in a loving way.

[Impish]

I don't understand how having, and enforcing boundaries and behavioural expectations translates to robots.

 

How else are kids to learn what's appropriate, if not shown boundaries and applied expectations?

[MommaOfalotta]

I don't understand how having, and enforcing boundaries and behavioural expectations translates to robots.

 

How else are kids to learn what's appropriate, if not shown boundaries and applied expectations?

:iagree:

[justLisa]

I don't understand how having, and enforcing boundaries and behavioural expectations translates to robots.

 

How else are kids to learn what's appropriate, if not shown boundaries and applied expectations?

 

No I don't think so either but also kids being a little bouncy and silly in public does not make them brats, either.

[Soror]

I don't understand how having, and enforcing boundaries and behavioural expectations translates to robots.

 

How else are kids to learn what's appropriate, if not shown boundaries and applied expectations?

 

I don't think it always or even usually does. I have seen though where it does sometimes though. Some people get so wrapped up in the exact behavior of their kids but seem to not even see them as people. Some people get so wrapped up in how their kids behavior reflects on them that their expectations are not always age appropriate and are not done with the respect that is expected of the children themselves.

 

I do think it part of our responsibility to pass on the expectations of society of our children. I think that just like anything we should do that with respect and love and even more so as parents.

Edited October 14, 2012 by soror

[Joyofsixreboot]

I'm voting for personality being huge in this. Seven kids raised with the same expectations but their behavior forms the familiar bell curve ( not horrible brats but some are much more vocal/noisy/active than others). I do find people translate "easy to handle" as well-behaved.

[Impish]

No I don't think so either but also kids being a little bouncy and silly in public does not make them brats, either.

I agree w/you.

 

It's when the behaviour is disruptive that folks have issues, ime.

 

I mean, I *expect* kids to be kids. Fidgety, talkative, etc.

 

But when they're tearing around, presenting a safety hazard to others in the area, screaming so that it disrupts those around them, etc, then yeah, it becomes a situation that ppl are going to judge. Like it or not, but it is the reality.

 

As parents, we have a responsibility to our kids to teach them how to behave in public. W/some kids, that's a tough, tough, tough gig. But, for their own good, for their future, it still *has* to be done.

 

I'd never tell anyone that parenting is easy. It sure as heck is not, and some kids present w/more challenges than others. Has nothing to do w/family size, hsing, psing, but everything thing to do w/*that* particular child.

 

I do my best to keep in mind that behavioural issues may well have an underlying medical situation. I know I've gotten a lot LESS judgemental after knowing parents whose children have invisible struggles and issues.

[SKL]

It occurs to me that the majority of the time, we don't notice the good kids. We only notice when kids are being "holy terrors."

 

Well, maybe those "holy terrors" and their mom are a good family having a really bad day.

 

Like I mentioned before, I run a tight ship, except that <1% of the time when I'm so exhausted I can hardly stand up. Then I pick my battles a little differently. If you see me and my kids on that day, you aren't getting the full picture at all.

 

Keep in mind that some of us are single parents who sometimes have no choice but to bring our kids with us at times/places that are not ideal. Yes, sometimes we "set our children up for failure" because we don't have another choice.

[PeacefulChaos]

I don't think it always or even usually does. I have seen though where it does sometimes though. Some people get so wrapped up in the exact behavior of their kids but seem to not even see them as people. Some people get so wrapped up in how their kids behavior reflects on them that their expectations are not always age appropriate and are not done with the respect that is expected of the children themselves.

 

I do think it part of our responsibility to pass on the expectations of society of our children. I think that just like anything we should do that with respect and love and even more so as parents.

 

:iagree:

 

I think there are people out there (general) who expect children to behave like adults. I also think there are people who get so caught up in 'if my kid misbehaves it's coming back on ME! people are going to think I'm an awful parent!' Who the heck cares? I certainly don't.

Yes, I think kids need to learn how to behave and should have consequences when they don't. But when they misbehave I couldn't care less how people are looking at me. If they are thinking I'm a failure as a parent because my 6 year old sometimes still wants to climb on the cart or because I'm pushing my 3 year old around the store and ignoring her crying, they are stupid.

I don't care if it is the norm for people to be judgmental. It's still dumb. If my kids are being good, that isn't just because of me either - and it would be quite selfish of me to assume it is.

 

It kind of reminds me of something I read a couple of years ago about a restaurant that decided not to allow kids or babies or something because they cry. Whatever, no big deal, just don't go there. But then it turned into this big thing where people were actually saying that kids shouldn't be taken out to eat until they are older and know how to behave properly. :001_huh: For real? How do they learn to behave in a restaurant when they aren't in one? They say 'train them at home' and I get that, but I don't make my kids sit at the table while I fix dinner - not to mention that wouldn't be realistic to a restaurant experience, anyway. :rolleyes: Some people do assume that 2 year olds should not have meltdowns, ever, and that (apparently) parents should never go out to eat as long as they have a child under age ????

Edited October 14, 2012 by PeacefulChaos

[Lovedtodeath]

Interesting responses.

:iagree:

 

I think there are people out there (general) who expect children to behave like adults. I also think there are people who get so caught up in 'if my kid misbehaves it's coming back on ME! people are going to think I'm an awful parent!' Who the heck cares? I certainly don't.

Yes, I think kids need to learn how to behave and should have consequences when they don't. But when they misbehave I couldn't care less how people are looking at me. If they are thinking I'm a failure as a parent because my 6 year old sometimes still wants to climb on the cart or because I'm pushing my 3 year old around the store and ignoring her crying, they are stupid.

I don't care if it is the norm for people to be judgmental. It's still dumb. If my kids are being good, that isn't just because of me either - and it would be quite selfish of me to assume it is.

 

It kind of reminds me of something I read a couple of years ago about a restaurant that decided not to allow kids or babies or something because they cry. Whatever, no big deal, just don't go there. But then it turned into this big thing where people were actually saying that kids shouldn't be taken out to eat until they are older and know how to behave properly. :001_huh: For real? How do they learn to behave in a restaurant when they aren't in one? They say 'train them at home' and I get that, but I don't make my kids sit at the table while I fix dinner - not to mention that wouldn't be realistic to a restaurant experience, anyway. :rolleyes: Some people do assume that 2 year olds should not have meltdowns, ever, and that (apparently) parents should never go out to eat as long as they have a child under age ????

Right.

 

*LOVE* your post. I have the same thoughts and my children are loving and well behaved. But yes, they are kids and real people and I don't wave a magic wand at them and expect them to walk single file like robots.

Thank you.

I agree w/you.

 

It's when the behaviour is disruptive that folks have issues, ime.

 

I mean, I *expect* kids to be kids. Fidgety, talkative, etc.

 

But when they're tearing around, presenting a safety hazard to others in the area, screaming so that it disrupts those around them, etc, then yeah, it becomes a situation that ppl are going to judge.

yes. balance.

 

Just noticing a kid is giggling, running and playing, in an almost empty store for example, is a good thing, not a bad thing. I noticed my reaction really sets the standard for judging. If I am having a good time with my kids racing down a grocery store isle and all of us are all smiles, then everyone else is all smiles too.

Edited October 14, 2012 by Lovedtodeath

[Impish]

Interesting responses. Right.

 

Thank you.

yes. balance.

 

Just noticing a kid is giggling, running and playing, in an almost empty store for example, is a good thing, not a bad thing. I noticed my reaction really sets the standard for judging. If I am having a good time with my kids racing down a grocery store isle and all of us are all smiles, then everyone else is all smiles too.

Ha! How about a mom DANCING in the grocery aisle, w/her face covering, blushing, mumbling teen dd following slowly behind her, audibly wishing the earth would open up and swallow her whole? :lol:

[GWOB]

Ha! How about a mom DANCING in the grocery aisle, w/her face covering, blushing, mumbling teen dd following slowly behind her, audibly wishing the earth would open up and swallow her whole? :lol:

 

That's just good parenting right there. (Says the weird lady often found in the middle of the grocery store belting out songs and/or dancing.)

[justLisa]

Ha! How about a mom DANCING in the grocery aisle, w/her face covering, blushing, mumbling teen dd following slowly behind her, audibly wishing the earth would open up and swallow her whole? :lol:

That is totally allowed!

[awisha.]

Ha! How about a mom DANCING in the grocery aisle, w/her face covering, blushing, mumbling teen dd following slowly behind her, audibly wishing the earth would open up and swallow her whole? :lol:

 

:lol: I want to be like you when I grow up!!!

[Crimson Wife]

Some people do assume that 2 year olds should not have meltdowns, ever, and that (apparently) parents should never go out to eat as long as they have a child under age ????

 

No, but IF your baby starts crying inconsolably or your toddler has a meltdown, THEN you take them out to the car so that you are not infringing upon the other diners' rights to enjoy their dinners in peace. You don't make everyone around you suffer because you are so worried about "treating your children with respect" that you lack the courage to actually parent them. :thumbdown:

 

The research has shown that the best outcome is not from "permissive" parenting but rather from "authoritative" parenting- being strict but warm. Too many parents today focus on the warm & loving part while ignoring the need for setting firm boundaries.

[Soror]

Keep in mind that some of us are single parents who sometimes have no choice but to bring our kids with us at times/places that are not ideal. Yes, sometimes we "set our children up for failure" because we don't have another choice.

 

Sometimes married people don't have that option either. Sometimes you do the best you can and try to make it through!

[Lovedtodeath]

NM